I know redshirt patch notes, redshirt is for beta testing before it goes to holodeck right now, if anyone has a concern they can test it for themselves... But yeah thats just nuckin futz isnt it! Maybe I need to see a shrink...
Join Date: Nobody cares.
"I'm drunk, whats your excuse for being an idiot?" - Unknown drunk man. :eek:
Simpler just to give players the powers to Kick AFKers and then work ways to handle griefers who abuse that tool.
That won't work... A System in the Hands of Players is doomed from the start...
To dissuade griefing they would have to check eack and every "vote" to see if it is legit and that cannot be done on the fly... the damage will be done by the time even an automated System is able to determine that and then?
We have the trolled player with a Ban and then what? The Griefers are banned too? Do they get a "You cannot vote for the next 2 hours" Message?
And I can understand when RL gets in the way... but seriously... don't you people have cordless phones? Do you have to be physically away for too long to speak on the phone?
Or are you unable to do two things at once? I don't mean it in a derogatory way, If there is something preventing you to do this it's sad...
If there is an emergency or whatever a 2 hour ban should be the least of your concerns and you should be happy to come back to see it still in effect.
That won't work... A System in the Hands of Players is doomed from the start...
Again with the silly assumption. It works in other games.
To dissuade griefing they would have to check eack and every "vote" to see if it is legit and that cannot be done on the fly...
Ridiculous. It's sufficient to review after the fact in the event of a complaint.
We have the trolled player with a Ban and then what?
Typically you don't need to ban with a vote-kick system.
The Griefers are banned too? Do they get a "You cannot vote for the next 2 hours" Message?
3 day ban from the game should do it.
To sum up: stop pretending that vote-kick is impossible, it works fine in many other MMOs.
Anyway, for now the point is moot. Cryptic has decided to try their hand at automated AFK detection. My bet is it takes less than 24 hours for people to crack it.
"Participation in PVP-related activities is so low on an hourly, daily, weekly, and monthly basis that we could in fact just completely take it out of STO and it would not impact the overall number of people [who] log in to the game and play in any significant way." -Gozer, Cryptic PvP Dev
Well done cryptic! The AFK problem has been a long term issue and its great to see it being addressed.
However I am also very concerned about "carries", specifically low DPS players who join elites and who expect to be carried through STFs they have no business being in. They barely contribute to the team and soak up a team slot that someone more useful could take. I'm talking about those players who can't even stop non-hostile probes in Khitomer Accord Space Elite, the players who die to a single Borg Sphere and the ones with a dozen ship injuries before the match even starts. :mad:
Let's get rid of the dead weight players next - if they don't know what they are doing then they should be forced to stick to normal mode STFs until they can parse a minimum amount of DPS .
It doesn't even need to be that high, but when fighter pets are drawing aggro off low DPS players you know there's a problem that needs to be fixed. Let's get rid of the dead weight players next by implementing a system that kicks mid-match if their in game combat log drops below a certain DPS output.
That won't work... A System in the Hands of Players is doomed from the start...
To dissuade griefing they would have to check eack and every "vote" to see if it is legit and that cannot be done on the fly... the damage will be done by the time even an automated System is able to determine that and then?
We have the trolled player with a Ban and then what? The Griefers are banned too? Do they get a "You cannot vote for the next 2 hours" Message?
And I can understand when RL gets in the way... but seriously... don't you people have cordless phones? Do you have to be physically away for too long to speak on the phone?
Or are you unable to do two things at once? I don't mean it in a derogatory way, If there is something preventing you to do this it's sad...
If there is an emergency or whatever a 2 hour ban should be the least of your concerns and you should be happy to come back to see it still in effect.
You realize there's been a kick system for private queues since the beginning of STO and nobody ever griefed using that. And mentioned above, other games use the kick system without any major problems either.
A Vote Kick is simple compared to what they are approaching with this proposal, where they have to program in all sorts of griefer variables to ensure innocent players don't get punished. Like above where I mentioned people getting stuck in the one map. And what of legit AFKers who have to be called away? There are parents who play and sometimes the kids drag you away from the computer at inopportune times.
So I really doubt this system will be very effective, especially once the griefers map out the boundaries. Which means someone from the STO team has to be monitoring.
Please... get your rose tinted rainbow bunny glasses off and look at the reality...
It IS abused... everywhere... from a lot of people... people are a-holes... no matter what...
It does NOT work in other games...
Sure, it occasionally works as intended... but there will be too many innocent victims for one real offender...
And yes... it doesn't mean it has to ban directly... but still, vote-kick right at the end, shortly before or after the final so the Trolled player gets no loot and has the global CD...
Or if you have a whole fleet, just keep vote-kicking players in several instances at once... you will always get fresh meat because of the lovely system that will put you in already started but not full instances...
And this WILL happen...
Edit:
If you're a parent and your Kid drags you away... or rather has to drag you away you're doing something very wrong...
If you put your concern about a mere 2 hour ban before that... sorry, anything more and I am sure to be banned from here...
Edit Edit:
Oh and yes, the PRIVATE Queues... they are not public... you're there with a select few that you know...
So... I don't know what your point is?
Just because it doesn't happen with people more or less close to you... doesn't mean it will not happen with others...
Please... get your rose tinted rainbow bunny glasses off and look at the reality...
It IS abused... everywhere... from a lot of people... people are a-holes... no matter what...
It does NOT work in other games...
Sure, it occasionally works as intended... but there will be too many innocent victims for one real offender...
It works far more often than not. Which is why MMO developers continue to use such systems. This is not "rose tinted rainbow bunny glasses," this is reality.
Btw, what color is rose tinted rainbow anyway?
"Participation in PVP-related activities is so low on an hourly, daily, weekly, and monthly basis that we could in fact just completely take it out of STO and it would not impact the overall number of people [who] log in to the game and play in any significant way." -Gozer, Cryptic PvP Dev
No... they continue to use and "tweek" this system solemnly because it means far less work for Devs and GMs... It's not because miraculousy people are not a-holes but it costs you far less to simply police the forums once in a while...
Oh and rose tinted rainbow bunnies! Fluffly little companions
You should search for them
No... they continue to use and "tweek" this system solemnly because it means far less work for Devs and GMs... It's not because miraculousy people are not a-holes but it costs you far less to simply police the forums once in a while...
Oh and rose tinted rainbow bunnies! Fluffly little companions
You should search for them
Google says you don't know what you're talking about.
About the bunnies anyway.
As for vote-kick, dozens of MMO developers and millions of players say you don't know what you're talking about.
"Participation in PVP-related activities is so low on an hourly, daily, weekly, and monthly basis that we could in fact just completely take it out of STO and it would not impact the overall number of people [who] log in to the game and play in any significant way." -Gozer, Cryptic PvP Dev
mark my words.. you guys were screaming about afkers ruining everything.
once then put this in, i bet you 100% you same people will be screaming about all the times you get a 2 hour ban..
How much money would you like to bet as you will lose? I never AFK unless some unexpected emergency draws me away from the keyboard and 2 hours is not going to bother me if it does.
The bottom line is that, regardless of the reason someone is AFK, they're still AFK. Whether it's that phone call you've been waiting for or the dodgy burrito you had for lunch, who cares? If you go AFK for long enough you should get the AFK penalty. Cryptic shouldn't give a TRIBBLE why player X queues up for the CE mission then does nothing.
Is that fair? Pretty much. AFK + duration = AFK penalty (equation subject to change). Is it fair to other players for one person to go AFK during a mission? I mean, most people won't care why. They'll just see someone either stop responding or give a hasty excuse then stop responding. I hope they can manage the mission one man down...
Basically, if real life is pulling someone away from STO in the middle of a mission, that person just needs to log out (taking the less harsh leaver penalty, if needed) and come back when they can. If the mission and the group can wait for them, awesome. If not, oh well.
And hey, if this actually reduces the rampant leeching by a large margin then I won't cry if I get slapped with an "unfair" AFK penalty because I had to go stop my house from burning down.
Star Trek: Online - Now with 100% more dinosaurs!!
Lately Cryptic have given us very welcome updates and changes this one is as highly welcomed by me as was recent account wide lobi reform, thank you development team.
You realize there's been a kick system for private queues since the beginning of STO and nobody ever griefed using that. And mentioned above, other games use the kick system without any major problems either.
No there isn't. You can kick people out of a match before the game starts, which I don't think anyone would find objectionable, but once someone is in the game, you cannot kick anyone.
While I truly believe Their intentions are good, we all should be very wary of how, more often than not...,
... this leads to bad decisions being implemented.
I just hope They are quick to 'adjust' this addition, if it all goes south.
<shrug>
This. Considering the occasional issues the STF leaver's penalty causes when they have the "Server stability issues" we all know and love, I hope their implementation is as good as their intentions.
Yes, I have completely stopped queuing Mine Trap thanks to the AFKers. Still, we'll just have to wait and see if this is something good, or just something to get us to stop complaining about the AFKers...
With each passing day I wonder if I stepped into an alternate reality. The Cubs win the world series. Donald Trump is President. Britain leaves the EU. STO gets a dedicated PvP season. Engineers are "out of control" in STO.
I predict that it will either start banning people for underperformance or unusually optimized performance (no-shots-fired Azure), or it will have no effect on the leeching because actual leechers tend not to actually be AFK,
Nice work cryptic updates like these is why i keep playing it shows me that cryptic actually listen to the players and act on it from time to time.
Funny a nice update comes along to prevent deadbeats from profiting on others hard works yet you get players QQ'ing on this thread...makes me wonder if they are not in fact the AFK'ers hmm.
If by "much more complicated", you mean "simpler."
"Participation in PVP-related activities is so low on an hourly, daily, weekly, and monthly basis that we could in fact just completely take it out of STO and it would not impact the overall number of people [who] log in to the game and play in any significant way." -Gozer, Cryptic PvP Dev
you are under the impression that most afkers are actually afk.. they are not..
some even type in chat.. they hit need on everything.. they even move..
a timer wont work.
That is a very good point, I have said that to people in the past, most AFK'ers are not AFK, they will be chatting away to their friends/guilds while everyone else does the work for them. AFK'ers that are not AFK for a genuine reason are idiots, they can't get it in to their tiny heads that if they just help out then the rewards come faster.
Vote to kick would never work. Too much griefing potential for that to ever happen.
If it works in WOW, of all games, why shouldn't it work here? Vote Kick is the best and easiest method against AFK'ers. Yes there are individual griefers, but a pug as a whole is not. In a group, there's always a bunch of reasonable players who can and will veto unfounded votes.
I'm a regular LFR-player over on WoW and the only people who i have ever seen kicked were players who either evidently did not contribute or were flaming and insulting everyone.
You may not trust the individual player to be reasonable, but you can trust the community to be. Griefers are a minority and vote kicks are either unanimous or a majority vote.
AFK'ers that are not AFK for a genuine reason are idiots, they can't get it in to their tiny heads that if they just help out then the rewards come faster.
Ah, but here's what you don't understand: They're not optimizing for speed of reward. Indeed, optimizing for speed of reward is nearly meaningless, because completion of any mission earns you a 30m+ ban anyway, so how fast you can run it is irrelevant: You get banned anyway, and cannot run it again for quite some time. Therefore, it does not really make a difference whether it takes 5 minutes or 15. They are optimizing their reward to effort ratio. Finishing faster won't increase their reward, but would require much more effort.
Additionally, with some of the more popularly leeched missions, there is no statistically significant correlation between effort exerted and reward gained. Their behavior in this regard is therefore actually entirely logical, if odious: Since they, individually, are unable to influence the outcome for better or worse one way or another, they see no reason to try. It's the same reason people don't vote.
If it works in WOW, of all games, why shouldn't it work here? Vote Kick is the best and easiest method against AFK'ers. Yes there are individual griefers, but a pug as a whole is not. In a group, there's always a bunch of reasonable players who can and will veto unfounded votes.
Yes, but how BIG is the typical WoW group? You say "a bunch of". In no STO group can ANY subset of the group be defined as a "bunch", since the typical size of an STO group is 5 or less. Therefore, it is entirely possible and entirely common to end up with 3 or more people who will thus achieve a majority vote. If these people are sufficiently dissatisfied with your performance, perhaps because you suck or, at least, they believe you do, since the failure of the optional couldn't possibly be THEIR fault, you're going to wind up eating a ban just for that.
Ah, but here's what you don't understand: They're not optimizing for speed of reward. Indeed, optimizing for speed of reward is nearly meaningless, because completion of any mission earns you a 30m+ ban anyway, so how fast you can run it is irrelevant: You get banned anyway, and cannot run it again for quite some time. Therefore, it does not really make a difference whether it takes 5 minutes or 15. They are optimizing their reward to effort ratio. Finishing faster won't increase their reward, but would require much more effort.
But the faster you finish an instance, the quicker you can get to the next one. For example, there is a difference between being able to finish all 3 Borg STF's in 10 mins than taking 1-2 hours to do all three back to back. Or if You're grinding fleet marks, you can go Fleet Alert -> Starbase Incursion -> Colony Invasion -> Crystalline -> etc etc etc.
So speed does matter when griding for marks because even if you are locked out of an instance for 30mins-1hour, there are other instance you can run for a similar reward.
Additionally, with some of the more popularly leeched missions, there is no statistically significant correlation between effort exerted and reward gained. Their behavior in this regard is therefore actually entirely logical, if odious: Since they, individually, are unable to influence the outcome for better or worse one way or another, they see no reason to try. It's the same reason people don't vote.
I guess you're referring to Azure, Crystalline, Mine Trap and Mirror? Individual effort might not SHOW there, but it matters. Especially for Mirror, since the quicker the instance is cleared, the quicker they can start the next. Also, if people use THAT as an excuse for their afking, they are idiots.
Yes, but how BIG is the typical WoW group? You say "a bunch of". In no STO group can ANY subset of the group be defined as a "bunch", since the typical size of an STO group is 5 or less. Therefore, it is entirely possible and entirely common to end up with 3 or more people who will thus achieve a majority vote. If these people are sufficiently dissatisfied with your performance, perhaps because you suck or, at least, they believe you do, since the failure of the optional couldn't possibly be THEIR fault, you're going to wind up eating a ban just for that.
The Typical size of a WoW-pug is 5. Anything bigger than that is more often than not a guild group. Well, that was the case until LFR came around late Cataclysm, but I had already stopped playing by then. And the vote kick in WoW is being perceived as being worth the downside of potential griefing. Why wouldn't it here? After all, the WoW-playerbase is most likely the lowest of the low in MMO-populace.
But the faster you finish an instance, the quicker you can get to the next one. For example, there is a difference between being able to finish all 3 Borg STF's in 10 mins than taking 1-2 hours to do all three back to back.
Except most people don't actually want to or need to do those. Also, the number of leechers in STFs is actually quite low: You pretty much don't EVER see them outside of anything but ISE. So the Leecher population is essentially looking to opportunistically fill their rep off ISE...and frankly, most people just do ISE, not the round-trip tour. That would actually require effort...
Effort is exactly what these people are attempting to avoid.
Or if You're grinding fleet marks, you can go Fleet Alert -> Starbase Incursion -> Colony Invasion -> Crystalline -> etc etc etc.
If you cared about fleet marks per time, you would not be doing any of these things, period, because all of those things are terrible. People are leeching those missions because they wish to acquire these things as passive income, and are not particularly concerned with pay per time.
I guess you're referring to Azure, Crystalline, Mine Trap and Mirror? Individual effort might not SHOW there, but it matters.
Actually, I collected stats during the last run about how long each run took, running it on over a dozen alts. I was completely unable to discern any correlation whatsoever between the quality of ships I ran (ranging from well-suited to utterly useless) through it, and how long it took. Since there was no apparent correlation between quality of effort and outcome, it stands to reason that you'd see more leechers in such a mission, and that's precisely what happens: When the effort exerted in a mission exhibits little or no connection to the outcome, you're going to find a lot more people deciding that the best effort is the minimal effort.
In contrast, no one AFKs IGE...why is that, you wonder? Because having a missing man all but assures failure, so the outcome is strongly linked to performance.
Especially for Mirror, since the quicker the instance is cleared, the quicker they can start the next. Also, if people use THAT as an excuse for their afking, they are idiots.
Mirror's an interesting case. People don't necessarily "leech" mirror. Many who are there are simply TERRIBLY USELESS. After awhile, they notice that any attempt to contribute at all is futile since their ships are simply utter garbage. And there's absolutely no way for them to fix this without shooting themselves in the foot in the long term, since they have to attend it in order to level up so they can actually GET a ship and equipment.
And the vote kick in WoW is being perceived as being worth the downside of potential griefing. Why wouldn't it here? After all, the WoW-playerbase is most likely the lowest of the low in MMO-populace.
For whatever reason, it seems STO has a troll population that exerts considerably more influence. Is it because there's more of them, or because STO's mechanics are more easily trolled, or even simple hysteria? Either way, it seems far more of a concern here than Warcrap. What exactly happens there if someone gets kicked? Because over here, the penalty for being ejected from a group would be the loss of all progress in the mission and a lengthy ban from Absolutely Everything In The Game, as opposed to something more potentially benign, like simply being abandoned on the battlefield and left to fend for yourself.
Comments
Fleet Admiral Rylana - Fed Tac - U.S.S Wild Card - Tactical Miracle Worker Cruiser
Lifetime Subscriber since 2012 == 17,200 Accolades = RIP PvP and Vice Squad
Chief of Starfleet Intelligence Service == Praise Cheesus
I know redshirt patch notes, redshirt is for beta testing before it goes to holodeck right now, if anyone has a concern they can test it for themselves... But yeah thats just nuckin futz isnt it! Maybe I need to see a shrink...
"I'm drunk, whats your excuse for being an idiot?" - Unknown drunk man. :eek:
AFKER"S gays are numbered meaning nomore free rides
redshirt is not beta testing it is where it goes right to holodeck
That won't work... A System in the Hands of Players is doomed from the start...
To dissuade griefing they would have to check eack and every "vote" to see if it is legit and that cannot be done on the fly... the damage will be done by the time even an automated System is able to determine that and then?
We have the trolled player with a Ban and then what? The Griefers are banned too? Do they get a "You cannot vote for the next 2 hours" Message?
And I can understand when RL gets in the way... but seriously... don't you people have cordless phones? Do you have to be physically away for too long to speak on the phone?
Or are you unable to do two things at once? I don't mean it in a derogatory way, If there is something preventing you to do this it's sad...
If there is an emergency or whatever a 2 hour ban should be the least of your concerns and you should be happy to come back to see it still in effect.
Again with the silly assumption. It works in other games.
Ridiculous. It's sufficient to review after the fact in the event of a complaint.
Typically you don't need to ban with a vote-kick system.
3 day ban from the game should do it.
To sum up: stop pretending that vote-kick is impossible, it works fine in many other MMOs.
Anyway, for now the point is moot. Cryptic has decided to try their hand at automated AFK detection. My bet is it takes less than 24 hours for people to crack it.
However I am also very concerned about "carries", specifically low DPS players who join elites and who expect to be carried through STFs they have no business being in. They barely contribute to the team and soak up a team slot that someone more useful could take. I'm talking about those players who can't even stop non-hostile probes in Khitomer Accord Space Elite, the players who die to a single Borg Sphere and the ones with a dozen ship injuries before the match even starts. :mad:
Let's get rid of the dead weight players next - if they don't know what they are doing then they should be forced to stick to normal mode STFs until they can parse a minimum amount of DPS .
It doesn't even need to be that high, but when fighter pets are drawing aggro off low DPS players you know there's a problem that needs to be fixed. Let's get rid of the dead weight players next by implementing a system that kicks mid-match if their in game combat log drops below a certain DPS output.
Let's bring the elite back to elite STFs!
You realize there's been a kick system for private queues since the beginning of STO and nobody ever griefed using that. And mentioned above, other games use the kick system without any major problems either.
A Vote Kick is simple compared to what they are approaching with this proposal, where they have to program in all sorts of griefer variables to ensure innocent players don't get punished. Like above where I mentioned people getting stuck in the one map. And what of legit AFKers who have to be called away? There are parents who play and sometimes the kids drag you away from the computer at inopportune times.
So I really doubt this system will be very effective, especially once the griefers map out the boundaries. Which means someone from the STO team has to be monitoring.
It IS abused... everywhere... from a lot of people... people are a-holes... no matter what...
It does NOT work in other games...
Sure, it occasionally works as intended... but there will be too many innocent victims for one real offender...
And yes... it doesn't mean it has to ban directly... but still, vote-kick right at the end, shortly before or after the final so the Trolled player gets no loot and has the global CD...
Or if you have a whole fleet, just keep vote-kicking players in several instances at once... you will always get fresh meat because of the lovely system that will put you in already started but not full instances...
And this WILL happen...
Edit:
If you're a parent and your Kid drags you away... or rather has to drag you away you're doing something very wrong...
If you put your concern about a mere 2 hour ban before that... sorry, anything more and I am sure to be banned from here...
Edit Edit:
Oh and yes, the PRIVATE Queues... they are not public... you're there with a select few that you know...
So... I don't know what your point is?
Just because it doesn't happen with people more or less close to you... doesn't mean it will not happen with others...
It works far more often than not. Which is why MMO developers continue to use such systems. This is not "rose tinted rainbow bunny glasses," this is reality.
Btw, what color is rose tinted rainbow anyway?
Oh and rose tinted rainbow bunnies! Fluffly little companions
You should search for them
Google says you don't know what you're talking about.
About the bunnies anyway.
As for vote-kick, dozens of MMO developers and millions of players say you don't know what you're talking about.
How much money would you like to bet as you will lose? I never AFK unless some unexpected emergency draws me away from the keyboard and 2 hours is not going to bother me if it does.
Is that fair? Pretty much. AFK + duration = AFK penalty (equation subject to change). Is it fair to other players for one person to go AFK during a mission? I mean, most people won't care why. They'll just see someone either stop responding or give a hasty excuse then stop responding. I hope they can manage the mission one man down...
Basically, if real life is pulling someone away from STO in the middle of a mission, that person just needs to log out (taking the less harsh leaver penalty, if needed) and come back when they can. If the mission and the group can wait for them, awesome. If not, oh well.
And hey, if this actually reduces the rampant leeching by a large margin then I won't cry if I get slapped with an "unfair" AFK penalty because I had to go stop my house from burning down.
This. Considering the occasional issues the STF leaver's penalty causes when they have the "Server stability issues" we all know and love, I hope their implementation is as good as their intentions.
Yes, I have completely stopped queuing Mine Trap thanks to the AFKers. Still, we'll just have to wait and see if this is something good, or just something to get us to stop complaining about the AFKers...
Funny a nice update comes along to prevent deadbeats from profiting on others hard works yet you get players QQ'ing on this thread...makes me wonder if they are not in fact the AFK'ers hmm.
If by simpler, you mean much more complicated.
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
If by "much more complicated", you mean "simpler."
No, I don't.
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
Fleet Admiral Rylana - Fed Tac - U.S.S Wild Card - Tactical Miracle Worker Cruiser
Lifetime Subscriber since 2012 == 17,200 Accolades = RIP PvP and Vice Squad
Chief of Starfleet Intelligence Service == Praise Cheesus
That is a very good point, I have said that to people in the past, most AFK'ers are not AFK, they will be chatting away to their friends/guilds while everyone else does the work for them. AFK'ers that are not AFK for a genuine reason are idiots, they can't get it in to their tiny heads that if they just help out then the rewards come faster.
I'm a regular LFR-player over on WoW and the only people who i have ever seen kicked were players who either evidently did not contribute or were flaming and insulting everyone.
You may not trust the individual player to be reasonable, but you can trust the community to be. Griefers are a minority and vote kicks are either unanimous or a majority vote.
Additionally, with some of the more popularly leeched missions, there is no statistically significant correlation between effort exerted and reward gained. Their behavior in this regard is therefore actually entirely logical, if odious: Since they, individually, are unable to influence the outcome for better or worse one way or another, they see no reason to try. It's the same reason people don't vote.
Yes, but how BIG is the typical WoW group? You say "a bunch of". In no STO group can ANY subset of the group be defined as a "bunch", since the typical size of an STO group is 5 or less. Therefore, it is entirely possible and entirely common to end up with 3 or more people who will thus achieve a majority vote. If these people are sufficiently dissatisfied with your performance, perhaps because you suck or, at least, they believe you do, since the failure of the optional couldn't possibly be THEIR fault, you're going to wind up eating a ban just for that.
But the faster you finish an instance, the quicker you can get to the next one. For example, there is a difference between being able to finish all 3 Borg STF's in 10 mins than taking 1-2 hours to do all three back to back. Or if You're grinding fleet marks, you can go Fleet Alert -> Starbase Incursion -> Colony Invasion -> Crystalline -> etc etc etc.
So speed does matter when griding for marks because even if you are locked out of an instance for 30mins-1hour, there are other instance you can run for a similar reward.
I guess you're referring to Azure, Crystalline, Mine Trap and Mirror? Individual effort might not SHOW there, but it matters. Especially for Mirror, since the quicker the instance is cleared, the quicker they can start the next. Also, if people use THAT as an excuse for their afking, they are idiots.
The Typical size of a WoW-pug is 5. Anything bigger than that is more often than not a guild group. Well, that was the case until LFR came around late Cataclysm, but I had already stopped playing by then. And the vote kick in WoW is being perceived as being worth the downside of potential griefing. Why wouldn't it here? After all, the WoW-playerbase is most likely the lowest of the low in MMO-populace.
Effort is exactly what these people are attempting to avoid.
If you cared about fleet marks per time, you would not be doing any of these things, period, because all of those things are terrible. People are leeching those missions because they wish to acquire these things as passive income, and are not particularly concerned with pay per time.
Actually, I collected stats during the last run about how long each run took, running it on over a dozen alts. I was completely unable to discern any correlation whatsoever between the quality of ships I ran (ranging from well-suited to utterly useless) through it, and how long it took. Since there was no apparent correlation between quality of effort and outcome, it stands to reason that you'd see more leechers in such a mission, and that's precisely what happens: When the effort exerted in a mission exhibits little or no connection to the outcome, you're going to find a lot more people deciding that the best effort is the minimal effort.
In contrast, no one AFKs IGE...why is that, you wonder? Because having a missing man all but assures failure, so the outcome is strongly linked to performance.
Mirror's an interesting case. People don't necessarily "leech" mirror. Many who are there are simply TERRIBLY USELESS. After awhile, they notice that any attempt to contribute at all is futile since their ships are simply utter garbage. And there's absolutely no way for them to fix this without shooting themselves in the foot in the long term, since they have to attend it in order to level up so they can actually GET a ship and equipment.
For whatever reason, it seems STO has a troll population that exerts considerably more influence. Is it because there's more of them, or because STO's mechanics are more easily trolled, or even simple hysteria? Either way, it seems far more of a concern here than Warcrap. What exactly happens there if someone gets kicked? Because over here, the penalty for being ejected from a group would be the loss of all progress in the mission and a lengthy ban from Absolutely Everything In The Game, as opposed to something more potentially benign, like simply being abandoned on the battlefield and left to fend for yourself.