Bms vs. Barbs -Major Respect Lack

Cernunnosx - Heavens Tear

Everyone has their own view on the "perfect party" but at times you just have to make do with what you have........ its not hard if people know how to play their characters.
Done many a BH without a Barb, or Veno, even done BH79/89 without a cleric.
Even ran FF with 3 archers, 1 cleric and 2 Bm's tanking.

But people would rather sit and wait 3 hours for the cookie cutter perfect party, rather than learn more about their own characters skills, and limits

Santacruz - Heavens Tear

when are people going to stop moaning and learn to work together as a team?

meirlerman

sorry for posting after such a dragging thread b:laugh

people dont like it when Bm's tank because~
while all the BM's who use axe/hammer (like 70% of the BM community) use heavy armor and invested in Hp and Def gems, it's easy to think they can tank due to high defense and sort of high HP. (lets say 6000 hp after shards and buffs).
but it's a mistake to think that way. because defense and hp are only 2/3 of the requirment.
they are lacking the most importent thing: aggro control.
without aggro control they cant tank nothing, because their only aggro pulling comes from their damage. and any wizard or archer can out-damage them at any stage of the boss fight (its lame when just befor people kill the boss, the boss change target and wipe the team.)

what worse, most of the BM's dont have 6000 hp. lvl 60 start with 2000 hp and with improvment goes to 4000 hp, while a barb at that lvl sky high to 7000 or 8000.

due to BM skills, it only shows that their main job was set to PVP, more then pve. and in that case. they were ment to do damage more then tanking.

if you are a BM and you do want to tank. what you have to do is earn a good genie, teach her the alpha male, and then you got a chance to be the "off tank". which main job is to protect the team from add's, while the barb tank the boss, or any singulary mob (for example, your team cought up with 3 mobs and you dont have a puller. then the barb charge on 1 mob. but the cleric heal him and pull the other 2 mobs. then you charge in, alpha male, and the 2 mobs attack you. due to your defense, you can hold them up while every body finish the third where the barb is fighting.)
do mind that alpha male is costly on energy. and that it suit for pve, while genies are mostly used in pvp.

any thing i missed? :P

Cernunnosx - Heavens Tear

meirlerman wrote: »

without aggro control they cant tank nothing, because their only aggro pulling comes from their damage. and any wizard or archer can out-damage them at any stage of the boss fight

That is no differant than if a Herc tanks (on non [?] bosses), If a Herc is tanking then other classes have to control their DD output or give the Herc a headstart on the boss and thats how it should be if a Bm is tanking.. weird how if a wiz pulls agro from a herc its the wizzies fault, but if he pulls it from a BM its the BM's fault

Thirion - Dreamweaver

Cernunnosx - Heavens Tear wrote: »

That is no differant than if a Herc tanks (on non [?] bosses), If a Herc is tanking then other classes have to control their DD output or give the Herc a headstart on the boss and thats how it should be if a Bm is tanking.. weird how if a wiz pulls agro from a herc its the wizzies fault, but if he pulls it from a BM its the BM's fault

to my knowledge, a herc has a good aggro pulling skills. not surprisingly many people use it.
from my experience, leting 1 herc tank and 2 veno's healing, is a good tanking build, since ive never had a squad wipe with it. but i had way too many wipes when a BM tanked. too many for me to trust BM's on it, sorry b:surrender
also, i've never had to hold back when a herc tanked. truely, a herc is an OP pet :P

oh and its not the BM fault. if a team deside a BM will tank, their suppose to hold the DD back. any one fail to do that is his/her fault.

Cernunnosx - Heavens Tear

Thirion - Dreamweaver wrote: »

also, i've never had to hold back when a herc tanked. truely, a herc is an OP pet :P

Weird,I must have squaded with bad veno's/herc's then, since if i dont give the Herc a headstart on an non [?] boss or control my DD, I can steal the agro easily and thats on a BM

Brael - Dreamweaver

Thirion - Dreamweaver wrote: »

to my knowledge, a herc has a good aggro pulling skills. not surprisingly many people use it.

Herc aggro sucks. Of the various tanking pets venos have (magmites, qingfu's, hercs, nix, and so on) the only one that's consistently lower aggro than a herc is an Eldergoth Marksman/Sharpshooter that's tanking from range. Aggro skills are the biggest portion of pet aggro, and due to those buffs which make up half a hercs considerable power, they only have room for one aggro skill (pets are limited to 4 skills, each buff uses a skill slot). Just about any other pet a veno uses to tank is going to have atleast two aggro skills which means... more skill aggro.

On bosses, a hercs aggro is a little better because reflect aggro is going to scale. If something has higher attack, reflect is going to turn back more damage, leading to more aggro. On ? mobs (or any other mob a squad fights over 40 levels above them... or less to a lesser extent) aggro is going to be better as the pet isn't taking a damage reduction while players are.

XxArchmagexX - Dreamweaver

SIMPLE FB RULEZ

BM with 2 or more clerics = victory

BM with 1 cleric (unless it a much higher lvl cleric) = disaster

Barbariankev - Heavens Tear

Necro FTL...............

AlbireoTwo - Lost City

xxarchmagexx - Dreamweaver wrote: »

simple Fb Rulez

Bm With 2 Or More Clerics = Victory

Bm With 1 Cleric (unless It A Much Higher Lvl Cleric) = Disaster

Simple Forum Rulez

Dont Bring Back Old Threads.

Quilue - Sanctuary

Thirion - Dreamweaver wrote: »

to my knowledge, a herc has a good aggro pulling skills. not surprisingly many people use it.
from my experience, leting 1 herc tank and 2 veno's healing, is a good tanking build, since ive never had a squad wipe with it. but i had way too many wipes when a BM tanked. too many for me to trust BM's on it, sorry b:surrender
also, i've never had to hold back when a herc tanked. truely, a herc is an OP pet :P

oh and its not the BM fault. if a team deside a BM will tank, their suppose to hold the DD back. any one fail to do that is his/her fault.

on a boss that is not lvl ? herc cannot hold aggro and DDs absolutely must wait before attacking the boss. i have taken aggro using lvl 60 fists with a herc tanking. with bow it's even easier.

_MonoxidE_ - Sanctuary

archalo wrote: »

Personally i've been wondering this. Why are bms treated so poorly. One day im out farming and there's people who needed a bh51 tank badly. So on the third tele i decided to help them i am a 8x bm. Next thing you know the lead sees my class and kicks me from the squad. Where the hell is the respect?? Did they expect a barb or veno herc? They're lucky to have even gotten a tank. I want some of those people to post here why they look down on bms so much as unable to pvp or tank. 1st was the one where sword bms were no good until eventually the high ones started to own all the other classes easy and now alot of people are dissing bms as no good for tanks. Btw is this happening just on the harshland server? On a later note to all the noobs on harshlands server - since barb culti is broken for most new barbs who dont have tiger form and only one skill. Appreciate the help of bms. We dont havta help you get your quests done at all. Respect people cuz to raise a barbs phys def up to tank level you need both bm and cleric buffs. Barbs aint no tank class without us and if anyone says they rule pvp it's a lie. Bms wont die as fast as barbs proven fact i killed a demon barb while i was at level 81. Can someone give me a good reason why these these 5x 6x 7x noobs are all dissing bm class? They've played long enough they should've learned by now.

P.s. - Stevvo on harshlands plz redo your class/character. If you can't respect the class you even play than don't play it all thank you.

I wonder how many bm's participated in all the veno hate a while back?

Enzio - Heavens Tear

Honestly, nowadays with the oracles out. You can't find a decent person anymore. They are Oracle babies, trying to play a class they have no idea how to play. I have a Barb and I have a BM I lvled them both up by grinding my **** off and questing. People have mains spend millions of coins on an alt they don't have any idea how to use. As a BM I know what I can and can not do. Same as with my Barb. I respect that, I don't try to out do it and get a party wiped out of my stupidity, I do that enough when I'm solo grinding to see if I can do it.

Jhaernyl - Heavens Tear

XxArchmagexX - Dreamweaver wrote: »

SIMPLE FB RULEZ

BM with 2 or more clerics = victory

BM with 1 cleric (unless it a much higher lvl cleric) = disaster

*shakes head * wrong on so many counts

Ussichu - Sanctuary

Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »

on a boss that is not lvl ? herc cannot hold aggro and DDs absolutely must wait before attacking the boss. i have taken aggro using lvl 60 fists with a herc tanking. with bow it's even easier.

+1, i take aggro off non fist BMs with fists (if a demon spark.... ITS TEMPTING DX) b:surrender

WaffleChan - Sanctuary

boo @ necros

eatwithspoons

I think this thread needs to die now, was necroed at least twice by my countb:chuckle