How the devs communicate and who with.

themightyzenith · January 2014

Very recently, on another thread here, it was claimed that the developers are in the habit of communicating upcoming developments and changes in the game with the private 'Forumites' channel.

I did ask on that thread for confirmation of this claim, but it seems that a lot of posts have now been removed from that thread. I see no problem with this as they were off-topic....hence the reason for me starting this new thread to make that the topic.

I don't think I am alone in wishing more communication from the devs and those in-the -know concerning upcoming CO changes and ideas in development, therefore it is a little disconcerting to discover that the devs ARE possibly communicating more information with players, but ONLY in the aforementioned private, player-made channel..........provided the claims are true of course.

My thoughts on this are that if information is being communicated then it should be to the player base as a whole, and not to a select few. However, I think it would be wrong to blame the members of this channel for receiving the information. They did not behave incorrectly.

So.......are the claims true?

ashensnow · January 2014

No, the claims are not true (as far as I have seen).

Devs have posted in the Forumites channel, but not in the manner that was claimed.

lafury001200 · January 2014

themightyzenith wrote: »

Very recently, on another thread here, it was claimed that the developers are in the habit of communicating upcoming developments and changes in the game with the private 'Forumites' channel.

I did ask on that thread for confirmation of this claim, but it seems that a lot of posts have now been removed from that thread. I see no problem with this as they were off-topic....hence the reason for me starting this new thread to make that the topic.

I don't think I am alone in wishing more communication from the devs and those in-the -know concerning upcoming CO changes and ideas in development, therefore it is a little disconcerting to discover that the devs ARE possibly communicating more information with players, but ONLY in the aforementioned private, player-made channel..........provided the claims are true of course.

My thoughts on this are that if information is being communicated then it should be to the player base as a whole, and not to a select few. However, I think it would be wrong to blame the members of this channel for receiving the information. They did not behave incorrectly.

So.......are the claims true?

Deep down I think you know the answers to the questions you pose. However, devs are people too and in game chat can be privatized, so it's not like it a developers' only channel that they control access to.

Translation since I ramble these days: It is what it is. It's not a big deal. We all want more communication I grant you, but beginning a campaign of who is who and who knows what on this channel or the other will lead nowhere.

As has been pointed out to me on several occasions, the forums and the game should be seperate. Lets keep it that way.

themightyzenith · January 2014

lafury001200 wrote: »

Deep down I think you know the answers to the questions you pose. However, devs are people too and in game chat can be privatized, so it's not like it a developers' only channel that they control access to.

Translation since I ramble these days: It is what it is. It's not a big deal. We all want more communication I grant you, but beginning a campaign of who is who and who knows what on this channel or the other will lead nowhere.

As has been pointed out to me on several occasions, the forums and the game should be seperate. Lets keep it that way.

Deep down I have no idea...I am neither in that channel nor am I a dev.

Just for the record, this is just a question I want answered, ...and I'm sure I'm not the only one. This is NOT some carefully crafted campaign.

These are forums FOR the game. It is impossible to keep them seperate by definition. I named no names and don't intend to.

I fail to see why this subject should be hushed up. Let's have some transparency.

There are no devious, hidden motivations behind why I started this thread. The reasons are simple.....they are in the OP.

Anyway, back on topic..............

ashensnow wrote: »

No, the claims are not true (as far as I have seen).

Devs have posted in the Forumites channel, but not in the manner that was claimed.

Thanks for the response ashen.....so basically, not while you were in-game.

As I recall from the previous posts (now gone) on the thread in question, no-one actually said this didn't happen. I saw a few folks saying that it's not up to them what a dev tells them in that channel and that devs can listen in to any channel (both completely true and reasonable), but no actual denial of the claim itself.

If long time members of that channel wish to tell me that it didn't actually happen then I would accept that. Even better would be a response from the devs who are members of that channel.

flyingfinn · January 2014

Sometimes, and the notes are all ready up in PTS thread or pop up in next minute, dev announces that theres new stuff at the PTS.
I hope this doesn't make some of you feel left out.
People are talking about games, movies, pets, random stuff.
Some people just seem to have a need to make a fush about regular, random, everyday stuff. Every day.

lafury001200 · January 2014

Sure but examine the last couple of statements. By definition you ask for names. In the end it doesn't matter. If they float ideas, those ideas will hit pts and people can vote pro or con. Exhibit a: first iteration of legion gear. Talked up a bunch, had support posts from that channel, and shot the f down. A bad idea is a bad idea, privelege (or perception thereof) notwithstanding.

Hell, if you feel it's that important just request to join that channel, or contact the devs personaly.

I'm not trying to hush you, or attempting covering anything up. That being said outtie, as this is not my fight.

jennymachx · January 2014

themightyzenith wrote: »

Thanks for the response ashen.....so basically, not while you were in-game.

So what you're saying is that you won't be satisfied until you get a full log of all communication that has happened by everyone that's a member of the channel from I don't know...two years back at least till now? You want to go through millions of lines of chat text to get some closure? Because other than that I don't see how you're going to be satisfied.

Here's my anecdote and it's up to you on how to take it. The kind of discussions I've seen involving devs and players have mainly been feedback on bugs and suggestions from players, and the responses from devs have always been along the lines of "We'll look into it" or "Sounds interesting, maybe we'll consider". There never were any announcements made about upcoming new features being added to the game that hasn't already been revealed in the PTS at the time. The people in the channel aren't getting any exclusive "insider" information that no one else is getting.

Let it die already, or continue with the rumor-mongering.

scorpagor · January 2014

What's with the hostile responses from Lafury and Jenny?

OP asked a perfectly normal question. You guys make it sound like she's trying to start a riot, jeez...

eiledon · January 2014

To be honest it looks like he is looking for multiple confirmations rather than conducting a witchhunt. people need to take a breath before posting sometimes as it seems to be some of the replies that are being incendiary rather than the original question which was based on the observation of claims on a thread that has since been edited/removed.

cyrone · January 2014

I see more joking and general chat from the devs. The occasional random picture. They're pretty much like us from what I've experienced.

jennymachx · January 2014

scorpagor wrote: »

What's with the hostile responses from Lafury and Jenny?

OP asked a perfectly normal question. You guys make it sound like she's trying to start a riot, jeez...

You thought that was hostile? I think I've been pretty tame. Lafury's responses have been nothing but civil by the way.

I only said what I said because of how the OP responded to Ashen's answer on the matter, that being along the lines of "Okay, thank you for confirming it....but regarding those times that you weren't ingame...". What are multiple confirmations going to achieve if the skepticism is going to be kept anyway?

Unknown · January 2014

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Unknown · January 2014

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derangedhero · January 2014

jennymachx wrote: »

What are multiple confirmations going to achieve if the skepticism is going to be kept anyway?

Increasingly less skepticism with each answer, I'd say.

themightyzenith · January 2014

jennymachx wrote: »

So what you're saying is that you won't be satisfied until you get a full log of all communication that has happened by everyone that's a member of the channel from I don't know...two years back at least till now? You want to go through millions of lines of chat text to get some closure? Because other than that I don't see how you're going to be satisfied.

I believe I made it clear with how I would be satisfied.....

themightyzenith wrote: »

If long time members of that channel wish to tell me that it didn't actually happen then I would accept that. Even better would be a response from the devs who are members of that channel.

Also, perhaps it's better not not try to assign base motivations to my request for a response. I am in the habit of meaning exactly what I say with no hidden deviousness. It's something I try to practice in all aspects of life.....I find it makes life easier.

I think Liath said it best when he said........

eiledon wrote: »

To be honest it looks like he is looking for multiple confirmations rather than conducting a witchhunt. people need to take a breath before posting sometimes as it seems to be some of the replies that are being incendiary rather than the original question which was based on the observation of claims on a thread that has since been edited/removed.

IMO, Liath has always been a voice of reason on the forums. He got it.

Thanks to those who have posted so far.

skcark · January 2014

derangedhero wrote: »

Increasingly less skepticism with each answer, I'd say.

True that...

Anyway, i can confirm the devs dont give them special treatment.. Ibut don't let the fact i've never once been in their channel get in the way of that.

sagewithbubbles · January 2014

themightyzenith wrote: »

Very recently, on another thread here, it was claimed that the developers are in the habit of communicating upcoming developments and changes in the game with the private 'Forumites' channel.

I did ask on that thread for confirmation of this claim, but it seems that a lot of posts have now been removed from that thread. I see no problem with this as they were off-topic....hence the reason for me starting this new thread to make that the topic.

I don't think I am alone in wishing more communication from the devs and those in-the -know concerning upcoming CO changes and ideas in development, therefore it is a little disconcerting to discover that the devs ARE possibly communicating more information with players, but ONLY in the aforementioned private, player-made channel..........provided the claims are true of course.

My thoughts on this are that if information is being communicated then it should be to the player base as a whole, and not to a select few. However, I think it would be wrong to blame the members of this channel for receiving the information. They did not behave incorrectly.

So.......are the claims true?

People claim a lot of things. Usually when their "SUPER AWESOME IDEA THAT COULD TOTALLY BE DONE IN A DAY AND WOULD FIX EVERYTHING EVER BECAUSE CONCEPTS" is somehow tragically ignored due to the crushing requirements of reality.

Gentleman Crush and Akinos have both (in the past, like On Alert and Melee Pass, respectively) set up public dev channels (named after their dev names) when they've wanted to carry on game-related dialogue with groups of players.

The only "crunch" stuff (meaning aside from jokes and the occasional funny picture) that I've personally seen in Forumites in the time I've been there (couple of years now) has been like...

- Someone popping in to say "there's stuff on PTS coming soon, we can't tell you what it is, but watch for the topic, test it and give feedback on the forums"

-"the Auras Dev Blog is up, go check it out: here's a link".

-"Post your feedback in the thread and tell us what you think. We'll look at the suggestions from there."

-"I'm working on stuff but I can't tell you what it is or when it will be ready, there's a blog coming up soon that will explain more"

Usually with about that level of detail. Things that you could also get by reading the forums or the blogs they post, with maybe a couple of minutes' more warning (since they may say that as they're posting it). Mostly it's more jokes and general chat (not game-related). They can't and don't give out detailed information on things that aren't already publicly-available (or will be publicly-available by the time they finish the sentence).

It's not a dedicated "talk to the devs" channel and it shouldn't be. There are dedicated forums (PTS and Suggestions) and the aforementioned Dev-named chat channels for that.

One point of confusion may come about from the fact that a lot of the members of Forumites are also part of the PTS testing community, and things that were said in zone/local/open testing periods on PTS may get construed as "being seen in Forumites" by word of mouth. Think of it like a game of telephone, only with conspiracy theorists and agendas.

TL; DR version: If you want to be in on the super-secret insider cabal of CO knowledge, go test stuff on PTS.

themightyzenith · January 2014

sagewithbubbles wrote: »

non-incendiary post with thought out response

Thanks for the measured response sage. If this is indeed the case (and you seem like a sincere and realistic person), then I don't see any problem with communication of that type.
Cheers

skcark wrote: »

....... i can confirm the devs dont give them special treatment.. but don't let the fact i've never once been in their channel get in the way of that.

Okay.....I lolled

skcark · January 2014

themightyzenith wrote: »

Thanks for the measured response sage. If this is indeed the case (and you seem like a sincere and realistic person), then I don't see any problem with communication of that type.
Cheers

Okay.....I lolled

Sorry.. i couldn't resist

But on a more serious note.. from what i have heard.. i'm always under the impression that IF a dev does tell them anything, it's only stuff already on the PTS for them, and anyone with gold to find out for ourselves. so perhaps if this is the case, then maybe someone else got the impression that that means being told 'special privilege information' even though it would be on PTS already?

biffsmackwell · January 2014

Anything we hear from the developers is not privileged information. They keep their cards close to their chest in that channel. We're always bugging them about what's coming up next, what's new, what are they working on, and generally don't get even a hint. They didn't say a single word (that I saw, for what it's worth - and know that I'm in that channel pretty much all day every day) about the Dryad or Victorian costume sets. If they don't even give hints to something like a costume set, I doubt they'd be dropping bombs about new stuff all the time.

Any information that is posted in that channel is likely stuff that you'd hear from them if you chat with them like you would anyone else.

forutnefire · January 2014

Yeah, anything I've seen in Forumites by a dev (and that's not much) is either already known or is simply stuff we'd all like to see or think is cool.

fudgemonsta · January 2014

Usually music videos...

...Actually a lot of music videos. But who can't resist good tunes?

themightyzenith · January 2014

Thanks for replying Biff, Flare and Fudge......I think I see the real situation now.

While I have some of you folks who are members of that channel here, I have a question from a friend. They were wondering if it was a pre-requisite to be a 'forumite' to get in the Forumites channel? If so, what constitutes being a 'forumite'?

Also, are there any other requirements to join and how do they apply?

iamrune · January 2014

themightyzenith wrote: »

Thanks for replying Biff, Flare and Fudge......I think I see the real situation now.

While I have some of you folks who are members of that channel here, I have a question from a friend. They were wondering if it was a pre-requisite to be a 'forumite' to get in the Forumites channel? If so, what constitutes being a 'forumite'?

Also, are there any other requirements to join and how do they apply?

If I recall correctly, Forumites channel was created and championed by Angelofcaine, and he was that channels original admin. I believe he created the channel as a way to get together all the regular forum posters that interacted here, in-game for concentrated PTS runs and general chatting in-game with people he liked, although as a guild leader I am usually quite busy and rarely got heavily involved in Forumites, I am a member.

I'm pretty sure you qualify as a forum personality, when I log in later I'll ask around and find out who may have invitation privileges [hell, I might], and see about getting you invited.

Shoot me an in-game email, I am @rune

And yeah,, nothing any dev ever communicated to me was "special" or "early info".. and I have several devs on my friends list, including my buddy Robobo, ex-EP for champs and now Lead design on Neverwinters foundry.

The most "extra special treatment" I ever got was an ear to bend to get bugs and errors in the game fixed. Like some old weapon unlocks being changed to account wide when mis-tagged as per character unlocks, etc. [Everyone with the second thin Vampire sword, thank me.. that was me that got that bug fixed, with old Rob's ear!]

ashensnow · January 2014

sagewithbubbles wrote: »

People claim a lot of things. Usually when their "SUPER AWESOME IDEA THAT COULD TOTALLY BE DONE IN A DAY AND WOULD FIX EVERYTHING EVER BECAUSE CONCEPTS" is somehow tragically ignored due to the crushing requirements of reality.

Gentleman Crush and Akinos have both (in the past, like On Alert and Melee Pass, respectively) set up public dev channels (named after their dev names) when they've wanted to carry on game-related dialogue with groups of players.

The only "crunch" stuff (meaning aside from jokes and the occasional funny picture) that I've personally seen in Forumites in the time I've been there (couple of years now) has been like...

- Someone popping in to say "there's stuff on PTS coming soon, we can't tell you what it is, but watch for the topic, test it and give feedback on the forums"

-"the Auras Dev Blog is up, go check it out: here's a link".

-"Post your feedback in the thread and tell us what you think. We'll look at the suggestions from there."

-"I'm working on stuff but I can't tell you what it is or when it will be ready, there's a blog coming up soon that will explain more"

Usually with about that level of detail. Things that you could also get by reading the forums or the blogs they post, with maybe a couple of minutes' more warning (since they may say that as they're posting it). Mostly it's more jokes and general chat (not game-related). They can't and don't give out detailed information on things that aren't already publicly-available (or will be publicly-available by the time they finish the sentence).

It's not a dedicated "talk to the devs" channel and it shouldn't be. There are dedicated forums (PTS and Suggestions) and the aforementioned Dev-named chat channels for that.

One point of confusion may come about from the fact that a lot of the members of Forumites are also part of the PTS testing community, and things that were said in zone/local/open testing periods on PTS may get construed as "being seen in Forumites" by word of mouth. Think of it like a game of telephone, only with conspiracy theorists and agendas.

TL; DR version: If you want to be in on the super-secret insider cabal of CO knowledge, go test stuff on PTS.

What Sage said.

That last part about PTS is particularly noteworthy.

forutnefire · January 2014

Rune covered most of it. I only came in last year-ish b/c apparently I'm a person of interest or whatnot.

I don't participate too much in forumites other than to crack a joke, ask for help, or provide 2 cents. When they start talking game mechanics I'm like:

I say it's up to the other members and next time I'm in game I'll ask and let ya know.

flyingfinn · January 2014

'Where's all the rum gone?'?

itsbrou · January 2014

No, being in that channel is not a sneak preview or method to direct development decisions.

flyingfinn · January 2014

Then whats the secret handshake is for?

crypticbuxom · January 2014

From what I know about the channel, the biggest things discussed in there related to the game is concepts. Really, really distant "these would be nice" concepts. Maybe discussions about confirming bugs or issues with certain powers not working as designed that the devs might want to actively fix.

I certainly hope they talk more about things that are on the PTS and whats going to be on there. But we have a channel already that anyone can join where we can collaborate on things added to the PTS and organize testing runs. Maybe talk to a dev or two who is also in it if they are online.

And that channel is simply called PTS.

themightyzenith · January 2014

Once again...thanks for posting folks. I appreciate you looking into that for me, Rune and Flare, really helpful

I'm also grateful for the info about the PTS channel, thanks a lot buxom

I was a little wary of starting this thread to begin with, I was worried that my intentions would be mis-construed as some attempt to cause problems for people, if anyone still doubts me, then all I can say is that I really meant what I said in the OP. This was , in no way, an attempt to undermine anyone.

I can honestly say that I am glad I started it and that it turned out so positive

Thanks to everyone who participated.

sagewithbubbles · January 2014

flyingfinn wrote: »

Then whats the secret handshake is for?

The rum. Or what's left of it, anyway.

forutnefire · January 2014

So according to the masses, to get into the channel you need to:

Not be a jerk*
talk to a memeber to be nominated for entry
nomination needs to be seconded
then there's a 24hr mail voting process

*this may or may not have been the exact term used.

themightyzenith · January 2014

forutnefire wrote: »

So according to the masses, to get into the channel you need to:
Not be a jerk*

talk to a memeber to be nominated for entry

nomination needs to be seconded

then there's a 24hr mail voting process

*this may or may not have been the exact term used.

lol.....okay Flare, thanks for that. I'll pass it on to the interested party

nepht · January 2014

sagewithbubbles wrote: »

The rum. Or what's left of it, anyway.

That rum is mine >_>

Anyhoo there used to be great info on the GMC channel until an alien ruined that by trolling.

All that happens on the forumites is this.

DEVS: We have updated the PTS thread.

FORUMITES: YAY \o/

NEPHT: FIX THE PVP QUEUES! :O

DEVS: *ignores the Nepht*

NEPHT: U__U I hate your faces.

SMACKWELL: SHUT UP NEPHT!

Seriously thats it thats all they say. Its just one of many channels in this game where they mention that they have updated the PTS thread. Most of us have PTS installed so its just to get some more players on that shard.

ashensnow · January 2014

nepht wrote: »

That rum is mine >_>

Anyhoo there used to be great info on the GMC channel until an alien ruined that by trolling.

All that happens on the forumites is this.

DEVS: We have updated the PTS thread.

FORUMITES: YAY \o/

NEPHT: FIX THE PVP QUEUES! :O

DEVS: *ignores the Nepht*

NEPHT: U__U I hate your faces.

SMACKWELL: SHUT UP NEPHT!

Seriously thats it thats all they say. Its just one of many channels in this game where they mention that they have updated the PTS thread. Most of us have PTS installed so its just to get some more players on that shard.

This is a fabrication.

Smackwell doesn't use caps when he tells you to shut up.

cyrone · January 2014

ashensnow wrote: »

This is a fabrication.

Smackwell doesn't use caps when he tells you to shut up.

Does Smackwell even use caps in the channel? I don't think he does.

neuraldamage · January 2014

forutnefire wrote: »

So according to the masses, to get into the channel you need to:
Not be a jerk*

talk to a memeber to be nominated for entry

nomination needs to be seconded

then there's a 24hr mail voting process

*this may or may not have been the exact term used.

Being an active player and a long-term vet helps. Most of the Forumites have been here since Day 1. :cool:

mrhinkypunk · January 2014

ashensnow wrote: »

This is a fabrication.

Smackwell doesn't use caps when he tells you to shut up.

Smackwell doesn't even need to tell nepht to shut up. Deep down they always know it.

Don't you agree caliga?

biffsmackwell · January 2014

I used caps yesterday, when I saw we could get "The" as a title. SO THERE!

But yes in general I lazy-type into chats and go all no-caps.

spinnytop · January 2014

neuraldamage wrote: »

Being an active player and a long-term vet helps. Most of the Forumites have been here since Day 1. :cool:

Being completely unknown helps too I hear. So... good luck working all that together.

helbjorn · January 2014

forutnefire wrote: »

So according to the masses, to get into the channel you need to:
Not be a jerk*

talk to a memeber to be nominated for entry

nomination needs to be seconded

then there's a 24hr mail voting process

*this may or may not have been the exact term used.

The channel was originally created by Angel as a way for "the Clique" to communicate in-game without interference from the rest of the rabble.

It has never, by any means, been a "Forumite" channel.

iamrune · January 2014

helbjorn wrote: »

The channel was originally created by Angel as a way for "the Clique" to communicate in-game without interference from the rest of the rabble.

It has never, by any means, been a "Forumite" channel.

This isn't true at all.

It's just that nobody wanted to talk with you. :rolleyes:

lucasjackson · January 2014

helbjorn wrote: »

The channel was originally created by Angel as a way for "the Clique" to communicate in-game without interference from the rest of the rabble.

It has never, by any means, been a "Forumite" channel.

If you squint your eyes and tilt your head to the left a little, you can actually see the butthurt in this post.

Unknown · January 2014

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Unknown · January 2014

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biffsmackwell · January 2014

The only "bias" is how well you get along with people in there. You're much likelier to become a member if you play nice on the forums, that's all.

Unknown · January 2014

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iamrune · January 2014

biffsmackwell wrote: »

The only "bias" is how well you get along with people in there. You're much likelier to become a member if you play nice on the forums, that's all.

This, my friend, it is a quote of quality.

Unknown · January 2014

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biffsmackwell · January 2014

gradii wrote: »

then you haven't had my experience with a certain jerk, rune. not all of them are nice.

(no its not the "usual suspect") oh god how the no naming rule impedes my communication lol.

You can't expect everyone to get along with everyone. I know there's lots of people who dislike me, I'd completely understand if I wasn't welcome in whatever chat channels those people frequent.

How the devs communicate and who with.

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