Why? There is NOTHING broken with it and complex? NOT really. They should dedicate the time to fix other stuff like create NEW content, another full or semi faction or even give some love to PvP? This would be like the 3rd time they touch the same stuff and IMO useless waste of time from what I see so far. I know some peeps might say well these are developers and NOT bug hunters...still they should devote the resources to something else. If ain't broken why fix it?
This, !!!
Cryptic is repairing something that ain't broken, and i think they will break it now !!
People have been begging for a skill revamp for a long time now. They do something players are asking for and get bitched at. What exactly is their motivation to continue to listen to people?
What people? I don't recall anyone asking for a complete skill revamp. Probably a few floating around I guess.
To suggest they are doing this because of players asking for it is nothing but theoretical.
Anyway, I'm going to hold judgment until actual release on holodeck. I expect changes to it currently to what is seen on Tribble, because some elements to it doesn't make any sense.
It is not theoretical, it has been brought up many many times in various forum threads, been asked in interviews with devs on multiple occasions, bandied around on reddit, etc. Whether you saw it or not people have been asking about a skill system revamp for a long time.
@azrael605 is right it has been brought up many times before, on these very forums, Reddit and in game. I'll admit I was one that was asking for ground and space skills to have separate pools from which experience was taken from when selecting skills.
Why? There is NOTHING broken with it and complex? NOT really. They should dedicate the time to fix other stuff like create NEW content, another full or semi faction or even give some love to PvP? This would be like the 3rd time they touch the same stuff and IMO useless waste of time from what I see so far. I know some peeps might say well these are developers and NOT bug hunters...still they should devote the resources to something else. If ain't broken why fix it?
This, !!!
Cryptic is repairing something that ain't broken, and i think they will break it now !!
People have been begging for a skill revamp for a long time now. They do something players are asking for and get bitched at. What exactly is their motivation to continue to listen to people?
What people? I don't recall anyone asking for a complete skill revamp. Probably a few floating around I guess.
To suggest they are doing this because of players asking for it is nothing but theoretical.
Anyway, I'm going to hold judgment until actual release on holodeck. I expect changes to it currently to what is seen on Tribble, because some elements to it doesn't make any sense.
It is not theoretical, it has been brought up many many times in various forum threads, been asked in interviews with devs on multiple occasions, bandied around on reddit, etc. Whether you saw it or not people have been asking about a skill system revamp for a long time.
I'll have to take your word for it, I don't feel like search on the forums and I don't use social media. Still, as you know, that represents a very small portion of the players as a whole and I still stand by this decision has nothing to do with player's request, but that's just a guess, nothing official has been said on how this came about.
I'll have to take your word for it, I don't feel like search on the forums and I don't use social media. Still, as you know, that represents a very small portion of the players as a whole and I still stand by this decision has nothing to do with player's request, but that's just a guess, nothing official has been said on how this came about.
Or you could look in the OP to see the poll results.... Over 50% approval.
But hey cryptic loves to reinvent the same stuff over and over until they break it rather than address stuff that is actually broken or unbalanced. After another skill revamp how about another esd revamp due to the new temporal drama? Kdf of course and romulans will get diddly squat.
I'll have to take your word for it, I don't feel like search on the forums and I don't use social media. Still, as you know, that represents a very small portion of the players as a whole and I still stand by this decision has nothing to do with player's request, but that's just a guess, nothing official has been said on how this came about.
Or you could look in the OP to see the poll results.... Over 50% approval.
We are talking about a complete revamp not just adjustments to the current model. Either case, about half wishes it. That doesn't yield anything, it just shows we have no idea what we want.
Retired. I'm now in search for that perfect space anomaly.
I'll have to take your word for it, I don't feel like search on the forums and I don't use social media. Still, as you know, that represents a very small portion of the players as a whole and I still stand by this decision has nothing to do with player's request, but that's just a guess, nothing official has been said on how this came about.
Or you could look in the OP to see the poll results.... Over 50% approval.
We are talking about a complete revamp not just adjustments to the current model. Either case, about half wishes it. That doesn't yield anything, it just shows we have no idea what we want.
There have been 17 Presidential elections in the United States since World War II ended. Only 4 of those had a winner who received over 55% of the popular vote. This is in a system where most of those were choices between 2 people. In this poll, there is a third option that's way more popular than the third option in all but 1 of those elections, and the leader is still over 50%, and beating the second place vote by over 20%. For things that matter to people, it is very often a matter of a few percentage points swung one way or the other.
This is an MMO, not a Star Trek episode simulator. That would make for a terrible game.
I dislike someone stating that I have no idea what I want. I do want a skills revamp. Do I care if things break because of it? Sure. I hate when things break. However, I think the boff change was pretty good, so I'm of the opinion that this could be pretty good too.
It's becoming more and more clear that when changes happen like this, this community actually has no idea what it is they want, partly because they don't even know what it is they are complaining about, even if they think they do. This is evident by at least two things:
1. Every other post is either "oh this is utterly horrible and messed up!" in between posts of "this is wonderful and absolutely necessary!".
2. Those who do complain about the change, are complaining about things that are technically benefits and not losses - "wait... so you mean I'm getting this skill AND this skill all in ONE?... sigh! this SUCKS! I'm not playing this game anymore..."
The current skill-tree is ugly and confusing. They have improved it over the years for better understanding, but it is still messy.
9 skills on each skill-ability, and the last three just give you a just a 5+ boost per point, why?
Why not scaling down the options to 3-4 (25% each with a total 0f 100% if four points is set)
I have not touched the new skill-tree, just read the blogs about it. I am sure the skill tree has its problems.
But the thing is that the skill-tree how it is today is scaring people away.
Star Trek Online has a "deep" learning curve to begin with, they really need to simplify stuff on the double, cause some things just feel uneccesary-complicated.
Example, quoted from the sto wiki about shields
The [Shield Array] has balanced stats compared to the three below.
The [Covariant Shield Array] has a 10% higher maximum capacity, but 25% slower regeneration rate.
The [Regenerative Shield Array] has a 25% faster regeneration rate, but 10% lower maximum capacity.
The [Resilient Shield Array] has 5% lower capacity and regeneration, but allows for 5% absorption and 5% bleedthrough, as opposed to the normal 10% bleedthrough.
[Cap] increases Maximum Capacity by 10%
[Reg] increases Shield Regeneration by 10%
[Dis] reduces Disruptor Damage by 20%
[Pha] reduces Phaser Damage by 20%
[Pla] reduces Plasma Damage by 20%
[Pol] reduces Polaron Damage by 20%
[Tet] reduces Tetryon Damage by 20%
[Ap] reduces Antiproton Damage by 20%
[Amp] Amplifies incoming healing by 10%
[Adapt] When your shields are hit, Adaptive Shielding gains one charge, increasing your Shields' resistance to the incoming damage type by 2% for 30 seconds. Stacks up to 10 times.
[ResA] Reduces Phaser, Polaron and Tetryon damage to shields by 15%
[ResB] Reduces Disruptor, Plasma and Antiproton damage to shields by 15%
Really? REALLY?
I don't call this a choice on play-style, I call this messed up.
This revamp will be a big nerv on all my ground builds (and a little on my space builds).
Space build now is 66.000 of 366.000 = 18% of skills for ground
Ground build is 100.000 of 366.000 = 27% of skills for ground.
Revamps system 10 of 56 = 17.8 % skills for ground.
So again they remove something from this game.
One can only hope that the results will be closer to the Admiralty system than the Specialization revamp; the former has worked out well, but the latter is still a bottomless pit...
Expendables Fleet: Andrew - Bajoran Fed Engineer Ken'taura - Rom/Fed Scientist Gwyllim - Human Fed Delta Tac Savik - Vulcan Fed Temporal Sci Dahar Masters Fleet: Alphal'Fa - Alien KDF Engineer Qun'pau - Rom/KDF Engineer D'nesh - Orion KDF Scientist Ghen'khan - Liberated KDF Tac Welcome to StarBug Online - to boldly Bug where no bug has been before!
STO player since November 2013
After trying out the WIP version ? Absolutely yes. Think it's a very positive step towards making ship roles relevant again for one thing.
Seems to me it's making them relevant in the wrong way IMO. As a Tactical Captain, I need to invest points in Science to unlock the recipe for BFaW III?
Of course, I mean- what infantry soldier wouldn't need to learn theoretical physics in order to pull a trigger? Pounds of force applied, etc. :P
It's not you- it's me. I just need my space.
Being critical doesn't take skill. Being constructively critical- which is providing alternative solutions or suggestions to a demonstrated problem, however, does.
I voted no because I do not want WoW in Space, the dumbing down of games so that it will "get" newer players only deminishes the final product and came play. look at what became of WoW or whats begining to happen in SW old Republic or a host of other games that have gone done this road. Soon after all originality has been stripped and every one has the same ship, same build, same toon, same everything. It starts little....... face it. if they cant find the time to play the game right and learn it, Do ya really want them, kinda like the guy in the turn lane in front of ya txt'ing when the arrows green
I voted no because I do not want WoW in Space, the dumbing down of games so that it will "get" newer players only deminishes the final product and came play. look at what became of WoW or whats begining to happen in SW old Republic or a host of other games that have gone done this road. Soon after all originality has been stripped and every one has the same ship, same build, same toon, same everything. It starts little....... face it. if they cant find the time to play the game right and learn it, Do ya really want them, kinda like the guy in the turn lane in front of ya txt'ing when the arrows green
^ this person gets it.
When WoW changed the skill trees to be similar to "Diablo III" and it became dumbed down (my theory was in preparation for future console release) it stripped any originality from character builds and shoehorned everyone into the same specs and choices. There's many people out in the world who don't give two shakes for "efficient builds" or "min/maxing" and just simply want to have fun and experience what they want- even if it means it's not the "right" way (according to the self-proclaimed "experts") and it should be available as a choice.
I don't understand why having choices is so "threatening" to those who want to minimize or reduce choices in games- if it's not the way YOU play then so be it. But stop trying to make everyone else's game into what you want it to be.
It's not you- it's me. I just need my space.
Being critical doesn't take skill. Being constructively critical- which is providing alternative solutions or suggestions to a demonstrated problem, however, does.
The reason for the change is simple. They are hoping to gain new players this anniversary year. Imagine you are a kiddie who goes out and sees the new movie and likes it and then checks out the game. When he gets to the skill points in the current system and compares them to the tonka trees in the other games he plays his head will explode. They have to make our trees look the same and be as simple as a phone game because that is the target audience.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
And I don't get it. What's wrong with the skill system now? If you don't like your skills, just reset them.
The biggest problem I see is respec tokens. You can't just 'reset them' it's a 500 Zen investment every time you want to change your skills. If you're gold, you would be able to respec for 'free' once a month and that would consume your entire stipend. Even the new system, everyone gets one free respec. Really? One? So I don't get to play with the system? I get one shot to make it perfect and then it's 500 Zen if I make a mistake? TRIBBLE that, my only option will be to not play until people post optimized builds since I get only one shot, just like now. I'm not going to blow all my dilithium on respec tokens, not going to happen.
Honestly, a week ago, I would have said 'hell yes' to a skill revamp, but after reading up and watching some videos from Tribble, I'm not excited in the least for this new system. It just doesn't look good to me, I'm not saying it's a bad system, but Cryptic is wanted to move the game in a different direction then my personal preference. They're trying to make Damage ships soft, Tank ships tough, etc to encourage team play. I'm not saying this is bad or wrong, it's just not what I want and to me it looks like a tremendous nerf.
I definitely don't want the new system, once it goes live I'll take an extended break and wait and see what people are able to do with builds before I decide if I'm coming back or not. If it turns out to be the massive nerf that I fear that it is, then the decision to stay gone will be an easy one.
The point of the new skill system is that there are no bad choices anymore and you can select almost any of the skills without feeling like it's subpar. So you don't need to wait for someone to post an "optimized build" If such a thing even exists anymore, because you have the ability to think for yourself.
Honestly it's like people think the new skill system is written in Calculus or something, its easier to understand than ever before.
Comments
@azrael605 is right it has been brought up many times before, on these very forums, Reddit and in game. I'll admit I was one that was asking for ground and space skills to have separate pools from which experience was taken from when selecting skills.
I'll have to take your word for it, I don't feel like search on the forums and I don't use social media. Still, as you know, that represents a very small portion of the players as a whole and I still stand by this decision has nothing to do with player's request, but that's just a guess, nothing official has been said on how this came about.
Adding to your post totals eh?
My character Tsin'xing
But hey cryptic loves to reinvent the same stuff over and over until they break it rather than address stuff that is actually broken or unbalanced. After another skill revamp how about another esd revamp due to the new temporal drama? Kdf of course and romulans will get diddly squat.
We are talking about a complete revamp not just adjustments to the current model. Either case, about half wishes it. That doesn't yield anything, it just shows we have no idea what we want.
There have been 17 Presidential elections in the United States since World War II ended. Only 4 of those had a winner who received over 55% of the popular vote. This is in a system where most of those were choices between 2 people. In this poll, there is a third option that's way more popular than the third option in all but 1 of those elections, and the leader is still over 50%, and beating the second place vote by over 20%. For things that matter to people, it is very often a matter of a few percentage points swung one way or the other.
1. Every other post is either "oh this is utterly horrible and messed up!" in between posts of "this is wonderful and absolutely necessary!".
2. Those who do complain about the change, are complaining about things that are technically benefits and not losses - "wait... so you mean I'm getting this skill AND this skill all in ONE?... sigh! this SUCKS! I'm not playing this game anymore..."
This is so hilarious...
The current skill-tree is ugly and confusing. They have improved it over the years for better understanding, but it is still messy.
9 skills on each skill-ability, and the last three just give you a just a 5+ boost per point, why?
Why not scaling down the options to 3-4 (25% each with a total 0f 100% if four points is set)
I have not touched the new skill-tree, just read the blogs about it. I am sure the skill tree has its problems.
But the thing is that the skill-tree how it is today is scaring people away.
Star Trek Online has a "deep" learning curve to begin with, they really need to simplify stuff on the double, cause some things just feel uneccesary-complicated.
Example, quoted from the sto wiki about shields
The [Shield Array] has balanced stats compared to the three below.
The [Covariant Shield Array] has a 10% higher maximum capacity, but 25% slower regeneration rate.
The [Regenerative Shield Array] has a 25% faster regeneration rate, but 10% lower maximum capacity.
The [Resilient Shield Array] has 5% lower capacity and regeneration, but allows for 5% absorption and 5% bleedthrough, as opposed to the normal 10% bleedthrough.
[Cap] increases Maximum Capacity by 10%
[Reg] increases Shield Regeneration by 10%
[Dis] reduces Disruptor Damage by 20%
[Pha] reduces Phaser Damage by 20%
[Pla] reduces Plasma Damage by 20%
[Pol] reduces Polaron Damage by 20%
[Tet] reduces Tetryon Damage by 20%
[Ap] reduces Antiproton Damage by 20%
[Amp] Amplifies incoming healing by 10%
[Adapt] When your shields are hit, Adaptive Shielding gains one charge, increasing your Shields' resistance to the incoming damage type by 2% for 30 seconds. Stacks up to 10 times.
[ResA] Reduces Phaser, Polaron and Tetryon damage to shields by 15%
[ResB] Reduces Disruptor, Plasma and Antiproton damage to shields by 15%
Really? REALLY?
I don't call this a choice on play-style, I call this messed up.
Space build now is 66.000 of 366.000 = 18% of skills for ground
Ground build is 100.000 of 366.000 = 27% of skills for ground.
Revamps system 10 of 56 = 17.8 % skills for ground.
So again they remove something from this game.
Savik - Vulcan Fed Temporal Sci
Dahar Masters Fleet: Alphal'Fa - Alien KDF Engineer Qun'pau - Rom/KDF Engineer D'nesh - Orion KDF Scientist Ghen'khan - Liberated KDF Tac
Welcome to StarBug Online - to boldly Bug where no bug has been before!
STO player since November 2013
Of course, I mean- what infantry soldier wouldn't need to learn theoretical physics in order to pull a trigger? Pounds of force applied, etc. :P
Being critical doesn't take skill. Being constructively critical- which is providing alternative solutions or suggestions to a demonstrated problem, however, does.
But it's happening. So, I'm gonna wait for it to hit the beta test serv...er, I meant Holodeck before I make a final judgement.
^ this person gets it.
When WoW changed the skill trees to be similar to "Diablo III" and it became dumbed down (my theory was in preparation for future console release) it stripped any originality from character builds and shoehorned everyone into the same specs and choices. There's many people out in the world who don't give two shakes for "efficient builds" or "min/maxing" and just simply want to have fun and experience what they want- even if it means it's not the "right" way (according to the self-proclaimed "experts") and it should be available as a choice.
I don't understand why having choices is so "threatening" to those who want to minimize or reduce choices in games- if it's not the way YOU play then so be it. But stop trying to make everyone else's game into what you want it to be.
Being critical doesn't take skill. Being constructively critical- which is providing alternative solutions or suggestions to a demonstrated problem, however, does.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Naaaaa!
i.imgur.com/LGpIGVB.png
FREE HONG KONG! *
i.imgur.com/LGpIGVB.png
FREE HONG KONG! *
The biggest problem I see is respec tokens. You can't just 'reset them' it's a 500 Zen investment every time you want to change your skills. If you're gold, you would be able to respec for 'free' once a month and that would consume your entire stipend. Even the new system, everyone gets one free respec. Really? One? So I don't get to play with the system? I get one shot to make it perfect and then it's 500 Zen if I make a mistake? TRIBBLE that, my only option will be to not play until people post optimized builds since I get only one shot, just like now. I'm not going to blow all my dilithium on respec tokens, not going to happen.
Honestly, a week ago, I would have said 'hell yes' to a skill revamp, but after reading up and watching some videos from Tribble, I'm not excited in the least for this new system. It just doesn't look good to me, I'm not saying it's a bad system, but Cryptic is wanted to move the game in a different direction then my personal preference. They're trying to make Damage ships soft, Tank ships tough, etc to encourage team play. I'm not saying this is bad or wrong, it's just not what I want and to me it looks like a tremendous nerf.
I definitely don't want the new system, once it goes live I'll take an extended break and wait and see what people are able to do with builds before I decide if I'm coming back or not. If it turns out to be the massive nerf that I fear that it is, then the decision to stay gone will be an easy one.
Honestly it's like people think the new skill system is written in Calculus or something, its easier to understand than ever before.