Can't. It's been mentioned the legal quagmire of ships from other games is just not worth the time, money, and effort. CBS Studios has more or less mandated that they develop all their new designs in-house, since even CBS Studios has agreements with other publishers they must honor.
If that's not enough, good luck getting Activision to agree on that.
Several ships have hopped from medium to medium in Trek games before. Winged Defender is one, the Vesta here in STO is another.
I'm not aware of a Winged Defender in STO. But the Vesta is from the books, not video games. Just like the Luna-class.
Cryptic could alternatively learn a thing or two about ship design from many of the fan mods out there. Star Trek Armada Fleet Ops has across the board better original ship designs than anything in STO, in my opinion.
You could learn a thing or two about intellectual property and copyright law, and how licensing works in terms of the licensee and licensor.
Cryptic can't just go on the internet and find some poorly-made fan design and tell them to make a knock-off of it. Cryptic pays ship designers to design ships. They can't take unsolicited designs -- no business can.
If Cryptic wanted to use more canon designs, they'd soon find that they'd be tripping over them. I can't help but suspect that they just aren't terribly interested.
The Constellation just came out. How can people be using this as a talking point? We've already reached the stage where they're scraping the bottom of the barrel for ship designs. So they're throwing some in-house designs into the mix too, that doesn't mean they're keeping things like the Niagara or New Orleans completely off the table.
Just means it might take a while.
Cryptic Seems to be saying that not only are they not interested in making 'Canon' ships, but that they don't want us using the ones they *do* make by making them inherently lesser than T6 equivalents. This does not make me optimistic.
How about you read what they're actually saying instead of trying to interpret what they seem to be saying?
anyone have a link to the no more iconic ships comment?
Your pain runs deep.
Let us explore it... together. Each man hides a secret pain. It must be exposed and reckoned with. It must be dragged from the darkness and forced into the light. Share your pain. Share your pain with me... and gain strength from the sharing.
The Constellation just came out. How can people be using this as a talking point? We've already reached the stage where they're scraping the bottom of the barrel for ship designs. So they're throwing some in-house designs into the mix too, that doesn't mean they're keeping things like the Niagara or New Orleans completely off the table.
Just means it might take a while.
how about they make cardassians playable and voila a whole new set of canon ships
^Not the timeline directly, but there were Many Star Trek ships from the "future" that could fill the "Cryptic create a toy" ships. Also, it is laughable to use current Delta Quadrant ships, and then shun Alpha and Beta Quadrant ships. It shows a lack of vision and understanding of continuity.
But we're not playing in the 29th century, are we? We're the 25th, and the closest we've seen to 25th century ship design is that time shuttle from "A Matter of Time". So, since we do not have a techno-evolutionary chart to show us how the Galaxy Class lead to whatever this is, Cryptic is going to have to go off book for a while until CBS greenlights a new Prime Trek show set in 2477.
Cuz right now, we're pretty much near the end of the line, canon ship wise. So instead of whining about Cryptic's art team, how about you try writing to major television networks and letting them know speculatory science fiction is still a viable and enjoyable medium of entertainment. That way, CBS can see how popular it is and make a new TV show to get a slice of the action.
"A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. LLAP"
This is why i think alot of people playing this game are not true Star Trek fans. They are just here for the space combat with ships. A real fan would be bothered by this. The replies to this are aweful to me and proves what i've been feeling. The IP will truely be dead when this happens.
Care to name me the treasure trove of ships still left? Nothing left for Romulans, maybe...maybe the K'Vort for Klingons...Feds there might be a few but we're moving on to top of the line new ships...we're decades ahead of where canon ended.
What there is left of ships are old ships...all of the new shiny ships we've seen in DS9 and Voyager have been added already.
Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
Care to name me the treasure trove of ships still left?
What there is left of ships are old ships...all of the new shiny ships we've seen in DS9 and Voyager have been added already.
The main issue is the idea put forth by cryptic that we will be reliable upon cryptic designed ships for T6 and forward.
It would appear that 'classic' ships will not be upgraded to T6 and we will have to use poorly (in my opinion) cryptic designed ships (non cannon)
That is the point of this debate.
Cryptic has done a VERY good job of including almost all Star Trek ship designs, that is not what we are complaining about.
Is anyone else concerned about the statement that Cryptic will not be using any further star trek I.P ships for the future expansion of the game?
If you think about it logically, Cryptic has already made all the important ships. Voyager, Defiant, and Enterprise (NCC-1701 thru NCC-1701-E) are the only recognizable ships STO needs.
If you think about it logically, Cryptic has already made all the important ships. Voyager, Defiant, and Enterprise (NCC-1701 thru NCC-1701-E) are the only recognizable ships STO needs.
Yes indeed, all the ships I love (and own)
Except they are not being upgraded to T6 - as far as I understand it.
The main issue is the idea put forth by cryptic that we will be reliable upon cryptic designed ships for T6 and forward.
It would appear that 'classic' ships will not be upgraded to T6 and we will have to use poorly (in my opinion) cryptic designed ships (non cannon)
That is the point of this debate.
Cryptic has done a VERY good job of including almost all Star Trek ship designs, that is not what we are complaining about.
But then Cryptic would be accused of rehashing old ships as "new tiers" and "nickel and diming my hard earned money on ships I already bought" and "blah blah evil game devs blah blah blah".
You've only seen the launch ships of Tier 6. You have no idea of what the entire tier set may look like or what new ships they may design in the future. I mean, look at the Odyssey. That's a "non canon" starship design made for STO and it's one of the nicer looking starships in the game.
"A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. LLAP"
You could learn a thing or two about intellectual property and copyright law, and how licensing works in terms of the licensee and licensor.
Cryptic can't just go on the internet and find some poorly-made fan design and tell them to make a knock-off of it. Cryptic pays ship designers to design ships. They can't take unsolicited designs -- no business can.
Question on that. Why not? I would be thrilled if a concept ship I came up with was rendered in STO and used. I would have a happy smile every time I saw it at ESD. And being unsolicited and given to them, not expect any fees or the like. So what is the issue?
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
uh, they have basically run out of canon ships to add.
Pretty much this. But if the ships don't look 'treky' I'll lose interest. And the Fed Intel ships don't. I hope future T6 ships are or I'll be back to WoW when it's new expansion drops.
Sometimes I think I play STO just to have something to complain about on the forums.
Pretty much this. But if the ships don't look 'treky' I'll lose interest. And the Fed Intel ships don't. I hope future T6 ships are or I'll be back to WoW when it's new expansion drops.
Its not 'pretty much this' as that is not the issue.
The issue is that (as far is it seems) Cryptic will not be upgrading current classic trek ships to T6 - and we will be reliant upon Cryptic designed ships.
Its not about Cryptic importing MORE trek ships into the game, its about using the ones they HAVE already.
Erm, no it is not, it is not nice looking at all, but that is all down to taste.
I pay for a star trek game, and would prefer to have classic Star Trek ships, right up to the highest level.
Thats just me. If you're different, that's OK too.
Well that's gonna be a bit of a problem when you're playing in the 24th century and those ships are considered museum pieces.
Do you honestly expect a Model T to keep up with the Lamborghini in this day and age?
You have to get with the (fictional) times. Those ships were great vessels in their day, but their designs are no longer competitive nor functional to the ships of 2410. Constitutions could only ever reach Warp 9 as it's top speed. We're running with Transwarp technology now. The Conni would be torn apart at those speeds. The Galaxy was considered a dreadnought by 24th century standards, but now anyone can tear through them with a well calibrated Quantum torpedo.
Isn't the point of Star Trek to look forward, move beyond the past and reach for a greater tomorrow? You can't be looking to the future if you're sitting in the captain's chair backwards, sir. Those ships were great vessels, and no one is asking you to forget their contributions to history. But we cannot take them with us ahead. They've served their purpose. Time to move on.
"A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. LLAP"
Unless they make more prime universe movies there will be no more additions to Star Trek IP. Abramsverse is an entirely different universe that they have already been stealing tidbits from such as the Adapted ship concept, I would expect some single Nacell ships if they are at all creative.
Its not 'pretty much this' as that is not the issue.
The issue is that (as far is it seems) Cryptic will not be upgrading current classic trek ships to T6 - and we will be reliant upon Cryptic designed ships.
Its not about Cryptic importing MORE trek ships into the game, its about using the ones they HAVE already.
Cryptic is about out of ships seen on screen now. So they are now having to use their own designs going forward. And this is a fair point. As others have said, Cryptic is paying the bills in ship sales. So they will want new shiny ships for people to buy. My only concern is they look like they belong in Star Trek. Less blocky for SF ships and well, they do Klingon and Romulan ships fine. So my only concern is Fed ships keep their look.
(And since it is on the topic I wish they could borrow the JJ-verse Kelvin arrangement. I thought it was clever.)
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
the ST IP is the ST universe, not just a few ships. I play STO for the universe it represents. Most, if not all, MMOs are about progress/evolution, using the same ship the entire game goes against that.
Well that's gonna be a bit of a problem when you're playing in the 24th century and those ships are considered museum pieces.
Logical fail I'm afraid.
Look up cannon, and you will see many Trek ships are built for hundreds of years service. Look up the time difference between TOS and TNG, DS9 and VOY.
We are not that far along the line since many of the ships where launched from them most recent (prior to TOS reboot) films such as First Contact.
The ships you are talking about are certainly NOT 'museum' pieces.
(Data was captain of the enterprise until Shon took over recently - he is still a NPC in the game - tell him he is dead)
What? You think ship design stalls when the TV show ended.
That was best and brightest in 2379 has to be best in 2410? All of the "classic" ships, as you call them, are at least 40 years old from an in game perspective.
This is like showing up at General Motors headquarters and crying that your "Classic" 1974 Corvette C3 should be just as fast and powerful as a modern C7 Stingray "Because it's iconic".
The canon ships may not all be museum pieces, but they are not top rate. Just because something can last 100 years doesn't mean it's going to stay at the top of the heap.
Everywhere I look, people are screaming about how bad Cryptic is.
What's my position?
That people should know what they're screaming about!
(paraphrased from "The Newsroom)
See that's the thing with games based off of popular IPs. There are certain features that people are familiar with from the shows and movies that get carried over into the games. Those features that people are familiar with is what makes people feel like they are playing a Star Trek game. If the ships in STO look like ships from Babylon 5, STO races that look like something out of Star Wars and STO race names are something out of World of ******** can the game really still be called Star Trek Online?
SWTOR despite being set 3000 years in the past of the movie timeline still has things like Lightsabers, Blasters, Bounty Hunters and Jedi and Sith who remind you every 5 seconds in their dialogue that they are in fact...Jedi and Sith. They can make up whatever excuse they want to to include or exclude the Lightsaber from SWTOR. But if it's a bunch of guys in white robes and black robes hacking away at each other with metal greatswords would it feel like a Star Wars game?
For some people it's enough if the names are the same. Ohh this race is called a Vulcan i'm playin Star Trek!!! but other people want the looks and the sounds of the Star Trek they are familiar with too.
I know exactly what you mean and how you feel. Everytime in the past that I have brought up the subject on the forums I am attacked from every end. Without remorse. I absolutely have no Idea why some ppl even play the game. If there was dinosaurs with lasers in it, they would defend it (oh, wait). I know how you feel, I promise but, take it from me. A Trek fan through and through. Its a dead horse. If you like the game play it. If you unsatisfied with how its turning out. Stop playing it. Nothing you say on the forums will ever change anything. EVER.
So Dinos with lasers are still a problem, but not "Planet of the Prohibition era Gangsters"? Or "Planet of the TRIBBLE?"
Everywhere I look, people are screaming about how bad Cryptic is.
What's my position?
That people should know what they're screaming about!
(paraphrased from "The Newsroom)
What? You think ship design stalls when the TV show ended.
.
Nope, but at the least I would expect some kind of outsourcing for the the design.
Cryptic are games designers of generic games, and I don't particularly like their artistic abilities when it comes to revamping classic star trek ships.
I don't dislike change, I dislike poorly designed change.
Has anyone maybe thought that cryptic might have last the liscence to any further ships maybe? Didn't they have to renew recently? Could be that their big push for in house designed ships maybe because of something like this? Just a speculation.
Once again. Its not about having MORE ships. Its about Cryptic not upgrading CLASSIC ships to T6.
I have no interest in flying Cryptic designed ships. That is the issue.
Nope, but at the least I would expect some kind of outsourcing for the the design.
Cryptic are games designers of generic games, and I don't particularly like their artistic abilities when it comes to revamping classic star trek ships.
I don't dislike change, I dislike poorly designed change.
But its all in the eye of the beholder.
Unless your name is Les Moonves, you can take what you are given or go find something else to do.
Just because YOU don't like it does not automatically make it bad.
I think some of them are wonderful, and some of them are weird. But I'm here to enjoy myself, not find fault with every last detail because it doesn't fit "My Idea of Trek"
Everywhere I look, people are screaming about how bad Cryptic is.
What's my position?
That people should know what they're screaming about!
(paraphrased from "The Newsroom)
As a fed. player i don't like 3 of the new t6 ships. The Guardian at lease looks like it belongs. And i did mention the game Star Trek Armada's ships only because most of them also look like they are from Trek. And since Crypitic has already started changing the ships,i could only hope they would make Fed ships look like Fed.ships. That's all i really want. Just my feelings on the subject.
Comments
Can't. It's been mentioned the legal quagmire of ships from other games is just not worth the time, money, and effort. CBS Studios has more or less mandated that they develop all their new designs in-house, since even CBS Studios has agreements with other publishers they must honor.
If that's not enough, good luck getting Activision to agree on that.
I'm not aware of a Winged Defender in STO. But the Vesta is from the books, not video games. Just like the Luna-class.
You could learn a thing or two about intellectual property and copyright law, and how licensing works in terms of the licensee and licensor.
Cryptic can't just go on the internet and find some poorly-made fan design and tell them to make a knock-off of it. Cryptic pays ship designers to design ships. They can't take unsolicited designs -- no business can.
The Constellation just came out. How can people be using this as a talking point? We've already reached the stage where they're scraping the bottom of the barrel for ship designs. So they're throwing some in-house designs into the mix too, that doesn't mean they're keeping things like the Niagara or New Orleans completely off the table.
Just means it might take a while.
How about you read what they're actually saying instead of trying to interpret what they seem to be saying?
Let us explore it... together. Each man hides a secret pain. It must be exposed and reckoned with. It must be dragged from the darkness and forced into the light. Share your pain. Share your pain with me... and gain strength from the sharing.
how about they make cardassians playable and voila a whole new set of canon ships
But we're not playing in the 29th century, are we? We're the 25th, and the closest we've seen to 25th century ship design is that time shuttle from "A Matter of Time". So, since we do not have a techno-evolutionary chart to show us how the Galaxy Class lead to whatever this is, Cryptic is going to have to go off book for a while until CBS greenlights a new Prime Trek show set in 2477.
Cuz right now, we're pretty much near the end of the line, canon ship wise. So instead of whining about Cryptic's art team, how about you try writing to major television networks and letting them know speculatory science fiction is still a viable and enjoyable medium of entertainment. That way, CBS can see how popular it is and make a new TV show to get a slice of the action.
-Leonard Nimoy, RIP
Care to name me the treasure trove of ships still left? Nothing left for Romulans, maybe...maybe the K'Vort for Klingons...Feds there might be a few but we're moving on to top of the line new ships...we're decades ahead of where canon ended.
What there is left of ships are old ships...all of the new shiny ships we've seen in DS9 and Voyager have been added already.
What ships? We've only ever seen one style of Cardie ship and, ding ding ding, lockbox took care of it!
Also, lamest attempt to justify a Cardie faction ever. *slaps hand* You are better than that! No. Bad forumite. Very bad.
-Leonard Nimoy, RIP
The main issue is the idea put forth by cryptic that we will be reliable upon cryptic designed ships for T6 and forward.
It would appear that 'classic' ships will not be upgraded to T6 and we will have to use poorly (in my opinion) cryptic designed ships (non cannon)
That is the point of this debate.
Cryptic has done a VERY good job of including almost all Star Trek ship designs, that is not what we are complaining about.
Yes indeed, all the ships I love (and own)
Except they are not being upgraded to T6 - as far as I understand it.
Am I wrong?
(I hope I am!)
But then Cryptic would be accused of rehashing old ships as "new tiers" and "nickel and diming my hard earned money on ships I already bought" and "blah blah evil game devs blah blah blah".
You've only seen the launch ships of Tier 6. You have no idea of what the entire tier set may look like or what new ships they may design in the future. I mean, look at the Odyssey. That's a "non canon" starship design made for STO and it's one of the nicer looking starships in the game.
-Leonard Nimoy, RIP
Erm, no it is not, it is not nice looking at all, but that is all down to taste.
I pay for a star trek game, and would prefer to have classic Star Trek ships, right up to the highest level.
Thats just me. If you're different, that's OK too.
Question on that. Why not? I would be thrilled if a concept ship I came up with was rendered in STO and used. I would have a happy smile every time I saw it at ESD. And being unsolicited and given to them, not expect any fees or the like. So what is the issue?
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
Pretty much this. But if the ships don't look 'treky' I'll lose interest. And the Fed Intel ships don't. I hope future T6 ships are or I'll be back to WoW when it's new expansion drops.
Its not 'pretty much this' as that is not the issue.
The issue is that (as far is it seems) Cryptic will not be upgrading current classic trek ships to T6 - and we will be reliant upon Cryptic designed ships.
Its not about Cryptic importing MORE trek ships into the game, its about using the ones they HAVE already.
Well that's gonna be a bit of a problem when you're playing in the 24th century and those ships are considered museum pieces.
Do you honestly expect a Model T to keep up with the Lamborghini in this day and age?
You have to get with the (fictional) times. Those ships were great vessels in their day, but their designs are no longer competitive nor functional to the ships of 2410. Constitutions could only ever reach Warp 9 as it's top speed. We're running with Transwarp technology now. The Conni would be torn apart at those speeds. The Galaxy was considered a dreadnought by 24th century standards, but now anyone can tear through them with a well calibrated Quantum torpedo.
Isn't the point of Star Trek to look forward, move beyond the past and reach for a greater tomorrow? You can't be looking to the future if you're sitting in the captain's chair backwards, sir. Those ships were great vessels, and no one is asking you to forget their contributions to history. But we cannot take them with us ahead. They've served their purpose. Time to move on.
-Leonard Nimoy, RIP
Cryptic is about out of ships seen on screen now. So they are now having to use their own designs going forward. And this is a fair point. As others have said, Cryptic is paying the bills in ship sales. So they will want new shiny ships for people to buy. My only concern is they look like they belong in Star Trek. Less blocky for SF ships and well, they do Klingon and Romulan ships fine. So my only concern is Fed ships keep their look.
(And since it is on the topic I wish they could borrow the JJ-verse Kelvin arrangement. I thought it was clever.)
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
Edit: I'm a ST fan since TOS, but not a fanboi
Logical fail I'm afraid.
Look up cannon, and you will see many Trek ships are built for hundreds of years service. Look up the time difference between TOS and TNG, DS9 and VOY.
We are not that far along the line since many of the ships where launched from them most recent (prior to TOS reboot) films such as First Contact.
The ships you are talking about are certainly NOT 'museum' pieces.
(Data was captain of the enterprise until Shon took over recently - he is still a NPC in the game - tell him he is dead)
That was best and brightest in 2379 has to be best in 2410? All of the "classic" ships, as you call them, are at least 40 years old from an in game perspective.
This is like showing up at General Motors headquarters and crying that your "Classic" 1974 Corvette C3 should be just as fast and powerful as a modern C7 Stingray "Because it's iconic".
The canon ships may not all be museum pieces, but they are not top rate. Just because something can last 100 years doesn't mean it's going to stay at the top of the heap.
What's my position?
That people should know what they're screaming about!
(paraphrased from "The Newsroom)
I know exactly what you mean and how you feel. Everytime in the past that I have brought up the subject on the forums I am attacked from every end. Without remorse. I absolutely have no Idea why some ppl even play the game. If there was dinosaurs with lasers in it, they would defend it (oh, wait). I know how you feel, I promise but, take it from me. A Trek fan through and through. Its a dead horse. If you like the game play it. If you unsatisfied with how its turning out. Stop playing it. Nothing you say on the forums will ever change anything. EVER.
What's my position?
That people should know what they're screaming about!
(paraphrased from "The Newsroom)
Nope, but at the least I would expect some kind of outsourcing for the the design.
Cryptic are games designers of generic games, and I don't particularly like their artistic abilities when it comes to revamping classic star trek ships.
I don't dislike change, I dislike poorly designed change.
But its all in the eye of the beholder.
Must have missed that one. What statement is this?
And who came up with the Dino lasers?
At least the stories you mentioned had a back story.
Who explained why we have dinosaurs with lasers to the great unwashed masses?
Even Voyager didn't jump the shark that high.
So come on Cryptic, why DO we have dinosaurs with lasers?
Once again. Its not about having MORE ships. Its about Cryptic not upgrading CLASSIC ships to T6.
I have no interest in flying Cryptic designed ships. That is the issue.
Unless your name is Les Moonves, you can take what you are given or go find something else to do.
Just because YOU don't like it does not automatically make it bad.
I think some of them are wonderful, and some of them are weird. But I'm here to enjoy myself, not find fault with every last detail because it doesn't fit "My Idea of Trek"
What's my position?
That people should know what they're screaming about!
(paraphrased from "The Newsroom)
Technically Data is dead. That's just B4 with Data's mind, and still an iffy ethical quandary.
-Leonard Nimoy, RIP
I meant Shon, (captain of the same Enterprise), but thats a good point