What do you think of this afternoon Domination Board when you look at the 3 first pages of the top board?
Here is the % of top characters:
TR 52%, DC 13%, HR 13%, GWF 10%, CW 10%, GF 2%, SW 0%
Here is the ratio kills vs death:
TR 8.1 kills for 1 death
DC 2.2 kills for 1 death
HR 4.8 kills for 1 death
GWF 5.6 kills for 1 death
CW 2.5 kills for 1 death
SW 0 kills for 0 deaths
Are TR players (52%) better than the total of all other characters players (48%) of Neverwinter?
Are you serious, you still deny there is something wrong????
jarec, at this point my patience is wearing thin, and at a rapid rate, so quickly go over what you've INITIALLY claimed throughout these 12 pages of HAMSTER. I'm gonna borrow mehguy's writing style as it seems quite efficient.
you've claimed TRs were dazing you for 10 seconds straight, while you yourself can't do anything to them because of ITC
to this, TR players who specialized in scoundrel tactics have answered that it is highly unlikely a Master Infiltrator builds is doing that
you've claimed it is not impossible, and other TR bashers have also pitched in with their 'theoretical' method of dazing people perma
to this, we have explained WHY it is extremely unlikely for a MI/Sco to fight that way, and properly shared information that the LONG-CHAINED-DAZES in actual PvP are almost exclusively the result of fighting WK/Scos
you would STILL argue that the dazes are too much, and the combination of perma-daze and ITC makes it too difficult, and chained dazes are too extreme. You effectively IGNORED every explanation we've given you, acted as if objections did not exist at all, and simply rolled back to line#1 of your speech
under extreme frustration, I had no choice to request that you present the evidence behind your claims. I've explained already why MI/Scos generally find it more difficult to chain-daze people due to their lack of offensive encounters + melee-oriented nature. I've also explained why the WKs find it easier to chain-daze since they are ranged, and have two offensive encounters at their disposal. You claimed ITC-toting TRs still chain daze you, so I ask for proof
then, here it comes, the Leaderboard pic -- "so many TRs have high K/D - they're so OP"
I DON'T EVEN CARE IF THAT'S TRUE OR NOT. WTF HAPPENED TO OUR DEBATE ON TR DAZES?
...that is these past 12 pages of this thread in summary. We were discussing TR dazes. You said certain things happen to you all the time, where you, a CW, is a victim of Master Infiltrator Scoundrels. To make a point that your obeservations are wrong, I've adequately explained how Scoundrel combat tactics work, and how things don't happen the way you say it. You keep going down this line, so in frustration I've asked you to come up with vid proof of a MI that chain dazes you 10 seconds all the time and practically keeps you dazed perma.
...and to that, you respond by a god-knows-what-the-relevancy-is pic of some PvP chatter, and then you come up with leaderboard scores and say, Look! TRs are doing great! Is this not wrong?....
Where did our "daze discussion" go? Shame on you, I feel dazed now.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Oh, btw, TRs ALWAYS have had twice~thrice higher K/D ratio than other clases, even in mod3 and mod4.
It's simply based on how the class operates. Even in a losing, totally PWND match, a TR can simply be extremely careful and not engage at all, and that would finish it with 0 deaths. This is ALWAYS how TRs have operated and thus, even in the most darkest hour of TRs, the good players have ALWAYS had at least 30:1 Kills-to-deaths ratio. In my case, I've used about the most weakest damage build out there, the WK-permastealth in mod 4, and during those times I've still managed a 6:1 K/D ratio.
Are you gonna claim the TR was also OP in mod4?
Please, man, stop grasping at straws. It's sad to watch.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
jarec, at this point my patience is wearing thin, and at a rapid rate, so quickly go over what you've INITIALLY claimed throughout these 12 pages of HAMSTER. I'm gonna borrow mehguy's writing style as it seems quite efficient.
.......
I say that perma daze even over 10 seconds can be achieved and for me it’s a fact, not all the time but it happens.
I say that daze effects should be shorter and have a cooldown on player and if so I think it would be a good step forwards a better PVP balance.
Balance that is clearly showing 52% TR against 48% for all other characters in Neverwinter. And 8.1 kills for 1 death.
jarec, at this point my patience is wearing thin, and at a rapid rate, so quickly go over what you've INITIALLY claimed throughout these 12 pages of HAMSTER. I'm gonna borrow mehguy's writing style as it seems quite efficient.
.......
I say that perma daze even over 10 seconds can be achieved and for me it’s a fact, not all the time but it happens.
I say that daze effects should be shorter and have a cooldown on player and if so I think it would be a good step forwards a better PVP balance.
Balance that is clearly showing 52% TR against 48% for all other characters in Neverwinter. And 8.1 kills for 1 death.
we told you it's because you lack control resist or tenacity (or not using shield if you are a wizard). only 1 generalized build can daze for 10 seconds straight and it's not easy or impossible to pull off on a smart opponent. instant fails if there is a teammate to help them.
did you count how many were scoundrels? if not, then leaderboards mean nothing. for all we know, there could be ZERO scoundrels in the top ten. regardless, 80-90% of all rogues seem like sabs/exe anyways since they are far easier to win with.
Even a blind hen..
You have your moments Kweassa they are few and far between but never the less /bow....
the thread hasn't even been about dazes or scoundrels for a while
it's been about lashing blade + 1st strike when a scoundrel can't even 1-shot a 9k gs wizard (that has even a tiny bit of tenacity or 25k hp) even if they had perfect vorpal with that. then we get stuck with an encounter that we can't stealth for in 16-20 seconds and a feature that is useless until we exit combat.
or about how dazes that are tier 3/5 are somehow being used by other trees without sacrificing their capstones
we told you it's because you lack control resist or tenacity (or not using shield if you are a wizard). only 1 generalized build can daze for 10 seconds straight and it's not easy or impossible to pull off on a smart opponent. instant fails if there is a teammate to help them.
did you count how many were scoundrels? if not, then leaderboards mean nothing. for all we know, there could be ZERO scoundrels in the top ten. regardless, 80-90% of all rogues seem like sabs/exe anyways since they are far easier to win with.
the thread hasn't even been about dazes or scoundrels for a while
it's been about lashing blade + 1st strike when a scoundrel can't even 1-shot a 9k gs wizard (that has even a tiny bit of tenacity or 25k hp) even if they had perfect vorpal with that. then we get stuck with an encounter that we can't stealth for in 16-20 seconds and a feature that is useless until we exit combat.
or about how dazes that are tier 3/5 are somehow being used by other trees without sacrificing their capstones
I told you I'm 25% Tenacity and I have one of CW best CR.
I'm saying that TR daze is too long and gives to much advantage in a fight and also can be chain if you are Scoundrel to a point of winning a complete fight while the opponent is daze.
I told you I'm 25% Tenacity and I have one of CW best CR.
I'm saying that TR daze is too long and gives to much advantage in a fight and also can be chain if you are Scoundrel to a point of winning a complete fight while the opponent is daze.
if it's as high as you say it is, then you should definitely be capable of fighting back. mine is just 47% total and i only have trouble vs skullcapper deft-strike users. every other daze can be dodged easily (possibly concussive strikes too if you get lucky on the timing and it procs on your dodge).
I told you I'm 25% Tenacity and I have one of CW best CR.
I'm saying that TR daze is too long and gives to much advantage in a fight and also can be chain if you are Scoundrel to a point of winning a complete fight while the opponent is daze.
You just described what a CW is.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
if it's as high as you say it is, then you should definitely be capable of fighting back. mine is just 47% total and i only have trouble vs skullcapper deft-strike users. every other daze can be dodged easily (possibly concussive strikes too if you get lucky on the timing and it procs on your dodge).
Deftstrike builds are predominantly WKs as well. For a MI to use it its a very desperate and pitiful build.
WKs actually fare much better since they can use both deft and DS.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
I am done in argue
at this point TR become OP because Dev want it to be
for me PVP is dead in mod 5 if you are not TR because mod 5 is not season of dragon but season of Trikster Rouge DEV AND TR WHO STILL TRY TO DEFEND THIS THING SHAME ON YOU
Skullcracker is fine
Dazing Strike is fine
Shadow Strike is fine
Concussive Strikes feat is not implemented well though: 2,5s stun every 5s. Duration should be halved or given a 10s+ internal cd instead of 5. Maybe proc only on attacks from behind, not backstabs+crits. Now if you somehow screw up your daze "rotation", you can just cloud of steel away to fill in the gaps, even with low crit%.
Skullcracker is fine
Dazing Strike is fine
Shadow Strike is fine
Concussive Strikes feat is not implemented well though: 2,5s stun every 5s. Duration should be halved or given a 10s+ internal cd instead of 5. Maybe proc only on attacks from behind, not backstabs+crits. Now if you somehow screw up your daze "rotation", you can just cloud of steel away to fill in the gaps, even with low crit%.
10 sec is kinda too much. i am fine with 7-8 sec though since that's about what i manage on average in pvp since that thing is random
i'd rather it didn't proc only from behind since that's an annoying requirement while visible. also ruins the support we can get to approach easier so we can actually land a daze while visible since nobody is gonna let us run up to them (much less behind them).
10 sec is kinda too much. i am fine with 7-8 sec though since that's about what i manage on average in pvp since that thing is random
i'd rather it didn't proc only from behind since that's an annoying requirement while visible. also ruins the support we can get to approach easier so we can actually land a daze while visible since nobody is gonna let us run up to them (much less behind them).
Need a reduction in duration from 2.5 to 2.0, and ICD up from 5 to 6, which will change it from a theoretical 50% uptime to 33% - not that people are able to consciously keep it running anyway, since Scoundrels fight predominantly out of stealth, and the crit chance of all TRs while out of stealth have now plummeted since people use low-dex builds nowadays.
It will also make it slightly easier to fight back against stealthed attacks, since most PvP builds usually tote around average 25% CC resistance. This will reduce the 2.0 duration down to 1.6 seconds, which will allow ONE attempt with a fast power to be applied before the TR fades back into stealth.
OTOH, people who build for high-CC resist whether it is by consciousd decision, or simply a by-product of some other build, ALREADY recovers fast enough from CS to retaliate BEFORE the TR fades away. I've specifically tested this against BiS level HRs, and some of them DO retaliate with Disruptive Arrow even when a throw of CoS has caused Concucssive Strikes.
A total CC resist of around 40% will allow you to retaliate despite CS, and of course, deflection DOES effect daze duration.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
If we talk about Tr in general this is simply not the truth.
First of all we have all players that experiance that Tr is OP from nabs to the most geared in premades, second we have the KD ratios that tells us that something is clearly amiss then we have the leaderboards from both our server and the russian server also telling us that something is very very wrong with the balance.
Next we have set up where we match classes against eachother with simular gearscore 1-1 and 1-2 and then again the same with differnt gs.
Now here is where you simple cant deny the emperical facts that Tr comes out not only as the winner among this but stands in a state of close to godhood compared to the other classes.
No class can match Trs in even gs no class can even phantom of going out victorious against 2 Trs fighting 1-2.
But yet a Tr at 14k can easely win against many classes if not all with 21gs that is 7k gs higher whish is huge.
Same goes for a Tr in 1-2 where the Tr can beat alot of other combinations of classes and I dare to say is the only class capable of doing so on a regular basis.
This is all common knowledge and clearly enough evidence that the TR need to be toned down in PVP.
In fact the evidence that Tr are OP in PVP is so abundant clear that denying it .. well the kindest word i can come up with is redicules.
All empirical evidence. As I said. Quoting people's feelings, inferring stuff from the leaderboard, making statements of 'fact' with no evidence to back them up - all of it is empirical evidence. Which was my point.
Yea well then start to believe if you play melee Hr compare it with sw in pve and pvp and you start to comprehend the HUGE difference in pvp compared to pve.
Actually, not so much. A well-played Melee Stormwarden HR is just as powerful in solo PvE as an SW. I know - I have both. In fact I have every class except GF (and I used to have one of those). The weakness of SW in PvP is something that was obvious as soon as they were launched - no need to actually PvP. No CC break and slow casting times = bad PvP class. Simple. For similar reasons it's easy to see why some parts of TR would be OP in PvP and not in PvE (like piercing damage) but dazes? In PvE mobs just stand around when you daze them, maybe follow you around aimlessly. They don't dodge, don't have CC breaks, and only some have CC immunity. Are you saying that elite PvP players are no better than the PvE mobs they despise? In fact worse?
But i think we all are getting a bit tired of this YES:NO YES:NO discussions and maby its time to hand it over to the devs and do the best we can of the situation I dont think we will get much further with 100 more threads like this.
Amen to that. Allthough sadly I lack confidence that the eventual solution will be a good or fair one. History indicates otherwise.
The sad part is that pvp is dieing and even if there is no empirical data for it those that I talked to says its mosly because of the imbalance between Tr and other classes that they quit...
Best
PvP has been dying for at least 2 mods. You only need to look at the huge drop in names on the leaderboard when they reset it at Mod 4 launch. Many people, me included, left PvP when bullcrap Glyphs became a thing. Or they got tired of the broken matchmaking system. Or bored with the same two maps over and over again. New players got put off by being roflstomped by heavily-twinked alts while levelling. Older players got sick of PvP being dominated by cheats and exploiters.
Man - PvP is so badly broken right now the surprising thing is that there is anyone still playing it at all.
What do you think of this afternoon Domination Board when you look at the 3 first pages of the top board?
Here is the % of top characters:
TR 52%, DC 13%, HR 13%, GWF 10%, CW 10%, GF 2%, SW 0%
The only conclusion is that people in our server are less interested in pvp than people from the russian server, where all the first three pages are TRs.
Let's face it, in NWO pvp is only for TRs. Now Cryptic has to come up with something outside the mainstream pve that will be only for HRs. Maybe walking in forests and invoking pagan gods, gaining Glory and Triumph seals in the process. And then something that will be only for DCs. Visiting temples and churches maybe, and gaining Glory and triumph seals in the process.
I am done in argue
at this point TR become OP because Dev want it to be
for me PVP is dead in mod 5 if you are not TR because mod 5 is not season of dragon but season of Trikster Rouge DEV AND TR WHO STILL TRY TO DEFEND THIS THING SHAME ON YOU
Replace "TR" with "CW" and reflect on the last 3 mods.
I mean, really, you can't be this vapid.
Broken mechanics, broken class designs, lack of actual content, and over zealous, bronze-age moderation?
The only conclusion is that people in our server are less interested in pvp than people from the russian server, where all the first three pages are TRs.
Let's face it, in NWO pvp is only for TRs. Now Cryptic has to come up with something outside the mainstream pve that will be only for HRs. Maybe walking in forests and invoking pagan gods, gaining Glory and Triumph seals in the process. And then something that will be only for DCs. Visiting temples and churches maybe, and gaining Glory and triumph seals in the process.
I really don't get it!
How can a company make money by frustrating there customers? The only results will be there customers leaving to buy somewhere else.
Neverwinter team try to make some little adjustment up until balance is done and customers will be happy to play instead of being frustrating, so the money will flow and the game will survive. But react now it’s urgent!!!
Or are 50% of Neverwinter players TR? And that’s why you keep it that way.
Step 1(done): The 2 seconds stealth brake on players is a great change.
Step 2: Make some change to TR dazes abilities by cutting down there duration from 100% to 60% on player and we will be moving close to balance.
Step 3: Make some change to TR immunities by cutting down there duration from 100% to 75% on player and I think after that we will have balance.
Up to a certain point, they make money by inconveniencing their players. For instance, any quest that's based around running some distance from A to B will inconvenience players that have slow mounts more, nudging them to buy faster mounts -- which are most convenient to get as a Zen mount. If you look at game content, a lot of it is designed to push people into buying mounts. In-game services like stores, mail, salvage and banks are split up and located apart from each other. Some quests are even specifically designed as mount checks -- Well of Dragons has at least three quests that are basically moving around the map between checkpoints.
Other aspects of the game employ the same way of gently, or not-so-gently encouraging people to part with their money. Don't like wasting time mining black ice? Don't worry, you can buy a much better pick for Zen.
However, class balance in PvP is a different beast. Some people have postulated that they're employing the same line of thinking here: Deliberately imbalance the game in order to make people switch to the FotM class and invest some money in that in order to catch their toon up, or to compete better with other classes that are more powerful. I think it's likely down more to a lack of competence or resources in their balancing endeavors, though. Trying to milk players by deliberately imbalancing parts of the game seems at least as likely to make people not want to invest in their toons because their investment will feel wasteful anyway, and it's likely to make people quit when they get nerfed or when forced to face overpowered opposition.
So while making money off of people's frustration is possible, it's a very delicate balancing act, and I think they fail at that if that's what they want to do with their approach to PvP balancing.
Killing the fun is not part of a good strategy, then it's doom.
What immunities?
Impossible to Catch or make the cooldown longer from 100% to 125%
Oh - I see
I thought ITC had already been toned down in the changes from mod4 to mod5, I thought it no longer stopped all incoming damage and what have you. I would love to check - but since my WK's don't have, and never have had ITC I cannot.
Regarding removing 100% crit - if this happens then WK at least will need a major damage boost to their base at wills, since you will then basically be reducing them back to the MOD4 level. Or a major defence boost, since again most are not deflecting types. For example stacking deflection upon my WK SAB I get a max of 27% deflection - waste of time. Again Defence is pretty rubbish with no stats really helping out - so remove the damage from 100%crit and SO and what is left?
From my experience of PVP against similar GS players it seems balanced - and reality even
Against MI's this might not be the same though since MI have pretty much always been the better of the paragons paths - but upon my WK SAB at wills against players are not doing massive damage. Certainly nowhere near the rumoured GC amounts of 10K - against a good defence build I get basic actual damage as low as 500, up to about 2K against a poor defence build.
So again although I can see some points are being made that I feel are relevant - anything one shot killing for example imo is wrong. It is not all TR's doing such things - and just calling for reductions across the board really is not helping resolve the issues for anyone imo
Comments
I have to cover players name, sorry.
jarec, at this point my patience is wearing thin, and at a rapid rate, so quickly go over what you've INITIALLY claimed throughout these 12 pages of HAMSTER. I'm gonna borrow mehguy's writing style as it seems quite efficient.
you've claimed TRs were dazing you for 10 seconds straight, while you yourself can't do anything to them because of ITC
to this, TR players who specialized in scoundrel tactics have answered that it is highly unlikely a Master Infiltrator builds is doing thatyou've claimed it is not impossible, and other TR bashers have also pitched in with their 'theoretical' method of dazing people perma
to this, we have explained WHY it is extremely unlikely for a MI/Sco to fight that way, and properly shared information that the LONG-CHAINED-DAZES in actual PvP are almost exclusively the result of fighting WK/Scosyou would STILL argue that the dazes are too much, and the combination of perma-daze and ITC makes it too difficult, and chained dazes are too extreme. You effectively IGNORED every explanation we've given you, acted as if objections did not exist at all, and simply rolled back to line#1 of your speech
under extreme frustration, I had no choice to request that you present the evidence behind your claims. I've explained already why MI/Scos generally find it more difficult to chain-daze people due to their lack of offensive encounters + melee-oriented nature. I've also explained why the WKs find it easier to chain-daze since they are ranged, and have two offensive encounters at their disposal. You claimed ITC-toting TRs still chain daze you, so I ask for proofthen, here it comes, the Leaderboard pic -- "so many TRs have high K/D - they're so OP"
I DON'T EVEN CARE IF THAT'S TRUE OR NOT. WTF HAPPENED TO OUR DEBATE ON TR DAZES?...that is these past 12 pages of this thread in summary. We were discussing TR dazes. You said certain things happen to you all the time, where you, a CW, is a victim of Master Infiltrator Scoundrels. To make a point that your obeservations are wrong, I've adequately explained how Scoundrel combat tactics work, and how things don't happen the way you say it. You keep going down this line, so in frustration I've asked you to come up with vid proof of a MI that chain dazes you 10 seconds all the time and practically keeps you dazed perma.
...and to that, you respond by a god-knows-what-the-relevancy-is pic of some PvP chatter, and then you come up with leaderboard scores and say, Look! TRs are doing great! Is this not wrong?....
Where did our "daze discussion" go? Shame on you, I feel dazed now.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Kweassa, you should have popped ITC for this forum thread! LOL
It's simply based on how the class operates. Even in a losing, totally PWND match, a TR can simply be extremely careful and not engage at all, and that would finish it with 0 deaths. This is ALWAYS how TRs have operated and thus, even in the most darkest hour of TRs, the good players have ALWAYS had at least 30:1 Kills-to-deaths ratio. In my case, I've used about the most weakest damage build out there, the WK-permastealth in mod 4, and during those times I've still managed a 6:1 K/D ratio.
Are you gonna claim the TR was also OP in mod4?
Please, man, stop grasping at straws. It's sad to watch.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Great.
Your lack of logic needs to be nerfed, because now I'm chain-dazed by it. THIS IS TOO OP!!
:rolleyes:
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
You have your moments Kweassa they are few and far between but never the less /bow....
we told you it's because you lack control resist or tenacity (or not using shield if you are a wizard). only 1 generalized build can daze for 10 seconds straight and it's not easy or impossible to pull off on a smart opponent. instant fails if there is a teammate to help them.
did you count how many were scoundrels? if not, then leaderboards mean nothing. for all we know, there could be ZERO scoundrels in the top ten. regardless, 80-90% of all rogues seem like sabs/exe anyways since they are far easier to win with.
the thread hasn't even been about dazes or scoundrels for a while
it's been about lashing blade + 1st strike when a scoundrel can't even 1-shot a 9k gs wizard (that has even a tiny bit of tenacity or 25k hp) even if they had perfect vorpal with that. then we get stuck with an encounter that we can't stealth for in 16-20 seconds and a feature that is useless until we exit combat.
or about how dazes that are tier 3/5 are somehow being used by other trees without sacrificing their capstones
I told you I'm 25% Tenacity and I have one of CW best CR.
I'm saying that TR daze is too long and gives to much advantage in a fight and also can be chain if you are Scoundrel to a point of winning a complete fight while the opponent is daze.
if it's as high as you say it is, then you should definitely be capable of fighting back. mine is just 47% total and i only have trouble vs skullcapper deft-strike users. every other daze can be dodged easily (possibly concussive strikes too if you get lucky on the timing and it procs on your dodge).
You just described what a CW is.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Deftstrike builds are predominantly WKs as well. For a MI to use it its a very desperate and pitiful build.
WKs actually fare much better since they can use both deft and DS.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
at this point TR become OP because Dev want it to be
for me PVP is dead in mod 5 if you are not TR because mod 5 is not season of dragon but season of Trikster Rouge
DEV AND TR WHO STILL TRY TO DEFEND THIS THING SHAME ON YOU
Dazing Strike is fine
Shadow Strike is fine
Concussive Strikes feat is not implemented well though: 2,5s stun every 5s. Duration should be halved or given a 10s+ internal cd instead of 5. Maybe proc only on attacks from behind, not backstabs+crits. Now if you somehow screw up your daze "rotation", you can just cloud of steel away to fill in the gaps, even with low crit%.
10 sec is kinda too much. i am fine with 7-8 sec though since that's about what i manage on average in pvp since that thing is random
i'd rather it didn't proc only from behind since that's an annoying requirement while visible. also ruins the support we can get to approach easier so we can actually land a daze while visible since nobody is gonna let us run up to them (much less behind them).
Need a reduction in duration from 2.5 to 2.0, and ICD up from 5 to 6, which will change it from a theoretical 50% uptime to 33% - not that people are able to consciously keep it running anyway, since Scoundrels fight predominantly out of stealth, and the crit chance of all TRs while out of stealth have now plummeted since people use low-dex builds nowadays.
It will also make it slightly easier to fight back against stealthed attacks, since most PvP builds usually tote around average 25% CC resistance. This will reduce the 2.0 duration down to 1.6 seconds, which will allow ONE attempt with a fast power to be applied before the TR fades back into stealth.
OTOH, people who build for high-CC resist whether it is by consciousd decision, or simply a by-product of some other build, ALREADY recovers fast enough from CS to retaliate BEFORE the TR fades away. I've specifically tested this against BiS level HRs, and some of them DO retaliate with Disruptive Arrow even when a throw of CoS has caused Concucssive Strikes.
A total CC resist of around 40% will allow you to retaliate despite CS, and of course, deflection DOES effect daze duration.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Actually, not so much. A well-played Melee Stormwarden HR is just as powerful in solo PvE as an SW. I know - I have both. In fact I have every class except GF (and I used to have one of those). The weakness of SW in PvP is something that was obvious as soon as they were launched - no need to actually PvP. No CC break and slow casting times = bad PvP class. Simple. For similar reasons it's easy to see why some parts of TR would be OP in PvP and not in PvE (like piercing damage) but dazes? In PvE mobs just stand around when you daze them, maybe follow you around aimlessly. They don't dodge, don't have CC breaks, and only some have CC immunity. Are you saying that elite PvP players are no better than the PvE mobs they despise? In fact worse?
Amen to that. Allthough sadly I lack confidence that the eventual solution will be a good or fair one. History indicates otherwise.
PvP has been dying for at least 2 mods. You only need to look at the huge drop in names on the leaderboard when they reset it at Mod 4 launch. Many people, me included, left PvP when bullcrap Glyphs became a thing. Or they got tired of the broken matchmaking system. Or bored with the same two maps over and over again. New players got put off by being roflstomped by heavily-twinked alts while levelling. Older players got sick of PvP being dominated by cheats and exploiters.
Man - PvP is so badly broken right now the surprising thing is that there is anyone still playing it at all.
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
So join my crusade to implement dynamic GS-performance adjustment system into the PvP world!
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
The only conclusion is that people in our server are less interested in pvp than people from the russian server, where all the first three pages are TRs.
Let's face it, in NWO pvp is only for TRs. Now Cryptic has to come up with something outside the mainstream pve that will be only for HRs. Maybe walking in forests and invoking pagan gods, gaining Glory and Triumph seals in the process. And then something that will be only for DCs. Visiting temples and churches maybe, and gaining Glory and triumph seals in the process.
Replace "TR" with "CW" and reflect on the last 3 mods.
I mean, really, you can't be this vapid.
Go Cryptic!
PS - I quit.
I really don't get it!
How can a company make money by frustrating there customers? The only results will be there customers leaving to buy somewhere else.
Neverwinter team try to make some little adjustment up until balance is done and customers will be happy to play instead of being frustrating, so the money will flow and the game will survive. But react now it’s urgent!!!
Or are 50% of Neverwinter players TR? And that’s why you keep it that way.
Step 1(done): The 2 seconds stealth brake on players is a great change.
Step 2: Make some change to TR dazes abilities by cutting down there duration from 100% to 60% on player and we will be moving close to balance.
Step 3: Make some change to TR immunities by cutting down there duration from 100% to 75% on player and I think after that we will have balance.
What immunities?
Impossible to Catch or make the cooldown longer from 100% to 125%
Killing the fun is not part of a good strategy, then it's doom.
I think so, but also daze length as to be cut down 40%.
Oh - I see
I thought ITC had already been toned down in the changes from mod4 to mod5, I thought it no longer stopped all incoming damage and what have you. I would love to check - but since my WK's don't have, and never have had ITC I cannot.
Regarding removing 100% crit - if this happens then WK at least will need a major damage boost to their base at wills, since you will then basically be reducing them back to the MOD4 level. Or a major defence boost, since again most are not deflecting types. For example stacking deflection upon my WK SAB I get a max of 27% deflection - waste of time. Again Defence is pretty rubbish with no stats really helping out - so remove the damage from 100%crit and SO and what is left?
From my experience of PVP against similar GS players it seems balanced - and reality even
Against MI's this might not be the same though since MI have pretty much always been the better of the paragons paths - but upon my WK SAB at wills against players are not doing massive damage. Certainly nowhere near the rumoured GC amounts of 10K - against a good defence build I get basic actual damage as low as 500, up to about 2K against a poor defence build.
So again although I can see some points are being made that I feel are relevant - anything one shot killing for example imo is wrong. It is not all TR's doing such things - and just calling for reductions across the board really is not helping resolve the issues for anyone imo
Thanks for answering my question btw