v182 Update discussion thread.

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  • SnowFalling - Dreamweaver
    SnowFalling - Dreamweaver Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    SgtSIaughter - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    the other 10% are either just out to kiss the GM/Mod's butt or afraid of the ban-hammer happy dictatorship which is PWi.

    Nail on the head, my friend.
  • Jhaernyl - Heavens Tear
    Jhaernyl - Heavens Tear Posts: 118 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    SgtSIaughter - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    the other 10% are either just out to kiss the GM/Mod's butt or afraid of the ban-hammer happy dictatorship which is PWi.

    Or we are just not overly bothered by it all, we get on, have fun and play the game in our own way.
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Jhaernyl - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Or we are just not overly bothered by it all, we get on, have fun and play the game in our own way.

    Yup, never underestimate the purchasing power of the casual gamer. (The higher one's level, the lower the chance they are satisfied with this "Anniversary".) Edit: Better yet, as your level approaches 105, your probability of being happy with the update approaches 0.

    I just wonder if it is enough for PWI to subsist on.
  • Jhaernyl - Heavens Tear
    Jhaernyl - Heavens Tear Posts: 118 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Falls - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Yup, never underestimate the purchasing power of the casual gamer.

    I just wonder if it is enough for PWI to subsist on.

    If you mean by casual gamer that, yes I realise this is a "game" and Im not to bothered who has what items, or how many refines in said item, then yes you are correct.

    More important rl things to worry about
  • eatwithspoons
    eatwithspoons Posts: 54 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    SnowFalling - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    You're mini-modding. You actions are your claims.

    flaming has never been allowed, please post on topic, these little arguments aren't necessary
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  • rsin
    rsin Posts: 163 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    SgtSIaughter - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I don't see anything being rectified even though 90% of the community is upset, the other 10% are either just out to kiss the GM/Mod's butt or afraid of the ban-hammer happy dictatorship which is PWi.

    Most of the upset people have calmed down. Gm's already said they are listening to everyones concearns. Its very pointless though to argue concearns if people do it while breaking rules. The ban hammer for one, means no rectification of anything unless your happy with creating a new account and starting from scratch, which would defeat the arguement and reason for looking for solutions. For those who so-called kiss Gm's butts as you say.. I simply practice common sense, courtesy, manners and have respect to not be a jerk about things because it truly gets nothing done. Voicing concearns is not a problem if its done in a proper manner. Being loud, rude and the senseless bashing of people is just immature.
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Jhaernyl - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    If you mean by casual gamer that, yes, I realize this is a "game", and I'm not too bothered by who has what items, or how many refines in said item, then yes you are correct.

    More important IRL things to worry about

    Yeah, that is what I mean.

    Although, it is only fair that you understand that at my level and class, at the current price of things, I can't even PLAY this game, certainly not how I used to. I could start a Veno =/, but that is quite the lame solution.
  • Kamikiri - Lost City
    Kamikiri - Lost City Posts: 182 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    I quit like 4 weeks ago, I came on the forums out of curiosity only to discover cash shoppers walking around with easily obtained CV/Lunar glade, pimped out tomes, crazy grade gems.
    But I raged so hard about the warsoul thing. >:O Yeah I shouldn't lt it bug me but weapons like that, dear lord there was a GOOD REASON IT WAS PRACTICALY IMPOSSIBLE before this new patch.
    If I may add, imagine a CS crazy barb loaded with vit gems and 12+ Brothers of fear fully buffed.
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=91de1b8d504b73b5 We already have a pretty cool demon barb on LC named Ballin, get him a warsoul and he shall be a god amoung barbs b:bye
    Even if prices drop, gold wise...there will be pleanty of after effects.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    ಙೆ_ಙೆ Rage sauce face, it's my expression everytime you necro a thread. ~Made by Konariraiden!
  • Lord__Zoa - Harshlands
    Lord__Zoa - Harshlands Posts: 164 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    this thing is depressing and i cant do my college home work now :(

    btw i bought 20 packs and nothing good came out XD

    but hEY i got 120 oracleII :D
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • DeathBanana - Heavens Tear
    DeathBanana - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,674 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Kamikiri - Lost City wrote: »
    I quit like 4 weeks ago, I came on the forums out of curiosity only to discover cash shoppers walking around with easily obtained CV/Lunar glade, pimped out tomes, crazy grade gems.
    But I raged so hard about the warsoul thing. >:O Yeah I shouldnt let it bug me but weapons like that, dear lord there was a GOOD REASON IT WAS PRACTICALY IMPOSSIBLE before this new patch.
    If I may add, imagine a CS crazy barb loaded with vit gems and 12+ Brothers of fear fully buffed.
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=1c72455df6b594a8 We already have a pretty cool demon barb on LC named Ballin, get him a warsoul and he shall be a god amoung barbs b:bye
    Even if prices drop, gold wise...there will be pleanty of after effects.

    lol, at first I thought that was real, I was all "O_O"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    9x Demon Cleric
  • Jhaernyl - Heavens Tear
    Jhaernyl - Heavens Tear Posts: 118 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Falls - Sanctuary wrote: »

    Although, it is only fair that you understand that at my level and class, at the current price of things, I can't even PLAY this game, certainly not how I used to.

    I do understand (since my main is a lvl 86 BM), and yes this patch with added charm cost, high end gear and shards will affect those that partake in PvP. So im not saying people dont have valid concerns, but that doesnt make the rest of us "evil butt kissers scared of the banhammer" because we choose to play the game in a differant way, with differant priorities

    Kamikiri - Lost City wrote: »
    I quit like 4 weeks ago, I came on the forums out of curiosity only to discover cash shoppers walking around with easily obtained CV/Lunar glade, pimped out tomes, crazy grade gems.

    Gold prices are high ... why ? because non cash shoppers are buying it up to buy these packs, so seriously you cant just point the finger at those that charge zen.

    How many millions of gc have dominant TW factions got to buy gold with and buy these packs, without even touching a credit card etc ?

    non-cash shop buyers are not all innocent
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    DeathBanana - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    lol, at first I thought that was real, I was all "O_O"

    LOL, I think his point is that it is quite realistic (If someone doesn't already have it).
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Jhaernyl - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I do understand (since my main is a lvl 86 BM), and yes, this patch with added charm cost, high end gear and shards will affect those that partake in PvP. So I'm not saying people don't have valid concerns, but that doesn't make the rest of us "evil butt kissers scared of the ban-hammer" because we choose to play the game in a different way, with different priorities

    To avoid misrepresentation, I will say that I never suggested that. (I know you didn't mean me.)
  • DeathBanana - Heavens Tear
    DeathBanana - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,674 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Falls - Sanctuary wrote: »
    LOL, I think his point is that it is quite realistic (If someone doesn't already have it).

    Sad but true.

    Also, Cliche-Double_post.jpg
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    9x Demon Cleric
  • Kamikiri - Lost City
    Kamikiri - Lost City Posts: 182 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Jhaernyl - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Gold prices are high ... why ? because non cash shoppers are buying it up to buy these packs, so seriously you cant just point the finger at those that charge zen.

    How many millions of gc have dominant TW factions got to buy gold with and buy these packs, without even touching a credit card etc ?

    non-cash shop buyers are not all innocent
    Gold comes from somewhere, It must be payed for with IRL cash before it is put in auction for whatever the seller wants. Secondly I damn well know dominant TW factions will be cashing in on this or leaving the game/raging because some random 6x gets a Lunar gold weapon instantly, when they took time to farm for it. There are exceptions to when non-cash shoppers buy gold; for charms, miji, dolls.. you know consumables? Now when gold is up to 400k/300k vs the amount of gold you can grind per hour. Only people with no life that farm 6+ hours aday can afford to purchase these boxes not even alot.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    ಙೆ_ಙೆ Rage sauce face, it's my expression everytime you necro a thread. ~Made by Konariraiden!
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Yeah, that TW Faction bit is untrue. I spent my entire time in PWI in my server's dominant TW Faction, and I have spent plenty buying Gold Charms. The fact that my entire 2-3M TW Paycheck (Among the highest) now has to go entirely to buying Gold Charms for a weekend's worth of defenses, makes me pity those who I am fighting against.
  • Redmenace - Heavens Tear
    Redmenace - Heavens Tear Posts: 908 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Falls - Sanctuary wrote: »
    1. Your point was to insult?

    2. You too are making an argument from ignorance that I could not know how a business will react, or how their decisions are made. That is the point. Obviously, I don't know all their circumstances. But I can make a practical assessment of the situation. Just as everyday I reach the practical conclusion that gravity will continue to function, even though there is nothing telling me so.

    So you can argue me logically and practically or you can continue to say; "You don't know nothing, and that can't be right" --- Argument From Ignorance.

    Whereas *your* argument is to put words into my mouth and the mouths of those who disagree with you.

    At no point in my previous messages did I say "you don't know how a business will react". You continue to attack me for an insult and a statement *You* generated, by assuming *you* know my opinion on the matter, and extending the argument out in a direction I never intended, to make yourself look more impressive.

    This is why you are a jerk. It has *nothing* to do with your opinions on business models, and everything to do with the dishonest method in which you discuss with those who disagree with you.

    I haven't even been able to discuss possible motives for PW's business model, because I've been too busy wading through the conjecture and fabrication and veiled insults to *find* your point.

    You have decided for yourself, that because an idea has sprung into your head, and it makes sense to you, then it must be correct, and anyone else who hasn't come to these "obvious and logical conclusions" is a deluded bastage.

    RedMenace
    \still looking
    \\hasn't yet found the Wikipedia entry for "self-righteous jack***"
    \\\but has the picture that goes next to the definition
    A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.
    Robert A. Heinlein
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Redmenace - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Whereas *your* argument is to put words into my mouth and the mouths of those who disagree with you.

    At no point in my previous messages did I say "you don't know how a business will react". You continue to attack me for an insult and a statement *You* generated, by assuming *you* know my opinion on the matter, and extending the argument out in a direction I never intended, to make yourself look more impressive.

    This is why you are a jerk. It has *nothing* to do with your opinions on business models, and everything to do with the dishonest method in which you discuss with those who disagree with you.

    I haven't even been able to discuss possible motives for PW's business model, because I've been too busy wading through the conjecture and fabrication and veiled insults to *find* your point.

    You have decided for yourself, that because an idea has sprung into your head, and it makes sense to you, then it must be correct, and anyone else who hasn't come to these "obvious and logical conclusions" is a deluded bastage.

    RedMenace
    \still looking
    \\hasn't yet found the Wikipedia entry for "self-righteous jack***"
    \\\but has the picture that goes next to the definition

    And I was too busy discussing PWs business motives to be bothered by trolls who keep flaming me pointlessly.

    Edit: Your whole post was just a huge personal attack, with the possible exception of your question as to why I assumed that you you were going to argue about what ever I was arguing about at the time. Its simple, because if I didn't, then your post would amount to a great big "WTF does this have to do with anything?".

    You admit it yourself, you have no clue what point I was defending, you just didn't like the method. Tough.
  • Jhaernyl - Heavens Tear
    Jhaernyl - Heavens Tear Posts: 118 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Falls - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Yeah, that TW Faction bit is untrue. I spent my entire time in PWI in my server's dominant TW Faction, and I have spent plenty buying Gold Charms. The fact that my entire 2-3M TW Paycheck (Among the highest) now has to go entirely to buying Gold Charms for a weekend's worth of defenses, makes me pity those who I am fighting against.

    For some people in TW factions yes it might be untrue, but saying that who is buying all the gold then to force the prices higher ?
  • Redmenace - Heavens Tear
    Redmenace - Heavens Tear Posts: 908 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Falls - Sanctuary wrote: »
    And I was too busy discussing PWs business motives to be bothered by trolls who keep flaming me pointlessly.

    There's that stunning discussion style we've all come to know and love.

    RedMenace

    \I don't know why PW does what it does
    \\no one else here does, either
    \\\except you, of course
    A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.
    Robert A. Heinlein
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Redmenace - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    There's that stunning discussion style we've all come to know and love.

    RedMenace

    \I don't know why PW does what it does
    \\no one else here does, either
    \\\except you, of course

    Personal attack.
  • eatwithspoons
    eatwithspoons Posts: 54 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    hey hey! let's keep it civil
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  • Redmenace - Heavens Tear
    Redmenace - Heavens Tear Posts: 908 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Falls - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Personal attack.

    Since there are no words I can use that you approve of, could you please refresh me on your opinion of what PW's intent is, (or point me to the relevant message number) and I will (honestly, I will) respond to just that statement?

    RedMenace
    A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.
    Robert A. Heinlein
  • SnowFalling - Dreamweaver
    SnowFalling - Dreamweaver Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Granted, disagreeing is NOT flaming, but c'mon guys. We can do better than this. Just... agree to disagree and let's just hope something good comes out of all of this.
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Redmenace - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Since there are no words I can use that you approve of, could you please refresh me on your opinion of what PW's intent is, (or point me to the relevant message number) and I will (honestly, I will) respond to just that statement?

    RedMenace

    Page 136, surprisingly enough I seemed to log in as you logged out, or we would've done this earlier.

    Keep in mind that I spent the rest of the time arguing the last sentence.

    Edit: Back after dinner in case you respond.
  • Kamikiri - Lost City
    Kamikiri - Lost City Posts: 182 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Kyon kun, Denwa...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    ಙೆ_ಙೆ Rage sauce face, it's my expression everytime you necro a thread. ~Made by Konariraiden!
  • Redmenace - Heavens Tear
    Redmenace - Heavens Tear Posts: 908 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Falls - Sanctuary wrote: »
    No. I ain't no sheeple b:angry. xD


    For those not in the know, the ONLY thing a company measures its success by is their profit.

    Is this event profitable in the short term? Oh heck yeah!

    What does this event mean for the long term profitability of PWI? I dunno. I can only speculate, but it looks grim to me. b:shy

    I kind of get the impression that they are giving up to their *censored* competition, and trying to cash out (Free Zen Scam FTW? xD). But I could be wrong *cough cough*.

    Perhaps many Cash Shoppers do stay, and they are happy with a game where they can buy everything they want, no actual "playing" required. Gosh, who plays MMORPGs these days xD? I mean those people are already heavily invested in their character so they have the greatest Exit Costs (Which is why game companies always find it profitable to shaft the high levels with every update ;D.)

    Either way, it won't be the same game by the time the next month comes around. I however, do trust in one thing: The company is doing everything they can to maximize profits. b:victory

    I hope they're not giving up in the face of their upcoming competition. Frankly, the only place I've heard of the new [censored] game was here, despite the best efforts of the mods to shush the Game-Which-Shall-Not-Be-Named. I've been too busy playing *this* game.

    I believe the angst over people getting high-end weapons is higher than the actual effect on the game will be, but that's only a guess - as we don't have numbers on how many have "escaped" and what is being done with them. (Personally, I imagine high-lvl players whispering the Duke-announced winners and offering large sums to them straight away - so those lvl 40 veno's don't actually keep that lvl 99 bow after all.)

    I agree the company is maximizing their profits. I personally believe PW has been unable to do much of anything that actually *pleases* the high-lvl players - or at least for very long, and has decided "**** it - scatter gold upon the masses (and make real $$ in the process)"

    The intent of this game is to make cash money via the website, and the way to do that is to attract people to the game with a free ride, then point out how nice it would be if you bought some nice fashion or a fancy mount, and make their $$ there.

    If you want to compare business models - movie theatres. The ticket cost just barely pays for the cost of renting the film itself. The real money is in the concession stand.

    Cash shop - concession stand

    RedMenace
    A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.
    Robert A. Heinlein
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Redmenace - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I hope they're not giving up in the face of their upcoming competition. Frankly, the only place I've heard of the new [censored] game was here, despite the best efforts of the mods to shush the Game-Which-Shall-Not-Be-Named. I've been too busy playing *this* game.

    I believe the angst over people getting high-end weapons is higher than the actual effect on the game will be, but that's only a guess - as we don't have numbers on how many have "escaped" and what is being done with them. (Personally, I imagine high-lvl players whispering the Duke-announced winners and offering large sums to them straight away - so those lvl 40 veno's don't actually keep that lvl 99 bow after all.)

    I agree the company is maximizing their profits. I personally believe PW has been unable to do much of anything that actually *pleases* the high-lvl players - or at least for very long, and has decided "**** it - scatter gold upon the masses (and make real $$ in the process)"

    The intent of this game is to make cash money via the website, and the way to do that is to attract people to the game with a free ride, then point out how nice it would be if you bought some nice fashion or a fancy mount, and make their $$ there.

    If you want to compare business models - movie theatre. The ticket cost just barely pays for the cost of renting the film itself. The real money is in the concession stand.

    Cash shop - concession stand

    RedMenace

    Yeah, I hope their not cashing out too. I agree with what you say xD.

    A guy who used to own some McDonald's franchises I know always used to say, that their best profit came out of the sugar water.

    I just realized theater is only recognized by that spelling under PWIs spell check. (As opposed to theatre.)
  • reallydisappointed
    reallydisappointed Posts: 15 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    I could personally care less about whether or not anyone agrees with anyone elses ideas or thoughts...this thread was not created to argue the point of who is right or who is wrong It was created to point out the flaws with the latest patch and event that is still going on and will continue to carry on. Which some of us have done..others well..they havent..some havent even had anything at all to say.
    I posted a lengthy post on page 114 with some legitimate and constructive ideas on ways to fix the problems at hand..then again i posted another with some different ideas and insight on page 121, then a shorter post with a totally new thought on page131, then on page 144 i ask a direct question to the GM who seems to be lead on this situation and by page 156 i still dont see a response of any sort from anyone on anything other than who is right or who is wrong...wat difference who is right or who is wrong when a problem the size of this one exists People feel cheated by end game gear being handed out people feel wronged by the fact that these packs have created or will soon create such an imbalance in the game for those who dont have access to them that it will shortly become a mute point for them to even bother to log on, thus making the game practically unplayable by a large portion of the people. Eatwithspoons the only reason your posts seem to cause people to flame more is *in my opinion* the lack of response from u. perhaps if u an some of the other GM's could post and tell us wat is going on regularly then maybe flames wont be the only reaction to your post. If flaming happens Delete the flaming post so we dont have to sift thru them if people dont see flames they wont be inspired to respond with flames. Some of us would like to have an adult discussion about these events that is either going to affect us all negatively or positively. this post is in no way meant to be a flame towards anyone who has posted an reposted it is simply a post to ask the GMs for some responses that actually tell us something rather than posts defending their lack of response
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    reallydisappointed wrote: »
    I could personally care less about whether or not anyone agrees with anyone elses ideas or thoughts...this thread was not created to argue the point of who is right or who is wrong It was created to point out the flaws with the latest patch and event that is still going on and will continue to carry on. Which some of us have done..others well..they havent..some havent even had anything at all to say.
    I posted a lengthy post on page 114 with some legitimate and constructive ideas on ways to fix the problems at hand..then again i posted another with some different ideas and insight on page 121, then a shorter post with a totally new thought on page131, then on page 144 i ask a direct question to the GM who seems to be lead on this situation and by page 156 i still dont see a response of any sort from anyone on anything other than who is right or who is wrong...wat difference who is right or who is wrong when a problem the size of this one exists People feel cheated by end game gear being handed out people feel wronged by the fact that these packs have created or will soon create such an imbalance in the game for those who dont have access to them that it will shortly become a mute point for them to even bother to log on, thus making the game practically unplayable by a large portion of the people. Eatwithspoons the only reason your posts seem to cause people to flame more is *in my opinion* the lack of response from u. perhaps if u an some of the other GM's could post and tell us wat is going on regularly then maybe flames wont be the only reaction to your post. If flaming happens Delete the flaming post so we dont have to sift thru them if people dont see flames they wont be inspired to respond with flames. Some of us would like to have an adult discussion about these events that is either going to affect us all negatively or positively. this post is in no way meant to be a flame towards anyone who has posted an reposted it is simply a post to ask the GMs for some responses that actually tell us something rather than posts defending their lack of response

    I posted my suggestions several times too, I'm not going back to check though xD. It went like this: "Add a useful coin sink".

    We can only hope they're taking notes or something.
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