Not sure, why are people whining about soul puppet? This was no surprise and if you ask me, they should give Warlocks the ability as a damnation to control the soul puppet (hell call it at will to). While I will admit, I do love the fact I can beat the **** out of a Rogue, GWF, and Guardian (with defensive gear), I do get my *** handed to me by CW due to the CC.
I' ll have a couple of builds up after, I hit end game and start getting in sets with bonuses.
SW just seems very rushed and poorly thought out. Like they wanted to make a pet class but didn't really make a pet class.
The Fury capstone feat is the whole reason the tree dose so much ****ing dmg with out its capstone is dose less dmg then a damnation warlock. The capstone in fury is nothing more the a huge FAT DoT proc the will deal 100% of the dmg used to proc it down in a DoT effect if you hit a warlocks cursed Target with 5k worth of necrotic dmg Creeping death Tick itself down in a DoT Until it dose 5k worth of dmg. With out that capstone the dmg fury Warlocks put out is halved and In pvp The game is just to fast paced to to be able to relie on it and utilize it to the fullest
Damnations damage mostly comes from the puppet. Which is unreliable at the best of time.
Yup you can't follow a converastion. SW has no way to deal with CC. Other classes do.
Unless of course you consider running away or praying by some fluke they target the puppet instead "dealing with CC".
Yup YOU can't follow a conversation. PVP is not just damage. It's stacking defensive options(hp/tenacity/feats/survivability mechanics). HR doesn't have a way to deal with cc, I wonder why they're considered a top tier pvp class(an unbalanced HEALING set)? Why Unstoppable was so unstoppable(I'll give you a hint: the dr increase, good heals(through feats/gear))? Why perma tr's were so annoying(perma stealth/ITC survivability builds)? DCs running healing/defensive builds?
I hear "learn to play" all the time, but it seems to me that it should be defined as "my class is balanced, except when others beat it, then THAT class is OP"...
Damnations damage mostly comes from the puppet. Which is unreliable at the best of time.
Wait, so a flat out permanent(while you're alive) 10% damage buff, IN ADDITION to your other buffs, is unreliable? :rolleyes:
I hear "learn to play" all the time, but it seems to me that it should be defined as "my class is balanced, except when others beat it, then THAT class is OP"...
Damnations damage mostly comes from the puppet. Which is unreliable at the best of time.
The only single problem damnation had was the pet AI locking onto target you mite has miss clicked But tbh targets will die so fast in a rotation of skills its not a problem the puppet itself is a body blocker and will soak up any attack you opponent mite aim at it you can even manipulate this by just stacking on your when you in a cluster **** at mid point. The Puppets AI is spot on when it comes to attacking targets and it will jump off ledges and every thing just to attack the target you want dead.the puppet will only wonder around when the SW who controls it dies. But now thats fixed on preview it will now despawn when the SW dies
Gang Busters PvP Guild Recruiting When Mod 6 goes live Pm Me for more Info If you have any Paladin question Message Me and i will get back to you ASAP
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
You're trolling or have never used a warlock. Which is it?
protip: the puppet likes to wander
Actually, YOURE trolling and have never used a Warlock. They attack targets in both pve and pvp just fine for me. And the damage bonus is constant while puppet's out.
Protip: last feat in damnation tree assures that the SOUL PUPPET IS ALWAYS OUT.
I hear "learn to play" all the time, but it seems to me that it should be defined as "my class is balanced, except when others beat it, then THAT class is OP"...
Actually, YOURE trolling and have never used a Warlock. They attack targets in both pve and pvp just fine for me. And the damage bonus is constant while puppet's out.
Protip: last feat in damnation tree assures that the SOUL PUPPET IS ALWAYS OUT.
Yeah you're probably trolling. You cant control what the puppet hits unless you are the one that initiates the fight.
Yup YOU can't follow a conversation. PVP is not just damage. It's stacking defensive options(hp/tenacity/feats/survivability mechanics). HR doesn't have a way to deal with cc, I wonder why they're considered a top tier pvp class(an unbalanced HEALING set)? Why Unstoppable was so unstoppable(I'll give you a hint: the dr increase, good heals(through feats/gear))? Why perma tr's were so annoying(perma stealth/ITC survivability builds)? DCs running healing/defensive builds?
Now imagine a HR that cant dodge and relied solely on damaging people to heal.
Yeah you're probably trolling. You cant control what the puppet hits unless you are the one that initiates the fight.
Now imagine a HR that cant dodge and relied solely on damaging people to heal.
It's actually quite sad how bad your trolls are failing at this point. You're really just failing at grasping the positives of BEING DEFENSIVE IN PVP. It really shows your lack of experience when you're in denial about why people make defensive builds in pvp.
And I also see you're trying to derail the topic by trying(and failing, I might add) to change the subject of the people who put you in your place. We didn't mention the life steal stacking as a survivability build. Granted, that makes them more suited for pve. But, we've been laying out in front of you the reasons why damnation has great pvp potential, but you continuously QQ about it. You basically come across this thread as someone who lost to damnation warlocks, and want to QQ for the nerfbat already because the "annoying soul puppet" doesn't work for YOU.
Now imagine how annoying an HR would be if it had a companion that can get in the enemies' way, and gives a damage/defense buff while it's out...
I hear "learn to play" all the time, but it seems to me that it should be defined as "my class is balanced, except when others beat it, then THAT class is OP"...
It's actually quite sad how bad your trolls are failing at this point. You're really just failing at grasping the positives of BEING DEFENSIVE IN PVP. It really shows your lack of experience when you're in denial about why people make defensive builds in pvp.
And I also see you're trying to derail the topic by trying(and failing, I might add) to change the subject of the people who put you in your place. We didn't mention the life steal stacking as a survivability build. Granted, that makes them more suited for pve. But, we've been laying out in front of you the reasons why damnation has great pvp potential, but you continuously QQ about it. You basically come across this thread as someone who lost to damnation warlocks, and want to QQ for the nerfbat already because the "annoying soul puppet" doesn't work for YOU.
Now imagine how annoying an HR would be if it had a companion that can get in the enemies' way, and gives a damage/defense buff while it's out...
Losing the argument and now want go back to the "who can nitpick the most" discussion. Your trolling attempts are getting pathetic. Other classes can dodge, break, block, or make themselves immune to CC. The SW has to take it on the chin. You clearly have no experience with the warlock and any further discussion is pointless. The fact you would use a fluke like them hitting the puppet just shows how desperate you are.
Losing the argument and now want go back to the "who can nitpick the most" discussion. Your trolling attempts are getting pathetic. Other classes can dodge, break, block, or make themselves immune to CC. The SW has to take it on the chin. You clearly have no experience with the warlock and any further discussion is pointless. The fact you would use a fluke like them hitting the puppet just shows how desperate you are.
Yet your holding on to a Tree that's capstone us utter garbage for PvP least the puppet can Block a few attack you cant do **** as a fury warlock not even relie on the puppet and most def will not do enough dmg to take down a CW in 5 seconds or less unless you kills stealing with killing flames
Gang Busters PvP Guild Recruiting When Mod 6 goes live Pm Me for more Info If you have any Paladin question Message Me and i will get back to you ASAP
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Yet your holding on to a Tree that's capstone us utter garbage for PvP least the puppet can Block a few attack you cant do **** as a fury warlock not even relie on the puppet and most def will not do enough dmg to take down a CW in 5 seconds or less unless you kills stealing with killing flames
Don't get me wrong. None of the trees are good for PVP. Fury is just the least ****ty.
The Soul Puppet is indeed pretty annoying in PVP, but really I do think it adds to the class for PvP. You will surely run in to people that get good with keeping the Puppet in their LoS from you if they are playing defensively.
I haven't maxed a SW yet but I can see either **** or Tempt being able to successfully be used in a defensive means. But I have started running into pretty decently geared SW, not frequently but there are some out there.
Between the Puppet, which any lock can have out and use for LoS means. Or Temptations insane looking on paper life steal capabilities it seems that tanky warlocks are a way to go. Yes I consider using a Soul Puppet wisely in PvP a form of tanking. It is taking hits for you = tanking. Vamp Embrace giving double the heal as temp hit points when used to consume a curse is also defensive.
Also if you go temp and take advantage of that crazy Stamina regen feat and get the reduction of stamina during Slip I can see SW being able to be control immune for nearly entire fights. It will come down to using Quick Shift bursts to be immune and take less damage. Treat it as if it was a dodge, but a dodge you want to use a fraction of a second sooner than you are used to. Make it so you get hit while Shadow Slipping or whatever SW sprint is called, and enjoy being Immune to Control and taking less damage.
I think SW's have potential to be really good once people start to really understand how everything will play out for real. Right now it is still all mostly speculation and theory crafting being put to use, which eventually will lead to a cookie cutter build that almost all SW's will use. So right now just enjoy that most SW's are all different and wacky in their own ways.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] PVPer rocking it Solo queue style since the dawn of Neverwinter
Losing the argument and now want go back to the "who can nitpick the most" discussion. Your trolling attempts are getting pathetic. Other classes can dodge, break, block, or make themselves immune to CC. The SW has to take it on the chin. You clearly have no experience with the warlock and any further discussion is pointless. The fact you would use a fluke like them hitting the puppet just shows how desperate you are.
You're failed trolls are getting quite sad and pathetic at this point. You've been losing this argument since you first posted, and now you're falling back on "waaah! multiple people disagree with me! They're wrong!" shows how desperate YOU are. I'll show you MORE flaws in your failed troll logic, as well as YOUR inexperience in pvp:
1: Sure the SW lacks cc. But doesn't the HR?
2: Shadow slip grants cc immunity. It functions EXACTLY like the GWF's sprint.
3: No one even focused primarily on the fact of the soul puppet getting in players' way. EVERYONE who's given you the business are more on the point of the buffs/debuffs involved in the tree, only talking about the puppet's annoyance as a secondary bonus.
4: offense AND Defense wins in pvp. You still haven't explained, if damage means so much in pvp, why even the most nooby pvp player knows that hp/tenacity stacking is what's called for in pvp.
I really don't think you've played any pvp, nor the Warlock at all. Really, give your failed trolls a rest. You're not fooling anyone at this point.
I hear "learn to play" all the time, but it seems to me that it should be defined as "my class is balanced, except when others beat it, then THAT class is OP"...
Don't get me wrong. None of the trees are good for PVP. Fury is just the least ****ty.
That's actually the exact opposite of true. Fury requires constant use of the capstone to out-DPS the other two trees by more than a small amount, and constant use of the capstone requires ONE specific rotation that is easily interfered with or interrupted in PvP. On the flipside it sacrifices all defence/utility for the enhanced DPS.
You will never kill targets in PvP fast enough with a Fury 'lock to compensate for the reduce defence/utility. Damnation or Temptation are the way to go with Damnation a shade in front IMO.
2: Shadow slip grants cc immunity. It functions EXACTLY like the GWF's sprint.
Good luck baiting CC while floating around doing nothing for a couple seconds. And if you run out of stamina, which you will, you have no defense against CC.
3: No one even focused primarily on the fact of the soul puppet getting in players' way. EVERYONE who's given you the business are more on the point of the buffs/debuffs involved in the tree, only talking about the puppet's annoyance as a secondary bonus.
The buff brought up in the pvp discussion is a 10% reduction in damage. That is it.
4: offense AND Defense wins in pvp. You still haven't explained, if damage means so much in pvp, why even the most nooby pvp player knows that hp/tenacity stacking is what's called for in pvp.
I never said to ignore defense. I said the defense from damnation is not enough to warrent its use.
You will never kill targets in PvP fast enough with a Fury 'lock to compensate for the reduce defence/utility. Damnation or Temptation are the way to go with Damnation a shade in front IMO.
None of the trees will allow you to tank through CC. As I said your best bet is to go all in on damage and try to pick people off at range.
None of the trees will allow you to tank through CC. As I said your best bet is to go all in on damage and try to pick people off at range.
I've been complaining about the Warlock's lack of CC defence since it launched on Preview, so you're preaching to the choir there. But the point I'm making is that you will never pick off targets at range fast enough with a Fury 'lock to compensate for the lack of the additional survivability options offered by the other two trees. Fury just doesn't do enough extra DPS in a fast-moving PvP environment. You will kill just about as fast with the other two trees but live longer.
I've been complaining about the Warlock's lack of CC defence since it launched on Preview, so you're preaching to the choir there. But the point I'm making is that you will never pick off targets at range fast enough with a Fury 'lock to compensate for the lack of the additional survivability options offered by the other two trees. Fury just doesn't do enough extra DPS in a fast-moving PvP environment. You will kill just about as fast with the other two trees but live longer.
I could see temptation with its assload of life steal being useful but I just can't see it for damnation.
I never said to ignore defense. I said the defense from damnation is not enough to warrent its use.
And has been stated already, the offense buff from fury isn't that much greater than what temptation and damnation can do as well. Now that's 3 people who've told you that.
Just cuz you failed at trolling does not mean that others are trolling you. Failing in a discussion DOES NOT mean that you're getting trolled. Get over yourself.
None of the trees will allow you to tank through CC. As I said your best bet is to go all in on damage and try to pick people off at range.
As has been stated before :rolleyes:, pvp is full of a balance of both tanky and dps builds. The best classes are those that can mix the 2.
I hear "learn to play" all the time, but it seems to me that it should be defined as "my class is balanced, except when others beat it, then THAT class is OP"...
And has been stated already, the offense buff from fury isn't that much greater than what temptation and damnation can do as well. Now that's 3 people who've told you that.
Nope. They've admitted it will outdps the other but say "its hard! ".
Nope. They've admitted it will outdps the other but say "its hard! ".
No, they stated that a more difficult rotation oriented build ends up being outshined by an easier to accomplish dps build through damnation. They've stated it's difficulty(not to mention your vulnerability in using it) ends up being outdps'ed by a more mobile playstyle.
Depends on the class and the persons playstyle. Some people go full damage. Others want to be more tanky. There are no "best" builds.
Then if there are no "best" builds, why are you QQing so much in the first place? Your statement right here not only exposes you for the bad troll you are, but also puts you in an endless loop where your own QQing negates your own QQing.
Troll done tuckered himself out, Awwww. I can add "defeated troll" to my list today, thanks for being such a horrible troll .
I hear "learn to play" all the time, but it seems to me that it should be defined as "my class is balanced, except when others beat it, then THAT class is OP"...
Couldn't resist this. I'm actually done now. For real this time.
Oh god... SW with better de/buffs than a HR and DC. Oh man... AHAHAHAHA
Nice try troll.
1)didn't even mention the DC in your post. Your trolling keeps on failing.
2)I'm pretty sure a tab mark debuff, shredding 20% of target's dr beats thorn ward and commanding shot combined(your continuous lack of experience noted ).
Bye failed troll.
I hear "learn to play" all the time, but it seems to me that it should be defined as "my class is balanced, except when others beat it, then THAT class is OP"...
Seriously man. Your failed trolls are getting pathetic. You've lost the argument from multiple points, and your continuous troll attempts expose you even more for the troll you are...
I hear "learn to play" all the time, but it seems to me that it should be defined as "my class is balanced, except when others beat it, then THAT class is OP"...
Sure lets just ignore the HRs stealth, better mobility, and both classes heals.
:rolleyes:
Does anyone else love it when trolls fail and go full damage control mode?
I really need more self control but the bait is just too good. I'm tired so this will be my last post. Totally for real this time. I mean it. Really I do.
Does anyone else love it when trolls fail and go full damage control mode?
I really need more self control but the bait is just too good.
Wow, really?! At this point you're trolling yourself?
Once again, a sign of your failed trolling:
1)You tried to squeeze in "Oh! Both these classes can heal more". Of course, theyre 2 CLASSES COMBINED! Not to mention that part was an HR vs SW discussion. And I quote:
Sure, lets just ignore the HRs stealth, better mobility, and both classes heals.
All I was considering was HR vs SW. Trying to sneak DC in(and once again failing at your trolling) exposed you further.
Failed at trolling again I see.
2)as has been discussed already, heals weren't incorporated in this discussion in the first place. Failed at trolling AGAIN.
I've noticed a pattern with your trolls here: every time you're put down, you try to switch gears to something not even on topic in your failed trolls, let alone the OP. You switch gears when you're caught more often than a bad trucker .
I hear "learn to play" all the time, but it seems to me that it should be defined as "my class is balanced, except when others beat it, then THAT class is OP"...
I could see temptation with its assload of life steal being useful but I just can't see it for damnation.
Damnation has additional mitigation and boosted lifesteal along with the other more offensive oriented buffs. The puppet is also useful for running interference if used right.
Comments
Yup YOU can't follow a conversation. PVP is not just damage. It's stacking defensive options(hp/tenacity/feats/survivability mechanics). HR doesn't have a way to deal with cc, I wonder why they're considered a top tier pvp class(an unbalanced HEALING set)? Why Unstoppable was so unstoppable(I'll give you a hint: the dr increase, good heals(through feats/gear))? Why perma tr's were so annoying(perma stealth/ITC survivability builds)? DCs running healing/defensive builds?
Wait, so a flat out permanent(while you're alive) 10% damage buff, IN ADDITION to your other buffs, is unreliable? :rolleyes:
protip: the puppet likes to wander
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Actually, YOURE trolling and have never used a Warlock. They attack targets in both pve and pvp just fine for me. And the damage bonus is constant while puppet's out.
Protip: last feat in damnation tree assures that the SOUL PUPPET IS ALWAYS OUT.
Now imagine a HR that cant dodge and relied solely on damaging people to heal.
It's actually quite sad how bad your trolls are failing at this point. You're really just failing at grasping the positives of BEING DEFENSIVE IN PVP. It really shows your lack of experience when you're in denial about why people make defensive builds in pvp.
And I also see you're trying to derail the topic by trying(and failing, I might add) to change the subject of the people who put you in your place. We didn't mention the life steal stacking as a survivability build. Granted, that makes them more suited for pve. But, we've been laying out in front of you the reasons why damnation has great pvp potential, but you continuously QQ about it. You basically come across this thread as someone who lost to damnation warlocks, and want to QQ for the nerfbat already because the "annoying soul puppet" doesn't work for YOU.
Now imagine how annoying an HR would be if it had a companion that can get in the enemies' way, and gives a damage/defense buff while it's out...
Yet your holding on to a Tree that's capstone us utter garbage for PvP least the puppet can Block a few attack you cant do **** as a fury warlock not even relie on the puppet and most def will not do enough dmg to take down a CW in 5 seconds or less unless you kills stealing with killing flames
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
The Soul Puppet is indeed pretty annoying in PVP, but really I do think it adds to the class for PvP. You will surely run in to people that get good with keeping the Puppet in their LoS from you if they are playing defensively.
I haven't maxed a SW yet but I can see either **** or Tempt being able to successfully be used in a defensive means. But I have started running into pretty decently geared SW, not frequently but there are some out there.
Between the Puppet, which any lock can have out and use for LoS means. Or Temptations insane looking on paper life steal capabilities it seems that tanky warlocks are a way to go. Yes I consider using a Soul Puppet wisely in PvP a form of tanking. It is taking hits for you = tanking. Vamp Embrace giving double the heal as temp hit points when used to consume a curse is also defensive.
Also if you go temp and take advantage of that crazy Stamina regen feat and get the reduction of stamina during Slip I can see SW being able to be control immune for nearly entire fights. It will come down to using Quick Shift bursts to be immune and take less damage. Treat it as if it was a dodge, but a dodge you want to use a fraction of a second sooner than you are used to. Make it so you get hit while Shadow Slipping or whatever SW sprint is called, and enjoy being Immune to Control and taking less damage.
I think SW's have potential to be really good once people start to really understand how everything will play out for real. Right now it is still all mostly speculation and theory crafting being put to use, which eventually will lead to a cookie cutter build that almost all SW's will use. So right now just enjoy that most SW's are all different and wacky in their own ways.
PVPer rocking it Solo queue style since the dawn of Neverwinter
You're failed trolls are getting quite sad and pathetic at this point. You've been losing this argument since you first posted, and now you're falling back on "waaah! multiple people disagree with me! They're wrong!" shows how desperate YOU are. I'll show you MORE flaws in your failed troll logic, as well as YOUR inexperience in pvp:
1: Sure the SW lacks cc. But doesn't the HR?
2: Shadow slip grants cc immunity. It functions EXACTLY like the GWF's sprint.
3: No one even focused primarily on the fact of the soul puppet getting in players' way. EVERYONE who's given you the business are more on the point of the buffs/debuffs involved in the tree, only talking about the puppet's annoyance as a secondary bonus.
4: offense AND Defense wins in pvp. You still haven't explained, if damage means so much in pvp, why even the most nooby pvp player knows that hp/tenacity stacking is what's called for in pvp.
I really don't think you've played any pvp, nor the Warlock at all. Really, give your failed trolls a rest. You're not fooling anyone at this point.
You will never kill targets in PvP fast enough with a Fury 'lock to compensate for the reduce defence/utility. Damnation or Temptation are the way to go with Damnation a shade in front IMO.
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
Good luck baiting CC while floating around doing nothing for a couple seconds. And if you run out of stamina, which you will, you have no defense against CC.
The buff brought up in the pvp discussion is a 10% reduction in damage. That is it.
I never said to ignore defense. I said the defense from damnation is not enough to warrent its use.
Now kindly go troll someone else.
None of the trees will allow you to tank through CC. As I said your best bet is to go all in on damage and try to pick people off at range.
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
SW has a couple of CCs if you want to go that way(Harrowstorm/Wraith's Shadow).
Something else that happens with DC/HR as well. And?
They can get a 10% damage reduction AND damage buff. And that's just the boosts from having the pet out.
And has been stated already, the offense buff from fury isn't that much greater than what temptation and damnation can do as well. Now that's 3 people who've told you that.
Just cuz you failed at trolling does not mean that others are trolling you. Failing in a discussion DOES NOT mean that you're getting trolled. Get over yourself.
As has been stated before :rolleyes:, pvp is full of a balance of both tanky and dps builds. The best classes are those that can mix the 2.
Sure lets just ignore the HRs stealth, better mobility, and both classes heals.
And the damage doesn't match fury and temptation is better if you want to stay defensive and support your team.
Nope. They've admitted it will outdps the other but say "its hard!
Depends on the class and the persons playstyle. Some people go full damage. Others want to be more tanky. There are no "best" builds.
I'm done feed the troll. Have fun.
And let's just ignore the SWs shadow slip, better debuffing/buffing, and tanky pet.
And, has been stated to you MULTIPLE times, damnation offers a bit of both. :rolleyes:
No, they stated that a more difficult rotation oriented build ends up being outshined by an easier to accomplish dps build through damnation. They've stated it's difficulty(not to mention your vulnerability in using it) ends up being outdps'ed by a more mobile playstyle.
Then if there are no "best" builds, why are you QQing so much in the first place? Your statement right here not only exposes you for the bad troll you are, but also puts you in an endless loop where your own QQing negates your own QQing.
Troll done tuckered himself out, Awwww. I can add "defeated troll" to my list today, thanks for being such a horrible troll
Couldn't resist this. I'm actually done now. For real this time.
Oh god... SW with better de/buffs than a HR and DC. Oh man... AHAHAHAHA
Nice try troll.
1)didn't even mention the DC in your post. Your trolling keeps on failing.
2)I'm pretty sure a tab mark debuff, shredding 20% of target's dr beats thorn ward and commanding shot combined(your continuous lack of experience noted
Bye failed troll.
Does anyone else love it when trolls fail and go full damage control mode?
I really need more self control but the bait is just too good. I'm tired so this will be my last post. Totally for real this time. I mean it. Really I do.
Wow, really?! At this point you're trolling yourself?
Once again, a sign of your failed trolling:
1)You tried to squeeze in "Oh! Both these classes can heal more". Of course, theyre 2 CLASSES COMBINED! Not to mention that part was an HR vs SW discussion. And I quote:
All I was considering was HR vs SW. Trying to sneak DC in(and once again failing at your trolling) exposed you further.
Failed at trolling again I see.
2)as has been discussed already, heals weren't incorporated in this discussion in the first place. Failed at trolling AGAIN.
I've noticed a pattern with your trolls here: every time you're put down, you try to switch gears to something not even on topic in your failed trolls, let alone the OP. You switch gears when you're caught more often than a bad trucker
Temptation is certainly a valid choice though.
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder