Regardless of the details, the premise alone is enough to make people react strongly to it. I sense that this is going to be one of those "love it or hate it" types of things. While it's an interesting concept, I can sympathize with those that hate it for the PvP element added to it. Many people simply just don't like PvP and never will, even if they work at being good at it. I know plenty of people who really tried to get into PvP and just couldn't. I've also known plenty of PvP'ers who have tried to get into PvE and had the same reaction; they just didn't like the predictability of scripted encounters. There's no way developers are ever going to get those two extremes to come together. But there's also a middle ground. There are plenty of players who love both PvE and PvP, and for them, this new zone is perfect.
Also, for everyone crying about the current state of the game regarding class balance, there is a big patch coming that will readjust things so today's super strong Trickster Rogue might be tomorrow's free gank. You never know in which direction the pendulum is going to swing until it swings. I recommend everyone give it some time, wait and see, relax, and try it out when it ships live. If you absolutely hate life after all that, then take it to the forums. Right now, all you're doing is complaining for the sake of complaining. None of us know how all this will play out until we have it in our hands.
I agree 100% , but that will still not change the fact that some people just do not enjoy pvp , nor does it change the fact that alot of pvp players will get the option to run a dungeon that they are simply not intrested in doing.
I have been an avid pvpe'r in the past , honestly i have not been incline to even try it in this game , i do however beleave Cryptic should pay attention to both and indeed provide content to keep everyone happy.
Is this "fruit salad" going to have success , i certainly doubt it , but ill try and keep an open mind , and even tho my mind screams "EPIC FAIL" im going to give it a try , doesn't seem like i have much of a choice anyway.
I have mixed feelings for this. For myself I currently have a Maxed out "full T2, T2.5 w/ rank 7+ gems" TR, GWF and DC. Im currently in the process of doing that to a CW. I will run Gauntlygrim 1 time for sure to check it out and just for the over all experience. But for me, It's all about the loot. If they do not implement better loot than T2.5 there is ZERO incentive to do it more than 1 time. So far I have enjoyed the over all design of the game. There is tons of room for improvements which I'm sure will come over time. They just need to find a way to keep the "end game" people busy tell then.
"The Sweet Ain't As Sweet Without The Sour!"
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calaminthaMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I have a feeling that, since people are (for the most part) T1 and T2 geared already, Phase 3 will not be happening very often.
Since some PvP players will probably go as far as completing the PvP-Phase 2 aspect and then /leave their respective groups.
Perhaps I'm wrong but...
But what will be the reward of the PvP phase? If there will be no glory reward it's kinda useless to complete that too if they all outgear it.
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xenobiusMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
Honestly, I don't see it working - at all.
I just see issues that will most likely, be accompanied by more issues.
1) Three phases likely means that it will take a helluva time - which is effectively wasted, if there's only tier 2 loot waiting.
2) PvP phase is a large scale Domination - which practically means "bring your PvP spec and 110% mounts". And, it's making people who don't give a rat's HAMSTER about PvP participate in one.
3) I can't imagine the queue for Gauntlgrym will work any better than the current ones - so expect leavers, afkers, people who can't teleport inside and whatnot.
4) Being a timed event, I already imagine the horror of assembling a good group for it - large raids NEED to have flexible time frame because, you know, people have different timezones and all. Having to adhere to a rather silly random schedule for a 20-man event is a no-go in my book.
5) Casual folk will have their backsides handed to them all the time. If you ever played in a pug against a premade on Alterac you'll know what I mean. They simply won't bother.
Overall, it seems a joke more than anything.
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mezekulMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 12Arc User
Here is a news flash - this game is pretty awesome, it's the COMMUNITY that is sorely lacking. I guess you'll have that with a F2P game: a lot of people who have contributed very little complaining and acting like they are owed something. Be constructive with your crit - otherwise just sit down and shut up and let the grown ups sort it out.
0
jnaathraMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Honestly, I don't see it working - at all.
I just see issues that will most likely, be accompanied by more issues.
1) Three phases likely means that it will take a helluva time - which is effectively wasted, if there's only tier 2 loot waiting.
2) PvP phase is a large scale Domination - which practically means "bring your PvP spec and 110% mounts". And, it's making people who don't give a rat's HAMSTER about PvP participate in one.
3) I can't imagine the queue for Gauntlgrym will work any better than the current ones - so expect leavers, afkers, people who can't teleport inside and whatnot.
4) Being a timed event, I already imagine the horror of assembling a good group for it - large raids NEED have flexible time frame because, you know, people have different timezones and all. Having to adhere to a rather silly random schedule for a 20-man event is a no-go in my book.
5) Casual folk will have their backsides handed to them all the time. If you ever played in a pug against a premade on Alterac you'll know what I mean. They simply won't bother.
Overall, it seems a joke more than anything.
...Then don't participate in it. Is it hard to imagine that it may just be fun to play? Wait... People don't play games for fun anymore I guess
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xenobiusMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
...Then don't participate in it. Is it hard to imagine that it may just be fun to play? Wait... People don't play games for fun anymore I guess
Is it fun to play a Domination match when out of 5 people, 1 couldn't teleport inside, one is a asdasd@asdasd bot, and another one leaves upon seeing the bot? Or maybe it's fun to find yourself in a Dungeon Delves group which consist of 2 GWFs, a TR a GF and a CW with 3 minutes left on DD event?
It's just that seeing how everything else in Neverwinter "works as intended" I'm afraid "fun" will be hard to find in Gauntlgrym.
Is it fun to play a Domination match when out of 5 people, 1 couldn't teleport inside, one is a asdasd@asdasd bot, and another one leaves upon seeing the bot? Or maybe it's fun to find yourself in a Dungeon Delves group which consist of 2 GWFs, a TR a GF and a CW with 3 minutes left on DD event?
It's just that seeing how everything else in Neverwinter "works as intended" I'm afraid "fun" will be hard to find in Gauntlgrym.
Maybe you don't find playing a game in Beta fun. Maybe you should wait until the game is released (2 weeks).
...Then don't participate in it. Is it hard to imagine that it may just be fun to play? Wait... People don't play games for fun anymore I guess
Bingo!
Honestly whatever happened to doing something just for the adventure...this is why I hate the current crop of MMO players, if it doesn't increase the size of their e-peen and is set up in a way that screams exclusionary they cry and throw tantrums.
One of the devs from Zenimax made a very eloquent post to the TESO beta testers a couple weeks back explaining how they were not going down that path that the game was about discovery and adventure, not acquisition or elitism. This is the coming trend like it or not.
syfylisMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, SilverstarsPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
hi storm long time
....
What i see that people who want to go for pvp and elitism can get what they want and people who cares only about adventure and story also can get what they want mainly because of foundry. Now the problem we have now it's same as with religous fanatics.
It's not good enough to let them believe what they want they want you to belive same thing they do. I understant that some people don't like pvp and for them PVE is more important than anything but why they want to take something from me that they don't need?
There is a lot of foundry quests and foundry get updated all the time so it would be nice if people would be more open about what is "FUN" for other people.
I love PvP in most MMO's but this games pvp is pretty horrible with the CC and no diminishing returns on it as you get cc'd continually.
But lets give it a try and see how it goes, as far as I can see, the devs have not hurt the game in any way for those who chose to remain PvE'ers and IMO PvE is extremely good in Neverwinter.
Honestly whatever happened to doing something just for the adventure...this is why I hate the current crop of MMO players, if it doesn't increase the size of their e-peen and is set up in a way that screams exclusionary they cry and throw tantrums.
One of the devs from Zenimax made a very eloquent post to the TESO beta testers a couple weeks back explaining how they were not going down that path that the game was about discovery and adventure, not acquisition or elitism. This is the coming trend like it or not.
All of those are great, I just don't see why the forced pvp is even a part of this xD and yes, it feels forced. Sure you can argue that it's all optional, but that's not much of an argument if we really look at it.
I guess my main concern is despite wanting this game to be awesome, I have like...no faith in Cryptic at the moment and so it will be highly reliant on the balance and bugfix patches/alterations that come just before the release of gauntlegrym.
I just DON'T think that cryptic have what it takes to make this work. It's a somewhat unique idea and in some ways they deserve credit for going outside the box and innovating, but I just can't personally see them managing it on the level that it needs to be when they essentially gate PVE with PVP and vice versa. That, to me anyways. Means that they need their PVP AND PVE to be equally balanced to a high degree.
I don't think they can accomplish this, and I find it a real let down that they're trying to launch themselves off cliffs, before they've learned to walk.
Is it fun to play a Domination match when out of 5 people, 1 couldn't teleport inside, one is a asdasd@asdasd bot, and another one leaves upon seeing the bot? Or maybe it's fun to find yourself in a Dungeon Delves group which consist of 2 GWFs, a TR a GF and a CW with 3 minutes left on DD event?
It's just that seeing how everything else in Neverwinter "works as intended" I'm afraid "fun" will be hard to find in Gauntlgrym.
Sounds like you need to join a good guild with many players to group with so you do not get stuck with randoms.
I dont really understand why people are getting there panty's all tight over something that isent released yet?
To all the pvp's = u wil shine in round 2 but round 1 gives a DR boost if i am not mistaken?
To all the pve = u wil have DR cause of round 1, and most likely ure teamwork is better then pvp'ers who are more single minded '-.-
Also what is the impact of the giant/catapults in pvp? do catapults 1 shot players??? NOBODY knows i think so far.
Why are people being emediatly dismisive of new content before it is released? new trents ore something? doomsayers are the jockeys of 2013?...
Also what is with this PVP vs PVE issue? if ure PVP oriented look at the monsters like players and smash em. if ure PVE oriented look at the players like monsters? there fixed ure base issue for u. '-.-
Petram Sacram - I am no devine cleric, i am a Gaurdian fighter in disguise with better threat and supportive spells -
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syfylisMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, SilverstarsPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
I don't understand how are you guys forced to go for pvp?
I don't want to go to pvp to get my T2 items! What should I do? Maybe I'll go to T2 dungeons like everyone so far?!
You feel forced without any point to support that.
1) GW2 account - I'd like to try the PvP in this game, doesn't matter what level the character is or anything like that.
GW2 is free, aside from the actual client which you must buy. And FYI in team PVP all players are automatically adjusted to lvl 80 and have access to the same class skills and equipment. In that sense it is totally balanced - only skill makes players of the same class better than one another. Balance between classes is another story, but I find it more balanced than many other PVP games.
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gerritxMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 24Arc User
edited June 2013
I kind of see both sides of the story... as someone who does not enjoy pvp then I will likely never do this raid. If it makes you feel superior and more manly to say you are a better player than me because you like PvP, feel free.
However, I am the kind of person who enjoys seeing the content and seeing the story unfold. I will not get to see Gauntlgrym and that kind of sucks. However, I am under no pretense that Cryptic is "forcing" me to do anything. It's disappointing that they mix content like this but I guess they will see how well it is received and make future decisions based on that.
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xcifuMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
Holy hell. I really don't get a lot of the replies on this post. It's new content, can you at least give it a try before jumping to an incomprehensible rant. Here are some bullet points for y'all.*
Don't compare this to WoW or Daoc or Warhammer, just stop before your brain implodes.*
Waaa Waaa I don't like pvp Waaa. Again while a persons preference is important to THAT person the majority don't give a rats *** about your personal play style. If you don't like pvp then don't participate in it.*
Why do carebears ruin everything for us pvpers. Honestly you don't see pvpers *****ing about pve content. A good pvper will also be a good pver. The opposite doesn't seem to translate half the time.*
This game has a lot of issues and bugs that they have been working to fix all through beta. So it's sorta understandable that there are a lot of dissatisfied customers, however, a beta is simply just what it sounds like: an unfinished version of a game where the developers intent is to test things out before going live.*
I think people's gripe is that real money has been spent on a beta where somethings are clearly broken or not working as intended. ***** it's beta. The money you are spending should be viewed as a contribution to the work the dev team is doing. Once the game goes live then absolutely I would agree with anyone that received something they did not pay for. Till then stop your crying I bet your tears are sweet nectar to the dev team.*
/rant.*
P.S.*
If you are on the mindflayer server and you want to be in a guild that is going to take Neverwinter release serious contact us on our website at www.the-darkhand.com or send an in game mail to cifu@xcifu
no possibillity to join with 20 men from guild -> MONSTER FAIL
This game is going down. I quit. I shouldnt have waited for this patch. I should have known they **** it up. Holy cow. This is redicilous.
Why are T2 drops a joke? That would offer more pvp oriented players another alternative to getting gear rather than farm the same old dungeons over and over again.
Holy hell. I really don't get a lot of the replies on this post. It's new content, can you at least give it a try before jumping to an incomprehensible rant. Here are some bullet points for y'all.*
Don't compare this to WoW or Daoc or Warhammer, just stop before your brain implodes.*
Waaa Waaa I don't like pvp Waaa. Again while a persons preference is important to THAT person the majority don't give a rats *** about your personal play style. If you don't like pvp then don't participate in it.*
Why do carebears ruin everything for us pvpers. Honestly you don't see pvpers *****ing about pve content. A good pvper will also be a good pver. The opposite doesn't seem to translate half the time.*
This game has a lot of issues and bugs that they have been working to fix all through beta. So it's understandable that there are a lot of dissatisfied customers. Typically a beta is simply just what it sounds like: an unfinished version of a game where the developers intent is to test things out before going live.*
I think people's gripe is that real money has been spent on a beta where somethings are clearly broken or not working as intended. ***** it's beta. The money you are spending should be viewed as a contribution to the work the dev team is doing. Once the game goes live then absolutely I would agree with anyone that received something they did not pay for. Till then stop your crying I bet your tears are sweet nectar to the dev team.*
/rant.*
P.S.*
If you are on the mindflayer server and you want to be in a guild that is going to take Neverwinter release serious contact us on our website at www.the-darkhand.com or send an in game mail to cifu@xcifu
LOL
How about you remove the insulting tone and maybe someone will you know...discuss it with you... which is what this is for...not recruitment xD
I'm sure when all is said and done the players that leave, won't be bothering you much longer, just have a little patience and don't get sucked into the fighting xD Oh and enjoy the lulz.
Comments
I agree 100% , but that will still not change the fact that some people just do not enjoy pvp , nor does it change the fact that alot of pvp players will get the option to run a dungeon that they are simply not intrested in doing.
I have been an avid pvpe'r in the past , honestly i have not been incline to even try it in this game , i do however beleave Cryptic should pay attention to both and indeed provide content to keep everyone happy.
Is this "fruit salad" going to have success , i certainly doubt it , but ill try and keep an open mind , and even tho my mind screams "EPIC FAIL" im going to give it a try , doesn't seem like i have much of a choice anyway.
If you happened to play on a server with balanced population.
But what will be the reward of the PvP phase? If there will be no glory reward it's kinda useless to complete that too if they all outgear it.
I just see issues that will most likely, be accompanied by more issues.
1) Three phases likely means that it will take a helluva time - which is effectively wasted, if there's only tier 2 loot waiting.
2) PvP phase is a large scale Domination - which practically means "bring your PvP spec and 110% mounts". And, it's making people who don't give a rat's HAMSTER about PvP participate in one.
3) I can't imagine the queue for Gauntlgrym will work any better than the current ones - so expect leavers, afkers, people who can't teleport inside and whatnot.
4) Being a timed event, I already imagine the horror of assembling a good group for it - large raids NEED to have flexible time frame because, you know, people have different timezones and all. Having to adhere to a rather silly random schedule for a 20-man event is a no-go in my book.
5) Casual folk will have their backsides handed to them all the time. If you ever played in a pug against a premade on Alterac you'll know what I mean. They simply won't bother.
Overall, it seems a joke more than anything.
If so, that explains a lot.
Here is a news flash - this game is pretty awesome, it's the COMMUNITY that is sorely lacking. I guess you'll have that with a F2P game: a lot of people who have contributed very little complaining and acting like they are owed something. Be constructive with your crit - otherwise just sit down and shut up and let the grown ups sort it out.
...Then don't participate in it. Is it hard to imagine that it may just be fun to play? Wait... People don't play games for fun anymore I guess
Is it fun to play a Domination match when out of 5 people, 1 couldn't teleport inside, one is a asdasd@asdasd bot, and another one leaves upon seeing the bot? Or maybe it's fun to find yourself in a Dungeon Delves group which consist of 2 GWFs, a TR a GF and a CW with 3 minutes left on DD event?
It's just that seeing how everything else in Neverwinter "works as intended" I'm afraid "fun" will be hard to find in Gauntlgrym.
Source? Or just speculation?
Maybe you don't find playing a game in Beta fun. Maybe you should wait until the game is released (2 weeks).
Bingo!
Honestly whatever happened to doing something just for the adventure...this is why I hate the current crop of MMO players, if it doesn't increase the size of their e-peen and is set up in a way that screams exclusionary they cry and throw tantrums.
One of the devs from Zenimax made a very eloquent post to the TESO beta testers a couple weeks back explaining how they were not going down that path that the game was about discovery and adventure, not acquisition or elitism. This is the coming trend like it or not.
Wrong before you even got started. Grats.
....
What i see that people who want to go for pvp and elitism can get what they want and people who cares only about adventure and story also can get what they want mainly because of foundry. Now the problem we have now it's same as with religous fanatics.
It's not good enough to let them believe what they want they want you to belive same thing they do. I understant that some people don't like pvp and for them PVE is more important than anything but why they want to take something from me that they don't need?
There is a lot of foundry quests and foundry get updated all the time so it would be nice if people would be more open about what is "FUN" for other people.
My work: Heroes Blacksmith - Library
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?21051-Heroes-Blacksmith-Library
But lets give it a try and see how it goes, as far as I can see, the devs have not hurt the game in any way for those who chose to remain PvE'ers and IMO PvE is extremely good in Neverwinter.
All of those are great, I just don't see why the forced pvp is even a part of this xD and yes, it feels forced. Sure you can argue that it's all optional, but that's not much of an argument if we really look at it.
I guess my main concern is despite wanting this game to be awesome, I have like...no faith in Cryptic at the moment and so it will be highly reliant on the balance and bugfix patches/alterations that come just before the release of gauntlegrym.
I just DON'T think that cryptic have what it takes to make this work. It's a somewhat unique idea and in some ways they deserve credit for going outside the box and innovating, but I just can't personally see them managing it on the level that it needs to be when they essentially gate PVE with PVP and vice versa. That, to me anyways. Means that they need their PVP AND PVE to be equally balanced to a high degree.
I don't think they can accomplish this, and I find it a real let down that they're trying to launch themselves off cliffs, before they've learned to walk.
Sounds like you need to join a good guild with many players to group with so you do not get stuck with randoms.
To all the pvp's = u wil shine in round 2 but round 1 gives a DR boost if i am not mistaken?
To all the pve = u wil have DR cause of round 1, and most likely ure teamwork is better then pvp'ers who are more single minded '-.-
Also what is the impact of the giant/catapults in pvp? do catapults 1 shot players??? NOBODY knows i think so far.
Why are people being emediatly dismisive of new content before it is released? new trents ore something? doomsayers are the jockeys of 2013?...
Also what is with this PVP vs PVE issue? if ure PVP oriented look at the monsters like players and smash em. if ure PVE oriented look at the players like monsters? there fixed ure base issue for u. '-.-
I don't want to go to pvp to get my T2 items! What should I do? Maybe I'll go to T2 dungeons like everyone so far?!
You feel forced without any point to support that.
My work: Heroes Blacksmith - Library
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?21051-Heroes-Blacksmith-Library
My work: Heroes Blacksmith - Library
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?21051-Heroes-Blacksmith-Library
GW2 is free, aside from the actual client which you must buy. And FYI in team PVP all players are automatically adjusted to lvl 80 and have access to the same class skills and equipment. In that sense it is totally balanced - only skill makes players of the same class better than one another. Balance between classes is another story, but I find it more balanced than many other PVP games.
However, I am the kind of person who enjoys seeing the content and seeing the story unfold. I will not get to see Gauntlgrym and that kind of sucks. However, I am under no pretense that Cryptic is "forcing" me to do anything. It's disappointing that they mix content like this but I guess they will see how well it is received and make future decisions based on that.
Don't compare this to WoW or Daoc or Warhammer, just stop before your brain implodes.*
Waaa Waaa I don't like pvp Waaa. Again while a persons preference is important to THAT person the majority don't give a rats *** about your personal play style. If you don't like pvp then don't participate in it.*
Why do carebears ruin everything for us pvpers. Honestly you don't see pvpers *****ing about pve content. A good pvper will also be a good pver. The opposite doesn't seem to translate half the time.*
This game has a lot of issues and bugs that they have been working to fix all through beta. So it's sorta understandable that there are a lot of dissatisfied customers, however, a beta is simply just what it sounds like: an unfinished version of a game where the developers intent is to test things out before going live.*
I think people's gripe is that real money has been spent on a beta where somethings are clearly broken or not working as intended. ***** it's beta. The money you are spending should be viewed as a contribution to the work the dev team is doing. Once the game goes live then absolutely I would agree with anyone that received something they did not pay for. Till then stop your crying I bet your tears are sweet nectar to the dev team.*
/rant.*
P.S.*
If you are on the mindflayer server and you want to be in a guild that is going to take Neverwinter release serious contact us on our website at www.the-darkhand.com or send an in game mail to cifu@xcifu
no possibillity to join with 20 men from guild -> MONSTER FAIL
This game is going down. I quit. I shouldnt have waited for this patch. I should have known they **** it up. Holy cow. This is redicilous.
Why are T2 drops a joke? That would offer more pvp oriented players another alternative to getting gear rather than farm the same old dungeons over and over again.
LOL
How about you remove the insulting tone and maybe someone will you know...discuss it with you... which is what this is for...not recruitment xD
I'm sure when all is said and done the players that leave, won't be bothering you much longer, just have a little patience and don't get sucked into the fighting xD Oh and enjoy the lulz.