tweeter83Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
just stop playing like me till its back up inventory is full not buyin more slots with zen and not going to sell my stuff for gold so why log in hit them where it hurts.
I would love to be able to provide an ETA but at this time we are lacking the information needed to make this determination.
We are currently performing testing on the Auction House changes that will allow us to enable it once again, though until we have more detail on the results of that testing, we will be unable to share an ETA.
Thank you for your patience and understanding while we work this out.
Well, an update is an update. Thank you
So will you be sending out a thank you addon for the AH downtime? Not trying to be a smart*** but a +3 Auctioneer's Gavel of Smiting would be hilarious
0
varatrasMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 22Arc User
I would love to be able to provide an ETA but at this time we are lacking the information needed to make this determination.
We are currently performing testing on the Auction House changes that will allow us to enable it once again, though until we have more detail on the results of that testing, we will be unable to share an ETA.
Thank you for your patience and understanding while we work this out.
My patience is about gone and as for my understanding it's right there with patience. i just find it difficult to comprehend that you can't figure it out. all you need is in the database right there in front of you. tweek, test, tweek, test. I write databases for a living and if i told one of my clients that i don't know what is wrong after 2 days of working on it i would seem to them like i don't know what the hell i'm doing and would promptly probably be replaced.
I'm truly at the end of what i have in me for a game i had a lot of hope for. My guild and I wish you the best in figuring out your problems and maybe in a year when you figure out the little things like class balance, auction halls, basic grouping mechanics, interface mechanics, etc, this game might be worth investigating further. Until then it's just been a big waste of time for our guild (which include many gaming bloggers and writers for MMO related websites). We will just chalk up to another game that had hope for but got lost in the translation to digital format.
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corleone33Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 17Arc User
Seriously?? maybe if u thought for a minute instead of Rage QQ'ing. Go to the postal courier and mail yourself some items. LOL u don't even need a bank in this game. Just send yourself mail with the item/items attached.
Probably easier to Rage QQ.
If you saw rage in my post, you're overreacting. A little frustration maybe, but not rage.
I hadn't thought of that workaround and I'll use it. Still, a function so important to the game's economy needs to be brought back up quickly or players need to be given better information about the why or when. Sure we can trade in gold for a few days, but gold is essentially worthless and I have enough of it now from a couple days worth of transactions to buy three characters potions from now until the day they shut down the servers.
There is no community , there are 100-200 people on the forums and about 2000 - 3000 people playing the game . Next month will be something like 10-15 on the forums and 100- 200 in game , why bother ?
I've added the latest info we have to the AD/AH Follow Up FAQ. Very sorry for the wait; we're doing everything we can to bring it up ASAP. Sorry, I know that having a specific time would be favorable to ASAP, but the most we can say at this time is that we are doing everything in our power to expedite the process.
I would love to be able to provide an ETA but at this time we are lacking the information needed to make this determination.
We are currently performing testing on the Auction House changes that will allow us to enable it once again, though until we have more detail on the results of that testing, we will be unable to share an ETA.
Thank you for your patience and understanding while we work this out.
Yo !
So....we have just 1-2 Days left and then the auctions run out anyways, as some of us thought already.
Take "your time to iron out some stuff" *cough-cough*
You can tell us when while we know already when it will happen anyways.
Honestly. Do you believe what you try to tell us? Especially after having yesterdays AH patch done?
Sry. I'm not.
Me thinks you just buying time on that way. And as it is always with communities in games, it will work that way.
Sad, rly.
So....now the following is on Twitter to read:
Neverwinter @NeverwinterGame 58m
AH Update: While we do not have an ETA of when the AH will be available, we do know that it will not be before Thursday, 5/23, Pacific Time.
Muahahaahaha......thats the 5 days then.
Man... you punched yourself IN Da FACE.
Epic.Fail.
Honestly, that was/is the biggest lie iv'e seen in gaming forum history EVER.
codewizardMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 1Arc User
edited May 2013
I am running very low on AD. Can't seem to earn enough without the AH or having to exchange ZEN. As a stop-gap I have indeed exchanged ZEN. That too takes time like the AH, so I am still going rapidly broke
0
daowaceMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
Lack of AH is why I quit GW2 during its launch phase.
Same thing happening here.
Boy, these two games sure are very similar with their problems. Hell, even Kripp thought so too.
Q: When will the Auction House and Astral Diamond Exchange become available?
The Astral Diamond Exchange is currently open, and we're working on bringing the Auction House back up as soon as possible. While we do not have an ETA of when the Auction House will be available again, we do know that it will not be before Thursday, 5/23, Pacific Time.
Thank you for your answer.If i understand correctly we only know when it will NOT come back but we still don't when it will am i right?
If that's the case it can be a week after thursday or a month right? (yea i know a month probably exaggeration or..?) I would like say for me the business part was always a big part of any MMO and i can just think i'm not alone with that.It adds another enjoyment for the experience.At the moment the items which i collected for sale are sitting in my mailbox (my bank and bag would be full if use 'em to store those staff).To be honest i don't know how long it can continue,i mean people obviously have different tolerance treshold and messing with that is never a good thing.
Although you guys made advancement by opening the ZEN market it still doesn't change the fact that the market is still frozen and people can't sell or buy staff for AD.MMO without economy can hardly operate or it can operate at all.I'm on the verge when thoughts come up the surface without any basis ( you know when you losing patience and your good ol' conspiracy theorist mind start to come up with silly ideas why it is happening )
So please fix the AH as soon as possible,thank you for listening.
0
kstjabMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 17Arc User
Servers come back up PWE signifies "Mission Acomplished".
MFW the game is still in a state of constant fail rivaling D3 until the AH is turned on.
Let's start with the underlined.
IF it was considered accomplished AH would be up by now.
#2 (The bolded part. D3 Is not in beta and still fail's you are comparing a beta game (neverwinter) to a non beta fail game. Never winter in beta form has bugs (AS ALL BETAS DO HENCE WHY ITS BETA )
We are way past 48 hours now that it's been down. All we are getting from any channel is "ASAP" or "soon". We have been hearing this for way to long now. We really need an Official response on when it will be back up, and not just soon or asap.
I'd rather them fix it then not to fix it.
Wait or quit the game already.
Because it's a game feature people have paid/are paying for.
wrenaq works for Corruptic, it's official. TRAITOR !
So,
#1 It's unacceptable that, they don't no the exact problem causing the glitch so it's taking longer? Or unacceptable they do not no how long it well take? If either of those are the cases why don't you try coding and then say its easy.
#2, Really you PAID to use the AH, If not you others have? Wow and to think i have been using it free along with many others! I FEEL GIFTED NOW!!!!!!!. No seriously now, you're information is misled please complain somewhere on a different forum where you do not look as stupid as you do now. Thank you!
People these day's are dumb as hell. Get off the forums please!
Thank you!
I wonder what will happen to my auction, which i started from 1 AD and someone gave an offer 7 AD (it was ring worth about 20k AD). There was no time for anyone else to won the auction by offering more AD for it. Someone will be lucky to buy my item below its value?
0
kstjabMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 17Arc User
I wonder what will happen to my auction, which i started from 1 AD and someone gave an offer 7 AD (it was ring worth about 20k AD). There was no time for anyone else to won the auction by offering more AD for it. Someone will be lucky to buy my item below its value?
Most likly yes, they may win it for what they bid, As there is always a risk of that when you put it on the AH for that low.
May i suggest next time putting the starting bid higher so you wont lose as much ad.
But who can predict that AH went offline ? i chose auction for 5 days but it continued about 3-4 hours. If i had knowlegde about AH i wouldnt take that sort of auctions. Its not my fault that AH is not working how it's supposed to.
I wonder what our admin stuff want to say about it ?
The only legitimate way of making AD, which is the game's only legitimate currency, is selling items in the Auction House.
There is also zone chat, you no you type /zone (message here)............Surprised you didn't think of that!
Well as it is sounds obvious i would like to point you out that AD CAN'T be traded via personal trades so there's no sense to use chat for that because you can't put AD in the trade window.
0
kstjabMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 17Arc User
Well as it is sounds obvious i would like to point you out that AD CAN'T be traded via personal trades so there's no sense to use chat for that because you can't put AD in.
[/QUOTE]
You are very correct, this is true you cannot trade AD but there are various other currencies in the game they could have traded for, Or waited for ah to come back up for that matter.
But who can predict that AH went offline ? i chose auction for 5 days but it continued about 3-4 hours. If i had knowlegde about AH i wouldnt take that sort of auctions. Its not my fault that AH is not working how it's supposed to.
I wonder what our admin stuff want to say about it ?
As i have stated above, things like this tend to happen in beta games. This is a free to play game after all. I don't believe they can even predict when a problem well occur with any said thing in the game. It is also not there fault that people were abusing glitchs and bugs to make billions of AD off the ah glitch. If anything blame the glitchers as it is down because of them.
As i said note i hate to seem like im bashing alot of people here when i do not intend to. I feel relly bad for the things that have happened to most of these user's. It is just a game after all weather they have put money (zen) into it or not things do happen and it should be expected at least a little bit on a game that is newly released as open beta.
I have tested alot of games and it seems as if more users instantly blame and yell at the creators for trying to fix the mistakes nothing is ever good enough to the common user, that in itself would make this a stressful job.
So if we cant predict how long AH will works what is the point to give us an oportunity for 5 days long auctions ? its useless.
i dont blame anyone i just want not to be a victim of Catastrophy
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kstjabMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 17Arc User
So if we cant predict how long AH will works what is the point to give us an oportunity for 5 days long auctions ? its useless.
i dont blame anyone i just want not to be a victim of Catastrophy
I agree with you completely, I hope that they have figured it out (may have taken a few days) and now there working to resolve this but as i said i am NOT a mod i am NOT working for cryptic and this is just SPECULATION That's my best guess i really hope it comes up though! I have alot to sell on the ah when it comes back!
0
varatrasMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 22Arc User
Let's start with the underlined.
IF it was considered accomplished AH would be up by now.
#2 (The bolded part. D3 Is not in beta and still fail's you are comparing a beta game (neverwinter) to a non beta fail game. Never winter in beta form has bugs (AS ALL BETAS DO HENCE WHY ITS BETA )
There is also zone chat, you no you type /zone (message here)............Surprised you didn't think of that!
I'd rather them fix it then not to fix it.
Wait or quit the game already.
So,
#1 It's unacceptable that, they don't no the exact problem causing the glitch so it's taking longer? Or unacceptable they do not no how long it well take? If either of those are the cases why don't you try coding and then say its easy.
#2, Really you PAID to use the AH, If not you others have? Wow and to think i have been using it free along with many others! I FEEL GIFTED NOW!!!!!!!. No seriously now, you're information is misled please complain somewhere on a different forum where you do not look as stupid as you do now. Thank you!
People these day's are dumb as hell. Get off the forums please!
Thank you!
Oh boy where do I begin with this pile of fail you just typed poorly.
1. You can not sell things via zone for AD. Only avenues to secure AD at the present time is buy zen then convert to AD, dailies from Rhix
2. I just happen to own a business the specializes in data driven websites, point of sale, credit card authorization, and property management systems. All of which are all database dependent. I do happen to know a lot about database coding. I know it's not easy but if the tables were turned and I let my customers down in such a manner, they would no longer be my customers.
What if I told Mandalay Bay Resorts that I don't know why their property management system don't work after 2 days of working on it? I would look incompetent and I'm sure they would replace my system quickly.
As to your end line of the post, I think you should really look in the mirror. As the only dumb person I see here shall remain nameless but won't be to hard for others to figure out. Maybe that person should take your advice and get off the forums.
Thank you!
Lol
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kstjabMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 17Arc User
Oh boy where do I begin with this pile of fail you just typed poorly.
1. You can not sell things via zone for AD. Only avenues to secure AD at the present time is buy zen then convert to AD, dailies from Rhix
2. I just happen to own a business the specializes in data driven websites, point of sale, credit card authorization, and property management systems. All of which are all database dependent. I do happen to know a lot about database coding. I know it's not easy but if the tables were turned and I let my customers down in such a manner, they would no longer be my customers.
What if I told Mandalay Bay Resorts that I don't know why their property management system don't work after 2 days of working on it? I would look incompetent and I'm sure they would replace my system quickly.
As to your end line of the post, I think you should really look in the mirror. As the only dumb person I see here shall remain nameless but won't be to hard for others to figure out. Maybe you should take your own advice and get off the forums.
Thank you!
Lol
Maybe you are correct about alot of what you said (as i am not here to fight these are forums but im up for a debate!) I have already been over the ad thing which you have mentioned there are other currencies of which you can trade for not just AD and as i said you could just wait for the ah to come up and not be so impatient. I understand what you were saying in the reference (about the failing your customers etc.) I'm sure there not going to have an answer right on the spot especially if there's a security risk OR glitch that may ruin the economy even more then it already has been. In some cases Alot of us would rather them spend there time trying to fix it rather then spending there time posting on the forums to all the people complaining about it. I do believe you are correct on the statement about how someone would look incompetent for working on it for so long and not have any knowledge to figure it out. Who is to no that they are simply not telling us due to how big the problem is and them not knowing exact how long it would take to fix (hence why only an estimate has been given thus far.)
Honestly, i was telling the people crying they should get off the forums not you. It appears however i have offended you, If i did i apologize. At that note i still stand by what i said, if the game becomes to aggravating due to the company or any other reason you should either
A. Wait and hope it gets better
or
B. Quit.
0
varatrasMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 22Arc User
edited May 2013
The whole purpose of this post was to get some sort of timeframe from the devs. They finally replied and that helps a little bit but their answer leaves me wondering if what little playtime I have nowadays Is worth being spent here. I will say I was having a blast even tho my first character is a GF that is pretty much useless now that he's 60 and in T2 armor and T3 everything else. I've rolled a cleric and its fun but not having an AH working I can't gear the poor sucker.
You in no way offended me I just felt the need to vent and you were the unfortunate victim. Please accept my apology for that but the best course of action in any interaction with people is don't call them dumb. You might just find out that they aren't the hard way.
you are comparing a beta game (neverwinter) to a non beta fail game. Never winter in beta form has bugs (AS ALL BETAS DO HENCE WHY ITS BETA)
I understand that you emphasize the BETA word and the meaning of it however i found it controversial that the PWE official page http://www.perfectworld.com/ debates itself.As you can see the banners above say it is BETA but if you check the marks besides the games title at Neverwinter it clearly says: LIVE where there is different marks for open beta.So as you can see it is not surprising that people are confused.If it possible please do some research before you state something which is not that obvious.
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kstjabMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 17Arc User
The whole purpose of this post was to get some sort of timeframe from the devs. They finally replied and that helps a little bit but their answer leaves me wondering if what little playtime I have nowadays Is worth being spent here. I will say I was having a blast even tho my first character is a GF that is pretty much useless now that he's 60 and in T2 armor and T3 everything else. I've rolled a cleric and its fun but not having an AH working I can't gear the poor sucker.
You in no way offended me I just felt the need to vent and you were the unfortunate victim. Please accept my apology for that but the best course of action in any interaction with people is don't call them dumb. You might just find out that they aren't the hard way.
I understand completely, honestly i wasnt calling you dumb it was the people complaining and making false claims such as "i paid to use the feature of AH" (if you read my quote) I also apologize to you, i did not intend for you to think i was calling you dumb. You were actually one of the only smart people to ask a decent question looking for an answer most of the others that i had quoted weren't exactly truthful witch made me feel as if they were dumb. (or liar's but i feel that lieing on a subject such as that would be too obvious they were lieing.)
I understand that you emphasize the BETA word and the meaning of it however i found it controversial that the PWE official page http://www.perfectworld.com/ debates itself.As you can see the banners above say it is BETA but if you check the marks besides the games title at Neverwinter it clearly says: LIVE where there is different marks for open beta.So as you can see it is not surprising that people are confused.If it possible please do some research before you state something which is not that obvious.
I thank you for this post as i well be reading up a bit about what's goin on, i did not catch the fact the game said live as it has been advertised (recently past few days) as still in beta. It appears this situation on "Beta" and non beta are somewhat foggy at the moment.
I honestly wish there was a rep system here on the Perfect World forum's for helpfull user's.
There are a slight few ive seen that are helpfull where as most just complain.
As you can see the banners above say it is BETA but if you check the marks besides the games title at Neverwinter it clearly says: LIVE where there is different marks for open beta.So as you can see it is not surprising that people are confused.If it possible please do some research before you state something which is not that obvious.
Comments
Well, an update is an update. Thank you
So will you be sending out a thank you addon for the AH downtime? Not trying to be a smart*** but a +3 Auctioneer's Gavel of Smiting would be hilarious
My patience is about gone and as for my understanding it's right there with patience. i just find it difficult to comprehend that you can't figure it out. all you need is in the database right there in front of you. tweek, test, tweek, test. I write databases for a living and if i told one of my clients that i don't know what is wrong after 2 days of working on it i would seem to them like i don't know what the hell i'm doing and would promptly probably be replaced.
I'm truly at the end of what i have in me for a game i had a lot of hope for. My guild and I wish you the best in figuring out your problems and maybe in a year when you figure out the little things like class balance, auction halls, basic grouping mechanics, interface mechanics, etc, this game might be worth investigating further. Until then it's just been a big waste of time for our guild (which include many gaming bloggers and writers for MMO related websites). We will just chalk up to another game that had hope for but got lost in the translation to digital format.
If you saw rage in my post, you're overreacting. A little frustration maybe, but not rage.
I hadn't thought of that workaround and I'll use it. Still, a function so important to the game's economy needs to be brought back up quickly or players need to be given better information about the why or when. Sure we can trade in gold for a few days, but gold is essentially worthless and I have enough of it now from a couple days worth of transactions to buy three characters potions from now until the day they shut down the servers.
pretty much this /thread
I've added the latest info we have to the AD/AH Follow Up FAQ. Very sorry for the wait; we're doing everything we can to bring it up ASAP. Sorry, I know that having a specific time would be favorable to ASAP, but the most we can say at this time is that we are doing everything in our power to expedite the process.
Download any C++ IDE and compile the following sourcecode by yourself
Enjoy
Code:
Post Needs to be removed from thread like the other ones
So....now the following is on Twitter to read:
Neverwinter @NeverwinterGame 58m
AH Update: While we do not have an ETA of when the AH will be available, we do know that it will not be before Thursday, 5/23, Pacific Time.
Muahahaahaha......thats the 5 days then.
Man... you punched yourself IN Da FACE.
Epic.Fail.
Honestly, that was/is the biggest lie iv'e seen in gaming forum history EVER.
Same thing happening here.
Boy, these two games sure are very similar with their problems. Hell, even Kripp thought so too.
PC specs: http://forum.daow.net/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=4#p99
Thank you for your answer.If i understand correctly we only know when it will NOT come back but we still don't when it will am i right?
If that's the case it can be a week after thursday or a month right? (yea i know a month probably exaggeration or..?) I would like say for me the business part was always a big part of any MMO and i can just think i'm not alone with that.It adds another enjoyment for the experience.At the moment the items which i collected for sale are sitting in my mailbox (my bank and bag would be full if use 'em to store those staff).To be honest i don't know how long it can continue,i mean people obviously have different tolerance treshold and messing with that is never a good thing.
Although you guys made advancement by opening the ZEN market it still doesn't change the fact that the market is still frozen and people can't sell or buy staff for AD.MMO without economy can hardly operate or it can operate at all.I'm on the verge when thoughts come up the surface without any basis ( you know when you losing patience and your good ol' conspiracy theorist mind start to come up with silly ideas why it is happening
So please fix the AH as soon as possible,thank you for listening.
IF it was considered accomplished AH would be up by now.
#2 (The bolded part. D3 Is not in beta and still fail's you are comparing a beta game (neverwinter) to a non beta fail game. Never winter in beta form has bugs (AS ALL BETAS DO HENCE WHY ITS BETA
)
There is also zone chat, you no you type /zone (message here)............Surprised you didn't think of that!
I'd rather them fix it then not to fix it.
Wait or quit the game already.
So,
#1 It's unacceptable that, they don't no the exact problem causing the glitch so it's taking longer? Or unacceptable they do not no how long it well take? If either of those are the cases why don't you try coding and then say its easy.
#2, Really you PAID to use the AH, If not you others have? Wow and to think i have been using it free along with many others! I FEEL GIFTED NOW!!!!!!!. No seriously now, you're information is misled please complain somewhere on a different forum where you do not look as stupid as you do now. Thank you!
People these day's are dumb as hell. Get off the forums please!
Thank you!
Most likly yes, they may win it for what they bid, As there is always a risk of that when you put it on the AH for that low.
May i suggest next time putting the starting bid higher so you wont lose as much ad.
I wonder what our admin stuff want to say about it ?
You are very correct, this is true you cannot trade AD but there are various other currencies in the game they could have traded for, Or waited for ah to come back up for that matter.
Patients is a virtue.
As i have stated above, things like this tend to happen in beta games. This is a free to play game after all. I don't believe they can even predict when a problem well occur with any said thing in the game. It is also not there fault that people were abusing glitchs and bugs to make billions of AD off the ah glitch. If anything blame the glitchers as it is down because of them.
As i said note i hate to seem like im bashing alot of people here when i do not intend to. I feel relly bad for the things that have happened to most of these user's. It is just a game after all weather they have put money (zen) into it or not things do happen and it should be expected at least a little bit on a game that is newly released as open beta.
I have tested alot of games and it seems as if more users instantly blame and yell at the creators for trying to fix the mistakes nothing is ever good enough to the common user, that in itself would make this a stressful job.
Why? It's been posted tonight. with video instructions on other websites. For example: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/385608/Neverwinters-Slew-of-Game-Bugs.html
i dont blame anyone i just want not to be a victim of Catastrophy
Oh boy where do I begin with this pile of fail you just typed poorly.
1. You can not sell things via zone for AD. Only avenues to secure AD at the present time is buy zen then convert to AD, dailies from Rhix
2. I just happen to own a business the specializes in data driven websites, point of sale, credit card authorization, and property management systems. All of which are all database dependent. I do happen to know a lot about database coding. I know it's not easy but if the tables were turned and I let my customers down in such a manner, they would no longer be my customers.
What if I told Mandalay Bay Resorts that I don't know why their property management system don't work after 2 days of working on it? I would look incompetent and I'm sure they would replace my system quickly.
As to your end line of the post, I think you should really look in the mirror. As the only dumb person I see here shall remain nameless but won't be to hard for others to figure out. Maybe that person should take your advice and get off the forums.
Thank you!
Lol
Maybe you are correct about alot of what you said (as i am not here to fight these are forums but im up for a debate!) I have already been over the ad thing which you have mentioned there are other currencies of which you can trade for not just AD and as i said you could just wait for the ah to come up and not be so impatient. I understand what you were saying in the reference (about the failing your customers etc.) I'm sure there not going to have an answer right on the spot especially if there's a security risk OR glitch that may ruin the economy even more then it already has been. In some cases Alot of us would rather them spend there time trying to fix it rather then spending there time posting on the forums to all the people complaining about it. I do believe you are correct on the statement about how someone would look incompetent for working on it for so long and not have any knowledge to figure it out. Who is to no that they are simply not telling us due to how big the problem is and them not knowing exact how long it would take to fix (hence why only an estimate has been given thus far.)
Honestly, i was telling the people crying they should get off the forums not you. It appears however i have offended you, If i did i apologize. At that note i still stand by what i said, if the game becomes to aggravating due to the company or any other reason you should either
A. Wait and hope it gets better
or
B. Quit.
You in no way offended me I just felt the need to vent and you were the unfortunate victim. Please accept my apology for that but the best course of action in any interaction with people is don't call them dumb. You might just find out that they aren't the hard way.
I thank you for this post as i well be reading up a bit about what's goin on, i did not catch the fact the game said live as it has been advertised (recently past few days) as still in beta. It appears this situation on "Beta" and non beta are somewhat foggy at the moment.
I honestly wish there was a rep system here on the Perfect World forum's for helpfull user's.
There are a slight few ive seen that are helpfull where as most just complain.
Yeah.. AH SHOO Survivor.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
1- 20, 2- 35, 3- 18, 4- 20 min
Comments to -> the Book Binding
It's a live beta open release. Duh.
Occam's Razor makes the cutting clean.