electricpantiesMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 3Arc User
edited June 2014
Expect Nerfs to your cash flow, I am so tired of PVP whines running PVE fun, These classes seem like they are about the right amount of Fun how they are, why not be different and buff up the weak classes/Mobs to accomplish your goals instead of Gutting the two classes that are Currently a lot of fun to play. I for one will just do what I always do when a Dev team makes a stupid decision like this one, STOP paying do not buy any more ZEN from this day on. Send a message. to the rest of you whining in your cellars about other classes, I remember you from the last game and the game before that one, You are the same guys who refuse to buy anything from the cash shop because you feel it is wrong. VOTE with your Dollars stop paying for this game until the collective dev-team head is removed from their collective rump.
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stinkbomber2Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 2Arc User
I don't know where to start. I don't even know If I want to spend time trying to make you realize how bad this is, because you are so off the grid with the changes so it feels useless to even try to get you on the right track.
You nerfed every single feat and power to the ground that are used in endgame PvP. All we had was our damage and debuff in PvP, now we don't have that either.
You want us to be useless in PvP? Did you even read the changelog? Please explain to me what exactly you want us to do in PvP. We have no control, no damage, no prones, no healing, no tankyness..
I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU. IMO, the new nerfs for CW are 99% designed to make us useless in PVP as we already are against TR and GWF. I've already spent lost fo moolah improving my CW but now it seems I just wasted my hard earned money because of this bull **** nerfs.
I don't know where to start. I don't even know If I want to spend time trying to make you realize how bad this is, because you are so off the grid with the changes so it feels useless to even try to get you on the right track.
You nerfed every single feat and power to the ground that are used in endgame PvP. All we had was our damage and debuff in PvP, now we don't have that either.
Thats exactly what I think. But never mind....lets not play DCs ...there are really less DCs anyway...and lets not play CW anymore.
Welcome to a world full of TR, HR and Gwf.
I ll play Gwf then cause...damage is on CW not soooo high...yeah and only controls? Nobody needs you anymore, not in PVP and not in PVE. Goodbye my beloved CW. Hallo "me on Gfw".
I can understand and support the PvE changes; CWs shouldn't be the one, dominant class there. More room for other classes is great. However, the dungeon content currently on offer will still favor CWs; that needs to change somewhat too.
What is hard to comprehend, however, is the change to the casting times of single-target powers. Those are useful mainly in PvP, not so much in PvE. CWs often struggle in PvP; their activation times are already higher than other classes. Seeing "big numbers" does not compensate for not getting a spell off because someone interrupted you in the meanwhile or you had to dodge. Decreasing the damage or increasing cooldowns? Okay. Increasing casting times? Not okay.
Just add more cc-immune mobs, add traps that can kill entire party (TR will be needed), make it more difficult. Buff for GF aggro and block is needed same as TR single damage, fix some DC powers like linked spirit, adjust archer path for HR. This big DPS nerf for CW (i think -20% less dps will be fine) and GWF unstoppable (30% DR will be fine) is like crazy train that could derail this game.
I think that the most CWs using the meatball is playing a role as a supporter in a match. Its about giving your teammates prones and with a meatball its possible to prone 2-3 players on a point if needed. And with that said, OFC a renegade CW would win over a oppressor meatball CW in 1on1, a supporter shouldn't win 1on1s.
And it does take skill to handle the shard on TAB since you need to have great timing with it and time it with your team players etc for best effect. Its not a walk in a park to use the shard with a GWF on you back (because it drops slow) and you have to control the shard while dodging enemies etc.
Most DPS CWs have to get used to the fact that the CW is now even more a support that offers control and the warlock is the high damage class. Its kinda hard to understand what Cryptic wants with the Renegade/Thaum because they lack the control and now they also lack the damage. Something is not right, it don't fit. You cant say that Renegade/Thaum is damaged focused when they don't have any damage compared to live. I mean, Its hard enough now in PvP as a CW, you are not OP in domination as it is now and with the huge damage nerf, well you should be able to do the math but it seems like nobody actually did the math...
I feel like they need to give us longer stuns/choke on Icy rays, entangle and chill strike so that Renegade/Thaum also get some control. And they need to remove the longer casting times.
Btw meld, I have a printscreen where u lost against virus and allt against you and inna 1000-450 (with a matched comp). :P
All I want is kill/burst from range (not that we have good preconditions for that in the first place). I just don't see the point in nerfing the Renegade build. It has nothing to do with PvE. And why mess with activation times? People have been practicing those rotations for over a year.
Yep, I remember that match. It was awesome and challenging as hell. A lot went wrong there (not gonna discuss it in this thread, though), but we worked on that and many of the mistakes we made in that match won't happen again.
If the Oppressor Mof is even better than the Oppressor SpellStorm, that's great. The Ice Control has great flavour, and delivering viable build variations is a DEV success.
MoF is low burst sustained damage, and my build more so than most (I have Bilethorn slotted for Perma hunting in PvP). Being able to hold mobs in place more or less indefinitely while they burn was most satisfying. The extra Chill ticks on RoF and the faster ticks on IT meant faster Smoulder/Bile stacking as well. Others have reported similar results with MoF Oppy so I think one very viable build has emerged already.
Anyone else think that reducing the target cap on sing, just makes it a better idea to bring more CW's? Same with reducing the aoe damage? If GF's/TR's/etc still dont do great damage, lowering the CW damage would make this worse, right? So now, where you could get by with 1 wizard 'carrying' everyone thru on their control/damage, now you are more likely to want two+? Not that most of the trash content is hard, but like CN draco fight. Why not make smaller adjustments to cw damage, and make the others equal? So you could bring an extra CW or a HR, or a Tr, or a GF, or a DC?
I understand the DPS reduction, it has a point, even tho in pvp, CW's are easy because their spells take time to cast and usually are snacks for other classes.
If u remove their control on the other hand, the result will be that every team will take 3 CW to go in the dungeon, simple as that.
If u really want to change this class change the spells, put new ones thinking always that u have in mind to make a new class of wizards that has dps
not really, if in module 4 GFs could oneshot 10mobs at the same time, would you bring 3 CWs to the party? I don't thionk so. You have to see how a class works compared to the rest, that's why CWs and GFW are being heavily nerfed in mod 4 to bring them more in line with the rest of the classes in PVE. I think the devs want to change how dungeons work, and stacking CWs won't be as effective as it is now. Maybe you'll actually need a tank or something.
reiwulf,i dont understand your response. My point is that you can't oneshot 10 mobs at once with 4 GF's. My point is you only nerfed CW/GWF damage, and didn't raise anyone but HR up. So nothing is changed, you are still going to just bring in multiple CW's/GWF's. In fact it is worse, because they don't do as much damage as before.
reiwulf,i dont understand your response. My point is that you can't oneshot 10 mobs at once with 4 GF's. My point is you only nerfed CW/GWF damage, and didn't raise anyone but HR up. So nothing is changed, you are still going to just bring in multiple CW's/GWF's. In fact it is worse, because they don't do as much damage as before.
it's hypotethical, I meant there are many more changes coming, and the general idea is to change how dungeons are run now, so there will be a point where it'll be better to bring in other classes instead of stacking CWs.
Exactly my point. I just want everyone to be aware that nerfing CW/GWF is not fixing the issue, and the changes to the other classes so far don't fix the issue.
Exactly my point. I just want everyone to be aware that nerfing CW/GWF is not fixing the issue, and the changes to the other classes so far don't fix the issue.
I disagree. The only thing I believe still needs addressed is improving CW survivability in PvP. That would offset the cooldown increases and add something the class has badly needed for some time. Maybe modify useless Shield to give CC immunity.
I just dodged 2 SE's from the same TR in the same match -- if you dodge right when you hear the start of the *whoosh* noise it's possible to avoid. You can also dodge the damage on icy rays, but still end up rooted at the end of your dodge, similar to how GWF roar can currently interrupt you mid-dodge.
You didn't dodge it, you ran out of its range.
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silverquickMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 1Arc User
reiwulf,i dont understand your response. My point is that you can't oneshot 10 mobs at once with 4 GF's. My point is you only nerfed CW/GWF damage, and didn't raise anyone but HR up. So nothing is changed, you are still going to just bring in multiple CW's/GWF's. In fact it is worse, because they don't do as much damage as before.
Pretty much...
But I wouldn't worry too much. The reality is, CWs under the surface aren't retooling to be "controllers" in their words, they're just retooling to be AoE damager again.
So not much is going to change here.
This whole thing was just a waste of time by people who had no understanding of how the GWF/CW mechanic worked in the first place, and they're about to make it even worse than before.
EDIT: And Rangers aren't wanted for their damage now... why would they be more wanted after?
The Devs just made Steal Time the new "Shards of Endless Avalanche" and Shards now becomes the new Steal Time. So its actually completely pointless. Shards was a hell of a lot harder to hit and cast in the beginning and its supposedly the highest level "Capstone" Spell. They're obviously just throwing anything at the wall an hoping it sticks by knee jerking on the "Oh shards is overpowered" idiocy being spewed by people. When if they'd have just stopped and thought it through with a calm head... they wouldn't have needed to waste anyone's time in the first place and could have just as well left everything as is.
pve wise well, look at arp , i went on preview and discovered the IT tabbed CoI was very controlling not to mention the dmg from coi reduced but IT bumped also the fact that you can "nearly" permafreeze mobs its pretty nifty.and the arp change well, i can only say its great.
Chill in pve is going to be your friend, i think Arcane presence and evocation[ or storm spell] are going to be the next best after losing Eots
We are going to have to stack some crit instead of shelving azures. so I can see Darks and azures being on par with radiant power gifts.
There wont be a HUGE AND HORRENDOUS loss of dps overall for the wizard, just a need to adapt and learn a new way to max your dmg while still cc'ing stuff.
Pvp : well ....lol..... tab coi dump IT and hold RoF and you will lock anyone on thier way to you and then again when they actually are on your toes. then , there is the daily thing - all those who cried and cried about ice knife can purchase some sandwipes for their preverbials cos it [with good arp] hits so **** hard its not funny, remeber its not supposed to kill /oneshot its a prone and some dmg and 3xchill , so either Ice storm [3xchill]also to give yourself some range.... or IK[3xchill] then within .5 sec you can have your target frozen again - giving you MORE time to cast CoI and IT and RoF again or another encounter [ which i havent really bothered with alot 1v1 as you dont even need them , maybe repel to give more range, i dont think chill strike will be very usefull in the long run unless you are using as an opener on a target thats not aware of you. I am currently testing Tabbed CoI [for free chill and its nice cd
Icy terrain for ppl who want to get in melee range [ good recovery can have this near perma terrain] repel for range gaining and entangling [ to keep my melee mates happy] - at the end of the day large range + chill to freeze is going to be our friend more so than other things currently [ this is SS cw btw]
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gregonmarsMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 3Arc User
edited June 2014
Hey
As a pure cw renegade pvp player, the proposed adjustments are really too drastic :
I mean for example :
RoE : my main pow in tab to help my peers ... now useless either for pvp or pve; please leave this pow asis
EoFS : u will kill the renegade tree !
In general why have u raise the cd of many pow ??? uncomprehensible ...
In general with these nerfs, the few CW pvpers will quit for we are now more than ever useless either in DPS or real control/debuff.
While CW is my main character, i think i'll get an HR to enjoy again real distance support and killing.
Last but not least : when and where the devs will give us the feedback about all the complains ?
I will repeat it until I get sick of it: you are making Oppressor perma-freezer the only viable option in PvP (and PvE). There are gamers who would love to play this way, but there are others who would like to have a different options equally viable. Don't take our choices away. Leave Renegade be. Renegade is not master DPS in PvE and it's fun to play in PvP although it's not the best DPS there either. It is one of the most balanced trees for CWs. Why destroy it.
And once again: casting time shouldn't be mangled with. This is one of the factors why combat in NWO is so smooth and exciting to play. If you insist on having it longer and implement teleportation cancelling skills... you would do better to take stamina bar away. In fierce PvP player with 3 dodges will have no chances against player with 5 dodges and no casting time for lots of useful skills. CW will dodge 3 times, HR will dodge 3 times, and after that CW will be forced to slow cast encounter, which HR will easily dodge since he has 2 more doges left, not to mention fox cunning. How is that fair?
I had an encounter with HR once, I was almost dead, but thanks to Shard on tab and FAST casting EF, RoE, Icy rays was I only able to survive this 1v1. The same scenario would have me killed twice, if those changes were implemented.
Bids he then the spruces to singer him an anthems!
And the Woodsie Lord binders them fleshes to stone!
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adernathMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
It would be nice, if the devs introduce an item, that will change characterbound items to acc.bound.
Cryptic would make money with that and we player will have a chance to transfer our Artifacts and Companions to the warlock. (If it will be the new pve dps class)
I have chosen Thauma CW, because it is a dps machine (PVE), but with those changes,
the Thauma CW will die, thats for sure.
Everyone and it doesn t matter if they want pve or pvp build, will stick with the opressor tree.
Wow all CWs are the same, no Thauma or Renegade builds, it will be boring i think.
It would be really helpful, if this item will released, it would be a win win situation.
Many people will loose motivation if we can t transfer the items for that we farmed and invested so much time.
If i imagine to do that again, it s like a nightmare.
For me, its a desaster to nerf a char like that, because all made that char because of its pve capabilities.
It s not funny to freeze enemies permanently and the others can just kill them without any difficulties at all.
If i think about it, will it help the TR to join partys?
I dont think so, because 2-3 CWs will perma freeze all and the GWFs or maybe HR (because the HRs dps is 30% higher with mod 4) will kill them. How do you wanna solve the TR pve problem?
So imo the renegade and the Thauma Trees are not needed, you can delete them and i think it is not the intention of the devs that those 2 trees are worthless.
Instead of nerfing the CW like that you could push the TR/GF to make them an option for pve.
The new changes will not make that difference people are hoping for.
I understand, that the CW needed a nerf because of the arm.pen. fix, but that is too much.
If the best pve dps class does 66% less dps in pve and get nothing instead (thauma tree), it s not easy to swallow.
I 100% agree with this.
And I want to add that even today you see horrible CWs wich make low damage using wrong spells and rotations. To be able to make high damage you need to practice and learn your class - and of course invest into your toon. And this is perfect as it is now.
I repeat again my suggestions with the state of module 3:
- The HR needs some buffs for pve which doesnt hurt pvp much. This is especially split shot: Increase split shot damage and tone down the aggro part of it. Many other abilities are also very useless in pve.
- The TR is different: Give him more single DPS but at the same time buff up the CWs shield (at least to 2x its strength). Give the TR also more effective AOE CCs so that he can be the 'meele' version of the CWs in regards of CCing. Hell, you can even give him so much CC that you can overwork stealth mechanics.
- Finally: Overwork the dodge of CWs so that they do not lose all their movement after 1 dodge but can dodge 'on the move' like the HR. This together with the shield buff will give CWs a better survivability in PvP and will make wonders.
I hope these suggestions are read by anyone
Suggestions to improve NW:
- Dualspec
- Better rewarding foundry and foundry pvp maps
- Custom PvP leagues with leaderboards instead of the current 'matchmaking'.
- Armory
- make jumping cost stamina (to reduce hopping in pvp)
the cast times seem to have minimal effect in pve. so i dont mind/ care about the extentions/reductions. Thau no longer gets any mitigation from its end feat, shard is shut down, so any spec i ran with thau as the tree was unuseable. most ran thau, as it was a lazy dps. i love the renegade end of tree being cw specific enhances rather than party buffs, this was the #1 reason that renegade was so up and down with dps ,at least for those not spending a lot of time waiting for chaotic nexus then switching. i am concerned with roe no l;ongher being a party debuff, its extended cast time and party debuff limitation is going to render it useless. steal time was always usefull, and now quite powerful. coi, even though the overall damage is reduced, it is balanced with a shorter cool down. but with it no longer useful to thau, only oppressors will use it, the shatter end of tree sounds good, but out of pvp, oppressor still is a single target tree. the lack of control is my real concern.
CONTROL wizards. reducing mobs controlled is not the way to make this class useful. sure they are op, and a damage reduction, reducing aoe damage by removing a heroic feat completly, and halfing the other. why cripple sing?
i see that you are leaving fire mages some outs, the buff to immolation on bottom orf oppressor, coupled with a renegade running fanning, icy terrain, steal time and coi on tab seems to be the only way to progress with any measure of results that will make a cw able to solo/pve. immolation with ice knife. scorching burst and chilling cloud. that will be my build, running crit heavy shadow, or bi gear. a vorpal, passives critical con and furious. this build allows me some of the dps i had previously, and wont have people turning me away. but the specificity of the build and limited choices with greatly reduced control is tough for a CONTROL less wizard
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arbitrarityMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 96Arc User
edited June 2014
I feel like the new encouraged oppressor build significantly increases control. The faster damage tick on Icy Terrain, Shattered's 5s stun, and shorter CoI cooldown let you perma-stun 5 enemies trivially while doing impressive sustained damage to them (though this may be because I have Willo'wisp/Cantankerous). This is even more obvious if you use Sudden Storm, with 5 stacks of chill from oppressor tree. This also looks promising in PvP, with fast RoI stacks and Shattered, even if Steal Time isn't nearly as effective. Immolation will probably replace Sing for grouping mobs, especially with the 4s daze.
The loss of lifesteal+burst damage from Sudden Storm and Shard really hurts though. Mobs in IWD, especially Deathlock Wights, seem to be bursting me down VERY quickly compared to live, unless I am really on the ball with dodge timing. Will do some comparison tests, and check if they're just tuned tougher on the test server.
Kikiseale, they reverted the nerf on RoE being for the CW only. However, multiple RoE's from multiple CWs will no longer stack.
If you want to leave control to the CW and give dps to the new class so do it, now you are simply killing a class. And i'm speaking as a debuff DC and a control lover CW; I want to use DC for help my team, CW for control (if you want to took away my dps give me more control cause if i cannot kill them i have to make them not touching me) and the new dps wizard to make amazing damages.
doriangreighMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 707Arc User
edited June 2014
I love how this game calls .25 seconds to 3 or so seconds control. My previous MMO had real CC, you put something down for a full 60 seconds. Why? Because if you didn't put down one or more of the adds or elites you got trashed, so you mark your target cc 1 - 3 of them (depending on who is in group with CC) and then DPS the remaining down so that hopefully they are dead by the time CC wears off.
If this game wants to rely on the term "control" it will need to completely re-work how dungeons and mobs are made and work. Right now control in this game is do as much dps as possible to kill the asinine amount of adds before they can kill everyone. I would like to see a CW actually do something like stun a whole group of mobs for a full 10 seconds so that elites can be killed and trashed and or see control wizards lock down elites so the rest of the group cleans up adds. This of course works best if the Adds don't respawn every 5 seconds.
OK. Where to begin? I'm quite upset with the proposed changes to CW's, so I am going to try to word this just right without being nasty.
WHAT THE HELL DID YOU DO TO MY RENEGADE?
Yes I yelled that. The tree is useless now. Not nerfed. Useless. I've been trying to play in the preview server, but as a renegade, with the combination of no EOTS, little to no additional Combat Advantage, little to no additional Crit Severity, decrease in damage and the increase in cooldown it takes too long to kill the ememies and sometimes is a struggle just to survive the battle.
OK. I get it. You want more control and less damage. I get that. But forcing everyone to be a Master of Flame Oppressor. Really. So we have to be a fire mage who uses frost? So which are we? A Control Wizard, a Fire Mage or a Frost Mage? If Wizards of The Coast need to sign off on this before it goes live, maybe ther is hope. I can't believe they would approve such drastic changes.
I fear now, the Renegade tree is useless.The whole reason to go Renegade was for Combat Advantage and Critical Severity. I have purchased several purple (or upgraded to purple) companions to give me addition Combat Advantage and Critical Severity. Not to mention my 2 week old Perfect Vorpal. All of which have been reduced to virtually useless.
Nightmare Wizardry: This feat now has a 1/2/3/4/5% chance (down from 4/8/12/16/20%) to grant you and allies combat advantage for 12 seconds (up from 4).
So now I have a 95% chance to get NO Combat Advantage from this feat at all? 5 Points wasted here.
Phantasmal Destruction: When you deal Combat Advantage damage you have a 25% chance (down from 100%) to grant 3/6/9/12/15% Critical Severity for 6 seconds.
So now I have a 75% chance to get an 85% chance to get NO additional crit severity... another 5 points wasted!
There's 10 points. Tossed away in the Renegade tree. These feats are so useless now, you might as well just replace them altogether.
I've spent all my AD and virtually all my spare time playing and tweaking my Renegade, to get him to where he is today.
I don't understand what your end game is. You want us to have more control and perform better in PVP by increasing the cooldowns? How is increasing cooldowns usefull EVER?
You give us artifacts to empower us, only to take away MORE damage then I get from the added stats of ALL my artifacts combined.
The only toon I care about is my PVE renegade CW. I've only PVP'd maybe 10 times since beta.
I think the changes to the oppressor tree are an excellent option for people to choose control over damage. Unfortunately you are not giving us a choice. You are forcing it upon us.
The only choice for Pure Damage Output is MOF Oppressor. Renegade is dead and Thaum is cut off at the knees.
I feel a flat across the board AOE DPS nerf would be a better choice.
I feel like you are destroying my tree and forcing me to MOF OPP.
I feel you are taking away the only part of this game that interests me.
I feel like I should call the police. Like I've just been mugged and all the time and effort I've put into my toon in this last year+, increasing his DPS to the MAX. Has just been stolen from me.
An AOE damage nerf would really suck. But it's still a much better outcome for both Thaum as well as Renegade.
I did more damage at level 30 with NO weapon enchant at all than I do now as a Renegade.
Please dev's reconsider these changes. My spirit is already broken. Playing PVE in Icewind Dale has lost it's fun for me. I know a nerf is coming and the thought of wasting any more of my life on this game seems pointless now. In fact typing this out seems like a waste of time. It will probably get deleted anyway.
Comments
I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU. IMO, the new nerfs for CW are 99% designed to make us useless in PVP as we already are against TR and GWF. I've already spent lost fo moolah improving my CW but now it seems I just wasted my hard earned money because of this bull **** nerfs.
I don't know where to start. I don't even know If I want to spend time trying to make you realize how bad this is, because you are so off the grid with the changes so it feels useless to even try to get you on the right track.
You nerfed every single feat and power to the ground that are used in endgame PvP. All we had was our damage and debuff in PvP, now we don't have that either.
Thats exactly what I think. But never mind....lets not play DCs ...there are really less DCs anyway...and lets not play CW anymore.
Welcome to a world full of TR, HR and Gwf.
I ll play Gwf then cause...damage is on CW not soooo high...yeah and only controls? Nobody needs you anymore, not in PVP and not in PVE. Goodbye my beloved CW. Hallo "me on Gfw".
Just add more cc-immune mobs, add traps that can kill entire party (TR will be needed), make it more difficult. Buff for GF aggro and block is needed same as TR single damage, fix some DC powers like linked spirit, adjust archer path for HR. This big DPS nerf for CW (i think -20% less dps will be fine) and GWF unstoppable (30% DR will be fine) is like crazy train that could derail this game.
All I want is kill/burst from range (not that we have good preconditions for that in the first place). I just don't see the point in nerfing the Renegade build. It has nothing to do with PvE. And why mess with activation times? People have been practicing those rotations for over a year.
Yep, I remember that match. It was awesome and challenging as hell. A lot went wrong there (not gonna discuss it in this thread, though), but we worked on that and many of the mistakes we made in that match won't happen again.
I hear ya.
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
If u remove their control on the other hand, the result will be that every team will take 3 CW to go in the dungeon, simple as that.
If u really want to change this class change the spells, put new ones thinking always that u have in mind to make a new class of wizards that has dps
I have seen Icy Ray to be dodged numerous times! Despite its undodgeable
hr fox cunning
CRAZY MIKE - 14.6k PvE CW
Backbone - 16.7k PvP HR
[SIGPIC]http://i59.tinypic.com/s3hts7.png[/SIGPIC]
I disagree. The only thing I believe still needs addressed is improving CW survivability in PvP. That would offset the cooldown increases and add something the class has badly needed for some time. Maybe modify useless Shield to give CC immunity.
You didn't dodge it, you ran out of its range.
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Pretty much...
But I wouldn't worry too much. The reality is, CWs under the surface aren't retooling to be "controllers" in their words, they're just retooling to be AoE damager again.
So not much is going to change here.
This whole thing was just a waste of time by people who had no understanding of how the GWF/CW mechanic worked in the first place, and they're about to make it even worse than before.
EDIT: And Rangers aren't wanted for their damage now... why would they be more wanted after?
The Devs just made Steal Time the new "Shards of Endless Avalanche" and Shards now becomes the new Steal Time. So its actually completely pointless. Shards was a hell of a lot harder to hit and cast in the beginning and its supposedly the highest level "Capstone" Spell. They're obviously just throwing anything at the wall an hoping it sticks by knee jerking on the "Oh shards is overpowered" idiocy being spewed by people. When if they'd have just stopped and thought it through with a calm head... they wouldn't have needed to waste anyone's time in the first place and could have just as well left everything as is.
Chill in pve is going to be your friend, i think Arcane presence and evocation[ or storm spell] are going to be the next best after losing Eots
We are going to have to stack some crit instead of shelving azures. so I can see Darks and azures being on par with radiant power gifts.
There wont be a HUGE AND HORRENDOUS loss of dps overall for the wizard, just a need to adapt and learn a new way to max your dmg while still cc'ing stuff.
Pvp : well ....lol..... tab coi dump IT and hold RoF and you will lock anyone on thier way to you and then again when they actually are on your toes. then , there is the daily thing - all those who cried and cried about ice knife can purchase some sandwipes for their preverbials cos it [with good arp] hits so **** hard its not funny, remeber its not supposed to kill /oneshot its a prone and some dmg and 3xchill , so either Ice storm [3xchill]also to give yourself some range.... or IK[3xchill] then within .5 sec you can have your target frozen again - giving you MORE time to cast CoI and IT and RoF again or another encounter [ which i havent really bothered with alot 1v1 as you dont even need them , maybe repel to give more range, i dont think chill strike will be very usefull in the long run unless you are using as an opener on a target thats not aware of you. I am currently testing Tabbed CoI [for free chill and its nice cd
Icy terrain for ppl who want to get in melee range [ good recovery can have this near perma terrain] repel for range gaining and entangling [ to keep my melee mates happy] - at the end of the day large range + chill to freeze is going to be our friend more so than other things currently [ this is SS cw btw]
As a pure cw renegade pvp player, the proposed adjustments are really too drastic :
I mean for example :
RoE : my main pow in tab to help my peers ... now useless either for pvp or pve; please leave this pow asis
EoFS : u will kill the renegade tree !
In general why have u raise the cd of many pow ??? uncomprehensible ...
In general with these nerfs, the few CW pvpers will quit for we are now more than ever useless either in DPS or real control/debuff.
While CW is my main character, i think i'll get an HR to enjoy again real distance support and killing.
Last but not least : when and where the devs will give us the feedback about all the complains ?
Long live PVP CW !! .. well just a wish now ?
And once again: casting time shouldn't be mangled with. This is one of the factors why combat in NWO is so smooth and exciting to play. If you insist on having it longer and implement teleportation cancelling skills... you would do better to take stamina bar away. In fierce PvP player with 3 dodges will have no chances against player with 5 dodges and no casting time for lots of useful skills. CW will dodge 3 times, HR will dodge 3 times, and after that CW will be forced to slow cast encounter, which HR will easily dodge since he has 2 more doges left, not to mention fox cunning. How is that fair?
I had an encounter with HR once, I was almost dead, but thanks to Shard on tab and FAST casting EF, RoE, Icy rays was I only able to survive this 1v1. The same scenario would have me killed twice, if those changes were implemented.
I 100% agree with this.
And I want to add that even today you see horrible CWs wich make low damage using wrong spells and rotations. To be able to make high damage you need to practice and learn your class - and of course invest into your toon. And this is perfect as it is now.
I repeat again my suggestions with the state of module 3:
- The HR needs some buffs for pve which doesnt hurt pvp much. This is especially split shot: Increase split shot damage and tone down the aggro part of it. Many other abilities are also very useless in pve.
- The TR is different: Give him more single DPS but at the same time buff up the CWs shield (at least to 2x its strength). Give the TR also more effective AOE CCs so that he can be the 'meele' version of the CWs in regards of CCing. Hell, you can even give him so much CC that you can overwork stealth mechanics.
- Finally: Overwork the dodge of CWs so that they do not lose all their movement after 1 dodge but can dodge 'on the move' like the HR. This together with the shield buff will give CWs a better survivability in PvP and will make wonders.
I hope these suggestions are read by anyone
- Dualspec
- Better rewarding foundry and foundry pvp maps
- Custom PvP leagues with leaderboards instead of the current 'matchmaking'.
- Armory
- make jumping cost stamina (to reduce hopping in pvp)
CONTROL wizards. reducing mobs controlled is not the way to make this class useful. sure they are op, and a damage reduction, reducing aoe damage by removing a heroic feat completly, and halfing the other. why cripple sing?
i see that you are leaving fire mages some outs, the buff to immolation on bottom orf oppressor, coupled with a renegade running fanning, icy terrain, steal time and coi on tab seems to be the only way to progress with any measure of results that will make a cw able to solo/pve. immolation with ice knife. scorching burst and chilling cloud. that will be my build, running crit heavy shadow, or bi gear. a vorpal, passives critical con and furious. this build allows me some of the dps i had previously, and wont have people turning me away. but the specificity of the build and limited choices with greatly reduced control is tough for a CONTROL less wizard
The loss of lifesteal+burst damage from Sudden Storm and Shard really hurts though. Mobs in IWD, especially Deathlock Wights, seem to be bursting me down VERY quickly compared to live, unless I am really on the ball with dodge timing. Will do some comparison tests, and check if they're just tuned tougher on the test server.
Kikiseale, they reverted the nerf on RoE being for the CW only. However, multiple RoE's from multiple CWs will no longer stack.
If this game wants to rely on the term "control" it will need to completely re-work how dungeons and mobs are made and work. Right now control in this game is do as much dps as possible to kill the asinine amount of adds before they can kill everyone. I would like to see a CW actually do something like stun a whole group of mobs for a full 10 seconds so that elites can be killed and trashed and or see control wizards lock down elites so the rest of the group cleans up adds. This of course works best if the Adds don't respawn every 5 seconds.
WHAT THE HELL DID YOU DO TO MY RENEGADE?
Yes I yelled that. The tree is useless now. Not nerfed. Useless. I've been trying to play in the preview server, but as a renegade, with the combination of no EOTS, little to no additional Combat Advantage, little to no additional Crit Severity, decrease in damage and the increase in cooldown it takes too long to kill the ememies and sometimes is a struggle just to survive the battle.
OK. I get it. You want more control and less damage. I get that. But forcing everyone to be a Master of Flame Oppressor. Really. So we have to be a fire mage who uses frost? So which are we? A Control Wizard, a Fire Mage or a Frost Mage? If Wizards of The Coast need to sign off on this before it goes live, maybe ther is hope. I can't believe they would approve such drastic changes.
I fear now, the Renegade tree is useless.The whole reason to go Renegade was for Combat Advantage and Critical Severity. I have purchased several purple (or upgraded to purple) companions to give me addition Combat Advantage and Critical Severity. Not to mention my 2 week old Perfect Vorpal. All of which have been reduced to virtually useless.
Nightmare Wizardry: This feat now has a 1/2/3/4/5% chance (down from 4/8/12/16/20%) to grant you and allies combat advantage for 12 seconds (up from 4).
So now I have a 95% chance to get NO Combat Advantage from this feat at all? 5 Points wasted here.
Phantasmal Destruction: When you deal Combat Advantage damage you have a 25% chance (down from 100%) to grant 3/6/9/12/15% Critical Severity for 6 seconds.
So now I have a 75% chance to get an 85% chance to get NO additional crit severity... another 5 points wasted!
There's 10 points. Tossed away in the Renegade tree. These feats are so useless now, you might as well just replace them altogether.
I've spent all my AD and virtually all my spare time playing and tweaking my Renegade, to get him to where he is today.
I don't understand what your end game is. You want us to have more control and perform better in PVP by increasing the cooldowns? How is increasing cooldowns usefull EVER?
You give us artifacts to empower us, only to take away MORE damage then I get from the added stats of ALL my artifacts combined.
The only toon I care about is my PVE renegade CW. I've only PVP'd maybe 10 times since beta.
I think the changes to the oppressor tree are an excellent option for people to choose control over damage. Unfortunately you are not giving us a choice. You are forcing it upon us.
The only choice for Pure Damage Output is MOF Oppressor. Renegade is dead and Thaum is cut off at the knees.
I feel a flat across the board AOE DPS nerf would be a better choice.
I feel like you are destroying my tree and forcing me to MOF OPP.
I feel you are taking away the only part of this game that interests me.
I feel like I should call the police. Like I've just been mugged and all the time and effort I've put into my toon in this last year+, increasing his DPS to the MAX. Has just been stolen from me.
An AOE damage nerf would really suck. But it's still a much better outcome for both Thaum as well as Renegade.
I did more damage at level 30 with NO weapon enchant at all than I do now as a Renegade.
Please dev's reconsider these changes. My spirit is already broken. Playing PVE in Icewind Dale has lost it's fun for me. I know a nerf is coming and the thought of wasting any more of my life on this game seems pointless now. In fact typing this out seems like a waste of time. It will probably get deleted anyway.
Please don't ruin Neverwinter for me.