I agree that the bug is not the problem, it is their refusal to admit the mistake and apologize for the damage it has done. Assuming they couldn't roll back and the only feasible option is to let this go, I am still willing to forgive them.
However, it will require them to take ownership of this issue, regardless of how or why it happened. They are the ones responsible for the state of the game. Take ownership and do whatever is possible to fix the issue or minimize the grief it causes to legitimate players if the issue can not be fixed.
As it is now, Cryptic's silence leads to conspiracy theories about how this 'bug' was intentionally abused for increased profit.
As stated above I am also offended at them referring to the persons receiving a mount as lucky. Certainly some of them were just that. The people who received many many multiples of the mount were most certainly not lucky, but, calculating exploiters.
I can only wonder whether this benefits Cryptic due to the increased zen sales and key purchases to open the 'old' lockboxes. Additionally, suppose the AD farmers were some of the main people taking advantage of this? Cryptic has then made money off the AD farmers and potentially recovered some lost revenue from the people who chose to buy AD via illicit means. Now I doubt this is the case, but, how do I know? This is my point.
In the absence of real information, people will fill in the blanks for themselves. When the response is unlike the response a genuine unexpected issue would receive, people become suspicious. All of these things may be easily explainable, but, we need to hear the rationale behind not issuing a rollback.
We need to hear the rationale behind not choosing to limit the 'bug' to 1 mount per account or character and refunding the remaining keys. We need to hear why you have decided to insult our intelligence and pretend as if just a small number of people luckily got a Nightmare Mount.
Your OP makes it sound as if the odds went from 5% to 25%, not .5% to 50% which is much more likely to be the truth. Never mind that as soon as the servers came up people began buying lock boxes with their stash of keys in ludicrous quantities. Surely someone that open 50 lock boxes within seconds of the servers coming online is not 'lucky'?
I'd love to stay here and make this thread 20 pages longer, but, sadly I have to go to work.
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flitser87Banned Users, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Indeed. They are putting in more effort covering this up than just rolling it back a little. I'm going to be sure to periodically repost to keep awareness up. Hopefully something actually gets done about this. I've already got one foot in the quitting grave already (was perfectly happy with the game yesterday) so really nothing to lose.
The same on theire facebook... They toss the messages in the spamfolder. Have checked with serveral accounts. They are nothing but a bunch of idiots. Exploiting is ok aslong as they get money from it. They can have my hero of the north pack. Every mmo site will have this posted. Cryptic will get nothing but negative rep. Enjoy the downfall. NW will go where APB will go, death in couple of months
Yes, the fact they are deleting post left and right is ridiculous. Additionally, why do they VERY quickly delete any new topic which mentions the fact this bug was reported over a week ago with a link to the original thread?
Could it be that they are just hiding their incompetence? Perhaps it is more sinister?
How the **** do we have any idea? We don't. Based on their actions, I am more inclined to believe they are interested in nothing but damage control and minimizing the number of players who actually learn of this. Thus limiting the mass exodus that will occur if they are unwilling to address this issue in a professional manner.
Indeed. They are putting in more effort covering this up than just rolling it back a little. I'm going to be sure to periodically repost to keep awareness up. Hopefully something actually gets done about this. I've already got one foot in the quitting grave already (was perfectly happy with the game yesterday) so really nothing to lose.
Yeah, I've already told all my friends I played this game with that I'm not coming back unless this issue is properly addressed. One of my friends was ready to drop $50 is Zen today but now they're going to hold onto that money to see how this plays out. I can't blame them. I sooooo regret buying $50 in Zen. I didn't know what kind of company I was supporting ... but I do now.
I can understand your disappointment. The lockboxes provide no real value for money. They don't even indicate what your chances are of getting what you want, so you literally don't know if you are just wasting money (I mean, it could be a 0.000000001% chance, how would we know?)
I've opened quite a few boxes and I feel like it was a total waste of money. No customer satisfaction at all. That translates to "won't spend in the future".
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ranncoreMember, Moderators, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 2,508
edited August 2013
You know I like to spend money on my games, and several times my friends have said to me, "but why not just buy from the gold spammers, you get the same thing and it's cheaper?" I've told them I'd rather buy from PWE and Cryptic because I'm supporting the game developers, not the exploiters AFKing in PvP and doing things like, well, this.
But now that Cryptic is supporting the exploiters, I think next time I want to buy something in Neverwinter, it's not going to be from PWE. I'll just go straight to the gold sellers, because apparently that business is okay with Cryptic and PWE.
During a brief period of time after Fury of the Feywild was live, the success rate for getting the elusive Heavy Inferno Nightmare Mount was higher than expected and we were glad to see some lucky players be rewarded. From this point on, we do not plan on performing any rollbacks and we've made the necessary adjustments going forward. If you received a Heavy Inferno Nightmare Mount during this time, enjoy it!
Sincerely,
Pin
Nice , was an obvious bug and we are told in the ToS that taking advantage of an obvious bug can lead to perma ban , so those of us who could have taken advantage of this but chose not to due to following your own ToS are basically being flipped off by the dev team.
So this basically sets a precedent for future bugs of the same type where apparently it is perfectly okay with the dev team if you take advantage of obvious bugs concerning high value items , nice , thanks for setting us straight on that cmpinpointerror
I think that I will bookmark this thread for future use next time an obvious bug is exploited and the dev team decide to use bans instead...
Yeah, I foolishly left a write up in the first one, then when it happened again I realized it must be pretty common. I know for a fact it has nothing to do with my computer which is rock solid. It does not crash, ever.
Does the game crash outside of PE? I could at least potentially play the game then, assuming I stick around.
It's happened to me in PE twice and the new Fey wild area, or whatever it's called, once.
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dadeathwish79Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited August 2013
@ranncore you should just read what you said calling everyone exploiters just cause the game messed up and gave a higher win rate. ive spent lots of money on this game and aint complaining about it. so what big deal and get over it. people should be disappointed in you in that foul mouth.
exploiters
Web definitions
(exploiter) a person who uses something or someone selfishly or unethically.
wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn
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lagbiatMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited August 2013
I get the being mad part, I dropped money on this trying to get a mount when it was first announced. Hearing that a "lucky" few got it is a bit of a slap in the face. However it's a mount, it doesn't seem all that game breaking to me. I might be more mindful of dropping coin down on this game, but some of you seem to be taking this way to personal.
Nice , was an obvious bug and we are told in the ToS that taking advantage of an obvious bug can lead to perma ban , so those of us who could have taken advantage of this but chose not to due to following your own ToS are basically being flipped off by the dev team.
So this basically sets a prescience for future bugs of the same type where apparently it is perfectly okay with the dev team if you take advantage of obvious bugs concerning high value items , nice , thanks for setting us straight on that cmpinpointerror
I think that I will bookmark this thread for future use next time an obvious bug is exploited and the dev team decide to use bans instead...
It is as long as they are making money off of it. That's your security blanket right there. If they profited somehow from the bug being exploited, there will be no negative repercussions as a result because they would also be punished. Silly us for thinking morally instead of selfishly. Should have known better I guess.
@ranncore you should just read what you said calling everyone exploiters just cause the game messed up and gave a higher win rate. ive spent lots of money on this game and aint complaining about it. so what big deal and get over it. people should be disappointed in you in that foul mouth.
exploiters
Web definitions
(exploiter) a person who uses something or someone selfishly or unethically.
wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn
Exactly, these people exploited a mistake, oversight, bug, glitch, incorrect data, whatever (point being, it wasn't supposed to be that way) for their selfish and unethical gain.
Wow a game that endorses the use and abuse of exploits. I just have to say WOW!!!
Ummm....People just bought (or acquired) lockboxes and opened them--and some people got a mystic mount. ("Yay! I won something in the lottery!") That's a bad thing? It's like leaving a door unlocked with an 'open me' sign and then getting miffed because the door was supposed to be locked or they were supposed to knock first. C'mon.
Deal with it. There's nothing to complain about unless someone actually took something from YOU. (And by 'you' I mean anyone who's miffed about this.)
If people get luckier than usual while playing a certain slot machine at a casino, do the casino owners take the money back? No. They send a tech over and they wait until whoever's playing leaves, then they fix it.
No harm, no foul, folks. Have a wonderfully nice day.
I get the being mad part, I dropped money on this trying to get a mount when it was first announced. Hearing that a "lucky" few got it is a bit of a slap in the face. However it's a mount, it doesn't seem all that game breaking to me. I might be more mindful of dropping coin down on this game, but some of you seem to be taking this way to personal.
It's not about the mount. It's about a company that choses to reward exploiters rather than enforce their own policies and back the community of players who legitimately earned their rewards. If you want to ignore what they did then that's your choice, but the backlash from this terrible decision is completely warranted. People who played by the rules are indeed taking it personally and they should.
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flitser87Banned Users, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Ummm....People just bought (or acquired) lockboxes and opened them--and some people got a mystic mount. ("Yay! I won something in the lottery!") That's a bad thing? It's like leaving a door unlocked with an 'open me' sign and then getting miffed because the door was supposed to be locked or they were supposed to knock first. C'mon.
Deal with it. There's nothing to complain about unless someone actually took something from YOU. (And by 'you' I mean anyone who's miffed about this.)
If people get luckier than usual while playing a certain slot machine at a casino, do the casino owners take the money back? No. They send a tech over and they wait until whoever's playing leaves, then they fix it.
No harm, no foul, folks. Have a wonderfully nice day.
U clearly have no idea what is going on. THIS WAS A KNOWN EXPLOIT!!!
Its not about luck, its 100% exploit... They aren't doing anything about it because they are making money from this... I can only say, never spend anymore money in this failure company... PWE, do us all a favor. Outsource the game before it dies out... U guys are pathetic...
My msg on the forum still not deleted? Or can't they keep up with the negative posts about theire incompitence on facebook?
@ranncore you should just read what you said calling everyone exploiters just cause the game messed up and gave a higher win rate. ive spent lots of money on this game and aint complaining about it. so what big deal and get over it. people should be disappointed in you in that foul mouth.
exploiters
Web definitions
(exploiter) a person who uses something or someone selfishly or unethically.
wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn
So... Cryptic/PWE are the exploiters! I get it! So meta.
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slayorianMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Even the impact on the games economy wasn't that big of a deal. The AD to Zen exchange price has evened out, at least on my server, and the cost of the mounts dropped a bit for those who are trying to sell them now. It the principle of the entire situation.
This isn't a "open door with a 'please come in' sign on the front"
This is an "open door with a 'do not enter' sign" where people are flooding in. But instead of calling the authorities, they're simply shrugging their shoulders at the people who stole their stuff and giving a good hard slap in the face to all the people who refused to walk in and take their unguarded belongings. This whole situation is encouraging dishonest behavior, bug exploitation, and because it really needs to be said... cheating.
This was an immoral gain by dishonest players. It has nothing to do with how many mounts are in the game now. Who cares about that <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>, the people that are defending the game saying "it's just a mount" clearly aren't reading what the rest of us are saying.
But again, I'm just wasting my time here by writing this, because the fools will read what they want to read, and the devs won't read it at all. They don't care about the people who are leaving the game because of this, we're already a lost cause, they know they won't make any money off of us. They only care about the people who will become a loyal "customer" of there's because they got to take advantage of a mistake and profit from it in some way.
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ranncoreMember, Moderators, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 2,508
Where are all these mounts? Not many cashing in if the AH is anything to go by.
They were selling for as little as 20 gold in zone chat.
The real exploiters were the gold spamming companies, and you can buy horses from them dirt cheap right now. They're the real benefactors of this debacle.
Many of the angry ones here are going off the assumption that everyone who logged in and opened a lockbox after the patch was an exploiter.
The Devs on the other hand are saying that these players were not exploiting, they simply opened it at an opportune time when there was a small bug, and therefore were lucky - because it was a small time frame before servers came back down to fix the bug.
So what we can all gather from this is that A) The Devs really think highly of us all, and The Devs know more than we do about the subject. They probably knew about the bug because they fixed it fast after the servers came back down. Maybe they forgot to fix it before go-live? Who knows, but they fixed it.
I think we all need to relax and understand that this is an MMO in it's infancy. If you like it, you should support it whichever way you can.
Where are all these mounts? Not many cashing in if the AH is anything to go by.
On beholder they were 800-900k last time I looked before the patch , just now after I logged off a hour or so ago there was one at 500k or so , I'm guessing people are saving them to make a fortune when the market evens out again...
Let's face it people. Cryptic is happy because it got loads of cash. It's happy because people who EXPLOITED this bug had to spend some money, REAL MONEY, on Zen to open the lockboxes.
So why would Cryptic want to listen to those people who said, "This bug is going to be rolled back because Cryptic has these rules/regulations on exploiting bugs in the game. I don't want to exploit the game because I'm trying to follow those rules and regulations which they have laid out".
Instead Cryptic has basically said, "To those people who follow rules and regulations... HAHAHAHA.. you didn't get the Nightmare Mount buuuut... we made a dump load of money today and guess what? Ooops... we are going to let those people who exploited the game keep their mounts".
I'm really not shocked that Cryptic has allowed people to exploit the game for profit, while letting the people who have honor and morals get kicked to the curb.
Way to go Cryptic. You've shown your true colors once again.
How about those of us who bought a LOT of keys who didn't get a mount? The ones who DIDN'T exploit the system? Free mount please? You can see the records of purchases.
Pretty gross that are allowing exploiters to reap the benefits.
I have to disagree with this. So i have to work my *** off gathering 600k+ AD to buy a mount that was somewhat rare and that i really enjoyed it, and now some people that abused from a bug gets dozens of mounts almost for free. Serious, i never criticize decisions from you guys, but this is not fair for people that gathered AD, fair and square, or spent keys while opening boxes.
Comments
However, it will require them to take ownership of this issue, regardless of how or why it happened. They are the ones responsible for the state of the game. Take ownership and do whatever is possible to fix the issue or minimize the grief it causes to legitimate players if the issue can not be fixed.
As it is now, Cryptic's silence leads to conspiracy theories about how this 'bug' was intentionally abused for increased profit.
As stated above I am also offended at them referring to the persons receiving a mount as lucky. Certainly some of them were just that. The people who received many many multiples of the mount were most certainly not lucky, but, calculating exploiters.
I can only wonder whether this benefits Cryptic due to the increased zen sales and key purchases to open the 'old' lockboxes. Additionally, suppose the AD farmers were some of the main people taking advantage of this? Cryptic has then made money off the AD farmers and potentially recovered some lost revenue from the people who chose to buy AD via illicit means. Now I doubt this is the case, but, how do I know? This is my point.
In the absence of real information, people will fill in the blanks for themselves. When the response is unlike the response a genuine unexpected issue would receive, people become suspicious. All of these things may be easily explainable, but, we need to hear the rationale behind not issuing a rollback.
We need to hear the rationale behind not choosing to limit the 'bug' to 1 mount per account or character and refunding the remaining keys. We need to hear why you have decided to insult our intelligence and pretend as if just a small number of people luckily got a Nightmare Mount.
Your OP makes it sound as if the odds went from 5% to 25%, not .5% to 50% which is much more likely to be the truth. Never mind that as soon as the servers came up people began buying lock boxes with their stash of keys in ludicrous quantities. Surely someone that open 50 lock boxes within seconds of the servers coming online is not 'lucky'?
I'd love to stay here and make this thread 20 pages longer, but, sadly I have to go to work.
The same on theire facebook... They toss the messages in the spamfolder. Have checked with serveral accounts. They are nothing but a bunch of idiots. Exploiting is ok aslong as they get money from it. They can have my hero of the north pack. Every mmo site will have this posted. Cryptic will get nothing but negative rep. Enjoy the downfall. NW will go where APB will go, death in couple of months
Could it be that they are just hiding their incompetence? Perhaps it is more sinister?
How the **** do we have any idea? We don't. Based on their actions, I am more inclined to believe they are interested in nothing but damage control and minimizing the number of players who actually learn of this. Thus limiting the mass exodus that will occur if they are unwilling to address this issue in a professional manner.
Yeah, I've already told all my friends I played this game with that I'm not coming back unless this issue is properly addressed. One of my friends was ready to drop $50 is Zen today but now they're going to hold onto that money to see how this plays out. I can't blame them. I sooooo regret buying $50 in Zen. I didn't know what kind of company I was supporting ... but I do now.
I've opened quite a few boxes and I feel like it was a total waste of money. No customer satisfaction at all. That translates to "won't spend in the future".
But now that Cryptic is supporting the exploiters, I think next time I want to buy something in Neverwinter, it's not going to be from PWE. I'll just go straight to the gold sellers, because apparently that business is okay with Cryptic and PWE.
Nice , was an obvious bug and we are told in the ToS that taking advantage of an obvious bug can lead to perma ban , so those of us who could have taken advantage of this but chose not to due to following your own ToS are basically being flipped off by the dev team.
So this basically sets a precedent for future bugs of the same type where apparently it is perfectly okay with the dev team if you take advantage of obvious bugs concerning high value items , nice , thanks for setting us straight on that cmpinpointerror
I think that I will bookmark this thread for future use next time an obvious bug is exploited and the dev team decide to use bans instead...
Gosh , TESO closed beta/open beta invite cannot come soon enough ....
It's happened to me in PE twice and the new Fey wild area, or whatever it's called, once.
exploiters
Web definitions
(exploiter) a person who uses something or someone selfishly or unethically.
wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn
It is as long as they are making money off of it. That's your security blanket right there. If they profited somehow from the bug being exploited, there will be no negative repercussions as a result because they would also be punished. Silly us for thinking morally instead of selfishly. Should have known better I guess.
Exactly, these people exploited a mistake, oversight, bug, glitch, incorrect data, whatever (point being, it wasn't supposed to be that way) for their selfish and unethical gain.
Ummm....People just bought (or acquired) lockboxes and opened them--and some people got a mystic mount. ("Yay! I won something in the lottery!") That's a bad thing? It's like leaving a door unlocked with an 'open me' sign and then getting miffed because the door was supposed to be locked or they were supposed to knock first. C'mon.
Deal with it. There's nothing to complain about unless someone actually took something from YOU. (And by 'you' I mean anyone who's miffed about this.)
If people get luckier than usual while playing a certain slot machine at a casino, do the casino owners take the money back? No. They send a tech over and they wait until whoever's playing leaves, then they fix it.
No harm, no foul, folks. Have a wonderfully nice day.
It's not about the mount. It's about a company that choses to reward exploiters rather than enforce their own policies and back the community of players who legitimately earned their rewards. If you want to ignore what they did then that's your choice, but the backlash from this terrible decision is completely warranted. People who played by the rules are indeed taking it personally and they should.
U clearly have no idea what is going on. THIS WAS A KNOWN EXPLOIT!!!
Its not about luck, its 100% exploit... They aren't doing anything about it because they are making money from this... I can only say, never spend anymore money in this failure company... PWE, do us all a favor. Outsource the game before it dies out... U guys are pathetic...
My msg on the forum still not deleted? Or can't they keep up with the negative posts about theire incompitence on facebook?
So... Cryptic/PWE are the exploiters! I get it! So meta.
Completely wrong. There is both harm and foul. Harm to the economy, players getting slighted, and the foul is how poorly it was handled.
I didn't try commenting, but I took back my "Like." I do not like them today.
all i have to say
This isn't a "open door with a 'please come in' sign on the front"
This is an "open door with a 'do not enter' sign" where people are flooding in. But instead of calling the authorities, they're simply shrugging their shoulders at the people who stole their stuff and giving a good hard slap in the face to all the people who refused to walk in and take their unguarded belongings. This whole situation is encouraging dishonest behavior, bug exploitation, and because it really needs to be said... cheating.
This was an immoral gain by dishonest players. It has nothing to do with how many mounts are in the game now. Who cares about that <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>, the people that are defending the game saying "it's just a mount" clearly aren't reading what the rest of us are saying.
But again, I'm just wasting my time here by writing this, because the fools will read what they want to read, and the devs won't read it at all. They don't care about the people who are leaving the game because of this, we're already a lost cause, they know they won't make any money off of us. They only care about the people who will become a loyal "customer" of there's because they got to take advantage of a mistake and profit from it in some way.
They were selling for as little as 20 gold in zone chat.
The real exploiters were the gold spamming companies, and you can buy horses from them dirt cheap right now. They're the real benefactors of this debacle.
The Devs on the other hand are saying that these players were not exploiting, they simply opened it at an opportune time when there was a small bug, and therefore were lucky - because it was a small time frame before servers came back down to fix the bug.
So what we can all gather from this is that A) The Devs really think highly of us all, and
I think we all need to relax and understand that this is an MMO in it's infancy. If you like it, you should support it whichever way you can.
On beholder they were 800-900k last time I looked before the patch , just now after I logged off a hour or so ago there was one at 500k or so , I'm guessing people are saving them to make a fortune when the market evens out again...
So why would Cryptic want to listen to those people who said, "This bug is going to be rolled back because Cryptic has these rules/regulations on exploiting bugs in the game. I don't want to exploit the game because I'm trying to follow those rules and regulations which they have laid out".
Instead Cryptic has basically said, "To those people who follow rules and regulations... HAHAHAHA.. you didn't get the Nightmare Mount buuuut... we made a dump load of money today and guess what? Ooops... we are going to let those people who exploited the game keep their mounts".
I'm really not shocked that Cryptic has allowed people to exploit the game for profit, while letting the people who have honor and morals get kicked to the curb.
Way to go Cryptic. You've shown your true colors once again.
Pretty gross that are allowing exploiters to reap the benefits.