Define "more complex crew system" please. I find the crew here very simplistic and zero personality.
What I was comparing wasn't the companions, who have deeper story significance and backstory quests in SWTOR.
What I mean is that the Duty Officer System as compared to the Crew Skills System has more:
variety of mission types,
branching duty officer assignments (SWTOR has none that I'm aware of- 400 Armortech, 400 Scavenging, 289 Underworld Trading--previously 400 Slicing and 200 Investigation before switching a couple weeks ago),
more areas to specialize for new items/perks/currencies/etc.
Longer-term progression than SWTOR (I can reach 400 in all three of my skills in under a week--in STO, it'll take you weeks to get one DO category to max tier).
interface in STO presents far more information at once--allowing you to easily manage hundreds of companions instead of the clunky feeling that the six companions bring in SWTOR.
Duty Officers also have more diverse impact on passives during regular play--whereas Crew Skills only help during selected flashpoints or crafting.
Assignments in SWTOR are an afterthought.
However, SWTOR has better crafting hands down, imo.
One area where SWTOR uses its Crew System more effectively, however, is that Crew Skills can simplify flashpoints--something that would be appreciated for STFs.
To make SWTOR clearly deeper than STO in regards to assignments, they'd need to add a great deal. STO only has to integrate DOFFs into gameplay more (STFs/Fleet Action) and improve crafting to make it the clear winner.
I was going to play TOR and pre ordered the first day. After my first beta I changed my digital deluxe to a collectors edition. I couldn't enter the code on the same account so I entered it on my second account.
I found out that I lost my first day access because I entered the new code in October. Then I found out that I would probably loose a day or two of game play because I would have to enter the code from the box. The grace period was very short. So instead of paying more for shipping, I just canceled my order.
I liked the game but I didn't like those decisions so I chose not to play. I will wait and hope they get a some more PVP options and some better space combat. I'm really looking forward to GW2's PVP and will probably play that.
What I was comparing wasn't the companions, who have deeper story significance and backstory quests in SWTOR.
What I mean is that the Duty Officer System as compared to the Crew Skills System has more:
variety of mission types,
branching duty officer assignments (SWTOR has none that I'm aware of- 400 Armortech, 400 Scavenging, 289 Underworld Trading--previously 400 Slicing and 200 Investigation before switching a couple weeks ago),
more areas to specialize for new items/perks/currencies/etc.
Longer-term progression than SWTOR (I can reach 400 in all three of my skills in under a week--in STO, it'll take you weeks to get one DO category to max tier).
interface in STO presents far more information at once--allowing you to easily manage hundreds of companions instead of the clunky feeling that the six companions bring in SWTOR.
Duty Officers also have more diverse impact on passives during regular play--whereas Crew Skills only help during selected flashpoints or crafting.
Assignments in SWTOR are an afterthought.
However, SWTOR has better crafting hands down, imo.
One area where SWTOR uses its Crew System more effectively, however, is that Crew Skills can simplify flashpoints--something that would be appreciated for STFs.
To make SWTOR clearly deeper than STO in regards to assignments, they'd need to add a great deal. STO only has to integrate DOFFs into gameplay more (STFs/Fleet Action) and improve crafting to make it the clear winner.
I don't see how you can call duty officers deep it's just waiting on timers. You can actually play with your companions using them as DPS, healers or tanks. Changing their gear and appearance.
Read this, slot that and wait for buffs you don't need doesn't interest or impress me at all.
I don't see how you can call duty officers deep it's just waiting on timers. You can actually play with your companions using them as DPS, healers or tanks. Changing their gear and appearance.
If you read my post, you should realize I'm differing Companions from the Crew Skill, just as Bridge Officers function differently from Duty Officers.
Crew Skills and Duty Officers are the systems that are metaphorically equivalent. (I prefer the Duty Officer System for the reasons listed above in comparison).
Companions should be compared to Bridge Officers. (Companions are better, hands down).
Read this, slot that and wait for buffs you don't need doesn't interest or impress me at all.
In that case, SWTOR's Crew Skills do less. If you're comparing the systems I'm comparing, it's clear in which area SWTOR has the lead--and which areas it doesn't.
The UI alone on STO presents more reliable information--and does a far better job showing you which Duty Officers are better for each assignment. SWTOR's interface lists the perks with zero context as to what those variables mean or how they scale to end-game.
Considering both games were development for similar time periods (though STO has been live longer), I'm surprised that STO does such a better job on things like the UI (and that's a gamewide issue, if you wish to compare beyond the Crew Skills to Duty Officer system).
Before anyone accuses me of STO fanboyism: I really enjoy SWTOR.
The crafting is deeper, there's more story in which to explore, there are two factions (unlike STO), companions serve more than just utility (they're part of the story and actual NPCs, instead of pets).
With that said, I'll be playing both games for a long time.
49 Imperial Agent (Operative -- 32/3/5) on my highest level character. I'm this close to endgame.
As it's been said many times before in this long thread... If you like STO, play STO. If you like SWTOR, play SWTOR. If you like them both, play them both. How much better one is compared to the other is subjective to the individual. We don't need to make it even slightly personal.
As much as it pains me to agree with you, I have to say you are totally correct.
I will pay to play TOR and have sub up again, and STO is now free, so I shouldn't be so churlish to give it the grief I do.
Regardless of the links to what other sites are saying (Massively columnists are pro STO and are always finding ways to dag on TOR), I will play both and enjoyed what I can, so yes, if you don't like TOR, then don't play it, give it 6 months and see if it has changed.If you love STO, then more power to you.
If you read my post, you should realize I'm differing Companions from the Crew Skill, just as Bridge Officers function differently from Duty Officers.
Crew Skills and Duty Officers are the systems that are metaphorically equivalent. (I prefer the Duty Officer System for the reasons listed above in comparison).
Companions should be compared to Bridge Officers. (Companions are better, hands down).
I don't see reading a dialogue box as variety in mission types since it's not a mission, it's text. I also believe that the companion's were far superior to duty officers in every way.
In that case, SWTOR's Crew Skills do less. If you're comparing the systems I'm comparing, it's clear in which area SWTOR has the lead--and which areas it doesn't.
The UI alone on STO presents more reliable information--and does a far better job showing you which Duty Officers are better for each assignment. SWTOR's interface lists the perks with zero context as to what those variables mean or how they scale to end-game.
Considering both games were development for similar time periods (though STO has been live longer), I'm surprised that STO does such a better job on things like the UI (and that's a gamewide issue, if you wish to compare beyond the Crew Skills to Duty Officer system).
What I was comparing wasn't the companions, who have deeper story significance and backstory quests in SWTOR.
What I mean is that the Duty Officer System as compared to the Crew Skills System has more:
variety of mission types,
branching duty officer assignments (SWTOR has none that I'm aware of- 400 Armortech, 400 Scavenging, 289 Underworld Trading--previously 400 Slicing and 200 Investigation before switching a couple weeks ago),
more areas to specialize for new items/perks/currencies/etc.
Longer-term progression than SWTOR (I can reach 400 in all three of my skills in under a week--in STO, it'll take you weeks to get one DO category to max tier).
interface in STO presents far more information at once--allowing you to easily manage hundreds of companions instead of the clunky feeling that the six companions bring in SWTOR.
Duty Officers also have more diverse impact on passives during regular play--whereas Crew Skills only help during selected flashpoints or crafting.
Assignments in SWTOR are an afterthought.
However, SWTOR has better crafting hands down, imo.
One area where SWTOR uses its Crew System more effectively, however, is that Crew Skills can simplify flashpoints--something that would be appreciated for STFs.
To make SWTOR clearly deeper than STO in regards to assignments, they'd need to add a great deal. STO only has to integrate DOFFs into gameplay more (STFs/Fleet Action) and improve crafting to make it the clear winner.
Okay. Makes more sense. I was thinking more BOs and not DOFFs. So maybe that helps you realize why I had to ask.
Before anyone accuses me of STO fanboyism: I really enjoy SWTOR.
The crafting is deeper, there's more story in which to explore, there are two factions (unlike STO), companions serve more than just utility (they're part of the story and actual NPCs, instead of pets).
With that said, I'll be playing both games for a long time.
49 Imperial Agent (Operative -- 32/3/5) on my highest level character. I'm this close to endgame.
Darren, the word I'd call you is actually noob. (wink to show not being mean or even serious there btw) I got a 50 smuggler, 30 Assassin, and now 22 Shadow. The 'sin and Shadow basically are the same but the 'sin has a better story. And so far even like the companions better although the Shadow has 1 less at the moment. Only playing the Shadow and not 'sin much anymore because I'm on a PvP server and my guild is Republic. I still do a little on the Assassin because of the better story though.
But Smuggler had the best story and Risha and Bowie I really felt they were my Leia and Chewie. It was odd having the bugged stowaway though and the Mandalorian female got all postal when Risha and my smug finally gave in to the attraction. Never told postal Mandalorian I was even interested but she came busting in there like she owned the ship.
(Granted, these are in development for SWTOR--but don't try and compare the UIs in either game's current state.)
TOR's UI works where I had to battle and fight STO UI for hours on end. I had absolutely no problem with the UI in TOR. Easy to use and it worked and I had no problems with the layout.
I do in that you can at least move and resize and hide windows in the STO UI.
(And yes, we BEGGED BioWare for at least this in SWToR beta, but I guess it took the outcry of the regular playerbase to get them to finally conceede and do something although when it hits SWToR is anyone's guess.)
TOR's UI works where I had to battle and fight STO UI for hours on end. I had absolutely no problem with the UI in TOR. Easy to use and it worked and I had no problems with the layout.
STO's is customizable and has a combat tracker--something MMOS aside from SWTOR have included for over ten years.
Also, don't get anyone who plays PvP in SWTOR started on the ability delay / UI unresponsiveness. SWTOR's abilities can regularly get clogged and misfire--it's a serious bug that affects most classes, especially towards endgame in PvP areas.
STO's is customizable and has a combat tracker--something MMOS aside from SWTOR have included for over ten years.
Also, don't get anyone who plays PvP in SWTOR started on the ability delay. SWTOR's abilities can regularly get clogged and misfire--it's a serious bug that affects most classes, especially towards endgame in PvP areas.
I never had any reason to change the way it came. I hit the ground running and never had to waste any amount of time trying to set it up like I did in STO.
I never had abilities misfire in TOR they weren't ready to be activated. I never had the problems that STO UI did. Many of STO ability's wouldn't fire a lot. You could actually push a ability twice in STO and it would deactivate it and not fire then you would have to wait on the cool down.
I never had any reason to change the way it came. I hit the ground running and never had to waste any amount of time trying to set it up like I did in STO.
I never had abilities misfire in TOR they weren't ready to be activated. I never had the problems that STO UI did. Many of STO ability's wouldn't fire a lot. You could actually push a ability twice in STO and it would deactivate it and not fire then you would have to wait on the cool down.
SWTOR upcoming content over the next few months...
Jeez your managing like what 2 FE's a year now... and shiny shiny TRIBBLE into c-store...
OH MORE PVP MAPS
Dun DuH Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
Yeah, fleet banks and movable UI elements are already in STO.
That trailer is out because Eaware are afraid that people will stop playing and are like:
"ok, ok guys, look at the nice things we have for you in the future!" Fleet banks and customizable UI.
It sounds more like a desperate attempt, because the timing of this trailer was perfect (aprox 1 month after release).
And I don't believe in coincidence
SWTOR upcoming content over the next few months...
Jeez your managing like what 2 FE's a year now... and shiny shiny TRIBBLE into c-store...
OH MORE PVP MAPS
Dun DuH Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
They spent a year adding some of the content in the 1.1 patch... so for your next big batch of content you can wait a year. Cryptic are doing pretty much on-par for it really.
I never had any reason to change the way it came. I hit the ground running and never had to waste any amount of time trying to set it up like I did in STO.
I never had abilities misfire in TOR they weren't ready to be activated. I never had the problems that STO UI did. Many of STO ability's wouldn't fire a lot. You could actually push a ability twice in STO and it would deactivate it and not fire then you would have to wait on the cool down.
I've still yet to en****er the mountain of issues in SWTOR that some people are claiming are present. Sure there are a few things that could do with tweaking, but some people are making out that the game is completely unplayable, which simply sin't true. My only guess is that some of the poeple making complaints are reading the forums and piling all the complaints together and talking about them (without actually checking to see if they are true or not).
For example,the new PvP drama, people are going ape that killing some defensive turrets was giving PvP honor, well, after been at that location in a raid (totally unaware of the issue as it was my first time PvPing there by chance) alot of the things people have complained about 'DID NOT' happen. Instead you are getting a few people making assumptions that arn't correct, then everyone jumps onboard complaining about something they havn't confirmed or know about. I'm glad they fixed the turrets to stop the spawn camping though :-)
Both games (STO and SWTOR) certainly have thier own niche audiances, and both have features the other doesn't, but I'm really thinking some of the abuse towards SWTOR here is completely uninformed, especially people saying there is nothing to do endgame, I've been max level for 3 weeks now and still have a huge ammount of content of planets to get though, as well as dailies to get better gear and instances to upgrade my other gear further, I still have half the codexes to find as well! I'm certainly having no issues finding stuff to do, so I'm really surprised some people are making such claims (ironically many of those people probably havn't even hit max level in SWTOR either).
As for Post Purchase Rationalisation, I spent far more on STO with 3 Collectors editions (for what I believed were 'exclusive' pre-order bonuses) as well as the LTS. I got max level in less than a week in STO and then found i had nothing to do! That was a Post Purchase Rationalisation moment! I've yet to feel that with SWTOR. Time will tell however..... :-)
I've still yet to en****er the mountain of issues in SWTOR that some people are claiming are present. Sure there are a few things that could do with tweaking, but some people are making out that the game is completely unplayable, which simply sin't true. My only guess is that some of the poeple making complaints are reading the forums and piling all the complaints together and talking about them (without actually checking to see if they are true or not).
For example,the new PvP drama, people are going ape that killing some defensive turrets was giving PvP honor, well, after been at that location in a raid (totally unaware of the issue as it was my first time PvPing there by chance) alot of the things people have complained about 'DID NOT' happen. Instead you are getting a few people making assumptions that arn't correct, then everyone jumps onboard complaining about something they havn't confirmed or know about. I'm glad they fixed the turrets to stop the spawn camping though :-)
If you look at some of the posts on TOR, it's funny to see some of the DEVs have stepped in to tell some posters that they are out and out lying and that they either haven't been barred or they haven't had roll backs as they claim.
Before the Devs come in, other posters are taking the Ops at their word and claiming it's outrageous and BW sucks etc. So yes, there is definately a general "group hypnosis" on the TOR forums that if someone says something is wrong, everyone seems to agree and are whipped up into a frenzy.
I too haven't had any issues at all and the only bug I have seen is this graphical issue of a green like shield on Tatooine. Nothing has prevented my enjoyment to the game and they have my sub money already today.
I suppose theirs something to say in that the majority of people playing TOR don't visit any forums and just play the game, where as forum posters tend to post more negativity then possitiity...(myself included:o).
I love how no one really focuses on hwo TOR is now 1 month old....ONE MONTH. TOR had ot be one of the top smoothest releases in MMO history, does the game have a few faults, yes, will they get fixed / altered in the near future, seeing that this is Bioware, yes.
STO is almost two YEARS old and it's in worse shape than TOR...and yet people complain more about TOR....oh well I guess that's the mystery of the internet....common sense has no place :rolleyes: .
Comments
What I mean is that the Duty Officer System as compared to the Crew Skills System has more:
Duty Officers also have more diverse impact on passives during regular play--whereas Crew Skills only help during selected flashpoints or crafting.
Assignments in SWTOR are an afterthought.
However, SWTOR has better crafting hands down, imo.
One area where SWTOR uses its Crew System more effectively, however, is that Crew Skills can simplify flashpoints--something that would be appreciated for STFs.
To make SWTOR clearly deeper than STO in regards to assignments, they'd need to add a great deal. STO only has to integrate DOFFs into gameplay more (STFs/Fleet Action) and improve crafting to make it the clear winner.
I found out that I lost my first day access because I entered the new code in October. Then I found out that I would probably loose a day or two of game play because I would have to enter the code from the box. The grace period was very short. So instead of paying more for shipping, I just canceled my order.
I liked the game but I didn't like those decisions so I chose not to play. I will wait and hope they get a some more PVP options and some better space combat. I'm really looking forward to GW2's PVP and will probably play that.
I don't see how you can call duty officers deep it's just waiting on timers. You can actually play with your companions using them as DPS, healers or tanks. Changing their gear and appearance.
Read this, slot that and wait for buffs you don't need doesn't interest or impress me at all.
If you read my post, you should realize I'm differing Companions from the Crew Skill, just as Bridge Officers function differently from Duty Officers.
Crew Skills and Duty Officers are the systems that are metaphorically equivalent. (I prefer the Duty Officer System for the reasons listed above in comparison).
Companions should be compared to Bridge Officers. (Companions are better, hands down).
In that case, SWTOR's Crew Skills do less. If you're comparing the systems I'm comparing, it's clear in which area SWTOR has the lead--and which areas it doesn't.
The UI alone on STO presents more reliable information--and does a far better job showing you which Duty Officers are better for each assignment. SWTOR's interface lists the perks with zero context as to what those variables mean or how they scale to end-game.
Considering both games were development for similar time periods (though STO has been live longer), I'm surprised that STO does such a better job on things like the UI (and that's a gamewide issue, if you wish to compare beyond the Crew Skills to Duty Officer system).
I really enjoy SWTOR.
The crafting is deeper, there's more story in which to explore, there are two factions (unlike STO), companions serve more than just utility (they're part of the story and actual NPCs, instead of pets).
With that said, I'll be playing both games for a long time.
49 Imperial Agent (Operative -- 32/3/5) on my highest level character. I'm this close to endgame.
As much as it pains me to agree with you, I have to say you are totally correct.
I will pay to play TOR and have sub up again, and STO is now free, so I shouldn't be so churlish to give it the grief I do.
Regardless of the links to what other sites are saying (Massively columnists are pro STO and are always finding ways to dag on TOR), I will play both and enjoyed what I can, so yes, if you don't like TOR, then don't play it, give it 6 months and see if it has changed.If you love STO, then more power to you.
I don't think STO has superior UI to TOR either.
Okay. Makes more sense. I was thinking more BOs and not DOFFs. So maybe that helps you realize why I had to ask.
Is it the lack of:
- customization options,
- UI scaling,
- combat tracker,
- etc.
compared to STO that sold you?(Granted, these are in development for SWTOR--but don't try and compare the UIs in either game's current state.)
I like SWTOR--but its UI is one of the worst in recent MMO memory.
Darren, the word I'd call you is actually noob.
But Smuggler had the best story and Risha and Bowie I really felt they were my Leia and Chewie. It was odd having the bugged stowaway though and the Mandalorian female got all postal when Risha and my smug finally gave in to the attraction. Never told postal Mandalorian I was even interested but she came busting in there like she owned the ship.
TOR's UI works where I had to battle and fight STO UI for hours on end. I had absolutely no problem with the UI in TOR. Easy to use and it worked and I had no problems with the layout.
I do in that you can at least move and resize and hide windows in the STO UI.
(And yes, we BEGGED BioWare for at least this in SWToR beta, but I guess it took the outcry of the regular playerbase to get them to finally conceede and do something although when it hits SWToR is anyone's guess.)
Also, don't get anyone who plays PvP in SWTOR started on the ability delay / UI unresponsiveness. SWTOR's abilities can regularly get clogged and misfire--it's a serious bug that affects most classes, especially towards endgame in PvP areas.
I never had any reason to change the way it came. I hit the ground running and never had to waste any amount of time trying to set it up like I did in STO.
I never had abilities misfire in TOR they weren't ready to be activated. I never had the problems that STO UI did. Many of STO ability's wouldn't fire a lot. You could actually push a ability twice in STO and it would deactivate it and not fire then you would have to wait on the cool down.
That has been many fatal flaws in STO's pvp...
Ok Cryptic your so got a run for you lack of money now..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUktp9Vmolg
SWTOR upcoming content over the next few months...
Jeez your managing like what 2 FE's a year now... and shiny shiny TRIBBLE into c-store...
OH MORE PVP MAPS
Dun DuH Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
Yeah, fleet banks and movable UI elements are already in STO.
That trailer is out because Eaware are afraid that people will stop playing and are like:
"ok, ok guys, look at the nice things we have for you in the future!" Fleet banks and customizable UI.
It sounds more like a desperate attempt, because the timing of this trailer was perfect (aprox 1 month after release).
And I don't believe in coincidence
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-purchase_rationalization
For example,the new PvP drama, people are going ape that killing some defensive turrets was giving PvP honor, well, after been at that location in a raid (totally unaware of the issue as it was my first time PvPing there by chance) alot of the things people have complained about 'DID NOT' happen. Instead you are getting a few people making assumptions that arn't correct, then everyone jumps onboard complaining about something they havn't confirmed or know about. I'm glad they fixed the turrets to stop the spawn camping though :-)
Both games (STO and SWTOR) certainly have thier own niche audiances, and both have features the other doesn't, but I'm really thinking some of the abuse towards SWTOR here is completely uninformed, especially people saying there is nothing to do endgame, I've been max level for 3 weeks now and still have a huge ammount of content of planets to get though, as well as dailies to get better gear and instances to upgrade my other gear further, I still have half the codexes to find as well! I'm certainly having no issues finding stuff to do, so I'm really surprised some people are making such claims (ironically many of those people probably havn't even hit max level in SWTOR either).
As for Post Purchase Rationalisation, I spent far more on STO with 3 Collectors editions (for what I believed were 'exclusive' pre-order bonuses) as well as the LTS. I got max level in less than a week in STO and then found i had nothing to do! That was a Post Purchase Rationalisation moment! I've yet to feel that with SWTOR. Time will tell however..... :-)
Did you get through with your free 30 days from game purchase yet? It's basically a 31 day vet reward to put it in STO terms.
Also it says on the page that says how to qualify: (NOTE: It may take up to 7 days for the "Founder" title to be applied).
A lot of people here use it too when speaking on STO's faults. So point is?
If you look at some of the posts on TOR, it's funny to see some of the DEVs have stepped in to tell some posters that they are out and out lying and that they either haven't been barred or they haven't had roll backs as they claim.
Before the Devs come in, other posters are taking the Ops at their word and claiming it's outrageous and BW sucks etc. So yes, there is definately a general "group hypnosis" on the TOR forums that if someone says something is wrong, everyone seems to agree and are whipped up into a frenzy.
I too haven't had any issues at all and the only bug I have seen is this graphical issue of a green like shield on Tatooine. Nothing has prevented my enjoyment to the game and they have my sub money already today.
I suppose theirs something to say in that the majority of people playing TOR don't visit any forums and just play the game, where as forum posters tend to post more negativity then possitiity...(myself included:o).
In another post I said I didn't buy TOR, I canceled my order. So, nice try almost..............
Heh, I was wondering what that was called. Thanks for the linky.
http://www.joystiq.com/2012/01/20/star-wars-the-old-republic-performance-fears-are-overblown-say/
Touche?
STO is almost two YEARS old and it's in worse shape than TOR...and yet people complain more about TOR....oh well I guess that's the mystery of the internet....common sense has no place :rolleyes: