Character Customization - MMORPG.com Exclusive

pwetrailturtle · December 2012

Every adventure begins at the character creator, and in Neverwinter, you'll have tons of options to customize your character - and MMORPG.com has the exclusive preview in our latest dev blog. Whether you're min/maxing your stats or crafting the perfect appearance, you'll be able to make your adventurer unique when Neverwinter launches.

Read more in this dev blog, exclusively at MMORPG.com!

zeoxz · December 2012

noticed human's traits been added.

what's Versatile Defense like ?

nvm found old topic using search.. duh ^^

guriphu · December 2012

I'm really hoping to see some sort of "unknown humanoid" option like STO's alien creator. The customization and flexibility of that - particularly being able to play a character that could be Romulan on Monday, Andorian on Tuesday, Human on Wednesday, and Borg on Thursday, was a lot of fun, and I'd be saddened if I can't reproduce that sort of experience in Neverwinter.

ghosty2a · December 2012

Oh Happy Day !!! At least now we know we will have some control over our stats at roll up. Am still disappointed that Half-Orcs won'tmake it in at game launch, so not sure what race and class to play to pass the time while waiting for Half-Orc release. But at least we know that we won't be forced into a set class role. This should also be Great Joyous news to the hyper immersive role players who really do like playing gimped characters. Mind you that's their way of playing this genre of game, and there are about as many ways to play DnD as there are players. So, any way, this makes me quite happy to hear, and I expect it is a relief to the vast majority of players as well. Bummer is though, waiting for Beta is gonna get even more excruciating. Maybe, just maybe, with the release of this info, Beta is just around the corner. Dare I hope for a Christmas present of Beta release?

devoteoftempus · December 2012

Can Cryptic elaborate on the "reroll" comments on stats in the article? Is it literally one can reroll their stats like in the old D&D game like Champions of Krynn where one would simply reroll for hours on end for those perfect scores? I would have thought that the stats would follow the standard point system that is in 4e, X points to be distributed as one saw fit. If one can simply reroll for hours on end for those perfect scores I cannot be a fan of which is exactly what will happen, point system provides a balance.

denkasaeba · December 2012

devoteoftempus wrote: »

Can Cryptic elaborate on the "reroll" comments on stats in the article? Is it literally one can reroll their stats like in the old D&D game like Champions of Krynn where one would simply reroll for hours on end for those perfect scores? I would have thought that the stats would follow the standard point system that is in 4e, X points to be distributed as one saw fit. If one can simply reroll for hours on end for those perfect scores I cannot be a fan of which is exactly what will happen, point system provides a balance.

Exactly my thought. A point buy system would have been much more linear imho.

viktormonsama · December 2012

Can't wait to play with the character creator! Always one of my favorite passtimes is creating characters in games that allows you to do so.

shredstallion33 · December 2012

I know we all complain about grinding levels in most mmo's, but I don't want the character customization to get out of hand to the point where everybody is going to have all 5 clases maxed out in a week while each one wields a +10 instant death weapon.

quorforged · December 2012

So after choosing Race and Class, your only build choices are a racial ability (likely to be obvious given class), and ability scores (even more likely to be obvious given class). Being able to take +2 CON instead of +2 INT on a Wizard is not an example of flexible build options; it's an example of a noob trap, if ability scores are anywhere near as important as they are in 4E PnP.

So far, the lack of ability to genuinely customize a character's build is my biggest concern for this game, but if the builds they provide are fun, it wouldn't be a deal-breaker.

shredstallion33 wrote: »

I know we all complain about grinding levels in most mmo's, but I don't want the character customization to get out of hand to the point where everybody is going to have all 5 clases maxed out in a week while each one wields a +10 instant death weapon.

Huh? What does this have to do with character build customization? That's a matter of XP/drop rates. That's not mentioned at all in the article.

iamtruthseeker · December 2012

However, this is how 4th edition does it: one fixed attribute and a choice of one other attribute from two stats.

What is likely will happen though is a stat array will be used instead of "rerolling" and maybe a point buy system for advanced options.

But unless we want people whining that sneaky Drow thief player Billy got a 20 dex and they got 18 because they rolled five times and he rolled 342 times and brags about it all the time and they "adjust" it at launch, don't think random generation is likely.

quorforged wrote: »

So after choosing Race and Class, your only build choices are a racial ability (likely to be obvious given class), and ability scores (even more likely to be obvious given class). Being able to take +2 CON instead of +2 INT on a Wizard is not an example of flexible build options; it's an example of a noob trap, if ability scores are anywhere near as important as they are in 4E PnP.

So far, the lack of ability to genuinely customize a character's build is my biggest concern for this game, but if the builds they provide are fun, it wouldn't be a deal-breaker.

Originally Posted by shredstallion33
I know we all complain about grinding levels in most mmo's, but I don't want the character customization to get out of hand to the point where everybody is going to have all 5 clases maxed out in a week while each one wields a +10 instant death weapon.

Huh? What does this have to do with character build customization? That's a matter of XP/drop rates. That's not mentioned at all in the article.

And yeah, stat point generation has nothing to do with level progression and is not mentioned in the article.

deathssickle · December 2012

deathssickle wrote: »

I would be happy with choices example

1. Standard Array- 16,14,13,12,11,10

2 Customizing scores- start with 8,10,10,10,10,10 and add 22 points as seen fit but it after it starts to take more points to raise your score eventually.

3. Rolling Scores*-(this is the way all DM's I know do it and is an adapted version)Ok so you take 4d6 and pick the best numbers of 3 of the dice add them together and get on score you continue until you get a set of scores to allocate to the stats you wish,(here is where things are adapted) Roll 3 sets instead of 1 and pick the set you want.(occasionally a DM will allow you to switch out 1 or 2 lower numbers from the set you chose with one of the other sets) You now allocate to the abilities of choice keeping in mind bonuses.

Like I've said before I like choices these choices allow you to play it safe or gamble for good stats and I would suggest if this is placed in, I suggest new DnD players to take the safe route.

If you do this where character is generated(Name,looks,etc) then you have stat generation. and say it has a timer of a 24 hours before you could make the same race class combo I think the rolling would work

you only get to roll the 3 stat sets no re-rolling after that but I would suggest at allowing one stat if say 8 or under to be switched out with one from another set.

If you dont like rolling take standard array as I said I would just like to have the options

Like I said this is just an example of how I might like it

clcmercy · December 2012

I would just like the ability to have a body style for -all- females, (Drow included) like this: http://mkgrr.deviantart.com/art/The-Guardian-129584341

ruikesan85 · December 2012

I'm not sure I'm on board with rolling stats for mmos. It works for table top but when you can just keep re-rolling till you get the coup-de-gras of stat combos it looses meaning.

singularitarian · December 2012

guriphu wrote: »

I'm really hoping to see some sort of "unknown humanoid" option like STO's alien creator. The customization and flexibility of that - particularly being able to play a character that could be Romulan on Monday, Andorian on Tuesday, Human on Wednesday, and Borg on Thursday, was a lot of fun, and I'd be saddened if I can't reproduce that sort of experience in Neverwinter.

I really don't think that would be appropriate to the setting, honestly.

ruikesan85 wrote: »

I'm not sure I'm on board with rolling stats for mmos. It works for table top but when you can just keep re-rolling till you get the coup-de-gras of stat combos it looses meaning.

Not to give them ideas, but rerolls could cost zen. :rolleyes:

denkasaeba · December 2012

singularitarian wrote: »

Not to give them ideas, but rerolls could cost zen. :rolleyes:

That would be pure pay to win... i hope we just won't have this kind of freedom with stats.. I just want point buy.

deathssickle · December 2012

ruikesan85 wrote: »

I'm not sure I'm on board with rolling stats for mmos. It works for table top but when you can just keep re-rolling till you get the coup-de-gras of stat combos it looses meaning.

That's why I stated that if you could only roll once per character and you can only make the same Class Race combo every 24 hours from when you last made one it would work, unless people are willing to possible spend months just roling stats on one character.I figure if someone does that after 3 or 4 days they would realize it is just better to go with what you have got or if they are bad use standard array

quorforged · December 2012

deathssickle wrote: »

Race
That's why I stated that if you could only roll once per character and you can only make the same Class Race combo every 24 hours from when you last made one it would work, unless people are willing to possible spend months just roling stats on one character.I figure if someone does that after 3 or 4 days they would realize it is just better to go with what you have got or if they are bad use standard array

Take 5 minutes to roll a character each day for months? Yes, people would absolutely do that. People grind in DDO for hours every three days for months for a chance for a net +1 in a single stat (getting a +4/+5 tome from a Raid).

If I were playing under you system, I'd probably roll one character, taking whatever I get, and play to learn the game, while I roll up another each day until I get stats that are so good that there's little to be gained from better. And then make that my "real" character going forward.

pilf3r · December 2012

quorforged wrote: »

Take 5 minutes to roll a character each day for months? Yes, people would absolutely do that. People grind in DDO for hours every three days for months for a chance for a net +1 in a single stat (getting a +4/+5 tome from a Raid).

If I were playing under you system, I'd probably roll one character, taking whatever I get, and play to learn the game, while I roll up another each day until I get stats that are so good that there's little to be gained from better. And then make that my "real" character going forward.

Aye just gives us a DDO like stats distribution system.

aandrethegiant · December 2012

Ability scores in 4e can be determined with one of three methods.

The first method uses a standard array of scores. Assign the following numbers to each ability score any way you like: 16, 14, 13, 12, 11, and 10.

The second method is very much like pre 4e, and my preferred method since it offers the most control over the output of your character. Start with the following scores: 8, 10, 10, 10, 10, and 10. You have 22 "points" to spend in order to increase the ability scores. Use the following rules to spend these points and improve your ability scores, then assign the score to the specific abilities.

Improving the numbers 8-12 costs one point. As such, increasing the "8" to a "12" would cost 4 points. Improving a "10" to a "13" would cost only 3: one point each for 10-to-11, 11-to-12, and 12-to-13.

Improving the numbers 13-15 costs two points. As such, increasing the "12" from before would cost another point to become a "13", but an additional two points to improve to a "14". Similarly, improving the "13" to a "16" would cost 6 points: two each for 13-to-14, 14-to-15, and 15-to-16.

Improving a "16" to a "17" costs another three points.

Improving a "17" to an "18" costs another four points. As a result, upgrading a "10" to an "18" would cost a total of 16 points = 3*1 + 3*2 + 3 + 4.

The third method uses randomly-generated numbers and provides the most versatile and volatile scores. For each ability score, roll 4 6-sided dice (4d6). Add the three highest numbers, ignore the lowest, and assign the sum as an ability score.

Then race +/- stat points must be figured in of course.

In this particular mmo, I believe they could very easily include 2 or possibly all three methods. Most DDOers I believe would feel most comfortable with the 2nd method, yet may very well choose another method for speed or just flavor.

Either way, there should be a custom route and an easy button route for those less able to decide.

m1ndfr1k · December 2012

why dont add a playable lizardman class???? in CO u can make some of this))))

deathssickle · December 2012

aandrethegiant wrote: »

Ability scores in 4e can be determined with one of three methods.

The first method uses a standard array of scores. Assign the following numbers to each ability score any way you like: 16, 14, 13, 12, 11, and 10.

The second method is very much like pre 4e, and my preferred method since it offers the most control over the output of your character. Start with the following scores: 8, 10, 10, 10, 10, and 10. You have 22 "points" to spend in order to increase the ability scores. Use the following rules to spend these points and improve your ability scores, then assign the score to the specific abilities.

Improving the numbers 8-12 costs one point. As such, increasing the "8" to a "12" would cost 4 points. Improving a "10" to a "13" would cost only 3: one point each for 10-to-11, 11-to-12, and 12-to-13.

Improving the numbers 13-15 costs two points. As such, increasing the "12" from before would cost another point to become a "13", but an additional two points to improve to a "14". Similarly, improving the "13" to a "16" would cost 6 points: two each for 13-to-14, 14-to-15, and 15-to-16.

Improving a "16" to a "17" costs another three points.

Improving a "17" to an "18" costs another four points. As a result, upgrading a "10" to an "18" would cost a total of 16 points = 3*1 + 3*2 + 3 + 4.

The third method uses randomly-generated numbers and provides the most versatile and volatile scores. For each ability score, roll 4 6-sided dice (4d6). Add the three highest numbers, ignore the lowest, and assign the sum as an ability score.

Then race +/- stat points must be figured in of course.

In this particular mmo, I believe they could very easily include 2 or possibly all three methods. Most DDOers I believe would feel most comfortable with the 2nd method, yet may very well choose another method for speed or just flavor.

Either way, there should be a custom route and an easy button route for those less able to decide.

Just like I was saying although I did offer the 3rd method with a couple modifications, and those modifications are just how I have played in 3.0 , 3.5, pathfinder, and 4.0. In PnP DnD I every DM I have had used the modified version of the 3rd method.

I thank you Andre for also mentioning this.

This is DnD and you no what the reason most people I know don't play 4th edition is because they think it is too much like an MMO. So if this game is based off 4th edition rules why not use the 4th edition rules and "options" of doing thing it gives you.

My friends are willing to try Neverwinter but as far as 4.0 rules go it is only because think 4th edition rules fit MMO's very well and thus the reason they will most likely play Neverwinter.

tagari84 · December 2012

Well, I think that if the player has the option to "roll" his abilities I don't think that we will be able to roll dice. I assume that the devs will want to keep a balance mostly for PvP or less likely for e-peen PvE reasons. I expect either to have standard values for a class (with the racial bonuses applied later) or to start with the usual 8, 10, 10, 10, 10 and 10 plus 22 points to spend. (in my opinion the red text is the most likely possibility from what I can read on the dev blog) So that everyone will be able to start on even ground.

iamtruthseeker · December 2012

Aandre's second method and my mentioning a point-by method are the same thing. Apologies if I was not clear that was the 4e method as well as stat arrays and random dice methods.

surf13 · December 2012

aandrethegiant wrote: »

Ability scores in 4e can be determined with one of three methods.

The first method uses a standard array of scores. Assign the following numbers to each ability score any way you like: 16, 14, 13, 12, 11, and 10.

Yes, in fact arrays can be achieved using point buy. They are basically point-buy sets known to be especially commonly used or useful.

aandrethegiant wrote: »

The second method is very much like pre 4e, and my preferred method since it offers the most control over the output of your character. Start with the following scores: 8, 10, 10, 10, 10, and 10. You have 22 "points" to spend in order to increase the ability scores. Use the following rules to spend these points and improve your ability scores, then assign the score to the specific abilities.
...snip...

Yep.

aandrethegiant wrote: »

The third method uses randomly-generated numbers and provides the most versatile and volatile scores. For each ability score, roll 4 6-sided dice (4d6). Add the three highest numbers, ignore the lowest, and assign the sum as an ability score.

While presented in books this option is not allowed in official tournaments or official games. It is essentially for unofficial games only.

If Neverwinter wants to follow 4e, at least at a token level, this method has no place in the game IMHO.

aandrethegiant wrote: »

In this particular mmo, I believe they could very easily include 2 or possibly all three methods. Most DDOers I believe would feel most comfortable with the 2nd method, yet may very well choose another method for speed or just flavor.

Agreed about 2...

aandrethegiant wrote: »

Either way, there should be a custom route and an easy button route for those less able to decide.

Agreed.

ruinedmirage · December 2012

Same. I'd probably end up with a couple stats under 6 and nothing above a 12, while everyone running around with at least 2 or 3 18+ scores.
The 4d6 system is just way too random and exploitable.

ruikesan85 · December 2012

m1ndfr1k wrote: »

why dont add a playable lizardman class???? in CO u can make some of this))))

Lizardman isn't a class, its a race. Dragonborn are about the closest you can get in 4e, but they'll likely come soon after the game is out since they are a standard race, even having their own book going into fine details. There are of course other races that would be closer to your traditional lizardmen but they weren't brought in as standard playable races.

*edit to add* Standard in the default setting, but since Neverwinter is Forgotten Realms they may not think of it as such.

deathssickle · December 2012

ruikesan85 wrote: »

Lizardman isn't a class, its a race. Dragonborn are about the closest you can get in 4e, but they'll likely come soon after the game is out since they are a standard race, even having their own book going into fine details. There are of course other races that would be closer to your traditional lizardmen but they weren't brought in as standard playable races.

*edit to add* Standard in the default setting, but since Neverwinter is Forgotten Realms they may not think of it as such.

The 4.0 Neverwinter Module contains Dragonborn NPC's so they are in Neverwinter and Forgotten Realms

aavarius · December 2012

Personally, I'm a fan of the 2d6+6 for each ability score method. The average is 12-ish, with a range of 8-18.

zebular · December 2012

We have three methods in our group. Usually, we do the roll 2 sets of 3d6 in order and choose the set you want. At times, we've also done the 4d6 take out the lowest roll, in order. We also sometimes do 3d6, place where you want.

In my campaign, I usually always have them to do the 2 sets of 3d6 in order, choose your set. Then after they choose their race and class, if they seem at all unhappy with their set, I'll let them decide if they want to swap any two stats, if they do, they get a random -1 to one of the other four stats (determined by 1d4).

surf13 · December 2012

aavarius wrote: »

Personally, I'm a fan of the 2d6+6 for each ability score method. The average is 12-ish, with a range of 8-18.

zebular wrote: »

We have three methods in our group. Usually, we do the roll 2 sets of 3d6 in order and choose the set you want. At times, we've also done the 4d6 take out the lowest roll, in order. We also sometimes do 3d6, place where you want.

In my campaign, I usually always have them to do the 2 sets of 3d6 in order, choose your set. Then after they choose their race and class, if they seem at all unhappy with their set, I'll let them decide if they want to swap any two stats, if they do, they get a random -1 to one of the other four stats (determined by 1d4).

All dice-based methods are prone to abuse

iamtruthseeker · December 2012

surf13 wrote: »

All dice-based methods are prone to abuse

*Is caught beating dice*

You didn't hear what the dice said to me!

*Is being dragged off by the authorities* They were asking for it I tell you!

Character Customization - MMORPG.com Exclusive

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