Hey guys, the stat curves are getting a second balancing pass. As a general rule of thumb now at level 70 all of your stats should be more competitive against each other.
As a soft rule, 400 Points in any stat is worth 1% of whatever it does (Deflect Rating into Deflect Chance for example).
Additionally, we are buffing the Cooldown Reduction portion of recovery to make it fall more in line with what its expected performance should be. Every 200 points will generate 1% shorter cooldowns (keep in mind that 100% CDR actually cuts your cooldowns in half).
I don't know yet when these changes will hit preview, but they should make statting a much simpler thing to do going forward.
Have you considered the possibility to give enchants a flat percentile boost?
Have you considered the possibility to give enchants a flat percentile boost?
they also need to better clarify when those % are in crease of the Stat point value or the effective %
Such as there was a Passive Feat that increased Armor Pen stat by x %, but it was % based on current Armor Pen stat, which would mean useless if your stats were not 3k+ (I think they since changed this, but the wording is still confusing)
Such as the FInal 3 Dragon Boons, Lifesteal % is a DIrect % increase of the chance to Proc Lifesteal. Cryptic needs to make these % increases Visible on the character sheet too, when I chose the lifesteal increase on live server, I was unable to "see" an actual Number change on any of my stats on character sheet. leaves you with more questions and less satisfaction lol
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aulduronMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,351Arc User
edited February 2015
As lifesteal stands now, I don't see anyone ever beating Tiamat again.
As it stands now there is no reason to choose Defense over HP in any situation. Even with the above announcement that 400 defense will equal 1% DR (before it was 393.5, so that would actually be worse), it is still just vastly inferior to HP.
Here's the math:
Let's say I have 50,000 HP, and 0 Defense. If I add 100 Defense, my effective HP becomes 50,000/(1-1/400) = 50,125. Alternatively, I can add 400 HP and make my effective HP 50,400. Which is quite a bit better an effective HP than if I had added defense. The value of HP is so much higher, in fact, that the break-even point is 159,600. That is, If I had 159,600 HP then adding 100 defense will be equivalent to adding 400 HP in terms of effective HP. So people should only stack HP up to that point before they even consider adding defense.
Now I understand that the goal is to prevent characters, especially non-tanks, from becoming too tanky. But defense needs to be made somewhat competitive with HP, especially for classes that are supposed to be more durable. I think at a minimum you need to give GF's, Guardian OP's, and GWF's better defense curves than you give to CW's, SW's, TR's, and DC's. My CW should need to hide behind a tank to stay safe. But there's really no way for a GF to get the durability they need to do their job properly with the slope of the Defense Curve.
Hey guys, the stat curves are getting a second balancing pass. As a general rule of thumb now at level 70 all of your stats should be more competitive against each other.
As a soft rule, 400 Points in any stat is worth 1% of whatever it does (Deflect Rating into Deflect Chance for example).
Additionally, we are buffing the Cooldown Reduction portion of recovery to make it fall more in line with what its expected performance should be. Every 200 points will generate 1% shorter cooldowns (keep in mind that 100% CDR actually cuts your cooldowns in half).
I don't know yet when these changes will hit preview, but they should make statting a much simpler thing to do going forward.
thank you for the update. I dont necessarily agree with the blanket 400 pts = 1% as I agreed with your previous system where stats like Crit and lifesteal had much higher "entry requirements". I believe those stats *should* be harder to stack than power and defense. What I would have changed in your formula is the %. 400 pts = 1.5% for power.. 900 pts = 1.5% lifesteal .. etc.
I agree with another poster who says "PLEASE UPDATE OUR GEAR" on preview - because alot of the whining and QQing is because people are looking at their stats in their current unmodified gear and being underwhelmed. I can see my Swashbuckling gear on the collections page HAS changed - but I cannot get that gear in my current inventory on preview (without spending a fair bit of AD on Live)
Bedlam: Creating chaos as a MI Exec TR Avariel Merilwen: Burn baby, MoF/Rene Aejun The Silver: Devoted to Healing, DevOP/Justice Mina Rosepetal: Super Natural, Pathfinder/Melee Frost: Benchwarmer, Soulbinder/Fury
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aulduronMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,351Arc User
edited February 2015
PLEASE UPDATE OUR GEAR
And give us 4/4 bonuses that compare to HP and HV, or we'll be staying in the same gear. I'm already wishing there was a way to play without gaining levels.
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ironzerg79Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,942Arc User
edited February 2015
I actually like the idea of the increase in each stat being relatively consistent. Now I can ask myself, "What has a bigger impact on my build? 1% more power or 1% more critical strike?" and build accordingly, instead of having to do a second layer of math to figure out the impact and then the point cost.
Hey guys, the stat curves are getting a second balancing pass. As a general rule of thumb now at level 70 all of your stats should be more competitive against each other.
As a soft rule, 400 Points in any stat is worth 1% of whatever it does (Deflect Rating into Deflect Chance for example).
Additionally, we are buffing the Cooldown Reduction portion of recovery to make it fall more in line with what its expected performance should be. Every 200 points will generate 1% shorter cooldowns (keep in mind that 100% CDR actually cuts your cooldowns in half).
I don't know yet when these changes will hit preview, but they should make statting a much simpler thing to do going forward.
The 69% damage bonus I get from power @ 11,497 Will now require 27,600 power for the same damage?
I hope the increased weapon damage makes up for it.
My spirit is broken again. Just like last mod. I've lost all desire to play on live or preview.
Also as a minor update we are updating Great Weapon Fighter weapon damage to be roughly 20% higher. This should hit at the same time as updated stat curves.
Also as a minor update we are updating Great Weapon Fighter weapon damage to be roughly 20% higher. This should hit at the same time as updated stat curves.
Also as a minor update we are updating Great Weapon Fighter weapon damage to be roughly 20% higher. This should hit at the same time as updated stat curves.
Also as a minor update we are updating Great Weapon Fighter weapon damage to be roughly 20% higher. This should hit at the same time as updated stat curves.
Boy that's a lot. Was already liking the new AoE capabilities, PVE GWFs should be beasting again.
Also as a minor update we are updating Great Weapon Fighter weapon damage to be roughly 20% higher. This should hit at the same time as updated stat curves.
That's great news. Now please, do something about threat generation of Sentinel GWF. Paladin has taken away our secondary tank role with his many aoe and single target hard taunts.
great news but there is still problem with GWF survaviblity in m6 due to no regen and lack of LS
I second this. With the damage increase GWF will be where it should be dps wise but there's still the issue of survivability, threat generation and utility. For example, even tank Paladin retains some of his heals that are more than enough for self sustain and his threat generation, taunts and the many buffs are insane. Our Battle Fury is not enough for utility, restoring strike is too dependant on damage dealt to be of any use for survivability and our somewhat 200% threat generation is not enough to steal aggro from pure dps classes and save them from getting killed.
Also as a minor update we are updating Great Weapon Fighter weapon damage to be roughly 20% higher. This should hit at the same time as updated stat curves.
Crush, I BEG you to re-evaluate this. GWFs dont just need "20% more weapon damage" because this drastically impacts ALL forms of damage. What GWFs REALLY need are stronger AT WILLS.
The more and more you keep buffing other sources of damage just means you will see GWFs doing 100k IBS. then youll nerf damage and constantly playing wack-a-mole.
Now if you want to make GWFs more balanced what you really need to do is start looking at at wills.
1) REMOVE the damage penalty during unstoppable for at wills (this now becomes a DPS boost)
2) Increase the damage of AT WILLS - Sure Strike should have the same "code" as Crushing Surge for damage. Thus Sure Strike should hit MUCH harder (due to increased weapon damage) over the GFs at will. Reaping Strike, Weapon Master Strike should all be beefed up.
3) Remove the damage loss on multiple targets on AoE At Wills.
THAT will bring GWFs much more in line. Buffing ALL damage will just turn a GWF into an OP damage machine. Buffing SOME of his damage abilities (at wills) removes the "1 shots" in PVE and PVP but gives them adequate damage.
Why does a lvl 1 HR's at will hit harder than a GWFs? Just shows you its not balanced....
DOUBLE to TRIPLE the amount of TEMP HP GWFs get on unstoppable and give that HP AFTER unstoppable ends. Problem solved.
Now that Temp HP counts TOWARDS building determination after youve popped it once. So yes itll still be a pain to get down to 60-65% HP to use unstoppable. But once you do, youll get a nice Temp HP buffer AFTER unstoppable ends, which makes your next unstoppable much much faster....
what dmg? i made it to 18k power on ptr now and it cant even compete with my dmg on live.
Wait until gear gets a second pass.
Was on the PTR last night at lvl 61 critting Intimidation for 80k+ Sure this is a dummy but 20% more damage and then lets wait until Drow gear gets a buff.
Or you can go Destroyer and with the new rank 4 Destroyer feat, you can see some crazy numbers. See the GWF thread about this.
Overall, we dont need just a 20% increase to weapon damage. We need a 100% increase to AT WILL DAMAGE and then the penalty for at wills removed in unstoppable.
The "gap" in damage between at wills and encounters is just stupid right now. YOu feel like swinging a wet noodle until you can IBS or Intimidation then if it hits AND crits its a Train going 200 MPH on your face....
When I swing a 2H sword I want it to feel like a 2H sword.
I go on my 2.5k Power PROT GF and at will a dummy for 1800. My sure strike hits dummies for 1200 with 14k Power. Tell me how that physics works out at alll
Was on the PTR last night at lvl 61 critting Intimidation for 80k+ Sure this is a dummy but 20% more damage and then lets wait until Drow gear gets a buff.
Or you can go Destroyer and with the new rank 4 Destroyer feat, you can see some crazy numbers. See the GWF thread about this.
Overall, we dont need just a 20% increase to weapon damage. We need a 100% increase to AT WILL DAMAGE and then the penalty for at wills removed in unstoppable.
The "gap" in damage between at wills and encounters is just stupid right now. YOu feel like swinging a wet noodle until you can IBS or Intimidation then if it hits AND crits its a Train going 200 MPH on your face....
When I swing a 2H sword I want it to feel like a 2H sword.
I go on my 2.5k Power PROT GF and at will a dummy for 1800. My sure strike hits dummies for 1200 with 14k Power. Tell me how that physics works out at alll
Weapon damage increase won't affect intimidation the slightest. All its base damage is from power and power alone. Weapon damage doesn't play a part.
Weapon damage increase won't affect intimidation the slightest. All its base damage is from power and power alone. Weapon damage doesn't play a part.
Very True. However many discussions in the GWF world have been swapping Intimidation FROM power TO weapon damage. With lvl 70 gear and rank 12s youll be able to stack a CRAZY high number for Power. You will get less % dmg yes, but stacking 30k Power will mean a 10k BASE damage which is much higher. Also the Intimidation issue currently is that it forces Sentinels (Tanks) to HAVE to stack Power (DPS stat) to be effective. So its counter-productive to allow this as a "tanking tool" when its clearly not being used as such.
Making it % weapon damage prevents crazy scaling as well as allowing those sentinels to stack defensive stats to you know... tank better.
But yes, you are correct. weapon damage wont help that niche build. Itll just make destroyers hit crazy hard IBS.
Hey guys, the stat curves are getting a second balancing pass. As a general rule of thumb now at level 70 all of your stats should be more competitive against each other.
As a soft rule, 400 Points in any stat is worth 1% of whatever it does (Deflect Rating into Deflect Chance for example).
Additionally, we are buffing the Cooldown Reduction portion of recovery to make it fall more in line with what its expected performance should be. Every 200 points will generate 1% shorter cooldowns (keep in mind that 100% CDR actually cuts your cooldowns in half).
I don't know yet when these changes will hit preview, but they should make statting a much simpler thing to do going forward.
High Vizier's 4 Piece bonus at 3 stacks is now only ~3.5% buff/debuff. Time to go buy a T1 set I guess.
Also as a minor update we are updating Great Weapon Fighter weapon damage to be roughly 20% higher. This should hit at the same time as updated stat curves.
Hey guys, the stat curves are getting a second balancing pass. As a general rule of thumb now at level 70 all of your stats should be more competitive against each other.
As a soft rule, 400 Points in any stat is worth 1% of whatever it does (Deflect Rating into Deflect Chance for example).
Additionally, we are buffing the Cooldown Reduction portion of recovery to make it fall more in line with what its expected performance should be. Every 200 points will generate 1% shorter cooldowns (keep in mind that 100% CDR actually cuts your cooldowns in half).
I don't know yet when these changes will hit preview, but they should make statting a much simpler thing to do going forward.
Feedback:
- Technically the "buff" to Recovery doesn't make it any better than its live version. At 2k Recovery, we get roughly 16.5% Recharge Speed. With the changes you guys intend for Recovery, 2k will become 10%. That's a huge nerf. And if we need 400 points to effectively increase our stat percentages by 1%, I'm not really sure anymore how exactly we are going to efficiently stack the stats we need on our builds. I usually agree with the changes you guys impose upon the game, but this is just too cruel for stat stacking.
These changes would take the fun out of creating specialized builds, specially those that relied on utility stats such as Recovery. I've seen very creative builds that relied on deflect, movement, recovery, AP gain, Control Bonus and the likes, but this change would make stacking stats pretty much unintelligent and unreliable if this pushes through. Right now, it doesn't seem as graceful as the opening posts claim it would be.
Not to mention HP, the most OP stat right now in live (and still in the future, in case this pushes through), is still unaffected by diminishing returns. This will essentially be the go-to stat now that stacking other stats no longer gives any reliable benefits.
I understand that these changes are needed to tone down the insane DPS people are dishing out with their beatstick builds, but at the very least, if you guys are seriously planning on imposing such a cruel change for stat stacking, please give us alternative ways to earn the stat percentages we need. If this will be done via equipment, then our equips will need to have FAR more stat points than they currently have in live.
Anyway, I usually do not say things like these but this is very concerning. I'm just wishing for favorable updates regarding this.
Feedback:
- Technically the "buff" to Recovery doesn't make it any better than its live version. At 2k Recovery, we get roughly 16.5% Recharge Speed. With the changes you guys intend for Recovery, 2k will become 10%. That's a huge nerf. And if we need 400 points to effectively increase our stat percentages by 1%, I'm not really sure anymore how exactly we are going to efficiently stack the stats we need on our builds. I usually agree with the changes you guys impose upon the game, but this is just too cruel for stat stacking.
These changes would take the fun out of creating specialized builds, specially those that relied on utility stats such as Recovery. I've seen very creative builds that relied on deflect, movement, recovery, AP gain, Control Bonus and the likes, but this change would make stacking stats pretty much unintelligent and unreliable if this pushes through. Right now, it doesn't seem as graceful as the opening posts claim it would be.
Not to mention HP, the most OP stat right now in live (and still in the future, in case this pushes through), is still unaffected by diminishing returns. This will essentially be the go-to stat now that stacking other stats no longer gives any reliable benefits.
I understand that these changes are needed to tone down the insane DPS people are dishing out with their beatstick builds, but at the very least, if you guys are seriously planning on imposing such a cruel change for stat stacking, please give us alternative ways to earn the stat percentages we need. If this will be done via equipment, then our equips will need to have FAR more stat points than they currently have in live.
Anyway, I usually do not say things like these but this is very concerning. I'm just wishing for favorable updates regarding this.
We will eventually be releasing gear that gets you back there, but not at launch of module 6. One of our primary goals with the new curves was give us better control over an end game progression and a longer time scale with which to deliver meaningful upgrades and content
stat change is good. been roflstomping everything since mod2 and I'm not even BiS enchants and artis back then. no more soft-capping every stat finally.
With the value of stats decreasing I thought that it might be the case that non-augment pets might finally find some use. So I did some testing and found that, no, just about every companion I have is completely useless even at Legendary level. Level 70 enemies either crush them, or ignore them.
For example, I ran around the Drowned Shores with a Legendary upgraded Galeb Dhur summoned and ACT running. Over a period of time doing quests and HE's I inflicted 23.3 million damage and took 636k damage. The Galeb Dhur inflicted 163k damage (0.7% of my damage output) and absorbed 35,620 damage (5.6% of the damage I took). I believe most of the damage the Galeb Dhur took was when he stood in an AoE that was targeting me and I got hit anyway. So it's not like he actually took very many hits for me. In short, in a region with level 60+ enemies an expensive, upgraded zen store companion is a walking pile of uselessness. It can't deal damage, can't draw aggro, and wouldn't be able to keep aggro if it could draw it.
Most companions are just hood ornaments. They look nice while not doing anything functionally useful. That's not unique to tanks. Every non-tank companion has the problem of dying almost instantly any time there's an actual tough fight.
Please consider re-working companions so that they can serve a function at level 70. They have their uses while leveling, but the enemies have gotten so strong and deal so much damage that companions are worthless after someone hits level 60.
I cannot for several reasons. The first of which is that revealing underlying math that controls the game (a la stat curves) would get me in pretty serious trouble. Second reason is that they are substantially more complex to better allow us to tune them on a level by level basis. Each stat curve has additional variables that let us tune or scale how good the curves are for particular level brackets or even particular levels. This gives us a level of control that we did not have with the old flat curves where any change would affect the whole game and made tweaking them far more difficult. With the new curves we can selectively turn a lot more dials and get stats performing where we want them an individual level basis. To accurately graph these curves I would need a better way to communicate 3 and 4 dimensional graphs in visual form. As pretty as 3D graphs are, they aren't very useful for much beyond looking at overall trends
We will eventually be releasing gear that gets you back there, but not at launch of module 6. One of our primary goals with the new curves was give us better control over an end game progression and a longer time scale with which to deliver meaningful upgrades and content. Your gear now has far more room to grow than it ever did before in the old system, without becoming wildly more complicated. It is also worth keeping in mind that your raw power (damage dealt/healed or effective health as the case may be) are going up pretty drastically in these 10 levels as a factor of how steeply weapon damage has increased as well as how we are granting HP going forward. While your raw crit chance is going down, this is not a relative measure of how powerful you are any more because everything else that feeds into critical chance is changing as well. Overall you *are* getting much stronger, and will have far more room to grow and improve that power.
Look. Let's be BRUTALLY HONEST for a moment.
This has been the party line for forever. Yet it has lead to the very things you claim to be correcting. I remember when I build a GF Tactician Build that could essentially function as a CW in Malabog's Castle. That enabled parties to take fewer CWs into parties and run a more rainbow spread. I know, because I farmed MC every day.
The next release, presto, Cyrptic said the very same things you are saying now, but obliterated the value of Tacticians and GFs completely. Overnight, though you said the same as you said above, it all became about CW DPS builds. All other classes need not apply.
I mean, I run CN now, for nostalgia, because you can't make the instance useful. (Why?) I can do it with no CW, because my DC can function as such. Do this, and no. Instantly, CN is rendered back into a 4-5 CW instance. No other class need apply. It's the same as when you nerfed eternal singularity. You made worse the very same community behavior you claimed you were trying to curb. This would be literally the 4th time you've tried to do the same thing and gotten the opposite outcome. You will get *again* the same contrary outcome.
If you want to open up content to NON CONTROL WIZARDS nerfing AP and RECOVERY is the last thing to do. The more you do that, the more we stack CWs. I could solo CW or take (cheerfully) non SS CWs into MC. I wanted that Artifact but would farm the whole dungeon regardless. The day you nerfed Malestrum was the day I stopped farming, and now the instance is Guild Only. How does that help anything?
Look, you want money from me? I want sexy fashion gear and better dyes on the Zen Market.
Additionally, we are buffing the Cooldown Reduction portion of recovery to make it fall more in line with what its expected performance should be. Every 200 points will generate 1% shorter cooldowns (keep in mind that 100% CDR actually cuts your cooldowns in half).
This might be a good time to step away from increasing the rate. It makes more sense to just reduce the cooldown times because it is easier to understand. This is especially true when translations (like the German translation) are talking about reduced times not rates, which is clearly wrong.
This might be a good time to step away from increasing the rate. It makes more sense to just reduce the cooldown times because it is easier to understand. This is especially true when translations (like the German translation) are talking about reduced times not rates, which is clearly wrong.
3. Effective recharge speed with 10k recovery (which is possible on Live) + CW Draconic set buff:
10k recovery = 50 RSI%, CW Draconic set buff = +10 RSI%
Current system: 20 / (1 + 60/100) = 12.5
Proposed system: 20 / (1 - 60/100) = 8
In the proposed system the best stat to stack would be recovery, since you could reach a point where you could play using only your encounters, which would result in more DPS than any +dmg% you can get from power or other sources.
With increase in artifact & enchantment levels, greater kits, and the new gear that will be introduced you should be able to reach 80%+ RSI if you focus on stacking recovery.
A curve using 1/x is an asymptote. It's used to create diminish return curve in x/(1+x).
In the case of cooldown reduction, we have a DR for Recovery rating followed by an asymptote for the cooldown. Both working in the same manner. It's easy to think that it's twice more punishing but it's not really the case.
If the cooldown reduction was linear new cooldown = old cooldown*(1-x), the cooldown would reach 0s at 100%.
With a curse like : new cooldown = old cooldown/(1 + reduction), it's impossible to reach 0. At 100%, it reduce the cooldown by 2.
In short:
+ using a linear curve for Cooldown reduction give it an hard cap where it's impossible to go after 100% reduction.
+ using an asymptote curve give the possibility to go after 100%.
If you want an intuitive way to interpret cooldown reduction just call it "increased activations per a minute"
activations per a minute = activations per a minute * (1+x)
where X is your current cool down reduction. If you have a "100%" cool down reduction" in fact you have 100% more activations per a minute. There wasn't that easy to interpret!
Comments
they also need to better clarify when those % are in crease of the Stat point value or the effective %
Such as there was a Passive Feat that increased Armor Pen stat by x %, but it was % based on current Armor Pen stat, which would mean useless if your stats were not 3k+ (I think they since changed this, but the wording is still confusing)
Such as the FInal 3 Dragon Boons, Lifesteal % is a DIrect % increase of the chance to Proc Lifesteal. Cryptic needs to make these % increases Visible on the character sheet too, when I chose the lifesteal increase on live server, I was unable to "see" an actual Number change on any of my stats on character sheet. leaves you with more questions and less satisfaction lol
As it stands now there is no reason to choose Defense over HP in any situation. Even with the above announcement that 400 defense will equal 1% DR (before it was 393.5, so that would actually be worse), it is still just vastly inferior to HP.
Here's the math:
Let's say I have 50,000 HP, and 0 Defense. If I add 100 Defense, my effective HP becomes 50,000/(1-1/400) = 50,125. Alternatively, I can add 400 HP and make my effective HP 50,400. Which is quite a bit better an effective HP than if I had added defense. The value of HP is so much higher, in fact, that the break-even point is 159,600. That is, If I had 159,600 HP then adding 100 defense will be equivalent to adding 400 HP in terms of effective HP. So people should only stack HP up to that point before they even consider adding defense.
Now I understand that the goal is to prevent characters, especially non-tanks, from becoming too tanky. But defense needs to be made somewhat competitive with HP, especially for classes that are supposed to be more durable. I think at a minimum you need to give GF's, Guardian OP's, and GWF's better defense curves than you give to CW's, SW's, TR's, and DC's. My CW should need to hide behind a tank to stay safe. But there's really no way for a GF to get the durability they need to do their job properly with the slope of the Defense Curve.
thank you for the update. I dont necessarily agree with the blanket 400 pts = 1% as I agreed with your previous system where stats like Crit and lifesteal had much higher "entry requirements". I believe those stats *should* be harder to stack than power and defense. What I would have changed in your formula is the %. 400 pts = 1.5% for power.. 900 pts = 1.5% lifesteal .. etc.
I agree with another poster who says "PLEASE UPDATE OUR GEAR" on preview - because alot of the whining and QQing is because people are looking at their stats in their current unmodified gear and being underwhelmed. I can see my Swashbuckling gear on the collections page HAS changed - but I cannot get that gear in my current inventory on preview (without spending a fair bit of AD on Live)
Avariel Merilwen: Burn baby, MoF/Rene
Aejun The Silver: Devoted to Healing, DevOP/Justice
Mina Rosepetal: Super Natural, Pathfinder/Melee
Frost: Benchwarmer, Soulbinder/Fury
And give us 4/4 bonuses that compare to HP and HV, or we'll be staying in the same gear. I'm already wishing there was a way to play without gaining levels.
The 69% damage bonus I get from power @ 11,497 Will now require 27,600 power for the same damage?
I hope the increased weapon damage makes up for it.
My spirit is broken again. Just like last mod. I've lost all desire to play on live or preview.
can SW has too plz
Well that's good news. Praise bejesus.
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
Boy that's a lot. Was already liking the new AoE capabilities, PVE GWFs should be beasting again.
That's great news. Now please, do something about threat generation of Sentinel GWF. Paladin has taken away our secondary tank role with his many aoe and single target hard taunts.
I second this. With the damage increase GWF will be where it should be dps wise but there's still the issue of survivability, threat generation and utility. For example, even tank Paladin retains some of his heals that are more than enough for self sustain and his threat generation, taunts and the many buffs are insane. Our Battle Fury is not enough for utility, restoring strike is too dependant on damage dealt to be of any use for survivability and our somewhat 200% threat generation is not enough to steal aggro from pure dps classes and save them from getting killed.
Crush, I BEG you to re-evaluate this. GWFs dont just need "20% more weapon damage" because this drastically impacts ALL forms of damage. What GWFs REALLY need are stronger AT WILLS.
The more and more you keep buffing other sources of damage just means you will see GWFs doing 100k IBS. then youll nerf damage and constantly playing wack-a-mole.
Now if you want to make GWFs more balanced what you really need to do is start looking at at wills.
1) REMOVE the damage penalty during unstoppable for at wills (this now becomes a DPS boost)
2) Increase the damage of AT WILLS - Sure Strike should have the same "code" as Crushing Surge for damage. Thus Sure Strike should hit MUCH harder (due to increased weapon damage) over the GFs at will. Reaping Strike, Weapon Master Strike should all be beefed up.
3) Remove the damage loss on multiple targets on AoE At Wills.
THAT will bring GWFs much more in line. Buffing ALL damage will just turn a GWF into an OP damage machine. Buffing SOME of his damage abilities (at wills) removes the "1 shots" in PVE and PVP but gives them adequate damage.
Why does a lvl 1 HR's at will hit harder than a GWFs? Just shows you its not balanced....
This too has been addressed and a solution given.
DOUBLE to TRIPLE the amount of TEMP HP GWFs get on unstoppable and give that HP AFTER unstoppable ends. Problem solved.
Now that Temp HP counts TOWARDS building determination after youve popped it once. So yes itll still be a pain to get down to 60-65% HP to use unstoppable. But once you do, youll get a nice Temp HP buffer AFTER unstoppable ends, which makes your next unstoppable much much faster....
Wait until gear gets a second pass.
Was on the PTR last night at lvl 61 critting Intimidation for 80k+ Sure this is a dummy but 20% more damage and then lets wait until Drow gear gets a buff.
Or you can go Destroyer and with the new rank 4 Destroyer feat, you can see some crazy numbers. See the GWF thread about this.
Overall, we dont need just a 20% increase to weapon damage. We need a 100% increase to AT WILL DAMAGE and then the penalty for at wills removed in unstoppable.
The "gap" in damage between at wills and encounters is just stupid right now. YOu feel like swinging a wet noodle until you can IBS or Intimidation then if it hits AND crits its a Train going 200 MPH on your face....
When I swing a 2H sword I want it to feel like a 2H sword.
I go on my 2.5k Power PROT GF and at will a dummy for 1800. My sure strike hits dummies for 1200 with 14k Power. Tell me how that physics works out at alll
Weapon damage increase won't affect intimidation the slightest. All its base damage is from power and power alone. Weapon damage doesn't play a part.
Very True. However many discussions in the GWF world have been swapping Intimidation FROM power TO weapon damage. With lvl 70 gear and rank 12s youll be able to stack a CRAZY high number for Power. You will get less % dmg yes, but stacking 30k Power will mean a 10k BASE damage which is much higher. Also the Intimidation issue currently is that it forces Sentinels (Tanks) to HAVE to stack Power (DPS stat) to be effective. So its counter-productive to allow this as a "tanking tool" when its clearly not being used as such.
Making it % weapon damage prevents crazy scaling as well as allowing those sentinels to stack defensive stats to you know... tank better.
But yes, you are correct. weapon damage wont help that niche build. Itll just make destroyers hit crazy hard IBS.
High Vizier's 4 Piece bonus at 3 stacks is now only ~3.5% buff/debuff. Time to go buy a T1 set I guess.
Thanks.
Sounds good.
Feedback:
- Technically the "buff" to Recovery doesn't make it any better than its live version. At 2k Recovery, we get roughly 16.5% Recharge Speed. With the changes you guys intend for Recovery, 2k will become 10%. That's a huge nerf. And if we need 400 points to effectively increase our stat percentages by 1%, I'm not really sure anymore how exactly we are going to efficiently stack the stats we need on our builds. I usually agree with the changes you guys impose upon the game, but this is just too cruel for stat stacking.
These changes would take the fun out of creating specialized builds, specially those that relied on utility stats such as Recovery. I've seen very creative builds that relied on deflect, movement, recovery, AP gain, Control Bonus and the likes, but this change would make stacking stats pretty much unintelligent and unreliable if this pushes through. Right now, it doesn't seem as graceful as the opening posts claim it would be.
Not to mention HP, the most OP stat right now in live (and still in the future, in case this pushes through), is still unaffected by diminishing returns. This will essentially be the go-to stat now that stacking other stats no longer gives any reliable benefits.
I understand that these changes are needed to tone down the insane DPS people are dishing out with their beatstick builds, but at the very least, if you guys are seriously planning on imposing such a cruel change for stat stacking, please give us alternative ways to earn the stat percentages we need. If this will be done via equipment, then our equips will need to have FAR more stat points than they currently have in live.
Anyway, I usually do not say things like these but this is very concerning. I'm just wishing for favorable updates regarding this.
stat change is good. been roflstomping everything since mod2 and I'm not even BiS enchants and artis back then. no more soft-capping every stat finally.
With the value of stats decreasing I thought that it might be the case that non-augment pets might finally find some use. So I did some testing and found that, no, just about every companion I have is completely useless even at Legendary level. Level 70 enemies either crush them, or ignore them.
For example, I ran around the Drowned Shores with a Legendary upgraded Galeb Dhur summoned and ACT running. Over a period of time doing quests and HE's I inflicted 23.3 million damage and took 636k damage. The Galeb Dhur inflicted 163k damage (0.7% of my damage output) and absorbed 35,620 damage (5.6% of the damage I took). I believe most of the damage the Galeb Dhur took was when he stood in an AoE that was targeting me and I got hit anyway. So it's not like he actually took very many hits for me. In short, in a region with level 60+ enemies an expensive, upgraded zen store companion is a walking pile of uselessness. It can't deal damage, can't draw aggro, and wouldn't be able to keep aggro if it could draw it.
Most companions are just hood ornaments. They look nice while not doing anything functionally useful. That's not unique to tanks. Every non-tank companion has the problem of dying almost instantly any time there's an actual tough fight.
Please consider re-working companions so that they can serve a function at level 70. They have their uses while leveling, but the enemies have gotten so strong and deal so much damage that companions are worthless after someone hits level 60.
Look. Let's be BRUTALLY HONEST for a moment.
This has been the party line for forever. Yet it has lead to the very things you claim to be correcting. I remember when I build a GF Tactician Build that could essentially function as a CW in Malabog's Castle. That enabled parties to take fewer CWs into parties and run a more rainbow spread. I know, because I farmed MC every day.
The next release, presto, Cyrptic said the very same things you are saying now, but obliterated the value of Tacticians and GFs completely. Overnight, though you said the same as you said above, it all became about CW DPS builds. All other classes need not apply.
I mean, I run CN now, for nostalgia, because you can't make the instance useful. (Why?) I can do it with no CW, because my DC can function as such. Do this, and no. Instantly, CN is rendered back into a 4-5 CW instance. No other class need apply. It's the same as when you nerfed eternal singularity. You made worse the very same community behavior you claimed you were trying to curb. This would be literally the 4th time you've tried to do the same thing and gotten the opposite outcome. You will get *again* the same contrary outcome.
If you want to open up content to NON CONTROL WIZARDS nerfing AP and RECOVERY is the last thing to do. The more you do that, the more we stack CWs. I could solo CW or take (cheerfully) non SS CWs into MC. I wanted that Artifact but would farm the whole dungeon regardless. The day you nerfed Malestrum was the day I stopped farming, and now the instance is Guild Only. How does that help anything?
Look, you want money from me? I want sexy fashion gear and better dyes on the Zen Market.
Crying to the moon.
This might be a good time to step away from increasing the rate. It makes more sense to just reduce the cooldown times because it is easier to understand. This is especially true when translations (like the German translation) are talking about reduced times not rates, which is clearly wrong.
Please consider to just use
"actual cooldown time" = "cooldown time" * (1 - x)
instead of
"actual cooldown time" = "cooldown time" / (1 + x)
That's a very bad idea and should never be implemented.
Here's a couple of examples why it's a bad idea. In all cases let's pretend the base recharge speed is 20 secs.
1. RSI required to have 0 sec cooldown:
Current system: Infinite ( 20 / (1 + Infinite/100) ~= 0 )
Proposed system: 100% (20k recovery) ( 20 * (1 - 100/100) = 0 )
2. RSI required to have 2 sec cooldown:
Current system: 900% (180k recovery) ( 20 / (1 + 900/100) = 2 )
Proposed system: 90% (18k recovery) ( 20 * (1 - 90/100) = 2 )
3. Effective recharge speed with 10k recovery (which is possible on Live) + CW Draconic set buff:
10k recovery = 50 RSI%, CW Draconic set buff = +10 RSI%
Current system: 20 / (1 + 60/100) = 12.5
Proposed system: 20 / (1 - 60/100) = 8
In the proposed system the best stat to stack would be recovery, since you could reach a point where you could play using only your encounters, which would result in more DPS than any +dmg% you can get from power or other sources.
With increase in artifact & enchantment levels, greater kits, and the new gear that will be introduced you should be able to reach 80%+ RSI if you focus on stacking recovery.
A curve using 1/x is an asymptote. It's used to create diminish return curve in x/(1+x).
In the case of cooldown reduction, we have a DR for Recovery rating followed by an asymptote for the cooldown. Both working in the same manner. It's easy to think that it's twice more punishing but it's not really the case.
If the cooldown reduction was linear new cooldown = old cooldown*(1-x), the cooldown would reach 0s at 100%.
With a curse like : new cooldown = old cooldown/(1 + reduction), it's impossible to reach 0. At 100%, it reduce the cooldown by 2.
In short:
+ using a linear curve for Cooldown reduction give it an hard cap where it's impossible to go after 100% reduction.
+ using an asymptote curve give the possibility to go after 100%.
activations per a minute = activations per a minute * (1+x)
where X is your current cool down reduction. If you have a "100%" cool down reduction" in fact you have 100% more activations per a minute. There wasn't that easy to interpret!