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[MOD 6 guide] Lazalia's High Crit build for PvE GWF Destroyer

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  • lazaroth666lazaroth666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    fizbad wrote: »
    I know this is outside of the scope of this thread, but what do you think about the Instigator path?

    Instigator path seems to be focused in AoE DPS, using Mighty Leap + Not So Fast and Wicked Strike. I see an instigator being swordmaster, using WMS to buff Wicked Strike and dealing a ton of damage clearing trash which would be great except that he needs to take damage in order to get his damage buffs and that means suicide in the actual dungeons. Also, the best encounters are IBS+HD+DS and switching one of these for Mightly LEap or Not So Fast is giving up too much for my taste. Instigator should be more about group buffs/support, that would be a very interesting path for a GWF, but that's just my humble opinion about it.

    loloxypw wrote: »
    Hi, I am not from eu. And i dont agree with Mighty blade. I thing would be rational get Powerfull challenge and Student of the Sword. But i liked your "High crit" build.... pleases no yellow numbers in dmg) And one question... what a helmet ?)

    Since I've reach 100% crit chance, I've started to test Powerful Challenge + Studente of the Sword because that means 20% more damage, I don't longer need Vicious Advantage because going above 100% crit doesn't make any sense. However, I didn't post anything about it yet because I still need to test a bit more. I would suggest a build like this only after you have reach the max % crit chance, otherwise that extra crit chance granted by Vicious Advantage is much more important than a bit more of damage.

    The helm is Paladin's Blessed Helm, it comes inside the Paladin Booster Pack (3500 zen).
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  • loloxypwloloxypw Member Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Maybe... you`re right
    What about Mighty blade? Its doent work for IBS and masters strike so... useless.
  • cromejohnsencromejohnsen Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 207 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Which ion stone are u using right now? Because for your crit calculatioin some pages ago u listed BDIS but in the Guide u show a Radiance one. Quite irritating. Not that it matters at this point.
    Also with the elven ward set u can get over 1k crit from vambraces and greaves. which make it much better option than the pvp set.(suggest you could add that to the guide for starter gear---> blue gear is almost the same just no extra 500 crit from greaves)

    Question. is there any benefit in upgrading ur lvl 135 elven ward set to lvl 137? (pretty damm expensive though)
    Is it like the Black ice Set from mod 3 where u can enhance the gear with black ice to get like 10% more stats ?

    you might want to fix the weapon master important note . it actually works fine now with 6 stacks combined with OH giving 16%.

    ps. Did anyone test out wrathful determination? Might be a good to go dps boost for the stage beyond 100% crit uptime without pots.
    Last time i tried it (actually be4 last patch) this feat was clearly not working at all. At no rank or in no combination with other class features.
  • lazaroth666lazaroth666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Which ion stone are u using right now? Because for your crit calculatioin some pages ago u listed BDIS but in the Guide u show a Radiance one. Quite irritating. Not that it matters at this point.
    Also with the elven ward set u can get over 1k crit from vambraces and greaves. which make it much better option than the pvp set.(suggest you could add that to the guide for starter gear---> blue gear is almost the same just no extra 500 crit from greaves)

    Question. is there any benefit in upgrading ur lvl 135 elven ward set to lvl 137? (pretty damm expensive though)
    Is it like the Black ice Set from mod 3 where u can enhance the gear with black ice to get like 10% more stats ?

    you might want to fix the weapon master important note . it actually works fine now with 6 stacks combined with OH giving 16%.

    ps. Did anyone test out wrathful determination? Might be a good to go dps boost for the stage beyond 100% crit uptime without pots.
    Last time i tried it (actually be4 last patch) this feat was clearly not working at all. At no rank or in no combination with other class features.

    Hello, thank you for your post.

    Yes, there are some differences in my actual character compared to my character when I wrote the guide and I was expecting until I get my whole Lv 137 before updating it, which btw is funny because I just got my last piece today. Now, I'm able to do another update for the guide with a bit more of information regarding to feats and the fix for that class feature that now is working properly.

    There's not really much difference when you update your gear from Lv 135 to Lv 137. I mean you can do it if it is your goal to achieve it but in the end, if you want to play with lv 135 that's more than enough.

    Wrathful determination might be a good option after Lostmauth's set bonus is fixed because right now the best thing is 100% crit chance. After the fix, 90%-95% will be more than enough and we could remove WM for WD but that requires some testing first.

    I'll be updating the guide ASAP.
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  • fizbadfizbad Member Posts: 202 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Instigator path seems to be focused in AoE DPS, using Mighty Leap + Not So Fast and Wicked Strike. I see an instigator being swordmaster, using WMS to buff Wicked Strike and dealing a ton of damage clearing trash which would be great except that he needs to take damage in order to get his damage buffs and that means suicide in the actual dungeons. Also, the best encounters are IBS+HD+DS and switching one of these for Mightly LEap or Not So Fast is giving up too much for my taste. Instigator should be more about group buffs/support, that would be a very interesting path for a GWF, but that's just my humble opinion about it.
    Yeah, I thought there might be a way of combining Instigator with IV for some crowd control/AOE damage (e.g. Come and Get it into Not So Fast and Wicked Strike, with Battle Fury thrown on the Encounter bar for good measure). Although I guess Not So Fast alone is not going to give enough proc time of Trample the Fallen.
  • lazaroth666lazaroth666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    ----Update---



    Ok guys, finally I got my last piece of Lv. 137 gear which allowed me to do a few more tests for the build. I've updated a couple of things and I have very nice information for you.

    Mighty Blade: Your AoE damage is increased by 12.5%. If you want to know which powers are affected by this feat, just read the tooltip and look for the word: Burst, i.e: Avalanche of Steel, Mighty Leap, Not so Fast. It was great because AoS is one of the most important dailies for the GWF and that extra damage is noticeable specially when you are fully buffed but in the overal damage it doesn't make a lot of difference, so I decided to stop using it. Invest full points in Staying Power and the last 5 points: 1 for Flanking Maneuvers and 4 for Unfettered Strikes. Why this feat? Because the extra speed can help you to avoid red areas much more easily, that's specially useful against hard hitting enemies and yes it does makes a difference.

    Weapon Master Strike: This feat is finally working as intended, you can add 4 points now.

    Wraitful Determination: This class feature gives you 12.5% more damage in your Power and it is supposed to give you twice the amount when your determination is full. However, after a few tests, I only noticed the increase of 12.5% without the extra bonus with full determination which means that overal dmg boost is much lower than expected. Even after Lostmauth's set bonus gets fixed, I don't see this class feature viable.

    On a side note, I've managed to achieve above 100% Crit chance. I don't longer need the extra 5% granted by Vicious Advantage so I had to choose a couple of feats in the Sentinel Tree: Scale Agility (5% Deflection) and Powerful Challenge (15% more damage to marked enemies) but keeping Student of the Sword. This means a total of 20% damage instead of 10% damage. Going for Vicious Advantage and removing 5% crit chance (azures in offensive slots) then adding Power won't give me the same benefit. Remember, this is only after you have reached 100% crit chance, otherwise if you for go these feats skipping Vicious Advantage and losing 5% crit chance you will be doing less DPS overall. This is an advice only for BIS players.


    I kindly suggest you read the whole guide again since a few points were modified and some info was added.
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  • fr3akout3fr3akout3 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 72
    edited May 2015
    ----Update---



    Ok guys, finally I got my last piece of Lv. 137 gear which allowed me to do a few more tests for the build. I've updated a couple of things and I have very nice information for you.

    Mighty Blade: Your AoE damage is increased by 12.5%. If you want to know which powers are affected by this feat, just read the tooltip and look for the word: Burst, i.e: Avalanche of Steel, Mighty Leap, Not so Fast. It was great because AoS is one of the most important dailies for the GWF and that extra damage is noticeable specially when you are fully buffed but in the overal damage it doesn't make a lot of difference, so I decided to stop using it. Invest full points in Staying Power and the last 5 points: 1 for Flanking Maneuvers and 4 for Unfettered Strikes. Why this feat? Because the extra speed can help you to avoid red areas much more easily, that's specially useful against hard hitting enemies and yes it does makes a difference.

    Weapon Master Strike: This feat is finally working as intended, you can add 4 points now.

    Wraitful Determination: This class feature gives you 12.5% more damage in your Power and it is supposed to give you twice the amount when your determination is full. However, after a few tests, I only noticed the increase of 12.5% without the extra bonus with full determination which means that overal dmg boost is much lower than expected. Even after Lostmauth's set bonus gets fixed, I don't see this class feature viable.

    On a side note, I've managed to achieve above 100% Crit chance. I don't longer need the extra 5% granted by Vicious Advantage so I had to choose a couple of feats in the Sentinel Tree: Scale Agility (5% Deflection) and Powerful Challenge (15% more damage to marked enemies) but keeping Student of the Sword. This means a total of 20% damage instead of 10% damage. Going for Vicious Advantage and removing 5% crit chance (azures in offensive slots) then adding Power won't give me the same benefit. Remember, this is only after you have reached 100% crit chance, otherwise if you for go these feats skipping Vicious Advantage and losing 5% crit chance you will be doing less DPS overall. This is an advice only for BIS players.


    I kindly suggest you read the whole guide again since a few points were modified and some info was added.

    Excellent guide Lazalia

    1 Question, if you removed 5 points in vicious and you went for 10 points in the sentinel tree then where did you remove the other 5 points from? Mighty Blade and 1 in Unfettered Striker?

    What do you think of the passive in the offhand for Wrathful Determination 20% Run Speed?
  • nazghul22nazghul22 Member Posts: 407 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Mighty Blade: Your AoE damage is increased by 12.5%.
    Avalanche of Steel, Mighty Leap, Not so Fast

    Slam is not an AOE? Nor Wicked strike?
    ToD = ..........
    Tired of Dailies/Tyranny of Dailies/Timers of Doom/Tricked Or Duped/Tremendously Obnoxious Dailies/Try Otherwise, Devs
  • lazaroth666lazaroth666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    fr3akout3 wrote: »
    Excellent guide Lazalia

    1 Question, if you removed 5 points in vicious and you went for 10 points in the sentinel tree then where did you remove the other 5 points from? Mighty Blade and 1 in Unfettered Striker?

    What do you think of the passive in the offhand for Wrathful Determination 20% Run Speed?

    Thank you. Yes, bye bye to Mighty Blade!

    That passive sounds great the problem is the class feature itself, it's hard to switch Weapon Master or Destroyer for Wrathful Determination that isn't even WAI.

    nazghul22 wrote: »
    Slam is not an AOE? Nor Wicked strike?

    It boosts Wicked Strike but Slam isn't affected by this feat.
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  • loloxypwloloxypw Member Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Mighty Blade work for Wicked Strike, but despite this, WMS profitable in M6 (cuz upped by 50%).
  • lazaroth666lazaroth666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    loloxypw wrote: »
    Mighty Blade work for Wicked Strike, but despite this, WMS profitable in M6 (cuz upped by 50%).

    I went to the preview server and yes Mighty Blade works in Wicked Strike. Unfortunately, it doesn't boost WMS. Both deal dmg in cone, it should boost WMS too, I'll ask Panderus about this.
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  • goranpetgoranpet Member Posts: 12 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Hi Lazalia!
    Loving your build, just one quick question. I see that Elemental Elven Ward Sallet gives you HP, Power, Recovery(most) and Defence, and Elemental Alliance Assault Sallet gives you HP, Crit (most), Arm Pen and Defence. Isn't it better to use Elemental Alliance Assault Sallet despite it is lower IL? Of course, only if player isn't at 100% crit chance.
  • lazaroth666lazaroth666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    goranpet wrote: »
    Hi Lazalia!
    Loving your build, just one quick question. I see that Elemental Elven Ward Sallet gives you HP, Power, Recovery(most) and Defence, and Elemental Alliance Assault Sallet gives you HP, Crit (most), Arm Pen and Defence. Isn't it better to use Elemental Alliance Assault Sallet despite it is lower IL? Of course, only if player isn't at 100% crit chance.

    Hi, Thank you!

    The thing is that once you get everything upgraded, you will have too much ArPen and you will need to switch that armor to the Elven Ward. Then you will have to farm the dungeons again and that takes a lot of time... Your suggestion is great, I mean you can get a lot of ArPen using that gear but in the end when you are above the cap, it means double work.
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  • mattymforummattymforum Member Posts: 8 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Hey lazalia,
    I try to follow your build the best I can, not sure if you play the Xbox version of neverwinter but I'm wondering if you can help me with it.

    I just seem to be lacking in dps quite strongly!!
    I'm about 13k gc and single target or even aoe dps I struggle badly to be a viable class in pve!!
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,453 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Hey lazalia,
    I try to follow your build the best I can, not sure if you play the Xbox version of neverwinter but I'm wondering if you can help me with it.

    I just seem to be lacking in dps quite strongly!!
    I'm about 13k gc and single target or even aoe dps I struggle badly to be a viable class in pve!!

    You need to post some numbers such as crit, ArPen, power, .....
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • mattymforummattymforum Member Posts: 8 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    plasticbat wrote: »
    You need to post some numbers such as crit, ArPen, power, .....

    Sure man sorry was kinda hoping for a reply first.

    Stats are as follows-
    GS - 12746
    Power - 5307
    Crit - 3163
    Ap - 2026
    Recovery - 1839
    Defense - 1860
    Deflect - 982
    Life steal - 967
    Crit chance - 34.5% 90% severity
  • boltzmann42boltzmann42 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 46 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    goranpet wrote: »
    Hi Lazalia!
    Loving your build, just one quick question. I see that Elemental Elven Ward Sallet gives you HP, Power, Recovery(most) and Defence, and Elemental Alliance Assault Sallet gives you HP, Crit (most), Arm Pen and Defence. Isn't it better to use Elemental Alliance Assault Sallet despite it is lower IL? Of course, only if player isn't at 100% crit chance.

    The ward set gives you the more crit and the less Arm Pen but if you need more Arm Pen, because you're not fully maxed, you can equipe the adamantium rings of piercing. You'll then have more Arm Pen but still maximum crit.
    And switching to the adamantium rings of recovery afterward will take you less time and effort than farming again the set
    Monsieur Seekan, Guild leader - Légende Obscure
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  • goranpetgoranpet Member Posts: 12 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Hi, Thank you!

    The thing is that once you get everything upgraded, you will have too much ArPen and you will need to switch that armor to the Elven Ward. Then you will have to farm the dungeons again and that takes a lot of time... Your suggestion is great, I mean you can get a lot of ArPen using that gear but in the end when you are above the cap, it means double work.

    Hi Lazalia!
    Thank you for quick response. I know about ArPen, and unfortunately I have about 69% resistance ignored and can't get rid of :) But here I'm talking about Crit, because if you remove Elemental Alliance Assault Sallet and put on Elemental Elven Ward Sallet you will loose about 1200 crit (roughly 3% Crit Chance) and gain same amount of recovery (not important). I think 3% constant Crit chance is not little for non BiS characters.
  • goranpetgoranpet Member Posts: 12 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    The ward set gives you the more crit and the less Arm Pen but if you need more Arm Pen, because you're not fully maxed, you can equipe the adamantium rings of piercing. You'll then have more Arm Pen but still maximum crit.
    And switching to the adamantium rings of recovery afterward will take you less time and effort than farming again the set

    I think it's the opposite, if you put The Ward helmet (Elemental Elven Ward Sallet) and remove Elemental Alliance Assault Sallet, you are loosing 1200 Crit which is most important.
  • boltzmann42boltzmann42 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 46 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    goranpet wrote: »
    I think it's the opposite, if you put The Ward helmet (Elemental Elven Ward Sallet) and remove Elemental Alliance Assault Sallet, you are loosing 1200 Crit which is most important.

    Yup sorry, misread and thought you were comparing the Elven Assault and the Elven Ward, my bad. (why do they have such close names >< ? got me all confused).
    Monsieur Seekan, Guild leader - Légende Obscure
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  • munchkinkittymunchkinkitty Member Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    This is a really great guide, thanks for posting it. I was having a few issues with my GWF and this cleared up a lot.
    Brìgh gach cluiche gu dheireadh.
    Ó Treasigh GF
    Ó Murchadh GWF
    Ó Kermichil CW

    Ó Pádruig TR
    Ó Dànaidh HR

    Ó Fionnlagh DC
    Ó Amhlaidh SW
    Ó Naomhin OP

    BLACK LOTUS
  • lazaroth666lazaroth666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    This is a really great guide, thanks for posting it. I was having a few issues with my GWF and this cleared up a lot.

    Thank you for reading the guide. If you have any question, please do not hesitate to contact me.
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  • usaempireusaempire Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Hey Lazaroth, thank you for this awesome guide!

    Even after Lostmauth's set bonus gets fixed [...]

    How is it broken at the moment? The only thing I found in the patches is they reduced its triggering on some DoT skills.
  • lazaroth666lazaroth666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    usaempire wrote: »
    Hey Lazaroth, thank you for this awesome guide!



    How is it broken at the moment? The only thing I found in the patches is they reduced its triggering on some DoT skills.

    Thank you for passing by. Actually, the lostmauth's set bonus is getting benefit from crit and damage bonus which is completely wrong. We have already seen before the very same behavior with Deep Gash in Mod2 and when Kessell's spheres arrived to the server. It is just a matter of time before we see the bonus more in line along with the others artifact.
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  • thevaliantraxthevaliantrax Member Posts: 9 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    (TheTimeLord) What is your race for ur GWF? I never really fancied non-human characters, but is it worth it choosing a half orc?
  • reddevilbsreddevilbs Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 84 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Hi Lazalia,

    It's a very nice guide, I keep eye on it, same time as I keep eye on Lia's guide :) It's good to have you both, giving advices to fellow GWF, cuz It's too frustrating other classes to think about us as useless dead meat.

    Let me show you my point of view, comparing to present situation at the dungeons. Note: most of the time I play top tier dungeons with same party.
    I still using IV build/ with Lostmauth set ofc/, cuz my party members asked me so aaaand I like FLS /nostalgically may be .../. It helps the tank to avoid first and most heavy mob's attack, giving time of the controllers to spam their skills. Also most of the time FLS + Hidden daggers are enough to kill trash and fill my determination - have 5 points to Mighty Blade feat.
    Here are my offensive stats:

    b6zZGd0.jpgnniGsJL.jpg


    This is without any buffs, with one crit stat companion/ Air Archon resting atm to test his full benefits./

    So what I noticed when we did legit all 3 top dungeons, comparing my IV build vs SM build. Note: I used absolutely same SM build as you do, with same companions and buffs with same party members.
    All the time SM build wins Paingiver chart but ... :
    eCC - SM wins with 2,8mil - 5,1 mil
    eToS - SM wins with 4.1mil - 7.2mil
    eGWD - SM wins with 3mil - 6.5mil
    Note: Im the only GWF in the party


    This small difference is cuz my 2 AoE skills kills trash very fast, giving me more power boost from the feats. The gap btw Min and Max is related with the two CWs in the party, Storm Spell class feature - depends how often is activated.
    Same time with SM build, till I use all the shouts, encounters and at-will to buff SS, CW's are killed trash mobs already.

    So that's it :) Wish you happy hunting and will keep watching your thread with interest!
  • lazaroth666lazaroth666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    reddevilbs wrote: »
    -snip-

    Thank you very much for passing by and for sharing your experience. It is good to see that there are still humble BIS players like you.

    I use Avalanche of Steel in the same way as you use Frontline Surge. If you are playing with the same players they will know your landing point and your CWs can cast oppresive force. The mobs will be CC'd during the whole fight and this increases the speed of the whole run. Don't wait for the tank, go in front of the group. This will allow you to build stacks faster.

    Don't let the CWs do damage. :p
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  • lazaroth666lazaroth666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    10oqulj.jpg

    Hey guys, for those who have been interested in the videos that I'm uploading, this is one of the most requested: Last boss fight in Epic Cragmire Crypts against Traven Blackdagger. I've added a few tips in the description of the video, specially for GWF, enjoy.
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  • reddevilbsreddevilbs Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 84 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Hi again.
    Please tell me which ACT parsing plugin you re using?
    May be this one
  • lazaroth666lazaroth666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    reddevilbs wrote: »
    Hi again.
    Please tell me which ACT parsing plugin you re using?
    May be this one

    AFAIK there are only 2 plugins. I'm using the latest one and it was updated like 1 year ago, I don't remember from where I downloaded it, lol.
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