Well now we (CWs) only need some powers that can actually benefit from ARP..
Dont really understand the reasoning here.
CWs are squishy. We don't benefit from ARP and we have like no control after tenacity is introduced.
What exactly is our role in PvP?
Sadly, very little. Perhaps a ranged debuffer. As it stands, HRs have more damage output. We'll have no control, moderate DPS and decent debuffing skills. That's about it.
I've stayed firm on my beleive with these changes that I'll just really not pvp anymore. Just makes everything more complicated and the fun of fighting just worse by narrowing down the usefulness of different builds and entire classes.
0
degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I've stayed firm on my beleive with these changes that I'll just really not pvp anymore. Just makes everything more complicated and the fun of fighting just worse by narrowing down the usefulness of different builds and entire classes.
I'd say it mainly isolates the PVE-ers. I PVP all the time, so farming Glory and getting the new gear will be easy. For casual PVE-ers, I have a feeling their experience is only going to get worse...
I'd say it mainly isolates the PVE-ers. I PVP all the time, so farming Glory and getting the new gear will be easy. For casual PVE-ers, I have a feeling their experience is only going to get worse...
Well, it depends.
If the matchmaking will be working correctly and put together people with same amount of skill, it will be a huge bonus.
If they allow us to swap enchants freely back and forth from PvP to PvE gear, it would be amazing.
If they introduce new game types such as CTF and slayer (or arena) Then the tenacity combined with healing depression is going to be much needed but the current issues with PVP that make it no fun:
1) No matchmaking system
- elo rating system will hopefully take care of this.
2) No RANK system for public view
- elo system SHOULD be public
3) People have no downside to leaving a pvp match.
PVP leaver penalty will curb this ALOT however.... Leaver Penalty seems WAY too harsh... If players leave, they should just be tied to THAT games instance and unable to que until the game is over. This makes zero benefit to leaving a match, they still need to stay until its over.
4) NO easy way for premades to que against eachother.
THIS IS A MAJOR ISSUE GUYS! Premades are what drive competative pvp. The leaver penalty removed any easy way to match up.
What should be done is if a premade Ques, it doesnt throw them into "matchmaking" but just Opens up their group as a "Que Option" in the window for others to see and if they choose, Que against them as a premade... This lets premades "shop" for other premades and then removes premades from PUG stomping.
5) PvP is stale with the same two maps and same ONE gametype
Guys... Foundry PVP is a no brainer here. Let people make their own maps. Let them que up and play them with no glory gain (for the moment) and done. This would be a MAJOR MAJOR update to the game that would probably bring ALOT of people back to it (along with a true rank system).
Ontop of that, CTF and arena gametypes should be implemented...
ALL of those issues above are what is NEEDED and without those, while I welcome the tenacity changes and enjoy the pvp as a result of it. Its not what is "NEEDED". Yes it may help balance pvp out a bit, and it will definitely change the way people PVP, but it wasnt what was "missing" from the game, and without the things above, NO AMOUNT OF CLASS BALANCE, OR GEAR BALANCE will make people happy.
If they introduce new game types such as CTF and slayer (or arena) Then the tenacity combined with healing depression is going to be much needed but the current issues with PVP that make it no fun:
1) No matchmaking system
- elo rating system will hopefully take care of this.
2) No RANK system for public view
- elo system SHOULD be public
3) People have no downside to leaving a pvp match.
PVP leaver penalty will curb this ALOT however.... Leaver Penalty seems WAY too harsh... If players leave, they should just be tied to THAT games instance and unable to que until the game is over. This makes zero benefit to leaving a match, they still need to stay until its over.
4) NO easy way for premades to que against eachother.
THIS IS A MAJOR ISSUE GUYS! Premades are what drive competative pvp. The leaver penalty removed any easy way to match up.
What should be done is if a premade Ques, it doesnt throw them into "matchmaking" but just Opens up their group as a "Que Option" in the window for others to see and if they choose, Que against them as a premade... This lets premades "shop" for other premades and then removes premades from PUG stomping.
5) PvP is stale with the same two maps and same ONE gametype
Guys... Foundry PVP is a no brainer here. Let people make their own maps. Let them que up and play them with no glory gain (for the moment) and done. This would be a MAJOR MAJOR update to the game that would probably bring ALOT of people back to it (along with a true rank system).
Ontop of that, CTF and arena gametypes should be implemented...
ALL of those issues above are what is NEEDED and without those, while I welcome the tenacity changes and enjoy the pvp as a result of it. Its not what is "NEEDED". Yes it may help balance pvp out a bit, and it will definitely change the way people PVP, but it wasnt what was "missing" from the game, and without the things above, NO AMOUNT OF CLASS BALANCE, OR GEAR BALANCE will make people happy.
I tend to agree with what you are saying. However, I believe it is important to get the balance down first, while still keeping variety with all of the new PvP gears before looking at changing things up. I'm sure collecting new PvP gears alone would rejuvenate some spark in PvP based on the sheer variety of what's going to be available and the costs. I am sure they are aware and working on these other things too behind the scenes like game modes/maps.
Personally though, I think just a matchmaking system would help the most of all of these things. Even if classes aren't perfectly balanced, a good matchmaking system could help solve that too even, but I am glad they are spending a lot of time refining what they are working on to get it in good balanced condition.
Im fine with everything else. The elo system that gives proper matchmaking is what we really need more than anything. With that and more maps and even modes be great. With that, things can be adjusted from there. As thats what all of us wanted from the very start and what we needed.
But I really still do not like this tenacity and healing depression nonsense. Its just uuugh!
These upcoming changes to PvP will most likely be the crucial deciding factor, either to make or break the game. [since PvE is so lackluster to most Level 60 players]
As a result, these new aspects of PvP will definitely cause a drastic change in the playerbase for the better or the worst [which is probably the case looking at what's in Preview shard right now].
Now that it's not too late yet, please reconsider and test these things properly before introducing them to the Live shard to prevent it from ending up like the recent event which was a complete utter failure.
Now that just pours salt into the wound for me.. while poking it with a hot needle over and over... When I average about 200 glory per match.
I add that glory thing for gear into the catagory of dislikes along with tenacity and healing depression.
yep. this is not looking appealing to me at all. It seems like Im going to be kissing pvp in neverwinter good bye.
That was a major part of what I enjoyed in neverwinter too. Its a shame, ALL that was needed was matchmaking. And more things to add to buy with glory. Just expand on whats already there.
I tend to agree with what you are saying. However, I believe it is important to get the balance down first, while still keeping variety with all of the new PvP gears before looking at changing things up. I'm sure collecting new PvP gears alone would rejuvenate some spark in PvP based on the sheer variety of what's going to be available and the costs. I am sure they are aware and working on these other things too behind the scenes like game modes/maps.
Personally though, I think just a matchmaking system would help the most of all of these things. Even if classes aren't perfectly balanced, a good matchmaking system could help solve that too even, but I am glad they are spending a lot of time refining what they are working on to get it in good balanced condition.
balance/matchmaking>modes>maps>visible ranking
I agree with you, but its not like the game is WIDELY imbalanced... When you play on the PTR pvp is completely different from live. Pretty much impossible to 2v1 anyone no matter what class you are, so pvp as a whole is going to change in a big way and it seems ALOT more balanced than live.
I would say the balance issue is much LESS of an issue than the maps/modes right now... Players are just sick of not having those things in the game. New maps is a MUST and new gametypes is a MUST and Foundry pvp is a MUST if they want this game to live past the release of the two upcoming games (we all know what games)....
Yes I need more convulated statistics to keep up with. Stacking and building character stats,gear stats,enchant stats, artifact stats,feat stats, buff stats, companion bonuses, companion gear/enchant stats, isn't enuff. Throw in another stat that will mess up my entire balance in my build and make me purchase new respec tokens and zen.
I'm a TR that uses Skulkers in PVE to perm stealth bosses. They need to leave the armor I've bought and paid for alone. If they wanna make new armor for pvp only then fine. They should leave current armors alone at least.
There's thirty ideas in this thread better than introducing a new stat to mess everyone's build up.
Yes I need more convulated statistics to keep up with. Stacking and building character stats,gear stats,enchant stats, artifact stats,feat stats, buff stats, companion bonuses, companion gear/enchant stats, isn't enuff. Throw in another stat that will mess up my entire balance in my build and make me purchase new respec tokens and zen.
I'm a TR that uses Skulkers in PVE to perm stealth bosses. They need to leave the armor I've bought and paid for alone. If they wanna make new armor for pvp only then fine. They should leave current armors alone at least.
There's thirty ideas in this thread better than introducing a new stat to mess everyone's build up.
WEll your in luck and obviously havnt been paying attention to everything thats going on. The existing Skulkers is going to remain the same (purchased via GG coins) if you would like you have the OPTION to exchange that for the tenacity gear version that has slightly lower stats but adds tenacity. If you want to farm the tenacity version it only takes glory to do that so its not super hard to do either.
As a PvP TR, they are robbing me of the stats I NEEDED to even HOPE to do DAMAGE with the new tenacity.
And with the new set allocation Given for TR..
No armor pen + crit combo's
No HP bonus on any of the T2.5 Sets? Like what the hell? your forcing all TRs to TRY and get damage by rolling complete glass cannon to get some damage. I say try, because even if you role complete glass cannon, you still couldn't hit a viable DPS mark, while having no survivability
Tenacity was one thing, 33% nerf to impact shot damage... on top of tenacity patch, that's a bit insulting
These new TR ""PvP"" (Lol okay.) Sets? That's blatant gimping. Healing depression affecting DC's and making their class useless, Down right stupidity, And with CONTROL Wizards, not being able to CONTROL anymore, whats the point of pvping in this game at all? This makes me wonder if the Developers even pay attention to our Top Tier PvP community.
Because the top community never asked for tenacity. we maybe hinted at a SLIGHT regen nerf, and a MODERATE nerf to gwf damage. BUT most of all we wanted an ELO system, New Maps, and New game types.
Truly bothers me, when I Join a random pug match, and watch how uneducated, and unskilled these players are at the game. This bothers me because the developers are listening to the whines of these people to determine how we play the game.
Brutal Stalker was Perfection for a new T2.5 TR upgrade
the sets they've replaced them with... Im debating wether or not I want to keep my pve skulker set, or if I even want to continue playing the game based on the TERRIBLE hand thats been dealt to DC's and CW's alike
Cryptic, you have TRs able to fire off multiple encounters while staying in stealth due to a bug with Improved Cunning Sneak. You have HRs that can refresh all 6 of their encounters instantly due to a bug with Stormstep action.
If you want to balance the mechanics of your own game, why not fix prior pvp-breaking issues before developing an entirely new system?
As a PvP TR, they are robbing me of the stats I NEEDED to even HOPE to do DAMAGE with the new tenacity.
And with the new set allocation Given for TR..
No armor pen + crit combo's
No HP bonus on any of the T2.5 Sets? Like what the hell? your forcing all TRs to TRY and get damage by rolling complete glass cannon to get some damage. I say try, because even if you role complete glass cannon, you still couldn't hit a viable DPS mark, while having no survivability
Tenacity was one thing, 33% nerf to impact shot damage... on top of tenacity patch, that's a bit insulting
These new TR ""PvP"" (Lol okay.) Sets? That's blatant gimping. Healing depression affecting DC's and making their class useless, Down right stupidity, And with CONTROL Wizards, not being able to CONTROL anymore, whats the point of pvping in this game at all? This makes me wonder if the Developers even pay attention to our Top Tier PvP community.
Because the top community never asked for tenacity. we maybe hinted at a SLIGHT regen nerf, and a MODERATE nerf to gwf damage. BUT most of all we wanted an ELO system, New Maps, and New game types.
Truly bothers me, when I Join a random pug match, and watch how uneducated, and unskilled these players are at the game. This bothers me because the developers are listening to the whines of these people to determine how we play the game.
Brutal Stalker was Perfection for a new T2.5 TR upgrade
the sets they've replaced them with... Im debating wether or not I want to keep my pve skulker set, or if I even want to continue playing the game based on the TERRIBLE hand thats been dealt to DC's and CW's alike
And this just echos the core problems of what I was stating before about this seriously unneeded tenacity and healing depression <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. All we needed was a proper matchmaking system. This ELO system would have been fine by itself along with the class adjustments they have along with it for the GF.
Everything they adjust, they over do it. Every single time. they did it with GWF's they TRIED to do it with TR's with the stealth thing a while back. They did it with Clerics at the very start. CW's a few months back. They just over do and over nerf everything they adjust. When part of what they are introducing would be enough. At least with refinement thing, it didnt affect the core gameplay too much, just an aspect of it, even though it has some flaws.
Im seriously growing tired of this. Its frustrating as all hell, and its really putting me off to a drastic degree. Theres alot that I really complain about in this game, but this is the number 1 thing of all time I have to say is just a bad idea in the long and short run.
...despite all these doomsayers and naysayers, the test of time has proven that real PvPers simply breathe in, and adapt to the new meta.
Simply means back to the drawing board for new build ideas, for me. No biggie.
Considering the fact that some of the complaints about certain direct nerfs are actually exactly the reason why it needs a nerf, I'm more or less happy with the changes.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
I really think the pvp set bonus for CWs needs to be
Tier 1:
"Your control powers have a 25% control bonus"
Tier 2:
"Your control powers have a 30% control bonus and your Powers in the spell mastery slot deal 5% more damage"
Tier 2.5:
"Your control powers have a 35% control bonus and your Powers in the spell mastery slot deal 7.5% more damage"
This would help balance CWs out for PVP. Tenacity helps the survivability quite a bit, but without Control in pvp... they are sitting ducks.
Control wizards should be all about control. THis bonus would help counter Tenacity/CC resist for the class....
Maybe the bonuses need to be bumped down a tad to 20%/25%/30% but you get the picture...
Some people in this thread also need to calm down.
The difference between the current skulkers and the new T2 PVP skulkers is:
-228 HP
-127 Crit
-127 ARP
-0 Defense
-64 Lifesteal
So in total you really didnt lose too much. The only thing that sucks is the new T2.5 gear has no hp, no arp so its not really a great choice for pvp considering those are easily the two best stats....
So you end up missing out on the 30% stealth bonus over a 25% stealth bonus and the BIGGEST thing IMO is the 2.5% damage bonus you lose (7.5% to 5%)
Because from my rough math 2k Power = somewhere around 8-9% damage boost. so that 2.5% is somewhere in the neighborhood of 550 Power Equiv.
But all that to say, your really not losing too much as a TR going from current build to the new gear and you gain Tenacity...
I DO!!!!! Agree its bogus they dont have a T2.5 version of Skulkers though... I dont know why they are making the sets the way they are. I am REALLY hoping these are not "final" but the rough draft (like the past two PTR patches) and will be revised once more upon release...
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pers3phoneBanned Users, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I really think the pvp set bonus for CWs needs to be
Tier 1:
"Your control powers have a 25% control bonus"
Tier 2:
"Your control powers have a 30% control bonus and your Powers in the spell mastery slot deal 5% more damage"
Tier 2.5:
"Your control powers have a 35% control bonus and your Powers in the spell mastery slot deal 7.5% more damage"
This would help balance CWs out for PVP. Tenacity helps the survivability quite a bit, but without Control in pvp... they are sitting ducks.
Control wizards should be all about control. THis bonus would help counter Tenacity/CC resist for the class....
Maybe the bonuses need to be bumped down a tad to 20%/25%/30% but you get the picture...
Certainly better than what we have now on gear, cooldown reduction, while helpful, will still not mean much.
I'm giving this a thumbs up -- CWs need some sort of boost along these lines. They could also give a 2-piece bonus of +450 Control instead of Recovery or Power or whatever.
I think that would be too much...
I mean when you think about it, the Guardian Fighter gets an extra 25%/30% block meter - this is their class role...
Control Wizards' class role is CONTROL so why dont they have a 25%/30% boost to that? Seems to balance out nicely.
This would also add some nice PVE-viability as well since the stats are sub par for PVE it would make up some nice advantage...
Just to be clear, by "also" I meant they could mix and match, not necessarily do both at the same time -- for example, they could do a set with +450 Control Bonus for the 2-piece bonus and -30% cooldown for the Spell Mastery slot for the 4-piece bonus or a set with +450 Recovery and +30% control duration for the Spell Mastery slot. I'm not altogether clear on exactly how the Control Bonus scales, but I doubt 450 of it is game-breaking.
400 is like 4%. Its nothing...
Yeah I could see that being an alternative as well. But they would have to make more gear have control bonus in order to warrant that being the way to be able to control in pvp...
I think most CWs wouldnt mind losing some damage stats like power for control bonus stats. I could even just see the point in making the CW set have one of the stats Control Bonus...
I dont play a CW by the way so people shouldnt dismiss this as a "I want my class to be OP" thing... I have experience playing a CW but I do not have one.
CWs heavily rely on CC and ontop of that, not only is there CC resist but elven armor enchant as well that impacts CC. Since CWs dont have cool spells like "invisibility" or something that really helps their survivability, their only hope is with CC - which GWFs are immune to most of the time BTW...
So I want to STRONGLY encourage the DEVs to offer some time of either control bonus or a stat that would work like ARP with a "Control Resistance Ignored" or heck...Maybe factor that INTO armor pen (but then the stat would be by FAR the best stat)...
I am still in favor of just adding control bonus to the set bonuses instead of the reduction on the CD...
Control bonus also doesn't help with resists, which is the big problem right now. If anything on these sets it needs to actually make your CCs hit more often, not increase duration by a very miniscule amount. i.e. a 2 second cc with 5% bonus control will make it 2.1 seconds. Is that even noticeable? Not really when say a cleric can have the new built in cc resist, resist from tenacity, resist from halfing, and resist from the wisdom stat. As it stands right now vs a DC half of your controls will be resisted. And don't get me started on GWF who has the built in, tenacity, halfling, some from attributes, and then unstoppable on top of that...
Control bonus also doesn't help with resists, which is the big problem right now. If anything on these sets it needs to actually make your CCs hit more often, not increase duration by a very miniscule amount. i.e. a 2 second cc with 5% bonus control will make it 2.1 seconds. Is that even noticeable? Not really when say a cleric can have the new built in cc resist, resist from tenacity, resist from halfing, and resist from the wisdom stat. As it stands right now vs a DC half of your controls will be resisted. And don't get me started on GWF who has the built in, tenacity, halfling, some from attributes, and then unstoppable on top of that...
Control bonus also doesn't help with resists, which is the big problem right now. If anything on these sets it needs to actually make your CCs hit more often, not increase duration by a very miniscule amount. i.e. a 2 second cc with 5% bonus control will make it 2.1 seconds. Is that even noticeable? Not really when say a cleric can have the new built in cc resist, resist from tenacity, resist from halfing, and resist from the wisdom stat. As it stands right now vs a DC half of your controls will be resisted. And don't get me started on GWF who has the built in, tenacity, halfling, some from attributes, and then unstoppable on top of that...
And this is my issue exactly with the BS they've given CONTROL wizards. They can't control <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> anymore! And its all for the sake of the poor players that complain after 1 PvP match without understanding how the top level of this game plays
7K GS Players are walking around and complaining that they can't kill a DC
Enter DC nerf (Now a Top Tier DC couldn't Heal Wolverine -who also has his regen gimped-)
7K GS players are complaining that they die to fast
Enter Damage nerf AND Defense buff!? way to double dip (Now a Top Tier TR couldn't cut paper with a pair of scissors)
7K GS players (who average 19k to 22K HP!? Lol.) are complaining that they're getting CC'd to death because CC is too long!? PuG, I'm surprised the non-existent PvP falling damage dosent kill you first. (Now a Top Tier Control Wizard couldn't control a Chihuahua on a leash)
I mean MAYBE prones were a bit excessive, but the only thing I truly ever worried about was the 17K IBS that typically came after it
GWF needed a slight damage nerf.
Or just forget about that in General
Start making this game for the truly geared and educated people who play it
Give me ELO, Give me new maps, Give me New Game types, Or give me a new game.
How many more posts do we need criticizing these changes before our voices are heard?
Some aspects of PvP needed to be changed, but none in the manner being introduced by CC resist, healing depression, etc. (In fact, all that really needed to be done was reduce regen, reduce GWF DPS, introduce matchmaking, and fix some class bugs.)
Comments
Sadly, very little. Perhaps a ranged debuffer. As it stands, HRs have more damage output. We'll have no control, moderate DPS and decent debuffing skills. That's about it.
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
12- It's Great
5- It's Terrible
4- It's not what I asked for
15- It's Unnecessary
5- No Opinion
Total of 36 votes.
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A Comprehensive Review of Neverwinter <-- Read it!
I'd say it mainly isolates the PVE-ers. I PVP all the time, so farming Glory and getting the new gear will be easy. For casual PVE-ers, I have a feeling their experience is only going to get worse...
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
Well, it depends.
If the matchmaking will be working correctly and put together people with same amount of skill, it will be a huge bonus.
If they allow us to swap enchants freely back and forth from PvP to PvE gear, it would be amazing.
If they don't...
It will be a huge mess.
1) No matchmaking system
- elo rating system will hopefully take care of this.
2) No RANK system for public view
- elo system SHOULD be public
3) People have no downside to leaving a pvp match.
PVP leaver penalty will curb this ALOT however....
Leaver Penalty seems WAY too harsh... If players leave, they should just be tied to THAT games instance and unable to que until the game is over. This makes zero benefit to leaving a match, they still need to stay until its over.
4) NO easy way for premades to que against eachother.
THIS IS A MAJOR ISSUE GUYS! Premades are what drive competative pvp. The leaver penalty removed any easy way to match up.
What should be done is if a premade Ques, it doesnt throw them into "matchmaking" but just Opens up their group as a "Que Option" in the window for others to see and if they choose, Que against them as a premade... This lets premades "shop" for other premades and then removes premades from PUG stomping.
5) PvP is stale with the same two maps and same ONE gametype
Guys... Foundry PVP is a no brainer here. Let people make their own maps. Let them que up and play them with no glory gain (for the moment) and done. This would be a MAJOR MAJOR update to the game that would probably bring ALOT of people back to it (along with a true rank system).
Ontop of that, CTF and arena gametypes should be implemented...
ALL of those issues above are what is NEEDED and without those, while I welcome the tenacity changes and enjoy the pvp as a result of it. Its not what is "NEEDED". Yes it may help balance pvp out a bit, and it will definitely change the way people PVP, but it wasnt what was "missing" from the game, and without the things above, NO AMOUNT OF CLASS BALANCE, OR GEAR BALANCE will make people happy.
I tend to agree with what you are saying. However, I believe it is important to get the balance down first, while still keeping variety with all of the new PvP gears before looking at changing things up. I'm sure collecting new PvP gears alone would rejuvenate some spark in PvP based on the sheer variety of what's going to be available and the costs. I am sure they are aware and working on these other things too behind the scenes like game modes/maps.
Personally though, I think just a matchmaking system would help the most of all of these things. Even if classes aren't perfectly balanced, a good matchmaking system could help solve that too even, but I am glad they are spending a lot of time refining what they are working on to get it in good balanced condition.
balance/matchmaking>modes>maps>visible ranking
But I really still do not like this tenacity and healing depression nonsense. Its just uuugh!
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?605661-100-000-Glory-for-set-INSANE
These upcoming changes to PvP will most likely be the crucial deciding factor, either to make or break the game. [since PvE is so lackluster to most Level 60 players]
As a result, these new aspects of PvP will definitely cause a drastic change in the playerbase for the better or the worst [which is probably the case looking at what's in Preview shard right now].
Now that it's not too late yet, please reconsider and test these things properly before introducing them to the Live shard to prevent it from ending up like the recent event which was a complete utter failure.
I add that glory thing for gear into the catagory of dislikes along with tenacity and healing depression.
yep. this is not looking appealing to me at all. It seems like Im going to be kissing pvp in neverwinter good bye.
That was a major part of what I enjoyed in neverwinter too. Its a shame, ALL that was needed was matchmaking. And more things to add to buy with glory. Just expand on whats already there.
I agree with you, but its not like the game is WIDELY imbalanced... When you play on the PTR pvp is completely different from live. Pretty much impossible to 2v1 anyone no matter what class you are, so pvp as a whole is going to change in a big way and it seems ALOT more balanced than live.
I would say the balance issue is much LESS of an issue than the maps/modes right now... Players are just sick of not having those things in the game. New maps is a MUST and new gametypes is a MUST and Foundry pvp is a MUST if they want this game to live past the release of the two upcoming games (we all know what games)....
I'm a TR that uses Skulkers in PVE to perm stealth bosses. They need to leave the armor I've bought and paid for alone. If they wanna make new armor for pvp only then fine. They should leave current armors alone at least.
There's thirty ideas in this thread better than introducing a new stat to mess everyone's build up.
WEll your in luck and obviously havnt been paying attention to everything thats going on. The existing Skulkers is going to remain the same (purchased via GG coins) if you would like you have the OPTION to exchange that for the tenacity gear version that has slightly lower stats but adds tenacity. If you want to farm the tenacity version it only takes glory to do that so its not super hard to do either.
Your welcome
And with the new set allocation Given for TR..
No armor pen + crit combo's
No HP bonus on any of the T2.5 Sets? Like what the hell? your forcing all TRs to TRY and get damage by rolling complete glass cannon to get some damage. I say try, because even if you role complete glass cannon, you still couldn't hit a viable DPS mark, while having no survivability
Tenacity was one thing, 33% nerf to impact shot damage... on top of tenacity patch, that's a bit insulting
These new TR ""PvP"" (Lol okay.) Sets? That's blatant gimping. Healing depression affecting DC's and making their class useless, Down right stupidity, And with CONTROL Wizards, not being able to CONTROL anymore, whats the point of pvping in this game at all? This makes me wonder if the Developers even pay attention to our Top Tier PvP community.
Because the top community never asked for tenacity. we maybe hinted at a SLIGHT regen nerf, and a MODERATE nerf to gwf damage. BUT most of all we wanted an ELO system, New Maps, and New game types.
Truly bothers me, when I Join a random pug match, and watch how uneducated, and unskilled these players are at the game. This bothers me because the developers are listening to the whines of these people to determine how we play the game.
Brutal Stalker was Perfection for a new T2.5 TR upgrade
the sets they've replaced them with... Im debating wether or not I want to keep my pve skulker set, or if I even want to continue playing the game based on the TERRIBLE hand thats been dealt to DC's and CW's alike
If you want to balance the mechanics of your own game, why not fix prior pvp-breaking issues before developing an entirely new system?
And this just echos the core problems of what I was stating before about this seriously unneeded tenacity and healing depression <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. All we needed was a proper matchmaking system. This ELO system would have been fine by itself along with the class adjustments they have along with it for the GF.
Everything they adjust, they over do it. Every single time. they did it with GWF's they TRIED to do it with TR's with the stealth thing a while back. They did it with Clerics at the very start. CW's a few months back. They just over do and over nerf everything they adjust. When part of what they are introducing would be enough. At least with refinement thing, it didnt affect the core gameplay too much, just an aspect of it, even though it has some flaws.
Im seriously growing tired of this. Its frustrating as all hell, and its really putting me off to a drastic degree. Theres alot that I really complain about in this game, but this is the number 1 thing of all time I have to say is just a bad idea in the long and short run.
Simply means back to the drawing board for new build ideas, for me. No biggie.
Considering the fact that some of the complaints about certain direct nerfs are actually exactly the reason why it needs a nerf, I'm more or less happy with the changes.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Tier 1:
"Your control powers have a 25% control bonus"
Tier 2:
"Your control powers have a 30% control bonus and your Powers in the spell mastery slot deal 5% more damage"
Tier 2.5:
"Your control powers have a 35% control bonus and your Powers in the spell mastery slot deal 7.5% more damage"
This would help balance CWs out for PVP. Tenacity helps the survivability quite a bit, but without Control in pvp... they are sitting ducks.
Control wizards should be all about control. THis bonus would help counter Tenacity/CC resist for the class....
Maybe the bonuses need to be bumped down a tad to 20%/25%/30% but you get the picture...
The difference between the current skulkers and the new T2 PVP skulkers is:
-228 HP
-127 Crit
-127 ARP
-0 Defense
-64 Lifesteal
So in total you really didnt lose too much. The only thing that sucks is the new T2.5 gear has no hp, no arp so its not really a great choice for pvp considering those are easily the two best stats....
So you end up missing out on the 30% stealth bonus over a 25% stealth bonus and the BIGGEST thing IMO is the 2.5% damage bonus you lose (7.5% to 5%)
Because from my rough math 2k Power = somewhere around 8-9% damage boost. so that 2.5% is somewhere in the neighborhood of 550 Power Equiv.
But all that to say, your really not losing too much as a TR going from current build to the new gear and you gain Tenacity...
I DO!!!!! Agree its bogus they dont have a T2.5 version of Skulkers though... I dont know why they are making the sets the way they are. I am REALLY hoping these are not "final" but the rough draft (like the past two PTR patches) and will be revised once more upon release...
Certainly better than what we have now on gear, cooldown reduction, while helpful, will still not mean much.
https://www.youtube.com/user/ThePatomalo/videos
I think that would be too much...
I mean when you think about it, the Guardian Fighter gets an extra 25%/30% block meter - this is their class role...
Control Wizards' class role is CONTROL so why dont they have a 25%/30% boost to that? Seems to balance out nicely.
This would also add some nice PVE-viability as well since the stats are sub par for PVE it would make up some nice advantage...
400 is like 4%. Its nothing...
Yeah I could see that being an alternative as well. But they would have to make more gear have control bonus in order to warrant that being the way to be able to control in pvp...
I think most CWs wouldnt mind losing some damage stats like power for control bonus stats. I could even just see the point in making the CW set have one of the stats Control Bonus...
I dont play a CW by the way so people shouldnt dismiss this as a "I want my class to be OP" thing... I have experience playing a CW but I do not have one.
CWs heavily rely on CC and ontop of that, not only is there CC resist but elven armor enchant as well that impacts CC. Since CWs dont have cool spells like "invisibility" or something that really helps their survivability, their only hope is with CC - which GWFs are immune to most of the time BTW...
So I want to STRONGLY encourage the DEVs to offer some time of either control bonus or a stat that would work like ARP with a "Control Resistance Ignored" or heck...Maybe factor that INTO armor pen (but then the stat would be by FAR the best stat)...
I am still in favor of just adding control bonus to the set bonuses instead of the reduction on the CD...
fair point...
And this is my issue exactly with the BS they've given CONTROL wizards. They can't control <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> anymore! And its all for the sake of the poor players that complain after 1 PvP match without understanding how the top level of this game plays
7K GS Players are walking around and complaining that they can't kill a DC
Enter DC nerf (Now a Top Tier DC couldn't Heal Wolverine -who also has his regen gimped-)
7K GS players are complaining that they die to fast
Enter Damage nerf AND Defense buff!? way to double dip (Now a Top Tier TR couldn't cut paper with a pair of scissors)
7K GS players (who average 19k to 22K HP!? Lol.) are complaining that they're getting CC'd to death because CC is too long!? PuG, I'm surprised the non-existent PvP falling damage dosent kill you first. (Now a Top Tier Control Wizard couldn't control a Chihuahua on a leash)
I mean MAYBE prones were a bit excessive, but the only thing I truly ever worried about was the 17K IBS that typically came after it
GWF needed a slight damage nerf.
Or just forget about that in General
Start making this game for the truly geared and educated people who play it
Give me ELO, Give me new maps, Give me New Game types, Or give me a new game.
Some aspects of PvP needed to be changed, but none in the manner being introduced by CC resist, healing depression, etc. (In fact, all that really needed to be done was reduce regen, reduce GWF DPS, introduce matchmaking, and fix some class bugs.)