Lockboxes are TRIBBLE, but I've long since accepted them. Kind of like how I accept there are drug dealers out there. It's not a good form of acceptance, but I don't get bent out of shape over it anymore.
I will never embrace the greedy gambling scam of lock boxes. The gambling nature of acquiring items is horrible. I will continue to be vocal about my dislike for it. Those items should all be c-store items. I will never like it, accept it, nor keep my mouth shut about it. You will not convince me otherwise.
What he said.
I do not spend money unless I know exactly what I'm getting for that money.
When this game starts to recieve regular content on a regular basis then i will start to think that the boxes are in part a good thing and are indeed helping the game evolve and grow.......until then the boxes seem to be nothing more than max profit for min effort while the game stagnates and goes nowhere.
You may like them and that's fine, others dont, but just like you they are entitled to voice that opinions....so if its gotten to the stage that you have to make threads telling people to stop then i suggest in future you make life easy for yourself, go enjoy the lockboxes and steer clear of threads where people are unhappy with them.
I see it as a bad thing for the IP of Star Trek because it does this- it allows a stupid and lazy excuse to be used to introduce ships to the players for almost no story and no reason. I mean the jem ship had an interesting story, the ferengi might have and the cards might have. But the tholian ships were complete bs. There's no way in any canon sense that a federation or Klingon would be able to use a tholian ship. Then they bring in the time ships -_- another excuse of a ship because "they're rare and hardly anyone will have them" isn't a valid excuse because I'm seeing more and more alien ships being used rather actual federation ships. It's just stupid.
That's why I think the IP of Star Trek is being put into a bad place by this company and want CBS to revoke their ip contract with them.
You can buy all the items that are in the lock boxes on the exchange. For instance, the Temporal Science ship can be bought on the exchange right now for about 80 million ec. You can buy keys for zen, and then sell these on the exchange. For all the people who complain about wanting these items in the C-Store, they already effectively are. Just buy keys, sell them and buy whatever you want.
Maybe people who complain about lock boxes dont know this. If they do know this, then they are really just complaining about the price. It would take about $60 dollars worth of lock box keys to get the temporal science ship. The Tholain Orb Weaver is about 32 dollars worth keys. The Jem Hadar ship is about $350 worth of keys. These are all pretty high prices, but it is for a rare ship. It is good for a game to have rare things that you aspire to get.
If you dont like the price of that, you can get a Fleet ship, most of which are equal to or better than the lock box ships, for $20. You can get it even cheaper if you use dilithium for zen or buy fleet ship modules on the exchange for ec. I got my fleet ship for free. If you dont want to do that, the rear admiral ships are fine for pve. I used my rear admiral ship in pvp a bit, and it went OK.
No one is forcing anyone to buy lock box keys. I havent opened any lock boxes because I dont think it is worth it. I am happy that other people are because it helps finance the game. I have bought zen for other stuff that I thought was worth it.
Lock boxes are actually a great way for Cryptic to finance a free to play game without negatively affecting game play. If Cryptic eliminated the lock boxes and put these ships on the C-Store for $30, $60, and $350, etc., it would be much worse for the game. If Cryptic made all of these ships C-Store only, it would be worse for the game. Some people would simply never be able to get these ships if they did that. As it is now, players can actually get all of these ships for free through game play, which is a great thing.
I think more people would buy these items if they knew that when they spent money, they got the item. I don't like the gambling nature of it all.
This is why I think these items that have been in lox boxes, should all be c-store items. You spend money, you buy your Zen, then you buy the item you want and you get it instantly, you are guaranteed to get it. This was the whole point of the c-store.
I don't like spending money, with a random chance to get the item, that is the part of it that I am against.
This is the best argument against lock boxes. If someone wants a ship, they should be able to pay money for it. Make it more money than a few lockboxes, sure, but there shouldn't be even the chance of someone saying "I want that ship" and not being able to get it because of random numbers.
The best argument against people whining about lockboxes is: "use the Exchange!"
...
Considering you can get EVERYTHING in this game without physically handing over money... it's just plain ridiculous to be whinging over this stuff.
Aren't the ships on the exchange in the 50 million EC range and up? That's not realistic for many players.
Lockboxes are TRIBBLE, but I've long since accepted them. Kind of like how I accept there are drug dealers out there. It's not a good form of acceptance, but I don't get bent out of shape over it anymore.
The best argument against people whining about lockboxes is: "use the Exchange!"
If you don't like the "gambling" aspect to get a ship, then go to the Exchange and spend EC for it.
The temporal warfare set cannot be gotten from the exchange. THAT is Cryptic's clever ploy: you can still get the ships off the exchange, but not the accessoires that come with it (and without which you really just have half a ship).
If this trend continues, then from here on in, we will see this happen for more and more major ships. And it should bother more people than just me; oddly enough, few really seem to mind.
"OMG Guise the ability to block lox boxes is unlocked using a loxs box, AMIRITE?"......"Nah Brah its gonna cost 400 Lobi.LOLOLOLOL"
Expect a lock box every 3 months or so, its just the way things are. I don't know who is having a hard time getting the prizes from these things. They are all over the exchange. I just got my time ship shuttle for 15 Mil EC and am happy with it. I've seen orb weavers for as low as 35 Mil. And yes you can grind for Keys off the exchange and turn your Dil / stipend in to keys too. So the lobi stuff isn't that hard to get either.
People like to go on about the Lobi Temporal set. But lets look at a few things:
Chroniton Dual Beam Array: A weak AP (lolAP) weapon with a Chroniton proc. You can only have one on a ship and most of the time its going to throw off an efficient weapon setup by quite a bit.
Temporal Disruption Device: A weaker, slower Tric torp with a useless proc.
Tachyokinetic Console: A weaker Assimilated module with a turn rate boost.
Out of all three, only the console is remotely worth it, and even then, most builds would be better off going for something better.
And if you're going for the actual set bonus? The first bonus is the equivalent of a Mk XI Purple Chroniton console (Which doesn't enhance the Temporal torp, making you take another torpedo which cuts into your energy weapon DPS) and the second is a power that, while pretty, is basically just a glorified tractor beam/grav well + evasive maneuvers in a nice 3-5m cooldown.
And the Temporal set gains no bonus for being on any of the Temporal ships.
So, all in all, anyone saying they HAVE to have or NEED the Temporal set for their Temporal ship, or even at all, is full of it.
After having lock boxes in game for nearly a year now I don't notice them as much as I did when they were introduced. I agree they do serve a purpose for funding the game. I just choose not to open them and discard them.
A year ago the droprate of the boxes where insane, you could end up with 10 boxes or more after 1 STF, now they drop sometimes, much better. They only thing i like to see is that they put lok-box keys into the loot table (very rare like prototech drops and bound).
Seriously? Give up on fighting something thats the exact opposite of what Star Trek stands for? Never.
Perfect world doesn't care. You're wasting your energy, and doing essentially nothing to affect their bottom line. Keep beating your head against the neutronium wall if you want I guess, the rest of us have better stuff to do.
♪ I'm going around not in circles but in spirographs.
It's pretty much this hard to keep just one timeline intact. ♪
You're wasting your energy, and doing essentially nothing to affect their bottom line. Keep beating your head against the neutronium wall if you want I guess, the rest of us have better stuff to do.
The temporal warfare set cannot be gotten from the exchange. THAT is Cryptic's clever ploy: you can still get the ships off the exchange, but not the accessoires that come with it (and without which you really just have half a ship).
If this trend continues, then from here on in, we will see this happen for more and more major ships. And it should bother more people than just me; oddly enough, few really seem to mind.
That's only a problem if there are more ships that you want.
If this trend continues, then from here on in, we will see this happen for more and more major ships. And it should bother more people than just me; oddly enough, few really seem to mind.
People don't seem to mind because they perceive they're getting increased value from the lockboxes - 'oh well, I didn't get the ship but at least I've got enough Lobi to get that cool console'
It's the fact that the cool console should be an in-game reward or come with a (fixed-price) C-Store ship that escapes them...
Considering the odds and monitoring the exchange closely every day, I can say that you are completely wrong. The average value of the lockbox is rather around 250-300k EC per key. It would require more serious calculation but it must be very close. Consoles, doff packs and boosters, have a very low market value. Even the purple doff won't pay for your key. Actually, only the ship will, and the odds to get it are insanely low (0.5%).
You're opening the wrong lockboxes. I only do Cardassian ones. The average is MUCH higher, in part because the Very Rare-quality doff packs go for 4 million. The trick is not to open them. The other lockboxes, I either sell, or stockpile to sell later. No price is too low to sell them, but some aren't worth selling until you've got dozens to do at once.
I'm averaging around 2 million right now, and since keys go for around 1.4 million, it's a slow and steady profit, even if I don't sell what I buy with Lobi. Which I probably will.
Former moderator of these forums. Lifetime sub since before launch. Been here since before public betas. Foundry author of "Franklin Drake Must Die".
People don't seem to mind because they perceive they're getting increased value from the lockboxes - 'oh well, I didn't get the ship but at least I've got enough Lobi to get that cool console'
It's the fact that the cool console should be an in-game reward or come with a (fixed-price) C-Store ship that escapes them...
So, out of all this, all I see is people whining because X ship isn't in their price range.
You know, whenever I see something thats out of my price range, I just move on and find something better, or, if I feel some need to have it (or do, in fact, have real need for it. Hint: No one needs any of the lockbox ships. Anyone who says otherwise is spewing lies) I save up to get it.
I don't whine and complain and try to get the price changed.
So, out of all this, all I see is people whining because X ship isn't in their price range.
You know, whenever I see something thats out of my price range, I just move on and find something better, or, if I feel some need to have it (or do, in fact, have real need for it. Hint: No one needs any of the lockbox ships. Anyone who says otherwise is spewing lies) I save up to get it.
I don't whine and complain and try to get the price changed.
Another straw man. No one is "whining because X ship isn't in their price range."
Those going on about "This should be a fixed price C-Store ship" or "In-game reward" or whatever seems to indicate the opposite.
Its either they don't want to spend the real world currency to buy whatever it is they want, or they don't want to spend the in-game currency to buy what they want. Thats what every argument against lockboxes has centered around that wasn't based around something that wasn't ever going to change.
Those going on about "This should be a fixed price C-Store ship" or "In-game reward" or whatever seems to indicate the opposite.
Its either they don't want to spend the real world currency to buy whatever it is they want, or they don't want to spend the in-game currency to buy what they want. Thats what every argument against lockboxes has centered around that wasn't based around something that wasn't ever going to change.
Or it could be, you know, what they actually said: purchasing ships shouldn't come down to chance. In fact, your argument appears really silly because one of those advocating for a change to ship purchases even said they'd pay more than standard C-Store prices; the difference for him/her is that they know they're getting the ship when they spend X-amount of money if they can buy it outright.
Where we can all agree or disagree about lockboxes and their place in this game (or no game for that matter), I think we can all agree that name-calling and personal insults are counter-productive and ultimately damaging to the community.
I'd kindly ask you all baiting each other to knock it off.
Totally agree.
#1 - Some people who will not be named should seriously consider going back and editing their posts. When referring to other forum users, leave off any personal references to beliefs, feelings, behavior, intelligence, character, etc. If you did any of this, you probably know who you are.
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And they don't have to come down to chance. This is why we have the exchange.
Quite honestly, you guys on the other side of the fence really make me want to ask what exactly you want. I point out a guaranteed way of procuring a ship for yourself and you still complain as if boxes are the only way ANYONE can get a ship, which is completely false. And its the same with every lockbox related item.
Everyone complaining just screams that they are only doing so because they aren't getting what they want and getting it NOW for little to no work and/or compensation.
Or it could be, you know, what they actually said: purchasing ships shouldn't come down to chance. In fact, your argument appears really silly because one of those advocating for a change to ship purchases even said they'd pay more than standard C-Store prices; the difference for him/her is that they know they're getting the ship when they spend X-amount of money if they can buy it outright.
So you'd be fine with them showing up for $200, as a fixed price?
You know all you have to do is buy them on the exchange, right?
And they don't have to come down to chance. This is why we have the exchange.
Quite honestly, you guys on the other side of the fence really make me want to ask what exactly you want. I point out a guaranteed way of procuring a ship for yourself and you still complain as if boxes are the only way ANYONE can get a ship, which is completely false. And its the same with every lockbox related item.
Everyone complaining just screams that they are only doing so because they aren't getting what they want and getting it NOW for little to no work and/or compensation.
That's just another straw man.
It's been perfectly laid out that people have a problem with lockboxes for one or more of several reasons. For my own part, I find the whole practice morally reprehensible because it relies on manipulating people's emotions and sense of control. Whether or not you think that's the responsibility of business is irrelevant; it doesn't matter whose responsibility it is if the action itself is still maligned.
For example, I used the matter of in-game exploits: Cryptic would and does suspend and/or ban users, as well as patch away actions they consider to be exploits. An exploit is really just players finding ways around Cryptic systems (intentional or not). Yet Cryptic and PWE themselves are exploiting individual players' self control with practices like winner announcements and tying unique, widely-wanted items largely to chance.
I just see anti-lockbox threads as the players trying to 'patch' away the exploit.
You say the exchange circumvents the whole process, but that's really not true either. It takes players opening boxes to populate the exchange with those ships and items.
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What he said.
I do not spend money unless I know exactly what I'm getting for that money.
This too.
That's why I think the IP of Star Trek is being put into a bad place by this company and want CBS to revoke their ip contract with them.
Maybe people who complain about lock boxes dont know this. If they do know this, then they are really just complaining about the price. It would take about $60 dollars worth of lock box keys to get the temporal science ship. The Tholain Orb Weaver is about 32 dollars worth keys. The Jem Hadar ship is about $350 worth of keys. These are all pretty high prices, but it is for a rare ship. It is good for a game to have rare things that you aspire to get.
If you dont like the price of that, you can get a Fleet ship, most of which are equal to or better than the lock box ships, for $20. You can get it even cheaper if you use dilithium for zen or buy fleet ship modules on the exchange for ec. I got my fleet ship for free. If you dont want to do that, the rear admiral ships are fine for pve. I used my rear admiral ship in pvp a bit, and it went OK.
No one is forcing anyone to buy lock box keys. I havent opened any lock boxes because I dont think it is worth it. I am happy that other people are because it helps finance the game. I have bought zen for other stuff that I thought was worth it.
Lock boxes are actually a great way for Cryptic to finance a free to play game without negatively affecting game play. If Cryptic eliminated the lock boxes and put these ships on the C-Store for $30, $60, and $350, etc., it would be much worse for the game. If Cryptic made all of these ships C-Store only, it would be worse for the game. Some people would simply never be able to get these ships if they did that. As it is now, players can actually get all of these ships for free through game play, which is a great thing.
This is the best argument against lock boxes. If someone wants a ship, they should be able to pay money for it. Make it more money than a few lockboxes, sure, but there shouldn't be even the chance of someone saying "I want that ship" and not being able to get it because of random numbers.
Aren't the ships on the exchange in the 50 million EC range and up? That's not realistic for many players.
This ^^^^
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The temporal warfare set cannot be gotten from the exchange. THAT is Cryptic's clever ploy: you can still get the ships off the exchange, but not the accessoires that come with it (and without which you really just have half a ship).
If this trend continues, then from here on in, we will see this happen for more and more major ships. And it should bother more people than just me; oddly enough, few really seem to mind.
"OMG Guise the ability to block lox boxes is unlocked using a loxs box, AMIRITE?"......"Nah Brah its gonna cost 400 Lobi.LOLOLOLOL"
Expect a lock box every 3 months or so, its just the way things are. I don't know who is having a hard time getting the prizes from these things. They are all over the exchange. I just got my time ship shuttle for 15 Mil EC and am happy with it. I've seen orb weavers for as low as 35 Mil. And yes you can grind for Keys off the exchange and turn your Dil / stipend in to keys too. So the lobi stuff isn't that hard to get either.
Chroniton Dual Beam Array: A weak AP (lolAP) weapon with a Chroniton proc. You can only have one on a ship and most of the time its going to throw off an efficient weapon setup by quite a bit.
Temporal Disruption Device: A weaker, slower Tric torp with a useless proc.
Tachyokinetic Console: A weaker Assimilated module with a turn rate boost.
Out of all three, only the console is remotely worth it, and even then, most builds would be better off going for something better.
And if you're going for the actual set bonus? The first bonus is the equivalent of a Mk XI Purple Chroniton console (Which doesn't enhance the Temporal torp, making you take another torpedo which cuts into your energy weapon DPS) and the second is a power that, while pretty, is basically just a glorified tractor beam/grav well + evasive maneuvers in a nice 3-5m cooldown.
And the Temporal set gains no bonus for being on any of the Temporal ships.
So, all in all, anyone saying they HAVE to have or NEED the Temporal set for their Temporal ship, or even at all, is full of it.
A year ago the droprate of the boxes where insane, you could end up with 10 boxes or more after 1 STF, now they drop sometimes, much better. They only thing i like to see is that they put lok-box keys into the loot table (very rare like prototech drops and bound).
Perfect world doesn't care. You're wasting your energy, and doing essentially nothing to affect their bottom line. Keep beating your head against the neutronium wall if you want I guess, the rest of us have better stuff to do.
It's pretty much this hard to keep just one timeline intact. ♪
same could be said about you post
system Lord Baal is dead
That's only a problem if there are more ships that you want.
People don't seem to mind because they perceive they're getting increased value from the lockboxes - 'oh well, I didn't get the ship but at least I've got enough Lobi to get that cool console'
It's the fact that the cool console should be an in-game reward or come with a (fixed-price) C-Store ship that escapes them...
You're opening the wrong lockboxes. I only do Cardassian ones. The average is MUCH higher, in part because the Very Rare-quality doff packs go for 4 million. The trick is not to open them. The other lockboxes, I either sell, or stockpile to sell later. No price is too low to sell them, but some aren't worth selling until you've got dozens to do at once.
I'm averaging around 2 million right now, and since keys go for around 1.4 million, it's a slow and steady profit, even if I don't sell what I buy with Lobi. Which I probably will.
soooooo this 100% agree
system Lord Baal is dead
You know, whenever I see something thats out of my price range, I just move on and find something better, or, if I feel some need to have it (or do, in fact, have real need for it. Hint: No one needs any of the lockbox ships. Anyone who says otherwise is spewing lies) I save up to get it.
I don't whine and complain and try to get the price changed.
Another straw man. No one is "whining because X ship isn't in their price range."
Its either they don't want to spend the real world currency to buy whatever it is they want, or they don't want to spend the in-game currency to buy what they want. Thats what every argument against lockboxes has centered around that wasn't based around something that wasn't ever going to change.
Or it could be, you know, what they actually said: purchasing ships shouldn't come down to chance. In fact, your argument appears really silly because one of those advocating for a change to ship purchases even said they'd pay more than standard C-Store prices; the difference for him/her is that they know they're getting the ship when they spend X-amount of money if they can buy it outright.
Totally agree.
#1 - Some people who will not be named should seriously consider going back and editing their posts. When referring to other forum users, leave off any personal references to beliefs, feelings, behavior, intelligence, character, etc. If you did any of this, you probably know who you are.
#2 - Please show some respect for other people's opinions, even if you don't agree with them.
#3 - "Forum PvP" is not entertainment. Any post that's been crafted to provoke an angry reaction is trolling and is subject to moderation, warnings, and infractions.
#4 - Please do not call other people trolls. This is in itself trolling. If you have a problem with something that's been posted, report it.
#5 - Stick with the facts -- Please don't speculate about other people's motivations.
#6 - Please do not make further moderation necessary. Read the Forum Rules.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
Quite honestly, you guys on the other side of the fence really make me want to ask what exactly you want. I point out a guaranteed way of procuring a ship for yourself and you still complain as if boxes are the only way ANYONE can get a ship, which is completely false. And its the same with every lockbox related item.
Everyone complaining just screams that they are only doing so because they aren't getting what they want and getting it NOW for little to no work and/or compensation.
So you'd be fine with them showing up for $200, as a fixed price?
You know all you have to do is buy them on the exchange, right?
You have to pay for both before you may open them.
The big difference is that with MLP blind bags, there's a code printed on the back that tells you which pony it is.
---
If you want a lockbox ship, but don't want to pay money for it, do what I did. Play the game for EC.
That's how I got my Wells in a few days, right on time before my birthday.
That's just another straw man.
It's been perfectly laid out that people have a problem with lockboxes for one or more of several reasons. For my own part, I find the whole practice morally reprehensible because it relies on manipulating people's emotions and sense of control. Whether or not you think that's the responsibility of business is irrelevant; it doesn't matter whose responsibility it is if the action itself is still maligned.
For example, I used the matter of in-game exploits: Cryptic would and does suspend and/or ban users, as well as patch away actions they consider to be exploits. An exploit is really just players finding ways around Cryptic systems (intentional or not). Yet Cryptic and PWE themselves are exploiting individual players' self control with practices like winner announcements and tying unique, widely-wanted items largely to chance.
I just see anti-lockbox threads as the players trying to 'patch' away the exploit.
You say the exchange circumvents the whole process, but that's really not true either. It takes players opening boxes to populate the exchange with those ships and items.