I honestly could see the absolute Troll outrage happen if they recommended Player A be kicked, and someone blocked the vote... To Troll the Troll would be epic... I could see the person end up going AFK themselves because they were so pissed... then earning a 2 hour AFK penalty and no rewards.... oh for the lolz.
But we all knew it would be now didn't we? All the things we talked about to avoid the penalty are working as described, which makes this fix just laughably inept.
All they have to do is die and sit dead for the entire mission.
Cryptic should have just added the vote-kick option, so that team members can vote to kick an AFK farmer from their team, thus making them zone out and allowing the auto queue to replace them.
People talked about how that could be abused, but I just don't see it. If four people don't want you on their team, for whatever reason, that is not abuse, that is a consensus.
Hold up! Can you really get round the afk penalty by just not respawning!?! My god! That is just baby-town frolics.
It's not myfault ifyoufeel trolledbymyDisco ball...Sorry'boutit.
i doubt that mentality will get any of us anything.
what happens if you needed to afk because you got a phone call and say something terrible happened to one of your family, you think you deserved that like the afk penalty? when the boot is on the other foot, dont assume your immune from it either.
I love the way the people who "hate" AFKers go out first thing, test the new system, find the ways to beat the system, POST the cheats on the forums for all to read - and then complain when everyone's "doing it".
Did your momma raise you with any common sense?
Actually, the problems with their AFK fix have been covered many times prior to it ever being released and any trained monkey can see how to get around them. It's not exactly rocket science dunmovyn.
You know Cryptic has Jumped the Proverbial Shark when they introduced Tractor Pulling to Star Trek Online!
But we all knew it would be now didn't we? All the things we talked about to avoid the penalty are working as described, which makes this fix just laughably inept.
All they have to do is die and sit dead for the entire mission.
Cryptic should have just added the vote-kick option, so that team members can vote to kick an AFK farmer from their team, thus making them zone out and allowing the auto queue to replace them.
People talked about how that could be abused, but I just don't see it. If four people don't want you on their team, for whatever reason, that is not abuse, that is a consensus.
Firstly, I saw someone try this already, and no loot dropped for him. I smiled because this type of concern has been posted over and over again and I was happy to see it was dead wrong.
Secondly, you're not going to get people to agree with you that votekick is an option because there are too many sociopaths that play this game that believe that they have the unalienable right to bring the crappiest build to an elite STF while contributing a grand total of 800dps and you should just haul them through it without so much as a whimper.
Yes like in NW when you have the wrong Class you get kicked, that is abuse since no one has the Right to tell others how and what they Play.
That's not abuse, that's a failure of the system matching people up appropriately and being kicked in such a situation isn't about YOU, its about the class loadout to ensure the mission is achievable by the group. No one is telling you what to play, they're telling you they have low confidence that the mission will be won and not be an utter waste of time with your class in combination with their classes. Again, its not all about YOU. And yes, if a group votes to kick you under the premise of receiving a completely new, unknown, random person, then they should have that right. If you don't like it, requeue. If you keep getting votekicked, then perhaps you should check your gear and consider a non-elite first.
What we need is a report afk button. Timer to engage begins...you don't make it. no soup for you. Tough but fair
Likely one of the best ideas I've seen so far.
Said NO to Arc. Gets punished by not being given a free outfit, free lobi, and free shuttle. Now forced to use Arc's site when trying to get to STO site. Still not rewards for beta testing the Arc website by force. Bravo Cryptic.
i doubt that mentality will get any of us anything.
what happens if you needed to afk because you got a phone call and say something terrible happened to one of your family, you think you deserved that like the afk penalty? when the boot is on the other foot, dont assume your immune from it either.
AFK means not paying attention to the instance and not participating.
Trying to make excuses for why it happens serves no legitimate purpose.
Actions of this type affect others, not just the person doing it. If you have to pee, leave the damn queue before the STF starts and address your business.
If you are a doctor or are on call for your job, and you get a phone call that you absolutely must take, apologize to the team and leave.
If someone knocks on your door and you absolutely must answer is because you are waiting for a package delivery, apologize to the team and leave.
We ALL know stuff happens. This is a video game that when real like interferes will, and should, take a backseat.
If whatever is happening in your RL is that much more important than what is happening in game, then you should be willing to accept any penalty, including the cooldown.
And yes, I have had to do it. It pains me when it happens because I understand my responsibility to the rest of the team. I apologized and left and while that hurts the team, it also shows to them that whatever has happened that forced me to leave was such that I accepted that I was leaving and was myself going to get dinged and I wasn't willing to remain behind and profit off of someone elses hard work.
So no, excuses for why people AKF in a team instance are not acceptable.
Pull up your big boy/girl britches and act like an adult instead of a petulant child.
And with VTK, one person pays the price for 3 or 4 trolls. You're kidding yourself if you don't believe it will happen.
How does this solve the problem for non-troll pre-mades who get stuck with a leecher?
This thread is really less about VTK and more about bringing attention once again the the AFK problem and Cryptics failure at addressing it. I could care less if they added the VTK to the game or not. I've always considered their entire public queue system a failure to begin with.
How does this solve the problem for non-troll pre-mades who get stuck with a leecher?
It doesn't, that's the price they choose to pay for not filling out their group. I'm talking about four players in a premade not being able to VTK. Again, the thread is less about VTK and more about finding a fix.
You know Cryptic has Jumped the Proverbial Shark when they introduced Tractor Pulling to Star Trek Online!
Nah, I think we understand it just fine and find it far less abusive than the current system. The difference between the current setup and a VTK is that currently four players pay the price for the farmer over one poor TRIBBLE being kicked from the team for no reason and without a penalty.
Simply removing the ability of VTK from pre-made teams gets rid of troll groups.
The difference here being that the four victims still have the possibility to get what they came for. The 'poor TRIBBLE' isn't so lucky.
I agree with you about the queues though
"So my fun is wrong?"
No. Your fun makes everyone else's fun wrong by default.
Actually, it's a mentality like yours that doesn't work. You're essentially asking for a reprieve from being penalized because you feel your reason for going AFK is legitimate. What isn't sinking in is that the reason doesn't matter. You're AFK. You're breaking a rule and will get the appropriate punishment.
You're also assuming I haven't been there. I've had to leave matches due to phone/kids/RL issues. Guess what? I apologize to the team and exit the match and accept the 1 hour penalty. That's the proper, courteous thing to do IMO.
^^ Also 100% agreed. Haven't read everything yet; but people thinking they should be exempt from incurring a penalty, because, Gawd forbid, they had a good (*cough*) reason to be asbsent, is ludicrous. You play, you get a reward; you don't play, you get a penalty. Simple as that.
Right now, you could have four trolling players form a team, queue up, go kill themselves and remain dead for the entire mission. Leaving one poor TRIBBLE to either go it alone or take a leaver penalty. Which then allows those four trolls to re-queue and do it again...
You know Cryptic has Jumped the Proverbial Shark when they introduced Tractor Pulling to Star Trek Online!
Right now, you could have four trolling players form a team, queue up, go kill themselves and remain dead for the entire mission. Leaving one poor TRIBBLE to either go it alone or take a leaver penalty. Which then allows those four trolls to re-queue and do it again...
And if there was a vote system the 4 trolls would vote the person out. If there were no system they would sit afk anyways. I don't get what you're trying to imply -- are you saying we should make the game troll proof? This would be a monumental achievement on its own for any game, much less a small F2P-P2W game.
Said NO to Arc. Gets punished by not being given a free outfit, free lobi, and free shuttle. Now forced to use Arc's site when trying to get to STO site. Still not rewards for beta testing the Arc website by force. Bravo Cryptic.
Secondly, you're not going to get people to agree with you that votekick is an option because there are too many sociopaths that play this game that believe that they have the unalienable right to bring the crappiest build to an elite STF while contributing a grand total of 800dps and you should just haul them through it without so much as a whimper.
I don't think I've really met many people who do this on purpose. Most players are just bad. They have no idea how to build a ship, and the game doesn't teach them. On top of that, they have no tools for assessing just HOW bad they are. In order for them to KNOW they are dealing 800 dps, they'd have to resort to a third-party tool. These people don't know that they suck until someone tells them, and given the hostile attitudes that people can take when doing so...
Although this new AFKer rule is a good thing,it does have its flaws though in a way.
What if someones door bell is ringing. you can not simply ignore it,as it could be an important person there.
Sudden need for bathroom breaks is another one,or a phone ringing at anytime of day or night.
I think the AFK rule has not considered the above mentioned.
This. I mean what if your wife goes into labor at the exact moment you're running Conduit and are only 900 dil away from getting an Avenger? People should think about that.
This. I mean what if your wife goes into labor at the exact moment you're running Conduit and are only 900 dil away from getting an Avenger? People should think about that.
I think if this happens you will be gone for a lot longer than 2 hours and won't notice.
Secondly, you're not going to get people to agree with you that votekick is an option because there are too many sociopaths that play this game that believe that they have the unalienable right to bring the crappiest build to an elite STF while contributing a grand total of 800dps and you should just haul them through it without so much as a whimper.
If anything, opinions like yours underline the very reason NOT to use a vote-kick system, as, before the thing is even implemented, peeps already announce they will (ab)use it for reasons *other* than AFK-ing. Q.E.D.
Firstly, I saw someone try this already, and no loot dropped for him. I smiled because this type of concern has been posted over and over again and I was happy to see it was dead wrong.
Uhh huh. I said a while back the only people that would come here crying "exploits! now remove it!" would be the peps hit hard by it (the afkers themselves). I knew from the thread's title that is precisely what it was, and nice to have an admin back that up.
Said NO to Arc. Gets punished by not being given a free outfit, free lobi, and free shuttle. Now forced to use Arc's site when trying to get to STO site. Still not rewards for beta testing the Arc website by force. Bravo Cryptic.
I think if this happens you will be gone for a lot longer than 2 hours and won't notice.
But what if your house is on fire and your children are running around screaming that their skin is burning, but you're in the middle of Colony Invasion and need a few more fleet marks to finish off that starbase project?
Now I have to consider whether or not to put the flames out on my children or getting a 2 hour afk penalty. Thanks, Cryptic.
Although this new AFKer rule is a good thing,it does have its flaws though in a way.
What if someones door bell is ringing. you can not simply ignore it,as it could be an important person there.
Sudden need for bathroom breaks is another one,or a phone ringing at anytime of day or night.
I think the AFK rule has not considered the above mentioned.
Announce the problem and leave the match. If grandma is at the door with cookie and milk, the match will be over by the time you are done socializing. If it's the mailman, he knew where to toss my box in the bushes when I was in the shower :eek:. And if ya gotta go so bad you are away that long, you need a laxative. :P
Seriously though, mocking aside, the situations you listed are AFK for a reason other than farming. Simply leave the match. You are of no use to your team when you are AFK for valid or invalid reasons. If it is an STF, you will get stuck with a penalty either way but when you gotta go, you gotta go.
But what if your house is on fire and your children are running around screaming that their skin is burning, but you're in the middle of Colony Invasion and need a few more fleet marks to finish off that starbase project?
I think that if you've fought your way into the middle of an event already, you're probably gonna escape the AFK penalty. Even if you don't, you're going to be gone a lot longer than 2 hours. Perhaps permanently.
As the Klingon proverb states, "Only a fool fights in a burning house."
Comments
Star Trek Online, Now with out the Trek....
Hold up! Can you really get round the afk penalty by just not respawning!?! My god! That is just baby-town frolics.
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
Are you completely nuts? :eek:
Actually, the problems with their AFK fix have been covered many times prior to it ever being released and any trained monkey can see how to get around them. It's not exactly rocket science dunmovyn.
Dev's already working on this... should be updated in the near future.
Star Trek Online, Now with out the Trek....
My PvE/PvP hybrid skill tree
Firstly, I saw someone try this already, and no loot dropped for him. I smiled because this type of concern has been posted over and over again and I was happy to see it was dead wrong.
Secondly, you're not going to get people to agree with you that votekick is an option because there are too many sociopaths that play this game that believe that they have the unalienable right to bring the crappiest build to an elite STF while contributing a grand total of 800dps and you should just haul them through it without so much as a whimper.
That's not abuse, that's a failure of the system matching people up appropriately and being kicked in such a situation isn't about YOU, its about the class loadout to ensure the mission is achievable by the group. No one is telling you what to play, they're telling you they have low confidence that the mission will be won and not be an utter waste of time with your class in combination with their classes. Again, its not all about YOU. And yes, if a group votes to kick you under the premise of receiving a completely new, unknown, random person, then they should have that right. If you don't like it, requeue. If you keep getting votekicked, then perhaps you should check your gear and consider a non-elite first.
Likely one of the best ideas I've seen so far.
AFK means not paying attention to the instance and not participating.
Trying to make excuses for why it happens serves no legitimate purpose.
Actions of this type affect others, not just the person doing it. If you have to pee, leave the damn queue before the STF starts and address your business.
If you are a doctor or are on call for your job, and you get a phone call that you absolutely must take, apologize to the team and leave.
If someone knocks on your door and you absolutely must answer is because you are waiting for a package delivery, apologize to the team and leave.
We ALL know stuff happens. This is a video game that when real like interferes will, and should, take a backseat.
If whatever is happening in your RL is that much more important than what is happening in game, then you should be willing to accept any penalty, including the cooldown.
And yes, I have had to do it. It pains me when it happens because I understand my responsibility to the rest of the team. I apologized and left and while that hurts the team, it also shows to them that whatever has happened that forced me to leave was such that I accepted that I was leaving and was myself going to get dinged and I wasn't willing to remain behind and profit off of someone elses hard work.
So no, excuses for why people AKF in a team instance are not acceptable.
Pull up your big boy/girl britches and act like an adult instead of a petulant child.
This thread is really less about VTK and more about bringing attention once again the the AFK problem and Cryptics failure at addressing it. I could care less if they added the VTK to the game or not. I've always considered their entire public queue system a failure to begin with.
It doesn't, that's the price they choose to pay for not filling out their group. I'm talking about four players in a premade not being able to VTK. Again, the thread is less about VTK and more about finding a fix.
The difference here being that the four victims still have the possibility to get what they came for. The 'poor TRIBBLE' isn't so lucky.
I agree with you about the queues though
No. Your fun makes everyone else's fun wrong by default.
^^ Also 100% agreed. Haven't read everything yet; but people thinking they should be exempt from incurring a penalty, because, Gawd forbid, they had a good (*cough*) reason to be asbsent, is ludicrous. You play, you get a reward; you don't play, you get a penalty. Simple as that.
And if there was a vote system the 4 trolls would vote the person out. If there were no system they would sit afk anyways. I don't get what you're trying to imply -- are you saying we should make the game troll proof? This would be a monumental achievement on its own for any game, much less a small F2P-P2W game.
Ah, you seek meaning? Then listen to the music, not the song.
Put your money where your mouth is.
...and they still get an AFK penalty: http://tinypic.com/r/1z307q1/5
Tested this on NWS just now. Myth, busted
Cheers,
Brandon =/\=
This. I mean what if your wife goes into labor at the exact moment you're running Conduit and are only 900 dil away from getting an Avenger? People should think about that.
You should consider doing "STO Mythbusters" where you devote an episode to proving or busting an STO rumor or commonly-believed 'fact'.
If anything, opinions like yours underline the very reason NOT to use a vote-kick system, as, before the thing is even implemented, peeps already announce they will (ab)use it for reasons *other* than AFK-ing. Q.E.D.
Uhh huh. I said a while back the only people that would come here crying "exploits! now remove it!" would be the peps hit hard by it (the afkers themselves). I knew from the thread's title that is precisely what it was, and nice to have an admin back that up.
But what if your house is on fire and your children are running around screaming that their skin is burning, but you're in the middle of Colony Invasion and need a few more fleet marks to finish off that starbase project?
Now I have to consider whether or not to put the flames out on my children or getting a 2 hour afk penalty. Thanks, Cryptic.
Announce the problem and leave the match. If grandma is at the door with cookie and milk, the match will be over by the time you are done socializing. If it's the mailman, he knew where to toss my box in the bushes when I was in the shower :eek:. And if ya gotta go so bad you are away that long, you need a laxative. :P
Seriously though, mocking aside, the situations you listed are AFK for a reason other than farming. Simply leave the match. You are of no use to your team when you are AFK for valid or invalid reasons. If it is an STF, you will get stuck with a penalty either way but when you gotta go, you gotta go.
Because you stayed dead when the mission finished. Had you respawned before it was over, you would not have seen the penalty.
As the Klingon proverb states, "Only a fool fights in a burning house."