I suggest working on that attitude. Instead of feeling like people owe you to be pro, next time try to help said player out if he does actually cry for help. Dont know what you try to prove with this thread, but i all see is what is wrong with a lot of people in this game.
So... you left because "OMG a low level player who hasn't gotten any accolades is in here"? Sorry to say it but... you deserve that penalty. It's designed to discourage behavior like yours (though it doesn't seem to really be doing its job).
Moral of the story: Stick it out in team fights if you want to keep playing them after the "failed" one ends.
By the way, "No Win Scenario" is only open to level 50 players. A level 30-39 captain can't even get into the queue, so I'm not really sure what you're on about anyway.
Ya know, I consider myself pro very much. But when I join the public que, I am fully prepared for the worst and if I get the worst I deal with the worst. As far as I am concerned the leaver penalty won't be enough until it punishes you with a 24 hour ban from all ques. And if you don't like it because you're fond of quitting on people to "spare myself of the agony because my time is oh so more important to not be wasted" rather than eying the end rewards by whatever means it takes to get them, well, tough. I bet you become a non quitter really damn quick with a 24 hour ban. The only downfall of such a massive penalty is once in a blue moon a person will TRIBBLE themselves over by accident or a person absolutely has no choice but to leave because of RL hitting them, or whatever but I think it's worth the tiny heartache that fair players endure to put a stop to people who the first thing they do upon entering a que'd event is not prepare for battle but to click on their group to see how many bloody accos they have. Seems people always find that one thing in a MMO that displays how veteran you are within the game and use it as a discrimination tool against newbie players.
Perhaps the system can be worked in such a way that it isn't a 24 hour ban from the word go, but the more you leave the heavier the penalty, and it never resets. At least this way legitimate players don't have to suffer. If you are pro who is skipping on pro made groups in favor of PUGs and you leave, you deserve the punishment you get. So yeah, 24 hour ban is entirely in the realm of acceptable. 30 minutes is a joke. It's a slap on the wrist.
As for AFKers, I'm not sure how to deal with the inevitable strategy of just AFKing to avoid a 24 hour ban but I do have a few ideas that will surely work. It's incidental punishment to legit players that makes them not so surefire. The most obvious is a kick option but it can be severely abused even in a player vote setting.
So yeah. If players are hellbent on not playing by leaving a group then Cryptic needs to cater to their desires of not playing by hitting them with 24 hour bans from que events. I'm not even sure why the OP is upset. Cryptic has done them a great service by helping them not playing the game. With 24 hours they have an entire 24 hours of not playing with newbies. That's amazing compared to 30 minutes you'd think people like the OP would pay Cryptic for the chance to be spared of newbs for an entire 24 hours. Anyways.
I think this wouldn't be a problem if the ques grouped people of appropriate level together in their own respective instances. They do this with old Fleet actions and mirror events, why not do it with the new Fleet Events.
Fact is being grouped with lowbies significantly increases the chance that the missions will fail or give few to little fleet marks to be worth your time. If I can't just leave anymore with out penalty I'll just log off and play another character for 30 min then until cryptic decides to fix the ques and stop grouping us with lowbies. I'm leveling another character and wouldn't even think of joining a fleet event until level 50.
Fact is being grouped with lowbies significantly increases the chance that the missions will fail or give few to little fleet marks to be worth your time.
I'm not sure where you got this "fact". I've run several Federation Fleet Alerts with "lowbies" that were not only successful, but gave the same number of marks as one filled with only vice admirals. In fact, the ones I've seen fail most often are full VA teams! Rank and accolade points aren't the only indicators of a strong player.
I'm more concerned about the ship than the rank. Given a choice of a team with 4 Captains in Escorts, or 4 VA's in Cruisers, I'll go with the Escort group. ( and I DO know there are some VERY effective Cruisers out there, just that odds are THEY won't be in that group of 4 )
The Fleet missions ARE a DPS race.
I'm more concerned about the ship than the rank. Given a choice of a team with 4 Captains in Escorts, or 4 VA's in Cruisers, I'll go with the Escort group. ( and I DO know there are some VERY effective Cruisers out there, just that odds are THEY won't be in that group of 4 )
The Fleet missions ARE a DPS race.
Escorts are definitely better for most of the fleet events, mostly due to DPS and quick turning. Only problem is even very well-built escorts die pretty easily if a mob manages to get ahold of them (solution: heal the escorts often as possible... but it's best if each escort also has their own shield and hull buffs).
I've seen some cruisers do well in the events, but the worst Federation Fleet Alert failure I've been in was my escort and four cruisers. We tried, but we sure didn't last long (no one's fault, really, just not the ideal group to have).
Maybe I'm missing something here but I thought most if not all MMOs have some sort of penalty for those who up and leave during a large group battle scenario. I know WoW does or at least did when I played and as far as the STO one goes, it's not a big deal by any stretch unless a player's one of those types who takes the game far too serious to where the assorted stereotypes we've heard of becomes a reality.
If not doing something group for 30 min is a hassle, then just take a few to get up and stretch the legs or get a snack or have a cig if you smoke. A little break won't kill anyone and you come back to the game mentally refreshed.
The fleet advancement system and missions were sold to players on the idea that it was all about end game content. Why a character fresh of the academy boat can participate is beyond me.
Do lowbies not have enough content as it is to play? The auto-bolster feature is a lazy attempt to include them. Simply buffing hit points of a ship to rank 50 while leaving them with one or two bridge officer powers in an under equipped ship is inadequate at best.
Seems like there is ALWAYS a (or 2) Lt or Lt.Com in the group for Fleet Alert. This 99% of the time means we will FAIL. So do I bail and take 30min penalty or play for 15-20 minutes and earn nothing? Great choices Cryptic!
Even if you bump a Lt in a Miranda to be comparable to a VA in every way for ship HP, shields & weapon damage, he's STILL missing weapons, boff powers and skill points in various powers! The lower ranked characters need to be grouped together if possible. Don't saddle 3-4 VAs with having to work extra hard because they got a useless 1-2 LTs/LCs.
If you keep grouping levels 1 through 50 together, then make the events the level of the lowest player. I'll hand hold some LTs if it means a cake-walk for me.
Cause having 55 seconds left to kill a full HPed Siege Ship with a Miranda and little ol' Enterprise-A class cruiser in your 5-man group is an exercise in futility.
Sometimes I think I play STO just to have something to complain about on the forums.
Upon entering earlier, I attempted the No-Win scenario (Which is a VA50 Mission) and upon rez had a Captain with ZERO accolade points sitting next to me. Knowing full well he is a one hit wonder who will immediately explode cryning HELP and HILFE, leaving the rest of the team to have to carry him and spend costly consumables, as always, I left before it even started.
Well call me a troll or a n00b but most of my toons have very few accolades and as a rule I get to the fifth wave when I PUG No Win. So when people like me show up in your instance you should be able to zone out without repercussion or consequence?
Zoning leaves people in as much of a lurch as AFK heroes.
Edited to add: That was after Gozer added the bio-neutral warheads and before the Devs when and made No Win a little easier again.
Also when I PUG the 15 person starbase defense my group almost always finishes defending the freighters first, and when my team is busy congratulating themselves I am the first to dash off and help the other teams defend their freighters.
Highest number of freighters saved in Blockade is nineteen.
I even have taken my Commander and Captain alts into FEs without getting chewed out.
Nothing personal man but the last time I ran a parser in a PvE thing I easily did 2-3 times the damage of the next best damage dealer, on a science toon in a science ship.
I'm just saying just because someone is not a accolade hound does not mean they are worse than you. Sometimes they can be better.
BTW it is near, (unless you DOFFed you way there), impossible to get to VA without getting the damage received and dealt accolades.
Damn, and I thought I would like this guy just because his forum name is the same as John Fogerty, (he's the one in plaid).
If you are a pickle in a pickle jar you know every pickle's different, sort of, but really they're all just pickles...
when you fail you should have no timers.. i just failed kase cause someone that was shooting down the probes half way through decided to fly over to the other gate and start hitting that instead..
The fleet advancement system and missions were sold to players on the idea that it was all about end game content. Why a character fresh of the academy boat can participate is beyond me.
Do lowbies not have enough content as it is to play? The auto-bolster feature is a lazy attempt to include them. Simply buffing hit points of a ship to rank 50 while leaving them with one or two bridge officer powers in an under equipped ship is inadequate at best.
Its just lazy design simply put.
Aren't these missions about the only content atm that gives Fleet marks? Esspecially for low levels? Ecluding them would prevent them from participating in the fleet base projects in a meaningful way.
Think about it... if you exclude them early on they will want to rush to endgame and VA level skipping valuable lessons on gameplay until they show up with a toothless rainbowboat which isn'T more effective than a tier 2 ship.
Take the chance to teach them a thing or two at the early stages and you get better VAs out of it. :D
Yeah, sorry but I find myself unable to sympathize. If you leave your team to die before the fight starts just because you don't like the look of your assigned teammates then you shouldn't play at all. Half an hour is not enough of a penalty for that kind of behaviour.
Just imagine Sisko:
"WHAT? They want me to assault the Dominion lines flanked by two MIRANDAS??? TRIBBLE that, I'm going to fly to Risa."
True, but what if you join a Cure Ground and 2 people leave right off the bat. Then you realize one of the people that is still there doesn't even have a remodulator. You have no choice but to leave because there is no way to finish the STF and there is no failing to get out of it. Should you really end up penalized for someone elses stupidity?
I'm pretty sure the remodulator can be replicated on ground maps now.
The universal leaver penalty is an exceptionally bad idea. Especially for end-game players, queued content is the bulk of the content that's available. Locking them out of whatever they abandoned, for once or twice the duration they'd be locked out if they'd completed it, I find tolerable, but the whole across the board thing is unreasonable. Not to mention potentially counterproductive.
The common argument, levied against leavers or people who advocate upping the criteria for participation in some of these queued events is that they knew the forecast was cloudy, with a chance of morons, and that they should just deal with it. Or private queue with some friends who'll pull their own weight.
Of course, that argument turns right around. You know that if you suck, you're going to get left kneedeep in the mess you've made, and you should just deal with it. Or private queue with some friends who don't mind pulling your weight for you.
On the part of the defensive ones, it is really no more reasonable to expect people to be coerced into completing (near) hopeless scenarios with people who don't know what they're doing, don't respond to explanation and all too often don't even share a common language, held hostage by the prospect of being barred from washing away the bad taste your shared experience left them with for an extended period of time, than it is for the credential slash exclusionist crowd to require a bouncer at the door, to go over everything from level to accolades, from gear to bridge officer skill-levels, and your real life prescriptions, before you can get in. Maybe.
The problem is, one of these things is perfectly acceptable, and the other a complete taboo. It's come to bug me to hear time and again that it's okay to say quitter X should be forced through penalties to endure any amount of aggravation the antics of an incompetent, non-communicative teammember can deliver, but not to say that there should be some kind of benchmark for people to get into these instances in the first place. It's a hell of a double standard. Yes, it's hard to do especially for the STFs, maps that rely on tactics, but even so... People's suggestion of banning leavers for a day or longer is just outright ridiculous. And so is branching out into all the other PVE queues.
Admittedly, there's the less invested capable ones, caught in the middle of mommy and daddy's separation, who neither ragequit nor bring down epic failure upon the group. But all they really need not to be a victim of this is a more reliable and efficient way of replacing lost teammembers.
Of course, what those new teammembers will do, when they're called into an STF with just the one or two guys who drove their entire last team away, I can probably guess.
I'm pretty sure the remodulator can be replicated on ground maps now.
correct its in replicator tab
The universal leaver penalty is an exceptionally bad idea. Especially for end-game players, queued content is the bulk of the content that's available. Locking them out of whatever they abandoned, for once or twice the duration they'd be locked out if they'd completed it, I find tolerable, but the whole across the board thing is unreasonable. Not to mention potentially counterproductive
.
leavers should be blocked from EVERYTHING queued for the duration of the block
they deserve it
perhaps they could use the time to run some missions.
The common argument, levied against leavers or people who advocate upping the criteria for participation in some of these queued events is that they knew the forecast was cloudy, with a chance of morons, and that they should just deal with it. Or private queue with some friends who'll pull their own weight.
leavers ARE the morons in most cases
Of course, that argument turns right around. You know that if you suck, you're going to get left kneedeep in the mess you've made, and you should just deal with it. Or private queue with some friends who don't mind pulling your weight for you.
most of the lowbies can find friends easily enough its the leavers who don't have any mostly
On the part of the defensive ones, it is really no more reasonable to expect people to be coerced into completing (near) hopeless scenarios with people who don't know what they're doing, don't respond to explanation and all too often don't even share a common language, held hostage by the prospect of being barred from washing away the bad taste your shared experience left them with for an extended period of time, than it is for the credential slash exclusionist crowd to require a bouncer at the door, to go over everything from level to accolades, from gear to bridge officer skill-levels, and your real life prescriptions, before you can get in. Maybe.
fine so ALL Stfs gated to block Defiants
ALL fleet missions gated to block people who have quit on a team
and ALL content gated to block anyone who doesn't speak english??
The problem is, one of these things is perfectly acceptable, and the other a complete taboo. It's come to bug me to hear time and again that it's okay to say quitter X should be forced through penalties to endure any amount of aggravation the antics of an incompetent, non-communicative teammember can deliver, but not to say that there should be some kind of benchmark for people to get into these instances in the first place.
not being a coward??
Not being an elitist??
Not being a complete JERK ??
It's a hell of a double standard. Yes, it's hard to do especially for the STFs, maps that rely on tactics, but even so... People's suggestion of banning leavers for a day or longer is just outright ridiculous. And so is branching out into all the other PVE queues.
well we can't fine them half their accolade points or auto kick them from their fleets
(which they might fear more)
so yes bans of a day or more will teach them not to be gutless
Of course, what those new teammembers will do, when they're called into an STF with just the one or two guys who drove their entire last team away, I can probably guess.
maybe its time to DITCH STF's entirely for these leavers
Luckily I have enough toons at VA so I can rotate out whenever some useless lowbie joins a fleet event. Not helping any of those leechers getting fleet marks. Same thing goes for VAs bringing their Connies to STFs.
As far as the leaver penalty is concerned it only affects one character. If you are worried you can switch characterss and play again.
This is a lifesaver. I am a proud elitist in the sense that I believe that if you are not capable of pulling your own weight in team missions, you should rethink your strategy and stay the heck outta those missions until you can! If you're learning, that's fine, then pay attention to what the veterans say and ask for help if you don't know what you are doing. In actuality, I do try to be a team player, offer advice, communicate, and stay in most games to the finish. Most games...
I've learned, for instance, that if I am doing a game of Khitomer Accord Space Elite (STF), if it takes more than about 3 minutes for the team to kill the tactical cube at the beginning then I might as well leave. Now, I haven't actually done that, but I have yet to have an at all reasonable game when the team's damage output is below a certain threshhold. I can understand now why some players might enter a game, size up the team, and leave to spare everyone the aggravation they'd all have otherwise.
Also, there are many ways of not being a team player. I used to despise quitters, but after enough ELITE stf's in which people had no clue what was going on and ignored all instructions, pleas, and screams from other players... what I wish is that there were a mechanism for punishing people for being bad teammates in other ways than just quitting early. A player can enter a game, sit AFK for the whole mission, and collect the reward with no penalty (I see this every now and then in fleet missions); but, if a player enters a game full of clueless players and leaves...they get punished. Keep that in mind. I know my real beef is with bad elite STF's...in those cases, players could play on normal until they are up to par, like I did...but even in fleet missions there are unexcusable things players do. Blockade, for instance...I'm sure we've all had games where everyone bunches up to defend the same transport despite repeated reminders over team chat that doing so will result in the loss of half of the transports. Look, everyone is a newbie at some point. Some people choose to remain noobs.
Again, though, that's why having multiple VA alts is a lifesaver. You can simply switch characters to dodge the penalty. Alternatively, in certain cases, such as a truly awful round of Cure Space Elite, you can log out for a couple minutes, wait for the game to end (as in, wait for the noobs to lose), and then log back in and continue with no penalty. Poor sportsmanship? perhaps. I try not to get in the habit of doing this because it feels, well, very anti-Trek to me in most cases. When other players are just willfully stupid and ignore all advice from you or even multiple vets, though, I reserve the right to put on a bit of Commander Shran's attitude and revel in my superiority.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Former/Cryptic Name: Captain_Hans_Langsdorff
Founding member, Special Service Squadron
"Fear God and Dread Nought." First Sea Lord, Adm. Jacky Fisher
True, but what if you join a Cure Ground and 2 people leave right off the bat. Then you realize one of the people that is still there doesn't even have a remodulator. You have no choice but to leave because there is no way to finish the STF and there is no failing to get out of it. Should you really end up penalized for someone elses stupidity?
Its happened to me 3 times this week.
First of all remodulators can, as far as I know, now be replicated on the ground. That leaves the problem that two people have left. Don't you think that THEY should be penalized? That's what the OP did. What the game is missing is the ability for left-over teams to finish the mission without penalty through a majority vote.
FKA K-Tar, grumpy Klingon/El-Aurian hybrid. Now assimilated by PWE.
Sometimes, if you want to bury the hatchet with a Klingon, it has to be in his skull. - Captain K'Tar of the USS Danu about J'mpok.
Ok so it does appear the ALOT feel the same way I do about after earning your ability to carry a mission through, and having to go above and beyond that using expensive consumables to carry leechers.
Some of you have this mis-interpretation that I am being an ELITIST. I am not. I am simply stating being QUALIFIED. You do not send a ricky recruit booter into a war zone. They have to LEARN first.
I don't understand where people can get off thinking, you can place a LT. into an ELITE type mission and expect success.
Now for the few that hammered me about not completing the mission. Here is some news for you:
Infected Ground (Normal) I have done over 450 times. How many EVER won (And that means playing to the end), NONE. Yes people that is correct. I spent many many, many, many hours doing this mission over and over and over, with lowbie noobs etc. even a few VA's thrown in like myself on occasion, and ALL FAILED, because of the dying noobsters.
Do I want to endure this pain and suffering again spending hundreds of thousands of EC trying to carry and teach them only to never see them again? Hell freaking No. It is BECAUSE of that mission, I have become ANTI NOOB and will never change back.
KA and CURE? Luckily I made it through those. I have done untold amounts of COLONY and Incursions and Fleet Alerts, and well, after seeing all my consumables go poof and have to keep making or buying more, I decided it was not worth it.
So re-think your position when you start calling me for being banned for 24 hours and permanently for not wanting to endure ANOTHER failed mission again and again and again.
Too Bad, So Sad
PS: Sollvax, no need to add your worthless wooden nickel comments.
Infected Ground (Normal) I have done over 450 times. How many EVER won (And that means playing to the end), NONE. Yes people that is correct. I spent many many, many, many hours doing this mission over and over and over, with lowbie noobs etc. even a few VA's thrown in like myself on occasion, and ALL FAILED, because of the dying noobsters.
I've just recently joined a fleet that's capable of sending out a complete STF team and were I'n the training stage , it's nice training the same people some lessons are learned and applied and the success rate climbs , However I have played perhaps 450 stfs, infected ground is my favorite and I have a complete Maco elite set and 5 of my Boffs have complete Maco or omega sets and I have a stack of common and rare Borg techs that I haven't cashed into Tech yet.
All of this I got with the random groups, some were a help some I had to carry and solo the boss myself. If you see me online I will group with you and we will do this STF , it's not that big of a deal , I don't know what your doing wrong but whatever it is we will fix it.
Either one of my characters can do this STF with ease, I never care about the optional because the prize you get from the boss not the optional and I've got that prize many times.the only complaint I really have is not being able to communicate with someone speaking a differnt language, that's hard.
Jellico....Engineer ground.....Da'val Romulan space Sci
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Luckily I have enough toons at VA so I can rotate out whenever some useless lowbie joins a fleet event. Not helping any of those leechers getting fleet marks. Same thing goes for VAs bringing their Connies to STFs.
Low level players trying to earn fleet marks are not leechers. They're just trying to contribute to their fleet's projects just like you.
Some of you have this mis-interpretation that I am being an ELITIST. I am not. I am simply stating being QUALIFIED. You do not send a ricky recruit booter into a war zone. They have to LEARN first.
I don't understand where people can get off thinking, you can place a LT. into an ELITE type mission and expect success.
Fleet events are not "elite type missions", and to get to No Win (the event you're complaining about) you have to be a Vice Admiral. That's the only requirement. And how the hell are "lowbies" supposed to learn how to run a fleet event if they don't play them? (Answer: they can't.)
You want to exclude "lowbies" because "they aren't experienced enough". You're claiming that you're more qualified for whatever reason. Guess what? That's elitism.
Not happy with new patch that if you leave an STF early your temporarily banned from ALL team type issions like PVP and PVE's for 30 mins.
I remember how we had the penalty for the borg missions, but this new penalty for fleet actions is WRONG.
Why? Because we are all fleets trying to build our starbases. Sometimes, not everyone you know who can handle these missions properly with you is online, so you must PUG it.
Upon entering earlier, I attempted the No-Win scenario (Which is a VA50 Mission) and upon rez had a Captain with ZERO accolade points sitting next to me. Knowing full well he is a one hit wonder who will immediately explode cryning HELP and HILFE, leaving the rest of the team to have to carry him and spend costly consumables, as always, I left before it even started.
Wham, hit with penalty.
As a paying customer since the beta days, I am REALLY angered by this.
Everyone keeps saying it is all based on Rank, well these noobs make VA in a matter of a week not even doing Storyline missions which give them the skills and 2% gains from damage and kill accolades. As I proposed in an earlier post, that I won't even attempt it anymore (After seeing so many fail miserably GARUNTEED) based on them being noobsters, if they have less than 6,000 accoldae points. They have the skills, the 2% accolades to handle more than one hit, and most likely the gear.
Of course VA's can drop it too, but the point is, they should not allow players with absolutely no experience in the game to wreck it for 4 other people who are working hard and spending alot of EC on consumables to complete these missions.
So at this point, I have definitely devised a new strategy (ancient chinese secret) and will NOT carry noobs through these missions. Secondly, I am NOW seriously considering to downgrade to Free as that appears to be all Craptic seems to cater to and is crapping on us veterans, who have EARNED their ranks and have the skills to be a team asset not a serious liability. :mad:
I remember when as a noob I couldn't even venture into certain sectors until achieving certain levels of accolades or skills and ranks, but it sure appears that these "i'm too lazy to work for it" types, can do more than I can.
Thanks alot. :mad:
P.S. I do expect the onslaught of trolls and noobs to blast me for this, about how they should have everything catered to them, so save your breath on that.
Accolades.
Seriously. Accolades?
What kind of demon keeled over and spilled his horrid essense over basic logic to make you think that accolades are in any way a proper method of appraising ones skill?
and the discussion is about players what leave mission for whatever reason and make the mission for the smaller group harder?
and if dis discussion is about that i vote for 5 hours penality for anyone who join a mission and then leave its 100% not importend why if he leave he have to pay for that.;)
The only real solution to this that I see to allow lower level players the opportunity to earn fleet marks and avoid the problems the level scaling system has is to do one of the following:
Set up bracketed fleet events for each rank
Set up two brackets
Elite Fleet Events - just rename the ones we have as it and make them all 40-45+
Fleet Events - make these for Lt. - Captain balanced at the Lt. Commander/Commander level
The devs say most people are at level cap but I do see alot of lower level players in these. I was in a Starbase Defense the other night where it was first off four of us, me as a VA, two Lt. Commanders, and a Commander. We earned a whopping two fleet marks.
On both sides of the coin, this is not fair to people at level cap, nor is it fair to people a lower levels. It boils down to that somewhere along the lines someone made the decision to push everyone into one mission using the level scaling system. That decision may have been time and cost effective, but it is not fair to the playerbase. Just look at the issues it is causing.
Comments
Moral of the story: Stick it out in team fights if you want to keep playing them after the "failed" one ends.
By the way, "No Win Scenario" is only open to level 50 players. A level 30-39 captain can't even get into the queue, so I'm not really sure what you're on about anyway.
Perhaps the system can be worked in such a way that it isn't a 24 hour ban from the word go, but the more you leave the heavier the penalty, and it never resets. At least this way legitimate players don't have to suffer. If you are pro who is skipping on pro made groups in favor of PUGs and you leave, you deserve the punishment you get. So yeah, 24 hour ban is entirely in the realm of acceptable. 30 minutes is a joke. It's a slap on the wrist.
As for AFKers, I'm not sure how to deal with the inevitable strategy of just AFKing to avoid a 24 hour ban but I do have a few ideas that will surely work. It's incidental punishment to legit players that makes them not so surefire. The most obvious is a kick option but it can be severely abused even in a player vote setting.
So yeah. If players are hellbent on not playing by leaving a group then Cryptic needs to cater to their desires of not playing by hitting them with 24 hour bans from que events. I'm not even sure why the OP is upset. Cryptic has done them a great service by helping them not playing the game. With 24 hours they have an entire 24 hours of not playing with newbies. That's amazing compared to 30 minutes you'd think people like the OP would pay Cryptic for the chance to be spared of newbs for an entire 24 hours. Anyways.
Fact is being grouped with lowbies significantly increases the chance that the missions will fail or give few to little fleet marks to be worth your time. If I can't just leave anymore with out penalty I'll just log off and play another character for 30 min then until cryptic decides to fix the ques and stop grouping us with lowbies. I'm leveling another character and wouldn't even think of joining a fleet event until level 50.
I'm not sure where you got this "fact". I've run several Federation Fleet Alerts with "lowbies" that were not only successful, but gave the same number of marks as one filled with only vice admirals. In fact, the ones I've seen fail most often are full VA teams! Rank and accolade points aren't the only indicators of a strong player.
The Fleet missions ARE a DPS race.
Escorts are definitely better for most of the fleet events, mostly due to DPS and quick turning. Only problem is even very well-built escorts die pretty easily if a mob manages to get ahold of them (solution: heal the escorts often as possible... but it's best if each escort also has their own shield and hull buffs).
I've seen some cruisers do well in the events, but the worst Federation Fleet Alert failure I've been in was my escort and four cruisers. We tried, but we sure didn't last long (no one's fault, really, just not the ideal group to have).
If not doing something group for 30 min is a hassle, then just take a few to get up and stretch the legs or get a snack or have a cig if you smoke. A little break won't kill anyone and you come back to the game mentally refreshed.
Do lowbies not have enough content as it is to play? The auto-bolster feature is a lazy attempt to include them. Simply buffing hit points of a ship to rank 50 while leaving them with one or two bridge officer powers in an under equipped ship is inadequate at best.
Its just lazy design simply put.
Even if you bump a Lt in a Miranda to be comparable to a VA in every way for ship HP, shields & weapon damage, he's STILL missing weapons, boff powers and skill points in various powers! The lower ranked characters need to be grouped together if possible. Don't saddle 3-4 VAs with having to work extra hard because they got a useless 1-2 LTs/LCs.
If you keep grouping levels 1 through 50 together, then make the events the level of the lowest player. I'll hand hold some LTs if it means a cake-walk for me.
Cause having 55 seconds left to kill a full HPed Siege Ship with a Miranda and little ol' Enterprise-A class cruiser in your 5-man group is an exercise in futility.
Well call me a troll or a n00b but most of my toons have very few accolades and as a rule I get to the fifth wave when I PUG No Win. So when people like me show up in your instance you should be able to zone out without repercussion or consequence?
Zoning leaves people in as much of a lurch as AFK heroes.
Edited to add: That was after Gozer added the bio-neutral warheads and before the Devs when and made No Win a little easier again.
Also when I PUG the 15 person starbase defense my group almost always finishes defending the freighters first, and when my team is busy congratulating themselves I am the first to dash off and help the other teams defend their freighters.
Highest number of freighters saved in Blockade is nineteen.
I even have taken my Commander and Captain alts into FEs without getting chewed out.
Nothing personal man but the last time I ran a parser in a PvE thing I easily did 2-3 times the damage of the next best damage dealer, on a science toon in a science ship.
I'm just saying just because someone is not a accolade hound does not mean they are worse than you. Sometimes they can be better.
BTW it is near, (unless you DOFFed you way there), impossible to get to VA without getting the damage received and dealt accolades.
Damn, and I thought I would like this guy just because his forum name is the same as John Fogerty, (he's the one in plaid).
Aren't these missions about the only content atm that gives Fleet marks? Esspecially for low levels? Ecluding them would prevent them from participating in the fleet base projects in a meaningful way.
Think about it... if you exclude them early on they will want to rush to endgame and VA level skipping valuable lessons on gameplay until they show up with a toothless rainbowboat which isn'T more effective than a tier 2 ship.
Take the chance to teach them a thing or two at the early stages and you get better VAs out of it.
fine how about this
EVERY time you leave a mission before it Finishes you lose 50% of your accolade points
UNLESS you return before the end and the others "vote you back in"
True, but what if you join a Cure Ground and 2 people leave right off the bat. Then you realize one of the people that is still there doesn't even have a remodulator. You have no choice but to leave because there is no way to finish the STF and there is no failing to get out of it. Should you really end up penalized for someone elses stupidity?
Its happened to me 3 times this week.
The universal leaver penalty is an exceptionally bad idea. Especially for end-game players, queued content is the bulk of the content that's available. Locking them out of whatever they abandoned, for once or twice the duration they'd be locked out if they'd completed it, I find tolerable, but the whole across the board thing is unreasonable. Not to mention potentially counterproductive.
The common argument, levied against leavers or people who advocate upping the criteria for participation in some of these queued events is that they knew the forecast was cloudy, with a chance of morons, and that they should just deal with it. Or private queue with some friends who'll pull their own weight.
Of course, that argument turns right around. You know that if you suck, you're going to get left kneedeep in the mess you've made, and you should just deal with it. Or private queue with some friends who don't mind pulling your weight for you.
On the part of the defensive ones, it is really no more reasonable to expect people to be coerced into completing (near) hopeless scenarios with people who don't know what they're doing, don't respond to explanation and all too often don't even share a common language, held hostage by the prospect of being barred from washing away the bad taste your shared experience left them with for an extended period of time, than it is for the credential slash exclusionist crowd to require a bouncer at the door, to go over everything from level to accolades, from gear to bridge officer skill-levels, and your real life prescriptions, before you can get in. Maybe.
The problem is, one of these things is perfectly acceptable, and the other a complete taboo. It's come to bug me to hear time and again that it's okay to say quitter X should be forced through penalties to endure any amount of aggravation the antics of an incompetent, non-communicative teammember can deliver, but not to say that there should be some kind of benchmark for people to get into these instances in the first place. It's a hell of a double standard. Yes, it's hard to do especially for the STFs, maps that rely on tactics, but even so... People's suggestion of banning leavers for a day or longer is just outright ridiculous. And so is branching out into all the other PVE queues.
Admittedly, there's the less invested capable ones, caught in the middle of mommy and daddy's separation, who neither ragequit nor bring down epic failure upon the group. But all they really need not to be a victim of this is a more reliable and efficient way of replacing lost teammembers.
Of course, what those new teammembers will do, when they're called into an STF with just the one or two guys who drove their entire last team away, I can probably guess.
correct its in replicator tab
.
leavers should be blocked from EVERYTHING queued for the duration of the block
they deserve it
perhaps they could use the time to run some missions.
leavers ARE the morons in most cases
most of the lowbies can find friends easily enough its the leavers who don't have any mostly
fine so ALL Stfs gated to block Defiants
ALL fleet missions gated to block people who have quit on a team
and ALL content gated to block anyone who doesn't speak english??
not being a coward??
Not being an elitist??
Not being a complete JERK ??
well we can't fine them half their accolade points or auto kick them from their fleets
(which they might fear more)
so yes bans of a day or more will teach them not to be gutless
maybe its time to DITCH STF's entirely for these leavers
This is a lifesaver. I am a proud elitist in the sense that I believe that if you are not capable of pulling your own weight in team missions, you should rethink your strategy and stay the heck outta those missions until you can! If you're learning, that's fine, then pay attention to what the veterans say and ask for help if you don't know what you are doing. In actuality, I do try to be a team player, offer advice, communicate, and stay in most games to the finish. Most games...
I've learned, for instance, that if I am doing a game of Khitomer Accord Space Elite (STF), if it takes more than about 3 minutes for the team to kill the tactical cube at the beginning then I might as well leave. Now, I haven't actually done that, but I have yet to have an at all reasonable game when the team's damage output is below a certain threshhold. I can understand now why some players might enter a game, size up the team, and leave to spare everyone the aggravation they'd all have otherwise.
Also, there are many ways of not being a team player. I used to despise quitters, but after enough ELITE stf's in which people had no clue what was going on and ignored all instructions, pleas, and screams from other players... what I wish is that there were a mechanism for punishing people for being bad teammates in other ways than just quitting early. A player can enter a game, sit AFK for the whole mission, and collect the reward with no penalty (I see this every now and then in fleet missions); but, if a player enters a game full of clueless players and leaves...they get punished. Keep that in mind. I know my real beef is with bad elite STF's...in those cases, players could play on normal until they are up to par, like I did...but even in fleet missions there are unexcusable things players do. Blockade, for instance...I'm sure we've all had games where everyone bunches up to defend the same transport despite repeated reminders over team chat that doing so will result in the loss of half of the transports. Look, everyone is a newbie at some point. Some people choose to remain noobs.
Again, though, that's why having multiple VA alts is a lifesaver. You can simply switch characters to dodge the penalty. Alternatively, in certain cases, such as a truly awful round of Cure Space Elite, you can log out for a couple minutes, wait for the game to end (as in, wait for the noobs to lose), and then log back in and continue with no penalty. Poor sportsmanship? perhaps. I try not to get in the habit of doing this because it feels, well, very anti-Trek to me in most cases. When other players are just willfully stupid and ignore all advice from you or even multiple vets, though, I reserve the right to put on a bit of Commander Shran's attitude and revel in my superiority.
Former/Cryptic Name: Captain_Hans_Langsdorff
Founding member, Special Service Squadron
"Fear God and Dread Nought." First Sea Lord, Adm. Jacky Fisher
First of all remodulators can, as far as I know, now be replicated on the ground. That leaves the problem that two people have left. Don't you think that THEY should be penalized? That's what the OP did. What the game is missing is the ability for left-over teams to finish the mission without penalty through a majority vote.
Sometimes, if you want to bury the hatchet with a Klingon, it has to be in his skull. - Captain K'Tar of the USS Danu about J'mpok.
Some of you have this mis-interpretation that I am being an ELITIST. I am not. I am simply stating being QUALIFIED. You do not send a ricky recruit booter into a war zone. They have to LEARN first.
I don't understand where people can get off thinking, you can place a LT. into an ELITE type mission and expect success.
Now for the few that hammered me about not completing the mission. Here is some news for you:
Infected Ground (Normal) I have done over 450 times. How many EVER won (And that means playing to the end), NONE. Yes people that is correct. I spent many many, many, many hours doing this mission over and over and over, with lowbie noobs etc. even a few VA's thrown in like myself on occasion, and ALL FAILED, because of the dying noobsters.
Do I want to endure this pain and suffering again spending hundreds of thousands of EC trying to carry and teach them only to never see them again? Hell freaking No. It is BECAUSE of that mission, I have become ANTI NOOB and will never change back.
KA and CURE? Luckily I made it through those. I have done untold amounts of COLONY and Incursions and Fleet Alerts, and well, after seeing all my consumables go poof and have to keep making or buying more, I decided it was not worth it.
So re-think your position when you start calling me for being banned for 24 hours and permanently for not wanting to endure ANOTHER failed mission again and again and again.
PS: Sollvax, no need to add your worthless wooden nickel comments.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
i vote for higher penalitys for this kids what destroy missions for others on this way many times the free places will not be refield.
so go in and do your job or get 5 hours penelity!!!;)
Guess you didn't read the last post.
PS: Sollvax, no need to add your worthless wooden nickel comments.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I've just recently joined a fleet that's capable of sending out a complete STF team and were I'n the training stage , it's nice training the same people some lessons are learned and applied and the success rate climbs , However I have played perhaps 450 stfs, infected ground is my favorite and I have a complete Maco elite set and 5 of my Boffs have complete Maco or omega sets and I have a stack of common and rare Borg techs that I haven't cashed into Tech yet.
All of this I got with the random groups, some were a help some I had to carry and solo the boss myself. If you see me online I will group with you and we will do this STF , it's not that big of a deal , I don't know what your doing wrong but whatever it is we will fix it.
Either one of my characters can do this STF with ease, I never care about the optional because the prize you get from the boss not the optional and I've got that prize many times.the only complaint I really have is not being able to communicate with someone speaking a differnt language, that's hard.
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Low level players trying to earn fleet marks are not leechers. They're just trying to contribute to their fleet's projects just like you.
Fleet events are not "elite type missions", and to get to No Win (the event you're complaining about) you have to be a Vice Admiral. That's the only requirement. And how the hell are "lowbies" supposed to learn how to run a fleet event if they don't play them? (Answer: they can't.)
You want to exclude "lowbies" because "they aren't experienced enough". You're claiming that you're more qualified for whatever reason. Guess what? That's elitism.
Accolades.
Seriously. Accolades?
What kind of demon keeled over and spilled his horrid essense over basic logic to make you think that accolades are in any way a proper method of appraising ones skill?
no only the first one what is importend.:D
and the discussion is about players what leave mission for whatever reason and make the mission for the smaller group harder?
and if dis discussion is about that i vote for 5 hours penality for anyone who join a mission and then leave its 100% not importend why if he leave he have to pay for that.;)
The devs say most people are at level cap but I do see alot of lower level players in these. I was in a Starbase Defense the other night where it was first off four of us, me as a VA, two Lt. Commanders, and a Commander. We earned a whopping two fleet marks.
On both sides of the coin, this is not fair to people at level cap, nor is it fair to people a lower levels. It boils down to that somewhere along the lines someone made the decision to push everyone into one mission using the level scaling system. That decision may have been time and cost effective, but it is not fair to the playerbase. Just look at the issues it is causing.