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Dev Journal: Monetization in Neverwinter
cmpinpointerror
Member, Moonstars, Neverwinter Beta Users, Cryptic Developers, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Founder's Pack Users Posts: 646Cryptic Developers ›
Read more about our ideas and plans on monetization in Neverwinter on MMORPG.com.
"Get Everything You Want by Playing": http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/634/feature/7129/Neverwinter-Get-Everything-You-Want-By-Playing.html
What do you think? Leave us a comment.
"Get Everything You Want by Playing": http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/634/feature/7129/Neverwinter-Get-Everything-You-Want-By-Playing.html
What do you think? Leave us a comment.
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Another thing, Jack said "started the countdown to Cryptic Studios' fourth MMORPG, Neverwinter.". Release date incoming?!?!?!?
Hopefully the markets won't be as flooded as I imagine they will be and that NWO does not follow the path D3 did on it's AH (which is a failure at best).
Hopefully with the "currency" you will just be able to buy cosmetic and other "not effecting the game balance" material like mounts, animations and such.
If so, the players who are willing to drop big bucks can get OP gear like crazy by just selling Zen.
I appreciate that everything can be gotten for free in NW, and I hope it works out, but Dollars to Diamonds to Gold completely imbalanced Runes of Magic's economy, putting hardcore gear utterly out of reach - unless you shelled out real money.
I would hope, instead, that you somehow make sure that the NW economy isn't whacked out by the Cash Shop. I really dislike it when that happens.
Still, I hope it works out for you guys. Good luck!
There is a limit on how much refined ADs will be available. Although player will be able to earn a lot of AD per day, those ADs are "raw". They have to be refined into useable currency. And there is a limit on how much a character can refine per day. And you have to log in every day to be able to refine your daily limit.
So that means players could drop a lot of Zen on the AD (I keep wanted to type AD&D
So is this quote from the mmorpg article for real ? If you really started a countdown (to release ???) then wouldn't it be time to throw us a bone regarding the release date ?
That still suggest that the economy will be massive and "broken" at some point since the supply is slow, but still infinite. It will grow day by day until it's just pocket money you have to use.
Although I don't see this really as player problem (unless you are trying to make ingame profit of it) if the items are just cosmetics, but rather that the gamemakers are shooting up their own leg if it is they who are trying to profit from this system somehow.
Again it depends on the content that is on sale. Would like a clearer answer for this from the makers themselves before I really judge this system.
As others have mentioned as well if it is indeed needed for endgame gear as it is in STO then the game does take a bit more of a p2w aspect as people can sell their zen for refined diamonds on top of their daily refining limit, thereby making more than the daily limit allows for everyone else who doesn't dish out the $$.
I went back to STO when I saw the 3rd Anniversary stuff and was starting to have a lot of fun with it again but soon as I saw the new reputation system and how refined dilithium was required to buy everything I quit rather quick. THe problem is I log in, I get my daily dilithium/diamonds refined and then what? I'm literally unable to progress my character at all until I wait for my daily timer to reset so I don't even bother playing anymore
If however its only used for converting to Zen or only buying vanity stuff ingame even then cool deal, no problem. Having it required for all the endgame gear though is not cool at all, I really don't want a time restriction placed on my gameplay
So the astral diamond gear will not unbalance the game and the only stuff available on the cash shop was some quality of life stuff, Xp boosts you can buy some companions(which you get for free at level 16) dye and costume items.
For anyone that has some really burning questions from a beta weekend player feel free to PM me and I will answer your questions!
Everything sold needs to not provide any power (such as cosmetics or housing) in order for a game to have zero Pay to Win. But, I think a small degree is tolerable. So long as the stuff sold is basically newbie gear, that is gotten without much trouble, it's not all that much of a problem.
Putting high-end gear in the astral diamonds store, for any amount, would not be tolerable to me.
edit: also, permitting exchange of Zen for AD, and use of AD on the AH implies that all auctionable gear is inherently pay for power. So, hopefully, all the high-end gear will bound, at least to account.
What are you going to buy? Especially considering the best drops are dungeon drops and not transferable.
So man ypeople forget this notion when considering that argument. Basically you get a guy who has alot of in game gold and use it to buy stuff with little to no meaning in the grand scheme of things. It's not as if you can use real life money to buy that +9 Vorpal Sword.
Character is what a man is in the dark
However, if the best gear is gated behind an artificial time sink, by artificial I mean daily refining of RAD, I will be disappointed.
Grinding dungeons for gear isn't artificial to me.
If this truly is the case at top level then cool deal, no problem with the AD system at all. The thing is with other Cryptic games such as STO this was not the case at all. All of the multiple tiers of good and best gear at top level required a minimum of 15k Dilithium to purchase. That meant you could farm dungeons and raids all day long if you wanted but you still could only get 1 upgrade every 2 days (some even longer than that). Farming dungeons/raids themselves got you nothing near as good as all of the gear purchased with Dilithium via the rep system.
Again I hope to god you're right and all the gear is obtained as drops from dungeons/raids rather than from vendors for astral diamonds like their other games and astral diamonds will actually be only for vanity and fluff items as it should be. If true I've got no problem with it and indeed will celebrate one of the best f2p models out there. Hopefully we can get some confirmation on this sometime soon since I imagine the beta weekends don't give a very good idea of what endgame systems will be like as of yet.
I'd imagine they will have something similar to STO's Fleet Advancement and Personal Reputation systems, which are pretty grindtastic.
I don't care about P2W in the sense that I'm cooperative, not competitive. I don't care if 3Lm1n5t3r bought all his super gear with real money or farmed it with AD. All I care is that he knows his character and play it properly in game, and that he behaves as a civilized person and not some HAMSTER throwing chimp. Why? Because in the end, it doesn't matter how he obtained it. Some people devote more time than others, the same as some start playing the game sooner than others, some cannot play as much time but must try to keep the pace with others...
I play to have fun and having people getting gear by extra game means is irrelevant to me. Even if I dared to PvP (which is no worries to me because I suck at it anyway, so I don't play PvP to not waste other's people time). What I care is if the game is solid and fun. I do concede that for PvP, some consideration about the gear is needed when talking of the store. In any case, as I have already said in many forums through the years, PvP ruins PvE so... who worries about the bad impact of PvP in my PvE gameplay? ("Nerf this!", "Now nerf that!")
The most important part to me anyways, and that would have seem common sense since Pong, is that you really need a good game no matter the payment model. If your game sucks, having everything for free (not even a store) won't save it. Having a good game (I liked the beta weekend stuff but it's obviously in need of some more works in different areas) and offering everything basic (races, classes, stuff for Foundry) for free and having only to pay money (if you choose to do so) in the store for cosmetic stuff, special but balanced companions... and maybe some stuff of low impact in game, is the way to go as I see it.
And even then, circumstances may tank your game ("Massive solar flare sinking the developed countries in chaos for a few years!!"). But at least you took all the needed controllable steps to avoid such thing. Hmm That reminds me, send the marketing team to level up. Really. "Drow only for founders?" comes to mind as example of something that could have been greatly avoided.
Recruitment is CLOSED!!
In both Champions and Star Trek Online you can earn as many of their equivalent to the astral diamonds as you want but you have to "refine" them to actually use them and you have a refine limit of 8,000 a day. I figure NW will work the same.
What bugs me is that STO got mentioned, and even CoH got a small mention.. but nothing about CO. This seems to be a trend when Devs talk about Cryptic games, it's like Co doesn't exist >.>
Here we are now going to the West Side
Weapons in hand as we go for a ride
Some may come and some may stay
Watching out for a sunny day
Where there's love and darkness and my sidearm
In game as @forgemccain
A leader of The Blackwatch Defenders
There is still the worry of them putting AD currency for cash store. Or that you can buy stuff from AH in cash (or swap cash into currency anyway around).
It would not be direct P2W gaming then, but there is a possibility to use cash for ingame credit if somebody puts something worth buying in AH.
Diablo 3 did this and they have admitted that it was a total failure.
I just keep hoping developers know what they are doing, since they have been giving assurance that they learned what has been wrong with other F2P games and "real money" shops.
CO got mentioned.
PvP won't be worth participating in if players can out-gear each other just by throwing money at the system.
That was the impression i got from reading posts on here but in game i got no where near my limit on daily refinement yet stopped getting them from praying, i will watch this more closely next beta. Thanks for answering
Recruitment is CLOSED!!
Even if there are limits placed on how much AD a player can get by selling Zen, the time limit thing is still a huge setback. STO grew really old really fast when I found that I could only really spend an hr each day accomplishing anything and any gameplay after that wasn't. Sure theres a lot more to playing a game than progression but once you've seen all the content and such multiple times you don't really have much ambition to do something for the 100th+ time if your not accomplishing anything by doing so.
Either way we still don't know all the details of how everythings going to work out and they have repeatedly said they have learned their lessons from their past games so we can only hope things work out for the best with Neverwinter
But.... let's not kid ourselves..
Astral Diamonds can be earned by playing the game.
Very large amounts can be converted to a much smaller amount of Zen.. Which SOMEONE has to pay for...The Zen aren't being traded by Cryptic or PWE.. they are traded by players that have already paid $$ for them. Each unit of Zen is real money that has been paid to PWE, just not perhaps by the player that ultimately spends it.
Now with this handful of Zen a player might have enough to purchase a....KEY
A key that will open a container, that MIGHT have the item the player wants.....
A gamblebag/lockbox means you are very unlikely to understand the true cost of the purchased item. $60 or more for a cool looking cloak or whatever have you.
Yes.. you can play enough to eventually get that cloak.. provided that OTHER people pay for enough Zen and are willing to trade that zen to get Astral Diamonds.
The reality of it however is that most people will either pay through the nose on their own to get the item.. or will simply do without, and allow the game to be supported by the more impulsive, or eagerly tricked, members of the playerbase.
It's predatory I'm sorry to say, plays on peoples weakness for gambling (only one more dollar and I could get it.. I've already spent ten and gotten junk.. what difference is one more?)
PWE and Cryptic NEED to make money. I want them to make money and to continue to support the games we like to play (I'm talking about you Champions Online). But creating complicated, confusing, and predatory monetizing systems that lead and trick people into paying money is not something PWE or Cryptic should be proud of.
The references to STO left me discouraged by the LACK of references to Champions Online, but not at all surprised.
That may be true w/o some other AD sinks. With the Fleet (i.e. guild) Base Progression System and their new Faction Reputation System, I think that there will be sufficient Astral Diamond sinks that will be added to the game. To advance in those systems, they take a number of different inputs Dilithium (aka STO Astral Diamonds), Commodities which are likes like food, medicine, and the like which are used in other areas of the game. They are a STO Gold sink. And other inputs whici don't have any counterparts in NW. These projects each your Fleet (Guild) XP in certain areas which unlocks new things that you can do in your Fleet Base (Guild House): E-mail, Bank, Tailor, special fleet stores with Fleet Gear. Higher Tiers unlock more and better stuff. It requires the resources of a lot of player. They amounts are geared towards a Fleet Size of 25.
The Reputation system is a max level lateral leveling system. It's works similarly to the Fleet BAse system where you earn a currency for doing mission for/against a faction. The Rep system has projects which have the faction current, and other inputs which earn Rep points. And upon reaching ceratin tiers, you earn some new passive abilities/buffs and unlock being able to purchase or create higher end gear. Many of which required Dilithium (Astral Diamonds).
We may know see these system at game launch. But I have no doubt that Cryptic will have sufficient Astral Diamond sinks which players will be paying into.
There will no doubt be better gear at the high end. Cryptic engine allows for Geat Sets which give additional ablities for having 2+ pieces of the gear set slotted. A Trickster Rogue set might be Armor, 2 Dirks, and a Belt. 2 Pieces of the set may give a bonus to Deflection, 3 pieces might give give +3 Dex and +1 Str, 4 pieces may give a +25% to Stealth duration. And the stats for each pieces of gear will be as good as or better than drops.
What competition?
I hope people understand this is a role playing game, not an e-peen stroker.
There is no ego contest in Neverwinter Nights or Skyrim, why should there be one here?
Even for PvP, I hope people play for the fun of all, not to humiliate other players. Winning is not the point, having fun is!