Remove Purify Proc: Y/N. We had it coming!

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  • PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver
    PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,507 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    PotatoHead remembers when people said that "casters are pvp classes, if you want to farm make a melee". PotatoHead now says the same to melees, make a casterb:cute
    you only purge once #yopo
  • unstop77
    unstop77 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Should nerf sin class : OP in PVP and PVE
  • bluestuffzzz
    bluestuffzzz Posts: 627 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    unstop77 wrote: »
    Should nerf sin class : OP in PVP and PVE

    Irrelevant.
    I host an Ecatomb mirror here: ecatomb.gdevtalk.net
    I've been actively playing since late 2008.
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  • _dblazen_ - Dreamweaver
    _dblazen_ - Dreamweaver Posts: 566 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    unstop77 wrote: »
    Should nerf sin class : OP in PVP and PVE

    b:laugh I was waiting for this one post to come up. Now I can stop looking at this thread in peace.
  • Crazybladema - Harshlands
    Crazybladema - Harshlands Posts: 425 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Tsyn - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Hello,

    After a lot of discussion, I think it would be interesting to see what the community thinks about removing/modifying purify proc. Hopefully we will not see a 50/50 distribution of votes when this poll is finished (as that would just mean Melees would be voting against Purify, and Arcanes for it).

    The following is a list of common yes/no's to the current Purify Proc issue.

    Yes to Purify:(Note: This list mostly applies to the casters themselves)

    -Gives casters survivability that they previously may have lacked
    -Gives casters greater mobility (as opposed to melee character speed buffs)
    -Allows for "lucky saves"
    -Destroys stunlocks that require damage
    -Anti APS users
    -20v1 Adroit Style in NW

    No to Purify:

    -Gives casters survivability that only HAs are supposed to have at equal gears
    -Gives casters greater mobility that vastly outperforms melee speed buffs
    -Allows for "lucky saves" even if the player using Purify is unskilled
    -Destroys stunlocks that require damage
    -20v1 Adroit Style in NW is OP
    -Vastly outperforms other weapon effects, which require that the user attacks (as opposed to Purify's "being attacked" requirement) e.g. :Archer Purge/GoF are powerful but "ride" on attacks - Purify proc does not require the caster to do anything.

    There are, of course, more reasons, but personally I think they're all variations of what I have listed.

    My opinion:

    Personally, I rather like the challenge of Purify Proc while 1v1sing S3 casters. The random breaking of my skill sequences forces me to think of counters and plan Bs. While some people may not find this enjoyable, I do.

    However, the problem of Purify rears its ugly head in group PvP, where I completely think that it is overpowered. Defeating 20 people vs 1 is absolutely ridiculous. Even the APS users of the past, when they were considered overpowered, could not singlehandly take on two entire squads. (If they could, they were either killing level 50s or they were GMs.)

    My solution is a bit strange. Since I want to keep Purify proc and also prevent it from being overpowered in the group PvP field, I would like to see the following changes:

    a. Purify Proc % remains the same as other proc rates.
    b. Purify anti-stun remains the same as current condition.
    c. Keep the "dispel" effect. (Retain the purify).
    d. Purify speed-effect is completely removed.

    This solution would make Purify proc almost as hard as it is to counter now in 1v1.

    However, it would balance group PvP. For one, there would be no infinite speedbuffs for escape. A caster would be forced to use their own speedbuffs or move at their regular speed, which would allow for enough time for their opponents to kill them before they moved out of range. Since anti-stun is also non-stackable, it would mean there would be small % chances to CC in between procs.

    Of course, there might be further ways to modify Purify Proc, but that's just my take on it.

    Overall, what do you guys think? There's no need to post, so let's see if we can get an unbiased opinion from the community: To keep, modify, or remove the Purify weapon effect.

    Topic needs to return to this issue.
  • darknessofmy
    darknessofmy Posts: 164 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    NERF: sin/psy END OF STORY
  • JoeBlack - Harshlands
    JoeBlack - Harshlands Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Grimmjow_X - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    why is it ppl keep bring aps up, sure 5 aps WAS broken but not with the gear ppl have now, i dont fear a aps sin, because he is a 1 shot in PK, but i fear a full r9rr sin, the problem with purity is it is broken end of shory, what i rage the most about is that it removes ALL debuffs, making ppl that is hard to kill already even harder to kill

    If I was Devs, I would remove speed buff effect from Procs effect and capture max aps at 3.33. All ppl are happy, more sins will change to sage sins and start pay cashes more to get R9rr set. Is it the PWI who at the end gets most benefits?


    So 1 arrow is on 2 birds. No more QQ about aps,, purify proc, at the end will be who pay more will be god as the design of this kind of this MMORPG f:fan
  • Tsyren - Dreamweaver
    Tsyren - Dreamweaver Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Purify is balanced 1v1.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9jjN3sj-w4

    Please return to the topic that I originally meant this thread to be on. This is getting to the point where even I want this to get closed.
  • SMASHnHEAL - Dreamweaver
    SMASHnHEAL - Dreamweaver Posts: 400 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Crazybladema - Harshlands wrote: »
    Thats true and one of the many reasons why this proc needs to be nerfed. If only three simple changes were made to it, it would not be so overpowered.

    1. remove the speed increase of the proc

    2. increase the proc rate from 8% to 16%

    3. make the proc only work on AUTO ATTACKS.

    With this type of nerf everyone would be happy, except anyone abusing aps. Which is what I think the proc was supposed to help with in the first place.

    1) I am for the first fix and I have said it before, we just need to break out of a stun lock we don't need to run for miles at the speed of light.

    2) I believe the proc rate is fine as it is, it does proc fairly frequent so I wouldn't be completely opposed to a small increase. However people keep talking about 20 people hitting at once - this is far from the norm so the chance of it procing in any other scenario is far from OP.

    3) No just no, this would make the proc close to worthless, leaves you wide open to loads of CC and who still auto attacks in pk? b:shutup
  • Crazybladema - Harshlands
    Crazybladema - Harshlands Posts: 425 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Tsyren - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Purify is balanced 1v1.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9jjN3sj-w4

    Please return to the topic that I originally meant this thread to be on. This is getting to the point where even I want this to get closed.

    The reason that purify is op is not 1v1 really. The problem lies in mass pvp.

    Where in the right conditions its really overpowered.

    Even in this fight we see here, it saved adroit many many times.
  • marvinhuddleston
    marvinhuddleston Posts: 99 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    This thread has proven one thing . At no time has the numbers ever supported nerfing or removal or even come close . Its a dead issue . Next poll : Favorite flavor of ice cream .
  • Crazybladema - Harshlands
    Crazybladema - Harshlands Posts: 425 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    marvinhuddleston wrote: »
    This thread has proven one thing . At no time has the numbers ever supported nerfing or removal or even come close . Its a dead issue . Next poll : Favorite flavor of ice cream .

    Actually, if you combine the numbers for the people who are for modifying purify and those who want to remove it.

    Its pretty close.

    Also, this is not an accurate poll and because of that the numbers we get are not accurate. Especially the way that these numbers are sampled.
  • HrunsPanda - Archosaur
    HrunsPanda - Archosaur Posts: 1,136 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Its been here so long now and still everytime i see this thread in the list of Today's post i just want to scream out loud "WE HAD IT COMING !"b:shocked
    And then regret i am not a mod so i cant put this thread out of its missery b:surrender
  • Fei_Lung - Sanctuary
    Fei_Lung - Sanctuary Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I'm amenable to modification or even outright removal of this skill, on one condition. Where are the caster versions of God of Frenzy? Soulshatter? Thunder Shocker? Soul Infect? or even Holy or Gloom?

    last I checked, casters didn't have that many "bonus" abilties coming from procs. given the fact that this proc is purely defensive in nature, gives me pause to think this may be more of an ego issue than a balance issue.
  • Chuck_smith - Sanctuary
    Chuck_smith - Sanctuary Posts: 305 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Well, of course this thread would stay alive. If the mods were serious, they would have closed this thread already. PWI turned backwards :D
    Sage barb in progress.
  • Zsw - Dreamweaver
    Zsw - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,087 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Fei_Lung - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I'm amenable to modification or even outright removal of this skill, on one condition. Where are the caster versions of God of Frenzy? Soulshatter? Thunder Shocker? Soul Infect? or even Holy or Gloom?

    last I checked, casters didn't have that many "bonus" abilties coming from procs. given the fact that this proc is purely defensive in nature, gives me pause to think this may be more of an ego issue than a balance issue.

    You don't need a proc to boost damage. By default, casters hit harder on their skills, AND receive a better boost from their stat points than physical classes do. As a wizard, you are also able to utilize the best debuff combo in the game, Spark + Undine. But if you really want to, it would still be more balanced than purify proc.
    Zsw -104 Sage Assassin
    TehZsw - 100 Demon Archer


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  • Fei_Lung - Sanctuary
    Fei_Lung - Sanctuary Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    it isn't just about boosting damage. I mean, a wizzy with GOF would make people cry. I'm just pointing out that melee classes get various procs on various weapons: purifys, stuns, purges, procs that have utility that casters do not get as a benefit of simply equipping a weapon and attacking.
  • Crazybladema - Harshlands
    Crazybladema - Harshlands Posts: 425 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Fei_Lung - Sanctuary wrote: »
    it isn't just about boosting damage. I mean, a wizzy with GOF would make people cry. I'm just pointing out that melee classes get various procs on various weapons: purifys, stuns, purges, procs that have utility that casters do not get as a benefit of simply equipping a weapon and attacking.

    Maybe the proc called "Distract". It lowers the targets magic defence.

    Dont know by what amount and the proc rate. But it sounds nice for mage classes.

    Which would be a good add on instead of purify. However aps would have to be nerfed as well if they removed this proc and replaced it with that one. To make it relatively fair and balanced.
  • marvinhuddleston
    marvinhuddleston Posts: 99 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    marvinhuddleston wrote: »
    This thread has proven one thing . At no time has the numbers ever supported nerfing or removal or even come close . Its a dead issue . Next poll : Favorite flavor of ice cream .

    My statement stands ...
  • Crazybladema - Harshlands
    Crazybladema - Harshlands Posts: 425 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    marvinhuddleston wrote: »
    My statement stands ...

    Not when the numbers are backed by bad sampling. Theres only a 3% difference between those who want purify removed/modified and those that want to keep it.

    Its a biased poll that suffers from bad sampling and doesn't prove much. It only proves that this is a very dividing issue and something probably should be done.

    Considering the reaction this poll invoked.
  • anwynd
    anwynd Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I was for it during the big aps craze and im still for it even tho i have aps sets for multiple characters. The aps cap should be lowered to 3.33 or lower because lets face it, it might not be great for pvp but it is a bit to much for pve and it won't kill people, myself included to take alittle longer getting what we want done. It should never have been possible and it shouldnt be possible to perma spark.

    Now that that is out of the way.
    I also think that purify is also on the OP side of things. Two wrongs dont make a right. Any arguement about this being a fair comprimise because of aps is just not a smart person no offense to anyone so this to must be modified. I think the following should be changed after reading both sides of this thread (every single page) and experiencing battle with a purify user on both my ranged,magic, and melee characters and playing one myself.

    Firstly the movment increase should be taken off because it is to OP to have when it can be tough for melee fighters to even get in close and casters dont need a free escape option every time this procs. Casters should have to actually use skills or items to escape if the need arises.

    Secondly i also have to say that an immune to effects after being purified is also not needed. It isnt right that casters get a free immune and not have to pay a thing for it well it costs the person there fighting chi,sparks, or their genie to even get an effect on the caster. If that gets purified off casters have plenty of time to get away and if they dont they deserve to get locked down again. If the caster wants to be immune after they are purified they should have to use an item to do so.

    The only thing this proc should do is purify every once in awhile to have a fair lucky break. It needs to be held in check because it can be proced far more often then other weapon procs. They also have the weakness of if the user is locked down they cant attack and in effect the wep proc is useless. This to must have a weakness so i believe it must have a cooldown of lets say 10-15 secs. It shouldnt be a crutch (that in my experience is far to reliable) for casters that shouldnt survive the given situation they are in. In a battle you are suppose to trick your opponent into using their supplies and then take them down, purify should be no different. Also it should not purify any debuffs only stuns,slows, or freezes to keep things fair.

    I think giving casters a proc was a nice and fair change but they went over board on it just like when the wing nuts were creating the game and didnt put an appropriate cap on aps. If you read all this i hope you will respect my opinion as i have and will respect yoursb:cuteb:victoryb:thanks
    Collector of pet eggs, armor, weapons, fashion, and mountsb:chuckle
  • Adroit - Lost City
    Adroit - Lost City Posts: 4,628 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Zsw - Dreamweaver wrote: »

    As you can see in both Fight 1 and Fight 3, your purify barely proced, but you were able to kill Bait anyway. While you could possibly argue that purify proc is not overpowered due to its low proc rate, I do not feel that you can possibly say that you would've lost those two fights had you not had purify. Yeah sure, Bait had a few mess ups. But that's not to say that Bait would stop making mistakes entirely when you loose purify, is it? Which is why I say that at the very least, purify proc is definitely unnecessary, and you did not NEED it to have a fighting chance. I dare say that even with purify proc completely removed (Much less the proposed change of adding a cooldown), the outcome of Fight 1 and 3 would not be different.

    Both fights 1 and 3 were very short, and I don't think they were very good examples for proc. As I'm sure you could see from the video, he was able to pressure/force me my limited defensive options constantly with just DD during his locks.. and in a longer 1v1 (like fight #2), without proc I would slowly but surely run out of defensive options. This may not sound like a bad thing, but he is able to keep his defensive options "replenished" so to speak so it would simply be a matter of time until I ran out of defenses (while he still had all of his) and it would become very one sided at that point. Purify allows for an occasional escape and allows a little more time for genie energy to regen and apoth to come off CD. If you wanted to remove/modify proc, at the very least for wiz vs sin.. sins would need some kind of nerf such as reduced chi gain or longer cd on control skills so that they were not able to force defensive options as frequently.
    Zsw - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    However, lets look at Fight 2. You spammed aqua flame armor multiple times, without much regard for its consequences, to be honest. Eventually, its what caused you to die. Although, the fight really should've ended much sooner. I consider the following a waste and/or risky use of that skill: you used aqua flame armor for a single spark at 2:36 from full hp; at 3:32 when you wasted it since your freeze just ended; at 4:55 when you continue to try and attack instead of kiting even though it's reduction effect is about to end, meaning you were going to get hit hard. Those are just some examples. Anyway, my point is, you are completely throwing around a skill that you yourself have said is pretty much as good as AD when you are not really in danger. A sin who wastes AD or Faith generally dies. However, you were definitely saved by purify proc in all those cases. When you misplay, you should suffer the consequences. In fact, even considering your death at the end, you had time to distance shrink yourself. You would've possibly lived. The fact that you neglected to do that, I feel, very much mean that you were almost expecting or even relying on purify procing, when you very much could've saved yourself.

    I am not saying that Aqua Flame Armor is a bad skill. But rather, I see it as a low cost skill to get you out of trouble, which is why it has a consequence of making you take more damage. However, with purify proc, you are using it as either a spammable damage reduction or a deter for Bait's attack. That is what you save stuff like Fortify for.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you're a bad player. However, I am pretty sure you said yourself that with aqua flame armor, all you have to do to survive ganks is to use that skill and wait for purify to proc. While non casters have to plan for proper timing of immune skills, you have made your playstyle completely based off the fact that purify will proc. I feel that this claim, along with my observation made above, negates any claims that purify's proc rate is too low to be effective, whether mass pk, or 1 v 1.

    I made many mistakes in the video, I'm not suggesting I played that perfectly at all. I did use AFA incorrectly a few times, one was a misclick when someone walked in my room and was asking me some stupid question.. but there were a few that were just poor skill choice. My death at the end of round two was mostly because I was getting impatient and making several back to back derps.. which Bait definitely took advantage of. It is not true however that wasting a faith/domain on a sin means they auto die.. I was able to make him waste faith/domain several times, but he didn't easily drop right after. Making one bad decision or mistake in wiz vs sin doesn't mean you auto die at end game (unless it is really major). You have to think that the defensive options for wizards and sins are very different.. sins genie/apoth + tidal/nerves/infinite chi, wizards get genie/apoth + purify. Obviously other classes are different.. bm vs wiz for example the bm is incredibly tanky and tbh.. I'd be surprised if an end game wiz could even kill a competent end game bm (and vice versa).. my guess is that it'd be a stalemate.
    Zsw - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Speaking of Fortify, I am believe you used Badge a total of 1 time and not a single time did you use fortify during Fight 2. I could be wrong, but I surely didn't see you spam it. This brings up another point, the addition of Purify means that you can just spam damage reduction on your genie all day long, instead of using it to break or counter stuns. Non casters are still forced to time immunities. You no longer have to.

    It is true that casters are able to use damage reduction skills to ride through control skills, but casters still need to use immunes just the same as anyone else. Even if we didn't need immunes (which we certainly do), using different skills is simply a difference.. which is not in and of itself a problem. You also mentioned earlier that AFA is a cheap skill.. and it really is not. Wizards are essentially forced into high dex genies (a wizard without spark = lulz), and on a dex genie.. AFA is a huge cost, not to mention the obvious amp issue after the first 10 seconds. You seem to have this impression that survival on a caster/wizard is just hit wind shield and wait for purify, but unless you are fighting an aps char or someone that is crazy undergeared.. sitting there waiting for purify is going to lead to a very quick trip to town a lot of the time. Purify is a nice little boost when it goes off, not a reliable on demand defensive skill like genie/apoth is.
    Zsw - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    So in summary, purify proc rate is decent enough that you feel safe enough to risk taking 20% more damage, and it activates frequently enough that you completely do not need to use any immune skill or break skills on your genie. This greatly removes any need to time your skill, or to predict your opponent's actions.
    This is addressed above, and is totally off base.
    Zsw - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Genie skills are meant to be used to break debuffs, and time immunities. Also, if you use a skill that has a negative effect wrongly, you should suffer for having used it wrong.
    I disagree with what you think genie skills are for, that is certainly one use, but there are many other ways to utilize a genie. If you are referring to the negative effect on AFA, I did suffer for using it wrong several times (or using it right, still had to deal with the amp after the first 10 seconds). I was forced to wind shield through the amp duration, I died once, I was forced to kite instead of attacking while Bait was low on resources, etc.
    Zsw - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    I wish to know, have you had the chance to kill full +12 josd pure support clerics, mystics, and venos with purify proc in mass pk? I don't know how many people go pure support on lost city nowadays. I remember the likes of lil_stern who were dedicated supports back in the days. Perhaps you could fill me in on those, and show me some videos of you and your squad effortlessly eliminating well supported end game support classes in mass pk. If those aren't around anymore, maybe show me how a 1 v 1 against an archer is balanced with purify proc. I shall await, and may a compromise be reached.

    I don't know of any full +12 josd clerics/mystics/venos on lost city.. although I have fought against several +10/+11 josd chars, which is relatively close (especially if they have buffs). I have never claimed that end game casters are "effortless eliminated", as they are not (nor is anything that is end game and competently played). They can be taken down relatively easily with a little coordination however.

    I know this has already been posted in this thread, but a few weeks ago (maybe a month or more now.. can't remember) when I tried to enter NW.. 3 of us dc'd upon entering and when we got back into game and entered war, we ended up in a different nation from the rest of the squad. It was kinda funny because our split squad ended up fighting each other for a majority of the NW time. Long story short, it was a really really fun NW and our first battle we actually ran out of time. I was the only one grabbing flag for our side (at the time I was missing 2-3 pieces of josd, but pretty close to end game) and Azura doesn’t have many josd but is full +11 full vit build veno that had full buffs the entire time (we had nobody that could purge). I can tell you that when I grabbed the flag, I scored once and died like 7 times (got kicked out and had made it back in because they were right at our base).. I would get purged + a few amps and drop almost instantly. Azura scored once and died 2-3 times, with me being pretty much the only one doing damage (meaning even if he had better gear, having another r9rr +12 char hitting him should be able to take him down.. especially with a purge/amps). The later battles were just frustrating for me, Bait was just harassing me so I couldn’t get to the flags or stop the flag carrier.. so my pt had basically nobody that could carry flag and nobody that could kill the flag carrier, which meant we lost almost everything after the first battle. So anyway, I was dying to the same 2-3 people (Bait + full vit veno and +7/+8 support barb) frustratingly easy.. and Azura was dying full buffed basically just to me, so that is one example where I’ve had to deal with end game purify.. and even in the place where it is complained about the most.

    There are no end game archers on LC that I think are competent, and actually most of the end game archers on LC are already in my videos.. :/

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  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Well like I said...I've watched other classes (not robes) march from flag to base with just pills and sprint skills...so it's probably a problem with the instance too.

    If we're measuring balance by how a class stands to an endgame sin in 1v1, what about all the other classes (*cough* archer) that sins can outlast by sheer chi gain? It's obvious every other class would need something more.

    inb4 powercreep.
    Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
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  • AlphaOmegaX - Dreamweaver
    AlphaOmegaX - Dreamweaver Posts: 302 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Crazybladema - Harshlands wrote: »
    Not when the numbers are backed by bad sampling. Theres only a 3% difference between those who want purify removed/modified and those that want to keep it.

    Its a biased poll that suffers from bad sampling and doesn't prove much. It only proves that this is a very dividing issue and something probably should be done.

    Considering the reaction this poll invoked.

    Thats cuz all you QQ'ers been getting on your alts and other accounts and voting get rid of Puri b:shutupb:laugh
  • Onatop - Lost City
    Onatop - Lost City Posts: 110 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    @Tsyn

    Obviously by your comments, u r mostly against purify, but to be honest if u're an endgame sin it really doesn't affect u much. sin's can instantly tele to thier target and have unlimited chi, so u can keep up with the purify speed most of the time. ofc in mass pk its a bit different since purify procs a lot more. To be honest the only classes that r deeply affected by purify proc are the bm and barb. ofc we have some movement speed but that's no where near what's required to keep up with the purify proc speed. Not to mention the bm's damage kinda suck, and chi is a serious problem (even more so with venos draining u); with low crit rate, the chance to zerk crit is low. Meanwhile the sin's damage is OP, u got chill of the deep and the best crit rate in the game.
    So really the bms/barbs r the ones that r/should b QQ-ing not sins.
    Find the solution to Laplace's equation at X=2, Y =3, OR bend over b:cry
  • ZooozOOo - Archosaur
    ZooozOOo - Archosaur Posts: 486 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    b:laugh b:laugh
  • Blue_Moon - Heavens Tear
    Blue_Moon - Heavens Tear Posts: 27 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    aww whats wrong poor sin's butt hurt because clerics can kill them now.b:chuckle
  • BungaSakura - Raging Tide
    BungaSakura - Raging Tide Posts: 902 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Blue_Moon - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    aww whats wrong poor sin's butt hurt because clerics can kill them now.b:chuckle

    sin used to be easy to play, spark and auto attack. so when they need to use brain to play they QQ, lol.
  • Suekasa - Archosaur
    Suekasa - Archosaur Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Most of the Melee Toons are Pretty OP as is IMo if take away any skill From clerics it would be that Gross Sleep i mean it lasts way too long and Frankly. if you take away
    Purify,then don't stop there Nerf assassins mass stun rate or Soul of Vengeance away from Psychic's you think that's unfair look at all the other cheap skills.b:surrender
    f:laugh"In the virtual world, you have power,respect,friends and peace. Why would you
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  • Slivaf - Dreamweaver
    Slivaf - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,106 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    AlphaOmegaX - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Thats cuz all you QQ'ers been getting on your alts and other accounts and voting get rid of Puri b:shutupb:laugh

    You have no proof to say that this is the case, we could just as easily say the same about those who wish to keep the proc.
    PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    a) Why does it have up to 20? What if 100 people hit you?
    b) Why is 20 the magic number? Why not 4 (=aps gof)?
    I am not sure what he meant here myself, so i'll leave that up to him... if he wants to clarify then more power to him.

    why is that bad?

    It's not just bad.. its just plain ridiculous. I get if they have the gear they shouldn't die that easily but really we aren't talking about npc gear/g15 or lower. As it has been said multiple times in this thread, more numbers on you should mean its HARDER for you to survive, not a better chance for a cheap proc... to process and allow you to get away, (and possibly turn around and continue the onslaught the (caster) started before the melee got to them.) That is an issue everywhere not just nw. (Mass pvp wise)

    why is that bad?

    Read the part that's italicized and underlined. That is why it's bad, it shouldn't be happening as frequently as it does. It's one thing to have the gear and the skill to be able to do it... but being able to rinse and repeat as much as it decides to process... it really is rather overpowered when it can do that. (Yes, I realize there are ways to potentially prevent these... issues from arising, but none of them have been easily at the ready for most people/squads these days.)

    fixed. they can still CC/debuff

    Of course they can.. until one of those 'noobs' he's talking about inadvertently activates the proc of the purify user. Yes some may be able to cc the noob(s).. but that is valuable resources wasted on the noobs that is better saved for the caster/purify proc user. As for the other scenario where they are helping attack the person without the purify proc... if you can't see how both scenarios help the purify user then I am afraid I can't help you on that... besides your entitled to your opinion.


    see above


    false. casters hit harder but melees have better defenses. so melees have to compete with casters' defenses. additionally, usually the archers are supposed to be the robe killers

    Its true casters have the distance + harder hits on their side before melees get anywhere near them, and having to compete with the haxed defenses of casters when melee gets near.. is so not fun. Yes archers kill casters far easier than melee, but a lot of melee even struggle to get near a lot of archers. I really don't see how this game favors melees at all in any scenario. Unless their gear truly does match their opponent. Essentially close enough is not good enough in this game, which is undoubtedly frustrating to many people.

    Sadly though this game is undoubtedly a pay to win game, games like those/this one often alienate those who don't put out tons of cash to be competitive. Though really if they keep that up I think we will continue to see people leave in hordes so to speak. Hell it's arguably why this game has seen an steady decline in the player base/activity. I think those who truly are tired of the bs pay to win model that pwi has went for has absolutely left the game. I know this tidbit is rather irrelevant but meh I still wanted to put it out there. lol I hope they try to get away from the pay to win mentality they have, but honestly I can't see it happening, as others have pointed out they definitely love their money. Not to mention they likely don't expect this game to last for decades to come. (Besides It really can be rather tedious/arduous dealing with the numerous complaints that come in their way.) Its all fine and dandy that they want money, but really there is imbalance with this proc.

    false.
    I think passive was the wrong word to use there, but really if you look at all the built in skills each of the melee have none have a real skill that doesn't have a drawback on it to increase their magical defense, practically every single caster in game has some kind of skill built in their original skills that allow their defenses to be boosted Melee classes are so not favored in this game at all. (EDIT: Yes they are favored a bit too much for pve instances, but meh that's pve, the real money is now in nw)... Yes they have their hp, and better physical defense, but their magic defense is lacking for quite some time... which is the case for casters physical defense to a certain extent... but the casters self buffs that boost their physical defense sure helps them obtain decent physical defense far faster than melee classes getting decent magical defense.

    I realize I am not kni, and I may not word things as well as he does, nor am I as... cruel as he is... but still I am going to attempt to answer you... the replies will be in yellow.

    I also realize most of what I have said is just reiterating what others have said... but meh there it is again.

    Damn this thread is like a wreck on the side of the highway, I know I shouldn't slow down and look but I do anyways. xD

    b:surrender b:cry So tired of this thread. f:brick
    Ah, Mistakes are so easily made. ~ laura resnick

    What kind of message are you sending when you insult my intelligence? ~ Me ~ 5/29/2015 (Yes it is possible someone said this before just no idea who/where.)
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