but back when the faction was actually introduced in game, there was a lot of discussion (in livestreams, forum threads, etc) about which races would be available, and eventually a statement that they had chosen to only make Jem'Hadar available (not even an alien option) because the devs felt that the tutorial storyline wouldn't make sense if you weren't Jem'Hadar.
Thank you, sir, for reminding me of this; it is natural in this theoretical eventuality for the tutorial to be appropriately revamped.
Returning to my earlier comments on the polearm: it occurs to me that if those suggestions for its inclusion in the core game are taken up, the one in the bundle would be distinguished by a unique model, much as there exists one for bat'leths (the replica of Kahless' shard-sword, as I recall).
I still wish they chose to go with a Cardassian mini-faction instead of a Jem'Hadar one, Jem'Hadar just aren't interesting to me it's why I only made one and even then disguised them as a Breen.
If the Gamma Recruit tutorial is anything similar to the normal one for the faction than the only thing about it that could use changing would be the cutscene at the start of the holodeck part, and possibly something to replace the one small section in it where the shroud is introduced since Vorta probably don't have the shrouds.
The cutscene would probably work best with a Vorta giving the PC orders instead of a J'H relaying orders from a Vorta at some headquarters, but the orders themselves would be the same (though explaining that the J'H troops are scattered and leaderless in the emergency and that the PC will have to fight their way through and gather them without support because there are no J'H available at the starting location would be a nice touch). DS9 showed several times that Vorta lead Jem'Hadar troops in the field just like the PC does a little later in the tutorial, so it fits the canon perfectly well.
And for that matter, the cutscene could be left just the way it is as a foreshadowing of the odd military structure Odo put together.
Replacing the shroud part would depend on what the Vorta get instead of the shroud. Something like (possibly improved) telekinesis and some sort of flanking resistance or flank counterstrike ability to represent their hearing-based situational awareness would be good possibilities for instance. Maybe the task for Vortas could be using the TK to force open a path to ambush the enemy instead of using the shroud to sneak around had flank them or knock lookouts or snipers off of their perches or something like that.
The ship sections are exactly right as is since in the show those ships would all commanded by Vorta anyway so the PC being a Vorta would simply mean Odo's expeditionary force would have a mix of traditional units and his weird J'H only ones with the PC being one of the traditional ones (example: Luaran). And Vorta leading landing parties is not too unusual either since both Kilana and Keevan are show doing exactly that, so the station assault parts are fine too.
The cutscene about issuing the white would have to be changed to Weyoun giving the PC the supply box or something like that though, or at least remove the part where he gives the PC a vial of it.
If the devs wanted to get really crazy they could always make it so that the boffs try to maneuver in a box formation with the Vorta in the center when possible instead of following the captain like they normally do.
I remember back when ViL was new the devs did not all seem to be 100% in agreement about limiting the faction to only horneytoads, but the ones in charge were part of the ones who wanted it that way so that is the way they did it.
I still wish they chose to go with a Cardassian mini-faction instead of a Jem'Hadar one, Jem'Hadar just aren't interesting to me it's why I only made one and even then disguised them as a Breen.
I think the Cardassian's should have been included as an option for the Dominion sub-faction.
I think the Cardassian's should have been included as an option for the Dominion sub-faction.
...but the Cardassians ousted the Dominion from their homeworld.
Having them, and Bajor, be part of the Federation in STO's ongoing timeline makes sense.
- - - - I n f e r i o r i t y - C o m p l e x - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I think the Cardassian's should have been included as an option for the Dominion sub-faction.
...but the Cardassians ousted the Dominion from their homeworld.
Having them, and Bajor, be part of the Federation in STO's ongoing timeline makes sense.
I still wish they chose to go with a Cardassian mini-faction instead of a Jem'Hadar one, Jem'Hadar just aren't interesting to me it's why I only made one and even then disguised them as a Breen.
I think it would have worked better if they had done a slightly different story and made it a Dominion faction with Vorta and aliengen playable, and if they had solved any animation issues Lifetime exclusive Changelings. The devs wanted to do a Jem'Hadar specific story, but that's not what many of the players wanted and that disconnect hurt the faction a lot imo.
I still wish they chose to go with a Cardassian mini-faction instead of a Jem'Hadar one, Jem'Hadar just aren't interesting to me it's why I only made one and even then disguised them as a Breen.
I think it would have worked better if they had done a slightly different story and made it a Dominion faction with Vorta and aliengen playable, and if they had solved any animation issues Lifetime exclusive Changelings. The devs wanted to do a Jem'Hadar specific story, but that's not what many of the players wanted and that disconnect hurt the faction a lot imo.
What they really wanted to do was jump on the endgame-starting character class bandwagon with Tera and the other games that experimented with the idea as a way of wooing players who were bored with the traditional MMORPG leveling grind. The Jem'Hadar were ideal for that since they are essentially bio-androids with pre-programmed skills that come from a production-line of vats.
The only problem was that in order to support that new class as anything but simple mercenaries or whatever out of nowhere they had to provide at least a minimal support structure to make it palatable to players who pay attention to Trek and its canon, so they came up with Odo's expeditionary force to explain how beings who are considered nothing but living (and disposable) weapons systems could possibly be in command positions, and do it with the least time and effort on the part of the devs.
The thing is, on a roleplay and space Barbie level there is almost nothing to work with. Not only are they an eyesore no matter what you do with them, they are a completely one-trick-pony when it comes to roleplayability (the "sudden freedom" thing the devs made them for) because of the fact that they are in effect vat-created attack golems with no life experiences and just the skills they were programmed with during their creation. And to add insult to injury they are genderlocked which is not a good thing either.
Ironically, the Vorta the devs seem to look down on so much can use the same new freedom plot seed as the Jem'Hadar and are also prime candidates for an endgame-starting character since they are clones themselves (though as clones instead of constructs they retain the memories and life experiences of their originals) and they are shown to be combatants in DS9 though they tend to try and obscure that fact a lot.
If you look at what they do in the show and not just go by the propaganda Weyoun fed the Federation, they make the Tal Shiar, the Obsidian Order, and the Zhat Vash look like bumbling toothless amateurs. And for a lot of players, they have the space Barbie thing going FOR them instead of against them, and they don't ruffle feathers by being genderlocked eunuchs like the J'H, so if playable Vorta were added to the faction it would eliminate both irritations for the price of one.
I, possibly foolishly, have made 3 Dominion toons. 1 of each profession. I never bought the "bug" ship from that Mudd's pack nor have gambled for a "bug" ship so this Lego "bug" pack is tempting. I'm liking the looks, & the traits well enough. The level 60 to level 65 boost is hilarious & really shows how pathetically that's been over-valued by Cryptic in STO even for full level boosting to 65.
I'm glad Cryptic has already responded by improving the starship trait a bit, well done. I do think the Weyoun & the Dominion ground weapon should be for any Dominion toon on an account & NOT just 1. That would make this any easy sell imo.
Did they clarify about the Jem'Hadar Attack Ship hangar unlock requirements?
Not really anything to clarify, owning the Legendary will unlock it just like owning the T5 and Strike Ship variants does now. That requirement actually went live before the ship was even announced, so a lot of people already knew the Legendary was coming.
Did they clarify about the Jem'Hadar Attack Ship hangar unlock requirements?
Not really anything to clarify, owning the Legendary will unlock it just like owning the T5 and Strike Ship variants does now. That requirement actually went live before the ship was even announced, so a lot of people already knew the Legendary was coming.
Current unlock conditions is:
One Dreadnought Cruiser
T5 Dreadnought Cruiser
T6 Dreadnought Cruiser
One Jem'Hadar Attack Ship
T5 JHAS
T6 Recon Ship
T6 Strike Ship
T6 Legendary Bugship
Blog hinted any Jem'Hadar ship with a hangar would work in addition to the Dreadnought Cruisers.
I, possibly foolishly, have made 3 Dominion toons. 1 of each profession. I never bought the "bug" ship from that Mudd's pack nor have gambled for a "bug" ship so this Lego "bug" pack is tempting. I'm liking the looks, & the traits well enough. The level 60 to level 65 boost is hilarious & really shows how pathetically that's been over-valued by Cryptic in STO even for full level boosting to 65.
I'm glad Cryptic has already responded by improving the starship trait a bit, well done. I do think the Weyoun & the Dominion ground weapon should be for any Dominion toon on an account & NOT just 1. That would make this any easy sell imo.
Nothing to be ashamed of, if you like and can play Jem'Hadar then making toons for all three departments is only sensible for a number of reasons (including the ability to mix and match with the various ships, which themselves usually lean towards a particular department).
In my case, I cannot get into the heads of the hornytoads so playing one is a surprisingly boring and tedious grind (I play MMORPGs from a roleplay perspective), so that is the only faction I dont have at least one of each department for (then again I am a bit of an altaholic with around thirty characters spread between two accounts, and one Gamma recruit which is just a necessary evil to get a few of the benefits (but none of the ones that require the thing to do ground content) to the characters I can actually stand to play). I suppose that it doesn't help that in DS9 they were meant to be nothing more than faceless, nameless obstacles for the heroes to fight through and that realworld toads are not exactly my favorite creatures.
I do like playing Vorta, and I like the bugships, and this particular ship would fit very well with my playstyle so I would be tempted if it was not for the fact that the considerable extra expense compared to c-store ships would be totally wasted. If they did make the Weyoun clone and the ground weapon available to the other characters on an account I would rather they not restrict that to just horneytoads, if they did make them available to everyone on it regardless of faction it would feel like less of a waste since I could use them with my faux-Vorta characters.
I dont like how the pack must be used on a jem char. So if our main is not a jem that means we won't be able to use the new boff on our main... same for Kartakin... Disappointing.
Not all of us play Jem'hadar chars and the fact that the weapon and the boff only being claimable for 1 single char, let alone only jem'hadar is not really valid for a pack of 9k zen. What do other people think?
Seconded. The fact that the Kar'takin is even restricted to this pack in the first place is kind of offensive, considering it's something that's been requested for Jem'Hadar for quite a while now.
"[GARBLED ELECTRONIC NOISES]"
- Thot Gar - Commanding Officer of the Braaktak Kaan
I still wish they chose to go with a Cardassian mini-faction instead of a Jem'Hadar one, Jem'Hadar just aren't interesting to me it's why I only made one and even then disguised them as a Breen.
I think it would have worked better if they had done a slightly different story and made it a Dominion faction with Vorta and aliengen playable, and if they had solved any animation issues Lifetime exclusive Changelings. The devs wanted to do a Jem'Hadar specific story, but that's not what many of the players wanted and that disconnect hurt the faction a lot imo.
What they really wanted to do was jump on the endgame-starting character class bandwagon with Tera and the other games that experimented with the idea as a way of wooing players who were bored with the traditional MMORPG leveling grind. The Jem'Hadar were ideal for that since they are essentially bio-androids with pre-programmed skills that come from a production-line of vats.
The only problem was that in order to support that new class as anything but simple mercenaries or whatever out of nowhere they had to provide at least a minimal support structure to make it palatable to players who pay attention to Trek and its canon, so they came up with Odo's expeditionary force to explain how beings who are considered nothing but living (and disposable) weapons systems could possibly be in command positions, and do it with the least time and effort on the part of the devs.
The thing is, on a roleplay and space Barbie level there is almost nothing to work with. Not only are they an eyesore no matter what you do with them, they are a completely one-trick-pony when it comes to roleplayability (the "sudden freedom" thing the devs made them for) because of the fact that they are in effect vat-created attack golems with no life experiences and just the skills they were programmed with during their creation. And to add insult to injury they are genderlocked which is not a good thing either.
Ironically, the Vorta the devs seem to look down on so much can use the same new freedom plot seed as the Jem'Hadar and are also prime candidates for an endgame-starting character since they are clones themselves (though as clones instead of constructs they retain the memories and life experiences of their originals) and they are shown to be combatants in DS9 though they tend to try and obscure that fact a lot.
If you look at what they do in the show and not just go by the propaganda Weyoun fed the Federation, they make the Tal Shiar, the Obsidian Order, and the Zhat Vash look like bumbling toothless amateurs. And for a lot of players, they have the space Barbie thing going FOR them instead of against them, and they don't ruffle feathers by being genderlocked eunuchs like the J'H, so if playable Vorta were added to the faction it would eliminate both irritations for the price of one.
I wonder if they just didn't have time because they changed the schedule to start work on the new star trek stuff. I get the feeling they were planning more with victory is life. But had to divert art team scheduling to prep for the new series which were announced during a lot of the work they were doing for victory is life. This is just speculation, I have no evidence this is only a gut feeling.
I want Vorta so bad, give me a enhanced hearing trait for ground. I would also like a space trait that is inspired by their underhanded nature, as well as there strategist role with in the dominion. They dropped the ball with the dominion faction that is for sure, other then tutorial the rest of the game works well. I'd rather have a tutorial that makes no sense then not have Vorta.
> @daimon97 said: > I dont like how the pack must be used on a jem char. So if our main is not a jem that means we won't be able to use the new boff on our main... same for Kartakin... Disappointing.
The reward pack is account bound but bind-on-equips so you can give the level up pack to your “recruit” and then transfer the weapons and boff pack to the “main.” I am pretty sure.
I would need to research who gave that explanation. I will add it here when I find it.
0
rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,577Community Moderator
I'll at least take the Kar'tarkin as an account unlock.
> @daimon97 said:
> I dont like how the pack must be used on a jem char. So if our main is not a jem that means we won't be able to use the new boff on our main... same for Kartakin... Disappointing.
The reward pack is account bound but bind-on-equips so you can give the level up pack to your “recruit” and then transfer the weapons and boff pack to the “main.” I am pretty sure.
I would need to research who gave that explanation. I will add it here when I find it.
Comments
Returning to my earlier comments on the polearm: it occurs to me that if those suggestions for its inclusion in the core game are taken up, the one in the bundle would be distinguished by a unique model, much as there exists one for bat'leths (the replica of Kahless' shard-sword, as I recall).
The cutscene would probably work best with a Vorta giving the PC orders instead of a J'H relaying orders from a Vorta at some headquarters, but the orders themselves would be the same (though explaining that the J'H troops are scattered and leaderless in the emergency and that the PC will have to fight their way through and gather them without support because there are no J'H available at the starting location would be a nice touch). DS9 showed several times that Vorta lead Jem'Hadar troops in the field just like the PC does a little later in the tutorial, so it fits the canon perfectly well.
And for that matter, the cutscene could be left just the way it is as a foreshadowing of the odd military structure Odo put together.
Replacing the shroud part would depend on what the Vorta get instead of the shroud. Something like (possibly improved) telekinesis and some sort of flanking resistance or flank counterstrike ability to represent their hearing-based situational awareness would be good possibilities for instance. Maybe the task for Vortas could be using the TK to force open a path to ambush the enemy instead of using the shroud to sneak around had flank them or knock lookouts or snipers off of their perches or something like that.
The ship sections are exactly right as is since in the show those ships would all commanded by Vorta anyway so the PC being a Vorta would simply mean Odo's expeditionary force would have a mix of traditional units and his weird J'H only ones with the PC being one of the traditional ones (example: Luaran). And Vorta leading landing parties is not too unusual either since both Kilana and Keevan are show doing exactly that, so the station assault parts are fine too.
The cutscene about issuing the white would have to be changed to Weyoun giving the PC the supply box or something like that though, or at least remove the part where he gives the PC a vial of it.
If the devs wanted to get really crazy they could always make it so that the boffs try to maneuver in a box formation with the Vorta in the center when possible instead of following the captain like they normally do.
I remember back when ViL was new the devs did not all seem to be 100% in agreement about limiting the faction to only horneytoads, but the ones in charge were part of the ones who wanted it that way so that is the way they did it.
I think the Cardassian's should have been included as an option for the Dominion sub-faction.
Having them, and Bajor, be part of the Federation in STO's ongoing timeline makes sense.
Not all Cardassians are traitors.
https://sto.fandom.com/wiki/True_Way_Alliance
I think it would have worked better if they had done a slightly different story and made it a Dominion faction with Vorta and aliengen playable, and if they had solved any animation issues Lifetime exclusive Changelings. The devs wanted to do a Jem'Hadar specific story, but that's not what many of the players wanted and that disconnect hurt the faction a lot imo.
What they really wanted to do was jump on the endgame-starting character class bandwagon with Tera and the other games that experimented with the idea as a way of wooing players who were bored with the traditional MMORPG leveling grind. The Jem'Hadar were ideal for that since they are essentially bio-androids with pre-programmed skills that come from a production-line of vats.
The only problem was that in order to support that new class as anything but simple mercenaries or whatever out of nowhere they had to provide at least a minimal support structure to make it palatable to players who pay attention to Trek and its canon, so they came up with Odo's expeditionary force to explain how beings who are considered nothing but living (and disposable) weapons systems could possibly be in command positions, and do it with the least time and effort on the part of the devs.
The thing is, on a roleplay and space Barbie level there is almost nothing to work with. Not only are they an eyesore no matter what you do with them, they are a completely one-trick-pony when it comes to roleplayability (the "sudden freedom" thing the devs made them for) because of the fact that they are in effect vat-created attack golems with no life experiences and just the skills they were programmed with during their creation. And to add insult to injury they are genderlocked which is not a good thing either.
Ironically, the Vorta the devs seem to look down on so much can use the same new freedom plot seed as the Jem'Hadar and are also prime candidates for an endgame-starting character since they are clones themselves (though as clones instead of constructs they retain the memories and life experiences of their originals) and they are shown to be combatants in DS9 though they tend to try and obscure that fact a lot.
If you look at what they do in the show and not just go by the propaganda Weyoun fed the Federation, they make the Tal Shiar, the Obsidian Order, and the Zhat Vash look like bumbling toothless amateurs. And for a lot of players, they have the space Barbie thing going FOR them instead of against them, and they don't ruffle feathers by being genderlocked eunuchs like the J'H, so if playable Vorta were added to the faction it would eliminate both irritations for the price of one.
I'm glad Cryptic has already responded by improving the starship trait a bit, well done. I do think the Weyoun & the Dominion ground weapon should be for any Dominion toon on an account & NOT just 1. That would make this any easy sell imo.
Not really anything to clarify, owning the Legendary will unlock it just like owning the T5 and Strike Ship variants does now. That requirement actually went live before the ship was even announced, so a lot of people already knew the Legendary was coming.
Current unlock conditions is:
Blog hinted any Jem'Hadar ship with a hangar would work in addition to the Dreadnought Cruisers.
Nothing to be ashamed of, if you like and can play Jem'Hadar then making toons for all three departments is only sensible for a number of reasons (including the ability to mix and match with the various ships, which themselves usually lean towards a particular department).
In my case, I cannot get into the heads of the hornytoads so playing one is a surprisingly boring and tedious grind (I play MMORPGs from a roleplay perspective), so that is the only faction I dont have at least one of each department for (then again I am a bit of an altaholic with around thirty characters spread between two accounts, and one Gamma recruit which is just a necessary evil to get a few of the benefits (but none of the ones that require the thing to do ground content) to the characters I can actually stand to play). I suppose that it doesn't help that in DS9 they were meant to be nothing more than faceless, nameless obstacles for the heroes to fight through and that realworld toads are not exactly my favorite creatures.
I do like playing Vorta, and I like the bugships, and this particular ship would fit very well with my playstyle so I would be tempted if it was not for the fact that the considerable extra expense compared to c-store ships would be totally wasted. If they did make the Weyoun clone and the ground weapon available to the other characters on an account I would rather they not restrict that to just horneytoads, if they did make them available to everyone on it regardless of faction it would feel like less of a waste since I could use them with my faux-Vorta characters.
- Thot Gar - Commanding Officer of the Braaktak Kaan
I wonder if they just didn't have time because they changed the schedule to start work on the new star trek stuff. I get the feeling they were planning more with victory is life. But had to divert art team scheduling to prep for the new series which were announced during a lot of the work they were doing for victory is life. This is just speculation, I have no evidence this is only a gut feeling.
I want Vorta so bad, give me a enhanced hearing trait for ground. I would also like a space trait that is inspired by their underhanded nature, as well as there strategist role with in the dominion. They dropped the ball with the dominion faction that is for sure, other then tutorial the rest of the game works well. I'd rather have a tutorial that makes no sense then not have Vorta.
Here:
> I dont like how the pack must be used on a jem char. So if our main is not a jem that means we won't be able to use the new boff on our main... same for Kartakin... Disappointing.
The reward pack is account bound but bind-on-equips so you can give the level up pack to your “recruit” and then transfer the weapons and boff pack to the “main.” I am pretty sure.
I would need to research who gave that explanation. I will add it here when I find it.
Thank you and I really hope that is the case
Ah well I will be buying the pack for the ship anyway haha so not that big of a deal I guess