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Scimitar bugged?

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  • hereticknight085hereticknight085 Member Posts: 3,783 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    I am calling BS on this one. Feel free to screenshot your pie graph for this one, because unless you have tricked out your plug-in, getting 14k encDPS would require you to be doing 50k burst(or more)... and I dont see that happening.

    ...
    I can sustain 10k with my scimitar relatively easily. And you can deal 14k dps with ease. Think about it. APA3, FOMM3, BFAW3, APO3, BFAW2, APB2, Singularity Overcharge 5. Just keep cycling the BFAWs and APs, and you can sustain it with ease.
    It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once. B)
  • caldannachcaldannach Member Posts: 485 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    OK, i have to say.

    I DELETED MY SHUTTLE.

    THE DIFFERENCE WAS HUGE!

    Dev's please look into this. Im not joking, my power levels and shields were totally different and my DPS has almost doubled. I used to parse at least 9-10 k DPS on my fleet haafeh on boff fights in ESTF.

    My scimitar, with almost teh same setup was doing like 6-7k. I couldnt understand why. Now i do. Its back up even higher than the haa'feh was, as it should be with an extra front weapon.

    Seriously, the shuttle is causing a bug somehow. I didnt think it was true but now i have seen it myself.
    " Experience is a hard mistress, she gives the tests first, and the lessons after... "
  • variise1984variise1984 Member Posts: 26 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Lets not give them the wrong information. For some people dismissing the shuttle didn't completely fix the issue. I'm an example of that.

    I still get hits that fold the ship in half or knock most of the crew out in one hit. The difference is it's not happening as often as when I had a shuttle. It's happening maybe one in ten matches now instead of every single match. Some of these issues are happening more often than others. It varies as these don't appear to be one problem but several acting in concert.

    I also don't want to hear about how the issue is one of design arguing that the warbirds are supposed to have less shield resists due to less sub power. I found my refit D'deridex was overall tougher even with 10k less hull and I can't even compare it to my Adapted Destroyer. It's night and day.

    What I noticed is I have had to compensate substantially to bring the Scim up to par. I never stacked BOF abilities like HAZ or EPTS before but suddenly I'm finding I must to live through engagements. I never had to pay any attention to how I spent my skill points before but now I had to respec several times to try and find an optimal skill setup that makes the Scim more effective. I have decent DOFs from before but it looks like I'll have to replace them all as I end up re-doing them as well to again compensate further.

    I still refuse to believe people are getting 250k crits and one shooting Tac Cubes with the Pulse. It's an annoying mosquito bite that does damage between 40k-55k or about 1-2% and only at ranges under 5k. It forces you to give up too much to make it effective in any capacity what so ever. You are better off moving the skill points from PG to sub systems, remove the 3rd console and replace it with any number of other useful consoles.

    I continue to use it and test it because it's my favorite ship from Star Trek and I refuse to give up on it so easily but as of right now it's not comparable to other top ships that can pull just as much weight without any of the negatives.
    4kDVOG9.jpg
  • vonhellstingvonhellsting Member Posts: 543 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Lets not give them the wrong information. For some people dismissing the shuttle didn't completely fix the issue. I'm an example of that.

    I still get hits that fold the ship in half or knock most of the crew out in one hit. The difference is it's not happening as often as when I had a shuttle. It's happening maybe one in ten matches now instead of every single match.

    When I got rid of the shuttle it seemed to make it way worse for me so I had to buy it again which returned everything back to normal bugged not uber bugged.
    The Lobi Crystals are Faaaakkkkee!
  • variise1984variise1984 Member Posts: 26 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    When I got rid of the shuttle it seemed to make it way worse for me so I had to buy it again which returned everything back to normal bugged not uber bugged.

    This is what I mean. My experience is slightly different from others and there are many variations.

    At one point I thought maybe it's an issue with the database since it wasn't impacting everyone but those it did impact it seemed to stay no matter what. However you experience suggests otherwise.

    There doesn't appear to be an obvious clear indication of what is causing it other than the shuttle. There is something there maybe in combination with some other things that is causing this.
    4kDVOG9.jpg
  • heizlueftaheizluefta Member Posts: 167 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    I dismissed my shuttles yesterday but yet i can not give any info if it helped.
    But waht i see is:

    BOs in the Roster having shipicons from the shipyard sometime, all other ships appearing in the space roster in adittion to BOs sometimes, BOs disappearing from stations, BOs and ship or shuttle switching names and positions in the roster, skills from actionbar disappearing resetting or reorganizing automatically, the game is so buggy atm that it would be a shame for me as DEV.

    And now think of all the things you dont see obviously !!!

    Yesterday just in the moment i dismissed my shuttle and beamed up to scimitar all my skills were resetted again...no BOs in stations and so on....which made me think the game must have been thinking i just equipped my scimitar as i deleted my shuttle....but thats pure theory....DEvs have to investigate that.

    What i think right now is: so many bugs...there must be more....maybe far more....i read in the notes that they fix shieldregen with cloak and shieldregen display with this patch but i really hope they dont stop investigating.

    Sometimes id like to see a DEVs face if i showed him what kind of bugs daily happen when i just switch maps.....but maybe he wouldnt be surpried

    I hope the hull bugs will be fixed soon because that really makes that ship feel like flying a commander ship in Elite Situations....
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • johankreigjohankreig Member Posts: 449 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    I switched shuttles, stripped it, deleted it and then bought it back again and all is better now, my tool tipmeven shows my hull andnshields
    Jorhana Kreig: KDF, Tal'is: Romulan Fed, Shona'a: Romulan KDF, Johan Paul Kreig: Fed
  • sdmaxwellsdmaxwell Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Lets not give them the wrong information. For some people dismissing the shuttle didn't completely fix the issue. I'm an example of that.

    I still get hits that fold the ship in half or knock most of the crew out in one hit. The difference is it's not happening as often as when I had a shuttle. It's happening maybe one in ten matches now instead of every single match. Some of these issues are happening more often than others. It varies as these don't appear to be one problem but several acting in concert.

    I also don't want to hear about how the issue is one of design arguing that the warbirds are supposed to have less shield resists due to less sub power. I found my refit D'deridex was overall tougher even with 10k less hull and I can't even compare it to my Adapted Destroyer. It's night and day.

    What I noticed is I have had to compensate substantially to bring the Scim up to par. I never stacked BOF abilities like HAZ or EPTS before but suddenly I'm finding I must to live through engagements. I never had to pay any attention to how I spent my skill points before but now I had to respec several times to try and find an optimal skill setup that makes the Scim more effective. I have decent DOFs from before but it looks like I'll have to replace them all as I end up re-doing them as well to again compensate further.

    I still refuse to believe people are getting 250k crits and one shooting Tac Cubes with the Pulse. It's an annoying mosquito bite that does damage between 40k-55k or about 1-2% and only at ranges under 5k. It forces you to give up too much to make it effective in any capacity what so ever. You are better off moving the skill points from PG to sub systems, remove the 3rd console and replace it with any number of other useful consoles.

    I continue to use it and test it because it's my favorite ship from Star Trek and I refuse to give up on it so easily but as of right now it's not comparable to other top ships that can pull just as much weight without any of the negatives.

    It depends on the STF you are doing, but some of those hits might be coming from borg Isometric Charges, which hit stupidly hard, even harder than the player versions can. They can ignore shields as well, which I'm sure is a bug, albeit a smaller one, and can be hard to see if you aren't looking for them. The AOE they do doesn't seem to have much of an animation either. If you are zoomed in close and your team mates are behind you, you could very well get hit for 50k and never see what did it.

    I've observed this in CSE only, but it may happen in other STFs.
  • vonhellstingvonhellsting Member Posts: 543 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    heizluefta wrote: »

    Yesterday just in the moment i dismissed my shuttle and beamed up to scimitar all my skills were resetted again...no BOs in stations and so on....which made me think the game must have been thinking i just equipped my scimitar as i deleted my shuttle....but thats pure theory....DEvs have to investigate that.

    I had my BOs reset the other day too. I think the game thought I was still on my Fed alt I had recently played because I notices my Scimitars power setting were set to the same settings as my Fed ship which was different to how I had my scimitar set.:eek:
    The Lobi Crystals are Faaaakkkkee!
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  • hereticknight085hereticknight085 Member Posts: 3,783 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    sdmaxwell wrote: »
    It depends on the STF you are doing, but some of those hits might be coming from borg Isometric Charges, which hit stupidly hard, even harder than the player versions can. They can ignore shields as well, which I'm sure is a bug, albeit a smaller one, and can be hard to see if you aren't looking for them. The AOE they do doesn't seem to have much of an animation either. If you are zoomed in close and your team mates are behind you, you could very well get hit for 50k and never see what did it.

    I've observed this in CSE only, but it may happen in other STFs.

    Borg Iso Charges come from the Borg Neg'vhars. And they only appear in CSEs. As for ignoring shields, that's one of their effects. The Iso Charge knocks down whatever shield facing it hits, in addition to dealing a ton of damage. However, on the bright side, they can miss or be duds (by dud I mean deal no damage), AND can only be fired if you're in front of the Neggy. Solution? Stay behind the bugger.
    It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once. B)
  • fenr00kfenr00k Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    The shield regen issue is annoying, but the real problem is taking massive "phantom" damage directly to the hull as if the shields and hull resistances are not even there.



    I am calling BS on this one. Feel free to screenshot your pie graph for this one, because unless you have tricked out your plug-in, getting 14k encDPS would require you to be doing 50k burst(or more)... and I dont see that happening.

    Call BS all you like, doesn't change the fact that a LOT of people can hit 14k enc dps using beam arrays and fire at will with the right team throwing out the right buffs and debuffs, on the right ships. I'm a member of TOS Vets, where we have members who regularly do over 10k enc dps. The Tal Shiar Battle Cruiser, Jem'Hadar Dreadnought Carrier (one of our fleet members actually does 14-16k dps in this ship) and now the Scimitar are all capable of hitting 14k and above dependant upon team.

    But heh, were also completely used to people who just don't know how to run the ships to the optimum calling BS too. Too many people are stuck in the idea that you have to use DHCs to get high dps, and this is where they go wrong, they only do high dps where you can keep that 45 degree firing arc pointing at your targets constantly, plus the simple truth is that when you are hitting a LOT of targets at once all around your ship then your enc dps is going to be higher than you will get hitting 1 or 2 targets at a time.

    The Scimitar is an excellent ship when set up properly, but so many folks think it's a giant escort, and try to set it up like one. It's not, it's something else entirely. I did and eSTF (infected) a few days back with a pug. 4 Scimitars (including mine) and a Tal Shiar Adapted Cruiser. NOBODY blew up even once and the STF was completed, with optional, with 9 minutes 45 seconds left on the clock.

    The Scimitar is bugged yes, with the shuttle bug and the shields whilst cloaked console (this 2nd one confirmed now). But it's the tank that is bugged and this can be worked around (as others keep trying to point out, the reduced power levels using singularity cores is one of the reasons folks have trouble tanking in Romulan ships, you have to rething your power levels), the dps is certainly not bugged though, and again I say that anybody doing under 6k dps (which is achievable with ease even in a Galaxy) in one really isn't set up right.

    Feel free to recreate my build and test it for yourself http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/?build=venspolscimupd_0.

    Ven
  • variise1984variise1984 Member Posts: 26 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    I have also seen the issue with the BOfs getting removed from the stations, all the BOfs having their icons changed to ships and you cannot use some functions with the ship until you click on them and it resets them back to normal. I have also had every ability removed from the ship not just when I released my shuttles, which I expected, but almost a week later when I simply beamed up from Risa to the ship. Everything was gone.

    So yeah there are "issues" to address.
    4kDVOG9.jpg
  • captainobvious09captainobvious09 Member Posts: 182 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    fenr00k wrote: »
    Call BS all you like, doesn't change the fact that a LOT of people can hit 14k enc dps using beam arrays and fire at will with the right team throwing out the right buffs and debuffs, on the right ships. I'm a member of TOS Vets, where we have members who regularly do over 10k enc dps. The Tal Shiar Battle Cruiser, Jem'Hadar Dreadnought Carrier (one of our fleet members actually does 14-16k dps in this ship) and now the Scimitar are all capable of hitting 14k and above dependant upon team.

    But heh, were also completely used to people who just don't know how to run the ships to the optimum calling BS too. Too many people are stuck in the idea that you have to use DHCs to get high dps, and this is where they go wrong, they only do high dps where you can keep that 45 degree firing arc pointing at your targets constantly, plus the simple truth is that when you are hitting a LOT of targets at once all around your ship then your enc dps is going to be higher than you will get hitting 1 or 2 targets at a time.

    The Scimitar is an excellent ship when set up properly, but so many folks think it's a giant escort, and try to set it up like one. It's not, it's something else entirely. I did and eSTF (infected) a few days back with a pug. 4 Scimitars (including mine) and a Tal Shiar Adapted Cruiser. NOBODY blew up even once and the STF was completed, with optional, with 9 minutes 45 seconds left on the clock.

    The Scimitar is bugged yes, with the shuttle bug and the shields whilst cloaked console (this 2nd one confirmed now). But it's the tank that is bugged and this can be worked around (as others keep trying to point out, the reduced power levels using singularity cores is one of the reasons folks have trouble tanking in Romulan ships, you have to rething your power levels), the dps is certainly not bugged though, and again I say that anybody doing under 6k dps (which is achievable with ease even in a Galaxy) in one really isn't set up right.

    Feel free to recreate my build and test it for yourself http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/?build=venspolscimupd_0.

    Ven


    I am not knocking your use of beams or your build, in fact your build is almost identical to mine except mine uses romulan faction beams and torp. What I do not understand is how your plug in is counting the damage, because I run ACT daily in eSTF, and nobody (seriously NOBODY) hits 14k on any ship encDPS, now in the DPS column yeah sure NP, my JHDC gets 12-14k DPS even if I afk for a sandwich, but not encDPS. The encDPS is counted through the entire mission, so at any point you are not hitting something you lose DPS (like when you pull agro on the gate and have to move out some).

    Is it possible you are reading something incorrectly, or can you share where you got your plug in, because something does not jive.

    I would also be happy to run with you and compare ACT numbers, I just want to understand how you are getting your numbers. I may be using a bad plug in.

    My Scimitar clocks out at 9k DPS and 5k encDPS, and like I said, its almost the same as yours but plasma and I also run aux2bat.

    What doffs are you using ? I am using 3 beam 1 torp and the one that gives extra power to emergency power.
  • gorlock691gorlock691 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Well a few fleetmates and myself did some testing last night with regards to the shuttle dismissing.
    Of course all our officers were dismissed from our bridge and had to reset all the officers and their abilities in the bars. We played for a couple of hours and definitely noticed a difference in the resiliency of our ships. I was in my Scimitar and they were in various Fed/Zen ships. They noticed a small increase in general toughness and I noticed a HUGE one. I was actually taking hits without losing half my hull or more. My crew wasn't all injured/dead in the first minute of an STF. I also noticed the crew was healing in the middle of an STF. That's a first!! There's definitely something wrong with the shuttles. I haven't tested the consoles yet. This problem might have been around for quite awhile but only became more noticeable when the Scimitars came out for some reason. We don't think it's just affecting the Scimitars.
  • zdfx19zdfx19 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    gorlock691 wrote: »
    Well a few fleetmates and myself did some testing last night with regards to the shuttle dismissing.
    Of course all our officers were dismissed from our bridge and had to reset all the officers and their abilities in the bars. We played for a couple of hours and definitely noticed a difference in the resiliency of our ships. I was in my Scimitar and they were in various Fed/Zen ships. They noticed a small increase in general toughness and I noticed a HUGE one. I was actually taking hits without losing half my hull or more. My crew wasn't all injured/dead in the first minute of an STF. I also noticed the crew was healing in the middle of an STF. That's a first!! There's definitely something wrong with the shuttles. I haven't tested the consoles yet. This problem might have been around for quite awhile but only became more noticeable when the Scimitars came out for some reason. We don't think it's just affecting the Scimitars.

    I am hesitant to second this post but I will. I have noted something in play like this myself across the board but do not know how to prove it well enough to see action taken. The DEV team needs to look at this.
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  • xxninjaz1xxxxninjaz1xx Member Posts: 23 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    I personally love the ship.
    Ok there may be a few problems with the shields and hull, but those are easily worked around and once you find those work arounds, the ship is pretty good.
    The only issue i have with it is the thalaron pulse.
    Even when fully buffed, all power to aux (because thats what the damage is based off for the pulse in case people havent realised) and skill in particle gens, i can only max the damage at 30-40k.
    For a weapon that is 1-hit kill for every NPC in the game, the player version sucks.
    However, this is an issue that i can live with since the pulse isnt the only way to cause damage, and it is generally a good ship. :D
  • alteri1alteri1 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Ive seen some scims fly in, nuke everything and fly out. Others ive seen fly in get nuked re-spawn and then get nuked again. I think it might be bugs mixed with not using it properlly
  • gilgalad195gilgalad195 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    So decommissioning my shuttle will fix some of the scimitar problems? I will definitely do that!
  • wufangchuwufangchu Member Posts: 778 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    So decommissioning my shuttle will fix some of the scimitar problems? I will definitely do that!

    It will help.. After that, in my experience its more of an alchemical amalgam of the consoles you have installed. The good, thebad and the really ugly ones are listed here and there throughout the threads here in this forum. If you have any of the legacy pack consoles installed, I recommend removing all of them then replacing them one at a time, noting down if they help or cause more problems..Make sure to add in a couple rcs consoles and a couple particle generators, and put an engineering BOFF in the Universal Lt Cmdr station and you'll be well on your way to having a wonderfully enjoyable ship :)..
    wraith_zps7pzgamff.jpg
  • gorlock691gorlock691 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Cheers to the devs! They have taken notice and are starting to refit all our Scimitars! :)

    From today's patch notes:


    "The Scimitar's shields will now properly regenerate while cloaked if the Singularity Distribution Unit is equipped.
    Ship shields will now appropriately display their values while in sector space."
  • fenr00kfenr00k Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    I am not knocking your use of beams or your build, in fact your build is almost identical to mine except mine uses romulan faction beams and torp. What I do not understand is how your plug in is counting the damage, because I run ACT daily in eSTF, and nobody (seriously NOBODY) hits 14k on any ship encDPS, now in the DPS column yeah sure NP, my JHDC gets 12-14k DPS even if I afk for a sandwich, but not encDPS. The encDPS is counted through the entire mission, so at any point you are not hitting something you lose DPS (like when you pull agro on the gate and have to move out some).

    Is it possible you are reading something incorrectly, or can you share where you got your plug in, because something does not jive.

    I would also be happy to run with you and compare ACT numbers, I just want to understand how you are getting your numbers. I may be using a bad plug in.

    My Scimitar clocks out at 9k DPS and 5k encDPS, and like I said, its almost the same as yours but plasma and I also run aux2bat.

    What doffs are you using ? I am using 3 beam 1 torp and the one that gives extra power to emergency power.

    I know where you are coming from bud, but nope, not misreading. Ok this screen is of a parse in my Jemmy dread using Romulan beams, however you can see it's perfectly possible to get higher enc dps:-

    Screeny of ACT

    My Scimitar does more damage than my Jemmy Dread, seriously, possibly thanks to the awesomeness that are advanced Romulan Drones. I will mention though, high enc DPS is often a side effect of been on a dps poor pug. If you are in there with others doing decent dps then it drops big time. When you are in there with folks who struggle to top 3k though it's a different story. ;)

    As to my doffs, they're truly naff, and nope no aux 2 bat. 3 blue damage control doffs and a couple of rubbish doffs I can't remember. Skills build is based around eptw and fire at will. I don't even have T5 in ANY rep (highest is my T3 Romulan rep. lol), so I fully expect DPS to go up as I get better equipment, doffs and rep.

    ACT plugin is this one http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=584871&highlight=plugin

    So heh, if it's not right, blame the plugin. lol Either way, my point still stands that anybody who can't break at least 6k enc dps in this ship has it set up wrong.

    Ven
  • gorlock691gorlock691 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    You guys mind moving your dps parse stuff to another thread? You're hijacking this one where we are trying to get to the bottom of all the issues.....
  • hereticknight085hereticknight085 Member Posts: 3,783 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    gorlock691 wrote: »
    You guys mind moving your dps parse stuff to another thread? You're hijacking this one where we are trying to get to the bottom of all the issues.....

    They aren't hijacking the thread. The thread is about bugs on the ship, and that includes damage output and BOff abilities/layout bugs as well. It's also about general ship gameplay and how the bugs are affecting that.

    So sorry to say, it's still on topic.
    It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once. B)
  • wufangchuwufangchu Member Posts: 778 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    theyve nerfed the thaleron and although shields now repair, the scimitar is even more squishy than it was..
    wraith_zps7pzgamff.jpg
  • gorlock691gorlock691 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Sorry, my mistake. I haven't noticed any dps issues with the ship. Thought it was all hull/shields/crewmen....
  • gorlock691gorlock691 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    wufangchu wrote: »
    theyve nerfed the thaleron and although shields now repair, the scimitar is even more squishy than it was..

    God I hope not. I haven't changed a thing since before the patch. I'll keep an eye out and test more.
  • wufangchuwufangchu Member Posts: 778 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    gorlock691 wrote: »
    God I hope not. I haven't changed a thing since before the patch. I'll keep an eye out and test more.

    Much appreciated.. Seems when they fxed one thing, they opened up another can of worms elsewhere..
    wraith_zps7pzgamff.jpg
  • giliongilion Member Posts: 686 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Ya Im still having issues with my Scimi as well. The shields to regen now, but it actually doesn't display in the UI that it is, next to shield regen rate it always says 0/-1 no matter what.

    Also I just went threw ISE twice, once with my Fed in a Breen Cruiser and again with my Scimi. Skill wise and console wise both char/ships are very close to each other, with my Romulan being slightly better skilled for tanking, and yet I still had to cloak every 10 sec to stop myself from dieing constantly, while in the Breen ship it was insanely easy to stay alive, I only went below 50% hull once.

    My Scimi even has more heals since I went with an Eng in the Lt. Cmdr Universal slot AND a Sci off with Transfer Shields in the Ensign Uni. So put simply, for one of the largest playable ships in the game the Scimi sure is squishy.
    _____________________________________________________
    Anyone want to give me a Temporal Heavy Dreadnought pack? I'll be your friend :D
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