Limiting Threatening Rush is one of the best changes they made next to fixing Roar, and a serious quality of life improvement for other classes. Dealing with GWFs spamming Threatening Rush over and over is one of the most annoying things in the game, and extremely imbalanced. GWFs already have tons of mobility, from Bravery and Sprint (which was also boosted in how much of it you get). You also seem to be missing that the underlying point of those changes was to reduce GWF reliance on the IV path by giving a little more base mobility to the class itself while removing the extreme amount of utility that power gave.
In terms of other classes, especially CWs and DCs, not being constantly spammed with Threatening Rush is also a tremendous quality of life improvement in PvP. Anyone that plays a ranged class will probably know that experience of being unable to get any power off because they can't get away from the GWF. Undoing this change would be seriously bad for the game.
You should probably start thinking of the GWF in team terms. A GWF should rely on his teammates to lock down targets so he can attack them; he should not be a self-reliant super-mobile, hard-hitting control machine. In that context, the GWF does not require any further additions to his mobility like boosting Threatening Rush or giving back prones.
GWFs also have other options for denying opponents mobility, like the Slam daily, their set bonus, or Not So Fast.
i agree i called it when GWf got the IV path that there would be problems threatening rush alone allows you to sprint directly into to the player and once your in spammable range a target will never escape. granted i would actually be fine with takedown keeping the prone in fact i would welcome it. however what i am not to keen on is the fact GWF essentially get Gf's tab ability which in turn kinda lets the GWf have 2 tab abilities at the expense of nothing while GF's tab ability once again becomes lackluster because it has no feats to increase the dmg or effectiveness of mark.
i wouldnt be opposed to GWF getting a slight increase in dmg but please remove the permanent mark it takes away from a TAB ability for another class, anyway im all for giving takedown back it's pron but to do that your going to have to lower cc immunity and DR while sprinting it's impossible to balance prones and to be so mobile.
so from my looking at it
decrease in certain dmg unless desroyer-check
increase in survivabilty/tanking as sent-check
have 2 tab abilities-check
instigator still useless-check
alot of people that have no idea how to play GWF in for a rude awakening come mod 4-check
if for i forgot anything feel free to add it.
Strangely enough, no. Because currently, they have a broken Threatening Rush that they spam, along with a broken Roar, then Takedown and IBS. And people use Savage Advance, Avalanche of Steel or Indomitable Strength for their dailies.
You missed the point; GWFs need to think a little differently, because if their current set of powers are changing, they might want to look into different options to adapt accordingly.
Like Ayroux wisely has posted, one should not look at classes in terms of their ability to manage on their own, but in terms of their ability to function within a group. That means re-boosting Threatening Rush or Takedown is unnecessary; there are other team members who can supply control to let the GWF close in and do damage.
The thing about that though is, a class shouldnt fully be reliant on another group.
If thats the case, why even have takedown as an ability when can rely on someone else to do it for you.
Class performance shouldnt be fully on individual abilty, but it shoudlnt also be on ability in groups. It should be a degree of both. Both should be options in a class's arsenal.
I found Threatening Rush to be fine with the charges, its the refresh rate I found to be abit too high.
The other options that are there, are just that options, but alot arent very good options without some tweaking. Not so Fast for instance doesnt have a very lastful effect and the damage is poor. Most of our powers are utility based and the few we have that does damage does a bit of damage (where Takedown i sbeing taken from this catagory) or not very much.
I dont really use the cookie cutter abilties of takedown, frontline, IBS. Though I do use Takedown, and I only on occasion use IBS. I've made due with that.
But with all the changes, to the nerfs of everything, its going to be even more difficult to make due with anything that isnt cookie cutter. If people adjust, every GWF will be playing the exact same way, more than they are now, and under performing.
The thing about that though is, a class shouldnt fully be reliant on another group.
If thats the case, why even have takedown as an ability when can rely on someone else to do it for you.
Class performance shouldnt be fully on individual abilty, but it shoudlnt also be on ability in groups. It should be a degree of both. Both should be options in a class's arsenal.
I found Threatening Rush to be fine with the charges, its the refresh rate I found to be abit too high.
The other options that are there, are just that options, but alot arent very good options without some tweaking. Not so Fast for instance doesnt have a very lastful effect and the damage is poor. Most of our powers are utility based and the few we have that does damage does a bit of damage (where Takedown i sbeing taken from this catagory) or not very much.
I dont really use the cookie cutter abilties of takedown, frontline, IBS. Though I do use Takedown, and I only on occasion use IBS. I've made due with that.
But with all the changes, to the nerfs of everything, its going to be even more difficult to make due with anything that isnt cookie cutter. If people adjust, every GWF will be playing the exact same way, more than they are now, and under performing.
there are plenty ways to make the gwf viable on each paragon, but either it's planned for near future updates or they don't care.
feedback : Intimidation feat should give lower cooldowns instead of threat.
0
iceloudMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited July 2014
We thanks the Perfect World... GWF R.I.P. So we dont want play on Module 4 NW
I think the changes are appropriate. Instead of being the single best or tied-for-best class option for every single gameplay scenario, GWFs will now be performing a role and some other classes will actually be better then them at some things.
In PVP, they will maintain their status as the best class to have fighting alongside you, but will not be the best 1v1.
In PVE they will remain great.
This is good for class diversity. If anything, they're still too good considering not many classes are so great in PVE and PVP, but overall it seems like good changes.
The only concern I have is that GF has been buffed so much it's just replaced GWF as "the best class" for "everything".
I think the changes are appropriate. Instead of being the single best or tied-for-best class option for every single gameplay scenario, GWFs will now be performing a role and some other classes will actually be better then them at some things.
In PVP, they will maintain their status as the best class to have fighting alongside you, but will not be the best 1v1.
In PVE they will remain great.
This is good for class diversity. If anything, they're still too good considering not many classes are so great in PVE and PVP, but overall it seems like good changes.
The only concern I have is that GF has been buffed so much it's just replaced GWF as "the best class" for "everything".
in pve ; with half power of my gwf, my ranger, t1 weapon has a Aimed higher than my ibs full stack (16.8 non critical).
OK well in PVE yes that's nice damage, but it's single target. HRs have almost no AOE abilities.
GWF was planned to be an AoE dps (the best damages). He has few AoE encounter power with high damages (only IBS), the base damages are extremely low, and the only damages AoE we can deal is this feat with Daring Shout and Come and Get It in Sentinel (tank) tree lol.
AoE damages we have, "Damages are reduced for hitting multi-target" LOL. It's like "we want AoE encounters but we reduce damages when it hits multi-target which are already soooo low"
i iam not a elite ranger (iam not a "elite player") but... I'm not 500 threads here for nothing.
ah, yes. the base damage of gwf is ridiculous (and loose damage hit multiple targets). the advantage of gwf is: gwf "dont stop" (which has always been a problem in pve because is better you hit 90k once than sustained 100k over 10 sec... debuff dinamic, limitad content, etc).
the problem is that now also stopped and dont hit too hard. attempting to force the gwf for "tank" in order to serve as a shield for the ranger / sw is offensive.
You know Crush, This MAY be a good time to consider making Determination gain based upon % of HP lost. I know its based on final damage taken, but as GWFs and everything has more and more HP increases, that may be the better way to go.
Something around the range of 15-30% (15% lost for 50% and 30% lost for full unstoppable).
Also,
Is Frontline Surge SUPPOSED to still prone with feated?
Will Frontline add an additional .5 seconds to stun when feated to 3.5 seconds?
Mark is still falling off when being struck - defeating alot of the advantage of mark for GWFs.
Remove bonus damage to "at wills" from Executioner Style. But give the Destroyers Capstone a new feature that: Unstoppable increases attack speed, but doesnt decrease damage on at wills. - I just think its silly to have Unstoppable give you a speed increase but a damage increase too... Honestly id say to do this to ALL GWFs, but maybe thats not fair. Unstoppable should just grant, CC immunity, DR, Temp Hp, Faster attack speed, NO loss of damge - meaning its a damage boost.
0
schweifer1982Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,662Arc User
edited July 2014
Feedback :
After long testing i came to the same reason as any one else. GWF have the lowest damage on at-wills and this is not rigth any other class can hit 6-18k with at wills but GWF simply cannot mostly 3-5k .
Ofc the poor DC dont count as dps class.
Also any other class have usefull at wills but gwf reaping strike is too stupid why ?
Becase GWF have no true immunity and even if he pop up unstoppable he can be still proned stunned and reaping have too loong animation also somtimes its bugged(if i pop up unstoppable) and stuck on the half animation and cannot complite it i must always sprint to reset the animation .
I have the same issue with 1 daly Spinning Strike always interrupted by other effect (prone/stun).
But the most joke of all Daly Avalanche of Steel i am in the air ? or wath? CW and HR can kill me in the air and i have full immunity ?
Dragons and mini bosses push me stunn me in the air? GF can prone me in the air ?
This dosnt feel so rigth.
Also i agree with all players you cant call somthing balanced if you only remove from one class the prone effect .
Suggestion to remove it from all encounters from all classes . Make sure prone can be only apply on dalys .
Remove bonus damage to "at wills" from Executioner Style. But give the Destroyers Capstone a new feature that: Unstoppable increases attack speed, but doesnt decrease damage on at wills. - I just think its silly to have Unstoppable give you a speed increase but a damage increase too... Honestly id say to do this to ALL GWFs, but maybe thats not fair. Unstoppable should just grant, CC immunity, DR, Temp Hp, Faster attack speed, NO loss of damge - meaning its a damage boost.
Yeah but we absolutely need a SM rework (only the At-Will is viable, Flourish only good against mono-target fight) and a total BUFF of AoE ENCOUNTER POWERS DAMAGES. I'm annoyied to see all these AoE powers "reduced by multi-target" with only 1700-2100 damages like Not So Fast, Roar, Mighty Leap etc and all these HAMSTER long cooldown like Daring Shout etc, no damages/little damages with not any controls (SM).
GWF was planned to be the best AoE DPS. What I see is HAMSTER base damages on everything which makes the Destroyer bad : a damage buff on so low damages powers is still bad.
Agree with determination from % of HP, 30-33% for full bar, 15-17% for half bar. Right now, it's too much damage taken to use a nerfed unstoppable for 8 seconds. My latest test is 17-20k HP against a HR hitting me with some mixed attacks. Leaves a ton of room to slow the burst and pretty much never allow a GWF to go Unstoppable, while keeping healing depression up.
It's a class mechanic, and you nerfed it too much.
To give a good PvP move to SM too:
allow punishing charge to stun the target for 3 seconds if it lands. It's a short burst and other classes can just move away to avoid it. But at least would be a "proactive" way to close gap and catch enemies.
Or either make flourish viable. Aka: fast animation so that it cannot be easily dodged/ parried cause the animation allows the other classes to see it coming and make it crush on their immunity moves.
Agree on bravery back to 15% deflect and mark to WMS.
Bravery is going to be a must have again in PvP, my guess. So buffing it could be a way to soften the hard survivability nerf a bit.
i iam not a elite ranger (iam not a "elite player") but... I'm not 500 threads here for nothing.
ah, yes. the base damage of gwf is ridiculous (and loose damage hit multiple targets). the advantage of gwf is: gwf "dont stop" (which has always been a problem in pve because is better you hit 90k once than sustained 100k over 10 sec... debuff dinamic, limitad content, etc).
the problem is that now also stopped and dont hit too hard. attempting to force the gwf for "tank" in order to serve as a shield for the ranger / sw is offensive.
Well, last I checked from tests people were doing, HR and GWF and CW all did pretty much the same overall damage. Not too much has changed since then offense-wise.
Also I'm not sure why it's offensive that you'd do a little less damage since you have inherent tanking abilities and great CC. HR brings nothing but DPS to PVE. If anything, control-wise, HRs make things much WORSE thanks to split shot aggoring 5 random mobs at a time. HR's are practically an anti-CC class.
The problem has been that you've done as good or better damage than other classes (actually literally the best currently in mod3), so why not just stack groups with GWFs and CWs?
What would be nice is if people wanted a GWF for offtank and good DPS in parties, but they wanted other classes for either more CC or more DPS or healing or more tanking.
I'm not sure that's going to happen, though, since like I said most people reported classes doing about the same amount of damage overall.
My Harem: Dawn HR, Erin CW, Piper TR, Zoe GWF
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lazaroth666Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,332Arc User
edited July 2014
I remember that there was a post where Crush stated that 2% deflect can be considered 1% DR, they just nerfed the TAB by decreasing the DR that the GWF get meaning that it wouldn't make sense if they add more deflection to Bravery. However, increasing the Run Speed sounds better for me due to the synergy with sprint which we can use for both offensive and defensive.
1) 30-33% for full bar, 15-17% for half bar. AGREE Seems very reasonable to me if GWFs lose 1/3rd their HP, they should have a full 8 second unstoppable. Especially now that its nerfed down.
2) I too like the idea of beefing up Bravery. Id even rather just flat out see the DR on Sprint and CC immunity on that removed - back to LIVE sprint but we can do it longer and Bravery brought BACK up to it previous values. (Honestly alot of the Sprint DR/Immunity is just a facade of DR - you want the GWF class turning into a class where your either unstoppable dealing damage, or cheese running away to keep CC immunity up? Its not going to be used as a "gap closer" since anytime your not unstoppable your too susceptible to damage and control. You close the gap, then the second you stop to attack, GG. Also causes CWs to get frustrated STILL when they have no defensive ability against CC immune)
3) SM does need some love. The tooltip on my GF is higher than my GWF on Flourish. Now theres ALOT that goes into that, but I thought it was funny my 671 top end weap dmg is > my 1009 top end on encounter tooltip.... Just silly to me.
4) SM needs a way to mark as well. Now that mark is that much greater damage potential.
Ill test the 3 second base stuns. Still like to point out: - Feated re-enforced surge prones on the PTR. It should be a 3.5 sec stun?
Mark still disappears when taking damage - not WAI yet.
1 - The world is big ... this is my shard in live (the golem is the same person):
you say that gwf does more damage than the cw (pve) is not a truth ... is a localized phenomenon. Obviously to get to this number, I am exploring a number of bugs that were adjusted only in preview (I think). On the other hand, there was an "urgent need" to give the Class A nerf of 13% damage (one "bug" reported previously).
So my problem with "damage" is basically moral.
2 - tankness / control: control of gwf in pve, you is not to create a "security situation for themselves." The only power that has this feature is the avalanch and fls (iv. .. always iv). What we have to "control aoe" nothing more emblematic than not so fast. You causes a slow effect on opponents, but ... you are melee. Our control is basically complementary.
about "tank", nothing more immoral than now: the gwf never had aggro tools. Now he will get "aggro tools", although it has lost resistence (unstoppable). Ie, threat becomes a problem for us too (and not a tool) ... but I'm melee and depend to 10,000 stacks to be a inferior dps. gwf is not a "natural dps" (low base damage).
Ie, the destroyer being sabotaged with the argument "separate tank to dps". But this occurs at the precise moment that the cw receives a buff in shield (so.. destroyer dont receive a buff in damage?)...
So let's summarize the changes: A destroyer was sabotaged, the sentinel received "tank buffs" (to serve the new kings) and the instigator was abandoned. Compare this treatment with other classes and understand the effort that I'm not doing to not insult the "combat designer". I already asked another dev to ban my forum account ... even that. i really dont understand the reason of this thread.
sprint with all boons and everything for stamina, grants us 7 small bursts around the lenght of a HR dodge.
HRs have 5 of these dodges plus CC and damage immunity, and they are a ranged class
CWs teleport grants CC and damage immunity too and covers around 3 times the lenght of these small bursts. And they are a ranged class too.
TRs have stealth, GFs have better block.
Now, with these 7 "small bursts" we are supposed to:
close the gap to get in melee range
chase the enemy who is dodging
use sprint as a defensive move
It's is not enough. Plus, it's not enough responsive to use it defensively, compared to other classes dodge moves. You said you wanted sprint to be "in line" with other dodges.
and he's not even using all the encounters he has while the GWF with PV is unloading everything he has, IBS included.
On a side note: Devastating critical is bugged and NOT GIVING the 15% bonus damage on crit to GWFs.
Fix it please, it's like another shadow nerf to GWF damage piling up with other nerfs. We're really hitting people with a wet noodle right now.
Also: IBS after prone needed to be "in line" and lowered down, but the damage posted above is fine? To be honest right now FLS still proning (gonna be a stun soon btw) on preview is the only way a GWF can deal some damage.
Start giving back takedown prone and it will be a nice step to balance. Cause believe me, even a IBS after prone is not too much compared to what other classes do right now.
armor specialization is also not working , it isnt giving any buffs to my DR , my DR remain constant even after i spent points on it.
and any DEV can u explain the amount of buff provided by come and get it cause i sure as hell not getting any.
armor specialization is also not working , it isnt giving any buffs to my DR , my DR remain constant even after i spent points on it.
It works; I've tested it 3 separate times since module 4 went on Preview and it worked each and every time. Why not actually TEST it instead of only rely on the number sheet? Let an enemy hit you without the feat, then with the feat and test the % reduction in your logs (use the same enemy). You WILL see that you took less damage with the feat (it ends up being your base DR, as in your DR with the defense stat and AC, multiplied by 5/10/15%). It does not reflect in the character sheet but it works; you can see the for yourself with less than 2 minutes of testing. I am sick and tired of explaining this.
Can a dev please put a note in the description for Armor Specialization that it will not reflect in the character sheet?
could be a nice way to "indirectly" buff our survivability, to allow unstoppable to refill our stamina bar
plus make sprint more reliable, more responsive, to be on par with other shift moves from other classes.
Also, as said multiple times, fix determination gain to be 33% total HP for full bar, 15% total HP for half bar.
Determination should not work off % HP lost. There is no reason to punish a player for choosing to have more HP. Going off percent means you have to take more damage to get just as many unstoppables off. That defeats the point of raising HP for survivability. Same goes for gaining more defense/deflect. Just because a person has defensive stats does not mean they should be able to use it any less.
Comments
i agree i called it when GWf got the IV path that there would be problems threatening rush alone allows you to sprint directly into to the player and once your in spammable range a target will never escape. granted i would actually be fine with takedown keeping the prone in fact i would welcome it. however what i am not to keen on is the fact GWF essentially get Gf's tab ability which in turn kinda lets the GWf have 2 tab abilities at the expense of nothing while GF's tab ability once again becomes lackluster because it has no feats to increase the dmg or effectiveness of mark.
i wouldnt be opposed to GWF getting a slight increase in dmg but please remove the permanent mark it takes away from a TAB ability for another class, anyway im all for giving takedown back it's pron but to do that your going to have to lower cc immunity and DR while sprinting it's impossible to balance prones and to be so mobile.
so from my looking at it
decrease in certain dmg unless desroyer-check
increase in survivabilty/tanking as sent-check
have 2 tab abilities-check
instigator still useless-check
alot of people that have no idea how to play GWF in for a rude awakening come mod 4-check
if for i forgot anything feel free to add it.
The thing about that though is, a class shouldnt fully be reliant on another group.
If thats the case, why even have takedown as an ability when can rely on someone else to do it for you.
Class performance shouldnt be fully on individual abilty, but it shoudlnt also be on ability in groups. It should be a degree of both. Both should be options in a class's arsenal.
I found Threatening Rush to be fine with the charges, its the refresh rate I found to be abit too high.
The other options that are there, are just that options, but alot arent very good options without some tweaking. Not so Fast for instance doesnt have a very lastful effect and the damage is poor. Most of our powers are utility based and the few we have that does damage does a bit of damage (where Takedown i sbeing taken from this catagory) or not very much.
I dont really use the cookie cutter abilties of takedown, frontline, IBS. Though I do use Takedown, and I only on occasion use IBS. I've made due with that.
But with all the changes, to the nerfs of everything, its going to be even more difficult to make due with anything that isnt cookie cutter. If people adjust, every GWF will be playing the exact same way, more than they are now, and under performing.
there are plenty ways to make the gwf viable on each paragon, but either it's planned for near future updates or they don't care.
feedback : Intimidation feat should give lower cooldowns instead of threat.
In PVP, they will maintain their status as the best class to have fighting alongside you, but will not be the best 1v1.
In PVE they will remain great.
This is good for class diversity. If anything, they're still too good considering not many classes are so great in PVE and PVP, but overall it seems like good changes.
The only concern I have is that GF has been buffed so much it's just replaced GWF as "the best class" for "everything".
in pve ; with half power of my gwf, my ranger, t1 weapon has a Aimed higher than my ibs full stack (16.8 non critical).
and now, less resistant (what is the excuse now?)
is an answer to this occurs, I really hope not to be a nerf to he ranger. but this is the FACT, the Truth , not revenge, delirium or mimimi.
ps: i used a "debuff encounter" do up the ranger damage. i dont know the name of this HAMSTER...
I could post the bonus with the bf, but ... I think the situation could not be more clearer.
AoE damages we have, "Damages are reduced for hitting multi-target" LOL. It's like "we want AoE encounters but we reduce damages when it hits multi-target which are already soooo low"
i iam not a elite ranger (iam not a "elite player") but... I'm not 500 threads here for nothing.
ah, yes. the base damage of gwf is ridiculous (and loose damage hit multiple targets). the advantage of gwf is: gwf "dont stop" (which has always been a problem in pve because is better you hit 90k once than sustained 100k over 10 sec... debuff dinamic, limitad content, etc).
the problem is that now also stopped and dont hit too hard. attempting to force the gwf for "tank" in order to serve as a shield for the ranger / sw is offensive.
Something around the range of 15-30% (15% lost for 50% and 30% lost for full unstoppable).
Also,
Is Frontline Surge SUPPOSED to still prone with feated?
Will Frontline add an additional .5 seconds to stun when feated to 3.5 seconds?
Mark is still falling off when being struck - defeating alot of the advantage of mark for GWFs.
Remove bonus damage to "at wills" from Executioner Style. But give the Destroyers Capstone a new feature that: Unstoppable increases attack speed, but doesnt decrease damage on at wills. - I just think its silly to have Unstoppable give you a speed increase but a damage increase too... Honestly id say to do this to ALL GWFs, but maybe thats not fair. Unstoppable should just grant, CC immunity, DR, Temp Hp, Faster attack speed, NO loss of damge - meaning its a damage boost.
After long testing i came to the same reason as any one else. GWF have the lowest damage on at-wills and this is not rigth any other class can hit 6-18k with at wills but GWF simply cannot mostly 3-5k .
Ofc the poor DC dont count as dps class.
Also any other class have usefull at wills but gwf reaping strike is too stupid why ?
Becase GWF have no true immunity and even if he pop up unstoppable he can be still proned stunned and reaping have too loong animation also somtimes its bugged(if i pop up unstoppable) and stuck on the half animation and cannot complite it i must always sprint to reset the animation .
I have the same issue with 1 daly Spinning Strike always interrupted by other effect (prone/stun).
But the most joke of all Daly Avalanche of Steel i am in the air ? or wath? CW and HR can kill me in the air and i have full immunity ?
Dragons and mini bosses push me stunn me in the air? GF can prone me in the air ?
This dosnt feel so rigth.
Also i agree with all players you cant call somthing balanced if you only remove from one class the prone effect .
Suggestion to remove it from all encounters from all classes . Make sure prone can be only apply on dalys .
Yeah but we absolutely need a SM rework (only the At-Will is viable, Flourish only good against mono-target fight) and a total BUFF of AoE ENCOUNTER POWERS DAMAGES. I'm annoyied to see all these AoE powers "reduced by multi-target" with only 1700-2100 damages like Not So Fast, Roar, Mighty Leap etc and all these HAMSTER long cooldown like Daring Shout etc, no damages/little damages with not any controls (SM).
GWF was planned to be the best AoE DPS. What I see is HAMSTER base damages on everything which makes the Destroyer bad : a damage buff on so low damages powers is still bad.
It's a class mechanic, and you nerfed it too much.
To give a good PvP move to SM too:
allow punishing charge to stun the target for 3 seconds if it lands. It's a short burst and other classes can just move away to avoid it. But at least would be a "proactive" way to close gap and catch enemies.
Or either make flourish viable. Aka: fast animation so that it cannot be easily dodged/ parried cause the animation allows the other classes to see it coming and make it crush on their immunity moves.
Bravery is going to be a must have again in PvP, my guess. So buffing it could be a way to soften the hard survivability nerf a bit.
Well, last I checked from tests people were doing, HR and GWF and CW all did pretty much the same overall damage. Not too much has changed since then offense-wise.
Also I'm not sure why it's offensive that you'd do a little less damage since you have inherent tanking abilities and great CC. HR brings nothing but DPS to PVE. If anything, control-wise, HRs make things much WORSE thanks to split shot aggoring 5 random mobs at a time. HR's are practically an anti-CC class.
The problem has been that you've done as good or better damage than other classes (actually literally the best currently in mod3), so why not just stack groups with GWFs and CWs?
What would be nice is if people wanted a GWF for offtank and good DPS in parties, but they wanted other classes for either more CC or more DPS or healing or more tanking.
I'm not sure that's going to happen, though, since like I said most people reported classes doing about the same amount of damage overall.
On live with 3 points on this, i have 95% crit severity. On preview, 80%. Looks like it's not applied on preview, and it's 15% less critical severity.
Was it nerfed or is it bugged?
2) I too like the idea of beefing up Bravery. Id even rather just flat out see the DR on Sprint and CC immunity on that removed - back to LIVE sprint but we can do it longer and Bravery brought BACK up to it previous values. (Honestly alot of the Sprint DR/Immunity is just a facade of DR - you want the GWF class turning into a class where your either unstoppable dealing damage, or cheese running away to keep CC immunity up? Its not going to be used as a "gap closer" since anytime your not unstoppable your too susceptible to damage and control. You close the gap, then the second you stop to attack, GG. Also causes CWs to get frustrated STILL when they have no defensive ability against CC immune)
3) SM does need some love. The tooltip on my GF is higher than my GWF on Flourish. Now theres ALOT that goes into that, but I thought it was funny my 671 top end weap dmg is > my 1009 top end on encounter tooltip.... Just silly to me.
4) SM needs a way to mark as well. Now that mark is that much greater damage potential.
Ill test the 3 second base stuns. Still like to point out:
- Feated re-enforced surge prones on the PTR. It should be a 3.5 sec stun?
Mark still disappears when taking damage - not WAI yet.
you say that gwf does more damage than the cw (pve) is not a truth ... is a localized phenomenon. Obviously to get to this number, I am exploring a number of bugs that were adjusted only in preview (I think). On the other hand, there was an "urgent need" to give the Class A nerf of 13% damage (one "bug" reported previously).
So my problem with "damage" is basically moral.
2 - tankness / control: control of gwf in pve, you is not to create a "security situation for themselves." The only power that has this feature is the avalanch and fls (iv. .. always iv). What we have to "control aoe" nothing more emblematic than not so fast. You causes a slow effect on opponents, but ... you are melee. Our control is basically complementary.
about "tank", nothing more immoral than now: the gwf never had aggro tools. Now he will get "aggro tools", although it has lost resistence (unstoppable). Ie, threat becomes a problem for us too (and not a tool) ... but I'm melee and depend to 10,000 stacks to be a inferior dps. gwf is not a "natural dps" (low base damage).
Ie, the destroyer being sabotaged with the argument "separate tank to dps". But this occurs at the precise moment that the cw receives a buff in shield (so.. destroyer dont receive a buff in damage?)...
So let's summarize the changes: A destroyer was sabotaged, the sentinel received "tank buffs" (to serve the new kings) and the instigator was abandoned. Compare this treatment with other classes and understand the effort that I'm not doing to not insult the "combat designer". I already asked another dev to ban my forum account ... even that. i really dont understand the reason of this thread.
Feedback:
Devastating Critical is not working. The 15% extra crit severity is NOT ADDED.
sprint with all boons and everything for stamina, grants us 7 small bursts around the lenght of a HR dodge.
HRs have 5 of these dodges plus CC and damage immunity, and they are a ranged class
CWs teleport grants CC and damage immunity too and covers around 3 times the lenght of these small bursts. And they are a ranged class too.
TRs have stealth, GFs have better block.
Now, with these 7 "small bursts" we are supposed to:
close the gap to get in melee range
chase the enemy who is dodging
use sprint as a defensive move
It's is not enough. Plus, it's not enough responsive to use it defensively, compared to other classes dodge moves. You said you wanted sprint to be "in line" with other dodges.
Well, it ISN'T.
Please keep posts respectful. Hostile posts are not respectful.
And do not avoid the chat filter.
In fact if there's a starred out word you probably shouldn't be saying what you are saying anyway.
If this can be useful, there's a video of a GWF being facetanked by a CW using shield:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXzX2L3L5KU
and he's not even using all the encounters he has while the GWF with PV is unloading everything he has, IBS included.
On a side note: Devastating critical is bugged and NOT GIVING the 15% bonus damage on crit to GWFs.
Fix it please, it's like another shadow nerf to GWF damage piling up with other nerfs. We're really hitting people with a wet noodle right now.
Also: IBS after prone needed to be "in line" and lowered down, but the damage posted above is fine? To be honest right now FLS still proning (gonna be a stun soon btw) on preview is the only way a GWF can deal some damage.
Start giving back takedown prone and it will be a nice step to balance. Cause believe me, even a IBS after prone is not too much compared to what other classes do right now.
and any DEV can u explain the amount of buff provided by come and get it cause i sure as hell not getting any.
It works; I've tested it 3 separate times since module 4 went on Preview and it worked each and every time. Why not actually TEST it instead of only rely on the number sheet? Let an enemy hit you without the feat, then with the feat and test the % reduction in your logs (use the same enemy). You WILL see that you took less damage with the feat (it ends up being your base DR, as in your DR with the defense stat and AC, multiplied by 5/10/15%).
It does not reflect in the character sheet but it works; you can see the for yourself with less than 2 minutes of testing. I am sick and tired of explaining this.
Can a dev please put a note in the description for Armor Specialization that it will not reflect in the character sheet?
plus make sprint more reliable, more responsive, to be on par with other shift moves from other classes.
Also, as said multiple times, fix determination gain to be 33% total HP for full bar, 15% total HP for half bar.