Oh I can believe that many kids asked for it. I think they asked for dino power though and wouldn't give a damn about the Voth or the Sphere. The Voth and Sphere are for the Trekkie to cloth this content and make it more acceptable.
I doubt many of the kids would have seen the Voyager episode with the Voth in it because it was very intellectual and not really kid material. All that talk of evolutionary scales, distant origin and doctrine would have made their heads spin.
As much as I tend to disagree with you, I won't disagree with you on this necessarily. I think the jury is still out.
But considering just how many people complained (and continue to complain) about a lack of story, not knowing that it was there to be discovered as you progress... I do think it's something they should revisit. Some kind of disclaimer in big gold text, or make it extremely obvious when you first show up that you will find out more as you progress.
If they did that already, I didn't notice. Which could be entirely my fault.
I do think it's an interesting way to express story in this fashion. I always enjoyed the chain doff mission stories, which gave me more incentive to do them. So I think the doff system to reveal more pieces of the puzzle is a step in the right direction.
Likewise with the reputation cinematics. I haven't seen the last 3 yet, so I can't make a final call. But I think it gives me the drive to accomplish the rep tiers to see them, in the same way New Romulus had cinematics to reveal more of the story. Since I do care about story more than pew pew.
Even though it still had some unanswered questions at the end (but not nearly as many as before). Hopefully the Dyson Sphere rep doesn't leave as many unanswered questions lingering. But having seen the first two I can say that there was actual thought put into it outside of "omg dinosaurs"
It just kind of sucks noone will know unless they do the rep grind. Again, big gold text or some other painfully obvious reminder that the story is there to be revealed if you go discover it a la Star Trek.
Yeah, I like the searching for bits and pieces of data aspect of this. But I think the initial explanations were a bit too sparse, and needed a bit more substance. Not a lot, but a little.
As much as I tend to disagree with you, I won't disagree with you on this necessarily. I think the jury is still out.
But considering just how many people complained (and continue to complain) about a lack of story, not knowing that it was there to be discovered as you progress... I do think it's something they should revisit. Some kind of disclaimer in big gold text, or make it extremely obvious when you first show up that you will find out more as you progress.
If they did that already, I didn't notice. Which could be entirely my fault.
I do think it's an interesting way to express story in this fashion. I always enjoyed the chain doff mission stories, which gave me more incentive to do them. So I think the doff system to reveal more pieces of the puzzle is a step in the right direction.
Likewise with the reputation cinematics. I haven't seen the last 3 yet, so I can't make a final call. But I think it gives me the drive to accomplish the rep tiers to see them, in the same way New Romulus had cinematics to reveal more of the story. Since I do care about story more than pew pew.
Even though it still had some unanswered questions at the end (but not nearly as many as before). Hopefully the Dyson Sphere rep doesn't leave as many unanswered questions lingering. But having seen the first two I can say that there was actual thought put into it outside of "omg dinosaurs"
It just kind of sucks noone will know unless they do the rep grind. Again, big gold text or some other painfully obvious reminder that the story is there to be revealed if you go discover it a la Star Trek.
Can you please summarize the revelations for those of us who don't care about buckets? How does season 8 advance the story of "Sphere of Influence"? Can you say more about the level of thought beyond "omg dinosaurs"?
I'm not trying to make a point. I'm genuinely curious, but not curious enough to fill buckets. Obviously, I want something for doing nothing, but the nothing doesn't motivate me to do something.
I doubt many of the kids would have seen the Voyager episode with the Voth in it because it was very intellectual and not really kid material. All that talk of evolutionary scales, distant origin and doctrine would have made their heads spin.
My point exactly. The Voth and the Sphere are for the Trekkies and dinos are for the kids. It is just coating the pill with sugar so we will take it. Obviously, it also makes for a cool and unique environment to host the Season.
The season should have just been renamed Star Trek: Into Darkness - >Jurassic Park
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
I am not against the idea of hidden or plain in sight Easter eggs or rewards in tier reps. But the new zone needs a story to drive the action and that should be presented through cinematics that take you to the sphere and walk you through the content. This is my opinion obviously.
Also I am not against grinds. Heck NO grinds means NO end game. I also praised them on the improvements in this season 8. But this is a bad design, to gate story this way, and it is going to confuse players.
Anyways, we shall see. I still don't believe that sphere was part of the Iconian story. It just feels out of place. Literally and figuratively.
As much as I tend to disagree with you, I won't disagree with you on this necessarily. I think the jury is still out.
But considering just how many people complained (and continue to complain) about a lack of story, not knowing that it was there to be discovered as you progress... I do think it's something they should revisit. Some kind of disclaimer in big gold text, or make it extremely obvious when you first show up that you will find out more as you progress.
If they did that already, I didn't notice. Which could be entirely my fault.
I do think it's an interesting way to express story in this fashion. I always enjoyed the chain doff mission stories, which gave me more incentive to do them. So I think the doff system to reveal more pieces of the puzzle is a step in the right direction.
Likewise with the reputation cinematics. I haven't seen the last 3 yet, so I can't make a final call. But I think it gives me the drive to accomplish the rep tiers to see them, in the same way New Romulus had cinematics to reveal more of the story. Since I do care about story more than pew pew.
Even though it still had some unanswered questions at the end (but not nearly as many as before). Hopefully the Dyson Sphere rep doesn't leave as many unanswered questions lingering. But having seen the first two I can say that there was actual thought put into it outside of "omg dinosaurs"
It just kind of sucks noone will know unless they do the rep grind. Again, big gold text or some other painfully obvious reminder that the story is there to be revealed if you go discover it a la Star Trek.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Can you please summarize the revelations for those of us who don't care about buckets? How does season 8 advance the story of "Sphere of Influence"? Can you say more about the level of thought beyond "omg dinosaurs"?
I'm not trying to make a point. I'm genuinely curious, but not curious enough to fill buckets. Obviously, I want something for doing nothing, but the nothing doesn't motivate me to do something.
[SPOILERS]
...
...
...
From the second cinematic, the Voth sympathizer that's trying to talk to Joint Command (through you) tells us that it isn't coincidence or random encounter that there are both the Voth and the "Alliance" on the Sphere and no other lifeforms whatsoever. He comes across as a genuine scientist who doesn't buy into the traditional Voth way of thinking that "only use science that agrees with our beliefs, and disregard all others".
I get the impression that the Voth think they're too prideful to think they've been purposefully lured here, as well as the Alliance. But that this Voth scientist thinks that the Sphere was not built by, but commissioned by the Iconians (no surprise there). But he says that it's extremely strange that a space station (or whatever) as big as a Dyson Sphere would be simply abandoned. He wants to find out why it was abandoned and who abandoned it. He also mentions that the Voth are typically not militarized, but that they have defended themselves in the Delta Quadrant. A cutscene shows plasma torpedos hitting Voth cruisers, which implies the Voth have defended themselves against the Borg. So he questions why they'd be militarized here on the Sphere where there was no known danger (I think).
I'll have to rewatch it, but those are the sticking points, since they were issues I brought up earlier as to having no story.
From the second cinematic, the Voth sympathizer that's trying to talk to Joint Command (through you) tells us that it isn't coincidence or random encounter that there are both the Voth and the "Alliance" on the Sphere and no other lifeforms whatsoever. He comes across as a genuine scientist who doesn't buy into the traditional Voth way of thinking that "only use science that agrees with our beliefs, and disregard all others".
I get the impression that the Voth think they're too prideful to think they've been purposefully lured here, as well as the Alliance. But that this Voth scientist thinks that the Sphere was not built by, but commissioned by the Iconians (no surprise there). But he says that it's extremely strange that a space station (or whatever) as big as a Dyson Sphere would be simply abandoned. He wants to find out why it was abandoned and who abandoned it. He also mentions that the Voth are typically not militarized, but that they have defended themselves in the Delta Quadrant. A cutscene shows plasma torpedos hitting Voth cruisers, which implies the Voth have defended themselves against the Borg. So he questions why they'd be militarized here on the Sphere where there was no known danger (I think).
I'll have to rewatch it, but those are the sticking points, since they were issues I brought up earlier as to having no story.
So is it going to be the Iconians again... because that is going to get really boring, really quickly. They've had their fingers in the pie for years and it really is getting rather boring having to continually fight these proxy wars. Tools in storytelling usually tell you NOT to introduce the main antagonist too late on in the plot, otherwise you end up with Ultimecia from Final Fantasy VIII, a character which we know very little about by poses no immediate danger because they take so long to enact their plan. This is true of audience, most of them getting p*****d off and leaving for just wanting a swift resolution.
The Iconians seem to be becoming a bad deus ex machina plot device when Cryptic cannot think of a better story. Its getting rather boring now, considering how long they are willing to drag out the big reveal.
Oh and I will contest Cryptic to this day that the Iconians were actually evil or "bad guys", I simply do not believe that they conquered a load of worlds and subjugated species. I don't believe that they built gates in the Andromeda Galaxy as well (Bad Stargate Atlantis rip-off).
If you watch the episode "Contagion", you will find that the Iconians had no evil intent. The computer virus that destroyed the Yomato was interacting with an alien computer and it was that incompatibility that destroyed the ship and nearly the Enterprise and the Hakoona as well. Picard made several references to the Iconians being generally misunderstood as "History is written by the victors" and I'm sorry but the whole Hobus supernova going through an Iconian Gateway to destroy Romulus is just verging on stupid.
Here is my take, the Iconians are not actually "evil" at all. They have been persecuted everywhere they retreated to after their homeworld was destroyed. They were chased by the Borg because of their knowledge of advanced technology and they have retreated into subspace to remain in peace. However Species 8472, convinced that the Iconians were a threat to their genetic integrity sent infiltrators into their population to convince them that the rest of the "genetically impure" species were a threat to the Iconians as well. So the Iconians have been acting out of fear produced by the Undine.
Because I hate to mention this but what is the point of reconquering the Galaxy in the first place for the Iconians, I refused to believe that if this species had been as determined and cunning as Cryptic makes out. They would want to conquer the Galaxy out of petty revenge for their defeat.
While I agree with you on a number of points I don't expect them to change this characterization of the Iconians. It is a done deal. What they need to do, as you suggested, it to get the ball rolling.
You can't have the big bad masterminds show up 2 years from now and tell a compelling story all in one season. Not at the pace Cryptic has been going. Sadly your pleas will fall on deaf ears.
So is it going to be the Iconians again... because that is going to get really boring, really quickly. They've had their fingers in the pie for years and it really is getting rather boring having to continually fight these proxy wars. Tools in storytelling usually tell you NOT to introduce the main antagonist too late on in the plot, otherwise you end up with Ultimecia from Final Fantasy VIII, a character which we know very little about by poses no immediate danger because they take so long to enact their plan. This is true of audience, most of them getting p*****d off and leaving for just wanting a swift resolution.
The Iconians seem to be becoming a bad deus ex machina plot device when Cryptic cannot think of a better story. Its getting rather boring now, considering how long they are willing to drag out the big reveal.
Oh and I will contest Cryptic to this day that the Iconians were actually evil or "bad guys", I simply do not believe that they conquered a load of worlds and subjugated species. I don't believe that they built gates in the Andromeda Galaxy as well (Bad Stargate Atlantis rip-off).
If you watch the episode "Contagion", you will find that the Iconians had no evil intent. The computer virus that destroyed the Yomato was interacting with an alien computer and it was that incompatibility that destroyed the ship and nearly the Enterprise and the Hakoona as well. Picard made several references to the Iconians being generally misunderstood as "History is written by the victors" and I'm sorry but the whole Hobus supernova going through an Iconian Gateway to destroy Romulus is just verging on stupid.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
From the second cinematic, the Voth sympathizer that's trying to talk to Joint Command (through you) tells us that it isn't coincidence or random encounter that there are both the Voth and the "Alliance" on the Sphere and no other lifeforms whatsoever. He comes across as a genuine scientist who doesn't buy into the traditional Voth way of thinking that "only use science that agrees with our beliefs, and disregard all others".
I get the impression that the Voth think they're too prideful to think they've been purposefully lured here, as well as the Alliance. But that this Voth scientist thinks that the Sphere was not built by, but commissioned by the Iconians (no surprise there). But he says that it's extremely strange that a space station (or whatever) as big as a Dyson Sphere would be simply abandoned. He wants to find out why it was abandoned and who abandoned it. He also mentions that the Voth are typically not militarized, but that they have defended themselves in the Delta Quadrant. A cutscene shows plasma torpedos hitting Voth cruisers, which implies the Voth have defended themselves against the Borg. So he questions why they'd be militarized here on the Sphere where there was no known danger (I think).
I'll have to rewatch it, but those are the sticking points, since they were issues I brought up earlier as to having no story.
This matches perfectly with what the consoles in the ground battle zone have to say. Granted the consoles primarily talk about the history of the sphere, but still. The ones I've seen talk about how the Sphere was built by a servitor race that later regretted building it for the Iconians.
They were chased by the Borg because of their knowledge of advanced technology and they have retreated into subspace to remain in peace.
The Iconians are TROLLING the Borg. They STOLE the central plexus of a Borg Cube in Sleepers, one of the missions of the Romulan storyline, after luring them with an Omega particle and one of their ships can destroy 2 cubes without even trying.
I'm pretty sure the Iconians just see the Borg as a nuisance at best. Oh, and it's also implied they're the ones who sent the Borg back in time on the Saragota.
This matches perfectly with what the consoles in the ground battle zone have to say. Granted the consoles primarily talk about the history of the sphere, but still. The ones I've seen talk about how the Sphere was built by a servitor race that later regretted building it for the Iconians.
*Cough* Reapers *cough*
*Cough* Mass Effect Rip-off *cough*
Ever noticed the similarity between the Collectors and the Elachi?
1. They both abduct defenseless colonists
2. They both serve a higher power (Iconians/Reapers)
3. They both live in an area of space which is inaccessible through normal conditions and a portal is needed to go there?
Do you get the point or do I need to go on. I could do this all day, the shameless Mass Effect rip off really doesn't end there.
Rewatched the cinematic. And yes, I'm very much aware of the Iconians being a deus ex machina. I think my forum signature was enough evidence of that. :rolleyes:
[SPOILERS]
Voth scientist guy says that the sphere was commissioned by the Iconians (not built by). Which either means the race that built it were enslaved, or peaceful allies of the Iconians. Voth guy says that the ministry of elders wanted him to publish a paper saying that the Voth's ancestors built the sphere, but he knows better than that. Which is what spurred him to defect.
He seems to think a war that broke out elsewhere caused the Iconians to use the sphere as a hiding place. That they could use the interior of the sphere to hide a bunch of warships, and use food grown in the gardens and farms that line the interior of the sphere. Using the sphere itself to hide them from the rest of the galaxy.
Voth guy says that the Voth aren't Warmongers but they do defend themselves against others who try to get them to join their ranks. Plasma torpedos in the cutscene imply the Borg.
He again questions why the Iconians (if they were here) abandoned the sphere. That they either picked a fight with a superior enemy and lost, or they found a flaw in the sphere itself which made it undesirable to stay at.
In which case we're all on a sphere that could be a ticking time bomb?
I think he implies the reason they're grabbing Omega Particles is to have an advantage over their enemies. Since the cutscene strongly implied the Borg, I'm assuming he meant the Voth were harvesting Omega Particles to use against the Borg.
But then again it could just as easily be them harvesting Omega Particles to use against the Iconians themselves. Which makes me wonder if the Iconians wanted to kill two birds with one stone and use Starfleet's Omega Directive against the Voth so both would be weakened and unable to turn against them. But considering that the scientist strongly stated that the Voth don't pick fights -- since the Voth are here in full military force, I don't think it's us they consider their enemy.
The Iconians are TROLLING the Borg. They STOLE the central plexus of a Borg Cube in Sleepers, one of the missions of the Romulan storyline, after luring them with an Omega particle and one of their ships can destroy 2 cubes without even trying.
I'm pretty sure the Iconians just see the Borg as a nuisance at best. Oh, and it's also implied they're the ones who sent the Borg back in time on the Saragota.
I'm talking about before they had a chance to rebuild, when they retreated from Iconia using the gates. They were scattered around and you have to admit, the Borg would love have assimilated one, think of the knowledge one Iconian would possess. It could have drove them into further seclusion.
Also... thats a good point... how did they regroup after the destruction of Iconia. Records show that they stayed and influenced the language and culture of Dewan, Iccobar and Dynassia?
I really wish this game had been more and that Perpetual had been allowed to finish it.
The myth that Perpetual would have made the ultimate Star Trek MMO is just that, a myth. Completely aside from the fact that they never even finished a Star Trek MMO for us to say one way or another. The very reason they "weren't allowed" to finish it was due to their failings to maintain their company. They had already cancelled one other MMO they were working on prior to coming apart at the seams.
Leading up to their dissolving due to their variety of legal and financial issues (a whole 'nother colorful story about how they mismanaged everything), their website's FAQs and various interviews were beginning to paint the picture of how their STO would have played out. It basically was STO as we have it now, single player captain to single player ship, third-person perspective, no ship interiors planned, etc., etc. I was quite disappointed at that point, though I understand MMO's can't be easily built for more than that.
When Cryptic got it, they had a limited time to build STO due to Perpetual squandering their time with the license and passing the deadline onto Cryptic before it'd get revoked, using whatever assets Perpetual managed to actually make. They likely also got all of Perpetual's documentation on how gameplay would work (you might scoff at this, but documentation is everything when it comes to building a game, you need to know how everything will work, laid out in charts and paragraphs of gameplay that don't exist yet). There's also all the concept work that was done and transferred over that can be clearly seen in our current STO.
What little I've heard beyond that is that there were the makings of a Perpetual STO engine, but little else, and Cryptic with Perpetual's deadline had to turn out a quick STO. As mentioned above, they at least had enough pre-production work to get going and they already had the engine used for Champions Online. The rest is history.
As is Perpetual, as even when the company went kaput and they tried again with company P2, that too closed its doors not too long after. Considering all just that much, it's quite possible an STO miraculously completed under them would have gone down under with them anyway.
Or Activision, for that matter with the experience they have creating some of the best Star Trek games around. Well with the help of Totally Games for Bridge commander and Raven Software for Voyager: Elite Force.
Irony abound then since Activision, in a quick bid for extra cash, dropped support on games like Starfleet Command III and Elite Force 2 almost straight out of release (leaving few copies of SFC3 available and pricey, and also leaving those games without further fixes and updates with the exception of fan modifications) and went to sue Paramount over them "not providing enough material" (i.e. new films/TV shows) for them to make games out of, despite their prior games not needing any new source material up till then.
You can see why they aren't making Star Trek games anymore and why they lost the license.
I recall hearing Stahl himself did quite a bit of grunt work to help fill out the KDF with new missions in the Legacy of Romulus release.
I find another irony in that you invoke the name of Rick Berman, the one many "credit" for crashing Star Trek into the ground, with his mismanagement of the franchise, ending us with Nemesis and a terrible finale for Enterprise. Paramount was happy to close the book on Star Trek after that, basically burning whatever sets and props they could not quickly sell off, hoping for no more Star Trek. Thankfully, things changed.
As for the other names, I think it more prudent that you should merely speak for yourself.
We all share annoyances when it comes to long-standing bugs, but it's silly to think that they don't listen to players. The fact that someone like Tacofangs will come into this thread and respond to your apparently venomous posts is proof enough that the devs here are responsive to players. Though they tend to respond better to constructive criticism and detailed bug reports, as any sane person would.
Not to mention, in development of any project, the workers have a list, a schedule even, of things to do. Some things do go on the backburner, and sometimes longer than they should be, especially if they still have to turn out a product and make money to keep making products. It's unfortunate and annoying, but it happens. That's why I go off to do other things besides play STO. There's plenty else you can do in your free time if something bothers you enough here.
At this point, that's what I'd suggest to you, as there's little constructive criticism going on here, and you may need a break. There's no need to take it this so seriously and aggressively.
Ever noticed the similarity between the Collectors and the Elachi?
1. They both abduct defenseless colonists
2. They both serve a higher power (Iconians/Reapers)
3. They both live in an area of space which is inaccessible through normal conditions and a portal is needed to go there?
Do you get the point or do I need to go on. I could do this all day, the shameless Mass Effect rip off really doesn't end there.
Similarities does not equal a rip-off though imo
Also, I believe the delusion you spoke of is not with me, but you. Not with your opinion (that is yours), though I think many of us wish it was less venom-based and more constructive, but with your view of our defense. Just because we bring up valid points does not automatically make us aft-kissers; that is not how it works
And also, none of us have stated Cryptic have done a perfect job. In fact, this forums is full of posts that show that - but that doesn't mean we can't defend their good points, or try to persuade misconceptions and assumptions toward other viewpoints. So far, you've responded by reverting to personal attacks and possible name-calling... which has already been stated to be a sign of a poor argument.
millybun above me also states similar things, and probably better than I have.
That is all
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
The myth that Perpetual would have made the ultimate Star Trek MMO is just that, a myth. Completely aside from the fact that they never even finished a Star Trek MMO for us to say one way or another. The very reason they "weren't allowed" to finish it was due to their failings to maintain their company. They had already cancelled one other MMO they were working on prior to coming apart at the seams.
Leading up to their dissolving due to their variety of legal and financial issues (a whole 'nother colorful story about how they mismanaged everything), their website's FAQs and various interviews were beginning to paint the picture of how their STO would have played out. It basically was STO as we have it now, single player captain to single player ship, third-person perspective, no ship interiors planned, etc., etc. I was quite disappointed at that point, though I understand MMO's can't be easily built for more than that.
When Cryptic got it, they had a limited time to build STO due to Perpetual squandering their time with the license and passing the deadline onto Cryptic before it'd get revoked, using whatever assets Perpetual managed to actually make. They likely also got all of Perpetual's documentation on how gameplay would work (you might scoff at this, but documentation is everything when it comes to building a game, you need to know how everything will work, laid out in charts and paragraphs of gameplay that don't exist yet). There's also all the concept work that was done and transferred over that can be clearly seen in our current STO.
What little I've heard beyond that is that there were the makings of a Perpetual STO engine, but little else, and Cryptic with Perpetual's deadline had to turn out a quick STO. As mentioned above, they at least had enough pre-production work to get going and they already had the engine used for Champions Online. The rest is history.
As is Perpetual, as even when the company went kaput and they tried again with company P2, that too closed its doors not too long after. Considering all just that much, it's quite possible an STO miraculously completed under them would have gone down under with them anyway.
Irony abound then since Activision, in a quick bid for extra cash, dropped support on games like Starfleet Command III and Elite Force 2 almost straight out of release (leaving few copies of SFC3 available and pricey, and also leaving those games without further fixes and updates with the exception of fan modifications) and went to sue Paramount over them "not providing enough material" (i.e. new films/TV shows) for them to make games out of, despite their prior games not needing any new source material up till then.
You can see why they aren't making Star Trek games anymore and why they lost the license.
I recall hearing Stahl himself did quite a bit of grunt work to help fill out the KDF with new missions in the Legacy of Romulus release.
I find another irony in that you invoke the name of Rick Berman, the one many "credit" for crashing Star Trek into the ground, with his mismanagement of the franchise, ending us with Nemesis and a terrible finale for Enterprise. Paramount was happy to close the book on Star Trek after that, basically burning whatever sets and props they could not quickly sell off, hoping for no more Star Trek. Thankfully, things changed.
As for the other names, I think it more prudent that you should merely speak for yourself.
We all share annoyances when it comes to long-standing bugs, but it's silly to think that they don't listen to players. The fact that someone like Tacofangs will come into this thread and respond to your apparently venomous posts is proof enough that the devs here are responsive to players. Though they tend to respond better to constructive criticism and detailed bug reports, as any sane person would.
Not to mention, in development of any project, the workers have a list, a schedule even, of things to do. Some things do go on the backburner, and sometimes longer than they should be, especially if they still have to turn out a product and make money to keep making products. It's unfortunate and annoying, but it happens. That's why I go off to do other things besides play STO. There's plenty else you can do in your free time if something bothers you enough here.
At this point, that's what I'd suggest to you, as there's little constructive criticism going on here, and you may need a break. There's no need to take it this so seriously and aggressively.
A valid and well structured agruement. But i will ask how long we have to wait for things to improve. This game started good, lots of potential but its decline into free-to-play is when things really started to go wrong and I remember some people saying about it when Free-to-play was announced.
What Taco mistakes for Venom is actually more frustration and fed-up-ness (Not a word, I know). I am tired of constant money grabs and profiteering while Cryptic releases sub-par content. Nobody is going to stick up for Season 8 because you really just can't. Its awful, its disjointed, rushed and really low quality.
Its the lack of quality that disturbs me the most. I would like to see Escorts eventually replaced by Frigates which specialize in beam weapon, as the Federation does in canon. The Defiant is an exception to Federation ship design, always has been but every other Federation ship both before and after has carried phaser beam weapons. Its this total affront and lack of respect for established continuity that annoys me with this game and I know that I am not the only person who thinks this.
The way I see it, Cryptic had their chance and squandered it, years ago.
I would be happy to see no more Trek, its one of those things that should be left with the fans who grew up with it and not brought back to life with the mangled corpse that it has now.
and the most ANNOYING thing of all... When Cryptic tries, they CAN on OCCASION actually produce GOOD stuff. I happened to enjoy the Romulans and then they killed it with that stupid Elachi lockbox, removing any unique and mysterious element about this race and then also by the legacy pack. Dil also needs to be taken out of the Reputation system and out of the Fleet system too. Its just more blatant money grab and exploiting smaller Fleets.
I do feel sorry for the people that don't know what a scam this game is in its current form.
Imo, you simply mistake 'don't know' for 'they honestly like the game'
Is it perfect? No. Is it consistent with canon? No, but then again, an MMO is designed for gameplay and general rule-of-cool, whether people like that or not. But for the most part, STO is pretty good with the new content, just with a modest amount of gameplay-and-story segregation
I liked this game at launch, and I like it now even more. Part of the fun is exploring things that canon wouldn't have us do normally
And also, I believe you miss the point: ST will always be the same. New material cannot and will not ever replace it, or make it a 'mangled corpse', or any such thing. Expanding on a story cannot degrade the previous versions, and never will imo
And in either case, STO is soft canon, meaning it's entirely up to the individual's opinion. Mine is that it's an interesting addition that may never be canon, but that's okay. And I think you'd do well by remembering this hasn't changed any of the ST you know and love.
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
So, to make things simple, you hate this game and the way it's handled. That's understandable and I agree on certain points. I even consider PW to be the Chinese EA and hope their Arc fails and dies in a very painful way, so that says something.
But here's an idea. Now that you shared your opinions (in quite an insulting way), how about you simply stop hurting yourself and leave right now?
Imo, you simply mistake 'don't know' for 'they honestly like the game'
Is it perfect? No. Is it consistent with canon? No, but then again, an MMO is designed for gameplay and general rule-of-cool, whether people like that or not. But for the most part, STO is pretty good with the new content, just with a modest amount of gameplay-and-story segregation
I liked this game at launch, and I like it now even more. Part of the fun is exploring things that canon wouldn't have us do normally
And also, I believe you miss the point: ST will always be the same. New material cannot and will not ever replace it, or make it a 'mangled corpse', or any such thing. Expanding on a story cannot degrade the previous versions, and never will imo
And in either case, STO is soft canon, meaning it's entirely up to the individual's opinion. Mine is that it's an interesting addition that may never be canon, but that's okay. And I think you'd do well by remembering this hasn't changed any of the ST you know and love.
Well, if you are going to make a Star Trek game, even a "soft" canon one. Then it needs to have the ships consistently displayed in a way that makes it correct to the source material. You cannot just make one ship more powerful then the other because you personally like it or reclassify ships from Crusiers to Escorts because you want them to be that (Akira, Steamrunner, Intrepid... all Cruisers). You make the game work around the established basis for Star Trek that you have beforehand, you don't try to change canon to fit some skewed idea of balance. (Lets be honest, balance doesn't really exist.)
To be constructive, I would suggest allowing ships to keep their original stats but allow all ships to have universal bridge officer consoles of various levels. This would allow people to create more unique builds and find new functions for their ships. Plus, I want to see a balance pass to actually see Science and Engineer come up on par with Tactical. I know some people say they are but I am speaking on a more basic level, without having to modify them with gear. New Boff Powers would be really good to see too but they are free so I don't expect to see that.
I do absolutely despise that some ships like the Intrepid, Iconic vessels have been effectively rendered obsolete to newer (usually lockbox or Z-Store ships). Its really wrong and disrespectful to these ships.
Dude. If you don't like it, why are you posting here and playing it? If you think you're going to bring down STO, one person can't, you're one person. The majority people who play this game love this game. Yeah, they get tired of grinding. Yeah, they want more stuff... but they still like it. Plus, it's just a game, it's not going to ruin the whole Trek franchise.
A valid and well structured agruement. But i will ask how long we have to wait for things to improve. This game started good, lots of potential but its decline into free-to-play is when things really started to go wrong and I remember some people saying about it when Free-to-play was announced.
What Taco mistakes for Venom is actually more frustration and fed-up-ness (Not a word, I know). I am tired of constant money grabs and profiteering while Cryptic releases sub-par content. Nobody is going to stick up for Season 8 because you really just can't. Its awful, its disjointed, rushed and really low quality.
Its the lack of quality that disturbs me the most. I would like to see Escorts eventually replaced by Frigates which specialize in beam weapon, as the Federation does in canon. The Defiant is an exception to Federation ship design, always has been but every other Federation ship both before and after has carried phaser beam weapons. Its this total affront and lack of respect for established continuity that annoys me with this game and I know that I am not the only person who thinks this.
The way I see it, Cryptic had their chance and squandered it, years ago.
I would be happy to see no more Trek, its one of those things that should be left with the fans who grew up with it and not brought back to life with the mangled corpse that it has now.
The problem is that Cryptic no longer follows the old subscription model and has to make its money elsewhere. Unfortunately, that involves lockboxes.
There are better ways to criticize what the devs have done and personal attacks is not one of them. You might be correct in your issues with Cryptic, not agreeing with you, but this is not the way to do it and makes you seem uncivilized.
Dude. If you don't like it, why are you posting here and playing it? If you think you're going to bring down STO, one person can't, you're one person. The majority people who play this game love this game. Yeah, they get tired of grinding. Yeah, they want more stuff... but they still like it. Plus, it's just a game, it's not going to ruin the whole Trek franchise.
They like it simply because its Star Trek, I actually still do play but not as much anymore, more like once a week etc. Believe me, if there was another Star Trek MMO of higher quality that was subscription based, had ships that were correct to their function on the show and basically no lockboxes. People would swarm at it. You are confusing "playing it because its the only one" with "they like it" I personally think. I know this to be true, especially to who I talk to but I won't speak for the entire community because I don't know.
But I dunno if people could like this version of a chinese sweatshop... its up to them really.
I really feel I have stated my opinion and I am prepared to leave it at that. I told Taco what I felt was the truth of the matter and I do not regret saying it or being honest. I hope that things will change in the future but after 3 years, I doubt it.
I am not confusing it. I am saying that the majority of people play it because they like it, plain and simple.
This. Just because a game is Star Trek doesn't mean a Star Trek fan will play it for a decent amount of time. Sure they are likely to test it out or research the game and determine if they will play it based on reviews, but if they can't stand it, then they won't play it for long. Lots of these "apologists" have things they don't like about the game, but they like the game in general and not because it is just Star Trek.
If I did not like this game, I would not play this game. If all I sought was Star Trek, Netflix has every episode of every season of every series ready for streaming at a moment's notice.
I enjoy getting into my starship and flitting about this MMO, mockery of real astronomy that it is. I enjoy the missions, and some of the NPC conversations (and willingly ignore the ones I don't enjoy - that's bog-standard for any MMO).
And if you don't enjoy it, don't do it. Life is far too short to waste doing things you don't enjoy, just because they're tinged around the edges with something you do like.
Rewatched the cinematic. And yes, I'm very much aware of the Iconians being a deus ex machina. I think my forum signature was enough evidence of that. :rolleyes:
[SPOILERS]
Voth scientist guy says that the sphere was commissioned by the Iconians (not built by). Which either means the race that built it were enslaved, or peaceful allies of the Iconians. Voth guy says that the ministry of elders wanted him to publish a paper saying that the Voth's ancestors built the sphere, but he knows better than that. Which is what spurred him to defect.
He seems to think a war that broke out elsewhere caused the Iconians to use the sphere as a hiding place. That they could use the interior of the sphere to hide a bunch of warships, and use food grown in the gardens and farms that line the interior of the sphere. Using the sphere itself to hide them from the rest of the galaxy.
Voth guy says that the Voth aren't Warmongers but they do defend themselves against others who try to get them to join their ranks. Plasma torpedos in the cutscene imply the Borg.
He again questions why the Iconians (if they were here) abandoned the sphere. That they either picked a fight with a superior enemy and lost, or they found a flaw in the sphere itself which made it undesirable to stay at.
In which case we're all on a sphere that could be a ticking time bomb?
I think he implies the reason they're grabbing Omega Particles is to have an advantage over their enemies. Since the cutscene strongly implied the Borg, I'm assuming he meant the Voth were harvesting Omega Particles to use against the Borg.
But then again it could just as easily be them harvesting Omega Particles to use against the Iconians themselves. Which makes me wonder if the Iconians wanted to kill two birds with one stone and use Starfleet's Omega Directive against the Voth so both would be weakened and unable to turn against them. But considering that the scientist strongly stated that the Voth don't pick fights -- since the Voth are here in full military force, I don't think it's us they consider their enemy.
I went back to the ground warzone to see what I could get quickly. This is by no means complete data but I did get some of the console data.
-=-=-Complete City console Entry-=-=-
Our gods are here.
They arrived through the sacred gateways, fleeing a fire from above that scorched the surface of their homes in the sun.
We do not know why they linger, when the galaxy is theirs.
They have commanded us to tap the star and generate more particles. It is dangerous, but we will obey.
-=-=-1/3 outskirts console entry-=-=-
It is over. Perhaps we pushed the experiments too far. We cannot know for sure, not in the time we have.
Our ...
-=-=-Voth cache (city)-=-=-
"The alliance of mammals seeks to disrupt our collection of the Omega particles. they have an interest in them. Perhaps they know more than we thought.
Ensure the communication point remains in our control. The array will allow us to record the majority of the mammals' transmissions in this area, while also serving as an excellent base.
Remember, our priority is securing the Omega particles."
-=-=-Voth Cache (city)-=-=-
"... a surprising experience, but one that revealed the barbarism of the mammals. They commit heinous crimes against one another. murder of their own kind is seen as commonplace. Heresy is not punished, but encouraged. Their societies are broken, scattered. They seek to conquer space, yet their own societies have no value for their lives.
We must remember that we, always, are above these mammals. A Voth would never strike another, a Voth would never question the Doctrines that exist to serve and unite our people. To deny any of this would put us at the same level as the mammals."
Very interesting.... I'm gonna have to see what else I can find. I estimate that I have 4/9 console entries and there's probably another 4 or so Voth caches.
-=-=-Complete City console Entry-=-=-
Our gods are here.
They arrived through the sacred gateways, fleeing a fire from above that scorched the surface of their homes in the sun.
We do not know why they linger, when the galaxy is theirs.
They have commanded us to tap the star and generate more particles. It is dangerous, but we will obey.
-=-=-1/3 outskirts console entry-=-=-
It is over. Perhaps we pushed the experiments too far. We cannot know for sure, not in the time we have.
Our ...
So it sounds like the Solanae are the Solanogen aliens according to Cryptic. They originally lived in the Dyson Sphere, but due to various experiments were forced into subspace to survive. Who knows what long term exposure to Omega particles will do.
So it sounds like the Solanae are the Solanogen aliens according to Cryptic. They originally lived in the Dyson Sphere, but due to various experiments were forced into subspace to survive. Who knows what long term exposure to Omega particles will do.
Maybe, maybe not. I need to see if I can find the complete text for the outskirts console next time. I did it on a differ char once, but I don't quite remember exactly what it said. but it was something to the effect that the Solanae race was now doomed because they did what the Iconians told them to do. It seemed to imply that they were becoming extinct, but it's hard to be sure.
As an interesting footnote, it occurred to me while pondering this that maybe those hooded robes the Solanagen aliens wear are actually a sort of environmental suit....
And do you first poster think Kirk and Worf and star trek is real?
They are real people if you are referring to their actors. However, where Star Wars essentially throws magic around and is accepted as more of a fantasy than anything scientific Star Trek tends to be a bit more science heavy. Not saying it does not have its own magic or "pseudoscience" but it at least makes an attempt to be a bit more realistic.
And comparing to Venus or Mars........they are pinpricks of light compared to a Dyson Sphere. A planet is going to reflect like less than 1% of the total output of a star, while a Dyson Sphere is going to reflect 100% of it.
Actually that is incorrect. Why? Because the sphere is going to obviously absorb a fair bit of the output of the star and is only going to reflect some fraction of it. Yes, it would be a big blurred brightness. I can even demonstrate what it would likely look like. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLJiXAnHkGg <- That is what it looks like when the sun's light bounces off the dust and such in our planetary plane (the Zodiac). Now imagine that being much brighter with no other stars and you have what you would see except that it would never be night in a sphere like this.
I concur that you would see something on the far wall. (I've cited Jupiter as well).
However, what we see, is all dependent on the scale of the continents/oceans of the surface. Earth as seen from Saturn, is a blue dot. That's not just because the whole thing is so small, but because the scale of our oceans and continents at that distance are so small, that they all blur together for us in our mind. Think of it like looking at the sand on a beach. If you're close enough, each grain of sand is a different shape/color than the grain next to it. But as seen from any distance, it's basically all one color (or might have larger threads of color running through it)
As for the last bit, yes, if you were inside the atmosphere, the atmosphere itself would cover up the transition, and you'd basically just see a wall rising in the distance (if you could make anything out on it). The problem we ran into is, if you're in space, above the atmosphere, the atmosphere wouldn't do the same thing. You'd be closer to one side of the sphere than the other, but I don't know if what you'd see is described so much as curvature, so much as distance variation.
The funny thing is that the only side you would be closer to is the one that you would currently refer to as the "ground". Because if this is a sphere all the other walls are basically at the same distance from you all the time and so would never really seem to grow closer as a standing wall as we would imagine a wall. It would just become the ground. I mean even on Earth you can very barely make out the curvature of its surface to the point were we used to think it was flat. A sphere like this would make that curvature look downright glaring by comparison.
It would be like taking a beach ball. From a distance you can see it is curved. Now put your nose right up against its surface and take a look at what you can see. Suddenly it looks flat and even that is not to scale because you would need to get microscopic in order to really be to scale.
However, like I said before: When you are in your ship it is not as much of a problem because the ship has advanced and long range sensors and considering how things interact with your view while in your ship we can reasonably assume that your ship view is that of your ship's sensors not your eyes.
I would also like to add that the various locations on the sphere we deal with do look pretty amazing. Not sure what it is up with all the antigravity stuff but it is kind of interesting. I honestly would love to see more of those structures getting even more use. I also like how when you look down you can even see what appear to be little cities which gives an even greater appreciation for the size of the really big structures and our ships.
Comments
I doubt many of the kids would have seen the Voyager episode with the Voth in it because it was very intellectual and not really kid material. All that talk of evolutionary scales, distant origin and doctrine would have made their heads spin.
My character Tsin'xing
Can you please summarize the revelations for those of us who don't care about buckets? How does season 8 advance the story of "Sphere of Influence"? Can you say more about the level of thought beyond "omg dinosaurs"?
I'm not trying to make a point. I'm genuinely curious, but not curious enough to fill buckets. Obviously, I want something for doing nothing, but the nothing doesn't motivate me to do something.
My point exactly. The Voth and the Sphere are for the Trekkies and dinos are for the kids. It is just coating the pill with sugar so we will take it. Obviously, it also makes for a cool and unique environment to host the Season.
The season should have just been renamed Star Trek: Into Darkness - >Jurassic Park
- Judge Aaron Satie
Also I am not against grinds. Heck NO grinds means NO end game. I also praised them on the improvements in this season 8. But this is a bad design, to gate story this way, and it is going to confuse players.
Anyways, we shall see. I still don't believe that sphere was part of the Iconian story. It just feels out of place. Literally and figuratively.
- Judge Aaron Satie
[SPOILERS]
...
...
...
From the second cinematic, the Voth sympathizer that's trying to talk to Joint Command (through you) tells us that it isn't coincidence or random encounter that there are both the Voth and the "Alliance" on the Sphere and no other lifeforms whatsoever. He comes across as a genuine scientist who doesn't buy into the traditional Voth way of thinking that "only use science that agrees with our beliefs, and disregard all others".
I get the impression that the Voth think they're too prideful to think they've been purposefully lured here, as well as the Alliance. But that this Voth scientist thinks that the Sphere was not built by, but commissioned by the Iconians (no surprise there). But he says that it's extremely strange that a space station (or whatever) as big as a Dyson Sphere would be simply abandoned. He wants to find out why it was abandoned and who abandoned it. He also mentions that the Voth are typically not militarized, but that they have defended themselves in the Delta Quadrant. A cutscene shows plasma torpedos hitting Voth cruisers, which implies the Voth have defended themselves against the Borg. So he questions why they'd be militarized here on the Sphere where there was no known danger (I think).
I'll have to rewatch it, but those are the sticking points, since they were issues I brought up earlier as to having no story.
So is it going to be the Iconians again... because that is going to get really boring, really quickly. They've had their fingers in the pie for years and it really is getting rather boring having to continually fight these proxy wars. Tools in storytelling usually tell you NOT to introduce the main antagonist too late on in the plot, otherwise you end up with Ultimecia from Final Fantasy VIII, a character which we know very little about by poses no immediate danger because they take so long to enact their plan. This is true of audience, most of them getting p*****d off and leaving for just wanting a swift resolution.
The Iconians seem to be becoming a bad deus ex machina plot device when Cryptic cannot think of a better story. Its getting rather boring now, considering how long they are willing to drag out the big reveal.
Oh and I will contest Cryptic to this day that the Iconians were actually evil or "bad guys", I simply do not believe that they conquered a load of worlds and subjugated species. I don't believe that they built gates in the Andromeda Galaxy as well (Bad Stargate Atlantis rip-off).
If you watch the episode "Contagion", you will find that the Iconians had no evil intent. The computer virus that destroyed the Yomato was interacting with an alien computer and it was that incompatibility that destroyed the ship and nearly the Enterprise and the Hakoona as well. Picard made several references to the Iconians being generally misunderstood as "History is written by the victors" and I'm sorry but the whole Hobus supernova going through an Iconian Gateway to destroy Romulus is just verging on stupid.
Here is my take, the Iconians are not actually "evil" at all. They have been persecuted everywhere they retreated to after their homeworld was destroyed. They were chased by the Borg because of their knowledge of advanced technology and they have retreated into subspace to remain in peace. However Species 8472, convinced that the Iconians were a threat to their genetic integrity sent infiltrators into their population to convince them that the rest of the "genetically impure" species were a threat to the Iconians as well. So the Iconians have been acting out of fear produced by the Undine.
Because I hate to mention this but what is the point of reconquering the Galaxy in the first place for the Iconians, I refused to believe that if this species had been as determined and cunning as Cryptic makes out. They would want to conquer the Galaxy out of petty revenge for their defeat.
You can't have the big bad masterminds show up 2 years from now and tell a compelling story all in one season. Not at the pace Cryptic has been going. Sadly your pleas will fall on deaf ears.
- Judge Aaron Satie
My character Tsin'xing
The Iconians are TROLLING the Borg. They STOLE the central plexus of a Borg Cube in Sleepers, one of the missions of the Romulan storyline, after luring them with an Omega particle and one of their ships can destroy 2 cubes without even trying.
I'm pretty sure the Iconians just see the Borg as a nuisance at best. Oh, and it's also implied they're the ones who sent the Borg back in time on the Saragota.
*Cough* Reapers *cough*
*Cough* Mass Effect Rip-off *cough*
Ever noticed the similarity between the Collectors and the Elachi?
1. They both abduct defenseless colonists
2. They both serve a higher power (Iconians/Reapers)
3. They both live in an area of space which is inaccessible through normal conditions and a portal is needed to go there?
Do you get the point or do I need to go on. I could do this all day, the shameless Mass Effect rip off really doesn't end there.
[SPOILERS]
Voth scientist guy says that the sphere was commissioned by the Iconians (not built by). Which either means the race that built it were enslaved, or peaceful allies of the Iconians. Voth guy says that the ministry of elders wanted him to publish a paper saying that the Voth's ancestors built the sphere, but he knows better than that. Which is what spurred him to defect.
He seems to think a war that broke out elsewhere caused the Iconians to use the sphere as a hiding place. That they could use the interior of the sphere to hide a bunch of warships, and use food grown in the gardens and farms that line the interior of the sphere. Using the sphere itself to hide them from the rest of the galaxy.
Voth guy says that the Voth aren't Warmongers but they do defend themselves against others who try to get them to join their ranks. Plasma torpedos in the cutscene imply the Borg.
He again questions why the Iconians (if they were here) abandoned the sphere. That they either picked a fight with a superior enemy and lost, or they found a flaw in the sphere itself which made it undesirable to stay at.
In which case we're all on a sphere that could be a ticking time bomb?
I think he implies the reason they're grabbing Omega Particles is to have an advantage over their enemies. Since the cutscene strongly implied the Borg, I'm assuming he meant the Voth were harvesting Omega Particles to use against the Borg.
But then again it could just as easily be them harvesting Omega Particles to use against the Iconians themselves. Which makes me wonder if the Iconians wanted to kill two birds with one stone and use Starfleet's Omega Directive against the Voth so both would be weakened and unable to turn against them. But considering that the scientist strongly stated that the Voth don't pick fights -- since the Voth are here in full military force, I don't think it's us they consider their enemy.
I'm talking about before they had a chance to rebuild, when they retreated from Iconia using the gates. They were scattered around and you have to admit, the Borg would love have assimilated one, think of the knowledge one Iconian would possess. It could have drove them into further seclusion.
Also... thats a good point... how did they regroup after the destruction of Iconia. Records show that they stayed and influenced the language and culture of Dewan, Iccobar and Dynassia?
The myth that Perpetual would have made the ultimate Star Trek MMO is just that, a myth. Completely aside from the fact that they never even finished a Star Trek MMO for us to say one way or another. The very reason they "weren't allowed" to finish it was due to their failings to maintain their company. They had already cancelled one other MMO they were working on prior to coming apart at the seams.
Leading up to their dissolving due to their variety of legal and financial issues (a whole 'nother colorful story about how they mismanaged everything), their website's FAQs and various interviews were beginning to paint the picture of how their STO would have played out. It basically was STO as we have it now, single player captain to single player ship, third-person perspective, no ship interiors planned, etc., etc. I was quite disappointed at that point, though I understand MMO's can't be easily built for more than that.
When Cryptic got it, they had a limited time to build STO due to Perpetual squandering their time with the license and passing the deadline onto Cryptic before it'd get revoked, using whatever assets Perpetual managed to actually make. They likely also got all of Perpetual's documentation on how gameplay would work (you might scoff at this, but documentation is everything when it comes to building a game, you need to know how everything will work, laid out in charts and paragraphs of gameplay that don't exist yet). There's also all the concept work that was done and transferred over that can be clearly seen in our current STO.
What little I've heard beyond that is that there were the makings of a Perpetual STO engine, but little else, and Cryptic with Perpetual's deadline had to turn out a quick STO. As mentioned above, they at least had enough pre-production work to get going and they already had the engine used for Champions Online. The rest is history.
As is Perpetual, as even when the company went kaput and they tried again with company P2, that too closed its doors not too long after. Considering all just that much, it's quite possible an STO miraculously completed under them would have gone down under with them anyway.
Irony abound then since Activision, in a quick bid for extra cash, dropped support on games like Starfleet Command III and Elite Force 2 almost straight out of release (leaving few copies of SFC3 available and pricey, and also leaving those games without further fixes and updates with the exception of fan modifications) and went to sue Paramount over them "not providing enough material" (i.e. new films/TV shows) for them to make games out of, despite their prior games not needing any new source material up till then.
You can see why they aren't making Star Trek games anymore and why they lost the license.
I recall hearing Stahl himself did quite a bit of grunt work to help fill out the KDF with new missions in the Legacy of Romulus release.
I find another irony in that you invoke the name of Rick Berman, the one many "credit" for crashing Star Trek into the ground, with his mismanagement of the franchise, ending us with Nemesis and a terrible finale for Enterprise. Paramount was happy to close the book on Star Trek after that, basically burning whatever sets and props they could not quickly sell off, hoping for no more Star Trek. Thankfully, things changed.
As for the other names, I think it more prudent that you should merely speak for yourself.
We all share annoyances when it comes to long-standing bugs, but it's silly to think that they don't listen to players. The fact that someone like Tacofangs will come into this thread and respond to your apparently venomous posts is proof enough that the devs here are responsive to players. Though they tend to respond better to constructive criticism and detailed bug reports, as any sane person would.
Not to mention, in development of any project, the workers have a list, a schedule even, of things to do. Some things do go on the backburner, and sometimes longer than they should be, especially if they still have to turn out a product and make money to keep making products. It's unfortunate and annoying, but it happens. That's why I go off to do other things besides play STO. There's plenty else you can do in your free time if something bothers you enough here.
At this point, that's what I'd suggest to you, as there's little constructive criticism going on here, and you may need a break. There's no need to take it this so seriously and aggressively.
Also, I believe the delusion you spoke of is not with me, but you. Not with your opinion (that is yours), though I think many of us wish it was less venom-based and more constructive, but with your view of our defense. Just because we bring up valid points does not automatically make us aft-kissers; that is not how it works
And also, none of us have stated Cryptic have done a perfect job. In fact, this forums is full of posts that show that - but that doesn't mean we can't defend their good points, or try to persuade misconceptions and assumptions toward other viewpoints. So far, you've responded by reverting to personal attacks and possible name-calling... which has already been stated to be a sign of a poor argument.
millybun above me also states similar things, and probably better than I have.
That is all
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
A valid and well structured agruement. But i will ask how long we have to wait for things to improve. This game started good, lots of potential but its decline into free-to-play is when things really started to go wrong and I remember some people saying about it when Free-to-play was announced.
What Taco mistakes for Venom is actually more frustration and fed-up-ness (Not a word, I know). I am tired of constant money grabs and profiteering while Cryptic releases sub-par content. Nobody is going to stick up for Season 8 because you really just can't. Its awful, its disjointed, rushed and really low quality.
Its the lack of quality that disturbs me the most. I would like to see Escorts eventually replaced by Frigates which specialize in beam weapon, as the Federation does in canon. The Defiant is an exception to Federation ship design, always has been but every other Federation ship both before and after has carried phaser beam weapons. Its this total affront and lack of respect for established continuity that annoys me with this game and I know that I am not the only person who thinks this.
This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Perfect World Entertainment Community Rules and Policies . ~Bluegeek
The way I see it, Cryptic had their chance and squandered it, years ago.
I would be happy to see no more Trek, its one of those things that should be left with the fans who grew up with it and not brought back to life with the mangled corpse that it has now.
and the most ANNOYING thing of all... When Cryptic tries, they CAN on OCCASION actually produce GOOD stuff. I happened to enjoy the Romulans and then they killed it with that stupid Elachi lockbox, removing any unique and mysterious element about this race and then also by the legacy pack. Dil also needs to be taken out of the Reputation system and out of the Fleet system too. Its just more blatant money grab and exploiting smaller Fleets.
Is it perfect? No. Is it consistent with canon? No, but then again, an MMO is designed for gameplay and general rule-of-cool, whether people like that or not. But for the most part, STO is pretty good with the new content, just with a modest amount of gameplay-and-story segregation
I liked this game at launch, and I like it now even more. Part of the fun is exploring things that canon wouldn't have us do normally
And also, I believe you miss the point: ST will always be the same. New material cannot and will not ever replace it, or make it a 'mangled corpse', or any such thing. Expanding on a story cannot degrade the previous versions, and never will imo
And in either case, STO is soft canon, meaning it's entirely up to the individual's opinion. Mine is that it's an interesting addition that may never be canon, but that's okay. And I think you'd do well by remembering this hasn't changed any of the ST you know and love.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
But here's an idea. Now that you shared your opinions (in quite an insulting way), how about you simply stop hurting yourself and leave right now?
Well, if you are going to make a Star Trek game, even a "soft" canon one. Then it needs to have the ships consistently displayed in a way that makes it correct to the source material. You cannot just make one ship more powerful then the other because you personally like it or reclassify ships from Crusiers to Escorts because you want them to be that (Akira, Steamrunner, Intrepid... all Cruisers). You make the game work around the established basis for Star Trek that you have beforehand, you don't try to change canon to fit some skewed idea of balance. (Lets be honest, balance doesn't really exist.)
To be constructive, I would suggest allowing ships to keep their original stats but allow all ships to have universal bridge officer consoles of various levels. This would allow people to create more unique builds and find new functions for their ships. Plus, I want to see a balance pass to actually see Science and Engineer come up on par with Tactical. I know some people say they are but I am speaking on a more basic level, without having to modify them with gear. New Boff Powers would be really good to see too but they are free so I don't expect to see that.
I do absolutely despise that some ships like the Intrepid, Iconic vessels have been effectively rendered obsolete to newer (usually lockbox or Z-Store ships). Its really wrong and disrespectful to these ships.
Dude. If you don't like it, why are you posting here and playing it? If you think you're going to bring down STO, one person can't, you're one person. The majority people who play this game love this game. Yeah, they get tired of grinding. Yeah, they want more stuff... but they still like it. Plus, it's just a game, it's not going to ruin the whole Trek franchise.
The problem is that Cryptic no longer follows the old subscription model and has to make its money elsewhere. Unfortunately, that involves lockboxes.
There are better ways to criticize what the devs have done and personal attacks is not one of them. You might be correct in your issues with Cryptic, not agreeing with you, but this is not the way to do it and makes you seem uncivilized.
They like it simply because its Star Trek, I actually still do play but not as much anymore, more like once a week etc. Believe me, if there was another Star Trek MMO of higher quality that was subscription based, had ships that were correct to their function on the show and basically no lockboxes. People would swarm at it. You are confusing "playing it because its the only one" with "they like it" I personally think. I know this to be true, especially to who I talk to but I won't speak for the entire community because I don't know.
But I dunno if people could like this version of a chinese sweatshop... its up to them really.
I really feel I have stated my opinion and I am prepared to leave it at that. I told Taco what I felt was the truth of the matter and I do not regret saying it or being honest. I hope that things will change in the future but after 3 years, I doubt it.
I am not confusing it. I am saying that the majority of people play it because they like it, plain and simple.
This. Just because a game is Star Trek doesn't mean a Star Trek fan will play it for a decent amount of time. Sure they are likely to test it out or research the game and determine if they will play it based on reviews, but if they can't stand it, then they won't play it for long. Lots of these "apologists" have things they don't like about the game, but they like the game in general and not because it is just Star Trek.
I enjoy getting into my starship and flitting about this MMO, mockery of real astronomy that it is. I enjoy the missions, and some of the NPC conversations (and willingly ignore the ones I don't enjoy - that's bog-standard for any MMO).
And if you don't enjoy it, don't do it. Life is far too short to waste doing things you don't enjoy, just because they're tinged around the edges with something you do like.
-=-=-Complete City console Entry-=-=-
Our gods are here.
They arrived through the sacred gateways, fleeing a fire from above that scorched the surface of their homes in the sun.
We do not know why they linger, when the galaxy is theirs.
They have commanded us to tap the star and generate more particles. It is dangerous, but we will obey.
-=-=-1/3 outskirts console entry-=-=-
It is over. Perhaps we pushed the experiments too far. We cannot know for sure, not in the time we have.
Our ...
-=-=-Voth cache (city)-=-=-
"The alliance of mammals seeks to disrupt our collection of the Omega particles. they have an interest in them. Perhaps they know more than we thought.
Ensure the communication point remains in our control. The array will allow us to record the majority of the mammals' transmissions in this area, while also serving as an excellent base.
Remember, our priority is securing the Omega particles."
-=-=-Voth Cache (city)-=-=-
"... a surprising experience, but one that revealed the barbarism of the mammals. They commit heinous crimes against one another. murder of their own kind is seen as commonplace. Heresy is not punished, but encouraged. Their societies are broken, scattered. They seek to conquer space, yet their own societies have no value for their lives.
We must remember that we, always, are above these mammals. A Voth would never strike another, a Voth would never question the Doctrines that exist to serve and unite our people. To deny any of this would put us at the same level as the mammals."
Very interesting.... I'm gonna have to see what else I can find.
My character Tsin'xing
So it sounds like the Solanae are the Solanogen aliens according to Cryptic. They originally lived in the Dyson Sphere, but due to various experiments were forced into subspace to survive. Who knows what long term exposure to Omega particles will do.
As an interesting footnote, it occurred to me while pondering this that maybe those hooded robes the Solanagen aliens wear are actually a sort of environmental suit....
My character Tsin'xing
They are real people if you are referring to their actors. However, where Star Wars essentially throws magic around and is accepted as more of a fantasy than anything scientific Star Trek tends to be a bit more science heavy. Not saying it does not have its own magic or "pseudoscience" but it at least makes an attempt to be a bit more realistic.
Actually that is incorrect. Why? Because the sphere is going to obviously absorb a fair bit of the output of the star and is only going to reflect some fraction of it. Yes, it would be a big blurred brightness. I can even demonstrate what it would likely look like. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLJiXAnHkGg <- That is what it looks like when the sun's light bounces off the dust and such in our planetary plane (the Zodiac). Now imagine that being much brighter with no other stars and you have what you would see except that it would never be night in a sphere like this.
The funny thing is that the only side you would be closer to is the one that you would currently refer to as the "ground". Because if this is a sphere all the other walls are basically at the same distance from you all the time and so would never really seem to grow closer as a standing wall as we would imagine a wall. It would just become the ground. I mean even on Earth you can very barely make out the curvature of its surface to the point were we used to think it was flat. A sphere like this would make that curvature look downright glaring by comparison.
It would be like taking a beach ball. From a distance you can see it is curved. Now put your nose right up against its surface and take a look at what you can see. Suddenly it looks flat and even that is not to scale because you would need to get microscopic in order to really be to scale.
However, like I said before: When you are in your ship it is not as much of a problem because the ship has advanced and long range sensors and considering how things interact with your view while in your ship we can reasonably assume that your ship view is that of your ship's sensors not your eyes.
I would also like to add that the various locations on the sphere we deal with do look pretty amazing. Not sure what it is up with all the antigravity stuff but it is kind of interesting. I honestly would love to see more of those structures getting even more use. I also like how when you look down you can even see what appear to be little cities which gives an even greater appreciation for the size of the really big structures and our ships.
Ain't Nobody Got Time for That
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]