So you have 18K GS and barely beat someone with 15K and you say its nothing special?
You're hilarious.
Your ignorance knows no bonds. I never even had to correct you on the fact that 18k GS GF is around the same gear level as a 15k GWF. Others have beaten me too it. This clearly shows you know nothing about GF's.
Now the reason I don't party with GWF is simpe. Why as a GF would I want a GWF in my group. Even this excellent GWF I played with is still not as useful as I am.
Yes he beat me on Aoe Damage versus trash. he is the first GWF I have ever seen do more than 10% my damage against trash mobs. And previously the only GWF's that could get into that bracket where using animation cancel WMS. So Yea I was surprised that a GWF could pull that off without that trick. But I still beat his damage by the end of the dungeon. I do significantly more single target damage than a GWF. This makes me alot more useful in the Valindra fight where DPS is key. And that is the most important thing. We have CW's and HR's to clear mobs. Why bring a GWF when I can have either or both of those other classes. What does a GWF do that they can't? What can a GWF do that I can't?
I still think I am more useful against trash mobs since I can make threat and tank mobs. I wonder how many GWF's would trade 10-15% of there damage to do just that. I wonder how much damage sentinel GWF's lose from destroyer trying to do just that. But they can't.
Oh and by the way Here is the true power of the GF In that party with the GWF and on our 4th Valindra attempt I dropped my DPS Gear for tank gear and went full add control I kited the entire room full of adds until Valindra stopped summoning adds because we had max adds on the map. Only me and the CW survived the entire Fight. DC almost did. I was going down soon without the DC but we won.
Only a GF can do that.
Now understand this I am for buffing the GWF, I want a reason to group with all players. it is sad the devs have designed the fighters so poorly that there is no reason to ever have two figthters in a group. The other thing the devs did wrong is how they built defensive type GF's. This is why you don't See GF's do alot of damage. Because not many players who roll a GF want to play a damage dealer they want to be a tank, they want to be hard to kill and hold monster aggro. The problem is you can't do that unless you are also dealing damage. The reason why you get threads like "The GF is useless" is because tank geared GF's are useless. You have to be a damage dealer to be effective. And to do that a GF needs an Ioun stone companion stacked up to the brim with Armor pen and crit to make up for the DPS stats his set gear does not have.
Just Want to point out that everytime I put the challenge out there to the GWF community on what they can do that a DPS GF can't there is always silence. No one can ever come up with an answer to it. It's almost like every GWF somewhere has met one of us DPS GF's and chooses not to talk about it. Because they know they got nothing on us.
If your not going to rise to the challenge then tell me what you GWF's think your really lacking to compare to a GF?
Just Want to point out that everytime I put the challenge out there to the GWF community on what they can do that a DPS GF can't there is always silence. No one can ever come up with an answer to it. It's almost like every GWF somewhere has met one of us DPS GF's and chooses not to talk about it. Because they know they got nothing on us.
maybe because nobody gives a **** about your GF
P.S. I also main a GF, but if possible would want it to become a gwf
Just Want to point out that everytime I put the challenge out there to the GWF community on what they can do that a DPS GF can't there is always silence. No one can ever come up with an answer to it. It's almost like every GWF somewhere has met one of us DPS GF's and chooses not to talk about it. Because they know they got nothing on us.
If your not going to rise to the challenge then tell me what you GWF's think your really lacking to compare to a GF?
Man, I really need to run VT with you. With my GWF, I've been out-DPSd by a GF ONCE...Long ago, when I had a 12k gs and was Swordmaster. Since Mod 2 I've gone Iron Vanguard, got a higher gs (16k,) and now I top DPS charts 90% of the time; typically only being beaten by CWs when my aoe number cap holds me back and let's them leap ahead. Even then, that's not often. I haven't even seen a GF come anywhere close to top, and I've personally felt GFs to be useless in this game. I would love to see a DPS GF and see how we compare.
Also, I feel Deep Gash has become a huge thing, and personally would love the tooltip to change and not receive a huge nerf to the way it's functioning...At least, not without bringing CWs down a bit. They do far too much damage to be left alone while other classes receive nerfs.
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katbozejziemiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 856Arc User
Just Want to point out that everytime I put the challenge out there to the GWF community on what they can do that a DPS GF can't there is always silence. No one can ever come up with an answer to it. It's almost like every GWF somewhere has met one of us DPS GF's and chooses not to talk about it. Because they know they got nothing on us.
If your not going to rise to the challenge then tell me what you GWF's think your really lacking to compare to a GF?
Probably because everyone sees you're a joke and no one takes your rambling seriously.
Just Want to point out that everytime I put the challenge out there to the GWF community on what they can do that a DPS GF can't there is always silence. No one can ever come up with an answer to it. It's almost like every GWF somewhere has met one of us DPS GF's and chooses not to talk about it. Because they know they got nothing on us.
If your not going to rise to the challenge then tell me what you GWF's think your really lacking to compare to a GF?
rly most of us are past that age... but i tell you what, post your numbers from a dungeon like VT with an Advanced Combat Tracker screen and let everyone be amazed by what a gf can do, this way you maybe be able to revive the class and inspire others to play your style. Alot of good things came for GWF by doing that so it can also help the GF in the same way, even now alot of new builds are being posted for gwfs so everyone can choose one from them or use them to find new ways to play the class. I encourage you to be one of the GFs to make such guides and help the new and old GFs discover/rediscover the class.
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inthefade462Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Probably because everyone sees you're a joke and no one takes your rambling seriously.
this. /10char
Also i'd love to form a group with you, ianthewizard, and a few more of my favorite forum trolls and stream the dungeon on twitch. please let me know when you are available.
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zardoz007Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 2Arc User
edited January 2014
And we have devolved into naming and flaming once again as all threads I start to try to get a serious discussion about the state of fighters in this game.
It is very sad to see this fighter on fighter childish tactics. Both classes suffer greatly in game when it comes viability and to have a role in party dungeons yet when one class has it bad childish players blame the other class for taking there spotlight. Most of it lately has been GF against GWF so shame on you, but back at launch there was enough GWF against GF too so I guess it is just how the ed and flow of the game goes.
katbozejziemi shame on you, your post specifically has inflamed this thread. Sure players have ego's and challenge others but at least they are giving examples of there own personal play experiences and why they feel this way even if they are kinda hard headed like players such as Cyan and Lobo. At least each of these players decide to champion there respective classes and post only to buff other classes and not just post flame like you do.
Probably because everyone sees you're a joke and no one takes your rambling seriously.
Hmmm this is the 2nd attack against me that I have even needed to defend myself from as other players have beaten me to the punch. At that I would like to thank Rollingonit and Zardoz for their contribution.
First of all Yes I will admit that the majority of GF players are a hindrance to their groups. But then again I can say the same about GWF's. It is the situation of all fighters. The problem with GF though is that most of them play defense stacking builds and they think it is useful, because that is the nature of most MMO tanks. but it is not the least bit true in this game. I am for the buffing of GF tank builds, if GF defense builds were effective I would play one. But they are not so I go all damage.
As for grouping with others to prove my worth I will have to decline I am no where near as forthright about my displeasure withe the GWF in game as I am on the forums. I like alot the GWF players i know as players in game and I'm not going to bash their dreams verbally in game. I know how I make them feel when I group with them and they see what I can do and they feel like their class is worthless. I am on the forums to help buff fighters. Since I am getting enough hate from players who think the GF is useless and can't even imagine my claims of a useful DPS specced GF I will not reveal my in game name. You will just have to find a High DPS P lightning Wield 18k+GF and assume it is me. Both fighters need a buff so having one of each in a group is actually a popular setup, right now it is one or the other and only proven fighters of each class get that spot over another TR, CW or HR.
For two fighters in a group to be useful the differences between the fighters need to be established. Right now the Damage of both fighter classes are far too close if they both use pure DPS builds it makes no difference what fighter class you play as long as you play pure DPS you will get decent damage numbers but not be able to compare to a CW or HR of equal gear.
And that is my argument on why GF's > GWF's we do comparable damage plus have threat and tanking skills the GWF can only dream off. It makes the GWF a second rate fighter.
And now the GF got a substantial buff. Buffing their AOe Damage considerably, and block being more functional. Every buff on the page has made DPS GF's alot better except for the Iron Warrior buff. The game is stacked against doing Damage. If More GF's realized this and built balanced stats with 2k+ Crit and Armor pen. We would wipe out GWF's as the more common party fighter.
But it should not be that way. Even though I love the GF buffs for what it has done to my toon. GF's need to be viable as a defense stacking party defender like most players want the GF to be. This is the only real way to improve the GF situation. Because no matter what I say on the forums I cannot affect most GF players in game who do not bother to read this stuff. I am here to effect the Devs so they adjust the figthers.
I am considering posting screenshots of my victories damage ratings, but I am a little turned off by the idea. I witnessed a player a few months ago post a screen shot of a GF Out dpsing 3 CW's in his group and he was flamed ridiculed and laughed at for playing a bad CW. I just dont have much respect for players that flame with not even in game experience to share to back it up.
Hmmm this is the 2nd attack against me that I have even needed to defend myself from as other players have beaten me to the punch. At that I would like to thank Rollingonit and Zardoz for their contribution.
First of all Yes I will admit that the majority of GF players are a hindrance to their groups. But then again I can say the same about GWF's. It is the situation of all fighters. The problem with GF though is that most of them play defense stacking builds and they think it is useful, because that is the nature of most MMO tanks. but it is not the least bit true in this game. I am for the buffing of GF tank builds, if GF defense builds were effective I would play one. But they are not so I go all damage.
As for grouping with others to prove my worth I will have to decline I am no where near as forthright about my displeasure withe the GWF in game as I am on the forums. I like alot the GWF players i know as players in game and I'm not going to bash their dreams verbally in game. I know how I make them feel when I group with them and they see what I can do and they feel like their class is worthless. I am on the forums to help buff fighters. Since I am getting enough hate from players who think the GF is useless and can't even imagine my claims of a useful DPS specced GF I will not reveal my in game name. You will just have to find a High DPS P lightning Wield 18k+GF and assume it is me. Both fighters need a buff so having one of each in a group is actually a popular setup, right now it is one or the other and only proven fighters of each class get that spot over another TR, CW or HR.
For two fighters in a group to be useful the differences between the fighters need to be established. Right now the Damage of both fighter classes are far too close if they both use pure DPS builds it makes no difference what fighter class you play as long as you play pure DPS you will get decent damage numbers but not be able to compare to a CW or HR of equal gear.
And that is my argument on why GF's > GWF's we do comparable damage plus have threat and tanking skills the GWF can only dream off. It makes the GWF a second rate fighter.
And now the GF got a substantial buff. Buffing their AOe Damage considerably, and block being more functional. Every buff on the page has made DPS GF's alot better except for the Iron Warrior buff. The game is stacked against doing Damage. If More GF's realized this and built balanced stats with 2k+ Crit and Armor pen. We would wipe out GWF's as the more common party fighter.
But it should not be that way. Even though I love the GF buffs for what it has done to my toon. GF's need to be viable as a defense stacking party defender like most players want the GF to be. This is the only real way to improve the GF situation. Because no matter what I say on the forums I cannot affect most GF players in game who do not bother to read this stuff. I am here to effect the Devs so they adjust the figthers.
I am considering posting screenshots of my victories damage ratings, but I am a little turned off by the idea. I witnessed a player a few months ago post a screen shot of a GF Out dpsing 3 CW's in his group and he was flamed ridiculed and laughed at for playing a bad CW. I just dont have much respect for players that flame with not even in game experience to share to back it up.
Until you get it into your thick skull that a well played dps specced gwf would well tower over your optimal dps output, no seasoned player is going to take you seriously. And for that matter, sustainability. You've driveled in several threads being able to outdps TRs on single target fights, yet not taken up any of the challenges offered.
So yeah, any seasoned player will not take you seriously.
I am considering posting screenshots of my victories damage ratings, but I am a little turned off by the idea. I witnessed a player a few months ago post a screen shot of a GF Out dpsing 3 CW's in his group and he was flamed ridiculed and laughed at for playing a bad CW. I just dont have much respect for players that flame with not even in game experience to share to back it up.
I was the one that made a comment about that terrible screenshot.
1) CW was using Shard on tab, and Evo + SS for passive.
2) GF had pots and stone, rest of the party didnt even have any.
3) Highest damage done was GF doing 8mil before the last boss in MC.
Conclusion:
Just bring in newbies into your party so you look pretty and cute. /thread @Cyan If you want to see what end-game CW does in dps, just hit me up in-game with 14keys upfront (time is AD). Thanks!
Comments
Your ignorance knows no bonds. I never even had to correct you on the fact that 18k GS GF is around the same gear level as a 15k GWF. Others have beaten me too it. This clearly shows you know nothing about GF's.
Now the reason I don't party with GWF is simpe. Why as a GF would I want a GWF in my group. Even this excellent GWF I played with is still not as useful as I am.
Yes he beat me on Aoe Damage versus trash. he is the first GWF I have ever seen do more than 10% my damage against trash mobs. And previously the only GWF's that could get into that bracket where using animation cancel WMS. So Yea I was surprised that a GWF could pull that off without that trick. But I still beat his damage by the end of the dungeon. I do significantly more single target damage than a GWF. This makes me alot more useful in the Valindra fight where DPS is key. And that is the most important thing. We have CW's and HR's to clear mobs. Why bring a GWF when I can have either or both of those other classes. What does a GWF do that they can't? What can a GWF do that I can't?
I still think I am more useful against trash mobs since I can make threat and tank mobs. I wonder how many GWF's would trade 10-15% of there damage to do just that. I wonder how much damage sentinel GWF's lose from destroyer trying to do just that. But they can't.
Oh and by the way Here is the true power of the GF In that party with the GWF and on our 4th Valindra attempt I dropped my DPS Gear for tank gear and went full add control I kited the entire room full of adds until Valindra stopped summoning adds because we had max adds on the map. Only me and the CW survived the entire Fight. DC almost did. I was going down soon without the DC but we won.
Only a GF can do that.
Now understand this I am for buffing the GWF, I want a reason to group with all players. it is sad the devs have designed the fighters so poorly that there is no reason to ever have two figthters in a group. The other thing the devs did wrong is how they built defensive type GF's. This is why you don't See GF's do alot of damage. Because not many players who roll a GF want to play a damage dealer they want to be a tank, they want to be hard to kill and hold monster aggro. The problem is you can't do that unless you are also dealing damage. The reason why you get threads like "The GF is useless" is because tank geared GF's are useless. You have to be a damage dealer to be effective. And to do that a GF needs an Ioun stone companion stacked up to the brim with Armor pen and crit to make up for the DPS stats his set gear does not have.
If your not going to rise to the challenge then tell me what you GWF's think your really lacking to compare to a GF?
maybe because nobody gives a **** about your GF
P.S. I also main a GF, but if possible would want it to become a gwf
Man, I really need to run VT with you. With my GWF, I've been out-DPSd by a GF ONCE...Long ago, when I had a 12k gs and was Swordmaster. Since Mod 2 I've gone Iron Vanguard, got a higher gs (16k,) and now I top DPS charts 90% of the time; typically only being beaten by CWs when my aoe number cap holds me back and let's them leap ahead. Even then, that's not often. I haven't even seen a GF come anywhere close to top, and I've personally felt GFs to be useless in this game. I would love to see a DPS GF and see how we compare.
Also, I feel Deep Gash has become a huge thing, and personally would love the tooltip to change and not receive a huge nerf to the way it's functioning...At least, not without bringing CWs down a bit. They do far too much damage to be left alone while other classes receive nerfs.
rly most of us are past that age... but i tell you what, post your numbers from a dungeon like VT with an Advanced Combat Tracker screen and let everyone be amazed by what a gf can do, this way you maybe be able to revive the class and inspire others to play your style. Alot of good things came for GWF by doing that so it can also help the GF in the same way, even now alot of new builds are being posted for gwfs so everyone can choose one from them or use them to find new ways to play the class. I encourage you to be one of the GFs to make such guides and help the new and old GFs discover/rediscover the class.
this. /10char
Also i'd love to form a group with you, ianthewizard, and a few more of my favorite forum trolls and stream the dungeon on twitch. please let me know when you are available.
It is very sad to see this fighter on fighter childish tactics. Both classes suffer greatly in game when it comes viability and to have a role in party dungeons yet when one class has it bad childish players blame the other class for taking there spotlight. Most of it lately has been GF against GWF so shame on you, but back at launch there was enough GWF against GF too so I guess it is just how the ed and flow of the game goes.
katbozejziemi shame on you, your post specifically has inflamed this thread. Sure players have ego's and challenge others but at least they are giving examples of there own personal play experiences and why they feel this way even if they are kinda hard headed like players such as Cyan and Lobo. At least each of these players decide to champion there respective classes and post only to buff other classes and not just post flame like you do.
Hmmm this is the 2nd attack against me that I have even needed to defend myself from as other players have beaten me to the punch. At that I would like to thank Rollingonit and Zardoz for their contribution.
First of all Yes I will admit that the majority of GF players are a hindrance to their groups. But then again I can say the same about GWF's. It is the situation of all fighters. The problem with GF though is that most of them play defense stacking builds and they think it is useful, because that is the nature of most MMO tanks. but it is not the least bit true in this game. I am for the buffing of GF tank builds, if GF defense builds were effective I would play one. But they are not so I go all damage.
As for grouping with others to prove my worth I will have to decline I am no where near as forthright about my displeasure withe the GWF in game as I am on the forums. I like alot the GWF players i know as players in game and I'm not going to bash their dreams verbally in game. I know how I make them feel when I group with them and they see what I can do and they feel like their class is worthless. I am on the forums to help buff fighters. Since I am getting enough hate from players who think the GF is useless and can't even imagine my claims of a useful DPS specced GF I will not reveal my in game name. You will just have to find a High DPS P lightning Wield 18k+GF and assume it is me. Both fighters need a buff so having one of each in a group is actually a popular setup, right now it is one or the other and only proven fighters of each class get that spot over another TR, CW or HR.
For two fighters in a group to be useful the differences between the fighters need to be established. Right now the Damage of both fighter classes are far too close if they both use pure DPS builds it makes no difference what fighter class you play as long as you play pure DPS you will get decent damage numbers but not be able to compare to a CW or HR of equal gear.
And that is my argument on why GF's > GWF's we do comparable damage plus have threat and tanking skills the GWF can only dream off. It makes the GWF a second rate fighter.
And now the GF got a substantial buff. Buffing their AOe Damage considerably, and block being more functional. Every buff on the page has made DPS GF's alot better except for the Iron Warrior buff. The game is stacked against doing Damage. If More GF's realized this and built balanced stats with 2k+ Crit and Armor pen. We would wipe out GWF's as the more common party fighter.
But it should not be that way. Even though I love the GF buffs for what it has done to my toon. GF's need to be viable as a defense stacking party defender like most players want the GF to be. This is the only real way to improve the GF situation. Because no matter what I say on the forums I cannot affect most GF players in game who do not bother to read this stuff. I am here to effect the Devs so they adjust the figthers.
I am considering posting screenshots of my victories damage ratings, but I am a little turned off by the idea. I witnessed a player a few months ago post a screen shot of a GF Out dpsing 3 CW's in his group and he was flamed ridiculed and laughed at for playing a bad CW. I just dont have much respect for players that flame with not even in game experience to share to back it up.
Until you get it into your thick skull that a well played dps specced gwf would well tower over your optimal dps output, no seasoned player is going to take you seriously. And for that matter, sustainability. You've driveled in several threads being able to outdps TRs on single target fights, yet not taken up any of the challenges offered.
So yeah, any seasoned player will not take you seriously.
Built + Geared + well-played GF = Meh DPS
Trying to argue differently is like trying argue against reality. Sorry, you're living in a fantasy.
Is it possible that he believes these delusions and isn't trolling, just really really mentally unstable?
You've refused to post your in game name when people have called your bluff on your "challenge"
Please post a screenshot of your dmg being anywhere close to the top in a real party.
I was the one that made a comment about that terrible screenshot.
1) CW was using Shard on tab, and Evo + SS for passive.
2) GF had pots and stone, rest of the party didnt even have any.
3) Highest damage done was GF doing 8mil before the last boss in MC.
Conclusion:
Just bring in newbies into your party so you look pretty and cute. /thread
@Cyan If you want to see what end-game CW does in dps, just hit me up in-game with 14keys upfront (time is AD). Thanks!
PvP GWF - BizzyBedBug
PvE GF (salvaged)
PvE TR (salvaged)
GWF PvP/CW PvE @ http://www.twitch.tv/bizzyplusplus/