Game mechanics. The ships should have a progression from weak to strong. TOSC will always be one of the weakest in any good system. Sovereign will always been one of the strongest.
Further, I don't know anything about the Klingon ships so even if I wanted to compare them, I couldn't.
People aren't talking about game mechanics when they say they are against the TOSC being T5, they are talking about immersion when they say they don't want TOSC in the game at Tier 5. If it is immersion they are concerned about, that is really out the window in so many ways it can't be listed in one post. For example, Federation on Federation is used so many times as comparative examples to illustrate why it hurts immersion, while those very examples contradict the very purpose of the argument.
Mechanics is definitely not an issue at all. People pay for a game they enjoy paying for, they stop paying when they lose enjoyment, the game suffers and then faulters for everyone. I have seen it happen on nearly 15 separate MMOs over the last 10 years. If someone wants a T5 Connie or a Tier 5 D5 Cruiser it really doesn't matter at all. It really comes down to a ship-skin they enjoy playing.
The fact is, all evidence points to the TOS era being among the most popular among a majority of paying subscribers. Unless you are not noticing the vast amount of attention TOS has garnered from the devs. They, being Cryptic and Atari, don't do that because it won't show them a return on their investment of time, human resources, and negotiations they go through to secure the right to use a particular ship in the game. They do it for quite the opposite reason. Because catering to the various majorities in this game is how they make money.
The way I see it in my humble opinion, it is easier for the devs to make a T1 into a T5, than it is for most people to just let other people enjoy their game in an iconic MMO already devoid of any semblance of immersion.
if you wanted a T5 conny you could have made something like it for the design the next enterprise contest. I know its over, and some of you couldnt enter, but the majority of you could have......just sayn.
Right now a ship is more than a skin. It is a game mechanic and part of the game's progression and leveling process. I personally do not like that game mechanic and that is why I am working on a proposal to make a better mechanic.
The way I see it in my humble opinion, it is easier for the devs to make a T1 into a T5, than it is for most people to just let other people enjoy their game in an iconic MMO already devoid of any semblance of immersion.
I have said over and over again in lots of threads that people all draw their personal line somewhere. That you have a line that has already been crossed so much you no longer care does not mean others do not. And that is excluding the game mechanic issue of having the weakest ships in the strongest tier.
The simple fact is that there is absolutely no reason to move the TOSC. There is no restriction against flying it at any point in the game; it is just much, much harder later on. If there were, then the T5 TOSC people would have a point. That means this is about the strength of the ship relative to other ships, and in Cryptic's system, it's one of the weakest for reasons that have been covered to death.
Moreover, T5 TOSC does not solve the problem. Then you have nothing to use from T2-T4, and then you need a T-everything TOSC. Meanwhile, the people who like other ships (the RC for me) will then want their T-everything ship. Once you do that, there is no tier system anymore, and you might as well have just one ship base with whatever skin you like.
So, in my humble opinion, the TOS people need to either accept the fact that this is not a TOS game and be happy with the fact their stuff is even included at all despite not belonging, or they need to shift their focus towards a new ship system that allows them to get more out of the TOS ship. I choose to assist in the latter because I think a new system is worth it.
I cut some of these quotes down to their primary points to save space, but:
I am.
Right now a ship is more than a skin. It is a game mechanic and part of the game's progression and leveling process. I personally do not like that game mechanic and that is why I am working on a proposal to make a better mechanic.
That is speculation and even if true, irrelevant.
I have said over and over again in lots of threads that people all draw their personal line somewhere. That you have a line that has already been crossed so much you no longer care does not mean others do not. And that is excluding the game mechanic issue of having the weakest ships in the strongest tier.
The simple fact is that there is absolutely no reason to move the TOSC. There is no restriction against flying it at any point in the game; it is just much, much harder later on. If there were, then the T5 TOSC people would have a point. That means this is about the strength of the ship relative to other ships, and in Cryptic's system, it's one of the weakest for reasons that have been covered to death.
Moreover, T5 TOSC does not solve the problem. Then you have nothing to use from T2-T4, and then you need a T-everything TOSC. Meanwhile, the people who like other ships (the RC for me) will then want their T-everything ship. Once you do that, there is no tier system anymore, and you might as well have just one ship base with whatever skin you like.
So, in my humble opinion, the TOS people need to either accept the fact that this is not a TOS game and be happy with the fact their stuff is even included at all despite not belonging, or they need to shift their focus towards a new ship system that allows them to get more out of the TOS ship. I choose to assist in the latter because I think a new system is worth it.
I agree with your last paragraph in that you are willing to consider a new system whereby most can get what they want. However, calling what I have to say speculation thereby discounting everything I have said is argumentative at best. They are ship models. Therefore they are all skins. They are a combination of polygons and hardpoints. The rest is semantics and you know it, or you don't.
And by the way, "TOS people?" Really, show some respect if not some reason. TOS is the reason this game exists. I don't mean the game in and of itself, I mean Star Trek as a whole. More than that, the amount of time and effort Cryptic has put into the TOS content of this game is more than luck. It is business pure and simple. There is a huge demand for it. If you can't see that, I feel for you. Well not really.
By the way, I like your entry. It has the most hope I have seen. It's definately better than the Star Trek XII horror. And I don't think the Connie should be end game stuff. Just powerful enough get someone through all the solo content and powerful enough to be of value in a group. We will see one way or another. The devs listen from mt perspective.
I agree with your last paragraph in that you are willing to consider a new system whereby most can get what they want. However, calling what I have to say speculation thereby discounting everything I have said is argumentative at best. They are ship models. Therefore they are all skins. They are a combination of polygons and hardpoints. The rest is semantics and you know it, or you don't.
They stopped just being ship skins when they started being part of your level progression. If they were just skins, we'd have one base model and you'd pick your skin for the whole game. But they are not, they're classified into three groups and five tiers.
And what I discounted is your speculation that TOS is most popular. It may very well be, but even if it is, it's irrelevant to the discussion at hand.
And by the way, "TOS people?" Really, show some respect if not some reason. TOS is the reason this game exists. I don't mean the game in and of itself, I mean Star Trek as a whole. More than that, the amount of time and effort Cryptic has put into the TOS content of this game is more than luck. It is business pure and simple. There is a huge demand for it. If you can't see that, I feel for you. Well not really.
:rolleyes: Yeah, TOS people, as in, people who want the TOS stuff. That's a short-hand description so that I don't have to type out "people who want more TOS stuff", not an insult.
And who said anything about a lack of demand or luck? I said that it's a game that isn't set in TOS, so the stuff shouldn't even be in it at all. As such, it is already a compromise to add them, and people should accept that compromise instead of trying to have their cake and eat it too.
For example, my favorite ship is the RC. It's T2. I am both surprised and thrilled it is even playable, so I have no reason to complain I can only use it for T2. I accept that the compromise between the game's setting and me getting to play the RC is that I can only use it early in the game.
They stopped just being ship skins when they started being part of your level progression. If they were just skins, we'd have one base model and you'd pick your skin for the whole game. But they are not, they're classified into three groups and five tiers.
And what I discounted is your speculation that TOS is most popular. It may very well be, but even if it is, it's irrelevant to the discussion at hand.
:rolleyes: Yeah, TOS people, as in, people who want the TOS stuff. That's a short-hand description so that I don't have to type out "people who want more TOS stuff", not an insult.
And who said anything about a lack of demand or luck? I said that it's a game that isn't set in TOS, so the stuff shouldn't even be in it at all. As such, it is already a compromise to add them, and people should accept that compromise instead of trying to have their cake and eat it too.
For example, my favorite ship is the RC. It's T2. I am both surprised and thrilled it is even playable, so I have no reason to complain I can only use it for T2. I accept that the compromise between the game's setting and me getting to play the RC is that I can only use it early in the game.
EDIT:
Thank you.
Yeah, I sped read your post and gleaned the "we should feel lucky" Hey no harm no foul. However, I think you can agree that allowing an upgrade to the Connie to be practically playable at the higher tier content can't hurt. I just think of someone wants it let em have it. Its not game breaking or anything and as far as immersion, to which so many complaints are directed, I can only point out that immersion was a lost cause some time ago. Beyond repair.
Im glad I chose a lifetime sub here, as I will definately get to the see this game develop through a broad range of change and improvements over the years. Some I will like and some I won't.
Yeah, I sped read your post and gleaned the "we should feel lucky" Hey no harm no foul. However, I think you can agree that allowing an upgrade to the Connie to be practically playable at the higher tier content can't hurt. I just think of someone wants it let em have it. Its not game breaking or anything and as far as immersion, to which so many complaints are directed, I can only point out that immersion was a lost cause some time ago. Beyond repair.
Im glad I chose a lifetime sub here, as I will definately get to the see this game develop through a broad range of change and improvements over the years. Some I will like and some I won't.
I do agree. That's why I'm trying to put together a system to make that happen that will eliminate this issue all together. If your ship truly could be outfitted with equipment, managed, and upgraded, there is very little limit to how far you can go.
The reason I think so many people want T5 TOSC is simply because the boundaries are so solid and arbitrary. If you could've done a lot more modifications to the ship from the start, I think more people could accept potentially not using it at end game. It would feel more like you simply got tired of working so hard to squeeze power out of it and chose to move on, rather than got booted at the next tier.
I've got some more shots of the system I'm putting together for everyone to look at. I need to do one more that's a balanced "fully upgraded" ship. Forgive me for fudging the item images by stretching them some. I don't have the time to make brand new ones that are sized appropriately.
Here's what a standard RC out of the gate might look like. As you can see, it has a forward dual phaser, a forward phaser strip, a forward quantum torp, a rear quantum torp, a standard bridge, and a "gaseous anomaly detector." It hits the power usage exactly at 60% so it will not suffer any ill-effects of power drain, but it will also not have any extra auxiliary to push around. It also has tons of extra space to expand as you upgrade the warp core.
Here is what a noob does with this system. As you can see, he's packed it with phasers and has completely blown by his power availability. He's used up so much it actually sends the bar all the way to the maximum potential output of his warp core. This ship would be utterly useless as those weapons would either have zero effectiveness when firing, have a massive cooldown, and/or both. His shields would crumple like tissue paper, his deflector would do nothing, and his sensors would have almost no range as they all also rely on power usage.
I've got some more shots of the system I'm putting together for everyone to look at. I need to do one more that's a balanced "fully upgraded" ship. Forgive me for fudging the item images by stretching them some. I don't have the time to make brand new ones that are sized appropriately.
Here's what a standard RC out of the gate might look like. As you can see, it has a forward dual phaser, a forward phaser strip, a forward quantum torp, a rear quantum torp, a standard bridge, and a "gaseous anomaly detector." It hits the power usage exactly at 60% so it will not suffer any ill-effects of power drain, but it will also not have any extra auxiliary to push around. It also has tons of extra space to expand as you upgrade the warp core.
Here is what a noob does with this system. As you can see, he's packed it with phasers and has completely blown by his power availability. He's used up so much it actually sends the bar all the way to the maximum potential output of his warp core. This ship would be utterly useless as those weapons would either have zero effectiveness when firing, have a massive cooldown, and/or both. His shields would crumple like tissue paper, his deflector would do nothing, and his sensors would have almost no range as they all also rely on power usage.
Now thats a nice proposal. Fair and balanced unlike the news. : )
I do hope that Cryptic takes a long, hard look at your proposal, LotD. I love the concept.
As for the "noob" picture, I can see a huge number of players just cramming weapons in there without thinking about power distribution.
That person will find out real quick it isn't worth it. :-D
The greatest thing about this is that you can get really deep in your customization if you really want to spend the time. Maybe adding one more weapon will put you over the line, but since you're only just over the debuff might be weak enough that having that extra weapon is worth it.
Similarly, maybe you want to leave some space and have the aux power to use instead.
I for one still feel very strong about not such an attribute being in game. Tos Players will agree such an attribute would not exist in canon and understand The common place of a Tos ship.
The reason the Tos segment is being given "love" is because it is popular to role play and as such is recommended to go to the c-store to role play. I do not see any role play in a T5 connie. It is not apart of any time line or role play function. It is to try and bring an old ship into the future and leave the ship as is. Tos fans will understand the function of that is not star trek and i do belive tos fans will also not want a gimmic but for attribute to make sense.
Your tos connie does not have rear weapons on the secondary hull. Your tos connie only has 6 phase emitters on the saucer section and 2 forward torpedoe tubes which mind you are bigger then the neck itself.
The problem of this T5 connie is that such a ship did not have enough space and power to stand the test of the future. In simple terms such a ship was completely phased out of star trek in tng while its bigger sister (excelsior) was made popular and is way bigger then the connie. I will remind all of you that from the previous games and mods done for star trek no one has ever put such an attribute into the game. No one has ever tried to upload such a canon change. No mod designer wanted such a change from canon.
I do believe CBS does not want such a strange attribute to change canon. From dstahls own lips they take these things serious. The last and most major upgrade to the connie was star trek VI the undiscovered country version.
I for one still feel very strong about not such an attribute being in game. Tos Players will agree such an attribute would not exist in canon and understand The common place of a Tos ship.
The reason the Tos segment is being given "love" is because it is popular to role play and as such is recommended to go to the c-store to role play. I do not see any role play in a T5 connie. It is not apart of any time line or role play function. It is to try and bring an old ship into the future and leave the ship as is. Tos fans will understand the function of that is not star trek and i do belive tos fans will also not want a gimmic but for attribute to make sense.
Your tos connie does not have rear weapons on the secondary hull. Your tos connie only has 6 phase emitters on the saucer section and 2 forward torpedoe tubes which mind you are bigger then the neck itself.
The problem of this T5 connie is that such a ship did not have enough space and power to stand the test of the future. In simple terms such a ship was completely phased out of star trek in tng while its bigger sister (excelsior) was made popular and is way bigger then the connie. I will remind all of you that from the previous games and mods done for star trek no one has ever put such an attribute into the game. No one has ever tried to upload such a canon change. No mod designer wanted such a change from canon.
I do believe CBS does not want such a strange attribute to change canon. From dstahls own lips they take these things serious. The last and most major upgrade to the connie was star trek VI the undiscovered country version.
1. This is a game.
2. This is a game loosely based on Star Trek.
3. This is a game that has never been canon, nor observant of canon.
4. You can shut the door on the barn after the horse runs out, but it won't do you any good.
5. This game is about 1 thing. Money.
6. If a T5 Connie will make Cryptic more money than it would lose from disgruntled players cancelling their subs, then they wil make a T5 Connie.
7. Your opinion, and my opinion, are both meaningless to Cryptic.
I for one still feel very strong about not such an attribute being in game. Tos Players will agree such an attribute would not exist in canon and understand The common place of a Tos ship.
That assumes that most TOS, hell most Trek fans care that much about canon.
The reason the Tos segment is being given "love" is because it is popular to role play and as such is recommended to go to the c-store to role play. I do not see any role play in a T5 connie.
No offense but that is frankly the dumbest idea I have ever heard. People roleplaying TOS are playing the game using TOS stuff how does TOS stuff actually being usable while playing the game TRIBBLE on role playing.
It is not apart of any time line or role play function. It is to try and bring an old ship into the future and leave the ship as is. Tos fans will understand the function of that is not star trek and i do belive tos fans will also not want a gimmic but for attribute to make sense.
It already is a new ship this has been pointed out and pointed out several times, it's just naysayers don't want to admit this as it refutes their one argument that isn't about them.
Your tos connie does not have rear weapons on the secondary hull. Your tos connie only has 6 phase emitters on the saucer section and 2 forward torpedoe tubes which mind you are bigger then the neck itself.
An Aft-phaer bank was use in "In a Mirror Darkly" and yes Enterprise counts and no just becuase fans don't like it doesn't mean anything.
The problem of this T5 connie is that such a ship did not have enough space and power to stand the test of the future. In simple terms such a ship was completely phased out of star trek in tng while its bigger sister (excelsior) was made popular and is way bigger then the connie.
That was becuase the trek owners think we're so dumb that Picard and Kirk both commanding Constitutions that we would be easily consused thus the Stargazer becuase a Constellation-class.
I will remind all of you that from the previous games and mods done for star trek no one has ever put such an attribute into the game. No one has ever tried to upload such a canon change. No mod designer wanted such a change from canon.
1) Mods are a fan thing not something the game people make
2) They were single player games set in one part of the franchise, not an MMO that is trying add things from all parts of the franchise to make everyone happy so they can get the biggest fanbase they can
I do believe CBS does not want such a strange attribute to change canon. From dstahls own lips they take these things serious. The last and most major upgrade to the connie was star trek VI the undiscovered country version.
Unless they think they can get more money from doing it.
It always suprises me when some trek fans think that Paramount and CBS won't make a major change to Star Trek if it will get them more cash.
3. This is a game that has never been canon, nor observant of canon.
4. You can shut the door on the barn after the horse runs out, but it won't do you any good.
5. This game is about 1 thing. Money.
6. If a T5 Connie will make Cryptic more money than it would lose from disgruntled players cancelling their subs, then they wil make a T5 Connie.
7. Your opinion, and my opinion, are both meaningless to Cryptic.
I agree with all 7 points made here. The game is like Star Trek in name only at this point. Might as well include a T5 Connie for all the eff-ups Cryptic has made to established lore.
I agree with all 7 points made here. The game is like Star Trek in name only at this point. Might as well include a T5 Connie for all the eff-ups Cryptic has made to established lore.
Or we can do it my way and never have to worry about T5 anything ever again.
However, that being said, LotD's idea would be the ax that killed the Goose that laid the Golden Egg.
Frankly, I can't see Cryptic adopting it, because their current system (as poor as it is) can generate future profit (as indicated in Jack_Armstrong's statement) because in the current system, Cryptic can give people what they want...but for a price.
A new game mechanic (like LotD's idea) takes money out of Cryptic's pocket, regardless of how awesome we all think it would be, and wish it would be implemented.
You ever known a capitalistic company to be charitable?
However, that being said, LotD's idea would be the ax that killed the Goose that laid the Golden Egg.
Frankly, I can't see Cryptic adopting it, because their current system (as poor as it is) can generate future profit (as indicated in Jack_Armstrong's statement) because in the current system, Cryptic can give people what they want...but for a price.
A new game mechanic (like LotD's idea) takes money out of Cryptic's pocket, regardless of how awesome we all think it would be, and wish it would be implemented.
You ever known a capitalistic company to be charitable?
I don't think Cryptic really wants to go down the road of having to duplicate all the ships and sell the duplicates, which is really the only thing my system would stop. They could still sell new ships in the C-store if they wanted, or even early unlocks for ships. My system would still make it so that you wouldn't have access to the big guns until you leveled up some, so you could easily just sell an early unlock token or something.
A Tier 5 connie is a lot more realistic than a Federation Carrier.
I disagree. the klingon carrier launches BoP these are combat ships with hyper drives and shields, the feds have the peregrine fighters...Where the BoP is a real and regular ship, these are actually fighters (yes they have shields and hyperdrives, but so do runabouts and when do you see them as a stand alone ship, not paired with a larger star ship) and would make sense to be paired with a federation cruiser or "carrier" at best these things would be like a scorpion fighter on steroids.
Federation fighters are warp cabaple, look at TNG premptive strike and ds9 for the marquis. thats a given duhh
There is already a T5 connie in the game. its called the Excelsior T5 Refit as the excelsior took over for the constitution in the early 23rd century. Even kirk new that was going to happen. Reference look at star trek the undiscovered country. skip to end and see what kirk says.
No, thats the EXCELSIOR, not the CONSTITUTION. They may be related, but they are NOT the same. Thats like saying the Galaxy is the same as the Sovereign.
As a recent self-enlightenment, and moment of genius, I have begun really pushing the concept of replica skins, instead of straight up connies, or ports of older ships up to T5, at least for certain era's.
In other words, let people experience the olden days by giving them TMP themed skins for their current ships, instead of asking for the impossible. We already have evidence of mischievous engineers in-universe building straight up replicas, why would it be so hard to see those same engineers taking a galaxy, and fiddling with it to turn it as close to a Connie's hull as possible, taking from that era of engineering as much as possible, with the awesome conclusion of that being a connie-sovereign?
As a recent self-enlightenment, and moment of genius, I have begun really pushing the concept of replica skins, instead of straight up connies, or ports of older ships up to T5, at least for certain era's.
In other words, let people experience the olden days by giving them TMP themed skins for their current ships, instead of asking for the impossible. We already have evidence of mischievous engineers in-universe building straight up replicas, why would it be so hard to see those same engineers taking a galaxy, and fiddling with it to turn it as close to a Connie's hull as possible, taking from that era of engineering as much as possible, with the awesome conclusion of that being a connie-sovereign?
because there is enough junk in the game with no purpose. I would only like to say that to such a request a great many people would agree to a hologram of the replica ships. not a skin but a holographic application like the one sold for latinum at ds9
Comments
People aren't talking about game mechanics when they say they are against the TOSC being T5, they are talking about immersion when they say they don't want TOSC in the game at Tier 5. If it is immersion they are concerned about, that is really out the window in so many ways it can't be listed in one post. For example, Federation on Federation is used so many times as comparative examples to illustrate why it hurts immersion, while those very examples contradict the very purpose of the argument.
Mechanics is definitely not an issue at all. People pay for a game they enjoy paying for, they stop paying when they lose enjoyment, the game suffers and then faulters for everyone. I have seen it happen on nearly 15 separate MMOs over the last 10 years. If someone wants a T5 Connie or a Tier 5 D5 Cruiser it really doesn't matter at all. It really comes down to a ship-skin they enjoy playing.
The fact is, all evidence points to the TOS era being among the most popular among a majority of paying subscribers. Unless you are not noticing the vast amount of attention TOS has garnered from the devs. They, being Cryptic and Atari, don't do that because it won't show them a return on their investment of time, human resources, and negotiations they go through to secure the right to use a particular ship in the game. They do it for quite the opposite reason. Because catering to the various majorities in this game is how they make money.
The way I see it in my humble opinion, it is easier for the devs to make a T1 into a T5, than it is for most people to just let other people enjoy their game in an iconic MMO already devoid of any semblance of immersion.
Bridge out.
I am.
Right now a ship is more than a skin. It is a game mechanic and part of the game's progression and leveling process. I personally do not like that game mechanic and that is why I am working on a proposal to make a better mechanic.
That is speculation and even if true, irrelevant.
I have said over and over again in lots of threads that people all draw their personal line somewhere. That you have a line that has already been crossed so much you no longer care does not mean others do not. And that is excluding the game mechanic issue of having the weakest ships in the strongest tier.
The simple fact is that there is absolutely no reason to move the TOSC. There is no restriction against flying it at any point in the game; it is just much, much harder later on. If there were, then the T5 TOSC people would have a point. That means this is about the strength of the ship relative to other ships, and in Cryptic's system, it's one of the weakest for reasons that have been covered to death.
Moreover, T5 TOSC does not solve the problem. Then you have nothing to use from T2-T4, and then you need a T-everything TOSC. Meanwhile, the people who like other ships (the RC for me) will then want their T-everything ship. Once you do that, there is no tier system anymore, and you might as well have just one ship base with whatever skin you like.
So, in my humble opinion, the TOS people need to either accept the fact that this is not a TOS game and be happy with the fact their stuff is even included at all despite not belonging, or they need to shift their focus towards a new ship system that allows them to get more out of the TOS ship. I choose to assist in the latter because I think a new system is worth it.
I agree with your last paragraph in that you are willing to consider a new system whereby most can get what they want. However, calling what I have to say speculation thereby discounting everything I have said is argumentative at best. They are ship models. Therefore they are all skins. They are a combination of polygons and hardpoints. The rest is semantics and you know it, or you don't.
And by the way, "TOS people?" Really, show some respect if not some reason. TOS is the reason this game exists. I don't mean the game in and of itself, I mean Star Trek as a whole. More than that, the amount of time and effort Cryptic has put into the TOS content of this game is more than luck. It is business pure and simple. There is a huge demand for it. If you can't see that, I feel for you. Well not really.
By the way, I like your entry. It has the most hope I have seen. It's definately better than the Star Trek XII horror. And I don't think the Connie should be end game stuff. Just powerful enough get someone through all the solo content and powerful enough to be of value in a group. We will see one way or another. The devs listen from mt perspective.
They stopped just being ship skins when they started being part of your level progression. If they were just skins, we'd have one base model and you'd pick your skin for the whole game. But they are not, they're classified into three groups and five tiers.
And what I discounted is your speculation that TOS is most popular. It may very well be, but even if it is, it's irrelevant to the discussion at hand.
:rolleyes: Yeah, TOS people, as in, people who want the TOS stuff. That's a short-hand description so that I don't have to type out "people who want more TOS stuff", not an insult.
And who said anything about a lack of demand or luck? I said that it's a game that isn't set in TOS, so the stuff shouldn't even be in it at all. As such, it is already a compromise to add them, and people should accept that compromise instead of trying to have their cake and eat it too.
For example, my favorite ship is the RC. It's T2. I am both surprised and thrilled it is even playable, so I have no reason to complain I can only use it for T2. I accept that the compromise between the game's setting and me getting to play the RC is that I can only use it early in the game.
EDIT:
Thank you.
Yeah, I sped read your post and gleaned the "we should feel lucky" Hey no harm no foul. However, I think you can agree that allowing an upgrade to the Connie to be practically playable at the higher tier content can't hurt. I just think of someone wants it let em have it. Its not game breaking or anything and as far as immersion, to which so many complaints are directed, I can only point out that immersion was a lost cause some time ago. Beyond repair.
Im glad I chose a lifetime sub here, as I will definately get to the see this game develop through a broad range of change and improvements over the years. Some I will like and some I won't.
I do agree. That's why I'm trying to put together a system to make that happen that will eliminate this issue all together. If your ship truly could be outfitted with equipment, managed, and upgraded, there is very little limit to how far you can go.
The reason I think so many people want T5 TOSC is simply because the boundaries are so solid and arbitrary. If you could've done a lot more modifications to the ship from the start, I think more people could accept potentially not using it at end game. It would feel more like you simply got tired of working so hard to squeeze power out of it and chose to move on, rather than got booted at the next tier.
Here's what a standard RC out of the gate might look like. As you can see, it has a forward dual phaser, a forward phaser strip, a forward quantum torp, a rear quantum torp, a standard bridge, and a "gaseous anomaly detector." It hits the power usage exactly at 60% so it will not suffer any ill-effects of power drain, but it will also not have any extra auxiliary to push around. It also has tons of extra space to expand as you upgrade the warp core.
Here is what a noob does with this system. As you can see, he's packed it with phasers and has completely blown by his power availability. He's used up so much it actually sends the bar all the way to the maximum potential output of his warp core. This ship would be utterly useless as those weapons would either have zero effectiveness when firing, have a massive cooldown, and/or both. His shields would crumple like tissue paper, his deflector would do nothing, and his sensors would have almost no range as they all also rely on power usage.
As for the "noob" picture, I can see a huge number of players just cramming weapons in there without thinking about power distribution.
Now thats a nice proposal. Fair and balanced unlike the news. : )
That person will find out real quick it isn't worth it. :-D
The greatest thing about this is that you can get really deep in your customization if you really want to spend the time. Maybe adding one more weapon will put you over the line, but since you're only just over the debuff might be weak enough that having that extra weapon is worth it.
Similarly, maybe you want to leave some space and have the aux power to use instead.
The reason the Tos segment is being given "love" is because it is popular to role play and as such is recommended to go to the c-store to role play. I do not see any role play in a T5 connie. It is not apart of any time line or role play function. It is to try and bring an old ship into the future and leave the ship as is. Tos fans will understand the function of that is not star trek and i do belive tos fans will also not want a gimmic but for attribute to make sense.
Your tos connie does not have rear weapons on the secondary hull. Your tos connie only has 6 phase emitters on the saucer section and 2 forward torpedoe tubes which mind you are bigger then the neck itself.
The problem of this T5 connie is that such a ship did not have enough space and power to stand the test of the future. In simple terms such a ship was completely phased out of star trek in tng while its bigger sister (excelsior) was made popular and is way bigger then the connie. I will remind all of you that from the previous games and mods done for star trek no one has ever put such an attribute into the game. No one has ever tried to upload such a canon change. No mod designer wanted such a change from canon.
I do believe CBS does not want such a strange attribute to change canon. From dstahls own lips they take these things serious. The last and most major upgrade to the connie was star trek VI the undiscovered country version.
1. This is a game.
2. This is a game loosely based on Star Trek.
3. This is a game that has never been canon, nor observant of canon.
4. You can shut the door on the barn after the horse runs out, but it won't do you any good.
5. This game is about 1 thing. Money.
6. If a T5 Connie will make Cryptic more money than it would lose from disgruntled players cancelling their subs, then they wil make a T5 Connie.
7. Your opinion, and my opinion, are both meaningless to Cryptic.
That assumes that most TOS, hell most Trek fans care that much about canon.
No offense but that is frankly the dumbest idea I have ever heard. People roleplaying TOS are playing the game using TOS stuff how does TOS stuff actually being usable while playing the game TRIBBLE on role playing.
It already is a new ship this has been pointed out and pointed out several times, it's just naysayers don't want to admit this as it refutes their one argument that isn't about them.
An Aft-phaer bank was use in "In a Mirror Darkly" and yes Enterprise counts and no just becuase fans don't like it doesn't mean anything.
That was becuase the trek owners think we're so dumb that Picard and Kirk both commanding Constitutions that we would be easily consused thus the Stargazer becuase a Constellation-class.
1) Mods are a fan thing not something the game people make
2) They were single player games set in one part of the franchise, not an MMO that is trying add things from all parts of the franchise to make everyone happy so they can get the biggest fanbase they can
Unless they think they can get more money from doing it.
It always suprises me when some trek fans think that Paramount and CBS won't make a major change to Star Trek if it will get them more cash.
I agree with all 7 points made here. The game is like Star Trek in name only at this point. Might as well include a T5 Connie for all the eff-ups Cryptic has made to established lore.
Or we can do it my way and never have to worry about T5 anything ever again.
I prefer your solution over the tier system.
As do I.
However, that being said, LotD's idea would be the ax that killed the Goose that laid the Golden Egg.
Frankly, I can't see Cryptic adopting it, because their current system (as poor as it is) can generate future profit (as indicated in Jack_Armstrong's statement) because in the current system, Cryptic can give people what they want...but for a price.
A new game mechanic (like LotD's idea) takes money out of Cryptic's pocket, regardless of how awesome we all think it would be, and wish it would be implemented.
You ever known a capitalistic company to be charitable?
I don't think Cryptic really wants to go down the road of having to duplicate all the ships and sell the duplicates, which is really the only thing my system would stop. They could still sell new ships in the C-store if they wanted, or even early unlocks for ships. My system would still make it so that you wouldn't have access to the big guns until you leveled up some, so you could easily just sell an early unlock token or something.
I disagree. the klingon carrier launches BoP these are combat ships with hyper drives and shields, the feds have the peregrine fighters...Where the BoP is a real and regular ship, these are actually fighters (yes they have shields and hyperdrives, but so do runabouts and when do you see them as a stand alone ship, not paired with a larger star ship) and would make sense to be paired with a federation cruiser or "carrier" at best these things would be like a scorpion fighter on steroids.
http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Federation_attack_fighter
how do you know? did one of the pilots tell you?
logic fail.
Carriers can use bird of prey.
Last I checked they have cloak and should be able to use hyper drives.
That would be really nice.
THoust doth FAIL TREK LORE FOREVER! Warp! WARP DRIVES FOR FETH'S SAKE!:mad:
There is already a T5 connie in the game. its called the Excelsior T5 Refit as the excelsior took over for the constitution in the early 23rd century. Even kirk new that was going to happen. Reference look at star trek the undiscovered country. skip to end and see what kirk says.
In other words, let people experience the olden days by giving them TMP themed skins for their current ships, instead of asking for the impossible. We already have evidence of mischievous engineers in-universe building straight up replicas, why would it be so hard to see those same engineers taking a galaxy, and fiddling with it to turn it as close to a Connie's hull as possible, taking from that era of engineering as much as possible, with the awesome conclusion of that being a connie-sovereign?
because there is enough junk in the game with no purpose. I would only like to say that to such a request a great many people would agree to a hologram of the replica ships. not a skin but a holographic application like the one sold for latinum at ds9