So what resources would you allocate away from the art department to bug fixes?
As I pointed out earlier in the thread, Cryptic employees aren't hourly -- they can't cut someone's hours and give those hours to someone else. They're all on salary, and often work long hours.
So if you want to "re-allocate resources", then what you're saying is you want to fire someone from the art department, and hire someone in systems. Who are you going to fire? The UI artist, that does all of the UI work in the game? The ship artist, so no more new ships will be added to the game? Concept artist, so the game will have no pre-production work? Cryptic's team is small, so logically their art department is going to be very small, too... which means it's already pretty lean. You aren't seeing the work of a massive group of people, you're seeing the result of 3-5 people at work, max. There's no fat on there to trim.
...
Now that you've learned something, you can feel free to totally hate on the new icons for legit reasons -- they're too similar, they aren't colorblind-friendly, you think they look stupid, whatever. But don't go thinking you can just shift anything away from art right now to help systems. That's not how it works.
I'll quote you integrally, as your flawed line of thinking is quite common in threads like this.
For one, the error of your reasoning can be easily demonstrated, as in your rigid line of thinking, a company would be forced to remain for ever locked into whichever way they initally divided their (human) resources. Obviously, and fortunately, as everyone can observe for themselves, that's not how things work in the world.
For two, reality simply falsifies your alleged lack of flexibility. EVE Online is a good example. CCP, at some point, simply diverted massive amounts of (human) resources towards one of their other games: Dust 254 (much to the annoyance of the player base, of course; but that aside). PWE is likely even larger than CCP (much larger, probably). They could easily shift (human) resources if they wanted to: pull a few systems folks off of Neverwinter (YAY!), and have them join the Cryptic crew, and have them start fixing some long overdue bugs. This happens within big companies a lot of times. No biggie. And, best of all, nobody needs to get fired.
There's also no crossover in their jobs and training. An artist is not a debugger. What the Art Department does has no effect on systems, good or bad. It's not preventing someone from fixing bugs, and they can't help someone to fix bugs either.
You remind me of man I once talked to in TV store. We were talking about deliveries somehow; and he said he would just put my TV on transport from a neighboring city tomorrow. I asked him whether he thought that was not a waste of transport. Upon which he smiled, and answered: "Nah; I thought so too, at first; but the van has to make that route anyway, so it makes no difference." He fancied himself clever, realizing the van had to drive anyway. Had he been one level smarter, though, he would have realized, that, because everyone was reasoning like him, the car making its long route was merely the result of everyone thinking 'It needs to drive anyway.'
You are like that TV salesman. You think the artist guy being there is "not preventing someone from fixing bugs, and they can't help someone to fix bugs either." True, when just seen within that narrow scope. Yet you fail to take your thinking one level higher, to where you realize PWE could shift/reallocate (human) resources as they see fit; and that having more people work on fixing bugs is not a matter of having the artist do it, LOL, but having another bug guy do it.
Now that you've learned something, you can feel free to totally hate on those who suggest more time be spent on fixing bugs than on revamping an icon system that absolutely needed no fixing at all; but let's stop the rather silly strawman that anyone is saying, even implying remotely, that the artist is supposed to fix bugs.
Ogres are like onions... and so is neutronium. If you look at the pictures of Neutronium, Victorium, etc... the different forms have different numbers of layers in the metal. (Think of the picture as a cross section.)
the Neutronium type stuff is distinguishable by the number of layers it has.
...as sketched by a three year old
...that or a six pack of sodas, which is Ironic considering you compare the new ones to soda cans.
...or emergency floor lighting.
...not really
They do have unique features. Granted they are shaped to make it easy to tell what type of console it is, but that's a good thing IMO. Seriously the new ones have sympols on them that match the icons for the type of weapon they buff. The old ones didn't have that.
I get it... you love the new icon cartoon graphics to the point of contradicting every statement criticizing them. That's fine -- everyone's opinion counts.
However, the issue boils down to personal preference vs. actual interface usability, and right now, in its present form, the new GUI icons are not very user friendly and flat out ignore color-blindness issues. The new tac consoles are difficult to distinguish from each other since they look almost identical to each other. STO majority has already expressed their disappointment in the change, and I concur with the latter.
My opinion: I don't like the new icons because they do not look like items from STO -- if anything, they more closely resemble World of W@rcr@ft items with their over-zoomed cartoon snapshot in a frame that is sized much too small to see the entire object. The new AP-consoles look like something out of a Hoard catapult.
The old icons have been around since STO's launch, and I had no difficulties whatsoever dealing with them back then, so I see no problem to fix with the new artwork. The new graphics actually make my eyes hurt.
EDIT: Yes, I like the idea of changing the console graphics to make their function and purpose more obvious, but Cryptic's initial attempt at doing so basically abandoned established standards and created something too alien to work properly.
Kinda reminds me of Microsoft and Window8 -- look how that turned out.
Or is the current state now in Cryptic's eyes something where any further discussion
is senesless?
No idea, but while we're waiting for a reply, I'll be trying out other game titles like Borderlands2 and Payday. If I'm going to power-game, I might as well play something more entertaining than Icon-Wars-Online.
No idea, but while we're waiting for a reply, I'll be trying out other game titles like Borderlands2 and Payday. If I'm going to power-game, I might as well play something more entertaining than Icon-Wars-Online.
By the way, are we tearing apart the console design or the people who don't
know the difference between Interface and Bug-fixing guys?
I'll quote you integrally, as your flawed line of thinking is quite common in threads like this.
For one, the error of your reasoning can be easily demonstrated, as in your rigid line of thinking, a company would be forced to remain for ever locked into whichever way they initally divided their (human) resources. Obviously, and fortunately, as everyone can observe for themselves, that's not how things work in the world.
For two, reality simply falsifies your alleged lack of flexibility. EVE Online is a good example. CCP, at some point, simply diverted massive amounts of (human) resources towards one of their other games: Dust 254 (much to the annoyance of the player base, of course; but that aside). PWE is likely even larger than CCP (much larger, probably). They could easily shift (human) resources if they wanted to: pull a few systems folks off of Neverwinter (YAY!), and have them join the Cryptic crew, and have them start fixing some long overdue bugs. This happens within big companies a lot of times. No biggie. And, best of all, nobody needs to get fired.
You remind me of man I once talked to in TV store. We were talking about deliveries somehow; and he said he would just put my TV on transport from a neighboring city tomorrow. I asked him whether he thought that was not a waste of transport. Upon which he smiled, and answered: "Nah; I thought so too, at first; but the van has to make that route anyway, so it makes no difference." He fancied himself clever, realizing the van had to drive anyway. Had he been one level smarter, though, he would have realized, that, because everyone was reasoning like him, the car making its long route was merely the result of everyone thinking 'It needs to drive anyway.'
You are like that TV salesman. You think the artist guy being there is "not preventing someone from fixing bugs, and they can't help someone to fix bugs either." True, when just seen within that narrow scope. Yet you fail to take your thinking one level higher, to where you realize PWE could shift/reallocate (human) resources as they see fit; and that having more people work on fixing bugs is not a matter of having the artist do it, LOL, but having another bug guy do it.
Now that you've learned something, you can feel free to totally hate on those who suggest more time be spent on fixing bugs than on revamping an icon system that absolutely needed no fixing at all; but let's stop the rather silly strawman that anyone is saying, even implying remotely, that the artist is supposed to fix bugs.
I bolded exactly where your argument stopped applying to what I was saying. I was telling someone why the one UI artist in the game doing his job wasn't preventing anyone from debugging the game. It's not his job to debug the game.
If PWE wanted to shift personnel over from another game with the appropriate skillset, they totally could. That's a valid solution. It's not coming from so much a place of ignorance. What I was saying was, there was no one in the art department with the appropriate skillset that could be shifted over to help with debugging, so someone from the art department doing their own job isn't affecting the debugging.
Your analogy of a TV salesman is inherently flawed, since you're comparing physical unskilled labor to specialized development. They're very different jobs, with very different requirements, actions, and goals. It's baffling you would even compare the two.
And you accused me of using a strawman argument...
What I was saying was, there was no one in the art department with the appropriate skillset that could be shifted over to help with debugging,
And no one ever suggested such a thing either, is what I was saying.
Your analogy of a TV salesman is inherently flawed, since you're comparing physical unskilled labor to specialized development. They're very different jobs, with very different requirements, actions, and goals. It's baffling you would even compare the two.
LOL. I'll give you points for obfuscation. :P Because the alternative would be to assume you really thought this was about me comparing the job of TV salesman to that of a design artist. And I'm trying to determine whether that's funny or sad (I'm leaning towards funny for the moment; but it's probably sad).
Anyway, as ppl have hinted above, maybe we should just stick to talking about the icon art again.
Well having played the game with the new icons my fears are realised. As a colour blind player I am totally lost with most of them, the only way I can tell most of them apart is by hovering my mouse over them.
For me and I suspect many others this is an unnecessary change, and unwelcome change and a change that has added confusion and irritation into the game that could have been totally avoided.
Generally bad all round Cryptic, sorry but that's my view and if you can change them back please do so asap for the love of Q.
I have to agree. I'm sat looking at these Icons and all I can see is either Red. blue or yellow backgrounds. The actual picture in the Icon is completely lost to me, most of which look exceptionally similar. Add into the equation the "Rarity" colour and they look a complete mess of colours which I can't see what Tac console boosts what Damage without mouse over and text reading. Not to mention my monitor resolution and being sat at least arms distance from it and not right on top of it.
I would like them to be changed back, I'm not a fan of all this pre-school colour coding of everything for the large percentage of players that cannot be bothered to read Quest or even STF optional text. Then get "helpful" colour coded skills and Icons. I wish games would stop pandering to people not willing to put in the effort to actually play.
However, the issue boils down to personal preference vs. actual interface usability, and right now, in its present form, the new GUI icons are not very user friendly and flat out ignore color-blindness issues. The new tac consoles are difficult to distinguish from each other since they look almost identical to each other. STO majority has already expressed their disappointment in the change, and I concur with the latter.
This was the entire reason I made the grayscale pictures. It doesn't matter if you're completely colorblind, you can still tell them apart.
The old icons have been around since STO's launch, and I had no difficulties whatsoever dealing with them back then, so I see no problem to fix with the new artwork. The new graphics actually make my eyes hurt.
Truthfully, I was never fond of the old ones. IMO most looked ridiculous.
Embassy consoles: other than the +/- threat, can't really tell them apart besides the small detail in lower left corner.
Tactical Energy/Projectile consoles: differentiation between different types of energy based solely on highlight color too subtle. It was better when each type of energy had their own icon. Step backwards in terms of clarity.
Engineering Alloy/Plating consoles: Same as above. Differentiating by highlight color is too subtle and not immediately apparent.
If I have to consult a chart to figure out what I'm seeing, then negative progress. I don't mind change and I like some of what I am seeing but I think you went overly subtle in trying for visual consistency by relying on tiny details to indicate important differences.
Why not just add a small black/white letter or two, to the upper left hand corner of the icon.
(the Red area)
Such as...
PL = Plasma
PH = Photon
D = Disruptor
T = Tetryon
A = Antiproton
PO = Polaron
Then it doesn't matter what the colors are.
Also, there is already a Roman Numeral in the opposite corner, so it wouldn't really be earth-shattering to do so.
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
Tactical Energy/Projectile consoles: differentiation between different types of energy based solely on highlight color too subtle. It was better when each type of energy had their own icon. Step backwards in terms of clarity.
It's not solely based on the highlight color. There's also the torpedo/beam's symbol on the console (which, for a low-resolution monitor and/or Disruptor coils, may be a little difficult to discern).
Ogres are like onions... and so is neutronium. If you look at the pictures of Neutronium, Victorium, etc... the different forms have different numbers of layers in the metal. (Think of the picture as a cross section.)In that aspect, the old system was just as bad...
As I have said, i suffer from Fuch's Dystrophy, am currently 30% blind and a complication of that disorder in my 2 year cycle with it (I have an operation every two years which basically "peels" my eyeballs) is i am now stage 1 monochromatic in both eyes, having lost an estimated 30 to 35% colour in all ranges.
The images you presented in your deviantart is nothing more than putting them into adobe photoshop and taking the colour slider down. That is NOTHING like colour blindness, it doesn't take into account the disparity between colour hues similar to the same RGB level, doesn't take into account various forms of colour blindness (cone or rod type blindness off the retina or back of the eyeball itself) or various other visual disorders which may be present with colour blindness.
I look at your greyscale images of those icons, and all i see is roughly the same shapes. I look at the greyscale images of the tac console you made as well and they LITERALLY look all the same to me, as they do in full colour as well in the game's UI.
Take your same colour images, put them back into Photoshop, pull the saturation down to 50%, pull the contrast and brightness down to 40% and then add a 1.8 gausian blur to the whole image.
THAT will give you an idea of what i have to look at. I have to use the ASUStec Mag Screen, a bubble which follows my mouse in game which magnfies that area by 5 times just to figure out what those new icons actually are.
Taking a screenshot of the images, sticking them into Photoshop and pulling the saturation down and then surmising that this is what it looks like to visually disabled people and that they are fine is demeaning to people like myself who have visual disorders who are already struggling with the horrid pastel shade low contrast trainwreck of a UI that was designed for LoR. Cryptic adding these new same looking consoles has made this game frankly made this game on the verge of unplayable for people like myself.
"You know when that shark bites, with its teeth dear... scarlet billows start to spread..."
So how about these new Icons that replaced the original Tactical, Engineering and Science console design... Does anyone else find them to be annoying? Why replace the original ones when they looked better, were more decisive and not as tacky? They're just plain ugly and you can't tell which is which.
It's not solely based on the highlight color. There's also the torpedo/beam's symbol on the console (which, for a low-resolution monitor and/or Disruptor coils, may be a little difficult to discern).
Hadn't noticed the symbols until I looked for them but that's the problem. The symbols are helpful (and, to be fair, the old icons were just as arbitrary) but not immediately apparent and, therefore, too small for their function. Better than relying on color alone but still not enough.
Logically, making these particular consoles the same shape but with different symbols/colors to differentiate them makes sense but the implementation is a step backwards in terms of usability. Again, I'm not opposed to the change but find some of the changes retrograde.
all I want to say is how much I dislike these new icons. if cryptic wanted to make it people learn to read they did a great job because now you have to read the tooltip on just about every console to find out what it is. At least before everything was different enough you knew at a glance what it was but now you have NO idea.
*side note, there was absolutely nothing else in the game that the art staff couldn't have done like new bridges, update a map, ship skins, etc?
As I have said, i suffer from Fuch's Dystrophy, am currently 30% blind and a complication of that disorder in my 2 year cycle with it (I have an operation every two years which basically "peels" my eyeballs) is i am now stage 1 monochromatic in both eyes, having lost an estimated 30 to 35% colour in all ranges.
The images you presented in your deviantart is nothing more than putting them into adobe photoshop and taking the colour slider down. That is NOTHING like colour blindness, it doesn't take into account the disparity between colour hues similar to the same RGB level, doesn't take into account various forms of colour blindness (cone or rod type blindness off the retina or back of the eyeball itself) or various other visual disorders which may be present with colour blindness.
I look at your greyscale images of those icons, and all i see is roughly the same shapes. I look at the greyscale images of the tac console you made as well and they LITERALLY look all the same to me, as they do in full colour as well in the game's UI.
Take your same colour images, put them back into Photoshop, pull the saturation down to 50%, pull the contrast and brightness down to 40% and then add a 1.8 gausian blur to the whole image.
THAT will give you an idea of what i have to look at. I have to use the ASUStec Mag Screen, a bubble which follows my mouse in game which magnfies that area by 5 times just to figure out what those new icons actually are.
Taking a screenshot of the images, sticking them into Photoshop and pulling the saturation down and then surmising that this is what it looks like to visually disabled people and that they are fine is demeaning to people like myself who have visual disorders who are already struggling with the horrid pastel shade low contrast trainwreck of a UI that was designed for LoR. Cryptic adding these new same looking consoles has made this game frankly made this game on the verge of unplayable for people like myself.
Some can tell the new icons apart with considerable effort, but that was never an issue with the old icons since they took zero effort to differentiate given their unique icon graphics. Others can't differentiate the new icons at all.
Regardless, more recognition effort = less ease of use = poor GUI design.
Adjusting image coloration still doesn't come close to addressing actual color blindness and recognition issues caused by the new icons. Please accept the first-hand accounts of actual color blind STO players instead of simply ignoring them.
Yeah, I'm not sure if there's any way to accurately show people what being color blind is actually like. Especially since all of us have varying degrees and types of it. The funny thing though is that his grey scale images kind of prove our point, even though he was trying to show the opposite. If you take those, shrink them down to their in game size and add in that rarity lighting/blur at the bottom (I can't tell the difference between rare, very rare, and ultra rare. It just looks like a light/blur at the edge) it becomes difficult if not impossible to tell some of the consoles apart. Take a look at the grey scale hull plating he made. Can you tell the differences between them? I sure can't. I can't tell the differences between them with the color added in. I just don't see it, my eyes can't process it.
While some of them do have subtle differences, there's one point that needs to be kept in mind:
Goal 1:Introduce a visual language into these console icons to make it easier to understand at a glance what bonuses that icon grants and what systems they affect.
Key phrase there being "easier to understand at a glance." Squinting in order to count the "layers" on an alloy is completely contrary to the objective outlined by the dev himself. At that point it's easier to just read the tool tips which defeats the entire purpose of having an icon in the first place.
Some can tell the new icons apart with considerable effort, but that was never an issue with the old icons since they took zero effort to differentiate given their unique icon graphics. Others can't differentiate the new icons at all.
Regardless, more recognition effort = less ease of use = poor GUI design.
Adjusting image coloration still doesn't come close to addressing actual color blindness and recognition issues caused by the new icons. Please accept the first-hand accounts of actual color blind STO players instead of simply ignoring them.
I have to wonder how someone like v1ctor1st is able to play the game at all. Based on his comments, he doesn't suffer from colorblindness as much as he suffers from reduced visual acuity. I don't think he would have been to distinguish between the old armor and hull plating consoles either. All of the old Armors were distinguished from each other primarily in color. Hull platings had more variation, but not a lot.
Key phrase there being "easier to understand at a glance." Squinting in order to count the "layers" on an alloy is completely contrary to the objective outlined by the dev himself. At that point it's easier to just read the tool tips which defeats the entire purpose of having an icon in the first place.
You don't need to count the layers on the alloys, since the alloys are fully separated by mark. Victorium, Duranium, Polyduranium... they all do the same thing as Neutronium, just at a lower mark. It's hull plating that's an issue.
You don't need to count the layers on the alloys, since the alloys are fully separated by mark. Victorium, Duranium, Polyduranium... they all do the same thing as Neutronium, just at a lower mark. It's hull plating that's an issue.
In that case, why bother having separate icons for them? No other consoles have visual differences between the marks, they all have the same icon. If they're going to have different icons then they do need to be easily distinguished "at a glance." If not, then they need to change the icons to be one uniform icon just like all the other consoles.
Comments
What layers?
I'll quote you integrally, as your flawed line of thinking is quite common in threads like this.
For one, the error of your reasoning can be easily demonstrated, as in your rigid line of thinking, a company would be forced to remain for ever locked into whichever way they initally divided their (human) resources. Obviously, and fortunately, as everyone can observe for themselves, that's not how things work in the world.
For two, reality simply falsifies your alleged lack of flexibility. EVE Online is a good example. CCP, at some point, simply diverted massive amounts of (human) resources towards one of their other games: Dust 254 (much to the annoyance of the player base, of course; but that aside). PWE is likely even larger than CCP (much larger, probably). They could easily shift (human) resources if they wanted to: pull a few systems folks off of Neverwinter (YAY!), and have them join the Cryptic crew, and have them start fixing some long overdue bugs. This happens within big companies a lot of times. No biggie. And, best of all, nobody needs to get fired.
You remind me of man I once talked to in TV store. We were talking about deliveries somehow; and he said he would just put my TV on transport from a neighboring city tomorrow. I asked him whether he thought that was not a waste of transport. Upon which he smiled, and answered: "Nah; I thought so too, at first; but the van has to make that route anyway, so it makes no difference." He fancied himself clever, realizing the van had to drive anyway. Had he been one level smarter, though, he would have realized, that, because everyone was reasoning like him, the car making its long route was merely the result of everyone thinking 'It needs to drive anyway.'
You are like that TV salesman. You think the artist guy being there is "not preventing someone from fixing bugs, and they can't help someone to fix bugs either." True, when just seen within that narrow scope. Yet you fail to take your thinking one level higher, to where you realize PWE could shift/reallocate (human) resources as they see fit; and that having more people work on fixing bugs is not a matter of having the artist do it, LOL, but having another bug guy do it.
Now that you've learned something, you can feel free to totally hate on those who suggest more time be spent on fixing bugs than on revamping an icon system that absolutely needed no fixing at all; but let's stop the rather silly strawman that anyone is saying, even implying remotely, that the artist is supposed to fix bugs.
more problems to see the quality level.
How about changing the icon text to include quality AND level?
(R) VI = Rare VI
(VR) XI = Very Rare XI
(UR) XII = Ultra Rare XII
Common is basic quality, so just the level on the icon
And sorry, dont like the TAC and ENG consoles either.
My character Tsin'xing
I get it... you love the new icon cartoon graphics to the point of contradicting every statement criticizing them. That's fine -- everyone's opinion counts.
However, the issue boils down to personal preference vs. actual interface usability, and right now, in its present form, the new GUI icons are not very user friendly and flat out ignore color-blindness issues. The new tac consoles are difficult to distinguish from each other since they look almost identical to each other. STO majority has already expressed their disappointment in the change, and I concur with the latter.
My opinion: I don't like the new icons because they do not look like items from STO -- if anything, they more closely resemble World of W@rcr@ft items with their over-zoomed cartoon snapshot in a frame that is sized much too small to see the entire object. The new AP-consoles look like something out of a Hoard catapult.
The old icons have been around since STO's launch, and I had no difficulties whatsoever dealing with them back then, so I see no problem to fix with the new artwork. The new graphics actually make my eyes hurt.
EDIT: Yes, I like the idea of changing the console graphics to make their function and purpose more obvious, but Cryptic's initial attempt at doing so basically abandoned established standards and created something too alien to work properly.
Kinda reminds me of Microsoft and Window8 -- look how that turned out.
Or is the current state now in Cryptic's eyes something where any further discussion
is senesless?
No idea, but while we're waiting for a reply, I'll be trying out other game titles like Borderlands2 and Payday. If I'm going to power-game, I might as well play something more entertaining than Icon-Wars-Online.
By the way, are we tearing apart the console design or the people who don't
know the difference between Interface and Bug-fixing guys?
I somehow lost track...
I'm only criticizing the GUI design because I do not want to violate any terms of use in this forum
I bolded exactly where your argument stopped applying to what I was saying. I was telling someone why the one UI artist in the game doing his job wasn't preventing anyone from debugging the game. It's not his job to debug the game.
If PWE wanted to shift personnel over from another game with the appropriate skillset, they totally could. That's a valid solution. It's not coming from so much a place of ignorance. What I was saying was, there was no one in the art department with the appropriate skillset that could be shifted over to help with debugging, so someone from the art department doing their own job isn't affecting the debugging.
Your analogy of a TV salesman is inherently flawed, since you're comparing physical unskilled labor to specialized development. They're very different jobs, with very different requirements, actions, and goals. It's baffling you would even compare the two.
And you accused me of using a strawman argument...
Ahh thank you good sir,
Well I have posted some opinions about the icons already.
Job is done.
What's next to complain about? Just point me in the direction
And no one ever suggested such a thing either, is what I was saying.
LOL. I'll give you points for obfuscation. :P Because the alternative would be to assume you really thought this was about me comparing the job of TV salesman to that of a design artist. And I'm trying to determine whether that's funny or sad (I'm leaning towards funny for the moment; but it's probably sad).
Anyway, as ppl have hinted above, maybe we should just stick to talking about the icon art again.
I have to agree. I'm sat looking at these Icons and all I can see is either Red. blue or yellow backgrounds. The actual picture in the Icon is completely lost to me, most of which look exceptionally similar. Add into the equation the "Rarity" colour and they look a complete mess of colours which I can't see what Tac console boosts what Damage without mouse over and text reading. Not to mention my monitor resolution and being sat at least arms distance from it and not right on top of it.
I would like them to be changed back, I'm not a fan of all this pre-school colour coding of everything for the large percentage of players that cannot be bothered to read Quest or even STF optional text. Then get "helpful" colour coded skills and Icons. I wish games would stop pandering to people not willing to put in the effort to actually play.
My character Tsin'xing
Tactical Energy/Projectile consoles: differentiation between different types of energy based solely on highlight color too subtle. It was better when each type of energy had their own icon. Step backwards in terms of clarity.
Engineering Alloy/Plating consoles: Same as above. Differentiating by highlight color is too subtle and not immediately apparent.
If I have to consult a chart to figure out what I'm seeing, then negative progress. I don't mind change and I like some of what I am seeing but I think you went overly subtle in trying for visual consistency by relying on tiny details to indicate important differences.
Why not just add a small black/white letter or two, to the upper left hand corner of the icon.
(the Red area)
Such as...
PL = Plasma
PH = Photon
D = Disruptor
T = Tetryon
A = Antiproton
PO = Polaron
Then it doesn't matter what the colors are.
Also, there is already a Roman Numeral in the opposite corner, so it wouldn't really be earth-shattering to do so.
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
As I have said, i suffer from Fuch's Dystrophy, am currently 30% blind and a complication of that disorder in my 2 year cycle with it (I have an operation every two years which basically "peels" my eyeballs) is i am now stage 1 monochromatic in both eyes, having lost an estimated 30 to 35% colour in all ranges.
The images you presented in your deviantart is nothing more than putting them into adobe photoshop and taking the colour slider down. That is NOTHING like colour blindness, it doesn't take into account the disparity between colour hues similar to the same RGB level, doesn't take into account various forms of colour blindness (cone or rod type blindness off the retina or back of the eyeball itself) or various other visual disorders which may be present with colour blindness.
I look at your greyscale images of those icons, and all i see is roughly the same shapes. I look at the greyscale images of the tac console you made as well and they LITERALLY look all the same to me, as they do in full colour as well in the game's UI.
Take your same colour images, put them back into Photoshop, pull the saturation down to 50%, pull the contrast and brightness down to 40% and then add a 1.8 gausian blur to the whole image.
THAT will give you an idea of what i have to look at. I have to use the ASUStec Mag Screen, a bubble which follows my mouse in game which magnfies that area by 5 times just to figure out what those new icons actually are.
Taking a screenshot of the images, sticking them into Photoshop and pulling the saturation down and then surmising that this is what it looks like to visually disabled people and that they are fine is demeaning to people like myself who have visual disorders who are already struggling with the horrid pastel shade low contrast trainwreck of a UI that was designed for LoR. Cryptic adding these new same looking consoles has made this game frankly made this game on the verge of unplayable for people like myself.
Pls PWE, can you add a switch to use old/new icons?
I was working off the posted artwork in the OP. In-game, you are correct.
Hadn't noticed the symbols until I looked for them but that's the problem. The symbols are helpful (and, to be fair, the old icons were just as arbitrary) but not immediately apparent and, therefore, too small for their function. Better than relying on color alone but still not enough.
Logically, making these particular consoles the same shape but with different symbols/colors to differentiate them makes sense but the implementation is a step backwards in terms of usability. Again, I'm not opposed to the change but find some of the changes retrograde.
*side note, there was absolutely nothing else in the game that the art staff couldn't have done like new bridges, update a map, ship skins, etc?
I believe v1ctor1st's follow-up post says it best:
Some can tell the new icons apart with considerable effort, but that was never an issue with the old icons since they took zero effort to differentiate given their unique icon graphics. Others can't differentiate the new icons at all.
Regardless, more recognition effort = less ease of use = poor GUI design.
Adjusting image coloration still doesn't come close to addressing actual color blindness and recognition issues caused by the new icons. Please accept the first-hand accounts of actual color blind STO players instead of simply ignoring them.
Yes, you've repeatedly stated the above ad nauseum, and this repetition adds no value towards finding a viable solution that satisfies all parties.
Universal Functionality always trumps personal preference, except when your living space is concerned
While some of them do have subtle differences, there's one point that needs to be kept in mind:
Key phrase there being "easier to understand at a glance." Squinting in order to count the "layers" on an alloy is completely contrary to the objective outlined by the dev himself. At that point it's easier to just read the tool tips which defeats the entire purpose of having an icon in the first place.
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My character Tsin'xing
You don't need to count the layers on the alloys, since the alloys are fully separated by mark. Victorium, Duranium, Polyduranium... they all do the same thing as Neutronium, just at a lower mark. It's hull plating that's an issue.
Can't be. Here's a picture someone posted earlier. That's the size I see in game. Yours are larger.
In that case, why bother having separate icons for them? No other consoles have visual differences between the marks, they all have the same icon. If they're going to have different icons then they do need to be easily distinguished "at a glance." If not, then they need to change the icons to be one uniform icon just like all the other consoles.
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