Of course these need to be improved:
Matching based on Gear Score
Matching based on the number of pre-mades vs randoms
Balancing class grouping
A surrender function
Failing to Port
I agree 100%.
This is a great list to work from.
The first three can be fixed/improved with the creation of a Find Party system. This would open up many options for similar playstyles. The last in the list just needs to be fixed.
A surrender option is the one I'm having trouble envisioning working properly, since I see the same cheaters hustling the system already in place taking advantage of it.
Perhaps the surrender system comes packaged with a soft penalty.. such as no rewards for 24 hours for losing (training mode). This would really screw afkers
So your wanting to punish people for "beating/working" a broken system that you put out because they found a way to get better gains?
HEEEEELL YES! Of course. I don't care about cheaters beating a game who think they are entitled to cheat because they "can"..... I care about those affected by cheaters, who are trying (and sometimes paying) to enjoy a game.
You can ride on both sides of the street, but you think twice when a semi is barreling down dont ya? Just because you CAN, doesn't mean you should. When they fix it, cheaters will find a new way to cheat... and a new excuse arises.
Sorry no sympathy for cheaters, try that on someone else!
My minor issue with this change is that it further punishes solo players who are unfortunate enough to meet a premade. Premades vs. randoms isn't ever fun for the randoms, and it feels much like getting bullied.
I'm all for "playing with friends", but there is no reason why people who play with friends should not be matched against people who also play with friends. This could even become a guild requirement.
Wow you guys are great, I love the ideas here.
We should absolutely punish any leavers in PvP because it ruins our fun when we have people on the opposing team refusing to play the way my team plays.
I group in a pre-made for PvP and we play a special mode of PvP.
The way we usually play is to deny people from capping any points (we don't cap any either) in PvP and drag it out as long as possible (this works especially well against a PUG), usually we get a few angry comments but mostly we have people leaving and that just spoils our fun. I don't get why people get upset at us or refuse to play the way we play because there's really nothing else for us to do but PvP now, so my team just queues for PvP and try and drag on a game as long as possible until a majority of the people leave, if they go AFK, we just chill around the opposing spawn camp and have a friendly chat amongst our selves, great way to relax after having some intense PvP action!
I can't wait until a leaver penalty is implemented, hope to see you all in PvP then!
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elawynMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
The way we usually play is to deny people from capping any points (we don't cap any either) in PvP and drag it out as long as possible (this works especially well against a PUG), usually we get a few angry comments but mostly we have people leaving and that just spoils our fun. I don't get why people get upset at us or refuse to play the way we play because there's really nothing else for us to do but PvP now, so my team just queues for PvP and try and drag on a game as long as possible until a majority of the people leave, if they go AFK, we just chill around the opposing spawn camp and have a friendly chat amongst our selves, great way to relax after having some intense PvP action!
I can't wait until a leaver penalty is implemented, hope to see you all in PvP then!
Easily fixed with a countdown timer. At zero, it's a draw and no-one gains a thing.
Wow you guys are great, I love the ideas here.
We should absolutely punish any leavers in PvP because it ruins our fun when we have people on the opposing team refusing to play the way my team plays.
I group in a pre-made for PvP and we play a special mode of PvP.
The way we usually play is to deny people from capping any points (we don't cap any either) in PvP and drag it out as long as possible (this works especially well against a PUG), usually we get a few angry comments but mostly we have people leaving and that just spoils our fun. I don't get why people get upset at us or refuse to play the way we play because there's really nothing else for us to do but PvP now, so my team just queues for PvP and try and drag on a game as long as possible until a majority of the people leave, if they go AFK, we just chill around the opposing spawn camp and have a friendly chat amongst our selves, great way to relax after having some intense PvP action!
I can't wait until a leaver penalty is implemented, hope to see you all in PvP then!
Well... no matter what system they implement, ****s will always try to be ****s, and sometimes succeed. Grats, I guess?
I think WoW experimented with a "Deserter" debuff. 30 Mins you can't re-queue in the pvp battlegrounds or arena if you quit in the middle of a match. They eventually lower it to 20 minutes due to "complaints".
Wow didn't experiment with a deserter debuff, they implemented one and have had one in place since they did so. It is extremely successful and effective.
Simply implementing such a thing goes a very long way toward protecting the innocent. Getting a deserter debuff by disconnecting sucks, but when you let yourself remember how bad the BG's where before it, you deal.
Beyond that, those that actually head into PvP to play matches start getting teams that fully intend to play out the match, rather than people with no intention of staying if the middle circle doesn't get won in the first thirty seconds. The leavers stop playing if they can't hang, but that's ok because they weren't innocent anyway.
As far as in-match abuse, small invisible baseline "participation" quotas wouldn't be all bad(such as "cannot have 1/10th the points of their average teammate). Eject players from the spawn area every ten seconds to prevent sitting up there and quitting. A massive, intensive sweep for bot accounts, and tools to eliminate and reduce their usefulness.
A vote-kick feature would likely be good as well. While things like this have potential for abuse, it's not nearly as high as a "can't be kicked AFKer sitting in the spawn without consequence" level of abuse.
A surrender option is the one I'm having trouble envisioning working properly, since I see the same cheaters hustling the system already in place taking advantage of it.
And that’s all you see clearly. But just take a moment and imagine in some alternate world someone entering in PVP only to find themselves hopelessly outmatched.
Your solution is “Get out here and let me beat on you”?
“Newp, I got’s 15 more minutes of pain for you, porkchop! C’mere!”
Or is it more along the line of don’t join PVP if you aren’t ready to be utterly humiliated with no hope of succor.
Or, and this is a revolutionary thought, how about we make PVP something people don’t want to leave. How about we make it something that doesn’t immediately suggest a winner and loser from the word go. Maybe if there is something of interest in the PVP game, the dirty, dirty, cheating leavers will stop leaving.
Yeah maybe that’s a lot to prognosticate, but I would be willing to bet that most of this problem would solve itself if PVP included anything to keep people’s attention besides a red and blue bar.
And since I do preach this, how do other games handle this? Who do you feel does a good job of handling this situation with cheaters leaving their games early?
So your wanting to punish people for "beating/working" a broken system that you put out because they found a way to get better gains? Sounds like when that Microsoft employee told people to "Deal with it" because the xbox one slapped on a ton of restrictions. What happened there? People decided to go to the other system. Before handing out restrictions how about taking a step back and looking at WHY they decided to do the things they did and how to fix it.
When they played this game they clicked this little agree button for an agreement that basicallhy stipulated that they must play the game as intended and cannot cheat.
So the answer is: ABSOLUTELY - punish them for exploiting the "broken system" they agreed not to exploit.
One thing Ive noticed on these forums - rampant justification of exploiting the system, with many using the flimsy argument that one should because one can. I hope this is investigated in full.
Countdown timer would be great as well, I don't PvP with my group to get "glory" just to have fun. We'd still be playing the way we play regardless if there are rewards or not because we find what we do fun. We like to just go all out brawl and wail on each other sometimes (more often than not), it's like playing Smash Brothers and having infinite lives and just playing for fun.
You guys are way too serious, why is my way of having fun not acceptable?
Yeah in the end... most WoW pvp matches are played by "pre-made" or pro groups (people who does e-sports for huge cash prizes). This pretty much leaves out the "casual" pvper or the newbies who are just dipping their toes into pvp. They raised the bar too high. Let's face ... make the rules too lax people abuse it, makes the rules too restrictive then people go somewhere else.
Another proposal is you would need a "pvp rating" system... it works like the ELO chess rating where high ranking (bracket) players are only matched against players of the same rating bracket (skill level). Lower ranking (casual) players can wallow around at the lower ranking matches and still have fun.
And that’s all you see clearly. But just take a moment and imagine in some alternate world someone entering in PVP only to find themselves hopelessly outmatched.
Your solution is “Get out here and let me beat on you”?
“Newp, I got’s 15 more minutes of pain for you, porkchop! C’mere!”
Or is it more along the line of don’t join PVP if you aren’t ready to be utterly humiliated with no hope of succor.
Or, and this is a revolutionary thought, how about we make PVP something people don’t want to leave. How about we make it something that doesn’t immediately suggest a winner and loser from the word go. Maybe if there is something of interest in the PVP game, the dirty, dirty, cheating leavers will stop leaving.
Yeah maybe that’s a lot to prognosticate, but I would be willing to bet that most of this problem would solve itself if PVP included anything to keep people’s attention besides a red and blue bar.
And since I do preach this, how do other games handle this? Who do you feel does a good job of handling this situation with cheaters leaving their games early?
I like a point system that is generated by a plethora of things rather than just DPS. The pikers and afkers get nothing - didnt score any points. The losers get rewarded based on points scored, and the winners will get more reward because they scored more points. How much more depends on how lopsided the win/loss was. If it was a close match, the winner only gets slightly more than the loser. If it was a cakewalk because the winners were facing afkers and pikers, then the winners get most or all of the reward, while the afkers and pikers get nothing.
Then make it so that you dont queue with people on your ignore list. I only have to experience the same afker or piker once.
My minor issue with this change is that it further punishes solo players who are unfortunate enough to meet a premade. Premades vs. randoms isn't ever fun for the randoms, and it feels much like getting bullied.
I'm all for "playing with friends", but there is no reason why people who play with friends should not be matched against people who also play with friends. This could even become a guild requirement.
Eh, I hear what you're saying, but this can be a valuable learning experience as well. You learn more from your defeats, or at least you should.
I picked up more tips on how to play well as a team by getting my hindquarters handed to me by a well tuned team.
So your wanting to punish people for "beating/working" a broken system that you put out because they found a way to get better gains?
Um, YES. Whether or not it's cheating is up for debate, but one aspect of this behavior is undeniable. The Quitter/Leaver is HAMSTER over 4 other players who have now been denied any real chance of competing due to the behavior of one "teammate". Probably the worse aspect of PvPing is being stuck with a player who seems to have no concept that they are part of a team.
You guys are way too serious, why is my way of having fun not acceptable?
Because the fun that you have as a premade is at the expense of the fun of the random players you bully.
As I said, there is nothing wrong with playing with friends, but you should be matched against people who also play with friends. That should still be fun for you.
Imo, rewards should be given out in a bell curve. Top performer on the team gets full rewards, and each person below gets 20% less based on their position in score. The last person must have 1/10 the score of the teams top performer or they get nothing.
Staying gives rewards, afking yields none, performing well gives you more.
Um, YES. Whether or not it's cheating is up for debate, but one aspect of this behavior is undeniable. The Quitter/Leaver is HAMSTER over 4 other players who have now been denied any real chance of competing due to the behavior of one "teammate". Probably the worse aspect of PvPing is being stuck with a player who seems to have no concept that they are part of a team.
To me this is an interesting sentiment and begs the question that no one seems to be asking.
Why did he or she leave?
What prompted the leaver to leave? Try to seriously consider that because it is rather the key to all this I believe.
Were they mistreated as youngsters and taught the cold hard truths of the street, growing up loveless and hardened; thus made into bad people who cheat just to do it?
Or maybe they see something that intimates they don’t have a chance in this match?
Perhaps they want a shot at a more favorable team make up or they recognize the opposition as a premade.
Perhaps they see it as a coin flip anyway and the whole thing is basically decided in the queuing (heh, I said Qing) process, getting a bad result now they opt to try again.
But there is a reason for it. Address that reason and you cure the symptom. Slap a penalty on it and you just invite a new symptom.
Yes, we would absolutely love it if we played against premades, but sadly that's not how the queue works.
I seriously doubt the logic to apply ratings to match groups against each other in PvP will be implemented anytime soon.
In regards to the bulling, how am I bullying other people to play the way I am? Can they not leave if they don't enjoy the way I play at the moment?
You all mentioned that the losers should get no reward, I agree with that. So either way, they can brawl it out with my team or we can absolutely wreck them in PvP and they'd still lose and if they happened to be matched against my team again (which often does occur) they will continually lose. All we do is queue for PvP because we're done with PvE content, we might run the odd dungeon now and then but it's not really fun fighting static AI, everything is so easy and the content is really lacking so what better way to kill time than to play against dynamic AI (players). Sure they don't really provide a challenge when we go against a PUG but that's the nature of things right now.
I guess they can alleviate this by adding another queue for PvP, group queue, but we'll still be queueing the other PvP for our random massacre events!
Eh, I hear what you're saying, but this can be a valuable learning experience as well. You learn more from your defeats, or at least you should.
You do not learn anything from getting slaughtered by an organized team that also outgears your group of random people. There is nothing you can learn, other than it's best to leave the match or wait it out. It is neither fun nor educating. This is the chief reason why I moved away from PvP in Neverwinter. (I ran premades in That Other MMO for several years, but there was an incentive to do so.)
More along the lines of how to implement a feature which won't be abused by those who are willing to lose for faster gain.
If a surrender option was added right now I could easily see players joining, getting in, surrendering, gaining glory, rinse and repeat.
So the question becomes how to make a surrender option viable without being exploitable.
Which is where ideas such as elawyn's come into play. However as much as I like the gamble analogies I'm not sure it would work out. Perhaps a mix of both worlds would improve the system? *shrugs and smiles*
You do not learn anything from getting slaughtered by an organized team that also outgears your group of random people. There is nothing you can learn, other than it's best to leave the match or wait it out. It is neither fun nor educating. This is the chief reason why I moved away from PvP in Neverwinter. (I ran premades in That Other MMO for several years, but there was an incentive to do so.)
Agree with the outgeared part, but can't disagree more with the rest.
If you're not picking up tactics from a well oiled PvP team, you're not paying attention. This leads to you developing countertactics against what becomes predictable behaviors.
Granted, it is very hard to overcome a good premade PvP group with a PUG, but it can be done. I've found that this is a good way to build up a pretty solid friends list that you can then parlay into your own premade.
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kristingraveMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
I honestly think you learn a hell of a lot when your matched up against a pre-made team with a 12k GS. Having to play against such teams with random nubs thought me how to better position myself in PvP and how to deal with encounters. Now I only try to get in to PvP with some friends/guild peeps only. But I still do random pug PvP at times. You learn more playing against experienced players, then chickens with their heads cut off.
Lift me up.. Panda@kristingrave - CW - Dragon
Death@healxyou - DC - Dragon
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kevinn777Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 3Arc User
edited June 2013
Leavers should be punish with the harshest penalty possible. I say give them a 24 hours account suspension. That will teach them! My trolling would so be worth it when I see them rage quit and can't log back in for another 24 hours. Also should have the countdown timer to leave the spawn area like someone else suggested. We'll just camp them there until they can't take it anymore while not capping at points and leaving the game at a neutral 0-0 score.
But in the end, it wouldn't even matter because the game is dying so fast on my server. If people already beat the game in 4 weeks or less and the next major patch has no new items then there's no point to playing the game except to troll in pvp. But what good is trolling when no one ques for pvp cause they get wreck by my team and cry about us "exploiting" to get to their spawn area.
The surrender option is also nice. But of course there should be a penalty. I say no rewards, 2 hours before they can que again, and each player loses 10g to the other team. Make them all pay for ruining my fun!
One thing Ive noticed on these forums - rampant justification of exploiting the system, with many using the flimsy argument that one should because one can. I hope this is investigated in full.
It absolutely will be (and currently is). Anyone who justifies and/or admits to exploiting the system on this forum is privy to further investigation by Cryptic Community Managers, developers, engineers, and other associates/representatives...
If you plan on cheating, dont talk about it here on the Neverwinter forum if you value your forum and in game account.
If you are a good egg, no worries, we very much welcome your report of any cheaters/exploiters you see in game or on these forums.
For those who wish to alert the Cryptic team of cheaters, or what you perceive might be a cheater, please contact customer service in game (file in game bug report), Contact A GM (? mark on main menu bar, H by default) or via email (link up top of thisage) first.
TO CONTACT AN IN-GAME GM: To alert the Cryptic team of a cheater or an exploiter, press H key or the ? on the menu bar to contact a GM. Then press the BEHAVIOR button.
Other methods to report cheaters/exploiters can be found here:
So I don't play too much PVP but I did like it when I did play on a balanced teams except for when I am the only one on the team trying to get objective etc and the spawn with 4 people in it is getting slammed and then I die and get slammed.
possible Suggestion: What if they made it so you had to move to an objective after the match starts to get included in the match rewards. Any bots would be stuck at the start and after 30 sec anyone who didn't reach the objective is kicked and replaced. Not sure what to do with afkers after they do this but maybe a deterrent to bots.
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elawynMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
possible Suggestion: What if they made it so you had to move to an objective after the match starts to get included in the match rewards. Any bots would be stuck at the start and after 30 sec anyone who didn't reach the objective is kicked and replaced. Not sure what to do with afkers after they do this but maybe a deterrent to bots.
Works until the bot scripters add that to their script.
As mentioned elsewhere, it's like the race between armor and weapons. One or two developers versus hundreds of bot script writers is a losing battle. The only way to deal with bots is to take away any reason to do it in the first place, starting with reducing the benefits of running a bot (because bots generally end up losing the match).
kristingraveMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
Kay since one of you mods posted here, granted you might not even know the answer to this not sure how much info you get from devs. But. Was the CW glitch fully patched? I was getting 1 shotted by a CW last night 1v1, looked at their gear after, they were in much worse gear then me. And there is no way the certain skill they were using could crit me every time for 60k+. Mainly when their crit was around 1.3k. It was annoying and that individual ranked up 20+ kills in that match due to it.
Lift me up.. Panda@kristingrave - CW - Dragon
Death@healxyou - DC - Dragon
Not that it would address the botting issue, but the game could lock you into PVP. There would be no leaving, no way out until the match was over. Que up, log in and take your lumps.
Wouldn’t fix the afk or bot problem but we did start this whole melee on the issue of people leaving in during a match.
Of course if you did get locked into the match, then logging off and closing the game would become cheating. Just because you can doesn’t make it right.
Actually this might work out pretty good for Cryptic. “You have received a 72 hour ban for excessive logging off of our game.”
Comments
I agree 100%.
This is a great list to work from.
The first three can be fixed/improved with the creation of a Find Party system. This would open up many options for similar playstyles. The last in the list just needs to be fixed.
A surrender option is the one I'm having trouble envisioning working properly, since I see the same cheaters hustling the system already in place taking advantage of it.
Perhaps the surrender system comes packaged with a soft penalty.. such as no rewards for 24 hours for losing (training mode). This would really screw afkers
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HEEEEELL YES! Of course. I don't care about cheaters beating a game who think they are entitled to cheat because they "can"..... I care about those affected by cheaters, who are trying (and sometimes paying) to enjoy a game.
You can ride on both sides of the street, but you think twice when a semi is barreling down dont ya? Just because you CAN, doesn't mean you should. When they fix it, cheaters will find a new way to cheat... and a new excuse arises.
Sorry no sympathy for cheaters, try that on someone else!
TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Neverwinter Online Guild
No Drama. Camaraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!
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I'm all for "playing with friends", but there is no reason why people who play with friends should not be matched against people who also play with friends. This could even become a guild requirement.
We should absolutely punish any leavers in PvP because it ruins our fun when we have people on the opposing team refusing to play the way my team plays.
I group in a pre-made for PvP and we play a special mode of PvP.
The way we usually play is to deny people from capping any points (we don't cap any either) in PvP and drag it out as long as possible (this works especially well against a PUG), usually we get a few angry comments but mostly we have people leaving and that just spoils our fun. I don't get why people get upset at us or refuse to play the way we play because there's really nothing else for us to do but PvP now, so my team just queues for PvP and try and drag on a game as long as possible until a majority of the people leave, if they go AFK, we just chill around the opposing spawn camp and have a friendly chat amongst our selves, great way to relax after having some intense PvP action!
I can't wait until a leaver penalty is implemented, hope to see you all in PvP then!
Easily fixed with a countdown timer. At zero, it's a draw and no-one gains a thing.
Well... no matter what system they implement, ****s will always try to be ****s, and sometimes succeed. Grats, I guess?
At least you won't get to be cheating ****s.
- What Class Are You? -
Wow didn't experiment with a deserter debuff, they implemented one and have had one in place since they did so. It is extremely successful and effective.
Simply implementing such a thing goes a very long way toward protecting the innocent. Getting a deserter debuff by disconnecting sucks, but when you let yourself remember how bad the BG's where before it, you deal.
Beyond that, those that actually head into PvP to play matches start getting teams that fully intend to play out the match, rather than people with no intention of staying if the middle circle doesn't get won in the first thirty seconds. The leavers stop playing if they can't hang, but that's ok because they weren't innocent anyway.
As far as in-match abuse, small invisible baseline "participation" quotas wouldn't be all bad(such as "cannot have 1/10th the points of their average teammate). Eject players from the spawn area every ten seconds to prevent sitting up there and quitting. A massive, intensive sweep for bot accounts, and tools to eliminate and reduce their usefulness.
A vote-kick feature would likely be good as well. While things like this have potential for abuse, it's not nearly as high as a "can't be kicked AFKer sitting in the spawn without consequence" level of abuse.
And that’s all you see clearly. But just take a moment and imagine in some alternate world someone entering in PVP only to find themselves hopelessly outmatched.
Your solution is “Get out here and let me beat on you”?
“Newp, I got’s 15 more minutes of pain for you, porkchop! C’mere!”
Or is it more along the line of don’t join PVP if you aren’t ready to be utterly humiliated with no hope of succor.
Or, and this is a revolutionary thought, how about we make PVP something people don’t want to leave. How about we make it something that doesn’t immediately suggest a winner and loser from the word go. Maybe if there is something of interest in the PVP game, the dirty, dirty, cheating leavers will stop leaving.
Yeah maybe that’s a lot to prognosticate, but I would be willing to bet that most of this problem would solve itself if PVP included anything to keep people’s attention besides a red and blue bar.
And since I do preach this, how do other games handle this? Who do you feel does a good job of handling this situation with cheaters leaving their games early?
When they played this game they clicked this little agree button for an agreement that basicallhy stipulated that they must play the game as intended and cannot cheat.
So the answer is: ABSOLUTELY - punish them for exploiting the "broken system" they agreed not to exploit.
One thing Ive noticed on these forums - rampant justification of exploiting the system, with many using the flimsy argument that one should because one can. I hope this is investigated in full.
You guys are way too serious, why is my way of having fun not acceptable?
Another proposal is you would need a "pvp rating" system... it works like the ELO chess rating where high ranking (bracket) players are only matched against players of the same rating bracket (skill level). Lower ranking (casual) players can wallow around at the lower ranking matches and still have fun.
I like a point system that is generated by a plethora of things rather than just DPS. The pikers and afkers get nothing - didnt score any points. The losers get rewarded based on points scored, and the winners will get more reward because they scored more points. How much more depends on how lopsided the win/loss was. If it was a close match, the winner only gets slightly more than the loser. If it was a cakewalk because the winners were facing afkers and pikers, then the winners get most or all of the reward, while the afkers and pikers get nothing.
Then make it so that you dont queue with people on your ignore list. I only have to experience the same afker or piker once.
Eh, I hear what you're saying, but this can be a valuable learning experience as well. You learn more from your defeats, or at least you should.
I picked up more tips on how to play well as a team by getting my hindquarters handed to me by a well tuned team.
Um, YES. Whether or not it's cheating is up for debate, but one aspect of this behavior is undeniable. The Quitter/Leaver is HAMSTER over 4 other players who have now been denied any real chance of competing due to the behavior of one "teammate". Probably the worse aspect of PvPing is being stuck with a player who seems to have no concept that they are part of a team.
Because the fun that you have as a premade is at the expense of the fun of the random players you bully.
As I said, there is nothing wrong with playing with friends, but you should be matched against people who also play with friends. That should still be fun for you.
Staying gives rewards, afking yields none, performing well gives you more.
To me this is an interesting sentiment and begs the question that no one seems to be asking.
Why did he or she leave?
What prompted the leaver to leave? Try to seriously consider that because it is rather the key to all this I believe.
Were they mistreated as youngsters and taught the cold hard truths of the street, growing up loveless and hardened; thus made into bad people who cheat just to do it?
Or maybe they see something that intimates they don’t have a chance in this match?
Perhaps they want a shot at a more favorable team make up or they recognize the opposition as a premade.
Perhaps they see it as a coin flip anyway and the whole thing is basically decided in the queuing (heh, I said Qing) process, getting a bad result now they opt to try again.
But there is a reason for it. Address that reason and you cure the symptom. Slap a penalty on it and you just invite a new symptom.
I seriously doubt the logic to apply ratings to match groups against each other in PvP will be implemented anytime soon.
In regards to the bulling, how am I bullying other people to play the way I am? Can they not leave if they don't enjoy the way I play at the moment?
You all mentioned that the losers should get no reward, I agree with that. So either way, they can brawl it out with my team or we can absolutely wreck them in PvP and they'd still lose and if they happened to be matched against my team again (which often does occur) they will continually lose. All we do is queue for PvP because we're done with PvE content, we might run the odd dungeon now and then but it's not really fun fighting static AI, everything is so easy and the content is really lacking so what better way to kill time than to play against dynamic AI (players). Sure they don't really provide a challenge when we go against a PUG but that's the nature of things right now.
I guess they can alleviate this by adding another queue for PvP, group queue, but we'll still be queueing the other PvP for our random massacre events!
You do not learn anything from getting slaughtered by an organized team that also outgears your group of random people. There is nothing you can learn, other than it's best to leave the match or wait it out. It is neither fun nor educating. This is the chief reason why I moved away from PvP in Neverwinter. (I ran premades in That Other MMO for several years, but there was an incentive to do so.)
More along the lines of how to implement a feature which won't be abused by those who are willing to lose for faster gain.
If a surrender option was added right now I could easily see players joining, getting in, surrendering, gaining glory, rinse and repeat.
So the question becomes how to make a surrender option viable without being exploitable.
Which is where ideas such as elawyn's come into play. However as much as I like the gamble analogies I'm not sure it would work out. Perhaps a mix of both worlds would improve the system? *shrugs and smiles*
Either way there's no simple solution.
i hope this is 10 characters.
Ability Scores || All Attribute Roll Combinations || My Cleric Stream \o/
Agree with the outgeared part, but can't disagree more with the rest.
If you're not picking up tactics from a well oiled PvP team, you're not paying attention. This leads to you developing countertactics against what becomes predictable behaviors.
Granted, it is very hard to overcome a good premade PvP group with a PUG, but it can be done. I've found that this is a good way to build up a pretty solid friends list that you can then parlay into your own premade.
Lift me up..
Panda@kristingrave - CW - Dragon
Death@healxyou - DC - Dragon
But in the end, it wouldn't even matter because the game is dying so fast on my server. If people already beat the game in 4 weeks or less and the next major patch has no new items then there's no point to playing the game except to troll in pvp. But what good is trolling when no one ques for pvp cause they get wreck by my team and cry about us "exploiting" to get to their spawn area.
The surrender option is also nice. But of course there should be a penalty. I say no rewards, 2 hours before they can que again, and each player loses 10g to the other team. Make them all pay for ruining my fun!
It absolutely will be (and currently is). Anyone who justifies and/or admits to exploiting the system on this forum is privy to further investigation by Cryptic Community Managers, developers, engineers, and other associates/representatives...
If you plan on cheating, dont talk about it here on the Neverwinter forum if you value your forum and in game account.
If you are a good egg, no worries, we very much welcome your report of any cheaters/exploiters you see in game or on these forums.
For those who wish to alert the Cryptic team of cheaters, or what you perceive might be a cheater, please contact customer service in game (file in game bug report), Contact A GM (? mark on main menu bar, H by default) or via email (link up top of thisage) first.
TO CONTACT AN IN-GAME GM:
To alert the Cryptic team of a cheater or an exploiter, press H key or the ? on the menu bar to contact a GM. Then press the BEHAVIOR button.
Other methods to report cheaters/exploiters can be found here:
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?306422-Reporting-Exploits-The-Right-Way&highlight=report+exploits
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possible Suggestion: What if they made it so you had to move to an objective after the match starts to get included in the match rewards. Any bots would be stuck at the start and after 30 sec anyone who didn't reach the objective is kicked and replaced. Not sure what to do with afkers after they do this but maybe a deterrent to bots.
Works until the bot scripters add that to their script.
As mentioned elsewhere, it's like the race between armor and weapons. One or two developers versus hundreds of bot script writers is a losing battle. The only way to deal with bots is to take away any reason to do it in the first place, starting with reducing the benefits of running a bot (because bots generally end up losing the match).
Lift me up..
Panda@kristingrave - CW - Dragon
Death@healxyou - DC - Dragon
Wouldn’t fix the afk or bot problem but we did start this whole melee on the issue of people leaving in during a match.
Of course if you did get locked into the match, then logging off and closing the game would become cheating. Just because you can doesn’t make it right.
Actually this might work out pretty good for Cryptic. “You have received a 72 hour ban for excessive logging off of our game.”