OP I think you're yucky. Me and my GF are both obsessed with femininity lol.. but whatever floats your boat. You wanna make some gross man-girl, I think you should be allowed to.
EDIT: Want to clarify it's purely squick, I have nothing against you on a person level. I just find masculinity gross. My best friend is a man.. it's just.. you know, ew.
♪ I'm going around not in circles but in spirographs.
It's pretty much this hard to keep just one timeline intact. ♪
Well, my issue is probably the fact, that the shape of male and female genders are overly exaggerated, in a cartoony way... there's no middle ground in STO. In real life, there are feminine males, but also masculine females and there's absolutely nothing wrong with it. And then there's middleground, but the male and female shapes are not as different, as painted in this games and several others. The shapes can completelly blend in, especially with the right clothing - or the shape can also be underlined, again, based on the clothes you wear.
Saying, I am yucky for wanting to have less exaggerated shape and wanting to go for more masculine female.. well, thank you. Everyone has opinion, personal tastes and all that. I for one do not care about 'femininity', because it tends to be exaggerated too much in most games, without the ability to choose something different.
[10:20] Your Lunge deals 4798 (2580) Physical Damage(Critical) to Tosk of Borg.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator "bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh." "Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness."~Day[9] "Your fun isn't wrong."~LaughingTrendy
Well, my issue is probably the fact, that the shape of male and female genders are overly exaggerated, in a cartoony way... there's no middle ground in STO. In real life, there are feminine males, but also masculine females and there's absolutely nothing wrong with it. And then there's middleground, but the male and female shapes are not as different, as painted in this games and several others. The shapes can completelly blend in, especially with the right clothing - or the shape can also be underlined, again, based on the clothes you wear.
Saying, I am yucky for wanting to have less exaggerated shape and wanting to go for more masculine female.. well, thank you. Everyone has opinion, personal tastes and all that. I for one do not care about 'femininity', because it tends to be exaggerated too much in most games, without the ability to choose something different.
I like you Op, you speak the truth, if I had a dollar for every time someone thought I was a girl in baggy clothing, I would have 7, maybe 8 dollars.
Though I would like to point out, with the exception of stubble, it is possible to make a girly looking guy. Not easy, but possible.
Also have you tried using armour in the game? I think it makes my bridge officer (Who is supposed to be the tough Yar type) look pretty masculine
Or, when all else fails, just give your Breen a feminine name and pretend it doesn't say male
"I am a travelor of both time and space to be where I have been"
I like you Op, you speak the truth, if I had a dollar for every time someone thought I was a girl in baggy clothing, I would have 7, maybe 8 dollars.
Though I would like to point out, with the exception of stubble, it is possible to make a girly looking guy. Not easy, but possible.
Also have you tried using armour in the game? I think it makes my bridge officer (Who is supposed to be the tough Yar type) look pretty masculine
Or, when all else fails, just give your Breen a feminine name and pretend it doesn't say male
Well, I tried armor as the first thing when I saw the issues with the boobies, but guess what.. it has cup shapes there. I could go lenghts why that is bad on armor (totally not sternum safe - and I do know, as somene who wore a real life armor, as I did sword-fighting/medieval reenactement), so I'll pass on that.
Tbh, I've been thinking about this over and over, and the fact the characters have exaggerated narrow waist shape, wide hips - it makes it impossible to make the character so it doesn't scream "female & TRIBBLE" and it does look unnatural - she wears clothes, which are not intended to be tight, so it should not be as exaggerated at all.
Reposting the original picture and what it'd do, if they made the middle part a bit thicker... red circles of area of issue, left picture the original model, right has my humble Photoshop skills applied to it..
If they made thet part of the body thicker, frankly, it'd be much closer to intended look... lowering the minimum size of TRIBBLE would be a great bonus to it.
[10:20] Your Lunge deals 4798 (2580) Physical Damage(Critical) to Tosk of Borg.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator "bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh." "Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness."~Day[9] "Your fun isn't wrong."~LaughingTrendy
Well, my issue is probably the fact, that the shape of male and female genders are overly exaggerated, in a cartoony way... there's no middle ground in STO. In real life, there are feminine males, but also masculine females and there's absolutely nothing wrong with it. And then there's middleground, but the male and female shapes are not as different, as painted in this games and several others. The shapes can completelly blend in, especially with the right clothing - or the shape can also be underlined, again, based on the clothes you wear.
One could argue that the body shapes in this game and in most other media is not exaggerated. Granted, not too many people today has body shapes like that, but humans in all shapes and sizes, including STO body shapes(sans alien species of course) do in fact exist. Not to mention that this is a game about the future. But note that this does not go against the point of this thread. This is just a fair acknowledgement.
Saying, I am yucky for wanting to have less exaggerated shape and wanting to go for more masculine female.. well, thank you. Everyone has opinion, personal tastes and all that. I for one do not care about 'femininity', because it tends to be exaggerated too much in most games, without the ability to choose something different.
This issue goes beyond personal opinion. It's about the choice to express your opinion. Granted, the plausibility of this suggestion being worthwhile from a development standpoint is important, but I believe that it would be worth investing in.
Well, I tried armor as the first thing when I saw the issues with the boobies, but guess what.. it has cup shapes there. I could go lenghts why that is bad on armor (totally not sternum safe - and I do know, as somene who wore a real life armor, as I did sword-fighting/medieval reenactement), so I'll pass on that.
Tbh, I've been thinking about this over and over, and the fact the characters have exaggerated narrow waist shape, wide hips - it makes it impossible to make the character so it doesn't scream "female & TRIBBLE" and it does look unnatural - she wears clothes, which are not intended to be tight, so it should not be as exaggerated at all.
Reposting the original picture and what it'd do, if they made the middle part a bit thicker... red circles of area of issue, left picture the original model, right has my humble Photoshop skills applied to it..
If they made thet part of the body thicker, frankly, it'd be much closer to intended look... lowering the minimum size of TRIBBLE would be a great bonus to it.
Looking at the pictures side by side really shows off the problem well
Hell, half my friends are closer to the second than the first (I don't have male friends)
And yeah, I realize how bad that would be for armour to have cup shapes in it, with the deflection of energy, but may I ask, out of an innocent ignorance, wouldn't that be more comfortable for females? (I am not saying it is a good thing, and I know comfort is not a priority, I am just curious)
"I am a travelor of both time and space to be where I have been"
Looking at the pictures side by side really shows off the problem well
Hell, half my friends are closer to the second than the first (I don't have male friends)
And yeah, I realize how bad that would be for armour to have cup shapes in it, with the deflection of energy, but may I ask, out of an innocent ignorance, wouldn't that be more comfortable for females? (I am not saying it is a good thing, and I know comfort is not a priority, I am just curious)
You don't wear armor to be comfortable, unless it's for parade, but even so, I'd never wear armor shaped like that. You wear it so it protects you. That's common misconception right there. If it was done properly, you'd not shape the boob cups to copy the shape, instead, for more comfort, you'd make the armor so it provides more space for TRIBBLE, so that they'd not be crushed underneath.
And to answer your question - if you shaped it to copy the shape the TRIBBLE or simply made enough space for them with the armor - the effect would be the same. More comfort. Except, the solution I present still offers sternum safe variety.
And well - as for your remark that people you know are closer to my edited variant - that's because some women don't wear super tight clothing, which copy the body shape as if no clothes were even on it, shape, which is still a tad questionable in STO anyways, and as such, they don't look as anorectic as this variant does - to simply exaggerate the fact the character is a female. That is imo unnecessaary, but for all I care, if we had choice to go more neutral, it should remain there as well, for those, who do like the current shape.
[10:20] Your Lunge deals 4798 (2580) Physical Damage(Critical) to Tosk of Borg.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator "bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh." "Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness."~Day[9] "Your fun isn't wrong."~LaughingTrendy
I've always thought about female armor shape in MMOs too. And I say let 'em have the sexy armor... but give them more functional armor as well. Also, reduce the defenses of sexy armor by the proportionate skin that's exposed. Gives players a choice that way; either look good while getting a sword shoved through your cleavage window or kick some TRIBBLE in your full-body suit.
I've always thought about female armor shape in MMOs too. And I say let 'em have the sexy armor... but give them more functional armor as well. Also, reduce the defenses of sexy armor by the proportionate skin that's exposed. Gives players a choice that way; either look good while getting a sword shoved through your cleavage window or kick some TRIBBLE in your full-body suit.
What?
You want realism in armour? :eek: :eek: :eek:
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
On a more serious note - when I put my close combat specialist kit as visible, it does the job of mitigating both the TRIBBLE, as well as the anorectic waists, as it is kinda armor'ish and doesn't have the boob cups shaped thingies, like the imho, ugly classic armors.
Problem is, it is reallllllly fugly, looks plastic, is totally not Trekky and the colour combinations suck - the Odyssey uniform looks so much better.
I want proper enhancements of the model, where we can adjust the waist slider as well, and bewb reduction for the minimum setting. When something is set to minimum, it should be actually, well, minimal. <.< >.>
Thinking about making a new, more orderly topic, to propose female model improvements/enhancements, such as the addition of sliders for waist (as someone nicely pointed out, body shapes and what is good and to likeable is very subjective), as well as to reitrate the need for reduced size of minimal boob size slider setting. But it's late, so maybe later. With hopes that the topic won't derive into namecalling and hate, such as this one.
[10:20] Your Lunge deals 4798 (2580) Physical Damage(Critical) to Tosk of Borg.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator "bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh." "Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness."~Day[9] "Your fun isn't wrong."~LaughingTrendy
On a more serious note - when I put my close combat specialist kit as visible, it does the job of mitigating both the TRIBBLE, as well as the anorectic waists, as it is kinda armor'ish and doesn't have the boob cups shaped thingies, like the imho, ugly classic armors.
Problem is, it is reallllllly fugly, looks plastic, is totally not Trekky and the colour combinations suck - the Odyssey uniform looks so much better.
I see what you mean about not being very trek. I almost thought you used photoshop to show us commander Shepard.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
As long as I still get to keep my big TRIBBLE, I don't see why this would be a problem.
I would like to see them fix some clipping issues with the bigger TRIBBLE, though. The TNG/DS9/Voyager combadges disappear under them.
Costume clipping is all over the place. Sashes clip into the bosom if your slider is too high. Some belts disappear into the body if the waist is too small.
Sometimes feels like they have one model they want to work. Absolute medium across the board for all sliders.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
Well, Yesterday's Enterprise chest stuff clips at some uniforms because of TRIBBLE. And mine are, naturally, set to minimum size.. and yet they still get in the way & it clips. I'd imagine that'd be an issue for chest gear for females in general...
The fact, stuff clips with the bigger sizes is known to me also, poor women get their combadges stabbed right into them... ouch.
I noticed that the TRIBBLE slider is actually adding extra TRIBBLE over the model's default ones, over those, when set to minimum; which means the female model has these C-sized TRIBBLE, when zeroing the boob slider, as kinda part of the female model - which is very bad and should be re-worked. That's imo also causing their unnatural shape as well, when set to higher settings.
[10:20] Your Lunge deals 4798 (2580) Physical Damage(Critical) to Tosk of Borg.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator "bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh." "Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness."~Day[9] "Your fun isn't wrong."~LaughingTrendy
Well, Yesterday's Enterprise chest stuff clips at some uniforms because of TRIBBLE. And mine are, naturally, set to minimum size.. and yet they still get in the way & it clips. I'd imagine that'd be an issue for chest gear for females in general...
The fact, stuff clips with the bigger sizes is known to me also, poor women get their combadges stabbed right into them... ouch.
I noticed that the TRIBBLE slider is actually adding extra TRIBBLE over the model's default ones, over those, when set to minimum; which means the female model has these C-sized TRIBBLE, when zeroing the boob slider, as kinda part of the female model - which is very bad and should be re-worked. That's imo also causing their unnatural shape as well, when set to higher settings.
The weird part is that I don't have that issue.... But the char I use it on doesn't have odd proportions.
The weird part is that I don't have that issue.... But the char I use it on doesn't have odd proportions.
Oh and did oyu see the floating combadge variant?
Lol, yes, floating combadge.. always wondered how 'special' someone has to be, to get a floating combadge...
[10:20] Your Lunge deals 4798 (2580) Physical Damage(Critical) to Tosk of Borg.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator "bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh." "Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness."~Day[9] "Your fun isn't wrong."~LaughingTrendy
Yeah, not sure how or why but the chest strap pieces don't clip on that outfit.
Well, it surely does clip on the Odyssey uniform.. And it's really the boob size, because not even reducing torso bulk fixed the issue. (and it's not unreasonably set either, have two bars only)
[10:20] Your Lunge deals 4798 (2580) Physical Damage(Critical) to Tosk of Borg.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator "bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh." "Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness."~Day[9] "Your fun isn't wrong."~LaughingTrendy
Yeah, not sure how or why but the chest strap pieces don't clip on that outfit.
So it does not clip on the veteran gold Jupiter jacket? :rolleyes: of course not, what was I thinking. Hmm, Need to test on a twok jacket, if it is not having problems on bulky jackets then it is scaled wrong for the slimmer body jackets.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
I've made a topic covering female torso/waists/hips specifically, how it can be enhanced/improved, rather than just focusing on one setting of it. If someone can close this huge mess, I'd be glad. Instead, please, look over more broader suggestion. Thank you.
[10:20] Your Lunge deals 4798 (2580) Physical Damage(Critical) to Tosk of Borg.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator "bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh." "Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness."~Day[9] "Your fun isn't wrong."~LaughingTrendy
Comments
EDIT: Want to clarify it's purely squick, I have nothing against you on a person level. I just find masculinity gross. My best friend is a man.. it's just.. you know, ew.
It's pretty much this hard to keep just one timeline intact. ♪
Saying, I am yucky for wanting to have less exaggerated shape and wanting to go for more masculine female.. well, thank you. Everyone has opinion, personal tastes and all that. I for one do not care about 'femininity', because it tends to be exaggerated too much in most games, without the ability to choose something different.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator
"bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh."
"Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness." ~Day[9]
"Your fun isn't wrong." ~LaughingTrendy
Find me on Twitterverse - @jodarkrider
Speak for yourself, I have serious hourglass action going on ^_^
It's pretty much this hard to keep just one timeline intact. ♪
I like you Op, you speak the truth, if I had a dollar for every time someone thought I was a girl in baggy clothing, I would have 7, maybe 8 dollars.
Though I would like to point out, with the exception of stubble, it is possible to make a girly looking guy. Not easy, but possible.
Also have you tried using armour in the game? I think it makes my bridge officer (Who is supposed to be the tough Yar type) look pretty masculine
Or, when all else fails, just give your Breen a feminine name and pretend it doesn't say male
Tbh, I've been thinking about this over and over, and the fact the characters have exaggerated narrow waist shape, wide hips - it makes it impossible to make the character so it doesn't scream "female & TRIBBLE" and it does look unnatural - she wears clothes, which are not intended to be tight, so it should not be as exaggerated at all.
Reposting the original picture and what it'd do, if they made the middle part a bit thicker... red circles of area of issue, left picture the original model, right has my humble Photoshop skills applied to it..
If they made thet part of the body thicker, frankly, it'd be much closer to intended look... lowering the minimum size of TRIBBLE would be a great bonus to it.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator
"bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh."
"Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness." ~Day[9]
"Your fun isn't wrong." ~LaughingTrendy
Find me on Twitterverse - @jodarkrider
This issue goes beyond personal opinion. It's about the choice to express your opinion. Granted, the plausibility of this suggestion being worthwhile from a development standpoint is important, but I believe that it would be worth investing in.
Helpful Tools: Dictionary.com - Logical fallacies - Random generator - Word generator - Color tool - Extra Credits - List of common English language errors - New T6 Big booty tutorial
Looking at the pictures side by side really shows off the problem well
Hell, half my friends are closer to the second than the first (I don't have male friends)
And yeah, I realize how bad that would be for armour to have cup shapes in it, with the deflection of energy, but may I ask, out of an innocent ignorance, wouldn't that be more comfortable for females? (I am not saying it is a good thing, and I know comfort is not a priority, I am just curious)
And to answer your question - if you shaped it to copy the shape the TRIBBLE or simply made enough space for them with the armor - the effect would be the same. More comfort. Except, the solution I present still offers sternum safe variety.
And well - as for your remark that people you know are closer to my edited variant - that's because some women don't wear super tight clothing, which copy the body shape as if no clothes were even on it, shape, which is still a tad questionable in STO anyways, and as such, they don't look as anorectic as this variant does - to simply exaggerate the fact the character is a female. That is imo unnecessaary, but for all I care, if we had choice to go more neutral, it should remain there as well, for those, who do like the current shape.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator
"bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh."
"Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness." ~Day[9]
"Your fun isn't wrong." ~LaughingTrendy
Find me on Twitterverse - @jodarkrider
Helpful Tools: Dictionary.com - Logical fallacies - Random generator - Word generator - Color tool - Extra Credits - List of common English language errors - New T6 Big booty tutorial
What?
You want realism in armour? :eek: :eek: :eek:
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
Helpful Tools: Dictionary.com - Logical fallacies - Random generator - Word generator - Color tool - Extra Credits - List of common English language errors - New T6 Big booty tutorial
On a more serious note - when I put my close combat specialist kit as visible, it does the job of mitigating both the TRIBBLE, as well as the anorectic waists, as it is kinda armor'ish and doesn't have the boob cups shaped thingies, like the imho, ugly classic armors.
Problem is, it is reallllllly fugly, looks plastic, is totally not Trekky and the colour combinations suck - the Odyssey uniform looks so much better.
I want proper enhancements of the model, where we can adjust the waist slider as well, and bewb reduction for the minimum setting. When something is set to minimum, it should be actually, well, minimal. <.< >.>
Thinking about making a new, more orderly topic, to propose female model improvements/enhancements, such as the addition of sliders for waist (as someone nicely pointed out, body shapes and what is good and to likeable is very subjective), as well as to reitrate the need for reduced size of minimal boob size slider setting. But it's late, so maybe later. With hopes that the topic won't derive into namecalling and hate, such as this one.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator
"bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh."
"Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness." ~Day[9]
"Your fun isn't wrong." ~LaughingTrendy
Find me on Twitterverse - @jodarkrider
I see what you mean about not being very trek. I almost thought you used photoshop to show us commander Shepard.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
I would like to see them fix some clipping issues with the bigger TRIBBLE, though. The TNG/DS9/Voyager combadges disappear under them.
Costume clipping is all over the place. Sashes clip into the bosom if your slider is too high. Some belts disappear into the body if the waist is too small.
Sometimes feels like they have one model they want to work. Absolute medium across the board for all sliders.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
The fact, stuff clips with the bigger sizes is known to me also, poor women get their combadges stabbed right into them... ouch.
I noticed that the TRIBBLE slider is actually adding extra TRIBBLE over the model's default ones, over those, when set to minimum; which means the female model has these C-sized TRIBBLE, when zeroing the boob slider, as kinda part of the female model - which is very bad and should be re-worked. That's imo also causing their unnatural shape as well, when set to higher settings.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator
"bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh."
"Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness." ~Day[9]
"Your fun isn't wrong." ~LaughingTrendy
Find me on Twitterverse - @jodarkrider
Oh and did oyu see the floating combadge variant?
My character Tsin'xing
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator
"bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh."
"Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness." ~Day[9]
"Your fun isn't wrong." ~LaughingTrendy
Find me on Twitterverse - @jodarkrider
Yeah, not sure how or why but the chest strap pieces don't clip on that outfit.
My character Tsin'xing
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator
"bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh."
"Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness." ~Day[9]
"Your fun isn't wrong." ~LaughingTrendy
Find me on Twitterverse - @jodarkrider
Original Join Date: January 30th, 2010
So it does not clip on the veteran gold Jupiter jacket? :rolleyes: of course not, what was I thinking. Hmm, Need to test on a twok jacket, if it is not having problems on bulky jackets then it is scaled wrong for the slimmer body jackets.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=918041
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator
"bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh."
"Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness." ~Day[9]
"Your fun isn't wrong." ~LaughingTrendy
Find me on Twitterverse - @jodarkrider