Blitz - 10,5 sec cd. PotB - 22 sec.
AP generation non stealth: Blitz - 6+% per use(0,57 Ap/sec). PotB - 13+% per use.(0,59 AP/sec)
Ap in stealth with Cunnin Stalker: Blitz - 8%(0,76 ap/s), PotB - 16%(0,73 ap/sec).
So, we have BLITZ VS PotB dmg - in 1st post this topic.
Ap gen - 0,57AP/s blits VS PotB 0,59 AP/s for my gear. non stealth.
Also blitz -instant dmg, PotB need much more time for dmg. but blitz have short cast animation, PotB - instant cast. Also Blitz have more benefit from Dazzling bladeds(-1 sec from 10,5sec=-9,52% cd, -1 sec from 22 sec = -4,54% cd)
In summ we must choice - 0.03ap/s in stealth + MUCH more dmg Blitz) VS PotB + 0,02 Ap/sec non stealth. It's for Execut TR.
In scoundrel build blitz Ap gen higher than PotB becouse we have Action rush(15% get 15% Ap from use encounter, more enc=more AP).
So you just restated what we already knew. Blitz is pretty much better all of the time. Also PotB is NOT an instant cast. In fact it takes longer to cast than blitz. You sort of float up in the air and cast it....takes like 1.5 seconds at least. If you jump to cast blitz it's instant and you don't move backwards.
I don't say nothing about dmg compare. Just test u'r qoute
I have also heard claims that PoB has very high AP regeneration. You could use path of blades from stealth to dish out 25k damage in 4.5 seconds to a target if you wanted to, Blitz does not have that capability.
Blitz have almost same AP gen, or better in some builds.
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mindstaticMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 10Arc User
Would seem sensible since the guide recommends STR and DEX as the most important attributes. I guess you could go STR and CHR if you really wanted, but STR and DEX seems the safest.
Primary Stats
When rolling a character you will have various options for your primary stats. In all cases you will want to maximize your strength and dexterity, and take as much charisma as possible third. The stat priority is the following:
Strength > Dexterity >= Charisma
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mindstaticMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 10Arc User
Would seem sensible since the guide recommends STR and DEX as the most important attributes. I guess you could go STR and CHR if you really wanted, but STR and DEX seems the safest.
Yeah, didn't know if I should put some points on charisma but I guess I'll go full STR and DEX.
This doesn't at all seem like a build for the casual player. It looks like a build for folks that can afford all of the enchantments, ioune stone pet, and has all the right gear.
How effective is this build with someone that just hit 60 and has Battlefield set and a level 15 cleric? Is it still viable? Thanks!
This doesn't at all seem like a build for the casual player. It looks like a build for folks that can afford all of the enchantments, ioune stone pet, and has all the right gear.
I don't really understand the question. The stat priorities and caps are things to aim for, not things you must have to use the spec.
@ascendasz my gear and stats aren't set up perfectly by the guide so they aren't a great example to follow anyway.
I don't really understand the question. The stat priorities and caps are things to aim for, not things you must have to use the spec.
@ascendasz my gear and stats aren't set up perfectly by the guide so they aren't a great example to follow anyway.
Thanks for responding. I think I'm going to give it a try. One thing I noticed is that our feats are almost identical. Our powers on the other hand are quite different.
Yeah, didn't know if I should put some points on charisma but I guess I'll go full STR and DEX.
I pretty much have the same question as this poster but wonder if it make sense to completely ignore Charisma since it (apparently) is roughly equivalent to Dexterity (according to the OP). I started my Half-Orc with 18 Dex, 16 Str, 14 Cha - so my Charisma is relatively low. Would it make the most sense for me to go Str + Cha until my Charisma is higher?
After reroling my TR I started with 18 str 16 dex 12 cha human. Will be 24\22\14 at 60. Before it was 26 dex\19 str\15 cha, so I loose 4% crit and gain 5% dmg. Aiming for 50% crit chance via crit rating increase.
Carnage TR Dragon shard - retired? hell yea it's retired along with Nevewinter
Well...I think it is indeed a good guide for dungeon dps....but for anything else, it's sorely lacking (as the op admitted). I've tried this build from 10-56. Up until the 50's or so...it's been a breeze...then again, leveling a rogue with any build is a breeze.
But in the 50's, this build really struggles because as the op says, there is ZERO survivability with it..it's all about dps...and the fact that it doesn't do much in the way of adds or multi-mobs is a really big challenge in the latter levels.
Also, with pvp, it's just not a good build either (as the op again, admits to).
So while it does do well in dungeon dps (particularly vs bosses and when the rogue is NOT a target of mobs), it's a great build. For for using this build other than what it was intended for, can be a real challenge.
I am going to respec out of this build since I do little dungeon delving and do more solo pve and pvp. This build just isn't working for me.
First off I read the entire 1st post and my brain exploded....
2nd, it seems you back your opinions with math *which i love*
3rd, i'm going to start a TR today. I like this Guild/Build because it seems like it's op for T2 dungs. I don't really care about PVP, I have a GWF for that .
So, Thank you for the guide but my question is...
1. Post Patch, would you or did you change anything on this build? and my 2nd question is
I've been in t2 dungs on my GWF and i've seen a rogue solo the Boss while we were on adds.
2. Can you do that with this build?
Very in-depth, going to read it over again so it can sink in well. I did not read the rest of the 30 something pages though..lol:cool:
The patch didn't really change the build at all. The overall dps went down due to the nerfs, but it didn't actually change anything.
Bosses don't autoattack so no reason you can't solo a boss as any class in the game. Long as you're dodging the AoE's you'll eventually kill the boss. Every class in the game does better dps on a boss when not soloing it, and this spec does not benefit a ton from combat advantage anyway, so it's uniquely suited to soloing bosses.
Thank you, Solsol. I did hear the dps went down but it still seems so much fun to play. Kudos on the guide once again as I will keep looking back at it as I level. I usually don't copy and paste a guide into my toon but until i see something i don't agree w, I will! LOL.
Thanks for the work you've but into your guide, Metzli. I think I remember reading bits and pieces about the following questions, but with 35 pages it's a little hard to keep track of (even with search, of someone referred to something differently or whatnot)--so I have a few questions for clarification's sake. If any of my statements (which are recaps for you to understand the basis of my questions) are inaccurate, please correct me.
1) Armor penetration is clearly the bee's knees. 100 armor penetration = ~1% resistance ignored up until around 2400 armor penetration, when we start getting diminishing returns. So who has 24% damage resistance? All mobs? Bosses only? Not that it's important, but if there's a difference between trash and boss damage resistance percentages, what are there respective resistances? Or are the diminished returns due to something else?
2) If a mob's damage resistance is reduced to 0, will Wicked Reminder lower damage resistance past 0? Will it lower it all the way to -25%?
3) You noted that Swashbuckler's is the best T2 set. For those of us below 8300 gear score, is there a clearly correct choice when it comes to T1 or would we be better off mixing and matching non-set gear to maintain as much offensive stats (particularly armor penetration) as we can?
Thanks for the work you've but into your guide, Metzli. I think I remember reading bits and pieces about the following questions, but with 35 pages it's a little hard to keep track of (even with search, of someone referred to something differently or whatnot)--so I have a few questions for clarification's sake. If any of my statements (which are recaps for you to understand the basis of my questions) are inaccurate, please correct me.
1) Armor penetration is clearly the bee's knees. 100 armor penetration = ~1% resistance ignored up until around 2400 armor penetration, when we start getting diminishing returns. So who has 24% damage resistance? All mobs? Bosses only? Not that it's important, but if there's a difference between trash and boss damage resistance percentages, what are there respective resistances? Or are the diminished returns due to something else?
2) If a mob's damage resistance is reduced to 0, will Wicked Reminder lower damage resistance past 0? Will it lower it all the way to -25%?
3) You noted that Swashbuckler's is the best T2 set. For those of us below 8300 gear score, is there a clearly correct choice when it comes to T1 or would we be better off mixing and matching non-set gear to maintain as much offensive stats (particularly armor penetration) as we can?
Thanks!
1) 100 armor pen is = ~ 1% resistance ignored up until mid 2200s. I'm at 2470 it is providing me 23.6 armor pen. Elite mob is 22%, while bosses are at 24%. Ranged Adds are around 10-12% resistance. Diminishing returns happens to armor pen around 2200s.
2) despite you can penetrate 24% more to bosses wicked reminder lowers the boss's defense. I'm pretty sure theres a difference between armor penetration and lowering defense(wicked reminder/GWF Debuffs/Plaguefire)
3) For the Trickster Rogues below 8300, My best recommendation is obtain a decent T2 dagger(Master Assassin dagger of the drake is not that bad to start off with) enchant it with lesser Plaguefire, and using either full set of t1 or 2 sets of t1 or full set of PVP(it starts with armor pen) from here you want to work on getting rank 5 dark enchants which are fairly cheap, so to answer your question yes try to keep as much armor pen as you can without giving up too much of other stats, i.e. Minor Slavemaster's ring of control +142Pow/Crit/Rec vs minor beserker ring of cleaving +133Power/AP/Lifesteal... take the slavemasters, its providing better stats, and just slap on a rank 4/5 dark on it for the time being. T2s will progressively become accessible as your gear score gets higher and getting into a decent guild.
Nevermore@meeggtoast 12.2 BiS TR Lanaya@meeggtoast 13.4 BiS GWF Shendelzare@meeggtoast 11.2k CN mule CW
Your forgetting that rogues have much higher crit than GFs and MUCH lower weapon damage. So of course the Vorpal is much better for rogues...
Also I dont know if this will make a difference but the target dummies dont have any DR... So that may also make a difference on the DPS boosts of GPF versus Vorpal also. A quick math will show that if you have 25% crit, a regular vorpal will add only slightly more than a 6% DPS boost, while greater on a GF will add more than that....
A greater Vorpal adds 9.5% with that same equation (which is around what the GPF is) so it appears to be CLOSE to a wash FOR GFs... For higher crit classes the vorpal is a much bigger difference...
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fimconteMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Your forgetting that rogues have much higher crit than GFs and MUCH lower weapon damage. So of course the Vorpal is much better for rogues...
Also I dont know if this will make a difference but the target dummies dont have any DR... So that may also make a difference on the DPS boosts of GPF versus Vorpal also. A quick math will show that if you have 25% crit, a regular vorpal will add only slightly more than a 6% DPS boost, while greater on a GF will add more than that....
A greater Vorpal adds 9.5% with that same equation (which is around what the GPF is) so it appears to be CLOSE to a wash FOR GFs... For higher crit classes the vorpal is a much bigger difference...
Wrong thread?
And yes, GPF is probably better for GFs. Unless you can get your crit up higher with 2 TRs in party / CWs / Timeless, etc.
Fans Glory to the Gladiators,
Gods Glory to the Heroes.
atm i got the following stats:
4,8k power / 3,9k crit (51,3% crit chance) / 2,4k arpen / 1,7k recovery
runnin a greater vorpal + 4/4 swashbuckling.
got all rank 8 enchantments, except the necklace, in necklace i got rank 7 dark enchantment, so now i dont rly know what to exchange that rank7 dark enchantment for. i dont think that getting a rank8 dark in there is worth it at all (2,4k arpen should be cap for bosses).
on the other hand i think i should be fine with my crit and recovery rating as well, so just exchange that dark enchantment for a radiant ? what would u guys do in my situation?
After this recovery may be better than power to a certain point, but definitely less than 2900. After 2900, recovery loses value at a rate of ~3% per 200.
Once you have reached all of these goals, just stack as much power as you can.
Does that answer your problem?
Nevermore@meeggtoast 12.2 BiS TR Lanaya@meeggtoast 13.4 BiS GWF Shendelzare@meeggtoast 11.2k CN mule CW
rlockwood1Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 3Arc User
edited July 2013
This is a great guide except for the companion part. You do NOT gain an additional 9% from the eldritch stone. I've tested this and it changes nothing on the character sheet when I equip an eldritch stone on my stone.
This is a great guide except for the companion part. You do NOT gain an additional 9% from the eldritch stone. I've tested this and it changes nothing on the character sheet when I equip an eldritch stone on my stone.
You do gain the % bonus from eldritch. im benefiting 1254 armor pen(from stone's tooltip) from my stone however when i summon my stone/dismiss im losing 1360 armor pen... jee i wonder why.
Nevermore@meeggtoast 12.2 BiS TR Lanaya@meeggtoast 13.4 BiS GWF Shendelzare@meeggtoast 11.2k CN mule CW
I feel like it's better to have combat advantage so when you activate lurkers you can nuke, rather than faster AP restore. Preferance thing though I guess. Thoughts?
atm i got the following stats:
4,8k power / 3,9k crit (51,3% crit chance) / 2,4k arpen / 1,7k recovery
runnin a greater vorpal + 4/4 swashbuckling.
got all rank 8 enchantments, except the necklace, in necklace i got rank 7 dark enchantment, so now i dont rly know what to exchange that rank7 dark enchantment for. i dont think that getting a rank8 dark in there is worth it at all (2,4k arpen should be cap for bosses).
on the other hand i think i should be fine with my crit and recovery rating as well, so just exchange that dark enchantment for a radiant ? what would u guys do in my situation?
Those are great stats and you have solid equipment, I'm a little envious!
Put in as high a silvery as you can, I've had great returns on recovery.
The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.
Comments
On my soundrel rogue i have
Blitz - 10,5 sec cd. PotB - 22 sec.
AP generation non stealth: Blitz - 6+% per use(0,57 Ap/sec). PotB - 13+% per use.(0,59 AP/sec)
Ap in stealth with Cunnin Stalker: Blitz - 8%(0,76 ap/s), PotB - 16%(0,73 ap/sec).
So, we have BLITZ VS PotB dmg - in 1st post this topic.
Ap gen - 0,57AP/s blits VS PotB 0,59 AP/s for my gear. non stealth.
Also blitz -instant dmg, PotB need much more time for dmg. but blitz have short cast animation, PotB - instant cast. Also Blitz have more benefit from Dazzling bladeds(-1 sec from 10,5sec=-9,52% cd, -1 sec from 22 sec = -4,54% cd)
In summ we must choice - 0.03ap/s in stealth + MUCH more dmg Blitz) VS PotB + 0,02 Ap/sec non stealth. It's for Execut TR.
In scoundrel build blitz Ap gen higher than PotB becouse we have Action rush(15% get 15% Ap from use encounter, more enc=more AP).
You can also see a better formatted version of the guide here.
Would seem sensible since the guide recommends STR and DEX as the most important attributes. I guess you could go STR and CHR if you really wanted, but STR and DEX seems the safest.
Yeah, didn't know if I should put some points on charisma but I guess I'll go full STR and DEX.
How effective is this build with someone that just hit 60 and has Battlefield set and a level 15 cleric? Is it still viable? Thanks!
I don't really understand the question. The stat priorities and caps are things to aim for, not things you must have to use the spec.
@ascendasz my gear and stats aren't set up perfectly by the guide so they aren't a great example to follow anyway.
You can also see a better formatted version of the guide here.
Thanks for responding. I think I'm going to give it a try. One thing I noticed is that our feats are almost identical. Our powers on the other hand are quite different.
I pretty much have the same question as this poster but wonder if it make sense to completely ignore Charisma since it (apparently) is roughly equivalent to Dexterity (according to the OP). I started my Half-Orc with 18 Dex, 16 Str, 14 Cha - so my Charisma is relatively low. Would it make the most sense for me to go Str + Cha until my Charisma is higher?
Thanks for any help.
Seze - Rogue - Necropolis -
But in the 50's, this build really struggles because as the op says, there is ZERO survivability with it..it's all about dps...and the fact that it doesn't do much in the way of adds or multi-mobs is a really big challenge in the latter levels.
Also, with pvp, it's just not a good build either (as the op again, admits to).
So while it does do well in dungeon dps (particularly vs bosses and when the rogue is NOT a target of mobs), it's a great build. For for using this build other than what it was intended for, can be a real challenge.
I am going to respec out of this build since I do little dungeon delving and do more solo pve and pvp. This build just isn't working for me.
I appreciate the build nonetheless.
check out the "Racials" section at first post, maybe it helps
2nd, it seems you back your opinions with math *which i love*
3rd, i'm going to start a TR today. I like this Guild/Build because it seems like it's op for T2 dungs. I don't really care about PVP, I have a GWF for that
So, Thank you for the guide but my question is...
1. Post Patch, would you or did you change anything on this build? and my 2nd question is
I've been in t2 dungs on my GWF and i've seen a rogue solo the Boss while we were on adds.
2. Can you do that with this build?
Very in-depth, going to read it over again so it can sink in well. I did not read the rest of the 30 something pages though..lol:cool:
Bosses don't autoattack so no reason you can't solo a boss as any class in the game. Long as you're dodging the AoE's you'll eventually kill the boss. Every class in the game does better dps on a boss when not soloing it, and this spec does not benefit a ton from combat advantage anyway, so it's uniquely suited to soloing bosses.
You can also see a better formatted version of the guide here.
Thanks for the work you've but into your guide, Metzli. I think I remember reading bits and pieces about the following questions, but with 35 pages it's a little hard to keep track of (even with search, of someone referred to something differently or whatnot)--so I have a few questions for clarification's sake. If any of my statements (which are recaps for you to understand the basis of my questions) are inaccurate, please correct me.
1) Armor penetration is clearly the bee's knees. 100 armor penetration = ~1% resistance ignored up until around 2400 armor penetration, when we start getting diminishing returns. So who has 24% damage resistance? All mobs? Bosses only? Not that it's important, but if there's a difference between trash and boss damage resistance percentages, what are there respective resistances? Or are the diminished returns due to something else?
2) If a mob's damage resistance is reduced to 0, will Wicked Reminder lower damage resistance past 0? Will it lower it all the way to -25%?
3) You noted that Swashbuckler's is the best T2 set. For those of us below 8300 gear score, is there a clearly correct choice when it comes to T1 or would we be better off mixing and matching non-set gear to maintain as much offensive stats (particularly armor penetration) as we can?
Thanks!
1) 100 armor pen is = ~ 1% resistance ignored up until mid 2200s. I'm at 2470 it is providing me 23.6 armor pen. Elite mob is 22%, while bosses are at 24%. Ranged Adds are around 10-12% resistance. Diminishing returns happens to armor pen around 2200s.
2) despite you can penetrate 24% more to bosses wicked reminder lowers the boss's defense. I'm pretty sure theres a difference between armor penetration and lowering defense(wicked reminder/GWF Debuffs/Plaguefire)
3) For the Trickster Rogues below 8300, My best recommendation is obtain a decent T2 dagger(Master Assassin dagger of the drake is not that bad to start off with) enchant it with lesser Plaguefire, and using either full set of t1 or 2 sets of t1 or full set of PVP(it starts with armor pen) from here you want to work on getting rank 5 dark enchants which are fairly cheap, so to answer your question yes try to keep as much armor pen as you can without giving up too much of other stats, i.e. Minor Slavemaster's ring of control +142Pow/Crit/Rec vs minor beserker ring of cleaving +133Power/AP/Lifesteal... take the slavemasters, its providing better stats, and just slap on a rank 4/5 dark on it for the time being. T2s will progressively become accessible as your gear score gets higher and getting into a decent guild.
Lanaya@meeggtoast 13.4 BiS GWF
Shendelzare@meeggtoast 11.2k CN mule CW
Server: Dragon
Stream: meeggtoast
Guide: Meeggtoast's Destroyer Dps Guide
Also I dont know if this will make a difference but the target dummies dont have any DR... So that may also make a difference on the DPS boosts of GPF versus Vorpal also. A quick math will show that if you have 25% crit, a regular vorpal will add only slightly more than a 6% DPS boost, while greater on a GF will add more than that....
A greater Vorpal adds 9.5% with that same equation (which is around what the GPF is) so it appears to be CLOSE to a wash FOR GFs... For higher crit classes the vorpal is a much bigger difference...
Wrong thread?
And yes, GPF is probably better for GFs. Unless you can get your crit up higher with 2 TRs in party / CWs / Timeless, etc.
Gods Glory to the Heroes.
TR:Anirul Corrino@Fimconte
GF:Irulan Corrino@Fimconte
atm i got the following stats:
4,8k power / 3,9k crit (51,3% crit chance) / 2,4k arpen / 1,7k recovery
runnin a greater vorpal + 4/4 swashbuckling.
got all rank 8 enchantments, except the necklace, in necklace i got rank 7 dark enchantment, so now i dont rly know what to exchange that rank7 dark enchantment for. i dont think that getting a rank8 dark in there is worth it at all (2,4k arpen should be cap for bosses).
on the other hand i think i should be fine with my crit and recovery rating as well, so just exchange that dark enchantment for a radiant ? what would u guys do in my situation?
Does that answer your problem?
Lanaya@meeggtoast 13.4 BiS GWF
Shendelzare@meeggtoast 11.2k CN mule CW
Server: Dragon
Stream: meeggtoast
Guide: Meeggtoast's Destroyer Dps Guide
You do gain the % bonus from eldritch. im benefiting 1254 armor pen(from stone's tooltip) from my stone however when i summon my stone/dismiss im losing 1360 armor pen... jee i wonder why.
Lanaya@meeggtoast 13.4 BiS GWF
Shendelzare@meeggtoast 11.2k CN mule CW
Server: Dragon
Stream: meeggtoast
Guide: Meeggtoast's Destroyer Dps Guide
http://guidescroll.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Feats.jpg
I feel like it's better to have combat advantage so when you activate lurkers you can nuke, rather than faster AP restore. Preferance thing though I guess. Thoughts?
Those are great stats and you have solid equipment, I'm a little envious!
Put in as high a silvery as you can, I've had great returns on recovery.