Right now it costs 5k Dil to make a Mk XI item and 20k Dil to make a Mk XII item. Those prices are subject to change pending testing on Tribble - our goal is to make it much cheaper to buy a given piece via crafting than it would be to just buy it from the Dilithium Store, since crafting requires time and effort as well.
...
This is going to blow right up in your face.
Just flipping through this thread, the outrage has already started.
I disagree with that assertion. Are you telling me you wouldn't pay 5k Dil for a piece of Mk XI gear on an alt you're gearing up or for a new build you wanted to try out? That's pretty easily earned by playing content in the game.
I think the 20k may be a bit high for a Mk XII, but compared to the 30-40k range for buying gear out of Reputations or the Dil Store, it still feels pretty reasonable to me.
Correct. My alts are for dil farming and for just playing for fun. I'm only trying to push the boundaries of DPS and such on my Fed's Avenger and my Rommie's Scimitar. Everything else is as cheap as I could get it.
Also, there is no way in heck that anyone's going to pay 20k dil plus days of work for a regular, non-set MK 12 purple when you can get a rep item for 40k that's got better stats AND a set bonus, or a fleet ultra-rare that's even more outlandishly powerful.
Thank you VERY much for your honesty, though. It and your straight answers are VERY much appreciated, even though I'm not a huge fan of the content of said answers.
Not at launch, but it is something that I hope to add later. I've set up all the items you create to "know" what it took to make them, so that in the future we can hopefully look that up and give you some of the materials back....
If the system is not fully ready for a launch in 9.5 for the love of god please do not launch a half system. I really would prefer if it was launched as a full system because past history tells me that it will stay in a half state for at least a year.
Second, I am not sure how I feel about more monitization of the crafting system. Will dilithium costs be removed? If so, the I can see the Zen use as a shortcut so long as the acquisition rates of very rare mats is not so low that "paying " is the only option. IF that is the case it is no more than an extended random lockbox system rather than even a semi-true MMO crafting system.
Three days ago, I bought a Romulan Plasma Pulsewave Assault Mk XII [CrtX]x2.
It cost me 11,000 Dilithium, which I afforded with my stipend.
20,000 is not half of 11,000. Do you even play this game?
Not every item is going to cost 20k, just like every piece does not cost 11k now. Rep store space gear costs 43k base, so obviously the 20k price was referring to that. The ground gear, if it costs 11k in the rep store, would likely end up being between 5 and 6k.
Also, there is no way in heck that anyone's going to pay 20k dil plus days of work for a regular, non-set MK 12 purple when you can get a rep item for 40k that's got better stats AND a set bonus, or a fleet ultra-rare that's even more outlandishly powerful.
There's no stats on what the crafted gear will actually have - so one can't make any sort of comparison yet...outside of the following tidbit that Hawk shared:
There is no Dilithium cost to create items of Mk X or below. There are very minor EC costs, less than or equal to half the cost of buying the item off of a vendor.
So what you seem to be saying here is that there will be dilithium AND zen costs now to crafting??
So what you seem to be saying here is that there will be dilithium AND zen costs now to crafting??
There were already freakin' Dil costs to crafting.
The costs have been removed for Mk X and below.
The costs have massively been reduced for Mk XI items.
Even Mk XII items are being added at costs massively less than Mk XI currently are.
Not every item is going to cost 20k, just like every piece does not cost 11k now. Rep store space gear costs 43k base, so obviously the 20k price was referring to that. The ground gear, if it costs 11k in the rep store, would likely end up being between 5 and 6k.
Heh, I think I need to walk away from this thread. Good luck if you stick around - with answering the same questions and pointing out the same things over and over and over...don't let it wear on your nerves like it has mine.
Not every item is going to cost 20k, just like every piece does not cost 11k now. Rep store space gear costs 43k base, so obviously the 20k price was referring to that. The ground gear, if it costs 11k in the rep store, would likely end up being between 5 and 6k.
You just hit the nail on the head as to why I don't buy Rep space gear. 43k Di for ANY non-set item is outlandish. If they're basing their prices off of the absurd, then the prices they result in will be absurd. And 20k for any Mk XII Crafting item is absurd. Assume each dilithium crystal is... oh, two inches each side and cubic.
Where the hell are you going to stick 5,000 of them in a Pulsewave? And before you say "the dilithium is a cost for another material," what kind of material that will fit in that rifle requires 5,000 dilithium crystals to make? The prices are absurd.
So what you seem to be saying here is that there will be dilithium AND zen costs now to crafting??
There's no mandatory zen costs. Zen costs are only incurred if you want to buy some rare materials instead of getting them through elite queues. It's the same as buying Lohlunat Pearls by paying Lobi.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
If the system is not fully ready for a launch in 9.5 for the love of god please do not launch a half system. I really would prefer if it was launched as a full system because past history tells me that it will stay in a half state for at least a year.
Second, I am not sure how I feel about more monitization of the crafting system. Will dilithium costs be removed? If so, the I can see the Zen use as a shortcut so long as the acquisition rates of very rare mats is not so low that "paying " is the only option. IF that is the case it is no more than an extended random lockbox system rather than even a semi-true MMO crafting system.
They crafting system was monetized when the game went F2P and they added the unrep items to all of the useful schematics. This is just a re-balance of that to match how the game has changed.
As for the drop rate concern, he already addressed that by saying that they should be readily obtained from elite queued missions. That's not to say that it won't be too low, but they do have plans in place to make it work and they can be tweaked before and after launch like Dil drop rates have been so many times in the past after new systems were introduced.
All that being said, the two concerns you have actually cancel each other out. They WANT you to get the rare items to craft things, because you need Dil to do so. Getting large quantities of Dil means getting in from the exchange for most people, and that means more Zen being sold so that people can buy it. So if the drop rates are too low, they make less money - and what do you think the chances of THAT happening are? :P
There's no mandatory zen costs. Zen costs are only incurred if you want to buy some rare materials instead of getting them through elite queues. It's the same as buying Lohlunat Pearls by paying Lobi.
They haven't even said that much at this point; they HAVE confirmed that there will be no special materials that can ONLY be bought with Zen, and they have not said anything about being able to buy the dropped material with them at all. If they did, it would be a first; the only time they have sold items in the Lobi store have been for limited time events, not for general drop items.
The only confirmed way you would need to use Zen at this point is if you want to use it to convert to Dilithium to pay that portion of the crafting costs. Until we hear otherwise, anything else is just a wild guess with no basis in fact.
You just hit the nail on the head as to why I don't buy Rep space gear. 43k Di for ANY non-set item is outlandish. If they're basing their prices off of the absurd, then the prices they result in will be absurd. And 20k for any Mk XII Crafting item is absurd. Assume each dilithium crystal is... oh, two inches each side and cubic.
Where the hell are you going to stick 5,000 of them in a Pulsewave? And before you say "the dilithium is a cost for another material," what kind of material that will fit in that rifle requires 5,000 dilithium crystals to make? The prices are absurd.
So by that logic, you'd be OK if they just renamed Dilithium to Spican Fire Gems you would be OK with things. I can live with that - devs, make it happen so icegavel can finally be happy!
We know that there will be a demand spike of Dil with this system. We're looking (long term, not 9.5-era) at ways to increase and normalize the ability to earn supply of Dil for players with different play patterns. Contrary to popular belief, we don't have any sort of widespread internal conspiracy to suck out all the ways to gain Dilithium - we want to reward you for playing the game.
Interesting... Still "long term"...
I know I'm straying from the main topic some, but how's last year's "revamp" of the Dil earning mechanics working? I'm sure you probably remember, it was the one where the lockbox mining claims came out?
I don't know about the overall metrics, but I know I'm not capping out in 3-4 hours of play. Mining claim or no. Actually, right at this particular moment, I've earned zero dilithium since the latter part of May (the launch of the Risa festival, for the record). Mainly because I've spent most of my time there except for the hour or so it took for my Fed engie alt to finish off the Solanae arc...
And before my nay-saying friend comes back, I'm fully aware that methods "exist" to gather piles and piles of Dil. I could:
1. Take my KDF, and DOff her a couple hours a day in morning, noon, evening, bedtime - focusing on Contraband, colonists, and prisoners.
2. Hit up the Pi Canis dailies.
3. Mining claim, Vlugta mines, fleet dil mine.
4. ISE runs in between 2 and 3 at every cooldown opportunity.
---or---
Dino tagging in Dyson battlezone. And tagging. And tagging.
Thing is, I'm not interesting in grinding the exact same things over and over just to earn purple rocks, however, they're "advertised" as being the "ultimate in time-gated currency". Yet, 75% (to 100%) of my time isn't earning me the currency in question.
Hence my earlier post. And this post piques my interest some, because once again a Dev is telling us that "the overall goals of playtime investment vs. earned dilithium" aren't being met, however, nobody seems to have the answer.
To echo the earlier discussion some, the simplest solution would be to grant dilithium from every single "endgame" action. Missions? Dil. STFs? Dil. Running around Risa for favors? Dil. Grinding marks? Get Dil as well. Fleet, Romulan and Nukara tracks are notoriously poor in Dil, while STFs (Omega) Dyson battlezone and Undine queues/battlezone all seem to pay semi-decently (perhaps too decently for the dino taggers, but I digress).
I also alluded to the refining bonus(es). Fleet mine and Veteran refiner. Perhaps a little readjusting with these guys once you've shored up the income system is in order. 1k or 2k for the veteran refiner would sure as heck convince people to subscribe and/or buy lifetime memberships. Maybe even 1k while gold, 2k once the 800 day accolade is earned.
Back on topic, high end crafting with dil costs (and no corresponding effort to help increase/normalize earnings) is gonna wind up right where we are now - nobody crafting because nobody can "afford to" craft. Either that, or the system will shift from fleet sinks to crafting sinks...
Well built crafting systems wind up being something that generate professional crafters, and makes an excellent diversion/secondary activity for everyone else, who'll tend to focus on one or two fields, using the income from that to gain other crafted features...
Detecting big-time "anti-old-school" bias here. NX? Lobi. TOS/TMP Connie? Super-promotion-box. (aka the two hardest ways to get ships) Excelsior & all 3 TNG "big hero" ships? C-Store. Please Equalize...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
So by that logic, you'd be OK if they just renamed Dilithium to Spican Fire Gems you would be OK with things. I can live with that - devs, make it happen so icegavel can finally be happy!
No, because my logic is "Where does all the mass go" when we're talking about constructing something with this material. I'm not arguing that it's Dilithium, I'm arguing because it's MATTER.
And because the amount of currency needed for an item being that high for something of that quality, you'd think it was outrageous, no matter WHAT the currency is called.
After having waded through this entire thread up to the point where this post sits (and it was like wading through sewage-infused quicksand at times ), I have one thing to ask of those people who are curious about, asking questions of, and even kvetching about the new system ... No, I am pleading for them to do one thing:
When 9.5 lands on Tribble, TEST IT. And by test, I don't mean walk in, take a cursory glance at the system, declare that it sucks, then walk away and slam the door behind you. I mean actually test it. Work with it for an extended period of time. See not only if there are bugs with it, but how it functions in general. Then, after you've tested it, go to the feedback thread for crafting and provide CONSTRUCTIVE feedback about what you think works, what you don't think works, and how it might be improved. Just don't think something like the wholesale removal of dilithium for mk XI and XII items will happen; with a launch date of late July, it's really only the magnitude of things which can be shifted now.
Compromise is not a dirty word. The developers are not out to get you. You are just being paranoid.
plsthxbye!
you must be new here....
that has and never will work, since the history of tribble's existence has the feedback met with any real consideration by the development team
No, because my logic is "Where does all the mass go" when we're talking about constructing something with this material. I'm not arguing that it's Dilithium, I'm arguing because it's MATTER.
Worth noting that the Dil costs are entirely on the syntehsizing materials into components - so you can build Mk XI and XII for EC only, as long as someone's selling their Very Rare components.
Worth noting that the Dil costs are entirely on the syntehsizing materials into components - so you can build Mk XI and XII for EC only, as long as someone's selling their Very Rare components.
Synthesizing materials into components. You're converting raw mass to refined mass. The dilithium is being made into them. Where are the components going? Where is the MASS going?
Or do you expect me to believe that I have to power Memory Alpha's main reactor to craft, like a GM worker being forced to pay part of the GM factory power bill?
They haven't even said that much at this point; they HAVE confirmed that there will be no special materials that can ONLY be bought with Zen, and they have not said anything about being able to buy the dropped material with them at all. If they did, it would be a first; the only time they have sold items in the Lobi store have been for limited time events, not for general drop items.
The only confirmed way you would need to use Zen at this point is if you want to use it to convert to Dilithium to pay that portion of the crafting costs. Until we hear otherwise, anything else is just a wild guess with no basis in fact.
I derived my statement solely from this section of the dev blog.
In addition, you can earn Very Rare materials by participating in queued events, and you can purchase R&D packs from the C-Store, which will give you an assortment of materials. As always, though, everything you need can be found by playing the game.
That reads to me like confirmation that we will be able to purchase packs of materials to cut down on the hunting for materials, since the C-Store last I check uses Zen.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
Synthesizing materials into components. You're converting raw mass to refined mass. The dilithium is being made into them. Where are the components going? Where is the MASS going?
Or do you expect me to believe that I have to power Memory Alpha's main reactor to craft, like a GM worker being forced to pay part of the GM factory power bill?
In every reply I've seen from you, it's been something along the lines of...
Somebody says X. You ignore X, and reply with Y loosely based on Z which was never said.
...doesn't that take far more effort than just reading the X?
Or is it just something that's more fun for you to completely ignore X and come up with Y/Z instead?
I'm cautiously approving of this. It needs some tweaks, but overall, it seems like a good effort. Hopefully I'll be able to test this out on Tribble.
That's how I'm looking at it - it looks promising compared to what we've got - but will have to see more of the meat and potatoes of it as well as test how it actually plays out, eh?
Cause not only will there be the testing of the how the crafting goes...but with the mention of unique procs to crafted items, that's going to have to be tested out as well.
Hope they give enough time for testing all of that - take that into consideration - when they do the Tribble drop for testing...leaving enough time for stuff to get addressed rather than it being addressed somewhere between S9.5 and X2 or even later...
With no end game, these are pointless changes and a waste of time of your efforts.
Right now any person hitting level cap can do all content with gear that comes on the ship aka whites.
They can use the rep systems to gear out the toon and be good to go. There is no need for a crafting system as long as the game lacks a end game that requires some form of effort to gear up for.
In every reply I've seen from you, it's been something along the lines of...
Somebody says X. You ignore X, and reply with Y loosely based on Z which was never said.
...doesn't that take far more effort than just reading the X?
Or is it just something that's more fun for you to completely ignore X and come up with Y/Z instead?
Then you're hallucinating, bud. I reply to X based on Y (in this case being my thoughts on the matter) using factual evidence Z. I took their X apart, analyzed it, and gave my views on what they were saying. I simply do not bother with the formality of "in reply to X" unless needed. I figure you'd be able to infer that, when I have text quotation above my reply, that perhaps what is being said may in some way relate to that. I am being efficient - factually and concisely (as possible to convey the point fully) replying to points instead of words themselves. Then I arrange the replies in a fashion which allows them to flow consistently.
For instance, in this case, X is "Somebody says X. You ignore X, and reply with Y loosely based on Z which was never said." The second and third sentences reply to that. The first sentence refers to your quote "In every reply I've seen from you" and implies that your vision is flawed using humor. The rest is simply explaining how I arrived at those conclusions.
Yes, I'm using basic sarcasm and direct response. How very advanced of me, how very difficult to do. :rolleyes:
First of all: Yay, a Dev communicating! (The last 2 or 3 weeks were like most of Cryptic disappeared into another dimension.)
Wait, wait, wait... When you say 'Clusters', you mean say Delta Volanis, B'tran or Azlesa expanse? If so, how the heck does changing them to 'locations in Secor space' permit any doffing in them. Will we have to get to 0.0 LY from them to load some assignements or something. That'd be very annoying.
I would expect it works like in the Dyson Zones - i f you reach certain areas in the Dyson Zone, you get access to new assignments.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
We've changed how Clusters work in 9.5 - they're now locations on the Sector Space map that was adjacent to them. There aren't any material harvesting interacts at these locations, but Doffing at them should now be much more convenient.
Interesting.
Will you make these new clusters also points that can be used as Foundry mission starts? So a player could create ahis own "B'Tran exploration cluster" missions for himself and others?
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
when I have text quotation above my reply, that perhaps what is being said may in some way relate to that.
That's probably the most amazing aspect of it all...you quote a post, creating the expectation that you've read it and are replying to it - only to then post a reply from out of left field as if you didn't read it at all...
Synthesizing materials into components. You're converting raw mass to refined mass. The dilithium is being made into them. Where are the components going? Where is the MASS going?
Worth noting that the Dil costs are entirely on the syntehsizing materials into components - so you can build Mk XI and XII for EC only, as long as someone's selling their Very Rare components.
So where in Hawk's post did he say a single thing about converting the Dilithium into anything? He said the Dil costs are on the synthesizing materials into components. Yep, the Dil costs are involved in the procedure of converting the various R&D raw materials into components used to craft the final item. The Dil is not converted into components - the materials are converted into components. So where on Earth did you get that Dilithium is made into anything?
I think the 20k may be a bit high for a Mk XII, but compared to the 30-40k range for buying gear out of Reputations or the Dil Store, it still feels pretty reasonable to me.
So with Hawk's post stating that the cost could be up to half of what it is for Rep/Dil Store items, you made a post stating that the cost is near double.
Your Y reply based on Z. /facepalm
It's like somebody could say "The sky is blue", and you would reply "No, the grass is green" in response.
I think the 20k may be a bit high for a Mk XII, but compared to the 30-40k range for buying gear out of Reputations or the Dil Store, it still feels pretty reasonable to me.
So with the Crafting Revamp we're looking at 5k Dil for Mk XI? What's the current cost for Mk XI? 31750 Dil. And that's being dropped to 5k Dil? They're going to be introducing Mk XII for only 20k Dil when currently Mk XI is 31750?
15.7% the cost for Mk XI? Mk XII which didn't exist for 63% of what Mk XI costs?
Mk XI in the Dil Store is 45k? Crafted Mk XI is going to cost 5k? Crafted Mk XII is going to cost ~20k or less?
Yeah, the appropriate reply is not that they've near doubled the cost.
Worth noting that the Dil costs are entirely on the syntehsizing materials into components - so you can build Mk XI and XII for EC only, as long as someone's selling their Very Rare components.
Oh, there's definitely something different about craftable gear. But today we're only supposed to be talking about materials!
Craftable gear has unique procs that can only be found via the crafting system.
...and you've got what looks to be a viable crafting system with demand. Which getting back to the first bit, the ability to sell the components - generates trade. Folks with Dil to spare wanting EC, say hello to the person with EC to spare wanting something they don't have the Dil to spare for...and tada, more trade. Heck, perhaps even something there to deal with some of the EC inflation folks have seen because of the loss of so many EC sinks in the past year or so, eh?
So while, imho, we should definitely be cautious about where this might go - wait to see what additional information we get, get the chance to test stuff out on Tribble, etc, etc, etc...
...talking about matter conversion efficiency and loss - how on Earth is that an appropriate reply?
This is going to sound a lot like the pot calling the kettle black, virusdancer. But I think you're wasting your time using things like 'fact' and 'reality' when people are bound and determined to think solely on paranoia and delusion.
Also, since the dilithium is being used to synthesize raw materials into usable components, and dilithium is used to power matter-antimatter cores in Star Trek, it might be reasonable to assume that the dilithium is not part of the object created... it's the fuel used to provide the power necessary to complete the manufacturing process that converts raw materials into usable components. If you want a Trek logic justification for dilithium.
With each passing day I wonder if I stepped into an alternate reality. The Cubs win the world series. Donald Trump is President. Britain leaves the EU. STO gets a dedicated PvP season. Engineers are "out of control" in STO.
Comments
So you read the post discussing the costs being half that of the Rep Store...yet posted that the costs were double that of the Rep Store anyway?
Okay then...
This is going to blow right up in your face.
Just flipping through this thread, the outrage has already started.
Correct. My alts are for dil farming and for just playing for fun. I'm only trying to push the boundaries of DPS and such on my Fed's Avenger and my Rommie's Scimitar. Everything else is as cheap as I could get it.
Also, there is no way in heck that anyone's going to pay 20k dil plus days of work for a regular, non-set MK 12 purple when you can get a rep item for 40k that's got better stats AND a set bonus, or a fleet ultra-rare that's even more outlandishly powerful.
Thank you VERY much for your honesty, though. It and your straight answers are VERY much appreciated, even though I'm not a huge fan of the content of said answers.
Three days ago, I bought a Romulan Plasma Pulsewave Assault Mk XII [CrtX]x2.
It cost me 11,000 Dilithium, which I afforded with my stipend.
20,000 is not half of 11,000. Do you even play this game?
If the system is not fully ready for a launch in 9.5 for the love of god please do not launch a half system. I really would prefer if it was launched as a full system because past history tells me that it will stay in a half state for at least a year.
Second, I am not sure how I feel about more monitization of the crafting system. Will dilithium costs be removed? If so, the I can see the Zen use as a shortcut so long as the acquisition rates of very rare mats is not so low that "paying " is the only option. IF that is the case it is no more than an extended random lockbox system rather than even a semi-true MMO crafting system.
Not every item is going to cost 20k, just like every piece does not cost 11k now. Rep store space gear costs 43k base, so obviously the 20k price was referring to that. The ground gear, if it costs 11k in the rep store, would likely end up being between 5 and 6k.
There's no stats on what the crafted gear will actually have - so one can't make any sort of comparison yet...outside of the following tidbit that Hawk shared:
So what you seem to be saying here is that there will be dilithium AND zen costs now to crafting??
There were already freakin' Dil costs to crafting.
The costs have been removed for Mk X and below.
The costs have massively been reduced for Mk XI items.
Even Mk XII items are being added at costs massively less than Mk XI currently are.
How are folks not getting this?
Heh, I think I need to walk away from this thread. Good luck if you stick around - with answering the same questions and pointing out the same things over and over and over...don't let it wear on your nerves like it has mine.
You just hit the nail on the head as to why I don't buy Rep space gear. 43k Di for ANY non-set item is outlandish. If they're basing their prices off of the absurd, then the prices they result in will be absurd. And 20k for any Mk XII Crafting item is absurd. Assume each dilithium crystal is... oh, two inches each side and cubic.
Where the hell are you going to stick 5,000 of them in a Pulsewave? And before you say "the dilithium is a cost for another material," what kind of material that will fit in that rifle requires 5,000 dilithium crystals to make? The prices are absurd.
There's no mandatory zen costs. Zen costs are only incurred if you want to buy some rare materials instead of getting them through elite queues. It's the same as buying Lohlunat Pearls by paying Lobi.
They crafting system was monetized when the game went F2P and they added the unrep items to all of the useful schematics. This is just a re-balance of that to match how the game has changed.
As for the drop rate concern, he already addressed that by saying that they should be readily obtained from elite queued missions. That's not to say that it won't be too low, but they do have plans in place to make it work and they can be tweaked before and after launch like Dil drop rates have been so many times in the past after new systems were introduced.
All that being said, the two concerns you have actually cancel each other out. They WANT you to get the rare items to craft things, because you need Dil to do so. Getting large quantities of Dil means getting in from the exchange for most people, and that means more Zen being sold so that people can buy it. So if the drop rates are too low, they make less money - and what do you think the chances of THAT happening are? :P
They haven't even said that much at this point; they HAVE confirmed that there will be no special materials that can ONLY be bought with Zen, and they have not said anything about being able to buy the dropped material with them at all. If they did, it would be a first; the only time they have sold items in the Lobi store have been for limited time events, not for general drop items.
The only confirmed way you would need to use Zen at this point is if you want to use it to convert to Dilithium to pay that portion of the crafting costs. Until we hear otherwise, anything else is just a wild guess with no basis in fact.
So by that logic, you'd be OK if they just renamed Dilithium to Spican Fire Gems you would be OK with things. I can live with that - devs, make it happen so icegavel can finally be happy!
Interesting... Still "long term"...
I know I'm straying from the main topic some, but how's last year's "revamp" of the Dil earning mechanics working? I'm sure you probably remember, it was the one where the lockbox mining claims came out?
I don't know about the overall metrics, but I know I'm not capping out in 3-4 hours of play. Mining claim or no. Actually, right at this particular moment, I've earned zero dilithium since the latter part of May (the launch of the Risa festival, for the record). Mainly because I've spent most of my time there except for the hour or so it took for my Fed engie alt to finish off the Solanae arc...
And before my nay-saying friend comes back, I'm fully aware that methods "exist" to gather piles and piles of Dil. I could:
1. Take my KDF, and DOff her a couple hours a day in morning, noon, evening, bedtime - focusing on Contraband, colonists, and prisoners.
2. Hit up the Pi Canis dailies.
3. Mining claim, Vlugta mines, fleet dil mine.
4. ISE runs in between 2 and 3 at every cooldown opportunity.
---or---
Dino tagging in Dyson battlezone. And tagging. And tagging.
Thing is, I'm not interesting in grinding the exact same things over and over just to earn purple rocks, however, they're "advertised" as being the "ultimate in time-gated currency". Yet, 75% (to 100%) of my time isn't earning me the currency in question.
Hence my earlier post. And this post piques my interest some, because once again a Dev is telling us that "the overall goals of playtime investment vs. earned dilithium" aren't being met, however, nobody seems to have the answer.
To echo the earlier discussion some, the simplest solution would be to grant dilithium from every single "endgame" action. Missions? Dil. STFs? Dil. Running around Risa for favors? Dil. Grinding marks? Get Dil as well. Fleet, Romulan and Nukara tracks are notoriously poor in Dil, while STFs (Omega) Dyson battlezone and Undine queues/battlezone all seem to pay semi-decently (perhaps too decently for the dino taggers, but I digress).
I also alluded to the refining bonus(es). Fleet mine and Veteran refiner. Perhaps a little readjusting with these guys once you've shored up the income system is in order. 1k or 2k for the veteran refiner would sure as heck convince people to subscribe and/or buy lifetime memberships. Maybe even 1k while gold, 2k once the 800 day accolade is earned.
Back on topic, high end crafting with dil costs (and no corresponding effort to help increase/normalize earnings) is gonna wind up right where we are now - nobody crafting because nobody can "afford to" craft. Either that, or the system will shift from fleet sinks to crafting sinks...
Well built crafting systems wind up being something that generate professional crafters, and makes an excellent diversion/secondary activity for everyone else, who'll tend to focus on one or two fields, using the income from that to gain other crafted features...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
No, because my logic is "Where does all the mass go" when we're talking about constructing something with this material. I'm not arguing that it's Dilithium, I'm arguing because it's MATTER.
And because the amount of currency needed for an item being that high for something of that quality, you'd think it was outrageous, no matter WHAT the currency is called.
you must be new here....
that has and never will work, since the history of tribble's existence has the feedback met with any real consideration by the development team
proof??
Galaxy
/thread
Dil doesn't go into the item...
Or do you expect me to believe that I have to power Memory Alpha's main reactor to craft, like a GM worker being forced to pay part of the GM factory power bill?
I derived my statement solely from this section of the dev blog.
That reads to me like confirmation that we will be able to purchase packs of materials to cut down on the hunting for materials, since the C-Store last I check uses Zen.
In every reply I've seen from you, it's been something along the lines of...
Somebody says X. You ignore X, and reply with Y loosely based on Z which was never said.
...doesn't that take far more effort than just reading the X?
Or is it just something that's more fun for you to completely ignore X and come up with Y/Z instead?
That's how I'm looking at it - it looks promising compared to what we've got - but will have to see more of the meat and potatoes of it as well as test how it actually plays out, eh?
Cause not only will there be the testing of the how the crafting goes...but with the mention of unique procs to crafted items, that's going to have to be tested out as well.
Hope they give enough time for testing all of that - take that into consideration - when they do the Tribble drop for testing...leaving enough time for stuff to get addressed rather than it being addressed somewhere between S9.5 and X2 or even later...
Right now any person hitting level cap can do all content with gear that comes on the ship aka whites.
They can use the rep systems to gear out the toon and be good to go. There is no need for a crafting system as long as the game lacks a end game that requires some form of effort to gear up for.
Then you're hallucinating, bud. I reply to X based on Y (in this case being my thoughts on the matter) using factual evidence Z. I took their X apart, analyzed it, and gave my views on what they were saying. I simply do not bother with the formality of "in reply to X" unless needed. I figure you'd be able to infer that, when I have text quotation above my reply, that perhaps what is being said may in some way relate to that. I am being efficient - factually and concisely (as possible to convey the point fully) replying to points instead of words themselves. Then I arrange the replies in a fashion which allows them to flow consistently.
For instance, in this case, X is "Somebody says X. You ignore X, and reply with Y loosely based on Z which was never said." The second and third sentences reply to that. The first sentence refers to your quote "In every reply I've seen from you" and implies that your vision is flawed using humor. The rest is simply explaining how I arrived at those conclusions.
Yes, I'm using basic sarcasm and direct response. How very advanced of me, how very difficult to do. :rolleyes:
Will you make these new clusters also points that can be used as Foundry mission starts? So a player could create ahis own "B'Tran exploration cluster" missions for himself and others?
That's probably the most amazing aspect of it all...you quote a post, creating the expectation that you've read it and are replying to it - only to then post a reply from out of left field as if you didn't read it at all...
You said this:
Replying to this:
So where in Hawk's post did he say a single thing about converting the Dilithium into anything? He said the Dil costs are on the synthesizing materials into components. Yep, the Dil costs are involved in the procedure of converting the various R&D raw materials into components used to craft the final item. The Dil is not converted into components - the materials are converted into components. So where on Earth did you get that Dilithium is made into anything?
Your Y reply based on Z. /facepalm
You said this:
Having said you read this:
So with Hawk's post stating that the cost could be up to half of what it is for Rep/Dil Store items, you made a post stating that the cost is near double.
Your Y reply based on Z. /facepalm
It's like somebody could say "The sky is blue", and you would reply "No, the grass is green" in response.
Let's go back and look at both of them, eh?
First there was:
So with the Crafting Revamp we're looking at 5k Dil for Mk XI? What's the current cost for Mk XI? 31750 Dil. And that's being dropped to 5k Dil? They're going to be introducing Mk XII for only 20k Dil when currently Mk XI is 31750?
15.7% the cost for Mk XI? Mk XII which didn't exist for 63% of what Mk XI costs?
Mk XI in the Dil Store is 45k? Crafted Mk XI is going to cost 5k? Crafted Mk XII is going to cost ~20k or less?
Yeah, the appropriate reply is not that they've near doubled the cost.
And then there was:
Taking into account the following two...
...and you've got what looks to be a viable crafting system with demand. Which getting back to the first bit, the ability to sell the components - generates trade. Folks with Dil to spare wanting EC, say hello to the person with EC to spare wanting something they don't have the Dil to spare for...and tada, more trade. Heck, perhaps even something there to deal with some of the EC inflation folks have seen because of the loss of so many EC sinks in the past year or so, eh?
So while, imho, we should definitely be cautious about where this might go - wait to see what additional information we get, get the chance to test stuff out on Tribble, etc, etc, etc...
...talking about matter conversion efficiency and loss - how on Earth is that an appropriate reply?