Curses

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  • RedBetty - Harshlands
    RedBetty - Harshlands Posts: 172 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    uscaredbrah?

    It's also been mentioned that Catalyst isn't after the whole map either..

    why are you even talking?
    i remember talking to a secret catalyst officer telling me that they might invite "the cresendia failveno" to troll you for backstabbing crimson...nevermind..that never happed, i made that story up b:chuckle
    but it seems you flirted yourself into a decent position in that guild! good job :)
  • Burnout - Harshlands
    Burnout - Harshlands Posts: 2,585 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Longknife makes some good points. Some of the most enjoyable fights I've ever had were with equally geared people in small fights, 2 v 2 or 3 v 3. I have around 23 +10 dragon orbs in bank I'm planning to merchant, yet my R8 weapon is only +6. I DID refine my armors up to +10, but only because I want some enjoyable fights instead of being one-shotted everywhere.

    MsNospheratu once told me that she "worked really hard for her gear and earned it". This pissed me off because it implied that I don't work hard IRL to make my money. I'm pretty sure EVERYONE around here has to work hard for their money, but some of us have more important priorities in life than dropping it on a game, priorities like, say, paying rent, saving for retirement, investing in stocks...

    saying "get a better job" to my face is just ****** pathetic...

    I'm not gonna lie I've spent quite a bit of money in this game. I've only told one person in the entire game how much actual IRL money I've spent. But it was more to keep my gear updated and to take advantage of certain sales when I had spare money.

    If I ever cash out all of my money in my bank for OP gear I'll probably still stick with my +6 R8 for pvp.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

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  • Curses - Harshlands
    Curses - Harshlands Posts: 401 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    why are you even talking?
    i remember talking to a secret catalyst officer telling me that they might invite "the cresendia failveno" to troll you for backstabbing crimson...nevermind..that never happed, i made that story up b:chuckle
    but it seems you flirted yourself into a decent position in that guild! good job :)

    Cresendia is a great veno to have in guild. She doesn't cry, start drama or rage quit like some veno's we've been associated with in the past. Solid strat making up a lie then calling urself out on it before u finish writing a post. Excellent display of character while ur trolling someone else's character XD.
  • RedBetty - Harshlands
    RedBetty - Harshlands Posts: 172 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    happy mothers day guys!
  • Hhlolz - Harshlands
    Hhlolz - Harshlands Posts: 574 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    crescendia for best veno b:victory
    nvm nyxya's kiting skills are slightly betterb:surrender
    *Faildom*
    I don't need a Squad
    Level a Venomancer to 90.
    Aug 12, 2009
  • Oannes - Harshlands
    Oannes - Harshlands Posts: 10 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Why DO people immediately charge thousands after hitting level 100? Someone asked this in another thread and no one really commented on it, but seriously: why? If you charge thousands and immediately hit r9 +12, then no one can compete with you except for the elite few who either did the exact same, have been playing since the server began or spent so much time farming that they could accuse PWI of slave labor. Every time I see a r9 at west that's killing everyone, I just leave. There's no point, because although it IS possible to kill a r9, it's a ridiculous uphill climb.
    In the meantime, I've spent $0 on the game and I'm sure I have far more fun than those who **** out a giant gold **** on the devs' stomaches. Why? Cause when I go out to west, people don't run from me. They stay and fight. Furthermore I actually forced to put SOME thought into what I do since I can't just kill people by looking at them funny. I'm getting far more bang for my buck in this game, which is ironic and hysterical considering I haven't even paid whereas some of them have paid small fortunes into this game.

    Don't normally post on pwi forums but seeing Longknife's above comment I thought of asking the same point. I also never really understood how some of these OP r9+10/12 players even enjoy this game anymore. When I go to west and see one of these r9s I just leave, no point in attacking someone who can tab kill you with no effort. I don't see how its fun anymore when the majority of the people just look at your gear and decide its not worth fighting you.
  • Nospheratu - Harshlands
    Nospheratu - Harshlands Posts: 39 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Valhalla vs Catalyst reminds me of the first few Crimson vs Zulu wars. Crimson was massively outgeared by Zulu in the first wars and would get rolled in about 20-30 mins until the rank sale which evened things out a bit and afterwards Crimson could actually somewhat-compete with Zulu.

    It pisses me off that people will always say Zulu/Catalyst win because of skill(although they are quite skilled) while completely ignoring that they also have much better gear than guilds they face.

    My point is that Valhalla is not a bunch of Bill Gates, Donald Trumps, and Warren Buffets all of a sudden deciding to play PWI and FCing to 101 and not know jack about the game. It takes 50-80 people that know what they are doing to win a TW. We lack the organization right now but we're also underdogs in this fight. People don't see it that way.

    People see it as OMG EVERY SINGLE LAST Valhalla has r9 and they still can't win. In reality Catalyst has more r9s than us and more of their r9s are DDs which makes a bigger impact in TW. We have many r9s who are sins and barbs and clerics. In my opinion r9 is meant for dealing damage not taking hits when you consider that the set bonus gives only 20 defense levels and it gives 60 attack levels and so r9 wizzies and archers will make a bigger impact.

    How effective is an r9 sin when he pops out of stealth and gets gang ***** by 3-4 r9 archers? How effective is an r9 Barb when wizards have 90+ attack levels? Our guild composition does not allow us to put more DDs in TW. They have 11r9 archers to our 3. 4r9 wizzies to our 1.

    Doesn't it say something that I am the 4th best geared archer in Valhalla and yet if I were in Catalyst I would be like the 17th best geared archer? That means nothing to you guys? I can't kill hardly anything in TW... I wonder how the other Valhalla archers feel.

    I will be the first to admit that we lack organization and teamwork right now. But come on. Cut us some freaking slack instead of just being like "roll over and die cause you guys suck and even csing couldn't save you"


    It is possible for us to beat Catalyst yes. But to do that takes a lot of coordination and skill that we lack and we are also undergeared. It's hard to beat (Skill + Gear) even if you have (Skill - Gear).

    If you're gonna tell me QQmore go get better gears you're missing the point.
  • Woneo - Harshlands
    Woneo - Harshlands Posts: 1,086 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Doesn't change the fact that Val had two more squads. Pretty sure a squad full of val's can take out an archer like Jekel.

    Most of our r9 archers only have the bow aswell, and not the set. :o.
  • _Althea_ - Harshlands
    _Althea_ - Harshlands Posts: 352 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Yknow, something I DO have to ask....

    Why DO people immediately charge thousands after hitting level 100? Someone asked this in another thread and no one really commented on it, but seriously: why? If you charge thousands and immediately hit r9 +12, then no one can compete with you except for the elite few who either did the exact same, have been playing since the server began or spent so much time farming that they could accuse PWI of slave labor. Every time I see a r9 at west that's killing everyone, I just leave. There's no point, because although it IS possible to kill a r9, it's a ridiculous uphill climb.
    In the meantime, I've spent $0 on the game and I'm sure I have far more fun than those who **** out a giant gold **** on the devs' stomaches. Why? Cause when I go out to west, people don't run from me. They stay and fight. Furthermore I actually forced to put SOME thought into what I do since I can't just kill people by looking at them funny. I'm getting far more bang for my buck in this game, which is ironic and hysterical considering I haven't even paid whereas some of them have paid small fortunes into this game.

    I guess what I'm saying is, stop paying PWI and pay my rent instead.

    Nah. My point is, now Valhalla has actually put themselves in an interesting position. They lack experience (both in TW and, for some of them, PK as well) and desperately need more if they're to beat Catalyst, yet BECAUSE their gear is so OP, they're gonna have a hell of a hard time building up that experience. Who are they gonna practice on? There's no one they can practice fighting expect for Catalyst, which isn't the most active PK guild and as far as TW goes, it'll take weeks before Val shows improvement. People might jump ship before then.

    What he said. I think it's hilarious how I've spent little to no money on the game, granted I have spent about a total of $100 over the course of two years playing : but it's hilarious to see people that level characters to 100 and then immediately spend thousands upon thousands of dollars to gear that character up. The game doesn't start at 100. At least that's the common belief. Or was...?

    You jerks, go spend that money by feeding starving children in Canada er sumthin...

    Longknife also makes another good point: how is Valhalla going to learn the ropes if nobody will fight them/they're too powerful already to practice group PVP/ect. ArmaniEx (Oh God I can't believe I'm saying this<333...) is right, too. SOME Catalyst members really did slave themselves to get where they are now...granted there are some back stories that would prove otherwise..but for the most part I know of a few who really worked hard for what they have.

    o.0 Just my thoughts of agreement.
  • Longknife - Harshlands
    Longknife - Harshlands Posts: 4,843 Arc User
    edited May 2011

    My point is that Valhalla is not a bunch of Bill Gates, Donald Trumps, and Warren Buffets all of a sudden deciding to play PWI and FCing to 101 and not know jack about the game.

    I can name three r9s in your guild who regularly stun themselves on me and make otherwise-suicidal mistakes whilst fighting me, but win anyways because they've got faceroll-quality gear.
    People see it as OMG EVERY SINGLE LAST Valhalla has r9 and they still can't win.
    You know why people probably say that?

    Because none of us can ****ing PK a single Valhalla without an army of 14 r9s coming to gank us. Ijs.

    It is possible for us to beat Catalyst yes. But to do that takes a lot of coordination and skill that we lack and we are also undergeared. It's hard to beat (Skill + Gear) even if you have (Skill - Gear).

    If you're gonna tell me QQmore go get better gears you're missing the point.

    I don't get the point of your post. You yourself say it's a lack of organization over and over and over. I don't know who you expect to sympathize with Valhalla's "lack of gear."

    No sympathy from me though. If Crimson-flippin'-Jr can actually organize and take down a r9 +12 Psy (or whatever Deity is, though I'm sure the refines are at least +10) with several level 100s backing him up while we've only got 20-30 level 80-100s at our disposal (like 4 of those actually being level 100 DDs), all while we only have one cata barb, two lowbies barbs and my ghetto butt pulling cata, then excuse me for not sympathizing.

    I just kinda get irritated when this server seems to only offer crystal sprints, and every time someone loses to this SAME group of people that've been in control for a year now, all the losers can do is shout "cash shoppers" instead of actually looking at what mistakes were made. You'll never get anywhere if you just use gear as an excuse to fall back on. As I've said before, I was in Catalyst vs. Valhalla PK fights and Val usually won, a Valhalla usually wins the Tournament and all the while the gear is EXACTLY the same as it always is. The variable here is that Catalyst knows what they're doing and actually plans for TW, NOT the gear.
    I <3 AGOREY
  • Nospheratu - Harshlands
    Nospheratu - Harshlands Posts: 39 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Let's put it this way. If Valhalla had won people would have been saying oh it's just because everyone in Valhalla is +12 r9 which is not even true.

    So why can't I spin it the other way? Catalyst has better gear than Valhalla period. I was trying to be unbiased by acknowledging our faults.
  • Hipotacros - Harshlands
    Hipotacros - Harshlands Posts: 64 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Catalyst 50 core is in average probably just as well geared as Valhalla 50 core, but while catalyst core is mainly composed of Archers, Wizzards and some Bms and barbs, Vahlalla core is composed of assasins and some Archers and Wizzards. Catalyst is much better prepared for TW than Vallala is, Catalyst has a much better team-work than Valhalla has and also a much better leadership.
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  • Acrelar - Harshlands
    Acrelar - Harshlands Posts: 305 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Let's put it this way. If Valhalla had won people would have been saying oh it's just because everyone in Valhalla is +12 r9 which is not even true.

    So why can't I spin it the other way? Catalyst has better gear than Valhalla period. I was trying to be unbiased by acknowledging our faults.

    Kylin had better gear than Zulu and got rolled. I don't know what kind of gear the average valhalla has but I've been oneshot a couple times by people I've either never heard of or I know just plain suck (looking at you crit-BT-Taarloor). Gear doesn't buy strategy (let's push C!! C again! go C! C?! YES C!), nor proper execution of such, which is the only reason Valhalla lost.

    Counting FULL R9s, not R9bows, I'm sure we're down by far.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  • Curso - Harshlands
    Curso - Harshlands Posts: 27 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    In my opinion r9 is meant for dealing damage not taking hits when you consider that the set bonus gives only 20 defense levels and it gives 60 attack levels and so r9 wizzies and archers will make a bigger impact.

    They have 11r9 archers to our 3. 4r9 wizzies to our 1.

    Doesn't it say something that I am the 4th best geared archer in Valhalla and yet if I were in Catalyst I would be like the 17th best geared archer?

    so far u did pretty well defending yourself alone vs all these catalyst nos, however..

    R9 gives 25 def lvl at lowest, if u choose not to use R9 ring thats a bit weird for most players, even if u +11 lunar i still dont agree it being better then the R9 ring, also full R9 gives 63 att lvl but thats not the point

    im not sure how many R9 archers we have or how many u have but we only have 2 R9 mages (nurfed/hellzdemon) and u have 2 as well (taarloor/afterlife guy wich name i cant remember)

    if u would join Catalyst u wouldnt be the 17th best geared archer, your def is better then quite a few of our R9 archers since our "11" archers mostly only have the bow, +10 R9 is prob better then +12 second cast with purge but its not a massive difference

    u guys do lack a load of organisation and your players dont really know how to play there class in TW, im not in a hurry to explain it to u guys how u should TW or how to use your class but since there are so many PW-MY legends in there that shouldnt be to hard to figure out ^^

    what i do think is that u over-estimated yourself by going trough the TW lands as a tunnelsnake (seewhatididthere) asuming u could just role any guild wich get in your way, u kinda made it really difficult for yourself.

    i was expecting more from u guys on certain grounds cuz at max it really was 65v80 for both nights and u even had 6 cata's (with your barbs it should make a difference) but the time it lasted was pretty much the same as the 4v4 TW.

    Hope u guys can just improve and we can have some real TW's in the nearby future because this isnt really a challange for any of us. With your members u should be able to do alot better.

    thanks for the TW
  • Woneo - Harshlands
    Woneo - Harshlands Posts: 1,086 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Take the top 3 geared in Valhalla for dd
    Wytche
    UrDian
    Banzzok?

    Top 3 for cata for dd
    Jekel
    Nurfed?HellzDemon?
    Lilhellz?

    Your top r9 players are better geared then ours :S
  • Nospheratu - Harshlands
    Nospheratu - Harshlands Posts: 39 Arc User
    edited May 2011

    Counting FULL R9s, not R9bows, I'm sure we're down by far.

    Lol you act like r9 bows don't do jack. Did you see Curses 12k Crit on urDian? don't pretend it's meaningless. who are these people you haven't heard of that oneshot you? Of course you haven't heard of them you don't even play the game unless your in an instance. I can't remember the last time I've seen you outside of TW.
  • Curso - Harshlands
    Curso - Harshlands Posts: 27 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Lol you act like r9 bows don't do jack. Did you see Curses 12k Crit on urDian? don't pretend it's meaningless. who are these people you haven't heard of that oneshot you? Of course you haven't heard of them you don't even play the game unless your in an instance. I can't remember the last time I've seen you outside of TW.

    tbh a 12k crit when someone is purged and DG'd is only a 3k normal hit unbuffed. thats not that much for +12 R9

    also u have to many sins, they are made to make world pvp boring and useless while infact they are boring and useless themself when it comes to TW
  • VenomousEmo - Harshlands
    VenomousEmo - Harshlands Posts: 860 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Take the top 3 geared in Valhalla for dd
    Wytche
    UrDian
    Banzzok?

    Top 3 for cata for dd
    Jekel
    Nurfed?HellzDemon?
    Lilhellz?

    Your top r9 players are better geared then ours :S


    They kicked Banz. They're probably slapping themselves now for doing that, trololololo.


    Really now, it's probably Godz_Raven in Banz's spot. Full r9 archer +10/+12 right der.
    Nos, if I were you, I'd really just stop wasting my time here. You fully admitted to Valhalla lacking organization and experience, but then basically say the only reason we won is because of gear. Like Longknife said, if you were to use actual communication, you could take down targets easily. Don't tell me those 2-3 squads weren't an advantage; if a bunch of 8x/9x undergeared alts and a couple lvl 100's can take down a HA r9 psyic, don't tell me ya'll can't do the same (since Valhalla is one hundred times better geared than CrimsonJr) Right now, it's just excuse after excuse. The majority of people who have r9 here farmed it or merchanted for it. I remember seeing Curses, Elednor, Barbapapa, etc, all the time grinding for DQ when I was still in Crimson (Curses liked chasing me back then QQ) but they'd be there sometimes as long as I would (hours and hours...) So stop saying "Herpderp all they do is CS for r9 herpderp" cuz you have absolutely no idea what you're saying. All you're good at is making excuses, and twisting others words into your own.
    GG.



    And RedBetty, dun be hatin' on mai dia. She be mine and she be pro <3 b:cute
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Acrelar - Harshlands
    Acrelar - Harshlands Posts: 305 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Lol you act like r9 bows don't do jack. Did you see Curses 12k Crit on urDian? don't pretend it's meaningless.

    not saying r9 bows don't do anything, but it's a difference if you have a guild full of glasscannons vs. a guild full of armored cannons.
    who are these people you haven't heard of that oneshot you? Of course you haven't heard of them you don't even play the game unless your in an instance. I can't remember the last time I've seen you outside of TW.

    I don't know their names, random csers that got r9 in 3months while I quit playing I'm assuming. My point is, that there's a bunch of well-geared people there, even if you take a few names like Diancecht, Wytche, Banz (who I heard got kicked or something though?)

    Anyways, cya next week.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Sig made by Scarlet
  • Woneo - Harshlands
    Woneo - Harshlands Posts: 1,086 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    ****.
    I just used my +12 orb to +1, it was a simple mistake.
  • Eoria - Harshlands
    Eoria - Harshlands Posts: 6,118 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    They kicked Banz. They're probably slapping themselves now for doing that, trololololo.

    I talked to Banzy yesterday. He left. For very justified reasons, honestly.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    "subtraction has the butt of an angel" - Paulrogers
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    /blatant sig copy is blatant

    105/105/105 obtained! b:cute
  • Nospheratu - Harshlands
    Nospheratu - Harshlands Posts: 39 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    ****.
    I just used my +12 orb to +1, it was a simple mistake.
    yes everything I will ever say is meaningless because I made a mistake once. I'm sorry for not being perfect like you herpderp.
  • Woneo - Harshlands
    Woneo - Harshlands Posts: 1,086 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    You are forgiven.
    Not really. How do you **** up that bad?
  • Hhlolz - Harshlands
    Hhlolz - Harshlands Posts: 574 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    tbh Catalyst have way more OP geared people than valhalla, so i dont know what all this bragging is about but r9 bow means ALOT, +30 atk lvl aint nothing b:bye

    @Curso
    Since when do EP buffs cut damage in half? please learn the basics of this game first and then buy r9.

    @Emo
    stop acting like you are a factor in catalyst please, you never been a factor and you never will be (besides being an e-*****)b:bye
    *Faildom*
    I don't need a Squad
    Level a Venomancer to 90.
    Aug 12, 2009
  • VenomousEmo - Harshlands
    VenomousEmo - Harshlands Posts: 860 Arc User
    edited May 2011

    @Emo
    stop acting like you are a factor in catalyst please, you never been a factor and you never will be (besides being an e-*****)b:bye

    umadbrah?

    yeumad.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • ArchAngeLi - Harshlands
    ArchAngeLi - Harshlands Posts: 285 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    It was depressing to watch so many R9s +12 not being able to killl anything on that video lol. I said it before. Valhalla don't bother with base buffers, nor would people buff themselves. I saw Dian repeatedly go out completely unbuffed... I guess he just trusts his +12 gears too much. Also, their squads are based on lanes "defend ur lane, C? yes C!". They thinkin they are playing chess or some board strategy games. On top of that, they mixed all channels together, so whenever someone called targets, noone knew who the *** was callin it. I dunno how many mistakes they did for the 2nd war cause I got kicked off guild the night before.

    Well.. it was fun. I'll go back to farm now.
  • Hhlolz - Harshlands
    Hhlolz - Harshlands Posts: 574 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    umadbrah?

    yeumad.

    Your comebacks dictionary isnt the biggest, think ive saw that comeback like 7 times todayb:cute
    *Faildom*
    I don't need a Squad
    Level a Venomancer to 90.
    Aug 12, 2009
  • Curses - Harshlands
    Curses - Harshlands Posts: 401 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Tbh, we're forgetting people like wolfo and hitman (who have actually both 1 shot me) hit harder than your super mage taarloor. I think taarloor put all his magic stats into trollarity. Valhalla is just not utilizing what they have. 15-20 average geared people (which is modest for valhalla) is a significant advantage. I cant kill 20 people...can anyone? so if they've killed someone like me, or like nurfed, or jekel, or anyone, they've created an advantage for themselves. 20 people can do more than focus down someone like me.

    My stand is that our gears are competitive, maybe now that you're losing members we have more...but for the wars of this weekend, they are competitive. But...even if ours were better by a margin, theres no way to describe them as "severely better". And a 20 person advantage can absolutely compensate for any small margin of gear different. Even if those 20 people came into the war and didnt do any damage..20 people contribute so much to crowd control (stuns, sleeps, seals, etc)... and with iron guards every person can do something useful for at least 2 seconds.

    Ya..about what vemo said regarding CS'ers. Everyone assumes people with good gear are heavy cs'ers...which is fine, people will think what they want and u likely wont get them to change there mind. But i havent CS'd even once since I got my rank 8. My r9 +12 was farmed. I got the +12 orb cheap from hudini who got it from a pack. Lots of valhalla and other people can attest for me farming every day at spiders or in the desert to get 1 peice of r9. People like raynox actually farmed all of his r9. If i was cs'er i wouldnt have been running around with +7 nirvana gear while people like banz and wytche were running around with +11-12 r9. I only recently +10'd my (outdated) armor from the money i saved over several months. 1/3 of the money spent came from the 2 lunar rings I got from some luck at the monday tiger event.

    I actually feel kinda dumb for csing in the past. I learned my lesson after they made r8 70 bucks. In my opinion your investments in the game arent safe or guaranteed and I personally dont feel comfortable spending even 50 bucks anymore. Plus what ive been able to get my gear up to without csing makes me wonder why I even bothered cs'ing in the past. Props to the people who figured that out faster than I did.

    I know barba doesnt CS and his gear is now actually slightly better than mine. It's all irrelevant whether people believe it or not. The point is we know that some people in both guilds actually have good gear from other means than CS'ing (merchanting, farming, etc). So I don't attribute a win or loss to CS'ing. Lottsss of people are getting good gear now....people ive never even seen or heard of coming out with gear equal or better than mine. Realistically though, what can you say when u kill someone, and they go "F*cking CS'er". You can say...well i dont actually CS... but the odds of them believing that are quite low. I choose to let people believe what they want and accepted you likely wont be able to change their opinion...nor does their opinion matter. Catalyst has CS'ers and farmers. So does valhalla. Some people do a little of both. If someone beats us, I'm not going to hold anyone's gear against them and try to take something away from their accomplishment..because I know to beat a significant group like us is going to take a great deal of skill. Just like we're assuming it takes a great deal of skill to beat those MY pro's.
  • VenomousEmo - Harshlands
    VenomousEmo - Harshlands Posts: 860 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Your comebacks dictionary isnt the biggest, think ive saw that comeback like 7 times todayb:cute

    Naw, it's pree big. I just don't feel the need to argue with you to prove you're a dumbass since everyone knows you are already. b:cute
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • ArmaniEx - Harshlands
    ArmaniEx - Harshlands Posts: 191 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Like when we had to deal with banz and kaly in tw, they were r9..zulu archers weren't..ask banz and kaly how we took them down? With r8 archers..(nurfed wasn't r9 yet) we had hellzdemon and urdian had already left to valhalla...



    Herp derp FOCUS FIRE, sins are rather useless in tw...but since valhalla has some pretty op sins with r9 daggers...a squad of sins can drop a r9 archer..Herpppp derpppp