I think most people in this thread are overlooking the psychological effect this change has.
Outside of how the system might be imperfect, you have to consider how the AFKers must perceive this.
Cryptic has taken notice. That is a really big deal, because the next step may become the banhammer if this doesnt work.
No matter how you slice it, AFK shenanigans are going to decline significantly due to this factor alone, even if the system is a wash and the forum explodes with negative feedback about it.
The gravy train has only existed until now because there was no penalty for the behavior (at least that we knew of)
Now there are negative consequences, and they can increase in the future. Cryptic, via this action, has flat out stated in not so many words that they do not support or condone afk farming of team queues.
This is a decisive victory for those of us that fought so hard to see this get noticed. I am very happy Crypic listened to us.
Fleet Admiral Rylana - Fed Tac - U.S.S Wild Card - Tactical Miracle Worker Cruiser
Lifetime Subscriber since 2012 == 17,200 Accolades = RIP PvP and Vice Squad
Chief of Starfleet Intelligence Service == Praise Cheesus
Overall this will solve almost nothing except to punish those who truly sit idle for to long or even those who may be dc'd from the mission. For those who leech they will find what it again takes to do the least amount of contributing to gain their awards.
Lagging out / disconnecting is most likely due to your ISP or PC. That's not something Cryptic has any control over. Blaming them for poor connection speed from your service provider doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
perhaps, but it seems i get "Disconnected" on map changes about 50% of the time.
[12:35] Vessel Two of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 225232 (271723) Plasma Damage to you with Plasma Lance.
[12:44] Vessel One of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 1019527 (1157678) Kinetic Damage to you with Plasma Energy Bolt Explosion.
Lots of Pages - Only hit Page 4/14 here so this may have been presented later.
AFKr's = Problem... No. They are annoying yes. As annoying as hell. I have participated in hundreds of STF's with AFK'rs and the mission has gone very well (Comp+Opt Gain).
TBH I have played in MORE missions where the Opt is failed or mission blown completely by Players who A. Think they know everything. B. Do not participate as Team Members. C. Just do outrageous and ridiculous things TRIBBLE it up for others.
Still. When you PuG, you need to expect your fair share of both. My personal Ignore list has so many names of accounts and people guilty of just such an act. If you want credible players all the time, and no AFK'rs ever... Create your own game with players you know and trust. Don't PuG.
-- From a players perspective. Yes agreed, good to see Cryptic trying to resolve an issue that most people get annoyed about.
BUT from what I have seen written and speculated on as to what will constitute an afk penalty.... I agree that most players will probably get nabbed under such proposed systems, cop penalties and bans etc etc etc.
EG: Specifying keystroke entries, damage rcvd/healing done, distance from target etc etc etc.
I run a lot of STFs - KV being a personal fav. I have been playing it A LONG time... and have built entire strategy and char around this mission goals and paramaters (which help in the others).
I am a sci heavy eng char flying a tholian Recluse. I begin launching my fighters, Buffing the team, communicating strategy etc etc etc. This is as I approach the Tac Cube cautiously. I can take hits a plenty, BUT I am NOT a TANK!!! Therefor I AVOID AGGRO as much as possible. Once the team is in and hitting it, I let the tanks do the work. My fighters have now moved in to support, and I move in, swinging around to my desg side for probe defence and adding to the attack.
That's all fine. Once its gone... I park. My fighters roam close by, help support and soften targets for the High DPS guys and I stop probes. Its what I am built for and I do it damn well. That means I sit parked. No keystrokes required (with autofire and mouse control), I don't absorb damage requiring any healing. and I have several mins of inactivity between probe waves, where I get to do nothing, recharge my timers and let my fighters soften targets.
I play a defense and support role. -- SO with that in mind. With these proposed AFK TEST's, I would be a classic for receiving AFK penalties for being an important and in essence CRITICAL part of any team and mission.
-- I will note, Having played often, all too much with people who should NOT be playing at Elite level. Doing not just ridiculous things (calling for certain roles, being let to do it and then flying off to do something else whilst the mission then fails), but the rude thing as well... (release cube - watch as it attacks the probe defenders, sit back and watch whilst they get pummeled and struggle to deal with multiple cubes and probe defence at the same time and then flame them if a probe gets through whilst they are respawning from the invetibale). On these occasions, I can and WILL sit back on occasion and do NOTHING more to assist the team until I am good and ready.
If people wont participate correctly there is no point in participating at all. Esp just to have your ship cop copious damage and require down time between STF runs in order to get it repaired, wait for crew regen so u don't just one shot die in the next mission you play or wasting Components that you genuinely need sometimes.
Vote to kick, wont work. People will abuse it.
Secret Parameter - No award and now you are banned from playing at all.. WILL kill and end the game period.
- How about a combination system of the two. In game players can VOTE to ban a player on their activity. Once a player accumulates X votes in a 1hr period... They cop a MINIMAL penalty... (EG Ban for 30mins). This is accompanied by a monthly counter attached to the account. For each Ban they incur they accumulate a point. For each point earned (that means say copping 15 votes per hour - that's every player in every game run per hour if you go back to back), the penalty on the ACCOUNT Doubles.
1st 30min
2nd 1hr
3rd 2hrs
4th 4hrs
5th 8hrs
For 6 or more then then the account is barred from all runs for a period of a month.
- Yes a month. And YES an ACCOUNT (this penalises to maximum).
It gives the players the vote option, but makes it VERY hard to abuse. A player must REALLY be being an annoyance to everyone to cop the ban. BUT IF they are.. They cop a slap and given a chance to rectify their gameplay. If they don't... They will eventually be run out as they should be.
I can see myself in trouble already. I have over 50% chance to get disconnected from game server during loading screens ( all loading screens ). Game is really eager to start the server timeout while looking at the loading screen more than 2 seconds.
There never has been an afk problem the problem was people where there and accepted the que popping but then sat on their TRIBBLE and did nothing but hit need greed or leave thast not AFK thats just plain not giving a ****...
I play a defense and support role. -- SO with that in mind. With these proposed AFK TEST's, I would be a classic for receiving AFK penalties for being an important and in essence CRITICAL part of any team and mission.
Interesting idea, but in my experience, the mission works better if the people who waste the probes are the same peeps who shoot holes in the gates. it takes very little time if you have 2-3 ships shooting them. It's as smooth as clockwork when people do it right.
your concerns are quite valid BUT I, as well as many players are glad to see SOME action towards this game crippling AFK issue.. I mean for the limited play time I get for missions (I mostly DOff at work between sales calls coming in) I would like to bonus or succeed, not pay for the benefit of some jerk who has no sportsmanship.
If they tell you, then AFK'ers will know how to get around it. So now you have to play the mission. Or you might get the ban....
People have figured out this sort of thing before and this will be no exception. They may not be 100% accurate but if they find out the simplest rule like so many red alerts then you can bet players will do the minimum and nothing more.
I'm in favour of having a system in place and since I don't afk with the intention to leech I don't really care what the requirements are as I'm nearly always in red alert, healing and doing some dps to a degree and definitely doing my fair share if not more. All Cryptic needs to know is are the criteria accurate enough to weed out the afkers but not punish innocent players. This can be achieved by playing on Redshirt. Ideally if Cryptic can see actual evidence (i.e. fraps video) that you were active throughout and still got penalised then they know they need to make some amendments.
mmm so im now going to get poss 2 hour penalty for the launcher crashing which happens quite often and not being able to get back in in time because every time it crashes i have to reboot to get the launcher to work,,,,,,,,,,great....
no prob with the set up or connection speed, done it ever since romulus release, reloaded game and done all the stuff i was advised to try but it still dose it, very random dont happen for days then 2-3 times a night,,,,,,,,just says cryptic launcher has just crashed and when i try to reload the game the computer tells me the game is still running,,,,,just been putting up with it but a poss 2 hour ban,,,?????
And just to rub salt into the wound iv just been disconnected from the server,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
mmm so im now going to get poss 2 hour penalty for the launcher crashing which happens quite often and not being able to get back in in time because every time it crashes i have to reboot to get the launcher to work,,,,,,,,,,great....
I don't think so... currently in these instances you aren't "on the team" at the start. If I am not mistaken, you don't even qualify for the 1 hour leaver penalty. You are removed from the team. If you get back in, you are added to the team and life goes on... if you don't you face no penalty at all. IIRC.
Of course, you could go to red shirt, with a few others and test this theory. Get into a STF... focibly close the program (reacts like a the situation you are describing), and see what happens after they finish the mission.
My guess... it will treat you like you were never on the team to start.
I don't think so... currently in these instances you aren't "on the team" at the start. If I am not mistaken, you don't even qualify for the 1 hour leaver penalty. You are removed from the team. If you get back in, you are added to the team and life goes on... if you don't you face no penalty at all. IIRC.
Of course, you could go to red shirt, with a few others and test this theory. Get into a STF... focibly close the program (reacts like a the situation you are describing), and see what happens after they finish the mission.
My guess... it will treat you like you were never on the team to start.
had a 1 hour leaver penalty cause of the launcher crashing and not being able to get back in in time,,,,,,but thats after the mission had started,,,,,
had a 1 hour leaver penalty cause of the launcher crashing and not being able to get back in in time,,,,,,but thats after the mission had started,,,,,
Well, you'd probably be facing the same 1 hour penalty...
I don't think that is really sufficient reason not to implement this type of AFK discouragement however. Since the rest of the team was not booted, and was able to continue on with their mission, it would seem that the issue is local to you.
Sucks, I know... in my years of playing this game it has happened a handful of times that I was dc'd and ended up with a penalty timer... but the number of times I have had this happen is far fewer than the number of times I have been teamed with an AFK'er.
Before anyone points out that I have been a vocal advocate for using the channels to form teams... I have been running ALL PvE missions in Pug's (save an occasional CCE or when i am NWS Accolade hunting/training), really to see how pervasive this AFK problem really is.
In STF's it isn't tremendously bad... but the other PvE missions... I see AFK'ers quite often.
Since the release of the upcoming changes to red-shirt I have had 1 to 2 AFK leechers in every single STF I have ran. I do each one twice per day and without fail there is someone AfK leeching. (needing on drops) They must be trying to get in as much as they can before the update hit holodeck.
Since the release of the upcoming changes to red-shirt I have had 1 to 2 AFK leechers in every single STF I have ran. I do each one twice per day and without fail there is someone AfK leeching. (needing on drops) They must be trying to get in as much as they can before the update hit holodeck.
would not surprise me being like squirrels and now stocking up for the winter
... and it isn't even really about the players who end up walking away right after joining, cuz they have to deal with the kid, or their mom is yelling at them to bring in the groceries, or whatever...
it is about those players who are consistently and regularly joining and staying afk, ALL THE TIME.
I can live with the former, if we can get the latter dealt with... so, an afk ban shouldn't happen just from one session alone.
maybe if ya haven't moved, or fired a shot, or whatever, then ok, no reward given at the end, but no ban... but, your last-status gets incremented, so if you join and afk the next time, at the end, it checks your last-status, and if you were afk for the previous one too? THEN drop the banhammer.
So it's funny that they are taking the time to make sure this is as bug free as possible instead of rushing to implement it on the live servers without proper testing like they have done in the past with other features.
Sounds to me like you'll try to find fault with whatever they do.
Yeah he hates my "Doom" thread:P
They better make sure this is 110% bug free - can you imagine the forums and game chat if it went live and there was a bug that 30 sec of idle everyone got a 2 hour ban?
Or something else? The fires here would not be able to be put out for a LONG TIME they would be burning so hot!!
They better test every possible scenario - it's just too risky to go live with something that could take every q'd mission offline.
So it's funny that they are taking the time to make sure this is as bug free as possible instead of rushing to implement it on the live servers without proper testing like they have done in the past with other features.
Sounds to me like you'll try to find fault with whatever they do.
Seems it turns out that the fix for "afkers" isn't as easy as a lot of forumites seem to think it is.:rolleyes:
It's not myfault ifyoufeel trolledbymyDisco ball...Sorry'boutit.
You rather not getting any rewards at all because the system decided you were AFKing?
There are a lot of variables, a well played Azure rescue will have NO DAMAGE INFLICTED because they will free the ships without engaging Tholian ships, Temple is a HUGE mess because players can end up spending too many time being dead because of the still absurd spawns and so you are AFKing.
Even a human player cannot tell if someone is AFKing or not if that player decides to put the bare minimum of effort, in fact I dislike this system because I rather be one man short that having Kamikaze AFKing were they will just go aggro everything on their path to remain "playing" when in fact they are not attempting to do.
Yeah Kamikaze afkers/leechers could make things WORSE in the Q's!!!
Comments
system Lord Baal is dead
Outside of how the system might be imperfect, you have to consider how the AFKers must perceive this.
Cryptic has taken notice. That is a really big deal, because the next step may become the banhammer if this doesnt work.
No matter how you slice it, AFK shenanigans are going to decline significantly due to this factor alone, even if the system is a wash and the forum explodes with negative feedback about it.
The gravy train has only existed until now because there was no penalty for the behavior (at least that we knew of)
Now there are negative consequences, and they can increase in the future. Cryptic, via this action, has flat out stated in not so many words that they do not support or condone afk farming of team queues.
This is a decisive victory for those of us that fought so hard to see this get noticed. I am very happy Crypic listened to us.
Fleet Admiral Rylana - Fed Tac - U.S.S Wild Card - Tactical Miracle Worker Cruiser
Lifetime Subscriber since 2012 == 17,200 Accolades = RIP PvP and Vice Squad
Chief of Starfleet Intelligence Service == Praise Cheesus
Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!
perhaps, but it seems i get "Disconnected" on map changes about 50% of the time.
[12:44] Vessel One of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 1019527 (1157678) Kinetic Damage to you with Plasma Energy Bolt Explosion.
a song to celebrate :eek:
Qapla':cool:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CayMeza487M
lmao
Your Javelin deals 125417 (89066) Disruptor Damage(Critical) to Tholian Recluse. > lol
My character Tsin'xing
AFKr's = Problem... No. They are annoying yes. As annoying as hell. I have participated in hundreds of STF's with AFK'rs and the mission has gone very well (Comp+Opt Gain).
TBH I have played in MORE missions where the Opt is failed or mission blown completely by Players who A. Think they know everything. B. Do not participate as Team Members. C. Just do outrageous and ridiculous things TRIBBLE it up for others.
Still. When you PuG, you need to expect your fair share of both. My personal Ignore list has so many names of accounts and people guilty of just such an act. If you want credible players all the time, and no AFK'rs ever... Create your own game with players you know and trust. Don't PuG.
-- From a players perspective. Yes agreed, good to see Cryptic trying to resolve an issue that most people get annoyed about.
BUT from what I have seen written and speculated on as to what will constitute an afk penalty.... I agree that most players will probably get nabbed under such proposed systems, cop penalties and bans etc etc etc.
EG: Specifying keystroke entries, damage rcvd/healing done, distance from target etc etc etc.
I run a lot of STFs - KV being a personal fav. I have been playing it A LONG time... and have built entire strategy and char around this mission goals and paramaters (which help in the others).
I am a sci heavy eng char flying a tholian Recluse. I begin launching my fighters, Buffing the team, communicating strategy etc etc etc. This is as I approach the Tac Cube cautiously. I can take hits a plenty, BUT I am NOT a TANK!!! Therefor I AVOID AGGRO as much as possible. Once the team is in and hitting it, I let the tanks do the work. My fighters have now moved in to support, and I move in, swinging around to my desg side for probe defence and adding to the attack.
That's all fine. Once its gone... I park. My fighters roam close by, help support and soften targets for the High DPS guys and I stop probes. Its what I am built for and I do it damn well. That means I sit parked. No keystrokes required (with autofire and mouse control), I don't absorb damage requiring any healing. and I have several mins of inactivity between probe waves, where I get to do nothing, recharge my timers and let my fighters soften targets.
I play a defense and support role. -- SO with that in mind. With these proposed AFK TEST's, I would be a classic for receiving AFK penalties for being an important and in essence CRITICAL part of any team and mission.
-- I will note, Having played often, all too much with people who should NOT be playing at Elite level. Doing not just ridiculous things (calling for certain roles, being let to do it and then flying off to do something else whilst the mission then fails), but the rude thing as well... (release cube - watch as it attacks the probe defenders, sit back and watch whilst they get pummeled and struggle to deal with multiple cubes and probe defence at the same time and then flame them if a probe gets through whilst they are respawning from the invetibale). On these occasions, I can and WILL sit back on occasion and do NOTHING more to assist the team until I am good and ready.
If people wont participate correctly there is no point in participating at all. Esp just to have your ship cop copious damage and require down time between STF runs in order to get it repaired, wait for crew regen so u don't just one shot die in the next mission you play or wasting Components that you genuinely need sometimes.
Vote to kick, wont work. People will abuse it.
Secret Parameter - No award and now you are banned from playing at all.. WILL kill and end the game period.
- How about a combination system of the two. In game players can VOTE to ban a player on their activity. Once a player accumulates X votes in a 1hr period... They cop a MINIMAL penalty... (EG Ban for 30mins). This is accompanied by a monthly counter attached to the account. For each Ban they incur they accumulate a point. For each point earned (that means say copping 15 votes per hour - that's every player in every game run per hour if you go back to back), the penalty on the ACCOUNT Doubles.
1st 30min
2nd 1hr
3rd 2hrs
4th 4hrs
5th 8hrs
For 6 or more then then the account is barred from all runs for a period of a month.
- Yes a month. And YES an ACCOUNT (this penalises to maximum).
It gives the players the vote option, but makes it VERY hard to abuse. A player must REALLY be being an annoyance to everyone to cop the ban. BUT IF they are.. They cop a slap and given a chance to rectify their gameplay. If they don't... They will eventually be run out as they should be.
My character Tsin'xing
If they tell you, then AFK'ers will know how to get around it. So now you have to play the mission. Or you might get the ban....
I'm in favour of having a system in place and since I don't afk with the intention to leech I don't really care what the requirements are as I'm nearly always in red alert, healing and doing some dps to a degree and definitely doing my fair share if not more. All Cryptic needs to know is are the criteria accurate enough to weed out the afkers but not punish innocent players. This can be achieved by playing on Redshirt. Ideally if Cryptic can see actual evidence (i.e. fraps video) that you were active throughout and still got penalised then they know they need to make some amendments.
And just to rub salt into the wound iv just been disconnected from the server,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
I don't think so... currently in these instances you aren't "on the team" at the start. If I am not mistaken, you don't even qualify for the 1 hour leaver penalty. You are removed from the team. If you get back in, you are added to the team and life goes on... if you don't you face no penalty at all. IIRC.
Of course, you could go to red shirt, with a few others and test this theory. Get into a STF... focibly close the program (reacts like a the situation you are describing), and see what happens after they finish the mission.
My guess... it will treat you like you were never on the team to start.
Star Trek Online, Now with out the Trek....
had a 1 hour leaver penalty cause of the launcher crashing and not being able to get back in in time,,,,,,but thats after the mission had started,,,,,
Well, you'd probably be facing the same 1 hour penalty...
I don't think that is really sufficient reason not to implement this type of AFK discouragement however. Since the rest of the team was not booted, and was able to continue on with their mission, it would seem that the issue is local to you.
Sucks, I know... in my years of playing this game it has happened a handful of times that I was dc'd and ended up with a penalty timer... but the number of times I have had this happen is far fewer than the number of times I have been teamed with an AFK'er.
Before anyone points out that I have been a vocal advocate for using the channels to form teams... I have been running ALL PvE missions in Pug's (save an occasional CCE or when i am NWS Accolade hunting/training), really to see how pervasive this AFK problem really is.
In STF's it isn't tremendously bad... but the other PvE missions... I see AFK'ers quite often.
Star Trek Online, Now with out the Trek....
would not surprise me being like squirrels and now stocking up for the winter
system Lord Baal is dead
it is about those players who are consistently and regularly joining and staying afk, ALL THE TIME.
I can live with the former, if we can get the latter dealt with... so, an afk ban shouldn't happen just from one session alone.
maybe if ya haven't moved, or fired a shot, or whatever, then ok, no reward given at the end, but no ban... but, your last-status gets incremented, so if you join and afk the next time, at the end, it checks your last-status, and if you were afk for the previous one too? THEN drop the banhammer.
-- Smoov
Let me be the first one to say.... lol
I know right.
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
system Lord Baal is dead
Yeah he hates my "Doom" thread:P
They better make sure this is 110% bug free - can you imagine the forums and game chat if it went live and there was a bug that 30 sec of idle everyone got a 2 hour ban?
Or something else? The fires here would not be able to be put out for a LONG TIME they would be burning so hot!!
They better test every possible scenario - it's just too risky to go live with something that could take every q'd mission offline.
Seems it turns out that the fix for "afkers" isn't as easy as a lot of forumites seem to think it is.:rolleyes:
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
i get where your coming from but with how cryptic is that could take another 6 months to make bug free
system Lord Baal is dead
system Lord Baal is dead
Yeah Kamikaze afkers/leechers could make things WORSE in the Q's!!!