Isnt Hellfire the Fury capstone ability triggered off necrotic damage? Not sure where hellish rebuke comes into the chart you showed, but i could be missing something i guess. Or are you saying HR triggers hellfire too often?
Feedback
Hellish rebuke does its animation and cast spell then I am rooted for another 1sec before i can move so its locking me in place 1-2sec to cast this at-will.
Wraiths shadow immobilize for 2sec thats awful and it does very very low damage.
Harrow storm same thing it does really low damage to no damage if you prone. Change HS to a simular mechanic to Wshadow where you cast the spell again to get affect currently its really clunky to use HS.
I think the SW is a great idea but im really concerned with the lack of CC/survivability for this class.
Isnt Hellfire the Fury capstone ability triggered off necrotic damage? Not sure where hellish rebuke comes into the chart you showed, but i could be missing something i guess. Or are you saying HR triggers hellfire too often?
No, Creeping Death is the Fury capstone triggered off necrotic damage.
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zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
edited July 2014
Feedback:
Having Intelligence as the primary stat is incorrect to the 4e Scourge Warlock. Constitution is their primary stat with Intelligence and Charisma as secondary stats. Even the Deceptive Warlock in 4e doesn't have Intelligence as its primary stat, it is Charisma for that role. To me, Intelligence doesn't make sense as a primary stat from a DM's viewpoint.
Scourge Warlock
No subtlety here—you want to deal damage. You're tougher than the deceptive warlock, and you’ve got powers to help you attack and defend in melee, as well as excellent ranged attacks. Your best attack powers depend on Constitution—make that your best ability score. Choose Intelligence second because it provides special bonuses to many of your powers and improves your Reflex defense and AC, too. Charisma is clearly your third choice.
Also, I do not like being pigeon holed into having to play an infernal pact warlock if I wish to roll a Scourge Warlock. There is not enough freedom to allow Fey (light) Pacts or Star (unaligned) Pacts within the powers and abilities presented and especially not with the paragon path we have. While I like the options presented to us for Infernal (dark) Pacts, the only Paragon Path allowed just adds to the pigeon holed feeling.
My only complaint about the SW we're getting is forcing us to sign an Infernal Pact instead of being more like it is in 4e D&D, where you choose between Infernal, Fey, or Star pacts.
The way it should have been is that as you create a SW, you need to choose between Infernal, Fey, or Star and then when you get in game, your powers and Paragon choices accurately reflect that Pact. Right now, our Warlock is not a true Scourge Warlock. It is only 1/3 of what the class should be.
While I will undoubtedly enjoy my Infernal Pact Warlock, as the class looks and feels extremely fun, I am highly disappointed that there is no freedom of choice as to the Pact I made.
Religion: Warlocks favor deities of cleverness, arcane power, or secrets. These include Corellon, Ioun, and Sehanine. Evil warlocks often revere Asmodeus or Vecna.
With that in mind, the deity choices do not accurately reflect the infernal pact a warlock, as presented on Preview, has made. Please add more variance and freedom to be able to choose whether we have made a light, dark, or unaligned pact and in that regard, add more evil and unaligned deities. Better yet, add all of the Faerun Pantheon please, including "dead" gods - for we all know gods rarely ever truly "die" in the Realms and are continued to be worshiped even when they are adrift "dead" in the Astral Plane or absorbed by another deity.
Giving me Mystra to choose would probably tide me over, for a while.
Feedback Damnation Feat Paths:
Solid path But it needs to give the puppet the secondary function of a tank the puppet needs to be able to hold on to aggro over the SW in control of it you guys gave the puppet the 80% dmg reduction and High health it now needs to be able to take at least 80% of the threat the SW generates i should not have to gimp my dps so that the puppet can hold agro you gave wrathful souls the dps the puppet needs so maby give warding spirits ability take all of the SW threat as well and giving him that 10% less dmg Buff i just feel that with out meaningful CC that the pet could at least take all the threat we generate so we don't have to kite around all the time and it would give are companions some slack.
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So hellfire is the DoT portion of hellish rebuke?
The ticks im seeing off HR are in the low 100s but im 46th level. Your chart looked like it ticked for 8k (MAX) if im understanding it correctly.
Any chance ACT was reading some other effect as a DoT tick, like creeping death ticks? that just seems crazy high.
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schweifer1982Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,662Arc User
edited July 2014
Feedback:
All other class have this : bonus to deflection from feat or class feature .
Only DC dont have this: movement speed buff from feats or class feature.
All other class have 2 ways to avoid or immune to CC some classes have even more then 2 .
Can we have some of this too ?
My biggest problem is rubberbanding trow me always back (while i am runnin and i have cc immunity)in red area or even if i am running in pvp i got the rollback and i am stunned or freez to death.
I have zero problem with my CW HR DC TR GF.
SW is not GWF cannot pop up the unstoppable to avoid this problem.
Bug: Warding Curse
Although WC can only be applied by Warlock Curse judging from its tooltip description, lesser curse also can apply WC. I am not sure whether this is WAI or not but i hope devs can change WC tooltip instead of restricting WC to Warlock Curse only. I hope in future, Warlock Bargain and any other skills/feats which can act like a curse can also apply Warding Curse when the class is officially launched.
Bug: Warding Curse
Although WC can only be applied by Warlock Curse judging from its tooltip description, lesser curse also can apply WC. I am not sure whether this is WAI or not but i hope devs can change WC tooltip instead of restricting WC to Warlock Curse only. I hope in future, Warlock Bargain and any other skills/feats which can act like a curse can also apply Warding Curse when the class is officially launched.
Yes But TBH the bug makes the class feat way more diverse. But it dose need to be fixed
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Hellfire is 4/4 set bomus, that prooves SW's has no damage, even a set bonus that hit 4k only has more damage than all SW powers.
The hellfire Bonus is caped at a max of 4k TO keep it from 1 shooting mobs and potentially bosses who have loads of HP most there set bonuses proc off a percentage of their HP or their targets HP and is caped in dmg to keep it in line post like this are some of the most annoying i see posted in the feed back forms if you not gonna bother going to the preview shard and test skills and class mechanics stop crying OP or Under powered that's exactly why the HR got Nerfed before it hit live servers
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BTW my last test show Creeping Death hit less than 100% weapon damage, it was hiting a portion of skill damage that triggered it, ~30%
Creeping death seems to have a interesting mechanic hidden into it. 1 stack of creeping death will currently deal 100% Of the damage used to proc it and tick that dmg down in a DoT effect over the 8 seconds.
Let me give you a better example for instance dreadtheft lets say DT dose not eat curses each Individual DMG Tik during DT cast will proc 1 stack of Creeping death. Now when one of the individual Tiks crits the next tick will then proc CP that will then proc another individual source of Necrotic dmg that will also trigger Creeping death not to mention executioners gift and Its Necrotic dmg DoT effect triggering for multiple creeping death packets also this is why dread and warlocks bargain can get up to 100 stacks of it in a single cast.
This is why the dmg from creeping can be on a low end or a high end it depends on the amount of necrotic dmg used to proc each stack. A 8 dmg necrotic tik from critical promise can trigger it giving Creeping a very Low end DoT tik. This is why crit matters alot more so with fury warlocks then the other paths its capstons dmg is heavily reliant of the randomness of crit the percentage of a targets HP and the amount of necrotic dmg used to proc each stack. Note any source of necrotic dmg procs it even life drinker enchantments will trigger it boons that do necrotic dmg as well
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The set bonus is fine to me, but SW powers is very underpowered since it's a heavy dps class that actualy doesnt compete with others high dps classes, so far i can tell SW is the 4rd heavy dps class at moment. on line HR/GWF/CW are the heaviest dps at moment.
The set bonus is fine to me, but SW powers is very underpowered since it's a heavy dps class that actualy doesnt compete with others high dps classes, so far i can tell SW is the 4rd heavy dps class at moment. on line HR/GWF/CW are the heaviest dps at moment.
You not gonna see huge upfront numbers with a SW as most its dmg is Done in the form of DoTs the entire fury feats path can blatantly tell you that. If your expecting Big huge spiking dps skills you will be let down killing flame is like are hardest hitting single target encounter But relies on DoTs to have already worked there magic against a target Hp so its bonus dmg can kick in. This class also relies on curse stacking Warlocks Curse Warlocks bargain and the lesser Curse all stack along with creeping and Executiners. The SW is a DoT class no ifs and or butts about it
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You not gonna see huge upfront numbers with a SW as most its dmg is Done in the form of DoTs the entire fury feats path can blatantly tell you that. If your expecting Big huge spiking dps skills you will be let down killing flame is like are hardest hitting single target encounter But relies on DoTs to have already worked there magic against a target Hp so its bonus dmg can kick in. This class also relies on curse stacking Warlocks Curse Warlocks bargain and the lesser Curse all stack along with creeping and Executiners. The SW is a DoT class no ifs and or butts about it
I know that, but dot or not, the damage is still low compared to others dps classes.
I know that, but dot or not, the damage is still low compared to others dps classes.
You know its a DoT class yet you still fail to see why they come up short in comparison to direct dmg classes DoT classes shine in extended fights against targets with HIGH HP like boss monsters DoT falls short in trash pull as it take time for DoT spells to ramp up by that time the direct dmg dealers will have already bursted down mobs or CW will have pushed them of ledges. You say you understand this is a DoT class yet dont understand how this effects there dmg in a group with other direct dmg dealing classes.
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You know its a DoT class yet you still fail to see why they come up short in comparison to direct dmg classes DoT classes shine in extended fights against targets with HIGH HP like boss monsters DoT falls short in trash pull as it take time for DoT spells to ramp up by that time the direct dmg dealers will have already bursted down mobs or CW will have pushed them of ledges. You say you understand this is a DoT class yet dont understand how this effects there dmg in a group with other direct dmg dealing classes.
ok,ok u win, than math DoT time x damage x CD, doest matther if DoT or Direct damage, just look at full damage rotation at dumies and then tell me if SW isnt underpowerd. compare i to any other dps class.
My own personal experience on the preview server is that I've run dungeons with several SW's who I would consider to be underpowered for a DPS class. They end up doing less damage than GWF's, CW's, and HR's. That's roughly about 3 out of 4 SW's I've played with. However, there are 1 out of 4 SW's who has figured out the right abilities, feats, build, and equipment. Those SW's can dwarf the damage of any other class. They can do nearly double the damage of GWF's, CW's, and HR's through a dungeon if built right. As time goes on, the right builds/equipment will spread and we'll end up with an overpowered class.
The Infernal Diabolist armor set seems like the biggest differentiator between those that underperform and those that overperform. Bringing the overall damage of the class up while bringing the damage from the armor set down would be the most reasonable solution.
ok,ok u win, than math DoT time x damage x CD, doest matther if DoT or Direct damage, just look at full damage rotation at dumies and then tell me if SW isnt underpowerd. compare i to any other dps class.
I can test temptation and damnation warlocks fine on test dummies But there support paths But Fury warlock's lose a lil over 20% of there dps when targeting training dummies and 2 of there feats proc on targets deaths Offering To The Prisoner and Daughters Promise both crucial dps feats and Executioners will not work as training dummies health dose not diminish so that's a lil over 20% bonus dmg i will not get from feats thanks to how training dummies work.
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We all know whats going to happen to an armor set bonus that is contributing 40per damage. The SW should be assessed on its own.
From my experience so far
DPS lower than other dps classes like HR, TR, GWF.
No real utility
The fewest and weakest CCs of any class
No dodge
Squishy like a CW
Very weak in PVP (maybe weakest)
The only plus I can see at this point is maybe Temptation tree. If the healing draws massive agro tho, the SW is dead. I hope they make some alterations before live, they certainly have plenty of feedback.
I think Cryptic is locked into the Lifesteal and necrotic damage mechanic for the SW and they are afraid if damage gets too high the SW will be an unkillable monster. The severe DimR of LS will make it unlikely. I would rather the abilities did 2x damage and were not necrotic. Everyone can get to min Arp easily. I think this fear of a super OP class is why they keep damage low, no dodge or CC but I am very concerned this is going to cripple the class.
OK so I leveled a SW to 60 and treated myself as a new player and 1st character and free to play, so I relied on drops and mission rewards for everything.
I played a fury exclusively and specked feats for dps and or ap gain.
my findings and opinions.
SW is a very fun class to play they can stomp most bosses with ease however the sprint mechanic is lack luster it offers no real defense and having its refresh rate tied to strength seems pointless str is not even a secondary stat as such even with a 12 to 14 str and a 10% reduced cost it recharges far slower than all other shift defenses.
The shift needs immunity frames because as of now combined with no immunity its relatively slow activation and ground speed, makes moving out of red zones the large ones almost imposable and with the SW lack of def makes having con our "true" primary stat necessary just to hold our own as well as a cloth wearing low con CW.
I cant give you hard numbers I'm a hard core gamer not a math major, sorry about that... But for a class that wears leather armor and has as many hp as the fighter classes SW lose hp fast, even against trash mobs we have low def and almost no deflect the current version of the SW as is even with the better than average life steal makes survivability much harder than any other class even with our great dps throw a fue elites and a stun or hold on us and were dead.
pertaining to the fury tree and so many of its feats allowing for an extra 10% dmg due to crit and or necrotic dmg etc... a very nice system its to increase multiple damage sources to amp up dps and life steal but if a SW is to have life steal as our primary mechanic for staying alive which I like a lot mind you but perhaps we need higher damage on our main-hand weapon in endgame a bonus 10% dmg of 600 to 800 wpn is just 60 to 80 pts of bonus dmg and mabe 2 to 4 additional life stolen per second not a big game changer when we take on average over a 1500 hp per hit per second if surrounded.
I like the curse system I dont even mind the tab to curse but having it need to be refreshed because the duration expires is tedious the animation takes time and when your surrounded trying to get breathing space to stay alive and keep attacking the interupt time of the tab will kill you. my suggestion have curse last until target and or the SW who cast it is dead have the bonus effects of the encounters etc still function as is but not consume the curse and maybe only allow the curse with the greatest power affect the targets so you don't get stacking major and minor curses.
you still tab to target/mark the target but at least it should save the tab key and a lot of hassle.
as for the powers themselves love the animations I feel the love your programers put into them really captures the dark nature of the powers.
I love them all but blades of the undead armies needs a boost its a last tier power after all, as it is a swirling cloud of weapons maybe adding a deflection bonus and or a debuff to hit when attacking into or inside the rotating knives think about it you are trying to hit a someone who has a cloud of weapons surrounding him attacks launched into the cloud will most likely be deflected think about shooting an arrow into a combine or wood chipper and or standing in one and trying to swing a sword accurately at a target?
as well the added def is necessary for pve and especially for pvp.
the only other powers in my opinion that needs work is Hand of Blight its damage is great and the mechanics from rage to melee is awesome but the range attack animation needs to be a little faster and mabe have the 3rd and 4th attack in melee be a 180 degree cone.
Also the other at will Hellish Rebuke this power is a must have dot especially in pvp but excels in pve as well, however its animation is far to slow I have tested it I take 3 targets at max range and try and mark each with once by the time I have hit the 3rd target the other 2 have already hit me and the 3rd is half way to me due to pulled agro ,as well the swapping between say hand of blight and the rebuke at wills you really notice the speed transitions there's a lot of unnecessary down time..
if you only do one thing to improve the SW please shorten the "casting time/animation" for this wonderful power and and make it transition with the other at wills as easily as the other classes because the seconds lost in the animations transition times make this power cumbersome to use when trying to spread the hell fiery goodness.
so as for game play in summery.
SW is and feels powerful but lacking and real def other than life steal which a low levels and as I have not been able to test with rank 9/10 dark's to boost life steal even with the substantial boost SW already get threw feats it is not a viable survival tool when swarmed by tougher enemies/other players.
SW make boss battles look easy as long as the adds don't swarm them. and I see them being essential in epic dungs to kill stubborn tough end bosses.
SW need more def options and or immunity frames in shadow shift.
The warlock Main hand needs more damage to increase the effectiveness of life steal our main survival mechanic.
What I absolutely hate about the SW was the last class mission where you meet your master... i hope its a work in progress and not just the cavern of Karandax with the dragon swapped for your master?!? because at lvl 30 the recommended lvl btw I was facing lvl 59 elites and after several attempts across several lvls I finaly made it to the female fire giant the 1st boss in karrandax to be reminded why that dungeon is best done with 5 people but this is my class quest? every other class quest can be soloed not mine at least not at lvl 30 and even at lvl 60 I need better than green/blue gear and rank 4 and 5 enhancements.
this is intended as a joke and is not meant to be hurtful: when the devs have to meet there boss do they have to fight to the death threw co-workers to see them? why does my SW need too I mean I'm having a meeting with the guy I brokered my soul with I expected this to be a "talkie" quest maybe if I choose the wrong dialogue option my master pwn's me hes a lord of hell he should do that!
but he also runs a tight ship the minions shouldn't be attacking me especially if I'm his public relations attempt to prove hell isn't all bad?
also fire giants in hell??? in all seriousness now the recycled dungeon isn't a bad idea but pallet swap the monsters to look like demons/devils etc not earth/fire elements and fire giants and tone the difficulty down so it can be soloed especially the mobs in boss fights the bosses can be tough but having 5 to 8 elites vs 1 guy? am I alone on this?
all in all the ongoing improvements to the SW have all been positive in my opinion and many other players it would seem.
Oh wait... the pact blade; it needs to go on the other hip or across the lower back so it stops looking like I use it for a Bookmark, and maybe tone down the size a bit on it its suppose to be a weapon not a holy symbol. and hay I get it your trying to do the whole is it a sword/knife is it a rod... I get that but please make sure in future mabe there are more simple options like rods/scepters /knives appearances for something a little more modest. a demonic looking machete would be cool.
But AWESOME JOB OVERALL, honestly it feels like your playing a warlock I know you have to face such harsh criticisms some far worse than necessary cryptic made my fave rate game of all time I still have faith in u and thanks for making my fav class in d&d as close to pen paper as programming can allow such as it is.
Feed Back Warlocks Curse
Remove that can only mark three targets just let it be a AoE and all of the dmg is split between all the parked targets its two flipping clunky to mark mobs mid fight and then target one of them for a power interaction that or just scrap TC as a daily and give its dmg linking properties to WC.
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So far the warlock is doing good in Pve, but how will it cope with other classes in pvp with almost 0 control? Yes we do have some nice solid damage but we need some control aswell. I don't want to be controlled to death before we can even move.
Also, the shift is working well at the moment now that stamina does not drain so fast, however a good idea is if we press shift once to a movement location we shadow dash or shadow teleport and if we hold it we hover like we do already. This would bring some utility to the table.
Here is my take on the SW shift after lots of testing in epic dungeons. It actually works well, however you just can be zipping all over the place all the time. You have to think about when to use it and save it.
Also it is great to break every CC effect thrown at me in these dungeons, only thing I have not tested it with is with player CC/Prone.
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ennteaMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited July 2014
I dunno, if you're complaining about sw being weaker than the rest somehow... try filling in your 4/4 accursed diabolist set and load up on radiants in everything, as many defense slots as you can handle, and watch your set bonus do 50-60% of your overall dungeon damage, with this meta its all about keeping as many hits of any size at all going out, so if you swim in the red with ~40k hp and 30%+ DR, (plus the 30 from 'slip, at crucial times) and you can outdps *and* outheal (with temptation) most other classes.. simultaneously. However, hellfire doesn't proc on players at all, so you'll probably end up with a secondary set for pvp, nether mage/empire/BI/etc to work the other meta...
I ran epic lostmauth a whole whack of times now, and I can definately reassure those worried that the current state of changes adds a ton of synergy to having a GF and/or a DC in party, the AP gain plus the combo of ItF & hallowed ground, kicks hellfire dots from 4k base to ~8860-12636... and the current state of guarded assault can crank out 350k hits under certain circumstances.
back on topic..
Feedback:
VT/MC both crash warlocks like crazy on the interlude phases of the last boss, seems to happen most if I use shadowslip at all during these phases.
My best guess on Hellfire is that it's bugged and is supposed to proc on Encounter activation rather than every hit an Encounter produces. It currently doesn't matter which path you choose, you just need that armor set.
Has anybody tested other sets that proc off Encounters? Same behavior? Fabled and Dread Legion have ICDs and are of course way worse.
If that stays optimal group in PVE should be DC/GF/(Renegade) HV CW/2SW.
Sounds like some of you are pinning your hopes on an obviously broken armor set and when they fix that set 40%+ of you damage disappears.
They may let the armor set go for 1 mod, but just like all the other sets, they fix them. I dont want the SW to end up like the GF after their OP set got nerfed, a gimp unneeded class for a year.
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mircalla83Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 36
Sounds like some of you are pinning your hopes on an obviously broken armor set and when they fix that set 40%+ of you damage disappears.
They may let the armor set go for 1 mod, but just like all the other sets, they fix them. I dont want the SW to end up like the GF after their OP set got nerfed, a gimp unneeded class for a year.
'Proc on Damage Tick instead of, as intended, Activation' was in the game for the whole lifetime of the game until Mod4. It is called 'Eye of the Storm'.
Comments
Feedback
Hellish rebuke does its animation and cast spell then I am rooted for another 1sec before i can move so its locking me in place 1-2sec to cast this at-will.
Wraiths shadow immobilize for 2sec thats awful and it does very very low damage.
Harrow storm same thing it does really low damage to no damage if you prone. Change HS to a simular mechanic to Wshadow where you cast the spell again to get affect currently its really clunky to use HS.
I think the SW is a great idea but im really concerned with the lack of CC/survivability for this class.
No, Creeping Death is the Fury capstone triggered off necrotic damage.
Having Intelligence as the primary stat is incorrect to the 4e Scourge Warlock. Constitution is their primary stat with Intelligence and Charisma as secondary stats. Even the Deceptive Warlock in 4e doesn't have Intelligence as its primary stat, it is Charisma for that role. To me, Intelligence doesn't make sense as a primary stat from a DM's viewpoint.
Also, I do not like being pigeon holed into having to play an infernal pact warlock if I wish to roll a Scourge Warlock. There is not enough freedom to allow Fey (light) Pacts or Star (unaligned) Pacts within the powers and abilities presented and especially not with the paragon path we have. While I like the options presented to us for Infernal (dark) Pacts, the only Paragon Path allowed just adds to the pigeon holed feeling.
My only complaint about the SW we're getting is forcing us to sign an Infernal Pact instead of being more like it is in 4e D&D, where you choose between Infernal, Fey, or Star pacts.
The way it should have been is that as you create a SW, you need to choose between Infernal, Fey, or Star and then when you get in game, your powers and Paragon choices accurately reflect that Pact. Right now, our Warlock is not a true Scourge Warlock. It is only 1/3 of what the class should be.
While I will undoubtedly enjoy my Infernal Pact Warlock, as the class looks and feels extremely fun, I am highly disappointed that there is no freedom of choice as to the Pact I made.
With that in mind, the deity choices do not accurately reflect the infernal pact a warlock, as presented on Preview, has made. Please add more variance and freedom to be able to choose whether we have made a light, dark, or unaligned pact and in that regard, add more evil and unaligned deities. Better yet, add all of the Faerun Pantheon please, including "dead" gods - for we all know gods rarely ever truly "die" in the Realms and are continued to be worshiped even when they are adrift "dead" in the Astral Plane or absorbed by another deity.
Giving me Mystra to choose would probably tide me over, for a while.
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Damnation Feat Paths:
Solid path But it needs to give the puppet the secondary function of a tank the puppet needs to be able to hold on to aggro over the SW in control of it you guys gave the puppet the 80% dmg reduction and High health it now needs to be able to take at least 80% of the threat the SW generates i should not have to gimp my dps so that the puppet can hold agro you gave wrathful souls the dps the puppet needs so maby give warding spirits ability take all of the SW threat as well and giving him that 10% less dmg Buff i just feel that with out meaningful CC that the pet could at least take all the threat we generate so we don't have to kite around all the time and it would give are companions some slack.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
The ticks im seeing off HR are in the low 100s but im 46th level. Your chart looked like it ticked for 8k (MAX) if im understanding it correctly.
Any chance ACT was reading some other effect as a DoT tick, like creeping death ticks? that just seems crazy high.
All other class have this : bonus to deflection from feat or class feature .
Only DC dont have this: movement speed buff from feats or class feature.
All other class have 2 ways to avoid or immune to CC some classes have even more then 2 .
Can we have some of this too ?
My biggest problem is rubberbanding trow me always back (while i am runnin and i have cc immunity)in red area or even if i am running in pvp i got the rollback and i am stunned or freez to death.
I have zero problem with my CW HR DC TR GF.
SW is not GWF cannot pop up the unstoppable to avoid this problem.
Although WC can only be applied by Warlock Curse judging from its tooltip description, lesser curse also can apply WC. I am not sure whether this is WAI or not but i hope devs can change WC tooltip instead of restricting WC to Warlock Curse only. I hope in future, Warlock Bargain and any other skills/feats which can act like a curse can also apply Warding Curse when the class is officially launched.
Yes But TBH the bug makes the class feat way more diverse. But it dose need to be fixed
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
The hellfire Bonus is caped at a max of 4k TO keep it from 1 shooting mobs and potentially bosses who have loads of HP most there set bonuses proc off a percentage of their HP or their targets HP and is caped in dmg to keep it in line post like this are some of the most annoying i see posted in the feed back forms if you not gonna bother going to the preview shard and test skills and class mechanics stop crying OP or Under powered that's exactly why the HR got Nerfed before it hit live servers
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Let me give you a better example for instance dreadtheft lets say DT dose not eat curses each Individual DMG Tik during DT cast will proc 1 stack of Creeping death. Now when one of the individual Tiks crits the next tick will then proc CP that will then proc another individual source of Necrotic dmg that will also trigger Creeping death not to mention executioners gift and Its Necrotic dmg DoT effect triggering for multiple creeping death packets also this is why dread and warlocks bargain can get up to 100 stacks of it in a single cast.
This is why the dmg from creeping can be on a low end or a high end it depends on the amount of necrotic dmg used to proc each stack. A 8 dmg necrotic tik from critical promise can trigger it giving Creeping a very Low end DoT tik. This is why crit matters alot more so with fury warlocks then the other paths its capstons dmg is heavily reliant of the randomness of crit the percentage of a targets HP and the amount of necrotic dmg used to proc each stack. Note any source of necrotic dmg procs it even life drinker enchantments will trigger it boons that do necrotic dmg as well
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You not gonna see huge upfront numbers with a SW as most its dmg is Done in the form of DoTs the entire fury feats path can blatantly tell you that. If your expecting Big huge spiking dps skills you will be let down killing flame is like are hardest hitting single target encounter But relies on DoTs to have already worked there magic against a target Hp so its bonus dmg can kick in. This class also relies on curse stacking Warlocks Curse Warlocks bargain and the lesser Curse all stack along with creeping and Executiners. The SW is a DoT class no ifs and or butts about it
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You know its a DoT class yet you still fail to see why they come up short in comparison to direct dmg classes DoT classes shine in extended fights against targets with HIGH HP like boss monsters DoT falls short in trash pull as it take time for DoT spells to ramp up by that time the direct dmg dealers will have already bursted down mobs or CW will have pushed them of ledges. You say you understand this is a DoT class yet dont understand how this effects there dmg in a group with other direct dmg dealing classes.
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ok,ok u win, than math DoT time x damage x CD, doest matther if DoT or Direct damage, just look at full damage rotation at dumies and then tell me if SW isnt underpowerd. compare i to any other dps class.
The Infernal Diabolist armor set seems like the biggest differentiator between those that underperform and those that overperform. Bringing the overall damage of the class up while bringing the damage from the armor set down would be the most reasonable solution.
I can test temptation and damnation warlocks fine on test dummies But there support paths But Fury warlock's lose a lil over 20% of there dps when targeting training dummies and 2 of there feats proc on targets deaths Offering To The Prisoner and Daughters Promise both crucial dps feats and Executioners will not work as training dummies health dose not diminish so that's a lil over 20% bonus dmg i will not get from feats thanks to how training dummies work.
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From my experience so far
DPS lower than other dps classes like HR, TR, GWF.
No real utility
The fewest and weakest CCs of any class
No dodge
Squishy like a CW
Very weak in PVP (maybe weakest)
The only plus I can see at this point is maybe Temptation tree. If the healing draws massive agro tho, the SW is dead. I hope they make some alterations before live, they certainly have plenty of feedback.
I think Cryptic is locked into the Lifesteal and necrotic damage mechanic for the SW and they are afraid if damage gets too high the SW will be an unkillable monster. The severe DimR of LS will make it unlikely. I would rather the abilities did 2x damage and were not necrotic. Everyone can get to min Arp easily. I think this fear of a super OP class is why they keep damage low, no dodge or CC but I am very concerned this is going to cripple the class.
I played a fury exclusively and specked feats for dps and or ap gain.
my findings and opinions.
SW is a very fun class to play they can stomp most bosses with ease however the sprint mechanic is lack luster it offers no real defense and having its refresh rate tied to strength seems pointless str is not even a secondary stat as such even with a 12 to 14 str and a 10% reduced cost it recharges far slower than all other shift defenses.
The shift needs immunity frames because as of now combined with no immunity its relatively slow activation and ground speed, makes moving out of red zones the large ones almost imposable and with the SW lack of def makes having con our "true" primary stat necessary just to hold our own as well as a cloth wearing low con CW.
I cant give you hard numbers I'm a hard core gamer not a math major, sorry about that... But for a class that wears leather armor and has as many hp as the fighter classes SW lose hp fast, even against trash mobs we have low def and almost no deflect the current version of the SW as is even with the better than average life steal makes survivability much harder than any other class even with our great dps throw a fue elites and a stun or hold on us and were dead.
pertaining to the fury tree and so many of its feats allowing for an extra 10% dmg due to crit and or necrotic dmg etc... a very nice system its to increase multiple damage sources to amp up dps and life steal but if a SW is to have life steal as our primary mechanic for staying alive which I like a lot mind you but perhaps we need higher damage on our main-hand weapon in endgame a bonus 10% dmg of 600 to 800 wpn is just 60 to 80 pts of bonus dmg and mabe 2 to 4 additional life stolen per second not a big game changer when we take on average over a 1500 hp per hit per second if surrounded.
I like the curse system I dont even mind the tab to curse but having it need to be refreshed because the duration expires is tedious the animation takes time and when your surrounded trying to get breathing space to stay alive and keep attacking the interupt time of the tab will kill you. my suggestion have curse last until target and or the SW who cast it is dead have the bonus effects of the encounters etc still function as is but not consume the curse and maybe only allow the curse with the greatest power affect the targets so you don't get stacking major and minor curses.
you still tab to target/mark the target but at least it should save the tab key and a lot of hassle.
as for the powers themselves love the animations I feel the love your programers put into them really captures the dark nature of the powers.
I love them all but blades of the undead armies needs a boost its a last tier power after all, as it is a swirling cloud of weapons maybe adding a deflection bonus and or a debuff to hit when attacking into or inside the rotating knives think about it you are trying to hit a someone who has a cloud of weapons surrounding him attacks launched into the cloud will most likely be deflected think about shooting an arrow into a combine or wood chipper and or standing in one and trying to swing a sword accurately at a target?
as well the added def is necessary for pve and especially for pvp.
the only other powers in my opinion that needs work is Hand of Blight its damage is great and the mechanics from rage to melee is awesome but the range attack animation needs to be a little faster and mabe have the 3rd and 4th attack in melee be a 180 degree cone.
Also the other at will Hellish Rebuke this power is a must have dot especially in pvp but excels in pve as well, however its animation is far to slow I have tested it I take 3 targets at max range and try and mark each with once by the time I have hit the 3rd target the other 2 have already hit me and the 3rd is half way to me due to pulled agro ,as well the swapping between say hand of blight and the rebuke at wills you really notice the speed transitions there's a lot of unnecessary down time..
if you only do one thing to improve the SW please shorten the "casting time/animation" for this wonderful power and and make it transition with the other at wills as easily as the other classes because the seconds lost in the animations transition times make this power cumbersome to use when trying to spread the hell fiery goodness.
so as for game play in summery.
SW is and feels powerful but lacking and real def other than life steal which a low levels and as I have not been able to test with rank 9/10 dark's to boost life steal even with the substantial boost SW already get threw feats it is not a viable survival tool when swarmed by tougher enemies/other players.
SW make boss battles look easy as long as the adds don't swarm them. and I see them being essential in epic dungs to kill stubborn tough end bosses.
SW need more def options and or immunity frames in shadow shift.
The warlock Main hand needs more damage to increase the effectiveness of life steal our main survival mechanic.
What I absolutely hate about the SW was the last class mission where you meet your master... i hope its a work in progress and not just the cavern of Karandax with the dragon swapped for your master?!? because at lvl 30 the recommended lvl btw I was facing lvl 59 elites and after several attempts across several lvls I finaly made it to the female fire giant the 1st boss in karrandax to be reminded why that dungeon is best done with 5 people but this is my class quest? every other class quest can be soloed not mine at least not at lvl 30 and even at lvl 60 I need better than green/blue gear and rank 4 and 5 enhancements.
this is intended as a joke and is not meant to be hurtful: when the devs have to meet there boss do they have to fight to the death threw co-workers to see them? why does my SW need too I mean I'm having a meeting with the guy I brokered my soul with I expected this to be a "talkie" quest maybe if I choose the wrong dialogue option my master pwn's me hes a lord of hell he should do that!
but he also runs a tight ship the minions shouldn't be attacking me especially if I'm his public relations attempt to prove hell isn't all bad?
also fire giants in hell??? in all seriousness now the recycled dungeon isn't a bad idea but pallet swap the monsters to look like demons/devils etc not earth/fire elements and fire giants and tone the difficulty down so it can be soloed especially the mobs in boss fights the bosses can be tough but having 5 to 8 elites vs 1 guy? am I alone on this?
all in all the ongoing improvements to the SW have all been positive in my opinion and many other players it would seem.
Oh wait... the pact blade; it needs to go on the other hip or across the lower back so it stops looking like I use it for a Bookmark, and maybe tone down the size a bit on it its suppose to be a weapon not a holy symbol. and hay I get it your trying to do the whole is it a sword/knife is it a rod... I get that but please make sure in future mabe there are more simple options like rods/scepters /knives appearances for something a little more modest. a demonic looking machete would be cool.
But AWESOME JOB OVERALL, honestly it feels like your playing a warlock I know you have to face such harsh criticisms some far worse than necessary cryptic made my fave rate game of all time I still have faith in u and thanks for making my fav class in d&d as close to pen paper as programming can allow such as it is.
Remove that can only mark three targets just let it be a AoE and all of the dmg is split between all the parked targets its two flipping clunky to mark mobs mid fight and then target one of them for a power interaction that or just scrap TC as a daily and give its dmg linking properties to WC.
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Also it is great to break every CC effect thrown at me in these dungeons, only thing I have not tested it with is with player CC/Prone.
I ran epic lostmauth a whole whack of times now, and I can definately reassure those worried that the current state of changes adds a ton of synergy to having a GF and/or a DC in party, the AP gain plus the combo of ItF & hallowed ground, kicks hellfire dots from 4k base to ~8860-12636... and the current state of guarded assault can crank out 350k hits under certain circumstances.
back on topic..
Feedback:
VT/MC both crash warlocks like crazy on the interlude phases of the last boss, seems to happen most if I use shadowslip at all during these phases.
Has anybody tested other sets that proc off Encounters? Same behavior? Fabled and Dread Legion have ICDs and are of course way worse.
If that stays optimal group in PVE should be DC/GF/(Renegade) HV CW/2SW.
They may let the armor set go for 1 mod, but just like all the other sets, they fix them. I dont want the SW to end up like the GF after their OP set got nerfed, a gimp unneeded class for a year.
'Proc on Damage Tick instead of, as intended, Activation' was in the game for the whole lifetime of the game until Mod4. It is called 'Eye of the Storm'.