After having briefly tested the new system on Tribble, I can state for certain, that higher mark (Mk XII) weapons will definitely cost in the range of 20k Dilithium. Each. And you only get the weapon, if the craft is successful. If it's a failure, you're out 20k Dilithium. That's 2.5 days worth of constant Dilithium grinding. Per weapon. I don't care what Cryptic thinks, that amount is absolutely ridiculous.
I agree entirely. I wouldn't risk wasting 20k dilithium and maybe get nothing out of it. I would sooner use the Repsystem to get weapons, where I know if I spend the near 20k plus Dilithium I will be 100% sure to get the weapon of my desire.
That's really not why. I've seen this conspiratorial thought creep up in just about every post on materials. They're removed because they drastically lower the quality of the game for new players who encounter them without knowing "Oh, those missions are 'special'" - and because they drastically increase the game's install size for new players, which prevents hundreds of players each month from even trying out the game in the first place.
If I remember they said the file size was important because the larger the file..the longer the download...the less likely someone will try out the game.
As for the mods starting to put some smack down, I think it is way over due. The negativity, entitlement, conspiracy theories and overall whininess of SOME of the posters is out of hand. It can be hard finding a post with constructive critisim when certain poster are falling over themselves to out do the lastest insult.
Yes, Atlmykl, that's what was said, and that's what quite a few people here and in-game are currently discussing.
But it still boggles me, considering most modern MMOs and all the new hip Triple-A games coming out require as much if not more hard-drive space than STO currently does.
Besides newbies getting lost (at which point, that's more them ignoring tutorials, not trying out enough things on their own, and/or the devs not spending the time to add tutorials to certain potentially-confusing moments), this sounds more like an attempt to make it easier for casual players who don't understand the concept of "hard-drive space." So that they can install the game and not scratch their heads over why the installation won't complete when they get an error prompt over lacking space being that their drive is full of other things or too small as it is.
I fully understand that there are more casual players out there who don't get these things. Others have already put up their own examples of computer illiterates who don't quite understand some aspects of computer hardware and software. But this flies in the face of all other popular MMOs out there right now having as much if not much more in the way of space taken on hard-drives.
Frankly, if people can't work things out to get STO working (upgrading to a new hard-drive, upgrading other computer components to make STO run smoother, finding their way out of a small "room" in the game, etc.), then it's unlikely they'd stay with the game long anyway. I've known players to get frustrated at the simplest of things and log off, never to return.
That being said, it's not a good enough reason for the removal of an entire system of gameplay from STO when there is *no* replacement for it. It's one thing if they say "Oh hey, we're planning an exploration upgrade in the near-future, so for the time being we're removing the old Star Clusters to make room for the new system," but that's not what we're being told.
I understand development secrecy, but we're just going by the only reason given so far.
Yes, I haven't used the Star Clusters much in quite a while, or done the First Contact missions since I finished grinding my diplomacy stuff the first time around. But this content actually immersed me in the game, and it's some of our only content available that isn't driven by a menu (queues, ugh)!
The joke going around now is that, at this rate, the devs may as well remove the rest of the game and have us play through a chat window and a menu to queue up runs in. Or replace the latter with a "press to win" button.
I love STO, I think the devs do a fantastic job with what they're given, and I want to keep playing STO. But I want an actual game, a game that grows, not a game that shrinks. Removing exploration without a proper replacement isn't good for a game with "Star Trek" in the title.
I'd rather they go back and fix up what they have if they're not planning a replacement (that doesn't involve playing through a menu to get to where we have to go, AKA queues).
I have a friend who suggested they could tie the Foundry into Star Cluster and other exploration assignments, do contests to find good exploration missions to use. Not talking about long epics, just shorter one-shot assignments to fill Star Clusters with.
If the devs don't want to make new things for Star Clusters, why can't we have that? That would be an amazing use for the Foundry!
After having briefly tested the new system on Tribble, I can state for certain, that higher mark (Mk XII) weapons will definitely cost in the range of 20k Dilithium. Each. And you only get the weapon, if the craft is successful. If it's a failure, you're out 20k Dilithium. That's 2.5 days worth of constant Dilithium grinding. Per weapon. I don't care what Cryptic thinks, that amount is absolutely ridiculous.
I should probably add, you need to input (from what I saw), 2 crafted items that cost a total of 20k Dilithium, and the quality of the item produced, as well as it's associated modifiers, aren't known until you actually hit "Craft". By then, it's too late to get your 20k Dilithium back. For 20k, you might end up with a Green or Blue weapon, or in worse case scenario, no weapon at all.
I call that a very bad mechanic, which will be used to milk consumers out of cash.
I should probably add, you need to input (from what I saw), 2 crafted items that cost a total of 20k Dilithium, and the quality of the item produced, as well as it's associated modifiers, aren't known until you actually hit "Craft". By then, it's too late to get your 20k Dilithium back. For 20k, you might end up with a Green or Blue weapon, or in worse case scenario, no weapon at all.
Thank you, but I'll stick to the Reputation grinds, and Fleet grind to get my guaranteed weapons.
In that cast this crafting system is doomed to fail right from the start. How ever given the feed back that happened on the first crafting overhaul, adding Dilithium it's self. Made the system unusible. The change to commodities that have to be bought with Dilithium and could be bought and traded took the major sting out of it.
I still was not thrilled they added it to the mix. But I accepted it. Granted I have a life time account, get 500 zen per month and can convert that into dilithium if I desire. It's not a major issue. and I hardly do any crafting. There are some good weapons you get through replays at high levels. So it's not really a die hard situation to craft anymore. I just run a mission five or six times trade the weapons and put them on another alt.
People need to keep in mind that it is based on how much skill you have. Yes, Cryptic is allowing you the opportunity to waste Dil on a Green/Blue item if that is what you want to do. They're not going to protect you from yourself in that sense. You can reach the point where you're going to get your Purple.
Unfortunately though, imho, you're not necessarily going to get your mods. They're still going to be random. So you could end up with your Purple - and - mods you absolutely do not want. That risk is still going to be there.
So while the gambling on Rarity is diminished/removed at a certain skill level - you're still going to be gambling on what mods you get.
Want an [Acc]x3 weapon? [CrtD]x3? [Acc][CrtH][CrtD]? Hell, some folks might want a [Dmg]x3 weapon. You've got no say in that...that gamble is going to remain.
Even though you may not be able to craft the items needed to make MK XII's at a low level, you can still buy the components to make them (seems hellapricey, but if that's what folks want to do then Cryptic is more than happy to let folks do that)...and you're probably going to be looking at getting a Common/White Mk XII item for it. You'll get the XP - will help you level up faster (hellapricey way to level)...but you're going to get vendor trash out of it.
But even if your skill, DOFF, Catalyst guarantees you that Purple...meh...you're still facing those random mods. Guess it's a Plan A and Plan B sort of gamble, eh? Gambling with Plan A that it's something you want and gambling with Plan B that it's something somebody else might want...otherwise, you're looking at vendor trash.
new players getting lost on explortion missions ?
I call nonsense here.untrue....how can you get lost flying up to a planet and taking a pop up mission ?
Personally i think they want to remove these missions because you can skip most of the story content leveling up Fed toons making leveling fed toons very much easier than klingon or romulan
reduce file size.............
files of this nature can be sent to the client side....they can also be dribbled
level 50 content doesnt need to be loaded at all fo ra new player...it can be added later in dribbles at specific levels saving huge amounts of download
The quality of the explore content is trash so we really arnt losing anything except a easy way to level Fed toons
now fed toons will be as annoying to level up as klingon and romulan toons are
Good news ....I dont need any more toons
Jellico....Engineer ground.....Da'val Romulan space Sci
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Yes, Atlmykl, that's what was said, and that's what quite a few people here and in-game are currently discussing.
But it still boggles me, considering most modern MMOs and all the new hip Triple-A games coming out require as much if not more hard-drive space than STO currently does.
Then it seem most people are still missing the point. HD space is not what they are worried about. The longer people have to wait for something the less likely they are going to follow through. Imagine they were giving free samples out at you favorite food court. Before you get that free slice of pizza they tell you have to fill out a 20 page questionnaire. Well the % of people taking that slice went down. Now imagine they told you that a 30 min personal interview was required... even fewer will follow through.
The point. Large files and long down load times turn off people who might try the game on a impulse.
To be honest if I had ended up in the clusters early on I probably would have uninstalled the game. Not because I was stuck but it would not be unresonable to assume the rest of the gameplay was as drab.
I should probably add, you need to input (from what I saw), 2 crafted items that cost a total of 20k Dilithium, and the quality of the item produced, as well as it's associated modifiers, aren't known until you actually hit "Craft". By then, it's too late to get your 20k Dilithium back. For 20k, you might end up with a Green or Blue weapon, or in worse case scenario, no weapon at all.
Thank you, but I'll stick to the Reputation grinds, and Fleet grind to get my guaranteed weapons.
It will also be possible to improve items through crafting, from what I understand from the recent interview with Captain Geko with Priority One.
I can see ending up with at least a white item worst case, especially if your crafting skill level is still low, but if the possibility of ending up with nothing exists, then no, I will not bother to craft. I can't see this as a possibility in STO - they always give you something.
Star Trek Battles Channel - Play Star Trek like they did in the series!Avatar: pinterest-com/pin/14003448816884219Are you sure it isn't time for a "colorful metaphor"? --Spock in 'The Voyage Home' SCE ADVISORY NOTICE: Improper Impulse Engine maintenance can result in REAR THRUSTER LEAKAGE. ALWAYS have your work inspected by another qualified officer.
Then it seem most people are still missing the point. HD space is not what they are worried about. The longer people have to wait for something the less likely they are going to follow through. Imagine they were giving free samples out at you favorite food court. Before you get that free slice of pizza they tell you have to fill out a 20 page questionnaire. Well the % of people taking that slice went down. Now imagine they told you that a 30 min personal interview was required... even fewer will follow through.
The point. Large files and long down load times turn off people who might try the game on a impulse.
To be honest if I had ended up in the clusters early on I probably would have uninstalled the game. Not because I was stuck but it would not be unresonable to assume the rest of the gameplay was as drab.
There's still a connection between the two.
If it isn't hard-drive space itself, then yes, it's download times. But contemporary gaming is filled with large games that prospective players have to download. Most PC gamers are now required to use digital services to buy, download, and install these 20-40gb-sized games. Modern console gamers can just about expect the same thing these days for console games.
In this, the point still stands. Currently-popular games, MMOs and others, require a lot of hard-drive space and time for downloads. Download sizes and times are only going to increase from here, and prospective players are just going to have to deal with it, barring better compression techniques and the like.
Having known more than a few people who have unapologetically short attention spans, I think it's a waste of time to take them into consideration. Most of them will abandon the game if they even get past download and installation long before seeing a good portion of the game's content whether or not it's altered to cater to them or otherwise.
I know people who've abandoned the game before even getting out of the new tutorial, or people who get frustrated with something easily avoidable or solvable by a quick Google search, and etc. etc. These players are not going to be kept, no matter how hard you try. Sure, they may spend some money on the game before their sudden abandonment of the game, but this is not a good long-term thing to focus on.
Instead, the focus should be on making exploration content better, so the players who *want* to stay but do get confused by such things as Star Clusters have an easier time understanding it, not necessarily having an easier time with it on the whole.
In this, you hit the nail on the head. Exploration should not be removed without viable replacement, it should be taken care of. As in fixed, updated, given love in general so players take notice of it and new players aren't confused by it. There's plenty of suggestions out there, and I think tying the Foundry to it and having events to make short missions for dev consideration to be made permanent exploration missions would be an idea too.
It could be tied into the new crafting system too, give us more "mining" opportunities and the like. Some of us prefer a game to play in, not a menu to take priority over gameplay and environments.
what is going to happen to those of us that have are crafting max out right now are we going to have to start over from the start if so that is a load of bs there should be some kind of reward for those of us who have a max out crafter on both sides
It can't be stressed enough that people need to listen to the podcast. It alleviated a lot of my concerns. With that being said, I'm still going to follow the Tribble patch notes, log on Tribble and see it for myself, and tell the devs what I think. Some of it will be positive, other parts will be constructive criticism.
Although I do think it would be a really good idea to post a Cliff's notes transcript of the podcast on the home page. I think that would be a more effective way to put out the fires than to respond in threads with dozens of pages. Most people don't read through all those pages or use the dev tracker.
The podcast got me pretty excited about some things to come, although I've still got a watchful eye for now.
Just as a comparison... I downloaded a 48hr full game trial of Titanfall this past weekend and it was 50GB. I have a 128gb SSD for my primary drive. I played it for an hour and that was it... not my thing. I have downloaded quite a few games on Origin and most of them are larger than STO. There are a myriad of reasons someone doesn't finish downloading and installing any game but download size I think is not STOs problem.
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Just as a comparison... I downloaded a 48hr full game trial of Titanfall this past weekend and it was 50GB. I have a 128gb SSD for my primary drive. I played it for an hour and that was it... not my thing. I have downloaded quite a few games on Origin and most of them are larger than STO. There are a myriad of reasons someone doesn't finish downloading and installing any game but download size I think is not STOs problem.
Where are people getting these very-very small hard-drives? 128 GB drives have not been made for years. Is this a laptop, tablet, etc..?
All true, but it only excuses so much; and I'm saying that as someone who is pretty steamed at Cryptic myself right now. Being angry is fine. Posting angry is often unwise, but understandable. Taking anger out on others is not fine.
You know what? Yeah, you are right. I didn't read this part of your statement. Self-control does have to play into the equation.
But it still boggles me, considering most modern MMOs and all the new hip Triple-A games coming out require as much if not more hard-drive space than STO currently does.
"SW: TOR" and "Elder Scrolls Online" require around 20 GB of space each. Most single-player and offline games require 20-30 GBs of storage space.
So, i may be the only person who bothered to level the current R&D all the way to the top... what happens to my progress? do i stay the top level or was all that just for kicks?
Where are people getting these very-very small hard-drives? 128 GB drives have not been made for years. Is this a laptop, tablet, etc..?
You know what? Yeah, you are right. I didn't read this part of your statement. Self-control does have to play into the equation.
"SW: TOR" and "Elder Scrolls Online" require around 20 GB of space each. Most single-player and offline games require 20-30 GBs of storage space.
What they are talking about are Solid State Drives which have less capacity but better performance (no moving parts). Sure, you can get a 1 TB traditional hard drive with the platters running at 7200 RPMs but a SSD drive will out perform a traditional drive on the reads/wrights.
Matt Miracle
Fleet Commander in Chief [Rank 7] for Covenant of Honor; a FED T5 Starbase
House Leader [Rank 7] for Honorable House of Mor'gue; a KDF T3 Starbase Find us at CovenantofHonor.com. My Twitter handle; @jmattmiracle
So, i may be the only person who bothered to level the current R&D all the way to the top... what happens to my progress? do i stay the top level or was all that just for kicks?
Badhandle, there maybe something but you will NOT get max level crafting on the new system because you are a max level crafter on the old one. It is a brand new system so everyone will start on the same page.
Matt Miracle
Fleet Commander in Chief [Rank 7] for Covenant of Honor; a FED T5 Starbase
House Leader [Rank 7] for Honorable House of Mor'gue; a KDF T3 Starbase Find us at CovenantofHonor.com. My Twitter handle; @jmattmiracle
Where are people getting these very-very small hard-drives? 128 GB drives have not been made for years. Is this a laptop, tablet, etc..?
You know what? Yeah, you are right. I didn't read this part of your statement. Self-control does have to play into the equation.
"SW: TOR" and "Elder Scrolls Online" require around 20 GB of space each. Most single-player and offline games require 20-30 GBs of storage space.
SSD(Solid State Drives) are mostly very small drives but have extremely fast Read/Write times. SSD are basically RAM sticks bundled up into Hard Drive form. Its best to have a SSD and a HDD and put your OS on the SSD for near instantaneous start up times but keep the rest of your stuff on a regular HDD. SSD are still quite expensive, costs over $400 just for a 1TB SSD.
Recovering from the Undine attack, Commander Jenna Romaine proposes a new surge of research and development. Undercover agents will likely to have gained access to our research plans, so it is our job to develop new advanced technology with our scientists and engineers. Read the proposal for state-of-the-art technology in the latest entry of the Season 9 News Dev Blog series.
As part of the new Research and Development system that were introducing in Season 9.5, were updating the kinds of raw materials that youll use. Designer Jesse Heinig Read more details about how the new system works in the latest entry of the Season 9 News Dev Blog series.
In our three-part blog, System Designer Jeff AdjudicatorHawk Hamilton shares more information about the new schools captains can take part in with crafting update coming soon! Read more details about how the schools function in the latest entry of the Season 9 News Dev Blog series.
The system looks really good actually and I can't wait to play around with it some more. However, Beams, Cannons, Ground Weapons and Shields just don't sound right as R&D titles. IMO I think you should use something like Tactical Systems for Cannons, Particle Generation for Beams, Defensive Systems for Shields and Operational Assets for Ground Weapons. It would just make is seem more scientific as a Research and Development model. I would also like to see Propulsion Systems for Engines. Engineering and Scientific Research work well and Projectiles is ok. I would also like to see a Medical Research that encompasses the Hypos and ground buffing items.
Not to say these are the only titles you should use but something along these lines just to make them sound more R&D.
Where are people getting these very-very small hard-drives? 128 GB drives have not been made for years. Is this a laptop, tablet, etc..?
SSD = Solid State Drive
HDD = Hard Disk Drive
Two completely seperate things.
SSDs use flash memory like on a USB thumb drive, and typically have ~500MBps read/write speed maximum. They are much more expensive than HDDs and come in lower capacities due to the cost of high-quality flash chips. They are also more durable than HDDs and can withstand alot of abuse without breaking.
HDDs are the old type of drives that use magnetic spinning platters, and max out at around 80-130 MBps read/write speed. They are also fragile, if you drop them or nudge them while they're operating they can break. They're cheaper, as they use a mature technology, and have a larger capacity, but they also use more power than SSDs.
In trying to make doffing easier for the female podcasters of this world you have actually gone backwards.
Doffing needs to stay in categories,get rid of those big icons with shiny planets in,atm doffing looks like a big wall of text.
As for trying to make it easier ? its actually harder now,not for me ,but for those people who couldn't make Mk12 consoles via childrens toys doff mission,this will turn them off even more.
More clicking and window opening than doffing atm
Yea i know its in an alpha state but its miles and miles away from where doffing will be used.
i doff every day,if it stays like that i will stop doffing,maybe even stop playing...no its not an i quit post,just saying that you're going the wrong way.
How many others will leave for that mess that is currently doffing on tribble ?
plz plz plz revert doffing to what it is now,its not hard,no i'm not frightened of change.
If people couldn't work out holodecks doffing atm,maybe its not the system but maybe,just maybe its them ?
In trying to make doffing easier for the female podcasters of this world you have actually gone backwards.
Doffing needs to stay in categories,get rid of those big icons with shiny planets in,atm doffing looks like a big wall of text.
As for trying to make it easier ? its actually harder now,not for me ,but for those people who couldn't make Mk12 consoles via childrens toys doff mission,this will turn them off even more.
More clicking and window opening than doffing atm
Yea i know its in an alpha state but its miles and miles away from where doffing will be used.
i doff every day,if it stays like that i will stop doffing,maybe even stop playing...no its not an i quit post,just saying that you're going the wrong way.
How many others will leave for that mess that is currently doffing on tribble ?
plz plz plz revert doffing to what it is now,its not hard,no i'm not frightened of change.
If people couldn't work out holodecks doffing atm,maybe its not the system but maybe,just maybe its them ?
We DO fear change. The doff interface is absolutely and completely 100% perfect as it is now. There is zero reason to change it.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
We DO fear change. The doff interface is absolutely and completely 100% perfect as it is now. There is zero reason to change it.
Primary reason for this change: Gateway integration. Remember, the Gateway is practically intended to be used on touchscreen devices, such as cell phones, where the UI scales to the size of the device.
Having a 100x100 pixel box on an iPhone 4S or Galaxy-x Mini = my kiddo will overlap the box with her fingernail. And I'm talking my 9 year old, not my 19 year old...
I do say that some things - sorting by primary CXP award, showing and sorting by trait, etc., need to come back to the DOff interface. Also, this is a chance to add QoL improvements - pick purples instead of whites, recommend by crit chance instead of success, etc.
Of course, the fact that we're in early alpha means that these things are potentially coming back or in. Same with price tweaks on crafting, the mod changing projects (want [ACC]x3? 3 modifier projects later, you'll have it...) more and more of the fancy modifiers (they released beams and cannons with [ARC] just this last trip to tribble, wondering if we might see [AUX] in the future?) etc. etc.
Detecting big-time "anti-old-school" bias here. NX? Lobi. TOS/TMP Connie? Super-promotion-box. (aka the two hardest ways to get ships) Excelsior & all 3 TNG "big hero" ships? C-Store. Please Equalize...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
...Beams, Cannons, Ground Weapons and Shields just don't sound right as R&D titles. IMO I think you should use something like Tactical Systems for Cannons, Particle Generation for Beams, Defensive Systems for Shields and Operational Assets for Ground Weapons. It would just make is seem more scientific as a Research and Development model...
Agreed +100%.
Please add more "flavor text" like described above to the crafting system.
You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
I popped over yesterday to take a look at crafting and wound up doing other things and playing with the DOFF system.
Some needed changes:
Please please Bring back the missions separated by type of XP. Especially when trying to focus on certain DOFF missions for XP (AKA Diplomatic) the new system is painful.
Maybe with time it'll be different but currently it 'feels' clunky. Specifically changing from the 'recommended' officers to one's you choose. I'll just say that given a choice the current 'live' DOFF layout is much more friendly than the one on Tribble. It looks like it's trying to be made nicer looking BUT lacks the functionality of the current system for lack of better way of putting it. The DOFF list is nice especially when you want to choose which officers to send and also the break down by type of mission was really a nice thing. To me it feels like the good was gotten rid of in the process of trying to make it look newer and sleeker.
As to the new crafting I agree with some of the posts before. If we can't pick the traits of the items we're after (rare, dmgx3 etc...) then the new crafting system pretty much just becomes a nerf of the exploration clusters if removed (on a side note does this also mean the KDF defense missions are going since they're setup almost exactly like cluster areas? No I'm not trying to stir up panic but asking in sincerity as it's one of the main ways I level my KDF chars so I can skip certain missions along the way.)
The system looks really good actually and I can't wait to play around with it some more. However, Beams, Cannons, Ground Weapons and Shields just don't sound right as R&D titles. IMO I think you should use something like Tactical Systems for Cannons, Particle Generation for Beams, Defensive Systems for Shields and Operational Assets for Ground Weapons. It would just make is seem more scientific as a Research and Development model. I would also like to see Propulsion Systems for Engines. Engineering and Scientific Research work well and Projectiles is ok. I would also like to see a Medical Research that encompasses the Hypos and ground buffing items.
Not to say these are the only titles you should use but something along these lines just to make them sound more R&D.
Agreed! Medical would be a really nice addition, but I can see that being added to the broadened "ground" category you describe.
It would be a small thing, perhaps, but one that would a nice coat of polish on the whole system. Make it sound a little more Trek.
Then again, I'm also in favor of adding more lore/flavor text to the tooltips for pretty much every item in the game. That would be no small undertaking...
OK, you wanted me to test it before commenting, I have done so. I got 3 things to level 2, 1 to level 1 and gave up out of boredom, but here's what I've learned so far
random rewards = frustration
massive jump in XP requirement from level 2 to 3 = grind = more frustration
making components before equipment = no problem
not knowing which components are needed = frustration
making components 1 at a time = frustration
slow crafting times = irrelevant
so to sum up
we need a way to guarantee rewards, make multiple components at one time, a way to know what components are required for the maximum level you can make and a much smaller grind
As it stands now the proposed crafting system is much worse than what it will replace. I know the intention is to get people to spend more dilithium but right now, what is being proposed is not worth investing the time in
I don't attack constructive criticism. I attack whining. I attack entitlement. I attack useless moaning and groaning. I attack trolling. I attack flaming. I attack all sorts of things that the mods would probably prefer that I don't...and yes, I do get my warnings from them for it. I'm not above the rules, so if I cross a line - I get dinged for it just like anybody else.
There's a difference between disagreeing with what somebody says and attacking them. I've got my opinions just like everybody else does. I'm going to argue them just like everybody else does.
Mocking though? I pretty much laid out the difference in the very post you quoted...
I'm going to mock the first but not the second. Doesn't mean I won't argue with the second if I disagree, but there's a major difference in how I reply to somebody doing the first and somebody doing the second.
Somebody saying, "This sucks, what's on Holodeck is better." has provided little to no information. What sucks about it? Everything? That's not possible, because parts of it are on what is on Holodeck so if those parts suck on Tribble then they suck on Holodeck as well...meaning that Holodeck's version can't be 100% perfect, if part of the complaint about the Tribble version is the same as the Holodeck version.
What sucks about it? What could suck less about it? What's preferred on the Holodeck version that's no longer there in the Tribble version? It's entirely possible to offer a great deal of negative feedback in a constructive manner...
...and I guess that's where the mocking comes into play, because with all the nonsensical QQ - it begins to give the impression that anybody with a complaint about anything, being negative about anything is just a whiner.
Haters <---> Fanboys
Those aren't the only two groups. There are plenty of us that are in the middle there, we like certain things - we hate certain things. Personally, I'd like to be able to offer that feedback without being dumped into some group...
...and all the "There's nothing wrong!" and all the "Everything sucks!" folks just make that much harder to do.
Both of those groups could totally TRIBBLE off and disappear, and I'd be a happy clam...cause then the rest of us could continue arguing toward a better game and not be mislabeled into either of those groups.
This is why you're one of my favorite posters on the forums. The forums need more objective people who aren't afraid to tell it how it is and let people know when their reality check has bounced.
Players need to be able to police themselves instead of needing a babysitter like Bluegeek, Askray, Smirk, or Trendy.
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I agree entirely. I wouldn't risk wasting 20k dilithium and maybe get nothing out of it. I would sooner use the Repsystem to get weapons, where I know if I spend the near 20k plus Dilithium I will be 100% sure to get the weapon of my desire.
Yes, Atlmykl, that's what was said, and that's what quite a few people here and in-game are currently discussing.
But it still boggles me, considering most modern MMOs and all the new hip Triple-A games coming out require as much if not more hard-drive space than STO currently does.
Besides newbies getting lost (at which point, that's more them ignoring tutorials, not trying out enough things on their own, and/or the devs not spending the time to add tutorials to certain potentially-confusing moments), this sounds more like an attempt to make it easier for casual players who don't understand the concept of "hard-drive space." So that they can install the game and not scratch their heads over why the installation won't complete when they get an error prompt over lacking space being that their drive is full of other things or too small as it is.
I fully understand that there are more casual players out there who don't get these things. Others have already put up their own examples of computer illiterates who don't quite understand some aspects of computer hardware and software. But this flies in the face of all other popular MMOs out there right now having as much if not much more in the way of space taken on hard-drives.
Frankly, if people can't work things out to get STO working (upgrading to a new hard-drive, upgrading other computer components to make STO run smoother, finding their way out of a small "room" in the game, etc.), then it's unlikely they'd stay with the game long anyway. I've known players to get frustrated at the simplest of things and log off, never to return.
That being said, it's not a good enough reason for the removal of an entire system of gameplay from STO when there is *no* replacement for it. It's one thing if they say "Oh hey, we're planning an exploration upgrade in the near-future, so for the time being we're removing the old Star Clusters to make room for the new system," but that's not what we're being told.
I understand development secrecy, but we're just going by the only reason given so far.
Yes, I haven't used the Star Clusters much in quite a while, or done the First Contact missions since I finished grinding my diplomacy stuff the first time around. But this content actually immersed me in the game, and it's some of our only content available that isn't driven by a menu (queues, ugh)!
The joke going around now is that, at this rate, the devs may as well remove the rest of the game and have us play through a chat window and a menu to queue up runs in. Or replace the latter with a "press to win" button.
I love STO, I think the devs do a fantastic job with what they're given, and I want to keep playing STO. But I want an actual game, a game that grows, not a game that shrinks. Removing exploration without a proper replacement isn't good for a game with "Star Trek" in the title.
I'd rather they go back and fix up what they have if they're not planning a replacement (that doesn't involve playing through a menu to get to where we have to go, AKA queues).
I have a friend who suggested they could tie the Foundry into Star Cluster and other exploration assignments, do contests to find good exploration missions to use. Not talking about long epics, just shorter one-shot assignments to fill Star Clusters with.
If the devs don't want to make new things for Star Clusters, why can't we have that? That would be an amazing use for the Foundry!
Apologies for the extremely long post. =P
...and, Cryptic wonders why people are upset.
I hope Cryptic solves these types of issues.
In that cast this crafting system is doomed to fail right from the start. How ever given the feed back that happened on the first crafting overhaul, adding Dilithium it's self. Made the system unusible. The change to commodities that have to be bought with Dilithium and could be bought and traded took the major sting out of it.
I still was not thrilled they added it to the mix. But I accepted it. Granted I have a life time account, get 500 zen per month and can convert that into dilithium if I desire. It's not a major issue. and I hardly do any crafting. There are some good weapons you get through replays at high levels. So it's not really a die hard situation to craft anymore. I just run a mission five or six times trade the weapons and put them on another alt.
Unfortunately though, imho, you're not necessarily going to get your mods. They're still going to be random. So you could end up with your Purple - and - mods you absolutely do not want. That risk is still going to be there.
So while the gambling on Rarity is diminished/removed at a certain skill level - you're still going to be gambling on what mods you get.
Want an [Acc]x3 weapon? [CrtD]x3? [Acc][CrtH][CrtD]? Hell, some folks might want a [Dmg]x3 weapon. You've got no say in that...that gamble is going to remain.
Even though you may not be able to craft the items needed to make MK XII's at a low level, you can still buy the components to make them (seems hellapricey, but if that's what folks want to do then Cryptic is more than happy to let folks do that)...and you're probably going to be looking at getting a Common/White Mk XII item for it. You'll get the XP - will help you level up faster (hellapricey way to level)...but you're going to get vendor trash out of it.
But even if your skill, DOFF, Catalyst guarantees you that Purple...meh...you're still facing those random mods. Guess it's a Plan A and Plan B sort of gamble, eh? Gambling with Plan A that it's something you want and gambling with Plan B that it's something somebody else might want...otherwise, you're looking at vendor trash.
I call nonsense here.untrue....how can you get lost flying up to a planet and taking a pop up mission ?
Personally i think they want to remove these missions because you can skip most of the story content leveling up Fed toons making leveling fed toons very much easier than klingon or romulan
reduce file size.............
files of this nature can be sent to the client side....they can also be dribbled
level 50 content doesnt need to be loaded at all fo ra new player...it can be added later in dribbles at specific levels saving huge amounts of download
The quality of the explore content is trash so we really arnt losing anything except a easy way to level Fed toons
now fed toons will be as annoying to level up as klingon and romulan toons are
Good news ....I dont need any more toons
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Then it seem most people are still missing the point. HD space is not what they are worried about. The longer people have to wait for something the less likely they are going to follow through. Imagine they were giving free samples out at you favorite food court. Before you get that free slice of pizza they tell you have to fill out a 20 page questionnaire. Well the % of people taking that slice went down. Now imagine they told you that a 30 min personal interview was required... even fewer will follow through.
The point. Large files and long down load times turn off people who might try the game on a impulse.
To be honest if I had ended up in the clusters early on I probably would have uninstalled the game. Not because I was stuck but it would not be unresonable to assume the rest of the gameplay was as drab.
It will also be possible to improve items through crafting, from what I understand from the recent interview with Captain Geko with Priority One.
I can see ending up with at least a white item worst case, especially if your crafting skill level is still low, but if the possibility of ending up with nothing exists, then no, I will not bother to craft. I can't see this as a possibility in STO - they always give you something.
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There's still a connection between the two.
If it isn't hard-drive space itself, then yes, it's download times. But contemporary gaming is filled with large games that prospective players have to download. Most PC gamers are now required to use digital services to buy, download, and install these 20-40gb-sized games. Modern console gamers can just about expect the same thing these days for console games.
In this, the point still stands. Currently-popular games, MMOs and others, require a lot of hard-drive space and time for downloads. Download sizes and times are only going to increase from here, and prospective players are just going to have to deal with it, barring better compression techniques and the like.
Having known more than a few people who have unapologetically short attention spans, I think it's a waste of time to take them into consideration. Most of them will abandon the game if they even get past download and installation long before seeing a good portion of the game's content whether or not it's altered to cater to them or otherwise.
I know people who've abandoned the game before even getting out of the new tutorial, or people who get frustrated with something easily avoidable or solvable by a quick Google search, and etc. etc. These players are not going to be kept, no matter how hard you try. Sure, they may spend some money on the game before their sudden abandonment of the game, but this is not a good long-term thing to focus on.
Instead, the focus should be on making exploration content better, so the players who *want* to stay but do get confused by such things as Star Clusters have an easier time understanding it, not necessarily having an easier time with it on the whole.
In this, you hit the nail on the head. Exploration should not be removed without viable replacement, it should be taken care of. As in fixed, updated, given love in general so players take notice of it and new players aren't confused by it. There's plenty of suggestions out there, and I think tying the Foundry to it and having events to make short missions for dev consideration to be made permanent exploration missions would be an idea too.
It could be tied into the new crafting system too, give us more "mining" opportunities and the like. Some of us prefer a game to play in, not a menu to take priority over gameplay and environments.
Although I do think it would be a really good idea to post a Cliff's notes transcript of the podcast on the home page. I think that would be a more effective way to put out the fires than to respond in threads with dozens of pages. Most people don't read through all those pages or use the dev tracker.
The podcast got me pretty excited about some things to come, although I've still got a watchful eye for now.
Lifetime Sub since June 2010
You know what? Yeah, you are right. I didn't read this part of your statement. Self-control does have to play into the equation.
"SW: TOR" and "Elder Scrolls Online" require around 20 GB of space each. Most single-player and offline games require 20-30 GBs of storage space.
What they are talking about are Solid State Drives which have less capacity but better performance (no moving parts). Sure, you can get a 1 TB traditional hard drive with the platters running at 7200 RPMs but a SSD drive will out perform a traditional drive on the reads/wrights.
Find us at CovenantofHonor.com. My Twitter handle; @jmattmiracle
Badhandle, there maybe something but you will NOT get max level crafting on the new system because you are a max level crafter on the old one. It is a brand new system so everyone will start on the same page.
Find us at CovenantofHonor.com. My Twitter handle; @jmattmiracle
SSD(Solid State Drives) are mostly very small drives but have extremely fast Read/Write times. SSD are basically RAM sticks bundled up into Hard Drive form. Its best to have a SSD and a HDD and put your OS on the SSD for near instantaneous start up times but keep the rest of your stuff on a regular HDD. SSD are still quite expensive, costs over $400 just for a 1TB SSD.
ROFL...
So I won't be able to send hate mail about lockboxes, bugs, glitches, the EP, I quit propaganda, or KDF discrimination anymore?
There is no fun in that!
Will they be added to crafting, or to Romulan reputation?
The system looks really good actually and I can't wait to play around with it some more. However, Beams, Cannons, Ground Weapons and Shields just don't sound right as R&D titles. IMO I think you should use something like Tactical Systems for Cannons, Particle Generation for Beams, Defensive Systems for Shields and Operational Assets for Ground Weapons. It would just make is seem more scientific as a Research and Development model. I would also like to see Propulsion Systems for Engines. Engineering and Scientific Research work well and Projectiles is ok. I would also like to see a Medical Research that encompasses the Hypos and ground buffing items.
Not to say these are the only titles you should use but something along these lines just to make them sound more R&D.
SSD = Solid State Drive
HDD = Hard Disk Drive
Two completely seperate things.
SSDs use flash memory like on a USB thumb drive, and typically have ~500MBps read/write speed maximum. They are much more expensive than HDDs and come in lower capacities due to the cost of high-quality flash chips. They are also more durable than HDDs and can withstand alot of abuse without breaking.
HDDs are the old type of drives that use magnetic spinning platters, and max out at around 80-130 MBps read/write speed. They are also fragile, if you drop them or nudge them while they're operating they can break. They're cheaper, as they use a mature technology, and have a larger capacity, but they also use more power than SSDs.
Pretty common knowledge.
Doffing needs to stay in categories,get rid of those big icons with shiny planets in,atm doffing looks like a big wall of text.
As for trying to make it easier ? its actually harder now,not for me ,but for those people who couldn't make Mk12 consoles via childrens toys doff mission,this will turn them off even more.
More clicking and window opening than doffing atm
Yea i know its in an alpha state but its miles and miles away from where doffing will be used.
i doff every day,if it stays like that i will stop doffing,maybe even stop playing...no its not an i quit post,just saying that you're going the wrong way.
How many others will leave for that mess that is currently doffing on tribble ?
plz plz plz revert doffing to what it is now,its not hard,no i'm not frightened of change.
If people couldn't work out holodecks doffing atm,maybe its not the system but maybe,just maybe its them ?
We DO fear change. The doff interface is absolutely and completely 100% perfect as it is now. There is zero reason to change it.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Primary reason for this change: Gateway integration. Remember, the Gateway is practically intended to be used on touchscreen devices, such as cell phones, where the UI scales to the size of the device.
Having a 100x100 pixel box on an iPhone 4S or Galaxy-x Mini = my kiddo will overlap the box with her fingernail. And I'm talking my 9 year old, not my 19 year old...
I do say that some things - sorting by primary CXP award, showing and sorting by trait, etc., need to come back to the DOff interface. Also, this is a chance to add QoL improvements - pick purples instead of whites, recommend by crit chance instead of success, etc.
Of course, the fact that we're in early alpha means that these things are potentially coming back or in. Same with price tweaks on crafting, the mod changing projects (want [ACC]x3? 3 modifier projects later, you'll have it...) more and more of the fancy modifiers (they released beams and cannons with [ARC] just this last trip to tribble, wondering if we might see [AUX] in the future?) etc. etc.
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
Please add more "flavor text" like described above to the crafting system.
You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
I popped over yesterday to take a look at crafting and wound up doing other things and playing with the DOFF system.
Some needed changes:
Please please Bring back the missions separated by type of XP. Especially when trying to focus on certain DOFF missions for XP (AKA Diplomatic) the new system is painful.
Maybe with time it'll be different but currently it 'feels' clunky. Specifically changing from the 'recommended' officers to one's you choose. I'll just say that given a choice the current 'live' DOFF layout is much more friendly than the one on Tribble. It looks like it's trying to be made nicer looking BUT lacks the functionality of the current system for lack of better way of putting it. The DOFF list is nice especially when you want to choose which officers to send and also the break down by type of mission was really a nice thing. To me it feels like the good was gotten rid of in the process of trying to make it look newer and sleeker.
As to the new crafting I agree with some of the posts before. If we can't pick the traits of the items we're after (rare, dmgx3 etc...) then the new crafting system pretty much just becomes a nerf of the exploration clusters if removed (on a side note does this also mean the KDF defense missions are going since they're setup almost exactly like cluster areas? No I'm not trying to stir up panic but asking in sincerity as it's one of the main ways I level my KDF chars so I can skip certain missions along the way.)
Agreed! Medical would be a really nice addition, but I can see that being added to the broadened "ground" category you describe.
It would be a small thing, perhaps, but one that would a nice coat of polish on the whole system. Make it sound a little more Trek.
Then again, I'm also in favor of adding more lore/flavor text to the tooltips for pretty much every item in the game. That would be no small undertaking...
random rewards = frustration
massive jump in XP requirement from level 2 to 3 = grind = more frustration
making components before equipment = no problem
not knowing which components are needed = frustration
making components 1 at a time = frustration
slow crafting times = irrelevant
so to sum up
we need a way to guarantee rewards, make multiple components at one time, a way to know what components are required for the maximum level you can make and a much smaller grind
As it stands now the proposed crafting system is much worse than what it will replace. I know the intention is to get people to spend more dilithium but right now, what is being proposed is not worth investing the time in
This is why you're one of my favorite posters on the forums. The forums need more objective people who aren't afraid to tell it how it is and let people know when their reality check has bounced.
Players need to be able to police themselves instead of needing a babysitter like Bluegeek, Askray, Smirk, or Trendy.