Main Discussion about NW pricing and effect on game

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  • Zanryu - Dreamweaver
    Zanryu - Dreamweaver Posts: 7,261 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    Zanir - Lothranis wrote: »
    It doesn't matter, you don't completely replace an instance in a matter of 2 hours. That's just bad form on PWEs' part.

    I believe change is good and I welcome it, but this was a bit overkill.

    People are pissed and have a right to be, some people can't afford to cash shop enough to buy R9 and +10/12 it with full JoSDs so Nirvana gear was their end game stuff. Then 3rd cast came along and it was comparable, but not entirely equal to, R9 stuff. Best part was you couldn't CS it, it had to be farmed.

    People felt a sense of accomplishment from getting those weapons and armor pieces and now in a matter of minutes after Nation Wars are over people are running around in full sets of 2nd cast Nirv stuff or linking G16 weapons/armor that they had molds for just sitting in bank with no desire to even use due to being lazy as hell and not wanting to go farm for their stuff.

    Do you not see it as being a slap in the face? I sure as hell do. Really wishing I had never spent a dime on this game at this point (not that I spent much anyways).


    Ah.. the joys of being 100% free to play. It's only a slap in the face if you already have your gear. Otherwise it's a godsend, like for those that can't play much or aren't able to farm very efficiently. I admit, PWI made a stupid move but.. hey, it's PWI we're talking about here. They don't tend to be very smart when it comes to thinking about the economy. All they want is money, and with this update the only efficient way to even get R9 is to CS considering the biggest market in the game is dead. You could merchant it, but not many of the people that play merchant enough for R9.

    Anyway... it's both good and bad update. You just have to live with it or quit. Sure there's not as much sense of accomplishment for 3rd cast Nirvana, but you still have to put in the work and do the Warsongs. The only negative aspects of this are a market crash and R9/+7/8 and higher refines are now harder to get unless you CS. Other than that people will now be able to balance their gear decently well. PWI is now a watered down P2W private server.

    Great job guys, great job.
  • viktorbg
    viktorbg Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    "Then you're an idiot to not realize the impact this will have on the rest of the game."

    The **** just got real - The mighty impact on the game.. really? Do you know what's coming next for PWI as update? NOPE, you don't, but dont worry they will make some instance for you to farm in and brag about how good you're at farming and how you got your r9 without spending any $.
  • RoidAbuse - Sanctuary
    RoidAbuse - Sanctuary Posts: 1,066 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    I have r9 josd +10-12 and I still like this update.
    Now you can PK for gear instead of PvE! Awwwshaaattttttttt!
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Making "non-trash-talkers" show their true color. RAGE ON! b:laugh
  • Euthymius - Heavens Tear
    Euthymius - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,162 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    :slow-clap:

    That's partially why I dont see this whole thing as the"Death of PWI" some are making this change out to be. Another part would be because Lunar/WS (and to a lesser extent TT) will gain even more popularity and TWs will be a bit more interesting.
    b:pleased
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  • Toomaga - Heavens Tear
    Toomaga - Heavens Tear Posts: 221 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    Zanir - Lothranis wrote: »
    Then you're an idiot to not realize the impact this will have on the rest of the game.

    If you feel you must result to such a childish response to my post then you should simply quit the game and let us who see a brighter side of this feel free to express our opinions.

    Nirvana is only one way to obtain money and gear in this game, that is a fact.When people worked hard to obtain Rank 8 and it was put in the Cash shop within a few weeks time people declared the end of the game. It still lives today.

    If you honestly think this will kill the game you need to expand your knowledge of how online games work. Private Servers exist and run perfectly fine with everyone having access to R9 stage 2 and more. I use private severs in the context of being given free gear basically.


    This game is always changing, and you can either complain and quit,complain and adapt, or try to be cheerful and continue your gaming experience.

    Also if your post was not targeted at me I apologize.I only assume so since it was made after mine with no quote inserted

    :).
  • fallingstars125
    fallingstars125 Posts: 9 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    viktorbg wrote: »
    Oh look the old farmer farming NV mats to "buy" his r9,3,4,5,s just spoken... QQ

    Sorry to tell ya, im free to play r9 and only farm nirv for pocket cash. Was that all u got bro? Try better next time u wanna offend some1 who knows what its like to have goals and see them completed in basic endgame gear. A joy many wont experience as its as common as dirt now, while others very hard to reach.
  • Zenorx - Harshlands
    Zenorx - Harshlands Posts: 443 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    Don't you just love it?

    Not quite as good as when rep badges were released though....

    Honestly everyone, get over it
  • Jaabg - Sanctuary
    Jaabg - Sanctuary Posts: 2,256 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    ChevaIier - Harshlands wrote: »
    In addition, this update has completely screwed sins over. Sin's tt99 gear and ornaments isn't enough to protect them from the new firepower other classes will get from their FULL G16 GEAR. To survive, most sins will now have to get full G16 gear (therefore reducing aps, YAY!) and compete on the same level as other classes.

    Isn't that the biggest issue. There were complain when g16 came out and LA wrists had no -int. Most people know, sins who use aps gear in tw are one shot food. Any decent bm with hf, stun, aoe can reduce the sin's hp or kill the sin with r8 axes at +4~+5.

    People made sins for a very specific purpose, to the extent they disregarded their original playing class they started with. Will post more later b:chuckle b:bye.
  • Lyritha - Heavens Tear
    Lyritha - Heavens Tear Posts: 447 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    this method leaves absolutely nothing to do during the week I give it thumbs down for lack of something to do during non-TW times which I barely can make anyway
  • Euthymius - Heavens Tear
    Euthymius - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,162 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    Delicious Rage~ b:laugh
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  • Zenorx - Harshlands
    Zenorx - Harshlands Posts: 443 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    Totally agree, this update will provide a much more even playing field for everyone, people actually might start doing TW again and the game will overall be more fun.

    I think the only people that are really annoyed are ones who farmed or CS'ed NV/R9, and that's for selfish reasons anyway, this update will make the game much more enjoyable... Hopefully
  • Bubbles - Morai
    Bubbles - Morai Posts: 1,143 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    So let me get this straight...
    The game first died when nixes were released.
    It died again when genies were released and then nerfed.
    It died again when packs were released.
    It died again when oracles were popularized.
    It died again when people realized they would never get low gold trade again.
    It died again when tb chars started hitting the higher levels and 5 aps became popular.
    It died again when packs were announced into the cash shop indefinitely.
    It died again when goon glitch was popularized.
    It died again when r9 medals could no longer be got from the dq shop.
    It died again when goon glitch was "fixed".
    It died again when the sale of 11 and 12 dorbs caused "client instability."
    It died again when frost runs were popularized.

    ... I don't think this mishap will be the final blow.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Desdi - Sanctuary
    Desdi - Sanctuary Posts: 8,680 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    I might have been okay with Nation Wars and all, I've learnt to adapt to changes, but I can't even attend them so that's just screwed up.

    No, moving to EU server is not an option. It's empty anyway.

    I'm still waiting to see the impact they will have the following days before I can truly judge.
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  • BerserkBeast - Sanctuary
    BerserkBeast - Sanctuary Posts: 1,417 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    Its a very bad blow to players that used to make money with Nirvana.

    I really find annoying how some other players feel the right to laugh at those who are angry after spending all their time farming in Vana like nerds to get the damn G15 Set to recast in G16.

    They have all the rights about being angry with this change, I can say bye-bye to my plans to refine +10 my equips with Nirvana income being totally destroyed, sure some are happy for their own reasons, I respect who's happy, why some players can't respect those who are angry instead?

    Does it make you feel good to laugh at those who worked so hard on stuff and now they're expressing their feelings?
    The only way to beat a troll is....to troll him back b:angry
  • ILacy - Sanctuary
    ILacy - Sanctuary Posts: 149 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    Nowitsawn - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    The cheap as hell exchange for raps and cannies are custom made for our version.

    I'm pretty sure this is all working exactly as intended.


    As usual, Mr. Awn is totally right. And since GMs and Devs dont play this game they dont have to care for what it means to the players.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • ChevaIier - Harshlands
    ChevaIier - Harshlands Posts: 300 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    Thanks for the reply guys :P

    I personally don't like the update because I spent a lot of time farming and merching for NV3...but oh well if it takes an update like this to save the game I'l gladly disregard my selfishness for the benefit of the whole.
  • ChevaIier - Harshlands
    ChevaIier - Harshlands Posts: 300 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    Jaabg - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Isn't that the biggest issue. There were complain when g16 came out and LA wrists had no -int. Most people know, sins who use aps gear in tw are one shot food. Any decent bm with hf, stun, aoe can reduce the sin's hp or kill the sin with r8 axes at +4~+5.

    People made sins for a very specific purpose, to the extent they disregarded their original playing class they started with. Will post more later b:chuckle b:bye.

    You're right, it was a big issue and pwi solved it instead of reducing aps they indirectly did it by making an update that will benefit other classes. I just wonder if it's a fluke or they actually planned this? hehe b:laugh
  • Nareeah - Lost City
    Nareeah - Lost City Posts: 81 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    and what will you re.tards farm?
    TT = worthless
    NV = worthless
    most DQ = worthless
    what are lower lvls supposed to farm? or even do?
    new players?
    REALLY !?

    what about the players that CAN'T DO nation wars?

    ye you make peeeeeeeeeeerfect sense
  • Deceptistar - Sanctuary
    Deceptistar - Sanctuary Posts: 10,454 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    im fine with it. Early on you realize that things change and update. Things get easier to get a hold of too. The oldies here spent over 4hrs in a whopping TT2-1 back in 2008, and over 8hrs to complete half a FCC (before the revamp), but we deal with the fact that stuff like that isnt gonna actually stay that way.

    'Suck it up and keep up or catch up'

    prolly PWI's secret motto >.>
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  • Zanir - Lothranis
    Zanir - Lothranis Posts: 106 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    It was not targeted at you it was actually meant for another thread. I've been bouncing between a few.

    I also understand that games change and adapt but usually it's a gradual change. This was not even remotely close to being in the same universe as gradual.

    I know full well that there are other ways to make money besides Nirv, I hardly run Nirv unless it's 2x simply because it's so damn difficult to find people to run with. But you don't just throw all the work people have done right out the window and act like it was all planned right along.

    Any company with some class would have had GMs and CMs online tonight to monitor what was going on since there was a major content update. They'd have seen the issue here and hopefully had addressed it. Instead we have nothing but people walking away with thousands and thousands of mats that shouldn't have been injected into the economy in the first place for doing next to nothing.

    I understand them wanting to make recasting things easier, but they could have done that without completely ruining an instance. Some people might find it boring (I certainly do) but let people choose how they want to get their stuff and at least make it somewhat comparable in terms of "difficulty".

    The best solution to the R9 recast situation would have been to directly add Summerwind tokens to the forges for a reasonable (but high) Supply Token and manufacturing fee so that it still took a while to get the top tier gear.

    Alternatively, Raps and Canny would be ok to be in there assuming they were not as readily available as they've now been made. 1 Rapture and 5 Uncanny for 1 Supply Token (Respectively) is a bit too easy. Especially when even people who aren't doing much of anything are getting hundreds of Tokens from a single night of Nation Wars.

    Best possible drop results for Nirvana during 2x are 10 Uncanny and 4 Raptures (assuming all boxes gave an Uncanny and final boss gave 4 Raptures). That's 1 Uncanny per person per run. Good squads now can average 6 runs per hour (10 min runs) that's 60 Uncanny and 24 Raptures (best case scenario) which equates to 10 Uncanny and 4 Raptures per person.

    Use an average of 250 Supply Tokens for a night of Nation Wars and increase the cost (in Tokens) to make Raptures and Uncanny and you could easily make Nirvana drops more accessible to other players while still maintaining some sort of balance.

    Remember, we're not talking about the high end, top tier players who can do 2 and 3 man Nirvana squads and completely destroy the instance already, they obviously get far more drops from Nirv in the same time span and would also get more Tokens in Nation Wars.

    Make the Uncanny and Rap costs to manufacture at the forges something along the lines of 12-15 (or more) Supply Tokens as well as a small fee and it would be more than acceptable. People would still have to work for them, the supply wouldn't be so huge that it messes with anything and everyone is happy. The people who farmed hard for their gear will still be upset to a degree but not as much as they are now since it won't be as bad as it was tonight. The people who didn't want to or didn't like to farm Nirvana don't have to and they can still farm their gear.

    To me it's a Win-Win should they be willing to reconsider how they applied these changes. Not everyone shares the same views, some people hate Nirv, some love it, but that's the beauty of an MMO, we're supposed to be free to choose how we want to achieve our goals. But the way it is currently eliminates any goals at all that people might have had. Working for your gear should be something people want to do instead of just expecting everything to be handed to them.
  • Teseanna - Heavens Tear
    Teseanna - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,021 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    StarStrukkk - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    You just ****ed everyone over :)

    Only people who are happy about the change are the people who can't farm their own ****, or are useless in general, and can't accomplish anything with any sort of hard work.
    Thanks for teaching people that you can be useless and still get somewhere.

    You won't be making as much money as you used too either, coz you just shat on everyone who spends money on the game. Enjoy your company falling.

    Game over.

    don't let the door hit ya...or do idk b:bye
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  • CynthiaDoll - Raging Tide
    CynthiaDoll - Raging Tide Posts: 26 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    Nareeah - Lost City wrote: »
    and what will you re.tards farm?
    TT = worthless
    NV = worthless
    most DQ = worthless
    what are lower lvls supposed to farm? or even do?
    new players?
    REALLY !?

    what about the players that CAN'T DO nation wars?

    ye you make peeeeeeeeeeerfect sense

    I go to the NW and i got mostly 1 shot lol. I have R8 +4 gear and all that R9 +12 1 shot me hahha. But i stil think Nirvana is good because not all of us can do NW. I think the best way is to make a better drop in Nirvana for us or make the bosses weaker so the TT90 people can farm canny and raps as well. I think the raps are non-trade I'm not sure yet
  • ChevaIier - Harshlands
    ChevaIier - Harshlands Posts: 300 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    Nareeah - Lost City wrote: »
    and what will you re.tards farm?
    TT = worthless
    NV = worthless
    most DQ = worthless
    what are lower lvls supposed to farm? or even do?
    new players?
    REALLY !?

    what about the players that CAN'T DO nation wars?

    ye you make peeeeeeeeeeerfect sense

    Are you really questioning what lower levels are supposed to "farm" or "do"?

    TT is not worthless. People still farm the instance and sell gold mats to make TT99 gear.

    I agree NV is worthless now due to being able to get raptures and cannies, but that can easily be solved by increasing the drop rate in that instance.

    I don't think you're understanding my message at all. Re-read what I wrote and give a thought before responding obnoxiously. b:chuckle
  • Nareeah - Lost City
    Nareeah - Lost City Posts: 81 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    i read what you wrote and i am afraid you are missing the bigger picture here
    BEFORE when a farming instance went down we had a new one sort of for F2P
    now there is none
    if you think this can work without a farming instance idk what to think of your bigger picture view
    and no TT will to no extent replace NV

    you are free to consult this (not mine) post here
  • BerserkBeast - Sanctuary
    BerserkBeast - Sanctuary Posts: 1,417 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    I wish those who are so happy about these changes had a deeper look at things like the above guy.
    The only way to beat a troll is....to troll him back b:angry
  • Teseanna - Heavens Tear
    Teseanna - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,021 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    MysticHayley - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    farming 2-3 or under was already useless before patch.
    3-1 and above is now useless with everyone having s3 gear.
    nirvana is dead.
    lunar has always been dead.

    sooo whats left to farm.........


    new game anyone?b:laugh

    Yes, go away.
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  • CynthiaDoll - Raging Tide
    CynthiaDoll - Raging Tide Posts: 26 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    MysticHayley - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    farming 2-3 or under was already useless before patch.
    3-1 and above is now useless with everyone having s3 gear.
    nirvana is dead.
    lunar has always been dead.

    sooo whats left to farm.........


    new game anyone?b:laugh

    Lets farm Boutique lol. I am happy all the server will have Nirvana gear soon with 100k 1 canny lol ..I will "drop" my R8 gear and get full nirvana finally. It is a great thing i buy cheap canny + raps from people that go to war . b:victoryb:cute
  • Teseanna - Heavens Tear
    Teseanna - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,021 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    ...a big **** plus one

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  • Haila - Sanctuary
    Haila - Sanctuary Posts: 467 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    They just had to fix the fee to 750k per rap and 150k per uncanny or something.
    10k is bit too cheap with the tokens handed out ...........
  • ChevaIier - Harshlands
    ChevaIier - Harshlands Posts: 300 Arc User
    edited November 2012
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    Nareeah - Lost City wrote: »
    i read what you wrote and i am afraid you are missing the bigger picture here
    BEFORE when a farming instance went down we had a new one sort of for F2P
    now there is none
    if you think this can work without a farming instance idk what to think of your bigger picture view
    and no TT will to no extent replace NV

    Due to nirvana mats more attainable, people will now spend time farming TT instances. The demand for the supply of TT mats will increase, which will increase price.

    TT generally died because of R9, and now since nirvana is more available TT will become popular again. I'm not saying that this will happen for sure, but I can see the intent of it from PWI.

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