I run the B'Tran, Deferi, Eta Eridani circuit on at least 2 of my characters each night and I'm done in a little over 3 hours. It should not take anyone more than that. These missions just are not that long.
He/she has a point. Pretty much. it would take one night and about 3+ hours to grind out enough emblems to convert to Marks of Honor for a Cov X Cap3.
I've spent weeks searching for hard to find items in old games like GemStone or Dragon Realms. I literally spent months camping this really old cyclops in an early MMO so I could take something only he would drop, and trade it in for a pair of boots that would let me run fast. I've also spent inordinately large amounts of time going on raids so I could get the best gear available for my class, just to have someone who showed up for the raid the first time ever win the roll for an item I still needed.
I do not have a problem with the "500 emblems" issue.
I do have a problem that you can not get emblems in more places. There should be at least one emblem awarded for doing any of the weekly episodes. Same if you replay any STO mission. There probably should be emblems for doing the DSE's at the higher levels as well. It is not the cost but the lack of variety in getting there.
I started accumulating emblems but up until the Defari Daylies there was only 4 per day that I would get as I do not like PvP. Yes, that is my choice. But I got so burned out by running B'tran VA missions that I finally just stopped. The new Defari missions helped but it still is a bit boring to do the same missions over and over and over and over.
Bottom line, add more chances and choices to get the emblems...500 cost is not the problem. And Cryptic, if you want to cap the number per day at 15, then do that. Just give us variation.
There are a lot of valid points brought up here. I don't think that comparing STO to other MMOs is one of them.
Many people in STO are completely new to MMOs. They have no way to compare STO's grind to other games. Sure, it may be "better" than old school punch-me-in-the-face MMOs or MUDs or whatever, but that is completely irrelevant for people who have STO as their first experience. The bottom line is that grinding 500 emblems is boring, repetitive, and not fun. Not a very goo dintroduction to MMOs.
What you fail to consider is most of the paying playerbase is casual and I do not consider the hour estimates I gave above anything other than power...
Perish the thought if you can only play on the weekends!!!!
Exactly! Cryptic has stated that a VERY large portion of the player base is not even above the Captain rank! If they're not even at Admiral yet, how the heck will they EVER get these ships if they don't want to pay? People have been talking in this thread about "only a few hours a day" or whatever. If someone doesn't want to pay, but doesn't have that kind of time, what are they supposed to do? And what if they want to spend their precious STO time doing something other than grinding for emblems?
Exactly! Cryptic has stated that a VERY large portion of the player base is not even above the Captain rank! If they're not even at Admiral yet, how the heck will they EVER get these ships if they don't want to pay? People have been talking in this thread about "only a few hours a day" or whatever. If someone doesn't want to pay, but doesn't have that kind of time, what are they supposed to do? And what if they want to spend their precious STO time doing something other than grinding for emblems?
I'm going to butt in here.
I play STO becuase I want to, not becuase I can. I play on a Sunday (for PvP with my American friends) and also about an hour on a weekday, should I choose. And normally that's doing normal missions or having a tinker on the Foundry (E1 - "Where Men Dare To Tread" and E2'beta' - "Undying Intervention") .
The rest of the time, I am either on the STO Forums, modelling railways, doing DIY/Gardening with my dad, playing BLUR on the xbox, or playing COD4:MW multiplayer. In my free time.
The rest of my life is taken up with sleeping and work.
I think what we're missing here is that it is YOUR personal choice to play the game in the long run. You CAN make 500 emblms without really noticing if you play on a regular basis. This doesnt mean play at all hours....a couple a day or every other day will do the trick.
OR
You can spend $20. to buy it out of the game store so its there when you want it.
Either way this shouldnt be a deciding factor on why you play.......MGDawson brings a very very valid point.
You either want it or you dont...and if you played MMO's before this shouldnt be anything new.
Nor should it really be anything to get into a twist over. Like anything in life.....you can have everything you want......you just have to work at it and have patience.
I play STO becuase I want to, not becuase I can. I play on a Sunday (for PvP with my American friends) and also about an hour on a weekday, should I choose. And normally that's doing normal missions or having a tinker on the Foundry (E1 - "Where Men Dare To Tread" and E2'beta' - "Undying Intervention") .
The rest of the time, I am either on the STO Forums, modelling railways, doing DIY/Gardening with my dad, playing BLUR on the xbox, or playing COD4:MW multiplayer. In my free time.
The rest of my life is taken up with sleeping and work.
See, this illustrates exactly the type of player that many posters in this thread are ignoring. For people to say "you can get all X emblems from the daily in just a few hours" completely leaves someone like MGDawson behind. I hope you weigh in on the actual cost of 500 emblems, MGDawson, because right now it looks like you are the perfect example of why it is too steep. Sure, you'll get there eventually, but not in any sort of timely fashion.
See, this illustrates exactly the type of player that many posters in this thread are ignoring. For people to say "you can get all X emblems from the daily in just a few hours" completely leaves someone like MGDawson behind. I hope you weigh in on the actual cost of 500 emblems, MGDawson, because right now it looks like you are the perfect example of why it is too steep. Sure, you'll get there eventually, but not in any sort of timely fashion.
The flipside is that if you trivialize the cost in Emblems to say 50 or 100, then you are making it far too easy for those who play more than the "once a week" types.
You will also have people complain about the Emblem cost regardless of how many Emblems it is. What Stormshade posted was spot on and fair. You can spend $20 or spend the equivilant time to earn the Emblems in game.
The alternative flipside is to give every "@_____" account a universal bank of credits or emblems (though not items) and then whever a person has got enough, through whatever character, they can then use those up.
Although maybe Cryptic could give us Lifer's a free item every 3 months and we'd play ball.
You can spend $20 or spend the equivilant time to earn the Emblems in game.
I'm not sure it is equivalent... I guess if it takes around a month to get a ship with emblems, as far as an MMO is concerned it is reasonably equivalent, since a month's subscription is just about the cost of a ship. But in real world money? I don't know what the minimum wage is for most people playing, but even if it's something like $5 (US), that's just 3 hours to earn a ship, not 50 or whatever the math is for emblems.
The problem is that people say "if you don't want to pay, just grind the emblems." Some people don't want to do that either. There's already one poster in this thread so bored with grinding he doesn't want to play, period. When the two options to get a ship are paying money, or being bored to tears, that's a problem. I'm not saying we shouldn't have to work for a ship - I'm saying it shouldn't be such a terrible grind that people don't even want to play the game. Yes, make us earn it, but let us earn it without feeling like we're hitting our heads against the wall.
The flipside is that if you trivialize the cost in Emblems to say 50 or 100, then you are making it far too easy for those who play more than the "once a week" types.
You will also have people complain about the Emblem cost regardless of how many Emblems it is. What Stormshade posted was spot on and fair. You can spend $20 or spend the equivilant time to earn the Emblems in game.
Most MMO players complain about the grind, but damn that's what makes the cool stuff cool. If the grind doesn't fit with your play style, maybe tossing some money in the C-store works.
If anyone is a totally new player to the scene you could be at max level looking for the one mob that dropped something for months, not to add that it was no trade so if some idiot "rolled" higher on it you lost it and that stopped you from playing in the big league of the game until it came up again. Or you die somewhere that you corpse could not be dragged somewhere safe and lost a level . So there you lost active time gaining what you needed to be viable and/or elite in that tiers instances/pvp.
30 hours of guaranteed play time for top tier is priceless.
And if you are still whining about how T6 ships, if they ever come out, shouldn't make your T5.5 or T5, or T1 Connie obsolete, it's called a business model. STO, Atari, heck even CBS probably need to see that they'll make a dime off the increase. It has to come from new account sales (not really relevant at this point), re-subscriptions, or sales through the C-store.
And some people might not have said it, but the extra money they made off of pregame Lifetime memberships only has what 5 months left? The companies are going to make money where they can.
I don't want to spend the time to grind the emblems: It's boring, it's a chore, it's no /fun/ (and contrary to the opinion of some, I play games to /have fun/, not 'work for things I want', I do that at... work)... but I don't want to pay the overpriced 'option' available on the C-store, either. Neither option is palatable. And you know what? I haven't. I've paid for 'fluff', uniforms, one bridge pack, but ships? Never. But sooner or later I'll have to, because that seems like the only way new ships are going to be made available, and God knows I really want me a Vesta.
Overpriced? Seriously? How much is the most expensive ship in game? $25? That's overpriced?
I spend more than $25 when I go to the theater to see a movie, and the movie usually lasts less than 2 hours. I spend more than $25 when I go out to dinner, and 4 to 6 hours later I'm hungry again. But if you purchase one of those ships from the C-Store you'll get to have it on all of your characters for however many years you decide to play Star Trek Online.
So yes, you know what? I will use the C-store, just like Cryptic wants, and they'll get their money from me, like a good business ought - but I'm going to resent it, because one way or another these business practices are shady - as business practices that concentrate solely on the profit potential /often are/. I do not believe a company has no ethical responsibilities other than pleasing its shareholders, and I do not believe that making money is an intrinsically good thing in and of itself.
I'm going to have to ask you to name each specific shady practice that Cryptic/Atari is engaged in. I'm not saying that I disagree with you, I'm saying that I'd like you to explain your vague claim to me.
So I'll pay, and I'll resent it, and I'll dislike Cryptic just a little more and be a little less inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt when they make a dubious decision - and I won't be the only one, and God knows I've been pretty mild on this subject until the new Prometheus was handled as such a blatant cash-grab - and /that/ is /not/ conducive to Cryptic's financial health in the long term.
Blatant cash-grab? Can you please explain this term to me? What's the difference between a blatant cash-grab and a subtle one? What's the difference between a cash-grab and simply offering an item or service for sale at a price that the customer is willing to pay?
And what specifically about making cash is not conductive to Cryptic/Atari's financial health?
The problem is that people say "if you don't want to pay, just grind the emblems." Some people don't want to do that either. There's already one poster in this thread so bored with grinding he doesn't want to play, period. When the two options to get a ship are paying money, or being bored to tears, that's a problem. I'm not saying we shouldn't have to work for a ship - I'm saying it shouldn't be such a terrible grind that people don't even want to play the game. Yes, make us earn it, but let us earn it without feeling like we're hitting our heads against the wall.
And that's what I'm talking about. Either put up the in game time to get something, or put up the real money to buy it..... it's not that big of a deal in the long run. It's not like the STO guys even design the content to playable at end game at this point, so unless T6 comes out sometime mid 2012 you'll have plenty of time anyways.
Not if the grind is boring and makes them not want to play the game entirely.
If the grind was made a bit more enjoyable, that'd be fine. But it's not. Achieving a goal in a game should be reasonably fun. A little bit of grinding is fine, but not so much so that people hate it and stop playing.
Sure, it may be better than other games' grinds, but this is not those games. Don't compare the STO grind to waiting months for some mythical creature to drop whatever item of clothing. Just because STO's grind is better doesn't mean it's good. Hopefully the currency streamline that is apparently planned will fix some of this - hopefully the exploration revamp will fix it even more.
Since the Featured Series are about to go in a few months of hiatus, any chance that we will see some ships get added for free? Since the team won't have the extra load of the series, you won't have to work "Extra Hard" on ship assets. I love with the featured Series, but I will not be caught grinding for 4 months without any fun new content to do (Maybe if the Foundry goes live...)
At this point, and as I defended on another thread, the constant "every ship must go to the C-Store" is a bit upsetting. And 500 emblems of grind is too much.
Although maybe Cryptic could give us Lifer's a free item every 3 months and we'd play ball.
Heck I'd be happy with them dropping 1 BO slot and 1 Ship Slot the way they're giving things away. Or maybe even a usable/functional Captain's Table (which everyone gets with account age).
And for Heaven's Sake, take the Table out of Sol/Q'nos space and at least put it in Sector.
Ehm its not only "FLUFF" anymore XP boost, Ships like Galaxy X or the Exelcior or even the siege one !! thats just a small portion of the stuff that gives player an edge in game! so not needed YES true in a small sent, gives you an Boost/advantage YES it does..
This has been my argument since before the C-store went live. The devs promised the community that no game changing items would ever be in it. As we all can see, that is no longer the case. The C-store was implemented in a pay to play game in such a way as to make it a comfortable feature that just added fluff. Now it has been changed into a store that is becoming a much needed feature.
The C-store is now our way of getting most new content, and people are forgetting that they actually pay a MONTHLY fee for the game. I, for one, would rather wait 18mos to 2 years for a expansion and save a few hundred dollars. Most players that use the store forget that they cumulatively pay tens of times what a 50 dollar expansion would cost.
The bottom line is the C-store is becoming the way that Cryptic and Atari is making money, which alludes me seeing that they have a descent player base that pays a monthly fee.
As far as emblem costs go, the amount of emblems needed should be about twice what the actual dollar amount would be. Lets say it cost 25 dollars to buy a pack of points. That is roughly 2 hours of someones work day(doing some averaging here, don't mean to offend). I would contend that you should be able to farm the amount of emblems in roughly 4-5 hours of game time.
But as others have pointed out, the high cost is to dissuade you from actually grinding emblems and just fork over cash. The only way this would ever happen is if people refused to use the C-Store at all, and its just not gonna happen, people want fast and easy and that's what the C-store is all about
At this point, and as I defended on another thread, the constant "every ship must go to the C-Store" is a bit upsetting. And 500 emblems of grind is too much.
It's only a bit too much if you are trying to get the emblems on one toon. If you played all 3 classes up from the beginning, and still planned on taking them in the same direction on the next tier, then really your T6 will probably be nothing. The first thing they will release will be available for one ship token when you make rank. Which is the same they did for the retrofits for T5.
Not if the grind is boring and makes them not want to play the game entirely.
Defining the method of obtaining Emblems in STO as "boring" does not apply to everyone. I do the B'Tran, Deferi and Eta Eridani missions every day. I do not find them boring.
Some will consider 500 Emblems to be "too much" and leave. There are those who will feel otherwise and stick with the game and be flying around in their ship that they worked for, while others will continue whining about not having the same thing.
If you want the free item, do what is required to get it.
To support the statements above, see Jedi and Mandalorian armor in SWG(pre NGE of course).
But that is what made end game fun for most of the original MMO player base. Working hard, spending time raiding and the anticipation of a class item dropping. Micro transaction stores are ruining that aspect of raiding/end game. Especially when the only alternative is to spend twice the monthly fee you already pay to play the game.
It is understandable that there are game mechanics that must be addressed, for an MMO, a certain level of grind will be necessary becasue not every mission can be a featured episode. Can we have a revision of the whole thing an either adjust the prices (Because they are absurd) so that the grind is lessened, or keep the price and increase our ways of getting the emblems and marks.
I suggested grinding for schematics, but actully crafting the ships to add variety. Doing the dailies to level a toon is a great little break of the missions and are kinda nice, however, if the dailies is the only thing I'm doing at max level it gets frustrating. I don't always group for the STF, and they take a nice chunk of time anyway, unfeasible for the casual player.
Like someone said earlier, just because the grind is better, doesn't mean it is good.
I disagree. 500 emblems is not steep and is achievable within one month. This ensures Cryptic gets a month long subscription versus the worse case scenario of an inactive account for the item they have spent money and time developing.
Not unfair at all.
Not achievable for people who have jobs and cannot dictate 4-5 hours of gameplay a day to the game. But hey, as I said before it is a smooth marketing tactic which targets those people directly.
If I understand the C-Store/Emblems thing correctly, the 500 emblems unlock is only per-character and not per-account like the C-store. If it was account-wide, 500 emblems would be an acceptable offer imo, but as a per-character unlock it drives everyone with more than one character (or a life outside of STO PvE) to the C-store.
Not achievable for people who have jobs and cannot dictate 4-5 hours of gameplay a day to the game.
I work a full time job and have a wife at home, yet I can find the time to crank out at least 10 Emblems in a day.
If you can only devote 1 hour a week to playtime, then you should not be expecting to earn the 500 Emblems anytime soon. You are being unrealistic if you want to devote an hour or two playing to earn a $25 ship.
Is 500 emblems steep or not...it really depends of the type of player.
i think you got to the bottom of the problem..The main issue is about the limited and repetitive content to get these emblems...if there was more diverse and enjoyable way to get these emblems it might not be a such a chore for most players.
QFE
Look I like to do the dalies and am happy the Deferi patrols somewhat rotate.
I am a little meh on swimming in a fishbowl, but I do like the space encounters (when you can actually get one as it seems 75% of the encounters are ground - for those I just get the anomalies and warp out).
I am little upset that there are no dalies associated with Cloaked Intentions.
It gets back to the balance point and content point. It is a grind because there are limited avenues to obtain emblems and yes they are highly reptative.
Defining the method of obtaining Emblems in STO as "boring" does not apply to everyone. I do the B'Tran, Deferi and Eta Eridani missions every day. I do not find them boring.
Some will consider 500 Emblems to be "too much" and leave. There are those who will feel otherwise and stick with the game and be flying around in their ship that they worked for, while others will continue whining about not having the same thing.
If you want the free item, do what is required to get it.
This I just don't get. (Nothing personal). Dailies are the definition of boring to me. Doing the same handful of missions day in and day out for the scraps a game maker throws you just is not fun for me. Or was that the definition of insanity? Doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result.
I usually quit a game shortly after I hit the level cap for just this reason, lack of anything to do at max level except raid (and the stf's here are broken), PvP (I'd like a war please, not dueling in an Arena. I expected more from a Trek game than pvp in a box. If I want arena duels I'll play WoW.) and dailies and I just really hate dailies, hate the whole concept. I'm so sick of the Deferi missions that I'm rooting for the Breen at this point.
Vice Admiral B'Tran yields 4 Emblems and can be done in a few minutes (just take the "scan 5" missions). You can also run the regular B'Tran exploration mission (doing the same 5 scan) and convert the Marks of Exploration to Emblems. Last I checked, it was a 1 to 1 ratio, so you would earn another 5 Emblems there.
Aiding the Deferi dailies yields 5 emblems and can be completed in well under an hour.
Eta Eridani yields anywhere from 1 to 6 Emblems.
Most all Fleet Actions can be completed in under an hour, and those each yield 3.
Not including Fleet Actions, a player can earn those 15+ Emblems doing the B'Tran, Deferi and Eta Eridani missions in about 2 hours per day.
This one is just too good to pass up...
I have done plenty of exploration - yes you can do the "Recetracks" or "Relifs" but the chances of getting those two are much lower than a ground missio or space mission so you will be spending plenty of time in load screens. At best if you get the rolls a full B'tran takes about an hour and half with most of the time in load screens. So we will go 1.5hrs.
Aid the Deferi - to do all four missions if you get them and start from botton up takes about an hour. So add 1 hr. We are not at the time I can spend in game per day and I have 9 emblems.
Eta Erandi - these are failry quick each take about 15 minutes with travel and load time and maybe you get to do all four that day so what 6 emblems. We sit at 3.5 hrs.
Fleet Actions and PvP - give both of these about an hour for another 6 emblems and we are at 4.5 hrs.
So where am I off and what is your secret to make these any faster?
I do these routinely - Eta Erandi, Deferi, B'tran, and Fleet actions in that order because I have found it minimised the travel time.
Comments
He/she has a point. Pretty much. it would take one night and about 3+ hours to grind out enough emblems to convert to Marks of Honor for a Cov X Cap3.
Hmm EQ :P
10/char
I do have a problem that you can not get emblems in more places. There should be at least one emblem awarded for doing any of the weekly episodes. Same if you replay any STO mission. There probably should be emblems for doing the DSE's at the higher levels as well. It is not the cost but the lack of variety in getting there.
I started accumulating emblems but up until the Defari Daylies there was only 4 per day that I would get as I do not like PvP. Yes, that is my choice. But I got so burned out by running B'tran VA missions that I finally just stopped. The new Defari missions helped but it still is a bit boring to do the same missions over and over and over and over.
Bottom line, add more chances and choices to get the emblems...500 cost is not the problem. And Cryptic, if you want to cap the number per day at 15, then do that. Just give us variation.
Many people in STO are completely new to MMOs. They have no way to compare STO's grind to other games. Sure, it may be "better" than old school punch-me-in-the-face MMOs or MUDs or whatever, but that is completely irrelevant for people who have STO as their first experience. The bottom line is that grinding 500 emblems is boring, repetitive, and not fun. Not a very goo dintroduction to MMOs.
Exactly! Cryptic has stated that a VERY large portion of the player base is not even above the Captain rank! If they're not even at Admiral yet, how the heck will they EVER get these ships if they don't want to pay? People have been talking in this thread about "only a few hours a day" or whatever. If someone doesn't want to pay, but doesn't have that kind of time, what are they supposed to do? And what if they want to spend their precious STO time doing something other than grinding for emblems?
I'm going to butt in here.
I play STO becuase I want to, not becuase I can. I play on a Sunday (for PvP with my American friends) and also about an hour on a weekday, should I choose. And normally that's doing normal missions or having a tinker on the Foundry (E1 - "Where Men Dare To Tread" and E2'beta' - "Undying Intervention") .
The rest of the time, I am either on the STO Forums, modelling railways, doing DIY/Gardening with my dad, playing BLUR on the xbox, or playing COD4:MW multiplayer. In my free time.
The rest of my life is taken up with sleeping and work.
OR
You can spend $20. to buy it out of the game store so its there when you want it.
Either way this shouldnt be a deciding factor on why you play.......MGDawson brings a very very valid point.
You either want it or you dont...and if you played MMO's before this shouldnt be anything new.
Nor should it really be anything to get into a twist over. Like anything in life.....you can have everything you want......you just have to work at it and have patience.
See, this illustrates exactly the type of player that many posters in this thread are ignoring. For people to say "you can get all X emblems from the daily in just a few hours" completely leaves someone like MGDawson behind. I hope you weigh in on the actual cost of 500 emblems, MGDawson, because right now it looks like you are the perfect example of why it is too steep. Sure, you'll get there eventually, but not in any sort of timely fashion.
The flipside is that if you trivialize the cost in Emblems to say 50 or 100, then you are making it far too easy for those who play more than the "once a week" types.
You will also have people complain about the Emblem cost regardless of how many Emblems it is. What Stormshade posted was spot on and fair. You can spend $20 or spend the equivilant time to earn the Emblems in game.
Although maybe Cryptic could give us Lifer's a free item every 3 months and we'd play ball.
I'm not sure it is equivalent... I guess if it takes around a month to get a ship with emblems, as far as an MMO is concerned it is reasonably equivalent, since a month's subscription is just about the cost of a ship. But in real world money? I don't know what the minimum wage is for most people playing, but even if it's something like $5 (US), that's just 3 hours to earn a ship, not 50 or whatever the math is for emblems.
The problem is that people say "if you don't want to pay, just grind the emblems." Some people don't want to do that either. There's already one poster in this thread so bored with grinding he doesn't want to play, period. When the two options to get a ship are paying money, or being bored to tears, that's a problem. I'm not saying we shouldn't have to work for a ship - I'm saying it shouldn't be such a terrible grind that people don't even want to play the game. Yes, make us earn it, but let us earn it without feeling like we're hitting our heads against the wall.
Then those people are being unreasonable IMO.
Most MMO players complain about the grind, but damn that's what makes the cool stuff cool. If the grind doesn't fit with your play style, maybe tossing some money in the C-store works.
If anyone is a totally new player to the scene you could be at max level looking for the one mob that dropped something for months, not to add that it was no trade so if some idiot "rolled" higher on it you lost it and that stopped you from playing in the big league of the game until it came up again. Or you die somewhere that you corpse could not be dragged somewhere safe and lost a level . So there you lost active time gaining what you needed to be viable and/or elite in that tiers instances/pvp.
30 hours of guaranteed play time for top tier is priceless.
And if you are still whining about how T6 ships, if they ever come out, shouldn't make your T5.5 or T5, or T1 Connie obsolete, it's called a business model. STO, Atari, heck even CBS probably need to see that they'll make a dime off the increase. It has to come from new account sales (not really relevant at this point), re-subscriptions, or sales through the C-store.
And some people might not have said it, but the extra money they made off of pregame Lifetime memberships only has what 5 months left? The companies are going to make money where they can.
I spend more than $25 when I go to the theater to see a movie, and the movie usually lasts less than 2 hours. I spend more than $25 when I go out to dinner, and 4 to 6 hours later I'm hungry again. But if you purchase one of those ships from the C-Store you'll get to have it on all of your characters for however many years you decide to play Star Trek Online.
I'm going to have to ask you to name each specific shady practice that Cryptic/Atari is engaged in. I'm not saying that I disagree with you, I'm saying that I'd like you to explain your vague claim to me.
Blatant cash-grab? Can you please explain this term to me? What's the difference between a blatant cash-grab and a subtle one? What's the difference between a cash-grab and simply offering an item or service for sale at a price that the customer is willing to pay?
And what specifically about making cash is not conductive to Cryptic/Atari's financial health?
And that's what I'm talking about. Either put up the in game time to get something, or put up the real money to buy it..... it's not that big of a deal in the long run. It's not like the STO guys even design the content to playable at end game at this point, so unless T6 comes out sometime mid 2012 you'll have plenty of time anyways.
Not if the grind is boring and makes them not want to play the game entirely.
If the grind was made a bit more enjoyable, that'd be fine. But it's not. Achieving a goal in a game should be reasonably fun. A little bit of grinding is fine, but not so much so that people hate it and stop playing.
Sure, it may be better than other games' grinds, but this is not those games. Don't compare the STO grind to waiting months for some mythical creature to drop whatever item of clothing. Just because STO's grind is better doesn't mean it's good. Hopefully the currency streamline that is apparently planned will fix some of this - hopefully the exploration revamp will fix it even more.
At this point, and as I defended on another thread, the constant "every ship must go to the C-Store" is a bit upsetting. And 500 emblems of grind is too much.
Heck I'd be happy with them dropping 1 BO slot and 1 Ship Slot the way they're giving things away. Or maybe even a usable/functional Captain's Table (which everyone gets with account age).
And for Heaven's Sake, take the Table out of Sol/Q'nos space and at least put it in Sector.
This has been my argument since before the C-store went live. The devs promised the community that no game changing items would ever be in it. As we all can see, that is no longer the case. The C-store was implemented in a pay to play game in such a way as to make it a comfortable feature that just added fluff. Now it has been changed into a store that is becoming a much needed feature.
The C-store is now our way of getting most new content, and people are forgetting that they actually pay a MONTHLY fee for the game. I, for one, would rather wait 18mos to 2 years for a expansion and save a few hundred dollars. Most players that use the store forget that they cumulatively pay tens of times what a 50 dollar expansion would cost.
The bottom line is the C-store is becoming the way that Cryptic and Atari is making money, which alludes me seeing that they have a descent player base that pays a monthly fee.
As far as emblem costs go, the amount of emblems needed should be about twice what the actual dollar amount would be. Lets say it cost 25 dollars to buy a pack of points. That is roughly 2 hours of someones work day(doing some averaging here, don't mean to offend). I would contend that you should be able to farm the amount of emblems in roughly 4-5 hours of game time.
But as others have pointed out, the high cost is to dissuade you from actually grinding emblems and just fork over cash. The only way this would ever happen is if people refused to use the C-Store at all, and its just not gonna happen, people want fast and easy and that's what the C-store is all about
It's only a bit too much if you are trying to get the emblems on one toon. If you played all 3 classes up from the beginning, and still planned on taking them in the same direction on the next tier, then really your T6 will probably be nothing. The first thing they will release will be available for one ship token when you make rank. Which is the same they did for the retrofits for T5.
Defining the method of obtaining Emblems in STO as "boring" does not apply to everyone. I do the B'Tran, Deferi and Eta Eridani missions every day. I do not find them boring.
Some will consider 500 Emblems to be "too much" and leave. There are those who will feel otherwise and stick with the game and be flying around in their ship that they worked for, while others will continue whining about not having the same thing.
If you want the free item, do what is required to get it.
But that is what made end game fun for most of the original MMO player base. Working hard, spending time raiding and the anticipation of a class item dropping. Micro transaction stores are ruining that aspect of raiding/end game. Especially when the only alternative is to spend twice the monthly fee you already pay to play the game.
I suggested grinding for schematics, but actully crafting the ships to add variety. Doing the dailies to level a toon is a great little break of the missions and are kinda nice, however, if the dailies is the only thing I'm doing at max level it gets frustrating. I don't always group for the STF, and they take a nice chunk of time anyway, unfeasible for the casual player.
Like someone said earlier, just because the grind is better, doesn't mean it is good.
Not achievable for people who have jobs and cannot dictate 4-5 hours of gameplay a day to the game. But hey, as I said before it is a smooth marketing tactic which targets those people directly.
I work a full time job and have a wife at home, yet I can find the time to crank out at least 10 Emblems in a day.
If you can only devote 1 hour a week to playtime, then you should not be expecting to earn the 500 Emblems anytime soon. You are being unrealistic if you want to devote an hour or two playing to earn a $25 ship.
QFE
Look I like to do the dalies and am happy the Deferi patrols somewhat rotate.
I am a little meh on swimming in a fishbowl, but I do like the space encounters (when you can actually get one as it seems 75% of the encounters are ground - for those I just get the anomalies and warp out).
I am little upset that there are no dalies associated with Cloaked Intentions.
It gets back to the balance point and content point. It is a grind because there are limited avenues to obtain emblems and yes they are highly reptative.
There is grinding and then there is GRINDING. The later being a monotony of highly reptative actions that lead to resentment and displeasure.
This I just don't get. (Nothing personal). Dailies are the definition of boring to me. Doing the same handful of missions day in and day out for the scraps a game maker throws you just is not fun for me. Or was that the definition of insanity? Doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result.
I usually quit a game shortly after I hit the level cap for just this reason, lack of anything to do at max level except raid (and the stf's here are broken), PvP (I'd like a war please, not dueling in an Arena. I expected more from a Trek game than pvp in a box. If I want arena duels I'll play WoW.) and dailies and I just really hate dailies, hate the whole concept. I'm so sick of the Deferi missions that I'm rooting for the Breen at this point.
This one is just too good to pass up...
I have done plenty of exploration - yes you can do the "Recetracks" or "Relifs" but the chances of getting those two are much lower than a ground missio or space mission so you will be spending plenty of time in load screens. At best if you get the rolls a full B'tran takes about an hour and half with most of the time in load screens. So we will go 1.5hrs.
Aid the Deferi - to do all four missions if you get them and start from botton up takes about an hour. So add 1 hr. We are not at the time I can spend in game per day and I have 9 emblems.
Eta Erandi - these are failry quick each take about 15 minutes with travel and load time and maybe you get to do all four that day so what 6 emblems. We sit at 3.5 hrs.
Fleet Actions and PvP - give both of these about an hour for another 6 emblems and we are at 4.5 hrs.
So where am I off and what is your secret to make these any faster?
I do these routinely - Eta Erandi, Deferi, B'tran, and Fleet actions in that order because I have found it minimised the travel time.
Sorry if I can complete content faster than you.