That's right. This is going to be as long as if not longer than the "What is your beef with the Galaxy Cryptic" thread. I think that CBS might say yes soon, but who knows. *Shrugs*
I got the NX skin as part of an Alienware giveaway some time back. I fly it every time I have a new Fed toon, because I think it looks cooler than the Miranda. And I've been watching Trek since it was originally on the air. (My parents were fans; I had to catch the third season in reruns because 10pm was after my bedtime when I was six.)
I've also been playing Trek games since college. (Incidentally, if you're playing Star Trek Battles, it does not help to be familiar with Niven's Known Space stories; if you play kzinti here as the "scream and leap" warriors Niven created, you'll get pasted quickly.) I still fondly recall the few adventures we got to have in the FASA RPG - I was Chief Science Officer of the USS Unicorn...
Does the US Navy pull old sailing vessels out of mothballs and begin equipping them with cruise missiles and point-defense laser systems?
Since the USS Constitution (the sailing ship) is still commissioned, I have hope that exactly this will happen. Follow a rolling broadside with a barrage of missiles
"old Connie is old, when the US Navy puts cruise missiles on a WWI destroyer blah blah blah"
There are T5 D7s (TOS era) and T'varos (ENTERPRISE era), so I'm afraid your logic is, and always has been, flawed.
There is no arguing that CBS has constantly said no.. but continuously using the "it's too old" excuse is as much of a dead horse as wishing for the Connie itself until CBS changes its mind.. if ever.
Most Connie naysayers are what I call "genners." They grew up with TNG and won't watch TOS because it's "old" and "has bad effects."
Growing up with TOS, I was waiting for Riker to take over from the stodgy old proffessor because he kind of looked like Kirk back then. Imagine my disappointment.
The problem seems to be when someone selfishly complains about someone else's preferences as it interferes with their immersion.
I'd say the best advice is: "Mind Your Own Business." It doesn't matter what someone else flies in this sandbox and nothing short of a complete reboot will make this game "canon."
Hit the nail right on the head. "I don't like it, so YOU can't have it... even though it's of no consequence to my own gaming". I personally think Voyager is the worst Trek series, and I'm not about to go "WHY SHOULD THEY FIX THE INTREPID? LET IT DIE ALREADY".
Then again, I'm not an entitled brat who thinks this game should revolve around my personal preferences and incomplete, double-standard ideas of "canon".
That's right. This is going to be as long as if not longer than the "What is your beef with the Galaxy Cryptic" thread. I think that CBS might say yes soon, but who knows. *Shrugs*
The thread shall be renamed into "What is your beef with the Constitution, CBS?"
I got the NX skin as part of an Alienware giveaway some time back. I fly it every time I have a new Fed toon, because I think it looks cooler than the Miranda. And I've been watching Trek since it was originally on the air. (My parents were fans; I had to catch the third season in reruns because 10pm was after my bedtime when I was six.)
I'm actually a huge ENT fan and I bought the entire ENT era bundle. I think that was my first C-Store purchase in STO. Every new Fed. toon of mine has also used the NX at the start of their careers.
And I happen to really like the NX. It's my favourite Enterprise and ship in Trek, back to back with the Galaxy. Too bad I'm not able to use a replica at T5, I'd love that. I have a D'kyr, T'Varo and a Kumari though, so I get my ENT era fix.
My father is a big fan as well, so I've been watching Trek from early childhood.
I've also been playing Trek games since college. (Incidentally, if you're playing Star Trek Battles, it does not help to be familiar with Niven's Known Space stories; if you play kzinti here as the "scream and leap" warriors Niven created, you'll get pasted quickly.) I still fondly recall the few adventures we got to have in the FASA RPG - I was Chief Science Officer of the USS Unicorn...
Star Trek Gamers are no FANS of Captian alternate timeline Archer NX Enterprise that ship does not exist in Trek canon as you don't see it on the rec deck of TMP.You don't it on observation lounge of the Ent. E First Conteact when Picard knocksmost of the gold ships down take a good notice of D.
I know this to be fact as I ma in serveral Trek gaming communites and been at it for over 10 years now.
I think Barak Obama is not President of the United States in 2014, because this fact is never mentioned in Star Trek :rolleyes:
"old Connie is old, when the US Navy puts cruise missiles on a WWI destroyer blah blah blah"
There are T5 D7s (TOS era) and T'varos (ENTERPRISE era), so I'm afraid your logic is, and always has been, flawed.
Not really...the US Navy isn't putting cruise missiles on WWI ships, while Iran, Russia, China et al are making new vessels and refitting things the US Navy wouldn't use for tugboats.
Just like the Federation isn't using Connies, while the Klingons, Romulans et al are using anything they can strap weapons onto.
Nice try though. :rolleyes:
0
rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,540Community Moderator
edited March 2014
Saying Enterprise isn't canon because the NX wasn't featured on display aboard the Enterprise-E in First Contact or the rec deck on the Enterprise in TMP is a flawed argument, considering both movies were produced before the series aired. They didn't have an NX back then. Enterprise was meant to be a prequel to TOS, showing how the tech we know and love came about.
Also... the NX class wasn't a Federation starship. The ships on display in the Ent-E's Observation Lounge might only be ships named USS Enterprise. And that argument could extend to the Ent-D's Lounge, which showed the carrier, but not the Enterprise that had the rings on her.. Not to mention the fact that the Ent-B that was on display on the Ent-D was a standard Excelsior and not the one seen in Generations.
Also... saying that Enterprise only exists in the AR created by the reboot is a flawed argument as well as Enterprise took place in the 2150s. The Alternate Reality was created in 2233. Therefor... it exists in both continuities.
Anyways... back on topic... the TOS Connie really doesn't fit the time period, but the Refit might fit a bit better as the Miranda is still around as well. When I flew a T2 on my main, I made her look like a Connie with Excalibur necelles. But as I pointed out in my last post in this thread, CBS has the ultimate say on ships that can be T5. IF a Fleet Cruiser Retrofit comes, it will most likely come in the form of the Excalibur, Vesper, and Exeter.
All Tier 1-5 Escorts, Cruisers, and Science vessels have Fleet variants, but only have access to 25th century skins.
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True but other nations do buy old US military hardware. When I was in the Navy my ship delivered two old patrol boats to Egypt which they had bought from our government.
Okay, so let the KDF and Romulans have Tier 3 Constitutions.
They should just it make a pirate ship or a rogue ship like the good ole USS Glory or the USS Centurion from the TNG novels. Which were both Constitution-class vessels serving into the TNG Era.
Since we are showing our Trek Street Cred, I have been watching Trek since the Wrath of Hispanic Khan, been reading Trek novels since the only good Shatner novel, The Ashes of Eden, been Trek computer gaming since the NES Star Trek game, which was the first NES game I beat. I have been a part of Starship tech when I found Frank Gerratana's SWDAO (Stuff We Don't Agree On) site which led to my involvement at the good ole Flare Sci-Fi Forums. Been in STO since Feb 2, 2010 with the Collector's Edition.
While not specifically mentioned outright to be a Constitution-refit in active service in the 24th century, it clearly uses the appropriate parts and was confirmed to use said parts.
The ship was on an extended exploration mission into the Beta quadrant, a distinguished duty as opposed to simple freight service =P
As far as I'm concerned, CBS is nuts not to give the go-ahead for a tier 5 Connie-refit, and I think the tier system STO uses doesn't do many of the ships justice anyway and would rather have all ships balanced to each other at tier 5 instead of being treated as "low level" junk. I want to use the starship at endgame that *I* enjoy most without hampering my PVE gameplay.
It's still *the* most iconic of all starships in Star Trek, and the only reason it didn't appear more in TNG was because Paramount was afraid of people confusing other random Connie-refits with the then-playing movie Enterprise-refit. I think we're well past that now.
It really won't impact anyone's gameplay or immersion, at least beyond a handful of people (I still remember the "carriers aren't canon!" threads...it doesn't seem to have affected the game negatively). We already have the ships on active duty at lower levels flying around, surely you can assuage your fears of seeing a tier 5 Connie-refit in an STF by telling yourself that it was one of the few ships in the quadrant that could arrive in time to assist =P Or that all the ships you see flying around in sector space are merely on light patrol and transport duty.
Regardless, this has to happen, I can foresee it happening eventually, and I think it's safe to assume it'll sell fairly well if it comes via c-store, as long as it's given proper dev lovin'. Again, it doesn't have to be the most powerful tier 5 ship...I just want it to put up more of a fight in endgame PVE.
And frankly, the precedent's been set over and over with other ships already, the K't'inga/D7 via the fleet shipyard, for starters.
There isn't much else to say that hasn't already been said, it's an over-beaten dead horse because it's a beloved much-desired ship. The demand is there, just playing the waiting (and sometimes begging) game now...
There can be no doubt that the wreck to the left is a Connie. Theres a 100% match (heck they even took the time to make the destroyed neck seem plausible for a 2 second shot).
But again... I agree that the connie is outdated and should go away.
Never noticed that before. Sure there was a Connie-refit there, but Starfleet was desperate to stop the Borg, for all we know that Connie was a restaurant pressed into service at Wolf 359. We've all seen the railroad car diners on TV.
Sometimes I think I play STO just to have something to complain about on the forums.
Seems to me that there are a large number of people that want the ship...why not give it to them...only the squeaky wheel will get the oil...and while CBS has said no now...if this thread gets big enough and people organize in game protests (Connie day...where everyone flies connies all day) then maybe the people in charge will change their minds.
Your pain runs deep.
Let us explore it... together. Each man hides a secret pain. It must be exposed and reckoned with. It must be dragged from the darkness and forced into the light. Share your pain. Share your pain with me... and gain strength from the sharing.
LOL Imagine the reaction on this forum if Cryptic and CBS give a T5 Connie, but only to the Klingon faction. hahaha :P
And this is why some of us should never be devs. If I was a dev, then I would be very tempted to do this or at least create a dev blog about it about a month from now. Although, I would probably go with "Due to popular demand, we are releasing the Tier 5 Constitution to each faction for 5000 Zen and 10,000 Zen for the 3-pack which contains a Tier 5 Constitution ship for each faction. Each ship is completely identical and contains no special console."
This is one time where I can say without reservation from the bottom of my heart, Thank you CBS, Thank You so very much.
I can see it now, right now it's "why can't I have a Tier 5 Constitution?", but if these people ever got their wish they would still be whining because it wasn't the most OP ship in the game.
We do not need this game turned into more of a farce by making the equivalent of Sopwith Camels keep up with F22 Raptors, it's already enough of a joke with some of the ships we have flying around.
If something is not broken, don't fix it, if it is broken, don't leave it broken.
they would still be whining because it wasn't the most OP ship in the game.
Seriously? Four years of people whining about Excelsiors and Galaxy X's. Right now there's multiple threads whining about the Scimitar.
What's the difference?
We do not need this game turned into more of a farce
Federation captains in Mirror universe bikini tops, with orion slave girl BOFFs next to Breen Boffs, flying a Jem'Hadar Dreadnought is not farcical to you?
But a guy flying around in the ship that launched the series is?
Federation captains in Mirror universe bikini tops, with orion slave girl BOFFs next to Breen Boffs, flying a Jem'Hadar Dreadnought is not farcical to you?
But a guy flying around in the ship that launched the series is?
/sigh
Come on, be fair, the poster did say that, minus the outfits and BOFFs:
We do not need this game turned into more of a farce by making the equivalent of Sopwith Camels keep up with F22 Raptors, it's already enough of a joke with some of the ships we have flying around.
Add t that the "more of a farce" should also show he already thinks it is a farce now.
This is one time where I can say without reservation from the bottom of my heart, Thank you CBS, Thank You so very much.
I can see it now, right now it's "why can't I have a Tier 5 Constitution?", but if these people ever got their wish they would still be whining because it wasn't the most OP ship in the game.
We do not need this game turned into more of a farce by making the equivalent of Sopwith Camels keep up with F22 Raptors, it's already enough of a joke with some of the ships we have flying around.
Hehe I think this is the type of reaction snoogymack22 talked about previously in the thread.
You admit that some of the ships and decisions in the game are already making it a farce, and considering that the Constitution is still a big problem. I wonder why people were and still are ok with all the decisions you yourself qualify as a farce and don't riot on the forum, but when the Constitution comes into play, it's suddenly "The line must be drawn here! This far, no further!" . lol We're already playing hopscotch over that line, in case you haven't noticed. :P
Seems to me that there are a large number of people that want the ship...why not give it to them...only the squeaky wheel will get the oil...and while CBS has said no now...if this thread gets big enough and people organize in game protests (Connie day...where everyone flies connies all day) then maybe the people in charge will change their minds.
Well maybe not necessarily as means of protest, but I'd love a Connie Day. I would be fun, imagine the entire game filled with Connies! It would be glorious and so fun. Even the KDF could join in and use their B'rels and K'tingas on that day.
This is one time where I can say without reservation from the bottom of my heart, Thank you CBS, Thank You so very much.
Trolling tends to diminish the point you are trying to make. Remember that.
I can see it now, right now it's "why can't I have a Tier 5 Constitution?", but if these people ever got their wish they would still be whining because it wasn't the most OP ship in the game.
That would only be a tiny minority, if even that. And they would get laughed right off of the forums.
What most endgame Constitution supporters want is one that is viable at endgame. Not one that is overpowered or superior to later classes that exist at Tier Five.
We do not need this game turned into more of a farce by making the equivalent of Sopwith Camels keep up with F22 Raptors, it's already enough of a joke with some of the ships we have flying around.
This is one ridiculous, asspull of an analogy if I have ever seen one. Same goes for jonsills comment on page one likening a T5 Constitution to an old sailing warship with modern weapons. It's over the top and silly.
And as for the whole idea of "more of a farce", that ship sailed a long time ago.
There is no logical reason whatsoever for an endgame Constitution not to be present in the game, unless somebody higher up the chain is blocking it. Period.
Seems to me that there are a large number of people that want the ship...why not give it to them...only the squeaky wheel will get the oil...and while CBS has said no now...if this thread gets big enough and people organize in game protests (Connie day...where everyone flies connies all day) then maybe the people in charge will change their minds.
That's a nice pipedream, but if the nonstop "OMG we all wantz teh T5 Connie lolol!!!1!!!" howling so far hasn't done the trick, this latest spoonful on top of the existing mountain of "want" isn't likely to make much difference.
Comments
I've also been playing Trek games since college. (Incidentally, if you're playing Star Trek Battles, it does not help to be familiar with Niven's Known Space stories; if you play kzinti here as the "scream and leap" warriors Niven created, you'll get pasted quickly.) I still fondly recall the few adventures we got to have in the FASA RPG - I was Chief Science Officer of the USS Unicorn...
Am I disqualified from being a "Star Trek Gamer"?
Since the USS Constitution (the sailing ship) is still commissioned, I have hope that exactly this will happen. Follow a rolling broadside with a barrage of missiles
There are T5 D7s (TOS era) and T'varos (ENTERPRISE era), so I'm afraid your logic is, and always has been, flawed.
There is no arguing that CBS has constantly said no.. but continuously using the "it's too old" excuse is as much of a dead horse as wishing for the Connie itself until CBS changes its mind.. if ever.
Hit the nail right on the head. "I don't like it, so YOU can't have it... even though it's of no consequence to my own gaming". I personally think Voyager is the worst Trek series, and I'm not about to go "WHY SHOULD THEY FIX THE INTREPID? LET IT DIE ALREADY".
Then again, I'm not an entitled brat who thinks this game should revolve around my personal preferences and incomplete, double-standard ideas of "canon".
The thread shall be renamed into "What is your beef with the Constitution, CBS?"
I'm actually a huge ENT fan and I bought the entire ENT era bundle.
And I happen to really like the NX. It's my favourite Enterprise and ship in Trek, back to back with the Galaxy. Too bad I'm not able to use a replica at T5, I'd love that. I have a D'kyr, T'Varo and a Kumari though, so I get my ENT era fix.
My father is a big fan as well, so I've been watching Trek from early childhood.
Only if you consider ENT to be canon.
I think Barak Obama is not President of the United States in 2014, because this fact is never mentioned in Star Trek :rolleyes:
Not really...the US Navy isn't putting cruise missiles on WWI ships, while Iran, Russia, China et al are making new vessels and refitting things the US Navy wouldn't use for tugboats.
Just like the Federation isn't using Connies, while the Klingons, Romulans et al are using anything they can strap weapons onto.
Nice try though. :rolleyes:
Also... the NX class wasn't a Federation starship. The ships on display in the Ent-E's Observation Lounge might only be ships named USS Enterprise. And that argument could extend to the Ent-D's Lounge, which showed the carrier, but not the Enterprise that had the rings on her.. Not to mention the fact that the Ent-B that was on display on the Ent-D was a standard Excelsior and not the one seen in Generations.
Also... saying that Enterprise only exists in the AR created by the reboot is a flawed argument as well as Enterprise took place in the 2150s. The Alternate Reality was created in 2233. Therefor... it exists in both continuities.
Anyways... back on topic... the TOS Connie really doesn't fit the time period, but the Refit might fit a bit better as the Miranda is still around as well. When I flew a T2 on my main, I made her look like a Connie with Excalibur necelles. But as I pointed out in my last post in this thread, CBS has the ultimate say on ships that can be T5. IF a Fleet Cruiser Retrofit comes, it will most likely come in the form of the Excalibur, Vesper, and Exeter.
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Okay, so let the KDF and Romulans have Tier 3 Constitutions.
LOL
Since we are showing our Trek Street Cred, I have been watching Trek since the Wrath of Hispanic Khan, been reading Trek novels since the only good Shatner novel, The Ashes of Eden, been Trek computer gaming since the NES Star Trek game, which was the first NES game I beat. I have been a part of Starship tech when I found Frank Gerratana's SWDAO (Stuff We Don't Agree On) site which led to my involvement at the good ole Flare Sci-Fi Forums. Been in STO since Feb 2, 2010 with the Collector's Edition.
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/USS_Olympia
While not specifically mentioned outright to be a Constitution-refit in active service in the 24th century, it clearly uses the appropriate parts and was confirmed to use said parts.
The ship was on an extended exploration mission into the Beta quadrant, a distinguished duty as opposed to simple freight service =P
As far as I'm concerned, CBS is nuts not to give the go-ahead for a tier 5 Connie-refit, and I think the tier system STO uses doesn't do many of the ships justice anyway and would rather have all ships balanced to each other at tier 5 instead of being treated as "low level" junk. I want to use the starship at endgame that *I* enjoy most without hampering my PVE gameplay.
It's still *the* most iconic of all starships in Star Trek, and the only reason it didn't appear more in TNG was because Paramount was afraid of people confusing other random Connie-refits with the then-playing movie Enterprise-refit. I think we're well past that now.
It really won't impact anyone's gameplay or immersion, at least beyond a handful of people (I still remember the "carriers aren't canon!" threads...it doesn't seem to have affected the game negatively). We already have the ships on active duty at lower levels flying around, surely you can assuage your fears of seeing a tier 5 Connie-refit in an STF by telling yourself that it was one of the few ships in the quadrant that could arrive in time to assist =P Or that all the ships you see flying around in sector space are merely on light patrol and transport duty.
Regardless, this has to happen, I can foresee it happening eventually, and I think it's safe to assume it'll sell fairly well if it comes via c-store, as long as it's given proper dev lovin'. Again, it doesn't have to be the most powerful tier 5 ship...I just want it to put up more of a fight in endgame PVE.
And frankly, the precedent's been set over and over with other ships already, the K't'inga/D7 via the fleet shipyard, for starters.
There isn't much else to say that hasn't already been said, it's an over-beaten dead horse because it's a beloved much-desired ship. The demand is there, just playing the waiting (and sometimes begging) game now...
Never noticed that before. Sure there was a Connie-refit there, but Starfleet was desperate to stop the Borg, for all we know that Connie was a restaurant pressed into service at Wolf 359.
Let us explore it... together. Each man hides a secret pain. It must be exposed and reckoned with. It must be dragged from the darkness and forced into the light. Share your pain. Share your pain with me... and gain strength from the sharing.
and for wolf 359 they just used what ever model was avalabile and they had several distoryed Connie Hall laying around gotta think about this things people
And this is why some of us should never be devs. If I was a dev, then I would be very tempted to do this or at least create a dev blog about it about a month from now. Although, I would probably go with "Due to popular demand, we are releasing the Tier 5 Constitution to each faction for 5000 Zen and 10,000 Zen for the 3-pack which contains a Tier 5 Constitution ship for each faction. Each ship is completely identical and contains no special console."
Well, it would be one way of boosting KDF numbers.... yeah, I would rather they all stay over there on Fedside. :eek:
Give us a Cstore T5 version of the K'tinga (D7) instead.
Still one of my favorite episodes ever of Enterprise.
I can see it now, right now it's "why can't I have a Tier 5 Constitution?", but if these people ever got their wish they would still be whining because it wasn't the most OP ship in the game.
We do not need this game turned into more of a farce by making the equivalent of Sopwith Camels keep up with F22 Raptors, it's already enough of a joke with some of the ships we have flying around.
Seriously? Four years of people whining about Excelsiors and Galaxy X's. Right now there's multiple threads whining about the Scimitar.
What's the difference?
Federation captains in Mirror universe bikini tops, with orion slave girl BOFFs next to Breen Boffs, flying a Jem'Hadar Dreadnought is not farcical to you?
But a guy flying around in the ship that launched the series is?
/sigh
Come on, be fair, the poster did say that, minus the outfits and BOFFs:
Add t that the "more of a farce" should also show he already thinks it is a farce now.
The explosion of rage would be larger than the one from Praxis lol.
Hehe
You admit that some of the ships and decisions in the game are already making it a farce, and considering that the Constitution is still a big problem. I wonder why people were and still are ok with all the decisions you yourself qualify as a farce and don't riot on the forum, but when the Constitution comes into play, it's suddenly "The line must be drawn here! This far, no further!" . lol
Well maybe not necessarily as means of protest, but I'd love a Connie Day. I would be fun, imagine the entire game filled with Connies!
Trolling tends to diminish the point you are trying to make. Remember that.
That would only be a tiny minority, if even that. And they would get laughed right off of the forums.
What most endgame Constitution supporters want is one that is viable at endgame. Not one that is overpowered or superior to later classes that exist at Tier Five.
This is one ridiculous, asspull of an analogy if I have ever seen one. Same goes for jonsills comment on page one likening a T5 Constitution to an old sailing warship with modern weapons. It's over the top and silly.
And as for the whole idea of "more of a farce", that ship sailed a long time ago.
There is no logical reason whatsoever for an endgame Constitution not to be present in the game, unless somebody higher up the chain is blocking it. Period.
That's a nice pipedream, but if the nonstop "OMG we all wantz teh T5 Connie lolol!!!1!!!" howling so far hasn't done the trick, this latest spoonful on top of the existing mountain of "want" isn't likely to make much difference.