I knew Cryptic forgot about something when it comes to monetizing their new piece of "content".
Now I know what they've missed - unique duty officers REQUIRED to craft some of the best stuff, which are ONLY going to be available from the C-STORE DOFF PACKS or by CHANCE from a SINGLE doff assignment located in the Academy of all places...
And it's all still chance based - even if you pay you're not guaranteed to get the doff you need.
You're not even pretending anymore, Cryptic. At least with newer traits such as Resolve or Free Thinker there are several ways of obtaining/buying the necessary doff. This time it's all random, regardless of whether you're spending real money, or grinding the assignment.
At least this new doff assginment should be available all over the system and sector space, not just in the academy. Either that or you should add another assignment like that, or just simply add School Specialist Doffs to buy elsewhere, even for dilithium.
the current crafting system is noting more than a glorified slots machine.
when implemented it will add no value to the game. as of right now it's better to keep the old system. yes the old system is a glorified shop but at least you know what you'll be getting up ahead.
it's not all terrible the ui is good, the approach is kinda good and using doff was the right thing to do.
however since i have little to no control over the outcome it's not a crafting system. you just put materials in and a semi-random item drops out that is more or less how a slots machine functions.
it's only generating semi-random loot for an alternative price. if it was a true crafting system i'd have full control over the outcome. the crafting system should functionally much more closely resemble that of ESO or GW2.
when crafting items we need to be able to control the following factors
Item Type
MK
Rarity
Modifiers
right now i can only control the item type. Several MKs cannot be selected but at least there is limited control over that. Rarity is determined by a dice roll by the system i can influence the odds but in the end have no control.
modifiers is where crafting should shine but i can't even control it.
custom making items should be the corner stone of crafting. that would probably make crafted items more popular that found ones. but by allowing us to change modifier and deconstruct them for crafting materials this should not be a problem.
change crafting to
give us full control over all aspects of the outcome
allow us to change modifier on found items
deconstruct found items for crafting materials
my true concern here is that you can reach level 20 in a school of crafting and then still get a white quality item because of a bad roll by the system that you have no control over!
that can happen It's specifically sated that chances will never be 100%.
actually some people have been saying that the crafting I want is just a shop. I've been giving that some thought and concluded that it's true. crafting can't even be anything else. Crafing is to a EC/Dilitium shop what a Tailor is to a fashion shop. both are shops that sell cloths but only the tailor crafts them to perfectly fit you.
only by controlling every aspect can you tailor make the items for yourself and your build. that the hallmark of a truly great crafting system. the one that when you fully master it will allow you to tailor make items.
as of right now I don't see that happen, actually I see us getting a system that the furthest removed from that as it can be.
As I've said in other threads: I'm not going to gamble Dilithium for a "Chance" of crafting something I want. :mad:
A dictionary definition of "to craft":
to make or manufacture (an object or objects) with great skill and care.
Not:
to make or manufacture (an object or objects) by rolling a dice and hoping that you get what you desire.
I cannot see this system being changed, unfortunately.
it's actually already implied in the very word that you shouldn't be relying on random roll but still you do
THE NEW CRAFTING SYSTEM IS TERRA-BAD First of all it's not even a crafting system! It's just a dumb game system that's nothing more than a glorified slots machine.
second the "special items" you hope will be the saving the saving grace are messed up to.
The geometry of ground weapons is inextricably tied to the FX art of firing them. It would take a massive amount of FX and Character Art time to split these out, but customized weapons would be awesome. Maybe someday, but not soon.
Damn, that's what I was afraid of. It's encouraging that you're not ruling out the possibility, though. It really would be a great feature.
Well I have tried the new crafting on Tribble. First let me say i have been with the game since near the beginning. Yep, that is a long time. I have seen a lot of changes in the game. Some of the changes were good, some were ok, and some where completely crazy,In my opinion.
First issue i see in the new crafting is need a quicker way to convert old samples/traces to the new system. I have collected 250+ of the samples/artifacts/alloys/particles/data/sequence/signatures/technology. So one at a time makes my poor mouse shudder in fear.
Second issue is on the personal level. I have seen the crafting system revamp once before. It added Unreplicateable materials to the recipes. I have worked several of my characters to the max crafting skills to 1650. I am wondering what possible compensation could be offered to the time and Energy credits i have wasted now that I will start back to 0 on crafting. This point is a bit of a sore spot on me. I am controlling my words and attempting to be constructive in my concerns.
Third concern is that i can not determine what i am crafting in a random console or weapon with barely any knowledge of what the outcome will be. I know i am crafting a weapon or console and the Mark level.
Fourth is a question, I have scanned this thread and i am sure i missed the answer to my question. Will crafting items be bound or trade-able.
Again i am trying to control my pain of the change. All that work i did collecting samples, crafting up to get to the max level to help my fleet and friends will not be incorporated into the new crafting system aggravates me.
But i am trying to re-assure myself that this will be good. In My Mind, the verdict is still out......only time will see
What a World...Server Crash...Respawn....borg Invades ...Respawn...
A few folks have mentioned the 1 at a time conversion...after...Cryptic implemented the up to 100 at a time. Guessing they didn't check it out Tribble after the last patch there, but yep - Cryptic added a slider so you could do up to 100 at a time instead of the 1 at a time.
Just added with the June 26th notes, so folks may not have had a chance to check it out on Tribble before they had posted...
Well I have tried the new crafting on Tribble. First let me say i have been with the game since near the beginning. Yep, that is a long time. I have seen a lot of changes in the game. Some of the changes were good, some were ok, and some where completely crazy,In my opinion.
First issue i see in the new crafting is need a quicker way to convert old samples/traces to the new system. I have collected 250+ of the samples/artifacts/alloys/particles/data/sequence/signatures/technology. So one at a time makes my poor mouse shudder in fear.
Current tribble build has a slider now to do 100 at a time.
Second issue is on the personal level. I have seen the crafting system revamp once before. It added Unreplicateable materials to the recipes. I have worked several of my characters to the max crafting skills to 1650. I am wondering what possible compensation could be offered to the time and Energy credits i have wasted now that I will start back to 0 on crafting. This point is a bit of a sore spot on me. I am controlling my words and attempting to be constructive in my concerns.
So far from the recent gecko podcast there will be no level experience granted from the previous system but they are looking at giving people something to recognize their previous efforts.
Third concern is that i can not determine what i am crafting in a random console or weapon with barely any knowledge of what the outcome will be. I know i am crafting a weapon or console and the Mark level.
So far there is no guarantee of what rarity you will get but your chances improve by having a higher experience level, very rare specialty doff, catalysts, etc. There is still a chance of just getting common though.
Fourth is a question, I have scanned this thread and i am sure i missed the answer to my question. Will crafting items be bound or trade-able.
All crafted items will be trade-able including components and gear.
Gold Sub since March 2010
Lifetime Sub since June 2010
I still think they should give the characters with top end crafting now, something. it's a bit silly that we hafta restart entirely from scratch yet again.
Completely agree. Honestly, with Cryptic constantly changing systems over and over again (see f2p currency, reputation, stags, et al), unless I'm compensated for time spent on older systems, I will be EXTREMELY unlikely to grind anything out ever again, because I have been hosed quite enough. No more, and that's that. I'd hate to grind this out, then lose all that Xp a year from now when they decide to redo this system AGAIN!
when it is all said and done ...When the last card is played
your crafted item will cost you not 20.000 diithium and a 1/2 day ...or much more time grinding to amass the materials needed
But perhaps
a week of grinding and 100.000 dilithium to get the mk-12 purple item you wanted
then move to the next 1 per ship item and start over
Jellico....Engineer ground.....Da'val Romulan space Sci
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Okay then, I wanted to do another conversion run with the updated conversion (100-slider) to take a look at what I was getting in exchange for my old samples/particles. Didn't pay close attention the first time I did it...
Alright the fact that the particle traces are converting to Common and Uncommon materials in the new system is very disconcerting. Rare for rare. Please re-adjust the tables. This completely renders any previous time and effort we have put into the game a lot less worthy. We have already had this happen to us with Marks...etc... Cryptic please learn from your past mistakes and do not repeat them. It is bad enough you added the Fleet project which awards people half of the fleet credits for the same amount of marks. I will say that the downfall of many MMOs is inconsistency in the rules. Be consistent.
Thirded.
Complete agreement. The particle traces should at the very least convert to rare components consistently. Rare to Rare anything else is just stupid.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
First off, I like the new system for the most part, it feels less generic than the old crafting system and I think it has a lot of potential. It does, however, need some polish. That being said...
The Good
I like the school breakdown and the fact that we can now craft any type of beam/cannon/torp/mine at any level. It allows for specialization of sorts with the flexibility to always go off in another direction if you decide to do so. This can also lead to a co-op of sorts in Fleets, where different people can specialize in different areas and become go-to crafters of their chosen vocation.
I also like the new materials system along with the creation of parts. This adds more of a role-play / realistic feel than the old particle system did. It also give people an easy way to ramp up to level one without having to really spend any materials.
The additional use of Duty Officers also adds a nice element to the system and further encourages people to try and advance their commendation ranks in order to get more purple officers to increase their chance of getting better items. One thing that would make a nice addition, would be that at certain levels you recieve (or earn via mission) a duty officer that specializes in a particular school (common and level 1, uncommon and level 5, rare at level 10, and ultra rare at level 15 perhaps).
The Bad
Making components can be a bit tedious. While I like that you earn more fabrication slots as you advance in level, it would be very nice to be able to queue slots or at least choose the quantity of items you want to make up to some pre-determined time limit or quantity, so we don't have to sit on the crafting page clicking away at electromagnetic couplings all day. Tediousness is the death of the most well-intentioned improvements
I have mixed feelings about the randomness of the quality of items you make. I like that it adds some realism to the system (every painting you make isn't going to be a masterpiece after all), but there should be ways to control it at least somewhat, such as increasing the time you're willing to spend on the object to be extra careful to make it better, risking greater quantities of materials, or throwing more manpower at it. I'm not asking for a 100% chance to make a purple, but some more control would be appreciated and (hopefully) minimize the "slot machine" feel that some people experience with it.
Another minor pet pieve is that the items you are capable of crafting at your level don't float to the top of the list. I really don't want to have to scroll through things I can't make to get to the ones I can.
The (B)Ugly
Materials from anomalies erroneously state that there is not inventory space the first time you try and pick them up.
The tier of the item you just created is missing from the lower-right corner of the icons for manufactured items
Antiproton Cannon and Tetryon Cannon are incorrectly labeled as Phaser Cannons in the selection drop-down (the icons look correct though). They do show up correctly on the confirmation page however.
Items with long names or a large number of requirements seem to spill over out of the content box borders. They should probably be allowed to wrap.
Many end products (consoles, weapons, etc.) do not display the warning regarding their not being any available slots on the selection pages.
The Duty Officer button by the mini-map seems to light up even when projects are not finished yet.
That is all that I've come across so far. I think the new system is off to a great start, and look forward to seeing what the final system will look like.
EDIT: I almost forgot one suggestion - adding sets other than the Aegis set to the top-tier would be nice. Also, giving crafters an option to learn how to make items from faction rep might be nice as well.
Wide-angle Dual Heavy Cannons and 360-degree beams have been added as an option, which I appreciate. These items will add an interesting element to gameplay. My Vesta already uses the 360-Antiproton beam for subsystem targeting, but I would prefer a Phaser one for use with the Auxiliary DHCs.
HOWEVER,
if Wide-Angle torpedo launchers are not added to the new R&D system, I will be highly upset. Cruisers with low turn-rates need these torpedo launchers. Escorts do NOT need DHCs with a larger firing arc.
TL;DR Please consider adding wide-angle torpedo launchers to the Projectiles School. Cruisers need them!
Lifetime Subscriber since October 31st, 2014
Star Trek Online Captain since September, 2012
Feedback on June 26th Patch - Nothing has noticeably changed. (Go Figure, this is going live no matter what people say).
I still hate the new UI window, especially those annoying side window pop-ups when it comes to DOFFs. If I don't have the DOFF, the mission is undoable. While with the current version, if I don't have the DOFF, I can substitute with another DOFF that has the criticals.
Also, I have no idea why the crafting isn't organized where Low-Levels are at the top and higher-levels are at the bottom (especially if you aren't high enough to craft those items yet). And also be nice if those higher-tiered requirements are off screen or organized different. Because of the small window space they have HUGE VERTICAL, when you got all that wasted Horizontal.
There do not appear to be any. The cluster missions were taken away for some unknown reason but there has not been a suitable replacement for pulling resources. As of now, crafting is even more tedius than before; mostly because of the lack of locations to retrieve resources.
I do like the removal of Memory Alpha and whatever the special Klingon crafing location was. Can we have easier access to resources?
Wide-angle Dual Heavy Cannons and 360-degree beams have been added as an option, which I appreciate. These items will add an interesting element to gameplay. My Vesta already uses the 360-Antiproton beam for subsystem targeting, but I would prefer a Phaser one for use with the Auxiliary DHCs.
HOWEVER,
if Wide-Angle torpedo launchers are not added to the new R&D system, I will be highly upset. Cruisers with low turn-rates need these torpedo launchers. Escorts do NOT need DHCs with a larger firing arc.
TL;DR Please consider adding wide-angle torpedo launchers to the Projectiles School. Cruisers need them!
i am interested to see how the added of 360 beams work. are they unique to one? or can we fit the whole rear weapon slots with them?
Surely feedback will help, however after all is said and done, this is an example of what's already out there: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Crafting 'Notes:
- The crafting process never fails.
- When crafting a stack of items, the process speeds up progressively: each item queued will craft in half the time of the previous item. For example, if it takes two seconds to create a single bronze ingot, it will take only one second to create the second, and a half second to craft a third. There is a limit to how fast items can be crafted.'
(just a small extract from the page...)
Don't get me wrong, I love STO and I appreciate the difficulties of making a game and the efforts put into everything by what it used to be a very small team...
It's just that it pains me so much that this game always seems to pale in comparison, no matter how much money we spend on it!
:mad:
OK, I'd like to post a feedback from my personal point of view (as maxed lvl 50 player with limited time to spend in-game, willing to sacrifice reasonable amount of dilithium to speed-up the crafting process).
First, the revamp is necessary, second - I was affraid of this but it isn't so bad, but... OK here we go:
- Why do we have this crafting so complicated? Make it more simple, ppl will thank you!
- Why do we have so many materials? Make one common, one uncommon and one special, or something like this.
- Why do we have so many components for crafting things?
- Why can't we craft components in bulks? It's so annoying to waist my time to do like million clicks to get somewhere in crafting.
- The whole crafting is useless until I reach higher levels, I craft consoles etc. in the early stages only to gain xp, no other benefits were from this for me.
- And yes, I'm maxed in recent craft system, I want some advantage over other players, and no, I'm not talking about some bonus materials or components for me, I'm talking about xp benefit, like 10 000 xp in all schools or 10% bonus xp gain from everything...
- The whole crafting is useless if I can't make a specific thing - I can't be sure that I'll EVER craft very rare dual heavy cannon Mk XII [Acc]x2, which I obviously want...
- Dilithium requierements? If I can't be sure what I get? I don't know...
I'm not sure that crafting is intended for me in this moment... But it doesn't mean some player can't enjoy it or make a good use of it.
Well thank you for reading, hope we'll get some tweaks.
Might as well spend that Dil on lockboxes... At least, then I might have a chance to get something really awesome. Cryptic, call me back when I can actually craft, not just toss away my Dil and materials and hope that I get what I want.
Here are four more comments, concerns, and criticisms:
24 - Recipes are not progressive: why do lower level beam weapons require a targeting interface but later MK ones (e.g. MK VI) do not? Yes it makes sense that weapons should have targeting arrays. The item recipes need to be progressive and logical. Thus give them a pass.
25 - Subcomponents need to come out at different qualities. Each subcomponent needs to be whit,e green, blue and purple. This should give a bonus toward the final item quality to reduce the gambling. Using all purple subcomponents should then give you a purple crafted item unless there is that rare critical failure.
26 - The dilithium prices on the new DOFF packs at SFA need to be at least cut in half. 1000 dilithium for a purely random draw is again even more gambling int he system. Same for the original packs btw. You put in the reputation system to eliminate player concern and remove the randomness for something guaranteed with progression yet a year later we are now back to another system that just has all randomness.
27 - I know you guys keep saying we can craft anything at any level and are touting that as the big thing for the system. However, all subcomponent recipes are not unlocked at the start of the system. For example in beams I cannot construct a firing sequencer until level 5 or an isolinear chip until level 10. I have to rely on someone else doing it and getting it from them. That means someone still has to level first, which logically means you cannot create anything at any level.
I was looking through what doffs are required. it seems deflectors require advisers.
That seems off; they should probably require deflector officers, as that would actually make sense.
28 - In the recycle tab of your inventory, all the new crafting items have priority. Please give them a lower priority than you main inventory. It is tedious to have to scroll down every time to recycle junk items into EC.
29 - The R&D DOFF job at the academy needs to have its timer drastically reduced. 48hrs? Seriously? Why not just keep it like the rest of them, same timer, same cooldown. Be consistent with the existing rules. The more and different rules and exceptions you have, the further you get from your goal of making the game easier to play for newcomers.
Thanks for making it easier to convert old materials into new ones.
It would be nice if I could queue multiple crafts of the base components, as sitting here for extended periods just making other needed materials isn't very fun and doesn't encourage me to continue playing.
Thanks for making it easier to convert old materials into new ones.
It would be nice if I could queue multiple crafts of the base components, as sitting here for extended periods just making other needed materials isn't very fun and doesn't encourage me to continue playing.
Agreed, I would like to be able to queue up about ten of these that just auto-complete after the timer. This piece by piece method is quite tedious and clink-n-scroll heavy given the UI is not laid out in a very flowing manner.
Someone asked for this so here are some quick and dirty hard numbers from my time crafting under the new system.
With 600 being the standard XP received per hour (no matter what you craft ..other than the “special” items.. it comes out to 600xp per hour).
Here is the number of hours or XP to level up to 10th.
0 to 1st = 0.05 or 30xp
1st to 2nd = 0.38 or 260xp
2nd to 3rd = 16.23 or 10,000xp
3rd to 4th = 33.33 or 30,000xp
4th to 5th = 30 or 48,000xp
5th to 6th = 34 or 68,400xp
6th to 7th = 42 or 93,600xp
7th to 8th = 45 or 120,600xp
8th to 9th = 48 or 149,400xp
9th to 10th = 51 or 180,000xp
The above is if you don't use dilithium to "finish now". You also need to add the hours together to get a total time for going from 1st level to 10th in just that one school (in this case 300 hours).
Don't sound too bad ..right? Just under 13 days and you could be level 10!
Lets look at the numbers going from level 11 to 15.
Finally.. you are level 10 and can make all the components, but you want to be able to make the special items from this school, so you need to get to level 15.
10th to 11th =120 or 252,000xp
11th to 12th = 135 or 333,000xp
12th to 13th = 150 or 423,000xp
13th to 14th = 165 or 522,000xp
14th to 15th = 180 or 630,000xp
So 1050 total hours into crafting (if you don't "finish now") you are able to craft the special items. That's nearly 44 days if you keep on top of things and can manage the materials required to keep it moving.
You decide to max out the school but level 16 requires a hefty price, what most games call a "HELL LEVEL" It costs 420 hours just to go from 15 to 16!
15th to 16th = 420 or 882,000xp
16th to 17th = 450 or 1,152,000xp
17th to 18th = 480 or 1,440,000xp
18th to 19th = 510 or 1,746,000xp
19th to 20th = 540 or 2,070,000xp
After 3450 hours (just under 144 days) and a minimum of 103,500 materials (3450 hourly projects consisting of 6 components per item with each component requiring 5 materials) you have mastered your first school.
Congratulations!
Operational Support Team
Squishing Bugs for a better future
Is there any indication of removing the "Confirm" button and just having the page auto-calculate the display as selections are made? In other words, selecing Item Type and Mk then auto-updates Required Duty Officer and Cost boxes. Personally, I'd shift the quality probability bar chart into Task Difficulty and Skill, with Crafting Skill and Difficulty Rating below the chart side-by-side so it can auto-calculate as well when the variables change... but that's just me. Mostly, is there any hint of making the UI less... clicky?
With each passing day I wonder if I stepped into an alternate reality. The Cubs win the world series. Donald Trump is President. Britain leaves the EU. STO gets a dedicated PvP season. Engineers are "out of control" in STO.
After 3450 hours (just under 144 days) and a minimum of 103,500 materials (3450 hourly projects consisting of 6 components per item with each component requiring 5 materials) you have mastered your first school.
Congratulations!
Thank you for putting the numbers out there so people can see. Just one thing, did you include that you could craft more than one 600XP item at a time while doing this? Rank 2 you get 2, Rank 4 you get 3, Three at five you get 4 and one at 15 you get 5. This does make leveling a second school a little faster but not enough to want to even bother with the system. It is the reputation system on grind steroids. If what you have done does not show the devs how badly executed this system is numerically then there is just no hope for it. Again, thanks for putting up the numbers.
Comments
Now I know what they've missed - unique duty officers REQUIRED to craft some of the best stuff, which are ONLY going to be available from the C-STORE DOFF PACKS or by CHANCE from a SINGLE doff assignment located in the Academy of all places...
And it's all still chance based - even if you pay you're not guaranteed to get the doff you need.
You're not even pretending anymore, Cryptic. At least with newer traits such as Resolve or Free Thinker there are several ways of obtaining/buying the necessary doff. This time it's all random, regardless of whether you're spending real money, or grinding the assignment.
At least this new doff assginment should be available all over the system and sector space, not just in the academy. Either that or you should add another assignment like that, or just simply add School Specialist Doffs to buy elsewhere, even for dilithium.
when implemented it will add no value to the game. as of right now it's better to keep the old system. yes the old system is a glorified shop but at least you know what you'll be getting up ahead.
it's not all terrible the ui is good, the approach is kinda good and using doff was the right thing to do.
however since i have little to no control over the outcome it's not a crafting system. you just put materials in and a semi-random item drops out that is more or less how a slots machine functions.
it's only generating semi-random loot for an alternative price. if it was a true crafting system i'd have full control over the outcome. the crafting system should functionally much more closely resemble that of ESO or GW2.
when crafting items we need to be able to control the following factors
- Item Type
- MK
- Rarity
- Modifiers
right now i can only control the item type. Several MKs cannot be selected but at least there is limited control over that. Rarity is determined by a dice roll by the system i can influence the odds but in the end have no control.modifiers is where crafting should shine but i can't even control it.
custom making items should be the corner stone of crafting. that would probably make crafted items more popular that found ones. but by allowing us to change modifier and deconstruct them for crafting materials this should not be a problem.
change crafting to
my true concern here is that you can reach level 20 in a school of crafting and then still get a white quality item because of a bad roll by the system that you have no control over!
that can happen It's specifically sated that chances will never be 100%.
actually some people have been saying that the crafting I want is just a shop. I've been giving that some thought and concluded that it's true. crafting can't even be anything else.
Crafing is to a EC/Dilitium shop what a Tailor is to a fashion shop. both are shops that sell cloths but only the tailor crafts them to perfectly fit you.
only by controlling every aspect can you tailor make the items for yourself and your build. that the hallmark of a truly great crafting system. the one that when you fully master it will allow you to tailor make items.
as of right now I don't see that happen, actually I see us getting a system that the furthest removed from that as it can be.
it's actually already implied in the very word that you shouldn't be relying on random roll but still you do
First of all it's not even a crafting system! It's just a dumb game system that's nothing more than a glorified slots machine.
second the "special items" you hope will be the saving the saving grace are messed up to.
Damn, that's what I was afraid of. It's encouraging that you're not ruling out the possibility, though. It really would be a great feature.
First issue i see in the new crafting is need a quicker way to convert old samples/traces to the new system. I have collected 250+ of the samples/artifacts/alloys/particles/data/sequence/signatures/technology. So one at a time makes my poor mouse shudder in fear.
Second issue is on the personal level. I have seen the crafting system revamp once before. It added Unreplicateable materials to the recipes. I have worked several of my characters to the max crafting skills to 1650. I am wondering what possible compensation could be offered to the time and Energy credits i have wasted now that I will start back to 0 on crafting. This point is a bit of a sore spot on me. I am controlling my words and attempting to be constructive in my concerns.
Third concern is that i can not determine what i am crafting in a random console or weapon with barely any knowledge of what the outcome will be. I know i am crafting a weapon or console and the Mark level.
Fourth is a question, I have scanned this thread and i am sure i missed the answer to my question. Will crafting items be bound or trade-able.
Again i am trying to control my pain of the change. All that work i did collecting samples, crafting up to get to the max level to help my fleet and friends will not be incorporated into the new crafting system aggravates me.
But i am trying to re-assure myself that this will be good. In My Mind, the verdict is still out......only time will see
Just added with the June 26th notes, so folks may not have had a chance to check it out on Tribble before they had posted...
Heh, I wouldn't have been able to convert 28458 samples/particles as quickly as I did for my post there otherwise.
Current tribble build has a slider now to do 100 at a time.
So far from the recent gecko podcast there will be no level experience granted from the previous system but they are looking at giving people something to recognize their previous efforts.
So far there is no guarantee of what rarity you will get but your chances improve by having a higher experience level, very rare specialty doff, catalysts, etc. There is still a chance of just getting common though.
All crafted items will be trade-able including components and gear.
Lifetime Sub since June 2010
Completely agree. Honestly, with Cryptic constantly changing systems over and over again (see f2p currency, reputation, stags, et al), unless I'm compensated for time spent on older systems, I will be EXTREMELY unlikely to grind anything out ever again, because I have been hosed quite enough. No more, and that's that. I'd hate to grind this out, then lose all that Xp a year from now when they decide to redo this system AGAIN!
your crafted item will cost you not 20.000 diithium and a 1/2 day ...or much more time grinding to amass the materials needed
But perhaps
a week of grinding and 100.000 dilithium to get the mk-12 purple item you wanted
then move to the next 1 per ship item and start over
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Thirded.
Complete agreement. The particle traces should at the very least convert to rare components consistently. Rare to Rare anything else is just stupid.
The Good
I like the school breakdown and the fact that we can now craft any type of beam/cannon/torp/mine at any level. It allows for specialization of sorts with the flexibility to always go off in another direction if you decide to do so. This can also lead to a co-op of sorts in Fleets, where different people can specialize in different areas and become go-to crafters of their chosen vocation.
I also like the new materials system along with the creation of parts. This adds more of a role-play / realistic feel than the old particle system did. It also give people an easy way to ramp up to level one without having to really spend any materials.
The additional use of Duty Officers also adds a nice element to the system and further encourages people to try and advance their commendation ranks in order to get more purple officers to increase their chance of getting better items. One thing that would make a nice addition, would be that at certain levels you recieve (or earn via mission) a duty officer that specializes in a particular school (common and level 1, uncommon and level 5, rare at level 10, and ultra rare at level 15 perhaps).
The Bad
Making components can be a bit tedious. While I like that you earn more fabrication slots as you advance in level, it would be very nice to be able to queue slots or at least choose the quantity of items you want to make up to some pre-determined time limit or quantity, so we don't have to sit on the crafting page clicking away at electromagnetic couplings all day. Tediousness is the death of the most well-intentioned improvements
I have mixed feelings about the randomness of the quality of items you make. I like that it adds some realism to the system (every painting you make isn't going to be a masterpiece after all), but there should be ways to control it at least somewhat, such as increasing the time you're willing to spend on the object to be extra careful to make it better, risking greater quantities of materials, or throwing more manpower at it. I'm not asking for a 100% chance to make a purple, but some more control would be appreciated and (hopefully) minimize the "slot machine" feel that some people experience with it.
Another minor pet pieve is that the items you are capable of crafting at your level don't float to the top of the list. I really don't want to have to scroll through things I can't make to get to the ones I can.
The (B)Ugly
That is all that I've come across so far. I think the new system is off to a great start, and look forward to seeing what the final system will look like.
EDIT: I almost forgot one suggestion - adding sets other than the Aegis set to the top-tier would be nice. Also, giving crafters an option to learn how to make items from faction rep might be nice as well.
HOWEVER,
if Wide-Angle torpedo launchers are not added to the new R&D system, I will be highly upset. Cruisers with low turn-rates need these torpedo launchers. Escorts do NOT need DHCs with a larger firing arc.
TL;DR Please consider adding wide-angle torpedo launchers to the Projectiles School. Cruisers need them!
Star Trek Online Captain since September, 2012
I still hate the new UI window, especially those annoying side window pop-ups when it comes to DOFFs. If I don't have the DOFF, the mission is undoable. While with the current version, if I don't have the DOFF, I can substitute with another DOFF that has the criticals.
Also, I have no idea why the crafting isn't organized where Low-Levels are at the top and higher-levels are at the bottom (especially if you aren't high enough to craft those items yet). And also be nice if those higher-tiered requirements are off screen or organized different. Because of the small window space they have HUGE VERTICAL, when you got all that wasted Horizontal.
I do like the removal of Memory Alpha and whatever the special Klingon crafing location was. Can we have easier access to resources?
i am interested to see how the added of 360 beams work. are they unique to one? or can we fit the whole rear weapon slots with them?
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Crafting
'Notes:
- The crafting process never fails.
- When crafting a stack of items, the process speeds up progressively: each item queued will craft in half the time of the previous item. For example, if it takes two seconds to create a single bronze ingot, it will take only one second to create the second, and a half second to craft a third. There is a limit to how fast items can be crafted.'
(just a small extract from the page...)
Don't get me wrong, I love STO and I appreciate the difficulties of making a game and the efforts put into everything by what it used to be a very small team...
It's just that it pains me so much that this game always seems to pale in comparison, no matter how much money we spend on it!
:mad:
First, the revamp is necessary, second - I was affraid of this but it isn't so bad, but... OK here we go:
- Why do we have this crafting so complicated? Make it more simple, ppl will thank you!
- Why do we have so many materials? Make one common, one uncommon and one special, or something like this.
- Why do we have so many components for crafting things?
- Why can't we craft components in bulks? It's so annoying to waist my time to do like million clicks to get somewhere in crafting.
- The whole crafting is useless until I reach higher levels, I craft consoles etc. in the early stages only to gain xp, no other benefits were from this for me.
- And yes, I'm maxed in recent craft system, I want some advantage over other players, and no, I'm not talking about some bonus materials or components for me, I'm talking about xp benefit, like 10 000 xp in all schools or 10% bonus xp gain from everything...
- The whole crafting is useless if I can't make a specific thing - I can't be sure that I'll EVER craft very rare dual heavy cannon Mk XII [Acc]x2, which I obviously want...
- Dilithium requierements? If I can't be sure what I get? I don't know...
I'm not sure that crafting is intended for me in this moment... But it doesn't mean some player can't enjoy it or make a good use of it.
Well thank you for reading, hope we'll get some tweaks.
That is what i got for the 1000 dili i spent for it:
8 rare partikel
8 common metalls
1 blue componet
2 purple componets (those u need dili for)
2 white R&D doffs.
I will do a few more runs to get to know what it will drop on average.
As it is now, that overall look fair for me
That's pretty cool IMO.
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I can't doublecheck the exact list since it crashes when I try to check the assignment log.
At they very least spending 1k dil to get a component that costs 15k is quite the bargain
24 - Recipes are not progressive: why do lower level beam weapons require a targeting interface but later MK ones (e.g. MK VI) do not? Yes it makes sense that weapons should have targeting arrays. The item recipes need to be progressive and logical. Thus give them a pass.
25 - Subcomponents need to come out at different qualities. Each subcomponent needs to be whit,e green, blue and purple. This should give a bonus toward the final item quality to reduce the gambling. Using all purple subcomponents should then give you a purple crafted item unless there is that rare critical failure.
26 - The dilithium prices on the new DOFF packs at SFA need to be at least cut in half. 1000 dilithium for a purely random draw is again even more gambling int he system. Same for the original packs btw. You put in the reputation system to eliminate player concern and remove the randomness for something guaranteed with progression yet a year later we are now back to another system that just has all randomness.
27 - I know you guys keep saying we can craft anything at any level and are touting that as the big thing for the system. However, all subcomponent recipes are not unlocked at the start of the system. For example in beams I cannot construct a firing sequencer until level 5 or an isolinear chip until level 10. I have to rely on someone else doing it and getting it from them. That means someone still has to level first, which logically means you cannot create anything at any level.
That seems off; they should probably require deflector officers, as that would actually make sense.
29 - The R&D DOFF job at the academy needs to have its timer drastically reduced. 48hrs? Seriously? Why not just keep it like the rest of them, same timer, same cooldown. Be consistent with the existing rules. The more and different rules and exceptions you have, the further you get from your goal of making the game easier to play for newcomers.
I forgot all about having done this on a guy over on Tribble...let me take a look and see what he got.
[System] [ItemReceived] Items acquired: Magnesite x 4
[System] [ItemReceived] Item acquired: Component - Power Surge Regulator
[System] [ItemReceived] Items acquired: Tritanium x 4
[System] [ItemReceived] Items acquired: Trionium Gas x 8
[System] [ItemReceived] Item acquired: Component - Emitter Array
[System] [ItemReceived] Items acquired: Verteron Particle x 4
[System] [ItemReceived] Items acquired: Hydrazine Gas x 4
16 common mats
8 uncommon mats
1 L5 rare component
1 L10 very rare component (5k Dil)
I'll start it up again and see if I remember to check it again...or I won't. Greyed out. No timer. Oh well.
It would be nice if I could queue multiple crafts of the base components, as sitting here for extended periods just making other needed materials isn't very fun and doesn't encourage me to continue playing.
Agreed, I would like to be able to queue up about ten of these that just auto-complete after the timer. This piece by piece method is quite tedious and clink-n-scroll heavy given the UI is not laid out in a very flowing manner.
With 600 being the standard XP received per hour (no matter what you craft ..other than the “special” items.. it comes out to 600xp per hour).
Here is the number of hours or XP to level up to 10th.
0 to 1st = 0.05 or 30xp
1st to 2nd = 0.38 or 260xp
2nd to 3rd = 16.23 or 10,000xp
3rd to 4th = 33.33 or 30,000xp
4th to 5th = 30 or 48,000xp
5th to 6th = 34 or 68,400xp
6th to 7th = 42 or 93,600xp
7th to 8th = 45 or 120,600xp
8th to 9th = 48 or 149,400xp
9th to 10th = 51 or 180,000xp
The above is if you don't use dilithium to "finish now". You also need to add the hours together to get a total time for going from 1st level to 10th in just that one school (in this case 300 hours).
Don't sound too bad ..right? Just under 13 days and you could be level 10!
Lets look at the numbers going from level 11 to 15.
Finally.. you are level 10 and can make all the components, but you want to be able to make the special items from this school, so you need to get to level 15.
10th to 11th =120 or 252,000xp
11th to 12th = 135 or 333,000xp
12th to 13th = 150 or 423,000xp
13th to 14th = 165 or 522,000xp
14th to 15th = 180 or 630,000xp
So 1050 total hours into crafting (if you don't "finish now") you are able to craft the special items. That's nearly 44 days if you keep on top of things and can manage the materials required to keep it moving.
You decide to max out the school but level 16 requires a hefty price, what most games call a "HELL LEVEL" It costs 420 hours just to go from 15 to 16!
15th to 16th = 420 or 882,000xp
16th to 17th = 450 or 1,152,000xp
17th to 18th = 480 or 1,440,000xp
18th to 19th = 510 or 1,746,000xp
19th to 20th = 540 or 2,070,000xp
After 3450 hours (just under 144 days) and a minimum of 103,500 materials (3450 hourly projects consisting of 6 components per item with each component requiring 5 materials) you have mastered your first school.
Congratulations!
Squishing Bugs for a better future
Thank you for putting the numbers out there so people can see. Just one thing, did you include that you could craft more than one 600XP item at a time while doing this? Rank 2 you get 2, Rank 4 you get 3, Three at five you get 4 and one at 15 you get 5. This does make leveling a second school a little faster but not enough to want to even bother with the system. It is the reputation system on grind steroids. If what you have done does not show the devs how badly executed this system is numerically then there is just no hope for it. Again, thanks for putting up the numbers.