Back to the OP, that is dang funny. I don't understand why the WBC would want to picket Nimoy's funeral in the first place. God hates Vulcans? I don't get it. I guess it would give them attention, which, is what they want most in order to spew hate or intolerance.
I hope they are equally unsuccessful in their future endeavors.
"After a time, you may find that having is not so pleasing a thing after all as wanting. It is not logical, but it is often true. Except for a T5 Connie. That would be f*%#ing awesome." - Mr. Spock
The Pew Survey chart where it lists the religion vs. number of answered questions disproves that. It lists Atheists/Agnostics at 20.9, Jews at 20.5, and Mormons at 20.3. The numbers are far too close to say a belief in god decreases as knowledge increases.
It also lists race to differentiate between Catholic and Protestant like White Catholic getting 16.0 and Hispanic Catholic getting 11.6 so a person's circumstances has a huge effect on their knowledge which has absolutely nothing to do with religion.
The pew survey chart ins't intended to show anything in regards to intelligence of those surveyed. Its intended to show how well educated people are when asked a standard set of religious questions. It is saying that Atheists along with followers of Judaism and Mormonism tend to have the best all around knowledge of religion.
Read what the words say instead of just looking at the pictures.
As for circumstance, yes that is what the study found.
When thinking about the study the outcome is pretty obvious to anyone that thinks about the nature of the test. In general Atheists are not often born into there belief system, at this point in human development the majority find there way there. Meaning they have knowledge of at least one other system of belief and often educate themselves further in other religions before choosing to identify themselves as Atheists. As for Mormonism, I can only assume as a still growing religion the same mostly holds true. Where followers are more likely to have some more exposure to religions outside of there own. Judaism is a more interesting study. I know the amount of study performed by those born into it is higher then most other religions. I find it interesting, as I believe it could also be related to there religions unique place in the world. Does all the conflict and geopolitical realities that fact that religion lead to followers that are better educated in terms of other religions. That is a possibility. As for the rest yes your correct often people born into there religion have very little understanding outside of what they have been told.
In general Atheists are not often born into there belief system, at this point in human development the majority find there way there.
Everybody is born atheistic, babies are taught religion by their parents.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
I thought this was an interesting article to insert at this point.
It's not causation, it's correlation; a lot of people with high IQs are scientists, and scientists, myself included, are likely to be non-religious.
Now, that doesn't mean that belief in a deity is inversely proportional to intelligence; I know many highly intelligent people of various denominations and faiths (and one deist), including my deist roommate, my Wiccan friend, several Muslim friends, and that cool guy who goes around campus smiling and telling everybody that Jesus loves them.
I gave the last guy a ten-minute explanation of my personal beliefs, and he didn't stop smiling once. He's a great guy, as long as you don't mind constant Jesus talk. And he doesn't do any of the racism/sexism/homophobia/anti-abortion/etc. that so many fundamentalists do.
Anyway. tl;dr: That study shows a correlation, not a causation. And, speaking as a sort-of not-really it's-more-complicated-than-that atheist, there's nothing at all inherently wrong with religion or religious people.
Everyone is also born toothless, helpless and dependent. Your point?
Oh that's right, teeth are social constructs right :rolleyes:.
Teeth are still there as we are born, they don't break the skin until later. Survival instinct and self dependability develop naturally amongst all life forms, including humans.
Religion is taught not instinctive. If it were instinctive, there would be no need for organisation amongst religions institutions would they?
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Anyone claiming that religious beliefs have an impact on intelligence is a fool. Intelligence comes from how much you learn..If you stop stimulating your brain by not engaging in activities which strengthen your mind (like going to school), naturally your IQ will decrease regardless of what you believe.
Religion is taught not instinctive. If it were instinctive, there would be no need for organisation amongst religions institutions would they?
Using the same reasoning, all hierarchies are taught, not instinctive - except that most social animals, from wolves to fish to birds to apes to humans, instinctively organize into a hierarchy of some sort. What we have to teach children (and each other, often) is how to organize the hierarchy so that we're more than just a pack led by the one who can kick the most butt.
I believe, however, that you make the common mistake of confusing "religion" and "faith". Religion is a codified faith; without one, historically humans have tended to start with faith, then start building rules around it, usually for the benefit of the strong guy at the top of the basic heirarchy. (A priest who can convince the populace that Big Phil is given his butt-kicking ability by the gods will find that Big Phil will make sure he's taken care of...)
Oh that's right, teeth are social constructs right :rolleyes:.
Teeth are still there as we are born, they don't break the skin until later. Survival instinct and self dependability develop naturally amongst all life forms, including humans.
Religion is taught not instinctive. If it were instinctive, there would be no need for organisation amongst religions institutions would they?
I'm not going to go dig this study up... nor do I defend the idea of religion.
Just wanted to point out that the idea of religion being instinctive has been studied. It is very possible that we do have an instinct built into us to "believe" in something greater. One hypothesis posed by the study I am thinking of was that for our ancient ancestors a willingness to believe may have increase survival chances. As it may have made them more bold in general, and allowed them to take some risks to self, for the good of offspring ect. that helped the species survive. (the idea being that animals may do these things for there offspring, but in the case of humans once we became self aware the notion of taking major risks would have become harder to do... at which point subsets of the species that did not believe may have been replaced by those more biologically prone to believe, standard evolution would have taken hold. With the group prone to belief in an afterlife replacing those less willing and therefore more risk adverse)
There was also an oxford study not that long ago involving children of many different nationalities and backgrounds... I don't remember all the details right now. I believe the bottom line was children where more prone to believe in supernatural. They also drew some conclusions that it may have been an instinct to help the young survive. As the same children attributed the same supernatural properties to there mothers. Something like that anyway.
In any event, just wanted to point out... religion is instinctual I think that is clear. If it wasn't we would have more atheists societies in history and we don't People are inclined to believe something. I think if anything that is more of a factor to disprove the reality of any one religion. As humans always seem to invent a form of religion. Are the Gods of the Pantheon or the Norse any less valid then more popular modern day religions.
There are also studies that show, it is not intelligence levels the determine belief as much as it is Social networks. Myself I tend to believe the complete truth is in the middle of that somewhere. Clearly there is a correlation between intelligence and faith, and there is also something to the idea of the strength of the social network affecting faith levels as well.
People believe irrational things-proof is the popularity of Socialism
Hey! Socialism's a perfectly workable economic model!
'course, Communism has a lot more problems--you just can't collectivize farms. Factories, yeah, government control is doable and arguably a good thing, but farms are just too much f*cking SPACE.
Communism only works with one or more of the following conditions:
Unlmited resources
Centuries of cultural legacy of successful communism.
Everybody is born atheistic, babies are taught religion by their parents.
Atheistic is the wrong term since they would have to believe that god doesn't exist. Agnostic almost fits, but it still requires thought to make a person agnostic. So a person has to go with the third option about whether god exists or doesn't exist to be Agnostic. Agnostic is different from "I haven't actually thought about whether god exists or not" which is where babies are currently at.
Using the same reasoning, all hierarchies are taught, not instinctive - except that most social animals, from wolves to fish to birds to apes to humans, instinctively organize into a hierarchy of some sort. What we have to teach children (and each other, often) is how to organize the hierarchy so that we're more than just a pack led by the one who can kick the most butt.
I believe, however, that you make the common mistake of confusing "religion" and "faith". Religion is a codified faith; without one, historically humans have tended to start with faith, then start building rules around it, usually for the benefit of the strong guy at the top of the basic heirarchy. (A priest who can convince the populace that Big Phil is given his butt-kicking ability by the gods will find that Big Phil will make sure he's taken care of...)
Not exactly, leave people alone and the hierarchies will become apparent i.e. 'rule of the strong'. What humans have to be taught is socially accepted or enforced hierarchies.
Same goes for your second point, leave people to make their own way and they develop their own opinions including their own acceptance of concepts that are not supported by evidence (for good or ill), specific religions are taught, not arrived upon.
Humans all start off atheistic to all gods, later they become atheistic to certain ones depending on their own conclusions or how they are told to believe. Some remain atheistic to all gods, universal (Deism) or personal (i.e. gods of religions).
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Atheistic is the wrong term since they would have to believe that god doesn't exist. Agnostic almost fits, but it still requires thought to make a person agnostic. So a person has to go with the third option about whether god exists or doesn't exist to be Agnostic. Agnostic is different from "I haven't actually thought about whether god exists or not" which is where babies are currently at.
Also, how can one be born with a belief system if as babies, we have not yet developed the intelligence to think about these concepts?
Okay, we get it. We all think we're right, we all think the others are wrong. Can we just agree to disagree and shut the f*ck up?
It doesn't help anything to argue! What the hell are you doing, seriously? People have different beliefs, and that's usual and based on so many f*cking factors we don't have the MENTAL CAPACITIY to understand them all.
So, stop wasting your time and other's and society's, and just give up on this pointless drivel and general argumentative behavior.
Atheistic is the wrong term since they would have to believe that god doesn't exist. Agnostic almost fits, but it still requires thought to make a person agnostic. So a person has to go with the third option about whether god exists or doesn't exist to be Agnostic. Agnostic is different from "I haven't actually thought about whether god exists or not" which is where babies are currently at.
That really is a matter of social linguistics as to exactly how people define those words.
I use it to mean 'without-gods' i.e. its literal definition, a child does not believe in the non existence of a concept it has not yet been introduced to, any more than any other concepts.
A young child cannot be agnostic (i.e. unsure) to something it has not yet been introduced to any way.
It doesn't really matter to me either way essentially, as I'm a agnostic apatheist towards a universal deity anyway (and a atheistic antitheist towards the personal deities of religions).
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
well, so is Feudalism, Worffan-but then, Socialism is Feudalism with the serial numbers filed off.
The Lord collects the product of the Serfs, and redistributes it in a way that maintains his power.
Whether that's by making sure he has lots of supporters dependent on him economically to work the phones and go to the polls, or lots of supporters dependent on him economically to go into the ville and bust heads directly is cosmetics.
In Socialism, and in Feudalism, the governing hierarchy owns the means of production, and distributes the produced wealth to their benefit and sets rules according to what the men at the top think is right in order to retain their position over the mass of serfs.
Only at the most basic level.
Feudalism is by the nobility, for the nobility. Socialism is citizen's councils distributing wealth for the maximum benefit of all citizens.
Yes, there is a central economic plan. However, the socialist leader's mandate is to the citizenry, and xir office is bound to distribute wealth to all, rather than to keep it for the leader and distribute the bare minimum to others.
Like any other system, it works better on paper than in practice (hell, even capitalism, which I despise, works fine on paper--bad people just hijack it far, far too easily in practice). But a proper socialistic state has several levels of safeguards that a capitalistic or feudalistic state does not.
Trust me on this, I'm a socialist myself, I've put a lot of study into this.
So...when your politician finishes his term, he doesn't have a lifetime pension that pretty much guarantees he'll never need work again? Your socialist paradise doesn't give government employees and selected groups special exemptions from enacted laws, including laws regarding health insurance and taxation? your government doesn't selectively approve special tax exemptions based on whether a group or groups is supportive of the dominant party?
Worffan, you must understand-I started out in my late teens as a socialist, I studied the theory, and I studied the practical side, and was even involved into my late twenties in Labor unions as an active member.
I've probably studied more of it, more extensively, than you have.
Considering he's a college kid last I recall, yea, you have.
So...when your politician finishes his term, he doesn't have a lifetime pension that pretty much guarantees he'll never need work again? Your socialist paradise doesn't give government employees and selected groups special exemptions from enacted laws, including laws regarding health insurance and taxation? your government doesn't selectively approve special tax exemptions based on whether a group or groups is supportive of the dominant party?
Worffan, you must understand-I started out in my late teens as a socialist, I studied the theory, and I studied the practical side, and was even involved into my late twenties in Labor unions as an active member.
I've probably studied more of it, more extensively, than you have.
Nope.
Government employees are not exempt. That's the point of equality. Everybody is subject to the same laws.
Part 2:
OK. I submit that you have a decade or three on me (dunno how much).
I also submit that you grew up during the 20th century, surrounded by a hefty amount of American propaganda about the Dirty Commies* and conservative culture.
I'm...well, not convinced.
And to be fair, we're two dudes on the Internet. Neither of us is going to convince the other.
*Not denying that China and the USSR were sh*tty places, and great examples of why collectivized farming is lunacy, but there's a difference between communism, socialism, and North Korean asininity.
True, but frankly, I'm burned out from 2 big papers, a midterm, and a nasty bout of food poisoning.
Maybe not right now?
perhaps if you hadn't had eaten both those papers you wouldn't be having food poisoning right now...
:P
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
And I misread that to say that you guys ate Sharpies. THAT would do it... :eek:
Still not sure what Sharples is.
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-) Proudly F2P.Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
Comments
I hope they are equally unsuccessful in their future endeavors.
The pew survey chart ins't intended to show anything in regards to intelligence of those surveyed. Its intended to show how well educated people are when asked a standard set of religious questions. It is saying that Atheists along with followers of Judaism and Mormonism tend to have the best all around knowledge of religion.
Read what the words say instead of just looking at the pictures.
As for circumstance, yes that is what the study found.
When thinking about the study the outcome is pretty obvious to anyone that thinks about the nature of the test. In general Atheists are not often born into there belief system, at this point in human development the majority find there way there. Meaning they have knowledge of at least one other system of belief and often educate themselves further in other religions before choosing to identify themselves as Atheists. As for Mormonism, I can only assume as a still growing religion the same mostly holds true. Where followers are more likely to have some more exposure to religions outside of there own. Judaism is a more interesting study. I know the amount of study performed by those born into it is higher then most other religions. I find it interesting, as I believe it could also be related to there religions unique place in the world. Does all the conflict and geopolitical realities that fact that religion lead to followers that are better educated in terms of other religions. That is a possibility. As for the rest yes your correct often people born into there religion have very little understanding outside of what they have been told.
Everybody is born atheistic, babies are taught religion by their parents.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
It's not causation, it's correlation; a lot of people with high IQs are scientists, and scientists, myself included, are likely to be non-religious.
Now, that doesn't mean that belief in a deity is inversely proportional to intelligence; I know many highly intelligent people of various denominations and faiths (and one deist), including my deist roommate, my Wiccan friend, several Muslim friends, and that cool guy who goes around campus smiling and telling everybody that Jesus loves them.
I gave the last guy a ten-minute explanation of my personal beliefs, and he didn't stop smiling once. He's a great guy, as long as you don't mind constant Jesus talk. And he doesn't do any of the racism/sexism/homophobia/anti-abortion/etc. that so many fundamentalists do.
Anyway. tl;dr: That study shows a correlation, not a causation. And, speaking as a sort-of not-really it's-more-complicated-than-that atheist, there's nothing at all inherently wrong with religion or religious people.
Oh that's right, teeth are social constructs right :rolleyes:.
Teeth are still there as we are born, they don't break the skin until later. Survival instinct and self dependability develop naturally amongst all life forms, including humans.
Religion is taught not instinctive. If it were instinctive, there would be no need for organisation amongst religions institutions would they?
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
I believe, however, that you make the common mistake of confusing "religion" and "faith". Religion is a codified faith; without one, historically humans have tended to start with faith, then start building rules around it, usually for the benefit of the strong guy at the top of the basic heirarchy. (A priest who can convince the populace that Big Phil is given his butt-kicking ability by the gods will find that Big Phil will make sure he's taken care of...)
I'm not going to go dig this study up... nor do I defend the idea of religion.
Just wanted to point out that the idea of religion being instinctive has been studied. It is very possible that we do have an instinct built into us to "believe" in something greater. One hypothesis posed by the study I am thinking of was that for our ancient ancestors a willingness to believe may have increase survival chances. As it may have made them more bold in general, and allowed them to take some risks to self, for the good of offspring ect. that helped the species survive. (the idea being that animals may do these things for there offspring, but in the case of humans once we became self aware the notion of taking major risks would have become harder to do... at which point subsets of the species that did not believe may have been replaced by those more biologically prone to believe, standard evolution would have taken hold. With the group prone to belief in an afterlife replacing those less willing and therefore more risk adverse)
There was also an oxford study not that long ago involving children of many different nationalities and backgrounds... I don't remember all the details right now. I believe the bottom line was children where more prone to believe in supernatural. They also drew some conclusions that it may have been an instinct to help the young survive. As the same children attributed the same supernatural properties to there mothers. Something like that anyway.
In any event, just wanted to point out... religion is instinctual I think that is clear. If it wasn't we would have more atheists societies in history and we don't People are inclined to believe something. I think if anything that is more of a factor to disprove the reality of any one religion. As humans always seem to invent a form of religion. Are the Gods of the Pantheon or the Norse any less valid then more popular modern day religions.
There are also studies that show, it is not intelligence levels the determine belief as much as it is Social networks. Myself I tend to believe the complete truth is in the middle of that somewhere. Clearly there is a correlation between intelligence and faith, and there is also something to the idea of the strength of the social network affecting faith levels as well.
Hey! Socialism's a perfectly workable economic model!
'course, Communism has a lot more problems--you just can't collectivize farms. Factories, yeah, government control is doable and arguably a good thing, but farms are just too much f*cking SPACE.
Communism only works with one or more of the following conditions:
But please don't confuse communism and socialism.
Atheistic is the wrong term since they would have to believe that god doesn't exist. Agnostic almost fits, but it still requires thought to make a person agnostic. So a person has to go with the third option about whether god exists or doesn't exist to be Agnostic. Agnostic is different from "I haven't actually thought about whether god exists or not" which is where babies are currently at.
Not exactly, leave people alone and the hierarchies will become apparent i.e. 'rule of the strong'. What humans have to be taught is socially accepted or enforced hierarchies.
Same goes for your second point, leave people to make their own way and they develop their own opinions including their own acceptance of concepts that are not supported by evidence (for good or ill), specific religions are taught, not arrived upon.
Humans all start off atheistic to all gods, later they become atheistic to certain ones depending on their own conclusions or how they are told to believe. Some remain atheistic to all gods, universal (Deism) or personal (i.e. gods of religions).
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Also, how can one be born with a belief system if as babies, we have not yet developed the intelligence to think about these concepts?
It doesn't help anything to argue! What the hell are you doing, seriously? People have different beliefs, and that's usual and based on so many f*cking factors we don't have the MENTAL CAPACITIY to understand them all.
So, stop wasting your time and other's and society's, and just give up on this pointless drivel and general argumentative behavior.
That really is a matter of social linguistics as to exactly how people define those words.
I use it to mean 'without-gods' i.e. its literal definition, a child does not believe in the non existence of a concept it has not yet been introduced to, any more than any other concepts.
A young child cannot be agnostic (i.e. unsure) to something it has not yet been introduced to any way.
It doesn't really matter to me either way essentially, as I'm a agnostic apatheist towards a universal deity anyway (and a atheistic antitheist towards the personal deities of religions).
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Only at the most basic level.
Feudalism is by the nobility, for the nobility. Socialism is citizen's councils distributing wealth for the maximum benefit of all citizens.
Yes, there is a central economic plan. However, the socialist leader's mandate is to the citizenry, and xir office is bound to distribute wealth to all, rather than to keep it for the leader and distribute the bare minimum to others.
Like any other system, it works better on paper than in practice (hell, even capitalism, which I despise, works fine on paper--bad people just hijack it far, far too easily in practice). But a proper socialistic state has several levels of safeguards that a capitalistic or feudalistic state does not.
Trust me on this, I'm a socialist myself, I've put a lot of study into this.
Considering he's a college kid last I recall, yea, you have.
Nope.
Government employees are not exempt. That's the point of equality. Everybody is subject to the same laws.
Part 2:
OK. I submit that you have a decade or three on me (dunno how much).
I also submit that you grew up during the 20th century, surrounded by a hefty amount of American propaganda about the Dirty Commies* and conservative culture.
I'm...well, not convinced.
And to be fair, we're two dudes on the Internet. Neither of us is going to convince the other.
*Not denying that China and the USSR were sh*tty places, and great examples of why collectivized farming is lunacy, but there's a difference between communism, socialism, and North Korean asininity.
True, but frankly, I'm burned out from 2 big papers, a midterm, and a nasty bout of food poisoning.
Maybe not right now?
I hope you get to feeling better.
perhaps if you hadn't had eaten both those papers you wouldn't be having food poisoning right now...
:P
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
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Thanks...half the school got sick...:(
Damn Sharples food....
And I misread that to say that you guys ate Sharpies. THAT would do it... :eek:
Still not sure what Sharples is.
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