Well its about time. Geez, I've been going over this for years now, trying to figure out how fighters were able to take so many hits and do so much damage against largerz far more powerful ships. Although, I doubt this will be a huge change. To everyone who's already whining about how this is going to kill the game for them, knock it off. You don't even know what they're going to do. So don't get your panties in a twist just yet. Keep your blouses on and wait and see what comes up.
Well its about time. Geez, I've been going over this for years now, trying to figure out how fighters were able to take so many hits and do so much damage against largerz far more powerful ships. Although, I doubt this will be a huge change. To everyone who's already whining about how this is going to kill the game for them, knock it off. You don't even know what they're going to do. So don't get your panties in a twist just yet. Keep your blouses on and wait and see what comes up.
Until DR even the most powerful pets (Elite rom drones and elite bugs as examples) blew up with a couple of hits, DRs buffing of NPCs appears to of inadvertantly buffed pets at the same rate, so this is a new issue, it's not been going on for 'years' it just happened.
Well its about time. Geez, I've been going over this for years now, trying to figure out how fighters were able to take so many hits and do so much damage against largerz far more powerful ships. Although, I doubt this will be a huge change. To everyone who's already whining about how this is going to kill the game for them, knock it off. You don't even know what they're going to do. So don't get your panties in a twist just yet. Keep your blouses on and wait and see what comes up.
Really you obviously have no idea about this game, which makes you either a dev or someone who is hoping that being a white knight will get you noticed.
With all the aoe in this games pets were easy to kill
I hope along with the nerf of the pets for players you will be adding HP to them. After all they are rather costly as I understand it and well given how utterly jacked up the situation with the NPCs is now due to whatever BS reasons how about putting the hammer to the NPCs before the players. Just sayin'....
Speaking of which, I'm a torp player, when will torps get some justice in this game? The FAW and A2B setups own pretty much everything. How about showing some love to those of us that try to play the game with a degree of skill.
If you are looking for an excellent PvE fleet consider: Omega Combat Division today.
Former member of the Cryptic Family & FriendsTesting Team. Sadly, one day, it simply vanished - without a word or trace...
When are we going to get a fix on the glitch commands?
When are seperated pets going to get commands? (You're treating them like hangar ones so give them the same controls)
When are we going to see the "improved AI" that stops them flying through ships going bang?
Do you guys have any idea on how to do things properly? Are you that intent on killing the game? It seems the forum posters are being ignored, even confirmed by a certain yellow poster, so maybe it's timne to take this to the next level. Break out the paper and stamps and start writing letters to the HQs of both PWE and Cryptic.
.....Seriously? A pet nerf? Elite Mesh Weavers die in less than 5 seconds to TBR from enemies on NORMAL DIFFICULTY as it is, and your "data" says they have too much HP? TBR kills them, is this a joke? These are Frigates. FRIGATES. Not Fighters. Fighters die almost instantly to enemy FAW, Torp Spread, or Photonic Shockwave, and THEY have too much HP? Not to mention our hangar pets have 0 evasion, unlike enemy Fighters which are stupidly hard to hit even using the Precision trait and weapons with accuracy mods, AND they have more than double the HP of our Fighter pets.
Because having anything that isn't a DPS ship now is not the intended form of play is it Cryptic? You guys are making that more and more obvious right now...
Ten soldiers wisely led will beat a hundred without a head. - Euripides
I no longer do any Bug Hunting work for Cryptic. I may resume if a serious attempt to fix the game is made.
I have been suspecting that Cryptic may be part of those psychological studies too see how far they can go with getting away with total BS studies... course, I never usually say something like that out loud to an entire community and rarely ever mention such an idea to even my friends.
But...
This ongoing nerf batting to this level of blatent extreme, that the mass majority is saying "WTF?! ARE YOU TRYING TO KILL THE GAME?" I think the community is far more prepaired and willing too listen to the possibility, that STO may actually be getting used as a test bed for pushing people, to see how far companies like this can get away with total BS.
At this point, I no longer concerned about the possibility that people will blame me for being an outrageous conspiracy theorist. After all, the entire real world is suffering from a lot of problems of blatantly obvious corruption to the point where conspiracy "theories" are being proven as "Actually, factually, really happening, OMG this **** is real, we need to do something about those psychopaths," events as of late.
I can hear it now!
Obama walks into the Cryptic PR room. Geko presents Obama with a computer linking to this STO Forum. He is given the username PWObama. PWObama logs in and post this message on this thread.
PWObama: "Nerfing your Hanger Pets will not Nerf your hanger pets! If you want to keep your hanger pets as is, you can keep your hanger pets as is!"
... ... ...
*sigh*
... ... ...
Ok, that is the last straw. I am going to Star Citizan.
someone mustve told a dev the hangar pets were too good. i personally think Ryansto posting the 50k and 100k vids got them investigating the dps factors and they happened to stumble onto the OP drones.
I thought i told you people to shut up about the stuff we like. Next up theyre gonna nerf attack patterns into doing -5 dmg res max.
This is a terrible idea. I can see nerfing the damage a bit, but the survivability was the best (only good thing?) about DR.
Unless you're willing to scale down enemy HP to the same extent, this is a horrible idea.
The irony is, that apparently having scaled our pets along with the NPC's, even when done so by accident, was the most natural thing to do. You know, like foes 5x harder to kill paying out 5x as much XP. Yet in the bizarro world - hereafter known as the Mirror Universe -- making enemies tougher means your pets should be nerfed!
Pets have had so many issues in the past. They made the current system the way it is because it was the only way they could figure out a fix. Once they change it back.... lets just start a pet bug post now to be proactive.
Even if it needs to be done, I foresee Cryptic breaking pets in some way, because their QA is atrocious. Or break something unrelated. Or both. Probably both.
Honestly, I don't see too much of an issue here. Having the discussion wheather carrier pets are useless, worthless or just how much they are is another thing entirely - a discussion that can and if people believe so, it should continue with the devs. on future adjustments for their preformance. But what we have here is adjusting because of a bug, or according to reports from players I read here - something that is obviously broken.
I'll go on a limb and say that the increase in level progression messed up these pets somehow, so they improperly scaled after the release of DR. Did it make them more usefull for some? I'm sure it did, but nevertheless it was the result of something unintended, a scaling bug. So what is Cryptic doing? Fixing one bug out of the many. It may not look like it's of much importance to players experiencing more problematic issues in the game, but it's still a fix.
Besides, Geko said this is due in 3 weeks at least, so there'll be at least 3 patches before then that may take care of other issues being reported lately.
What I'm saying is don't mistake a bug fix with underwhelming preformance of carrier pets. A bug causing this has to be fixed. The debate of the carrier pet usefullness is something else and if people feel so strongly about it - should continue with the devs on possible improvements. Broken things are broken however and they should be fixed, regardless of who may benefit from them.
someone mustve told a dev the hangar pets were too good. i personally think Ryansto posting the 50k and 100k vids got them investigating the dps factors and they happened to stumble onto the OP drones.
I thought i told you people to shut up about the stuff we like. Next up theyre gonna nerf attack patterns into doing -5 dmg res max.
KEEP YOUR MOUTH CLOSED
Sadly, it would indeed appear that any public demonstration of proficiency can, and will, be used against you. Either it will be called an exploit, or be downgraded, as a means to have you buy it back, later, via the upgrade system.
Honestly, I don't see too much of an issue here. Having the discussion wheather carrier pets are useless, worthless or just how much they are is another thing entirely - a discussion that can and if people believe so, it should continue with the devs. on future adjustments for their preformance. But what we have here is adjusting because of a bug, or according to reports from players I read here - something that is obviously broken.
I'll go on a limb and say that the increase in level progression messed up these pets somehow, so they improperly scaled after the release of DR. Did it make them more usefull for some? I'm sure it did, but nevertheless it was the result of something unintended, a scaling bug. So what is Cryptic doing? Fixing one bug out of the many. It may not look like it's of much importance to players experiencing more problematic issues in the game, but it's still a fix.
Besides, Geko said this is due in 3 weeks at least, so there'll be at least 3 patches before then that may take care of other issues being reported lately.
What I'm saying is don't mistake a bug fix with underwhelming preformance of carrier pets. A bug causing this has to be fixed. The debate of the carrier pet usefullness is something else and if people feel so strongly about it - should continue with the devs on possible improvements. Broken things are broken however and they should be fixed, regardless of who may benefit from them.
As long as I have had my Aquatic Carrier (several months, at least), I'm pretty sure my Elite Mobulai pets have always been very sturdy, and, near as I can tell, nothing changed with DR, really.
People who generally run numbers will probably know for certain, though.
I get the fact that Geko is trying to communicate here and that is appreciated... I imagine they've probably been working on this "fix" for a bit now... I just don't know that I perceive it as one because of the other things that are broken.
Now on the other hand if they just started working on it after DR rolled... DERP...
But seriously posts like this when everything else is swirling and going on like this is like you guys (Cryptic) are trying to throw 20 gallons of gas on a bonfire and then stand back and say... look (At how everything got out of control again) the players are being angry, rude and disrespectful again... your creating your own self fulfilling prophecy by bringing up a "nerf" or the perceived taking away of something while folks are already riled up... for real?? What reaction did you think you we're going to get??
Do you guys even have a communications/pr department??
To me this is just further proof there is something wrong...
But seriously posts like this when everything else is swirling and going on like this is like you guys (Cryptic) are trying to throw 20 gallons of gas on a bonfire and then stand back and say... look (At how everything got out of control again) the players are being angry, rude and disrespectful again... your creating your own self fulfilling prophecy by bringing up a "nerf" or the perceived taking away of something while folks are already riled up... for real?? What reaction did you think you we're going to get??
I don't know, better to do it earlier than later. Let it go on long enough and people will convince themselves it was intended.
I just wish it would go hand in hand with some other, much needed, fixes for pets/separations. But I know it won't. It will just come with its own set of over corrections/bugs as per Cryptic SOP.
You know, honestly, part of me is kinda happy about this, because i never liked that there were certain ship like the Narcine, Recluse and Scimitar that utterly dominated the game.
At the same time though, is the next thing that the player base needed to deal with REALLY another nerf?
I honestly cannot figure out how this can be a good idea. Even a right decision made at the wrong time or for the wrong reasons can be a wrong decision.
Real Temporal Operative: Purchased the Special Temporal Agent pack before it was even officially announced!
Or how about you just stop nerfing things? No, that would make too much sense.
My pets die if you look at them the wrong way. I glare at them and they blow up. How is that OP?
The reason I ask is, because I only have the advanced drones and, they do not seem to have anywhere near the huge #'s people are saying, at least not that I can tell seeing how a single drone can be almost dead and, I can throw it a single HE2 + ET1 and viola full health and, this is coming from 2 skills that combined for me, only put out some 15k-20k worth of hull healing max.
The reason I ask is, because I only have the advanced drones and, they do not seem to have anywhere near the huge #'s people are saying, at least not that I can tell seeing how a single drone can be almost dead and, I can throw it a single HE2 + ET1 and viola full health and, this is coming from 2 skills that combined for me, only put out some 15k-20k worth of hull healing max.
You know, LOL, currently flying my loyal Mobius, I was going to quickly check on my Aquatic Carrier, to see what HP the pets actually have. Then I remembered the loadout system is horridly broken, so I went like 'Never mind!'
So, between perfectly good pets and a broken loadout system, which one you think should have gotten priority?!
Even when I left them with 1 thing to shoot at, it still took them a minute or 2 to take down a syphon destroyer, with all 6 pets out (both wings from my scim).
With me firing at the mobs, 2 entire mobs where dead in less then a minute.
I know elite Danubes have an issue, 53k hull is more than my T5U fleet Nova. But I think overall they need rebuilding rather than nerfing because the Prommy vectors are near useless anyway and STILL need to stop to separate.
Even when I left them with 1 thing to shoot at, it still took them a minute or 2 to take down a syphon destroyer, with all 6 pets out (both wings from my scim).
With me firing at the mobs, 2 entire mobs where dead in less then a minute.
This is a bait and switch sells trick.
Pets taking down a destroyer in 1-2 minutes seems pretty OP to me.
Even when I left them with 1 thing to shoot at, it still took them a minute or 2 to take down a syphon destroyer, with all 6 pets out (both wings from my scim).
With me firing at the mobs, 2 entire mobs where dead in less then a minute.
This is a bait and switch sells trick.
Was this in mission space?! Or outside ESD and the like? (You know, where your actual stats show up). If so, where is this 80k BS coming from then?!
Honestly if they cap pets at level 50 (before DR) then it wont affect most of us. However if they go further than that.. it would likely create another player rage. It is nice to see he was clear and open about what he is doing and why. Lets hope this doesn't turn into an issue like the XP nerf.
Comments
Until DR even the most powerful pets (Elite rom drones and elite bugs as examples) blew up with a couple of hits, DRs buffing of NPCs appears to of inadvertantly buffed pets at the same rate, so this is a new issue, it's not been going on for 'years' it just happened.
Really you obviously have no idea about this game, which makes you either a dev or someone who is hoping that being a white knight will get you noticed.
With all the aoe in this games pets were easy to kill
Speaking of which, I'm a torp player, when will torps get some justice in this game? The FAW and A2B setups own pretty much everything. How about showing some love to those of us that try to play the game with a degree of skill.
ingame: @.Spartan
Original Cryptic Forum Name: Spartan (member #124)
The Glorious, Kirk’s Protegè
Unless you're willing to scale donw enemy HP to the same extent, this is a horrible idea.
When are seperated pets going to get commands? (You're treating them like hangar ones so give them the same controls)
When are we going to see the "improved AI" that stops them flying through ships going bang?
Do you guys have any idea on how to do things properly? Are you that intent on killing the game? It seems the forum posters are being ignored, even confirmed by a certain yellow poster, so maybe it's timne to take this to the next level. Break out the paper and stamps and start writing letters to the HQs of both PWE and Cryptic.
I have been suspecting that Cryptic may be part of those psychological studies too see how far they can go with getting away with total BS studies... course, I never usually say something like that out loud to an entire community and rarely ever mention such an idea to even my friends.
But...
This ongoing nerf batting to this level of blatent extreme, that the mass majority is saying "WTF?! ARE YOU TRYING TO KILL THE GAME?" I think the community is far more prepaired and willing too listen to the possibility, that STO may actually be getting used as a test bed for pushing people, to see how far companies like this can get away with total BS.
At this point, I no longer concerned about the possibility that people will blame me for being an outrageous conspiracy theorist. After all, the entire real world is suffering from a lot of problems of blatantly obvious corruption to the point where conspiracy "theories" are being proven as "Actually, factually, really happening, OMG this **** is real, we need to do something about those psychopaths," events as of late.
I can hear it now!
Obama walks into the Cryptic PR room. Geko presents Obama with a computer linking to this STO Forum. He is given the username PWObama. PWObama logs in and post this message on this thread.
PWObama: "Nerfing your Hanger Pets will not Nerf your hanger pets! If you want to keep your hanger pets as is, you can keep your hanger pets as is!"
... ... ...
*sigh*
... ... ...
Ok, that is the last straw. I am going to Star Citizan.
I thought i told you people to shut up about the stuff we like. Next up theyre gonna nerf attack patterns into doing -5 dmg res max.
KEEP YOUR MOUTH CLOSED
The irony is, that apparently having scaled our pets along with the NPC's, even when done so by accident, was the most natural thing to do. You know, like foes 5x harder to kill paying out 5x as much XP. Yet in the bizarro world - hereafter known as the Mirror Universe -- making enemies tougher means your pets should be nerfed!
Oh and good point Meimeitoo.
Click to Join armadafleet.org/
I'll go on a limb and say that the increase in level progression messed up these pets somehow, so they improperly scaled after the release of DR. Did it make them more usefull for some? I'm sure it did, but nevertheless it was the result of something unintended, a scaling bug. So what is Cryptic doing? Fixing one bug out of the many. It may not look like it's of much importance to players experiencing more problematic issues in the game, but it's still a fix.
Besides, Geko said this is due in 3 weeks at least, so there'll be at least 3 patches before then that may take care of other issues being reported lately.
What I'm saying is don't mistake a bug fix with underwhelming preformance of carrier pets. A bug causing this has to be fixed. The debate of the carrier pet usefullness is something else and if people feel so strongly about it - should continue with the devs on possible improvements. Broken things are broken however and they should be fixed, regardless of who may benefit from them.
Sadly, it would indeed appear that any public demonstration of proficiency can, and will, be used against you.
As long as I have had my Aquatic Carrier (several months, at least), I'm pretty sure my Elite Mobulai pets have always been very sturdy, and, near as I can tell, nothing changed with DR, really.
People who generally run numbers will probably know for certain, though.
Now on the other hand if they just started working on it after DR rolled... DERP...
But seriously posts like this when everything else is swirling and going on like this is like you guys (Cryptic) are trying to throw 20 gallons of gas on a bonfire and then stand back and say... look (At how everything got out of control again) the players are being angry, rude and disrespectful again... your creating your own self fulfilling prophecy by bringing up a "nerf" or the perceived taking away of something while folks are already riled up... for real?? What reaction did you think you we're going to get??
Do you guys even have a communications/pr department??
To me this is just further proof there is something wrong...
My new sig till Cryptic fixes it....
I don't know, better to do it earlier than later. Let it go on long enough and people will convince themselves it was intended.
I just wish it would go hand in hand with some other, much needed, fixes for pets/separations. But I know it won't. It will just come with its own set of over corrections/bugs as per Cryptic SOP.
At the same time though, is the next thing that the player base needed to deal with REALLY another nerf?
I honestly cannot figure out how this can be a good idea. Even a right decision made at the wrong time or for the wrong reasons can be a wrong decision.
My pets die if you look at them the wrong way. I glare at them and they blow up. How is that OP?
...oh right, it was by design...
The reason I ask is, because I only have the advanced drones and, they do not seem to have anywhere near the huge #'s people are saying, at least not that I can tell seeing how a single drone can be almost dead and, I can throw it a single HE2 + ET1 and viola full health and, this is coming from 2 skills that combined for me, only put out some 15k-20k worth of hull healing max.
Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!
You know, LOL, currently flying my loyal Mobius, I was going to quickly check on my Aquatic Carrier, to see what HP the pets actually have. Then I remembered the loadout system is horridly broken, so I went like 'Never mind!'
So, between perfectly good pets and a broken loadout system, which one you think should have gotten priority?!
Pets don't need to be nerfed.
Elite Scorpion Fighter
Just Launched, no ranking stars
Hull: 7802
At 4 star rank
Hull: 9363
The damage they delt to direct hull on an NPCs side facing no shield was not impressive.
Non-crit damage from pets:
Plasma Turret: 130-160
Plasma Dual Cannon: 300-330
Plasma Torp: 5000-5750
Even when I left them with 1 thing to shoot at, it still took them a minute or 2 to take down a syphon destroyer, with all 6 pets out (both wings from my scim).
With me firing at the mobs, 2 entire mobs where dead in less then a minute.
This is a bait and switch sells trick.
Pets taking down a destroyer in 1-2 minutes seems pretty OP to me.
Oh well, back to ships that don't use pets, then....
Was this in mission space?! Or outside ESD and the like? (You know, where your actual stats show up). If so, where is this 80k BS coming from then?!
Click to Join armadafleet.org/
Lvl 60
It was in the recently XP nerfed patrol of Japori, normal difficulty.
Call it BS if you want, but my Advanced Mobulais were at 108k hull at 5 stars, whereas the Narcine itself was just below 90k.