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Official M16: Paladin Feedback

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  • hagbard#9047 hagbard Posts: 31Member Arc User
    after the new patch, i did a few test on preview. my lvl80 tank paladin got down really fast on the HE's in barovia. i can solo them on live, it takes a few minutes but i can do it and never lose all my HP after a few hits from this HE mobs.

    So my question, is the scaling WAI on all the low lvl areas after your character is lvl80?
  • benyrbenyr Posts: 140Member Arc User
    Ok i am now officially concerned, was that the last or the penultimate patch before we go live? I've tried to remain positive on theses forums pointing out both what i do and don't like, and trying to look at the situation through the eyes of a Dev rather than just through the eyes of an OP player, but this latest patch just feels like a another step backwards and takes us back to a scenario not too far away from the horror show that first hit preview.

    I've just tried to solo a small HE in the Riverdistrict, something even my lowest level toons have been able to do for an age on live, and in my opinion for game enjoyment and progress is something that its important to be able to solo. My 22k IL Level 80 OP got killed during the first wave.

    I don't have the language to express how disillusioned I am right now. @asterdahl is this working as intended? I'm sorry i've avoided any declarations as to how I will react to Mod 16 up to now, but if this goes live i'm done. I don't know if you have access to records on my interaction on this game to look at the countless hours of spent playing it, and more importantly to you the £1000's per year I have spent on it. I spent that money willingly, as this was my hobby that i enjoyed and i thought it was important to contribute to its upkeep. I didn't need to spend the money, and as a Mastercrafter with all skills maxed out i can make more than enough AD in game, but i chose to in order to show my appreciation. Just in order to clear the AD I was buying I ended up doing things like collecting legendary mounts ( I have 15), so that's an indication of my financial contribution to the game to date, you may also find if you look on my records you guys have in the past shipped me nice little token gifts half way across the globe to thank me for my custom, which was a really nice customer service touch, but suggest to me my financial activity was registering somewhere?

    I'm not calling for my money back, I view it as subscription, much like when i used to play football I paid an annual membership fee, and when I got too old to play I didn't demand my money back, i simply stopped paying and playing. And that's where I am with this game, as things stand when Mod 16 drops it will cease to be an enjoyable hobby so I'll stop paying and playing.

    Genuinely gutted.
  • obsidiancran3obsidiancran3 Posts: 1,823Member Arc User
    I haven’t looked at levelling in detail yet this week. (It’s been a busy day.)

    However my experience from doing HEs in Undermountain makes me believe that scaling is still broken.

    Best way to test characters without hitting broken scaling is to level through the campaign and run expeditions, without a Rune.

    It’s the only level 80 specific, non-scaled content that I can find that exists. Everything else in the game seems to have some type of scaling. Which means the scaling system is affecting everything else and contributes to negative experience.

    It’s why in other threads I have suggested they remove it totally from Mod 16 and work on it more and present us with a working system, instead of the current game breaking one.
    Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin
    Obsidian Oath - Warlock
    A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
  • skrewfaz3d#1482 skrewfaz3d Posts: 48Member Arc User
    Radiant Charge has changed into Radiant tickle. Good job dummies.
  • skrewfaz3d#1482 skrewfaz3d Posts: 48Member Arc User
    I did test a little last week too. I liked the feel last week. However, my "testing" is basically heroics/expeditions. The difference I was experiencing may be related to what obsidian posted in expeditions about there being two different types. You're saying Radiant Charge wasn't more than 600 magnitude before? If I'm wrong my bad lol but I swear it was more than that.
  • emilemoemilemo Posts: 1,718Member Arc User

    I did test a little last week too. I liked the feel last week. However, my "testing" is basically heroics/expeditions. The difference I was experiencing may be related to what obsidian posted in expeditions about there being two different types. You're saying Radiant Charge wasn't more than 600 magnitude before? If I'm wrong my bad lol but I swear it was more than that.

    Radiant Charge was indeed stronger and Bane used to be 600 mag. They reduced all mags across all classes awhile back. That being said what i am noticing now is a major stat drop /Power, Arm Pen, Def, Crit...all of them are down by at least 10 000/ compared to the previous patch. However without a dev input there is no way to tell if the higher stats last patch were a bug or if the lower stats this patch are wai..
    Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream.
    Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
  • obsidiancran3obsidiancran3 Posts: 1,823Member Arc User
    @emilemo Did you change pet?

    I might have a small down shift in Power, but its less than 10k if there is one. Other stats seem to be the same.

    @skrewfaz3d#1482 you have to be very careful with Radiant Charge, if you blink before the AP is drained it doesn't actually do anything. This includes any CC of any sort being imposed on you between activating it and the AP drain coming into effect. Good thing. you don't waste AP, bad thing, the power often just fails to activate.

    I've now done a pass through all the dungeons and Barovia for the effect on stats and...

    @asterdahl I'm concerned about the HP reduction that happens in dungeons and lower level zones and how that impacts on the shield abilities of tanks. Currently I see the following tiers in Dungeons:
    T1: SoT, KR, MC, VT, LoL.
    T2: ToS, CC, GWD, CN
    T3: mSP, FBI, ToNG, and CR

    I didn't check the skrimishes but I expect the same patterns will emerge. Each one of these has the same stats for every dungeon in those tiers. So you get scaled to the same stats for mSP as you do for CR. The recommended iL for those 2 dungeons is 2k apart, and that makes a pretty big difference in stats and expected gear performance.

    Its hard to tell how this is working exactly from the outside, but I'm concerned Tank HP is being scaled to aggressively for this content, given the way our HP works. In KR for example I find the first mob cuts through my shields incredibly quickly, to the point that they are largely irrelevant.

    Some of these dungeons feel "doable" in parties, some of them seem like they are going to be incredibly hard even in parties, all because the key feature of tanking, HP, is going to be nerfed every time we enter them.
    Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin
    Obsidian Oath - Warlock
    A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
  • emilemoemilemo Posts: 1,718Member Arc User
    No pet change. Im using a legendary aug on preview all the time
    Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream.
    Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
  • obsidiancran3obsidiancran3 Posts: 1,823Member Arc User
    edited April 13
    Maybe because you’re well above me in iL you are seeing a bigger change, but Augments did get a down turn in effect, the gap between them and other pets is smaller. At this point other pets either just need more damage or to give more stats otherwise we are in danger of making Augments ineffective again.
    Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin
    Obsidian Oath - Warlock
    A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
  • benyrbenyr Posts: 140Member Arc User
    i have to agree with @emilemo, a short while ago i reported a bug on this forum where my stats dropped massively on entering combat and only returned when i completely changed pet. Now i'm stuck with the reduced stats regardless of what I do, I also now don't know if this is as intended and the increased stats were an error or vice versa.

    I hope its the latter, as my patience is out and i'm not interested in ploughing through solo content at the reduced speed the former causes.
  • emilemoemilemo Posts: 1,718Member Arc User
    edited April 13
    Dungeons and overall group pve

    The Justicar Block depletes way too fast in scaled content/ WAY TOO FAST/. I just did Castle Never and finally no more 1shots by the demons on the bridge yet even the smallest zombies could break my Block in moments. Is our Block too weak thanks to it being based on our HP or are mobs still hitting too hard? Who the F knows. This is definitely not good. Why are Paladins going thru the same troubles GFs had back in the day with Block breaking too easily? You devs should know by know how to code a freakin Block on a tank. Should we stick to only the new post lvl 70 content once m16 goes Live? Because, you know everything that involves scaling will be imbalanced?



    Fix the damned classes and scaling, you barely have any time left.
    Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream.
    Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
  • fenrir4lifefenrir4life Posts: 295Member Arc User
    emilemo said:

    Dungeons and overall group pve

    The Justicar Block depletes way too fast in scaled content/ WAY TOO FAST/. I just did Castle Never and finally no more 1shots by the demons on the bridge yet even the smallest zombies could break my Block in moments. Is our Block too weak thanks to it being based on our HP or are mobs still hitting too hard? Who the F knows. This is definitely not good. Why are Paladins going thru the same troubles GFs had back in the day with Block breaking too easily? You devs should know by know how to code a freakin Block on a tank. Should we stick to only the new post lvl 70 content once m16 goes Live? Because, you know everything that involves scaling will be imbalanced?



    Fix the damned classes and scaling, you barely have any time left.

    We're testing over in Fighterland to confirm, but for at least a couple of patches, our damage reduction from Defense was not applying to Blocked attacks. That may be what's going on, here
  • obsidiancran3obsidiancran3 Posts: 1,823Member Arc User
    Could simply be that the hamsters have eaten our defence and HP in the scaling as well.

    You get the same stats for CN as you get for ToS but the enemies are clearly not equal.
    Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin
    Obsidian Oath - Warlock
    A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
  • gonzothegreat198gonzothegreat198 Posts: 10Member Arc User
    What I think is very telling is the lack of ANY kind of acknowledgement from any of the devs about the issue raised. The last thing we heard was a hey I'm not dead post, and then silence. These guys could really work on their communication when it comes to stuff like this.
  • autumnwitchautumnwitch Posts: 304Member Arc User

    What I think is very telling is the lack of ANY kind of acknowledgement from any of the devs about the issue raised. The last thing we heard was a hey I'm not dead post, and then silence. These guys could really work on their communication when it comes to stuff like this.

    They are at crunch. I don't doubt they are paying attention to us but they simply don't have time to engage at this point.
    Aeywnn - HR
    Ashryne - GF
    Anais - HR
    Red Jenny - SW
    Wintyr - DC
    Sillvi - HR
    Niri - CW

    Boudica's Sisters
  • obsidiancran3obsidiancran3 Posts: 1,823Member Arc User

    What I think is very telling is the lack of ANY kind of acknowledgement from any of the devs about the issue raised. The last thing we heard was a hey I'm not dead post, and then silence. These guys could really work on their communication when it comes to stuff like this.

    Given the quite little addition of "Marathon Runner" to our general skills, and the changes to Oathkeeper, things are still being read.

    Actions are say more than words.
    Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin
    Obsidian Oath - Warlock
    A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
  • ragnarz2ragnarz2 Posts: 208Member Arc User

    What I think is very telling is the lack of ANY kind of acknowledgement from any of the devs about the issue raised. The last thing we heard was a hey I'm not dead post, and then silence. These guys could really work on their communication when it comes to stuff like this.

    They are at crunch. I don't doubt they are paying attention to us but they simply don't have time to engage at this point.
    They are at deaths door. No amount of effort will yield a viable product at this point.
  • mistwalk3rmistwalk3r Posts: 18Member Arc User

    They are at crunch. I don't doubt they are paying attention to us but they simply don't have time to engage at this point.

    Right, and the reason they're at crunch is because of the April 23rd release date, which was decided by them, to near unanimous uproar from every single person providing feedback for the past weeks, unified in stating that it's not going to be near ready by then.

    In some ways, that makes the silence at this point worse.
  • autumnwitchautumnwitch Posts: 304Member Arc User

    They are at crunch. I don't doubt they are paying attention to us but they simply don't have time to engage at this point.

    Right, and the reason they're at crunch is because of the April 23rd release date, which was decided by them, to near unanimous uproar from every single person providing feedback for the past weeks, unified in stating that it's not going to be near ready by then.

    In some ways, that makes the silence at this point worse.
    I'm wasn't making any judgements either way. I just think we are a bit naive to think they have time to engage right now regardless of the reasons they arrived there. Also keep in mind, the devs were probably told by powers way up the food chain it has to be done my the 23rd no matter what.
    Aeywnn - HR
    Ashryne - GF
    Anais - HR
    Red Jenny - SW
    Wintyr - DC
    Sillvi - HR
    Niri - CW

    Boudica's Sisters
  • mistwalk3rmistwalk3r Posts: 18Member Arc User
    I admit to being flippant when I said the release date was "decided by them" as if the devs had any say whatsoever, when it clearly is a business decision out of their control. Given that no one is spending money (zen, AD or otherwise) in anticipation, any delay means more lost revenue, but it's disheartening to see short-term profits and deadlines putting the devs in an impossible situation. We've all been here before, and we know how this situation tends to go.

    OP is the only class I've invested heavily in, so here's hoping it survives on the other side.
  • boggo49boggo49 Posts: 8Member Arc User

    OP is fine.

    The “problems” with the Paladin right now are more a matter of personal preference than if the class actually works.

    The real problems are outside the class, how scaling works (or doesn’t), monsters that are performing well outside their expected bracket, broken quests etc.

    But the class actually works.
    (At least as Justicar.)

    Really? Does anyone here think they could do the present Tales of Old on a mod 16 op, or K team? Or pug the random queues for ad in a reasonable amount of time every day ( thanks to time zone differences I have to pug a lot to get the daily cap).We're slow,( Can't glide, sprint, teleport or use in to the fray to catch up ), clunky and are forced into managing not only stamina (for blocking) but also divinity for every thing else. We'll take longer to level the new content than any other character. We've gone from a dynamic and active character to something that's bland, boring (spending half of the fight backing away with you shield up to regain stamina is about as much fun as watching paint dry) and no fun to play anymore.
    Sorry for the rant, but after thousands of hours, millions of AD and not inconsiderable amounts of real money to get my Op to where he is now , to say I'm disappointed with the OP MK2 is an understatement.
    One of the comments on Northside's video about the latest patch sums it up perfectly "" the only good thing about this new mod is that it will make Mod 6 look like a masterpiece
  • majorcharvenakmajorcharvenak Posts: 734Member Arc User
    edited April 14
    Looks like what we have now is what we're going to get, for good or for ill. Why do I have the feeling that this game is now on track for maintenance mode faster than the other (and older game) I play - STO? I already know of one player who has stated their intention to leave. I suspect and am fearful that many more will follow.
    ~Shia~

    House Miliskeera in exile (NW)
    Sereska Miliskeera, Lvl 70 OP - Devotion (Just.)/Protection (Just.)
    Shizlee Miliskeera, Lvl 70 DC - Divine Oracle (Right.)/Anoited Champion (Faith.)
    Finithey Miliskeera, Lvl 70 HR - Stormwarden (Combat)/Pathfinder (Trapper)
    Maya Sik-Miliskeera, Lvl 70 CW - Spellstorm
    Irae Sik-Miliskeera, Lvl 70 TR - Master Inflitrator

    Member - Houseclan t'Charvon (STO)
    Shiarrael e'Tal'Aura t'Charvon, LvL 60, Rom Sci
    S'aana ir'Virinat t'Charvon, Lvl 60, Rom Eng
    T'Lyra, LvL 60, Fed, Vul Sci
    Ta'el, Lvl 60, Rom Tac
  • ruigat911ruigat911 Posts: 6Member Arc User
    Attempt to tank Drufi
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