test content
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc

Official Feedback Thread: M12 Private PvP Queues (& a bit about where PvP is headed)

rgutscheradevrgutscheradev Posts: 133Member Cryptic Developer
Releasing with Chult, we have the much-requested “Private PvP” queue: a queue where you can invite a full team of 10 (or 20 for Gauntlgrym), divided as you choose, to a PvP match. We hope this will appeal to all ranks of PvP players, from beginners who want to do some experimentation before diving into regular PvP matches, to experts who want to arrange battles with other experts.

We know that PvP right now is in a state where it needs lots of love. Private PvP queues represent an initial down payment on those needs, and also a way to make it easier for everyone to generate feedback.
We hope that Private PvP queues can serve as a “laboratory” for players who care about Neverwinter PvP to try various experiments, and let us know what works, what doesn’t, and what problems they find. Right now, it’s pretty hard to experiment. But with Private PvP queues, it should be a lot easier.

Please feel free to try all sorts of things. Maybe...
* Test specific player powers and items in a controlled setting
* Everyone take off all their Tenacity gear and just wear regular PvE gear -- is the play experience better? Worse? In what ways?
* Try out a 3v3 match (you can enter a Private PvP queue with less than a full group if you want)
* Experiment with new and unusual team comps
* Make up a new game mode (eg, a deathmatch where everyone has 2 lives). Of course, it will have to be enforced by player agreement, but if it becomes popular, maybe it can become an official mode some day! (Kind of like what happened with ARAM in League of Legends, if you’re familiar with that history.)
* Anything you can think of! For science!

Known Issue
Currently, the normal PvP rewards are still attached. That’s a bug. There will NOT be rewards attached to private PvP queues (way too abusable, as you can imagine) when the system goes live.

A few comments about PvP in general... you all have had lots of good ideas for PvP improvements. The big message we’ve received is that PvP is in a state where it needs fixes first before new PvP content (like a new game mode or map). Here are the things we are looking at first (I think pretty much all of these are forum suggestions!):
* Tenacity Rework: we have a small down payment on this with Chult. See https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter#/discussion/1231983/official-feedback-thread-m12-armor-pen-changes-and-pvp for details, including where we’re currently headed with Tenacity.
* Permanent Solo Queue
* Diminishing CC Returns: this is something we want to do some experiments with, and add to PvP if those experiments go well.
* Fix the Leaderboard bug
* Hopefully do a PvP rewards pass as well (at very least, give some stats to compensate for any Tenacity that disappears)
Keep in mind none of this certain to happen -- game development, things can change, all the usual warnings! But these are the things we want to do first for PvP. Once they are done (or, in some cases, maybe they go horribly wrong and we decide against them, or we decide to deal with the problem in some other better way instead), then we can look at where we are and see if we should be focusing on further fixes, or if it’s time to look at things like new game modes.
«13456713

Comments

  • darthtzarrdarthtzarr Posts: 898Member Arc User

    Currently, the normal PvP rewards are still attached. That’s a bug. There will NOT be rewards attached to private PvP queues (way too abusable, as you can imagine) when the system goes live.

    Just an FYI, the system is already being abused in this way with the public queues on live. It takes some work but it's not hard to "sync" your queue group up with another one. Well... at least it's not hard to fight randoms, actually getting it matched can be quite hard some days.

    Very nice though. Private Queues were really needed.

    Signature [WIP] - tyvm John

  • rgutscheradevrgutscheradev Posts: 133Member Cryptic Developer
    edited June 17

    Currently, the normal PvP rewards are still attached. That’s a bug. There will NOT be rewards attached to private PvP queues (way too abusable, as you can imagine) when the system goes live.

    Just an FYI, the system is already being abused in this way with the public queues on live. It takes some work but it's not hard to "sync" your queue group up with another one. Well... at least it's not hard to fight randoms, actually getting it matched can be quite hard some days.

    Very nice though. Private Queues were really needed.
    Yes, I'm hoping the private queues will reduce the incentive to synch queues somewhat, although of course it can't prevent it. But people who were synching just because they honestly wanted to fight it out in a specific reasonable match will be able to use the private queues to do that.
  • mamalion1234mamalion1234 Posts: 2,855Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    WILL The players able to use companions in private queue? Maybe two teams want to fight with their companions.
  • vteasyvteasy Posts: 708Member Arc User
    can we do this with stronghold siege?
  • nezdin#5514 nezdin Posts: 232Member Arc User
    This is really great!

    Why not accompany the private PvP queue with the permanent solo queue in mod 12? I don't see any reason not to do so.
    Aelan Icebleed (CW)
    Nezdin (DC)


    Ж Corrupted Ж
  • frozenfirevrfrozenfirevr Posts: 761Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User

    WILL The players able to use companions in private queue? Maybe two teams want to fight with their companions.

    Nah... I don't think the mechanics will or should be changed in any way. You have IWD for that anyways.
    FrozenFire
  • tripsofthrymrtripsofthrymr Posts: 1,526Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Community Moderator
    Thank you for this! I can take it off of my list of things I bug @nitocris83 about :smile:

    I fully understand your motivation for removing rewards, especially when this is first released. However, consider that many people getting their feet wet in PVP will not be abusing the system. It would be great if they could earn some form of reward in a later release. Perhaps you limit rewards through private queues to a certain amount per day or per week so that honest players can get honest rewards, while limiting the amount of reward obtainable by abusing the system.

    Perhaps you could even add a flag where if you investigate an abuse report and find an account was abusing the feature, rewards are disabled for a few months (by the way, that's generally a much better system than perma-banning players for abusing system features... don't kick the player, remove their access to that feature temporarily or permanently).
    Caritas Guild Founder (Greycloak Alliance)

    Cryptic of Kelemvor (NW-DQMV5SWT5) Pokes good-natured fun at the AD nerf and many other things
    The Legend of Nicolas
    The Rise of Nicolas (NW-DAYMFZO7V) White Dragon Winter (NW-DEUHGX6AO) Icy the Snow Troll (NW-DN6RJGT3B)
    Is the Foundry important? R.A. Salvatory things so (clip, full stream)
    Author, The Gods We Make
  • ejziponkenejziponken Posts: 831Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    edited June 17
    I love the 1vs1-5vs5 private Q for PvP. Very much needed.

    Now we need to focus on the gear gap so we actually have someone to Q against.

    Im worried tho about rewards, if u can Q 1vs1 you can Q against an alt and farm the loot. This has to be prevented somehow.

  • wintermurlocwintermurloc Posts: 76Member Arc User
    This is a nice addition , thnx a lot for this and yes you are absolutely right about not rewarding these private queues cause it will lead to something else.
  • cilginordekcilginordek Posts: 283Member Arc User


    * Everyone take off all their Tenacity gear and just wear regular PvE gear -- is the play experience better? Worse? In what ways?

    Everything dies too quickly and the classes with most burst reign.

    Also, can we expect any class balancing? Diminishing returns on CC could help with balance of some classes, but resistance ignore on HR still needs a look in my opinion.
  • vordaynvordayn Posts: 563Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User


    * Diminishing CC Returns: this is something we want to do some experiments with, and add to PvP if those experiments go well.

    Does this include all CC powers like stun, prone, root, daze, slows, immobilise?

    Are all the above types of CC affected by control bonuses/resist?
    Vordon CW        Vordayn DC        Axel Wolfric GWF        Logain SW
  • deathklaat666deathklaat666 Posts: 42Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    Thank you very Much for this. Is there going to be an overhaul of the pvp campaign at all, Longtime players have this of course, but I see new players struggling to complete it and the rewards from it are long Obsolete(pvp rings,ets..)
  • wintersmokewintersmoke Posts: 471Member Arc User

    Thank you very Much for this. Is there going to be an overhaul of the pvp campaign at all, Longtime players have this of course, but I see new players struggling to complete it and the rewards from it are long Obsolete(pvp rings,ets..)

    In theory, it should be possible for more players to begin working through the PvP campaign once the private queue option goes live. If the Pre-mades that currently dominate move mostly to play there, then the "normal" queue should open up & allow for better matches for us PUGlets.

    @rgutscheradev You say no rewards in private, I am assuming that includes boon progression as well, yes?

  • kalina311kalina311 Posts: 947Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    edited June 17
    @rgutscheradev

    The post brought a tear to my eye +1 million

    Atomic Batteries to Power! Turbines to Speed!

    Are we able to select which 5 v 5 pvp map to chose in the Q

    maybe we can get a private Q/ regular normal q for strongholds with companions turned off lol .. how it should have been lag free

    can you please take a look at toning down adtional sources of potions and powers stacks in pvp that are not included in item level
    https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1230908/fully-potted-pvp

    potions / buffs adds up to an extra 38 rank 12 enchantments worth of power

    this will bypass all your changes making them moot what say you to this sir
    Post edited by kalina311 on
  • urabaskurabask Posts: 2,923Member Arc User

    WILL The players able to use companions in private queue? Maybe two teams want to fight with their companions.

    Nah... I don't think the mechanics will or should be changed in any way. You have IWD for that anyways.
    I don't really see why it would be problematic to have the option for 1000+ mutators. It's a private queue with no rewards there's no reason to box PvP into the limits that have been in place for so long. They could add run speed sliders, toggles to disable/enable pots, enchants, insignia bonuses,mount powers etc., options to change dom rules (e.g. the number of capture points, the score limit, respawn limits), mutators to set resistances at a specific number, modifiers for weapon damage/stats etc. etc.

    Cryptic is so slow at actually balancing things themselves I'd think you'd want the ability to fix things yourself rather than waiting for them.
    I8r4ux9.jpg
  • urabaskurabask Posts: 2,923Member Arc User

    There need to be rewards in Private queue, so that Prestige gear can be earned. The issues that make it hard to win a match to get seals and Glory are not being addressed, so lower Il players need a way to get the BIS gear. Lower the salvage value of the PVP gear and add seals and glory to the queue, or let there be a chance for Prestige armor to drop to the players with the highest scores.

    Their proposed solution is to eventually eliminate PvP gear so that shouldn't really be necessary. The amount of glory they could reward without encouraging exploits is so small it wouldn't be worth it. They'd be better of adjusting rewards in the normal queues so that lower ilvl players are still rewarded.
    I8r4ux9.jpg
  • lowjohnlowjohn Posts: 338Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    Possibly a dumb suggestion: Maybe a *permanent* cap on rewards from private PVP? Or permanently diminishing returns?

    Get your first Seals, your first Banners, your first Grym Coins, your first Glory, etc, in Private? No problem..... but you can only *ever* get, say, 300 Seals, 20K Glory, 60 Grym Coins, 5 Banners, whatever from Private, and then the rewards get smaller every time until you hit the limit.

    Still lets you get rewards for Private. Still encourages you to run Private with new players to show them the ropes or when you want to challenge specific people/teams. You can make progress towards achievements and PVP boons. You can get your first piece or maybe two of Prestige or Lionsmane armor, or start your way to a Banner or Skull - but makes it so Private is simply *not* farmable.

    How about it, folks? Tell me why this is a bad idea.
  • wintersmokewintersmoke Posts: 471Member Arc User

    There need to be rewards in Private queue, so that Prestige gear can be earned. The issues that make it hard to win a match to get seals and Glory are not being addressed, so lower Il players need a way to get the BIS gear. Lower the salvage value of the PVP gear and add seals and glory to the queue, or let there be a chance for Prestige armor to drop to the players with the highest scores.

    Why should rewards drop only for the players that get the highest scores?
  • feanor70118feanor70118 Posts: 715Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    It is incomprehensible why they have not included a permanent solo queue.

    90% of players want one.

    This has been known for more than a year.

    Just. Give. Us. The. Permanent. Solo. Queue. Now.
  • emilemoemilemo Posts: 1,664Member Arc User

    WILL The players able to use companions in private queue? Maybe two teams want to fight with their companions.

    Really? :|
    Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream.
    Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
  • nezdin#5514 nezdin Posts: 232Member Arc User

    It is incomprehensible why they have not included a permanent solo queue.

    90% of players want one.

    This has been known for more than a year.

    Just. Give. Us. The. Permanent. Solo. Queue. Now.

    Maybe they think that normal queue will become something like a solo queue if all premades now have private queue. I still do not see the point of going one (easy) step further by transforming normal queue into solo queue to assure no pointless and calculated stomping takes place.
    Aelan Icebleed (CW)
    Nezdin (DC)


    Ж Corrupted Ж
  • nezdin#5514 nezdin Posts: 232Member Arc User


    Known Issue
    Currently, the normal PvP rewards are still attached. That’s a bug. There will NOT be rewards attached to private PvP queues (way too abusable, as you can imagine) when the system goes live.

    If you leave the reward system in normal domination and disable rewards in the private queue this is what will happen: premades will run
    2 x normal domination to get rewards before going back to private queue to have their fun.
    Solution? Transform "normal" queue into permanent solo queue to prevent systematic premades from farming AD. If anyone wants AD, he has to queue solo.
    Aelan Icebleed (CW)
    Nezdin (DC)


    Ж Corrupted Ж
  • kalina311kalina311 Posts: 947Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    also wondering If pvp records will get published for the private Q and mess/ mix up leader board and standings as well

    there should be no records of kills or deaths or anything for private Q as it will discourage new and old people alike from trying / participating / being shamed / bragging
  • josiahiyonjosiahiyon Posts: 391Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    we ran a few private q dominations on ptr, and they did not show up on the leaderboard.
    Pvpbysynergy.png
    Iyon the Dark
«13456713
Sign In or Register to comment.