Ok guys, i know you are playing Trickster Rogue, but fact is .....rogue is OP. All mages spell are not control and in the fact these spell have lower DPS than base atack from rogue. Ok i understand rogue can do the highest direct dmg ok. But not AOE !.
Or you say me it is normal if rogue have a triple overall dmg in dungeon ??? It is joke !
I seen a Wizard do almost 4x the damage of another wizard of the same level in a dungeon this Wizard also had just under 2 times the damage as the next highest damage character in that run a rogue.
Basically it comes down to gear and wise skill usage unless both you and the rogue have the same stats from gear you cant run a comparison.
As for PvP duh a Rogue is meant to be a real threat to a solo wizard and Clerics, just dont let him land daze and the fight becomes much easier. BTW a rogue got a much defense as wet tissue paper.
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hellfinger69Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 5Arc User
It is fact. Another class are little useless with compare with rogue.
I not compare with him, its not necessary ^^
But with other classes, its not possible that the dps is so bad.
In dungeon , last dps after Clerc, Tank and other. (Behind rogue, ok im not shocking, even with 4 level )
The cleric has almost the same multi-dps that the Guardian fighter .... lol
So, the question is : What is the use of war dps ? (multi-target ? lol and that 's it ? wouahou ! so just 1 dps cac in NW ?)
(sorry for my english im french^^)
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ecchijinMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 3Arc User
edited April 2013
Always the same story in any mmo since 1996.
When in some random mmo FINALLY people can play a ROGUE has is meant to be.
People QQ and only ask nerfs, instead to try to understand and counter the class.
Always the same story in any mmo since 1996.
When in some random mmo FINALLY people can play a ROGUE has is meant to be.
People QQ and ask only nerfs, instead to try to understand and counter the class.
yup, every mmo, this happens. ppl crying
"Drive it like u stole it"
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ecchijinMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 3Arc User
I know, its in the nature of any mmo. The problem is this "rogue rage" that hits any mmo.
Its mind blowing.
Thats why the rogue after a while get nerfed then nobody play anymore; besides some hardcore rogue lover that play the class anyway, even if gets facerolled from any smashing button class.
And everyone is happy again.
I know, its in the nature of any mmo. The problem is this "rogue rage" that hits any mmo.
Its mind blowing.
Thats why the rogue after a while get nerfed then nobody play anymore; besides some hardcore rogue lover that play the class anyway, even if gets facerolled from any smashing button class.
And everyone is happy again.
Next mmo.
Then there is the opposite problem. TRs are so powerful right now that ppl are shelving their mains and rerolling TRs. I predict that in a week 90% of all players in PVP will be TRs and CWs, so imbalanced are they.
The outlook is not good. Cryptic cant figure out how to add camera zoom let alone balance classes.
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xantrisMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
That is WoW logic. in D&D TRs should not be outperforming any other class DPS wise. GWF should. And currently GWF is at the bottom of the list.
No, in D&D 4e, the GWF is a DEFENDER and the TR is a STRIKER. Strikers do more damage than defenders pretty much always, even offensive oriented defenders like the GWF.
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gtoxMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 10Arc User
Cleric is not OP. In all dungeons you dont need him ni party. Also in PVP rogue kill him v. easy with his OP dps.
lol I'm lovin' this thread. I wish I had read this before my cleric got 2nd in points in pvp, with no deaths despite the SUPER OMG OP ROGUES all trying to kill him.
Clearly you just don't know what you are doing, and that is not the rogue's fault.
As for not needing a Cleric for dungeons.. I don't NEED a car to get to work, but you don't see me getting up four hours early and putting on my running shoes.
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gtoxMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 10Arc User
Then there is the opposite problem. TRs are so powerful right now that ppl are shelving their mains and rerolling TRs. I predict that in a week 90% of all players in PVP will be TRs and CWs, so imbalanced are they.
The outlook is not good. Cryptic cant figure out how to add camera zoom let alone balance classes.
This comment is made even funnier by the fact that the game does have camera zoom. Doh!
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hellfinger69Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 5Arc User
Always the same story in any mmo since 1996.
When in some random mmo FINALLY people can play a ROGUE has is meant to be.
People QQ and only ask nerfs, instead to try to understand and counter the class.
It's sickening.
You play a rogue , no ? lol ^^
imo It is not a problem of charachter DD, but more a problem of general balance for all playable characters actually avaible in the game
Yea i have some experimence from game. My friend have a lvl 60 rogue and we compared it in action.
Experimence from dungeon.... rogue have double or more overall dmg than another class. If any rogue use companion (CAT) i think it will be more.
Pls nerf trickster rogue
1. He has the best direct dmg
2. He has the best aoe dmg
3. He has instant (cast) of his skills
4. He has a disarm of enemy foe skills ( it is similar CC)
5. He has invisiblity
6. It is boring play with rogue because he kill everything before i cast any aoe spell
If me compare with control wizard ha have a lower AOE dmg with long time to cast
What's funny is I couldn't have picked a better OP to make this argument look completely ridiculous.
Thank you, OP, for posting and defeating your own purpose.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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klangeddinMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 882Arc User
edited April 2013
If the Trickster Rogue is suppoed to deal so much damage, then the Brawny Rogue will get instant kill to everything on sight. :P
I don't think its fair to call for nerfs yet because the TR is the only striker in the game yet. Once the Warlock and Ranger come out and we have an apples-apples compare, then it should be determined. Right now of course the TR is going to be the best damage dealer because he is the only striker (DPS) class available.
Please wait level 60 before making such post .... I bet you are lvl25
I'm currently level 37 and it's getting harder and harder to solo PvE/kill in PvP.
Good wizzard can be pain in the *** ^^
If you use blink/roll/whatever you have to evade at the good time (when you see the emote of Dazing Strike), the fight will much easier. I'm just saying. Same for Lashing Blade obviously ^^
I think it's a problem with the OP understanding that, this MMO isn't about balancing all of the classes. If anything it's about hyper enforcing the trinity rules of Dmg, Heal, and Tank.
The Control Wizard isn't supposed to be an AoE damaging master, it's main function is crowd control. That's why it's called CONTROL.
The Great Weapon Fighter, has moderate skills in Damage dealing and AoE, but its ultimately still a Defending class. If anything secondary Tank.
Trickster Rogue is the only straight Damage Dealing class of the game. Everything it's supposed to do is for damage, it has little function outside of that. By calling for a nerf, for being insecure about your damage output in comparison, all you do is hurt the entire purpose for the rogue's existence. KILL ****.
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gumdropMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I don't think its fair to call for nerfs yet because the TR is the only striker in the game yet. Once the Warlock and Ranger come out and we have an apples-apples compare, then it should be determined. Right now of course the TR is going to be the best damage dealer because he is the only striker (DPS) class available.
^ This ........
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ecchijinMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 3Arc User
I think it's a problem with the OP understanding that, this MMO isn't about balancing all of the classes. If anything it's about hyper enforcing the trinity rules of Dmg, Heal, and Tank.
The Control Wizard isn't supposed to be an AoE damaging master, it's main function is crowd control. That's why it's called CONTROL.
The Great Weapon Fighter, has moderate skills in Damage dealing and AoE, but its ultimately still a Defending class. If anything secondary Tank.
Trickster Rogue is the only straight Damage Dealing class of the game. Everything it's supposed to do is for damage, it has little function outside of that. By calling for a nerf, for being insecure about your damage output in comparison, all you do is hurt the entire purpose for the rogue's existence. KILL ****.
Amen.
If everyone could understand that instead of noobish QQ in the forums.
1 - I know rogue is the ondly DD right now so I have no problems in it topping the charts in damage.
2 - Despite point 1 , the rogue is OP as shti right now, the threshold between the dmg it does and the other classes is just too high. PvE wise it's a concern but it's in pvp where it becomes unplayable. Rogue is too **** OP, to the point you don't even want to have another class in your group.
I don't care what you reply to this, it's ******* true.
Trickster rogue - nefr him pls for balance the game
Pls nerf trickster rogue
1. He has the best direct dmg
2. He has the best aoe dmg
3. He has instant (cast) of his skills
4. He has a disarm of enemy foe skills ( it is similar CC)
5. He has invisiblity
6. It is boring play with rogue because he kill everything before i cast any aoe spell
If me compare with control wizard ha have a lower AOE dmg with long time to cast
madcuzbad?
only 3 main dps classes.. one was bound to be on top.. either re-roll or play something else.
the games main focus right now is PvE so if Rogues can dish out alot of dps then good.. mobs will die faster. i can care less about dps charts as long as the boss dies and players get loot.
I will start rogue char tommorow. And i will post some screens from dungeon overall damage for prove ...rogue is OP . My plan is also take companion (CAT) for increase critical chance. I will invest into power and crit 50/50 procent.
I will start rogue char tommorow. And i will post some screens from dungeon overall damage for prove ...rogue is OP . My plan is also take companion (CAT) for increase critical chance. I will invest into power and crit 50/50 procent.
As everyone else has said...the point is that this game has exactly 1 Striker class in it right now. NONE of the other classes available are primary strikers. Therefore comparing DPS right now between classes is pointless.
People need to realize that this game is still in BETA and has A LOT of development to go before it reaches the point of being ready for live. There are at least one more pure striker class coming soon in the Ranger and possibly a 3rd in the Warlock. Also, there will be at least one more healing class that has to be integrated before this game even becomes close to being ready for a live production. That brings the total class list up to 8 with multiple choices for the 4 main 4e D&D roles (Defender, Leader, Controller, Striker).
Honestly, I would like to see 10 classes before they consider the game live production ready. At least two classes per role need to be available for diversity sake.
Anyone complaining about PvP balance in this game right now needs to reconsider. First off, PvP in a D&D game is never really going to be balanced for all classes. D&D is a PvE designed game. PvP is primarily about DPS and Healing, with CC playing a niche role from time to time. You can't "tank" in PvP as threat mechanics are completely irrelevant...all "tanking" can be made to do is cause a dps penalty to hitting anyone else. Even in these scenarios it is still best to just deal with the dps loss and burn the real threats down and then kill the "tanks" off last.
When you are looking at a choice of a whole 5 classes available and only one of them a true striker, of course PvP is going to be heavily skewed in their favor. Same as with PvE when it's the only striker in the game. Arguing balance in a game where there are at least 3 key classes missing still is pointless. Once the rest of the core classes are fleshed out, then we can star focusing on balancing apples vs apples.
As everyone else has said...the point is that this game has exactly 1 Striker class in it right now. NONE of the other classes available are primary strikers. Therefore comparing DPS right now between classes is pointless.
People need to realize that this game is still in BETA and has A LOT of development to go before it reaches the point of being ready for live. There are at least one more pure striker class coming soon in the Ranger and possibly a 3rd in the Warlock. Also, there will be at least one more healing class that has to be integrated before this game even becomes close to being ready for a live production. That brings the total class list up to 8 with multiple choices for the 4 main 4e D&D roles (Defender, Leader, Controller, Striker).
Honestly, I would like to see 10 classes before they consider the game live production ready. At least two classes per role need to be available for diversity sake.
Anyone complaining about PvP balance in this game right now needs to reconsider. First off, PvP in a D&D game is never really going to be balanced for all classes. D&D is a PvE designed game. PvP is primarily about DPS and Healing, with CC playing a niche role from time to time. You can't "tank" in PvP as threat mechanics are completely irrelevant...all "tanking" can be made to do is cause a dps penalty to hitting anyone else. Even in these scenarios it is still best to just deal with the dps loss and burn the real threats down and then kill the "tanks" off last.
When you are looking at a choice of a whole 5 classes available and only one of them a true striker, of course PvP is going to be heavily skewed in their favor. Same as with PvE when it's the only striker in the game. Arguing balance in a game where there are at least 3 key classes missing still is pointless. Once the rest of the core classes are fleshed out, then we can star focusing on balancing apples vs apples.
Sorry, i see you mention "live" a lot in your post. Can you tell me what difference between "open beta" and "live" will there be, except blaming all the game shortcomings on the fact that officially, this is beta.
When the game opens up tomorrow the masses are gonna flock in, play and judge it on the current version. If it's lacking they will quit and the vast majority of them won't be coming back.
The "this is beta" argument is completely flawed. When the open beta starts, you might as well call it live.
I have been at lots and i mean LOTS of mmo launches and honestly the game isn't probably that far away from live.
That said you won't have more classes at launch than what you already have plus the one to be unlocked I can bet you on that and if you search you will find info on it. Devs won't develop new classes or work on classes that haven't been tested in closed betas once you go into an open beta.
Also I don't care if it's D&D or whatever universe it is. You can't have such a lousy balance in a game . I understand it's beta but that isnt't an excuse and being savvy in this department I know you won't get mcuh different at launch than from what it is now.
And as it is now it's simply unplayable and not funny if you're not a rogue, period.
The "this is beta" argument is completely flawed. When the open beta starts, you might as well call it live.
Comments
I seen a Wizard do almost 4x the damage of another wizard of the same level in a dungeon this Wizard also had just under 2 times the damage as the next highest damage character in that run a rogue.
Basically it comes down to gear and wise skill usage unless both you and the rogue have the same stats from gear you cant run a comparison.
As for PvP duh a Rogue is meant to be a real threat to a solo wizard and Clerics, just dont let him land daze and the fight becomes much easier. BTW a rogue got a much defense as wet tissue paper.
I not compare with him, its not necessary ^^
But with other classes, its not possible that the dps is so bad.
In dungeon , last dps after Clerc, Tank and other. (Behind rogue, ok im not shocking, even with 4 level )
The cleric has almost the same multi-dps that the Guardian fighter .... lol
So, the question is : What is the use of war dps ? (multi-target ? lol and that 's it ? wouahou ! so just 1 dps cac in NW ?)
(sorry for my english im french^^)
When in some random mmo FINALLY people can play a ROGUE has is meant to be.
People QQ and only ask nerfs, instead to try to understand and counter the class.
It's sickening.
yup, every mmo, this happens. ppl crying
I know, its in the nature of any mmo. The problem is this "rogue rage" that hits any mmo.
Its mind blowing.
Thats why the rogue after a while get nerfed then nobody play anymore; besides some hardcore rogue lover that play the class anyway, even if gets facerolled from any smashing button class.
And everyone is happy again.
Next mmo.
That is WoW logic. in D&D TRs should not be outperforming any other class DPS wise. GWF should. And currently GWF is at the bottom of the list.
Then there is the opposite problem. TRs are so powerful right now that ppl are shelving their mains and rerolling TRs. I predict that in a week 90% of all players in PVP will be TRs and CWs, so imbalanced are they.
The outlook is not good. Cryptic cant figure out how to add camera zoom let alone balance classes.
No, in D&D 4e, the GWF is a DEFENDER and the TR is a STRIKER. Strikers do more damage than defenders pretty much always, even offensive oriented defenders like the GWF.
lol I'm lovin' this thread. I wish I had read this before my cleric got 2nd in points in pvp, with no deaths despite the SUPER OMG OP ROGUES all trying to kill him.
Clearly you just don't know what you are doing, and that is not the rogue's fault.
As for not needing a Cleric for dungeons.. I don't NEED a car to get to work, but you don't see me getting up four hours early and putting on my running shoes.
This comment is made even funnier by the fact that the game does have camera zoom. Doh!
imo It is not a problem of charachter DD, but more a problem of general balance for all playable characters actually avaible in the game
Experimence from dungeon.... rogue have double or more overall dmg than another class. If any rogue use companion (CAT) i think it will be more.
What's funny is I couldn't have picked a better OP to make this argument look completely ridiculous.
Thank you, OP, for posting and defeating your own purpose.
I'm currently level 37 and it's getting harder and harder to solo PvE/kill in PvP.
Good wizzard can be pain in the *** ^^
If you use blink/roll/whatever you have to evade at the good time (when you see the emote of Dazing Strike), the fight will much easier. I'm just saying. Same for Lashing Blade obviously ^^
The Control Wizard isn't supposed to be an AoE damaging master, it's main function is crowd control. That's why it's called CONTROL.
The Great Weapon Fighter, has moderate skills in Damage dealing and AoE, but its ultimately still a Defending class. If anything secondary Tank.
Trickster Rogue is the only straight Damage Dealing class of the game. Everything it's supposed to do is for damage, it has little function outside of that. By calling for a nerf, for being insecure about your damage output in comparison, all you do is hurt the entire purpose for the rogue's existence. KILL ****.
^ This ........
Amen.
If everyone could understand that instead of noobish QQ in the forums.
1 - I know rogue is the ondly DD right now so I have no problems in it topping the charts in damage.
2 - Despite point 1 , the rogue is OP as shti right now, the threshold between the dmg it does and the other classes is just too high. PvE wise it's a concern but it's in pvp where it becomes unplayable. Rogue is too **** OP, to the point you don't even want to have another class in your group.
I don't care what you reply to this, it's ******* true.
Peace.
If YOU could understand that you deal at least 3 times more dmg in a pvp match than any class you would maybe realize you're the ****.
I don't care and heavily criticize QQ in forums about classes but only to a certain degree. The difference is too **** high to be acceptable.
madcuzbad?
only 3 main dps classes.. one was bound to be on top.. either re-roll or play something else.
the games main focus right now is PvE so if Rogues can dish out alot of dps then good.. mobs will die faster. i can care less about dps charts as long as the boss dies and players get loot.
Any rogue use CAT just now ?
Can't you see he is trolling?
Threads like these are bound to happen, just ignore them.
I'm not remotely concerned... Anyone else?
People need to realize that this game is still in BETA and has A LOT of development to go before it reaches the point of being ready for live. There are at least one more pure striker class coming soon in the Ranger and possibly a 3rd in the Warlock. Also, there will be at least one more healing class that has to be integrated before this game even becomes close to being ready for a live production. That brings the total class list up to 8 with multiple choices for the 4 main 4e D&D roles (Defender, Leader, Controller, Striker).
Honestly, I would like to see 10 classes before they consider the game live production ready. At least two classes per role need to be available for diversity sake.
Anyone complaining about PvP balance in this game right now needs to reconsider. First off, PvP in a D&D game is never really going to be balanced for all classes. D&D is a PvE designed game. PvP is primarily about DPS and Healing, with CC playing a niche role from time to time. You can't "tank" in PvP as threat mechanics are completely irrelevant...all "tanking" can be made to do is cause a dps penalty to hitting anyone else. Even in these scenarios it is still best to just deal with the dps loss and burn the real threats down and then kill the "tanks" off last.
When you are looking at a choice of a whole 5 classes available and only one of them a true striker, of course PvP is going to be heavily skewed in their favor. Same as with PvE when it's the only striker in the game. Arguing balance in a game where there are at least 3 key classes missing still is pointless. Once the rest of the core classes are fleshed out, then we can star focusing on balancing apples vs apples.
Sorry, i see you mention "live" a lot in your post. Can you tell me what difference between "open beta" and "live" will there be, except blaming all the game shortcomings on the fact that officially, this is beta.
When the game opens up tomorrow the masses are gonna flock in, play and judge it on the current version. If it's lacking they will quit and the vast majority of them won't be coming back.
The "this is beta" argument is completely flawed. When the open beta starts, you might as well call it live.
I have been at lots and i mean LOTS of mmo launches and honestly the game isn't probably that far away from live.
That said you won't have more classes at launch than what you already have plus the one to be unlocked I can bet you on that and if you search you will find info on it. Devs won't develop new classes or work on classes that haven't been tested in closed betas once you go into an open beta.
Also I don't care if it's D&D or whatever universe it is. You can't have such a lousy balance in a game . I understand it's beta but that isnt't an excuse and being savvy in this department I know you won't get mcuh different at launch than from what it is now.
And as it is now it's simply unplayable and not funny if you're not a rogue, period.
almost 100% accurate. +1.