Something unique like
Com Engineer
Ens Engineer
Lt Com Tactical
Lt com Science
with
3 engineering consoles
3 science consoles
3 Tactical consoles
Fleet version could add another Engineer or keep the unique feel by adding a universal console so you choose what you want the added console to be (bit of a pipe dream i know but would be cool).
You may be up to something here though as people already said, changing BOFF layouts won't happen since the ship in-game has been paid for and they can't change the product afterwards.
But I like the 3(4)/3/3 (ENG/SCI/TAC) console layout reflecting a well balanced ship class. Your suggested layout, however, I'd change to something like
CMDR Engineer
LTC Engineer
LTC Science
LT Tac
Why? As dknight pointed out, this layout (C,LC,LC,L) is featured on the Vo'Quv already. I would keep the CDR/LTC Engineering combo however since it reflects the sturdyness of this vessel and keeps it's excellent resistance. The additional tac console brings it en par with the other cruisers but while keeping the lt tac it doesn't outclass the regent which is supposed to be the most offensive cruiser plus it's kinda cheap to just buff up the tac abilities to make the ship worthwhile - that's not helping adressing the problems the game and cruisers have. My suggested setup would put it in a very good all around position of supporting and solo operations. I wouldn't add a universal BOFF to the Gal as well since I kinda think that should be reserved for mission-pod vessels.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
Well the fate of every fictional character lies in the hands of the author.
Fact is that Riker was in command when the -D was destroyed. It wasn't a Borg ship, it wasn't a small fleet of Romulan Warbirds that managed to kill the Hero ship, no it was a cheap old ship. Even with the shield modulation data, in their hands the klingon ship never should have been capable to destroy the -D. One single salvo of photon torpedoes, one forceful counter attack of the GCS should have obliterated those cave mans and their bucket of a ship.
Plot death or not Riker never should set a foot on a Starfleet ship again just as half of the Bridge crew. Not because they have lost, but because HOW.
That's not all, has anyone noticed how disinterested Picard behaved in the last minutes of the movie? It's almost as if he would leave for hollidays, lol.
Even Kirk was shocked when he saw "his" Enterprise get destroyed in ST: III.
Production wise, why couldn't they have made a complete overaul of the ship similar to the TOS Enterpise in the motion picture? The result could have been a much more "modern" looking ship (similar to STOs Venture Class, but without the ugly Engineering hull and pylons), but there was no absolutely no reason to give the Big -D a undeserving and unheroic death and substitute it with a cheap looking Excelsior copy.
On the other hand, i belive that ST:8 would have had a much more emotional impact for the fans if we would have seen the -Ds corridors being "Borgified" instead of a total unknown ship we have never seen before.
I think the flyby at the end of the Movie would have been looking awesome with a GCS instead of a Sovereign.
(But thats just my sujective opinion, of course.)
again not riker's fault. we know he's a good tacical captain again Plot death. the B'Rel should have never been able to cause that much damage. the phasers and photons volleys should have killed it. again another critical mistake by the writers in this poorly designed movie.
again not riker's fault. we know he's a good tacical captain again Plot death. the B'Rel should have never been able to cause that much damage. the phasers and photons volleys should have killed it. again another critical mistake by the writers in this poorly designed movie.
To be fair B'rel took out the D twice: once, in Rascals where it was disabled and boarded by Ferengi, and once in Generations - and Riker was in command both times. I think when Riker was about the Pagh as an exchange officer the Klingons secretly slipped something into his brain that makes it not function properly when fighting Klingon ships.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
some people claim to be able to finish elite stf with shuttle and connie ship, daes that mean these ships are on part with tier 5 ship? no.
you don't evaluate the capacities of a ship by the less challenging area of the game since it will not show you the limits of it and how daes it perform against other ship in the same categorie.
I never said that the Galaxy was on par 100% with other Tier 5 vessels.
And you do not evaluate a ship in this game solely through the more challenging instances either.
The general argument is that the Galaxy is completely useless. I refuted that.
However, I did not refute that the Galaxy is not a good choice in some venues. As it stands now, that much is true.
i do run the galaxy x as my primary, and that is an understatement since i only fly that ship since 2 years altrought i got an exelsior, breen, free odysssey and defiant available.
i do not switch ship for any content, elite stf or pvp ( even if i don't have much time for pvp lately )
so even today, elite stf and the like ( exept pvp ) are not that challenging even for that ship.
I've played, and still do at times play, the Galaxy-X, although it has largely been pushed to the wayside by my Odyssey. And throughout my time in this game, I've played a variety of ship types. But I'm a cruiser man at heart, and know 'em far better than the other types of vessels in this game.
That being said, with any good, carefully though out build, any cruiser can easily pull it's weight in difficult venues (which is mostly pressure damage and taking some of the heat off of the Escorts and Science Vessels), while racking up some kills of it's own. But without top flight gear (fleet and rep) and careful builds, I wouldn't run a typical cruiser in a typical elite STF or a PvP match with heavy hitters. That's the territory that Escort "fighter jocks" flourish, and dominate, in.
But maybe that's just me.
that depend of what you mean by "better".
for the galaxy retrofit, better, in my opinion daesn't mean more powerfull, but more efficient.
3 ensign engie power is not efficient.
to show you are inefficient this ship is let do a little comparison.
can you find any "free" tactical cruiser that is as good or better than the cstore exelsior or assault cruiser ( remember, cruiser not hybrid ) ?
response: no
can you find any "free" ship that is as good or better than the cstore galaxy retrofit?
response: yes and in fact it is better and it's the star cruiser
The C-Store Galaxy has only one Ensign Engineer Boff position. The other two are Lt. Commander and Commander. Which, in theory, combined with passives and gear should keep the ship alive (in a typical instance) to keep up pressure damage, draw aggro from the DPS muscle boats, and throw out some heals.
Which I managed to do (more or less) with my crummy Tier 4 version back in the day, with a Tactical captain at that. The T5 Galaxy should do better at those kind of jobs, provided that you don't believe that they are obsolete in the current age of power creep and the DPS arms race. (Which I don't. But I do believe that their relevance has been greatly reduced thanks to "tanky" Escorts).
Does that mean that I like the setup of the Galaxy Retro? No, I don't. I believe that a C-Store vessel should have at least one Universal bridge officer slot.
And one free ship out of dozens being "better" than the Galaxy Retrofit doesn't make it a complete waste. And comparison to the Excelsior C-Store upgrade isn't relevant because it's better than just about any cruiser in it's class. Hell, the Fleet variant is probably the best cruiser in the game. Just about any cruiser would "suck" when compared to it.
A better comparison is between the Galaxy-R and Odyssey Operations variant. On paper, it's far better than the older vessel. But the only areas where it really shines over the Galaxy-R is universal Boff seating and larger crew. Other than that, they are somewhat comparable. Both are big, slow engineer heavy cruisers. And I don't see much in the way of condemnation for the Odyssey Operations model. If you can successfully utilize the Odyssey Ops boat, with a little more work, you can successfully use a Galaxy-R in this game. Which means it's not a complete suck boat like many think it is. Just neither are ideal choices in a couple of venues.
Sure, things could be worked to get more usefulness out of the Galaxy, which I would have no issue with. In fact, I would support such a move 100%. But to say that it is a real stinker as is would be a faulty conclusion.
would retconning it to a modified vorcha might make more sense?
a vorcha would just about be a perfect match for a GCS with no shields. not being able to instantly re-modulate shields on a whim, especially post borg contact, would still be a huge plot hole. a vorcha vs galaxy would have been a worthy movie fight, and a good death for the D.
You may be up to something here though as people already said, changing BOFF layouts won't happen since the ship in-game has been paid for and they can't change the product afterwards.
But I like the 3(4)/3/3 (ENG/SCI/TAC) console layout reflecting a well balanced ship class. Your suggested layout, however, I'd change to something like
CMDR Engineer
LTC Engineer
LTC Science
LT Tac
Why? As dknight pointed out, this layout (C,LC,LC,L) is featured on the Vo'Quv already. I would keep the CDR/LTC Engineering combo however since it reflects the sturdyness of this vessel and keeps it's excellent resistance. The additional tac console brings it en par with the other cruisers but while keeping the lt tac it doesn't outclass the regent which is supposed to be the most offensive cruiser plus it's kinda cheap to just buff up the tac abilities to make the ship worthwhile - that's not helping adressing the problems the game and cruisers have. My suggested setup would put it in a very good all around position of supporting and solo operations. I wouldn't add a universal BOFF to the Gal as well since I kinda think that should be reserved for mission-pod vessels.
Personally i'd like to see something more like a
Lt.Cmdr. Tac
Cmdr. Engineer
Lt. Engineer
Lt.Cmdr. Science
(exactly like the Mirror Universe Vo'Quv Carrier, which is a free ship, btw.)
I think this would make the ship much more versatile and to be honest just a Lt tactical is to little.
But i like the emphasis on Science of your proposed BOFF layout. It's similar to the T4 Venture BOFF layout which has
Lt. Tac
Cmdr. Engineering
Lt. Engineering
Lt. Sci.
Ens. Sci
Althrough it is just a T4 ship its BOFF layout is by far better that the Galaxy -R BOFF layout.
On the other hand i don't see a big hinderance to give a ship the same BOFF or console Layout as another ship has.
Especially since both ships don't belong to the same faction and even if they did, all other stats and their function would still be different. The important thing is that people could fly their favourite ships without being disadvantaged so i wouldn't care if they would give it the same Layout like a Kamarag Battlecruiser Retrofit or Mirror Universe Vo'Quv Carrier, the GCS still would be hugely different.
a vorcha would just about be a perfect match for a GCS with no shields. not being able to instantly re-modulate shields on a whim, especially post borg contact, would still be a huge plot hole. a vorcha vs galaxy would have been a worthy movie fight, and a good death for the D.
Yeah, but in order to make it a heroic death, i would make them a squadron of three Vor'cha Battlecruisers, and we all know Klingons like to attack in superior numbers . They should have let the GCS her shields and instead put them a good fight to the bitter end.
That fight didn't need to be as static as most TNG space fights where, instead they could have maneuvered the -D to the center of the Planets magnetic pole to confuse the attackers or could have maneuvered the -D into a nebular and start them a cat-and-mouse game.
But in my opinion, the -D didn't need to die at all.
TBH, i found her death far more sad then Kirks.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
Lt.Cmdr. Tac
Cmdr. Engineer
Lt. Engineer
Lt.Cmdr. Science
(exactly like the Mirror Universe Vo'Quv Carrier, which is a free ship, btw.)
I think this would make the ship much more versatile and to be honest just a Lt tactical is to little.
(...)
Yeah, I'm still not sure about the LTC tac because I somehow try to put the GCS into the limitations that STO offers. Just considering cruisers in game and presume they have a "role", the GCS would not be the first choice for a tactical mission. She's a command ship more than a frontline battlecruiser and we have the sovereign and regent fill that role already which I can accept being more tactical oriented cruisers. That should be reflected by an ability rather than tactical slots like make the Gal-X's phaser lance a charged phaser blast using the full array or something. You know that I know the GCS can pack a punch while keeping the Federation's more peaceful principles up - and I feel just putting LTC tacs on every ship somehow doesn't help the problems of the game. The sci/eng heavy seating I proposed wuld be a good upgrade over the T4 venture, like you pointed out.
On the other hand i don't see a big hinderance to give a ship the same BOFF or console Layout as another ship has.
Especially since both ships don't belong to the same faction and even if they did, all other stats and their function would still be different. The important thing is that people could fly their favourite ships without being disadvantaged so i wouldn't care if they would give it the same Layout like a Kamarag Battlecruiser Retrofit or Mirror Universe Vo'Quv Carrier, the GCS still would be hugely different.
To be perfectly honest - I don't see a reason why ships should have different/not all universal slots at all because we should just use the ship we like to use. Sure, a console layout/bonus abilities can change and smaller vessels should have less abilities than large one but compensate for it by other means so we have a high diversity on ships, many different big cruisers who are accompanied by smaller vessels that support them would make a much better and epic feel than the trinity. But it's hard to implement such a fundamental change to the game.
Yeah, but in order to make it a heroic death, i would make them a squadron of three Vor'cha Battlecruisers, and we all know Klingons like to attack in superior numbers . They should have let the GCS her shields and instead put them a good fight to the bitter end.
Well, three Vor'Cha Battlecruisers would be a little bit overkill, as much as I love the old girl she's not that tough especially when ambushed. But A fight Galaxy vs Vor'Cha would be a epic final moment since I love both ship classes - it just would be hard to explain how renegade Klingons could get hold of a Vor'Cha which was the most advanced and important vessel in the KDF until the Negh'Var came along.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
the combos you can make that cause bops to be such alpha-beasts.
im all for maximising flexability, but even i cant see a way to balance that level of alpha spike.
It was more of a quick thought than an actual suggestion. I am well aware that you can't just make everything uni in an instant, the whole mechanic as to how ships work and how they are balanced had to be reworked as well.
I just meant why should vessels be locked in trinity classes in the first place while their distinctive factor should be mass/size, technology, armament etc. - the game would have to work in a different way than "most guns, most tac slots = win". I just like the thought of having vastly mixed fleets consisting of large cruisers forming the base, smaller cruisers fulfilling the "escort" role as it is intended by screening them/watch out for ambushes and maybe even implement longer range "artillery" support and the like. It's just daydreaming, not a "make everything uni now" suggestions ^^
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
I just meant why should vessels be locked in trinity classes in the first place while their distinctive factor should be mass/size, technology, armament etc. - the game would have to work in a different way than "most guns, most tac slots = win". I just like the thought of having vastly mixed fleets consisting of large cruisers forming the base, smaller cruisers fulfilling the "escort" role as it is intended by screening them/watch out for ambushes and maybe even implement longer range "artillery" support and the like. It's just daydreaming, not a "make everything uni now" suggestions ^^
THAT'S how a Star Trek game should be balanced!
Aplying a RTS mechanic to a RPG/MMORPG is just lazy, and plainly said a stupid idea. I have no idea why game developers had any success with this.
The sad thing is, that way too many people have grown used to that mechanic and seem to think that it is the only way a game could be balanced, lol.
OT:
I think a more science heavy BOFF and a balanced console layout would fit very good to a GCS.
Since i doubt we will ever get get dontdrunkimshoots enhanced exploration cruiser retrofit 3 pack, a science heavy Cruiser with 3 tac/sci consoles would be the next best and appropriate thing we could ask for.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
You may be up to something here though as people already said, changing BOFF layouts won't happen since the ship in-game has been paid for and they can't change the product afterwards.
But I like the 3(4)/3/3 (ENG/SCI/TAC) console layout reflecting a well balanced ship class. Your suggested layout, however, I'd change to something like
CMDR Engineer
LTC Engineer
LTC Science
LT Tac
Why? As dknight pointed out, this layout (C,LC,LC,L) is featured on the Vo'Quv already. I would keep the CDR/LTC Engineering combo however since it reflects the sturdyness of this vessel and keeps it's excellent resistance. The additional tac console brings it en par with the other cruisers but while keeping the lt tac it doesn't outclass the regent which is supposed to be the most offensive cruiser plus it's kinda cheap to just buff up the tac abilities to make the ship worthwhile - that's not helping adressing the problems the game and cruisers have. My suggested setup would put it in a very good all around position of supporting and solo operations. I wouldn't add a universal BOFF to the Gal as well since I kinda think that should be reserved for mission-pod vessels.
Mirror to the vo'quv or not I'd like it to have that layout. Shouldnt be to big of a deal as one is a science carrier and GCS is a cruiser with no hanger. Though as always i think they would be better off doing another ship and adding it with a new setup instead of changing the current. Would be nice however if ppl that have original version got it free or atleast a discount price.
It's true, the Galaxy is pretty useless offensively in PVP, but it can sure draw the fire if it wanted to as a tank. Then again, PVP, is useless as well.
I don't know, IMO the Galaxy wasn't meant to be the same in this game as in the series. For one thing, it's now an old vessel in terms of timeline. Another is, the TV series made for a super hero style entertainment. They made the ship powerful in the series to present the fact that it was not only the flagship of the Federation, but the vessel was carrying the best officers in the fleet (aka the protagonists).
I accept that you want the best for this ship, but I hope that it won't dissuade you from playing the ship you love. There are plenty of ships in the game I wish were better, but they've got to balance the mechanics that are in place. When I'm swearing blue murder that my Defiant class retrofit is getting mashed when I just want to destroy everything in sight, I accept that it has weaknesses, and that I have to adapt to them to make the ship better. That's the name of the game.
It was more of a quick thought than an actual suggestion. I am well aware that you can't just make everything uni in an instant, the whole mechanic as to how ships work and how they are balanced had to be reworked as well.
I just meant why should vessels be locked in trinity classes in the first place while their distinctive factor should be mass/size, technology, armament etc. - the game would have to work in a different way than "most guns, most tac slots = win". I just like the thought of having vastly mixed fleets consisting of large cruisers forming the base, smaller cruisers fulfilling the "escort" role as it is intended by screening them/watch out for ambushes and maybe even implement longer range "artillery" support and the like. It's just daydreaming, not a "make everything uni now" suggestions ^^
Cool idea though I'd settle for taking my most like cruiser frame the Galaxy and putting the Odyssey Boff layout with Excelsoirs console layout and building it for the cost of dilithium or zen points. Would be nice to use the kind of ship we want with different layouts of boff and consoles from other ships in their class we own. Adds flexability but still have to pick from its class so no defiant builds on your science ships or intrepid builds on your atrox.
Cool idea though I'd settle for taking my most like cruiser frame the Galaxy and putting the Odyssey Boff layout with Excelsoirs console layout and building it for the cost of dilithium or zen points. Would be nice to use the kind of ship we want with different layouts of boff and consoles from other ships in their class we own. Adds flexability but still have to pick from its class so no defiant builds on your science ships or intrepid builds on your atrox.
That would be a neat concept as well (I think that's akin to skollulfr's suggestion? If not, sorry mate I might have mixed that up ^^) with the only "fix" factors would be hull and unique abilities. I think that would make for more versatile endgame fleets. If the game would then be changed that even a Miranda could have her endgame task we'd have a pretty solid experience
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
Yeah, but in order to make it a heroic death, i would make them a squadron of three Vor'cha Battlecruisers, and we all know Klingons like to attack in superior numbers . They should have let the GCS her shields and instead put them a good fight to the bitter end.
That fight didn't need to be as static as most TNG space fights where, instead they could have maneuvered the -D to the center of the Planets magnetic pole to confuse the attackers or could have maneuvered the -D into a nebular and start them a cat-and-mouse game.
But in my opinion, the -D didn't need to die at all.
TBH, i found her death far more sad then Kirks.
the vorcha is no slouch, just 1 with that shield bypassing could more then believable take out a GCS. it seems to me that the sovereign is really the vorcha's direct counterpart. smaller heavily armed battlecruiser, not full size battleships like the much larger galaxy or negvar.
the TNG movies would have been awesome if the sovereign class never existed. the D in all the movies would have made them better. fighting the borg and slowly getting assimilated, talk of saucer separation to save the ship from assimilation, it would have looked cool in the brier patch, and the fight with the scimitar wouldn't have been nearly as 1 sided. if it was choreographed by someone who has done half the research i have done on its capability
the vorcha is no slouch, just 1 with that shield bypassing could more then believable take out a GCS. it seems to me that the sovereign is really the vorcha's direct counterpart. smaller heavily armed battlecruiser, not full size battleships like the much larger galaxy or negvar.
true, i was just wanted to make it as heroic as possible.
i also think that the shield bypass part should have been scraped by the authors, if they would have made the threat more menacing. A full combat ready GCS going 1 on 1 (2 or 3) with another ship would have bcome a massive battle of material.
the TNG movies would have been awesome if the sovereign class never existed. the D in all the movies would have made them better. fighting the borg and slowly getting assimilated, talk of saucer separation to save the ship from assimilation, it would have looked cool in the brier patch, and the fight with the scimitar wouldn't have been nearly as 1 sided. if it was choreographed by someone who has done half the research i have done on its capability
Very true.
I think the audience didn't had a chance to get accustomed to the new ship before it was bogified. So there never was a phase to get accustomized to the new ship, especially since the the beginning of ST:8 is very fast paced.
On the other hand seeing a ship we had seen for 7 seasons being assimilated by the borg, would have been much more emotional for the audience.
And to be honest, if the producers wanted to keep the GCS they easily could have given her some upgrades, without any problem.
All the other battles would have become real epic with a GCS IMHO.
Especially if we consider it being similar upgraded (but not nearly as OP as the Sov in ST:10, torpedoes everywhere..., just rediculus). But i think a upgrade from Photons to Quantum torpedoes, and maybe some Phaser strip improvements (stronger with a new kind of special effect maybe) would have made every chance to see this ship in action into a Special effects celebration. :cool:
..but hey .. the sovereign looks cool also (yuck).
Hmm Ship give away week. Anyone suspecting a fleet Gal-X coming up, or a Galaxy 3 pack?
I wouldn't wait for it.
They will maybe release some "cool" escorts they have put into the C-Store for a long time, or maybe a ship like the risian corvette, but a GCS 3pack?
Even if a dev would say they would give away
dontdrunkimshoots enhanced exploration cruiser retrofit 3 pack today, i would first believe it if i would fly it on my own.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
That would be a neat concept as well (I think that's akin to skollulfr's suggestion? If not, sorry mate I might have mixed that up ^^) with the only "fix" factors would be hull and unique abilities. I think that would make for more versatile endgame fleets. If the game would then be changed that even a Miranda could have her endgame task we'd have a pretty solid experience
No worries i do remember seeing it on the forums somewhere just wish the devs would and setup a system to do it. Be nice if you could fly what you like and still have the boff and console setup best suited for your playstyle and it would be even better seeing more different ships flying around instead of going into a stf and seeing all the same ones everytime.
I just came up with an idea. And I volunteer to do most of the grunt work for this.
Forum signatures. They're one of the most eye-catching parts of the forum. People look at them and read/see the contents. And they remember pictures far more often than words.
I propose a movement. It's not a petition or a rebellion or anything, it's a simple silent declaration. All it requires of each of you is to give up your forum signature, at least for a little while.
I propose the "wearing" of forum signatures that encourage a change in the Galaxy-class.
For example, there would be a picture of the Enterprise-D from the series in the background. Text on the top and bottom would say, "My name is stardestroyer001, and I support a revamped Exploration Cruiser". Your name and/or handle would be placed there, and you can choose colours and fonts for your name.
If we got enough people to do this, I'm sure people would start noticing - especially when it is uniform (except for the names).
stardestroyer001, Admiral, Explorers Fury PvE/PvP Fleet | Retired PvP Player
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9 My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
I just came up with an idea. And I volunteer to do most of the grunt work for this.
Forum signatures. They're one of the most eye-catching parts of the forum. People look at them and read/see the contents. And they remember pictures far more often than words.
I propose a movement. It's not a petition or a rebellion or anything, it's a simple silent declaration. All it requires of each of you is to give up your forum signature, at least for a little while.
I propose the "wearing" of forum signatures that encourage a change in the Galaxy-class.
For example, there would be a picture of the Enterprise-D from the series in the background. Text on the top and bottom would say, "My name is stardestroyer001, and I support a revamped Exploration Cruiser". Your name and/or handle would be placed there, and you can choose colours and fonts for your name.
If we got enough people to do this, I'm sure people would start noticing - especially when it is uniform (except for the names).
I like it, as long as it stays a statement.
I think it could help to get our cause a bit forward and maybe to get bit of the devs attention so it doesn't appear to be the thing of just one or two people anymore.
On the other hand i have no idea if that would offend the forum rules or not, so i'll be a bit cautious.
I like angrytarg proposed system very much.
I was always annoyed by the Stone/paper/scissor sytem cryptic used for Star Trek ships.
We all saw that TNG ships had programmable bridge stations which are universal stations in STO terms. So giving Ships fixed BOFF stations always seemed odd to me from the beginning.
Cryptic stated themselves that ships in the 25th centure where build modular, so there shouldn't be any big difference between cruisers for example. The crucial differences between them should be their mass/size, power generation, Crew and position of the ships weapons for example.
Instead of putting Star Trek ships into roles like Tank, Damage Dealser and Wizard, they should have given them different weapon arcs, power generation, inertia, speed and stuff like that. Things like that should be the decisive value of a ship, not just the lame Stone/Scissor/Paper mechanic. Additionally it should be harder to get better ships, maybe they could be earned by the accolade system.
OT:
I have found asomething at the STO wiki (upcoming content), but i have no idea if that's already outdated or not.
Saucer separation for the Galaxy-X Dreadnought Cruiser (before Season 8) [43][60][29]
Likely as part of a general "Galaxy-revamp", possible as part of a bundle [6]
Separation mode
Animation kinks being worked out as of December 2012 [53]
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
Not willing to sacrifice anything myself, the Galaxy is THE Federation ship, it is iconic, it is fundamental to StarTrek and for some reason known only to Cryptic it has been severely ignored in just about every way possible since launch. The Galaxy-X is a better ship all round but as a dreadnought it sucks and is only good on extremely specific roles in PvP aka the Sir Lance A Lot build, decloak, Lance and flee.
Drunk's three pack is what's needed, a complete interior and a totally updated Galaxy-X for PvP.
As this thread is one of the largest in the forums with hundreds of different individual contributors, it just goes to show that Cryptic have no intention of satisfying the player's wishes.
It is for me the most disappointing aspect of STO. For PvE both ships work ok but nothing like as good as almost any other ship in the game. For PvP then forget it unless you like making a zombie cruiser or a Lancing Alpha Striker, and even the latter is hindered by a Lt Tac station and a very inaccurate Lance with much lower power than the Javelin.
I feel like giving up, but as long as you guys are on here plugging away for something to be done I'll read and contribute some. Perhaps it's time to email Mr Stahl directly with our wishes?
Email him, message him ingame, send him a letter in the mail, hide in his closet if we have to. And not just him, do it to every mod as well, get their attention to this thread.
Comments
You may be up to something here though as people already said, changing BOFF layouts won't happen since the ship in-game has been paid for and they can't change the product afterwards.
But I like the 3(4)/3/3 (ENG/SCI/TAC) console layout reflecting a well balanced ship class. Your suggested layout, however, I'd change to something like
CMDR Engineer
LTC Engineer
LTC Science
LT Tac
Why? As dknight pointed out, this layout (C,LC,LC,L) is featured on the Vo'Quv already. I would keep the CDR/LTC Engineering combo however since it reflects the sturdyness of this vessel and keeps it's excellent resistance. The additional tac console brings it en par with the other cruisers but while keeping the lt tac it doesn't outclass the regent which is supposed to be the most offensive cruiser plus it's kinda cheap to just buff up the tac abilities to make the ship worthwhile - that's not helping adressing the problems the game and cruisers have. My suggested setup would put it in a very good all around position of supporting and solo operations. I wouldn't add a universal BOFF to the Gal as well since I kinda think that should be reserved for mission-pod vessels.
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again not riker's fault. we know he's a good tacical captain again Plot death. the B'Rel should have never been able to cause that much damage. the phasers and photons volleys should have killed it. again another critical mistake by the writers in this poorly designed movie.
I never said that the Galaxy was on par 100% with other Tier 5 vessels.
And you do not evaluate a ship in this game solely through the more challenging instances either.
The general argument is that the Galaxy is completely useless. I refuted that.
However, I did not refute that the Galaxy is not a good choice in some venues. As it stands now, that much is true.
I've played, and still do at times play, the Galaxy-X, although it has largely been pushed to the wayside by my Odyssey. And throughout my time in this game, I've played a variety of ship types. But I'm a cruiser man at heart, and know 'em far better than the other types of vessels in this game.
That being said, with any good, carefully though out build, any cruiser can easily pull it's weight in difficult venues (which is mostly pressure damage and taking some of the heat off of the Escorts and Science Vessels), while racking up some kills of it's own. But without top flight gear (fleet and rep) and careful builds, I wouldn't run a typical cruiser in a typical elite STF or a PvP match with heavy hitters. That's the territory that Escort "fighter jocks" flourish, and dominate, in.
But maybe that's just me.
The C-Store Galaxy has only one Ensign Engineer Boff position. The other two are Lt. Commander and Commander. Which, in theory, combined with passives and gear should keep the ship alive (in a typical instance) to keep up pressure damage, draw aggro from the DPS muscle boats, and throw out some heals.
Which I managed to do (more or less) with my crummy Tier 4 version back in the day, with a Tactical captain at that. The T5 Galaxy should do better at those kind of jobs, provided that you don't believe that they are obsolete in the current age of power creep and the DPS arms race. (Which I don't. But I do believe that their relevance has been greatly reduced thanks to "tanky" Escorts).
Does that mean that I like the setup of the Galaxy Retro? No, I don't. I believe that a C-Store vessel should have at least one Universal bridge officer slot.
And one free ship out of dozens being "better" than the Galaxy Retrofit doesn't make it a complete waste. And comparison to the Excelsior C-Store upgrade isn't relevant because it's better than just about any cruiser in it's class. Hell, the Fleet variant is probably the best cruiser in the game. Just about any cruiser would "suck" when compared to it.
A better comparison is between the Galaxy-R and Odyssey Operations variant. On paper, it's far better than the older vessel. But the only areas where it really shines over the Galaxy-R is universal Boff seating and larger crew. Other than that, they are somewhat comparable. Both are big, slow engineer heavy cruisers. And I don't see much in the way of condemnation for the Odyssey Operations model. If you can successfully utilize the Odyssey Ops boat, with a little more work, you can successfully use a Galaxy-R in this game. Which means it's not a complete suck boat like many think it is. Just neither are ideal choices in a couple of venues.
Sure, things could be worked to get more usefulness out of the Galaxy, which I would have no issue with. In fact, I would support such a move 100%. But to say that it is a real stinker as is would be a faulty conclusion.
a vorcha would just about be a perfect match for a GCS with no shields. not being able to instantly re-modulate shields on a whim, especially post borg contact, would still be a huge plot hole. a vorcha vs galaxy would have been a worthy movie fight, and a good death for the D.
Lt.Cmdr. Tac
Cmdr. Engineer
Lt. Engineer
Lt.Cmdr. Science
(exactly like the Mirror Universe Vo'Quv Carrier, which is a free ship, btw.)
I think this would make the ship much more versatile and to be honest just a Lt tactical is to little.
But i like the emphasis on Science of your proposed BOFF layout. It's similar to the T4 Venture BOFF layout which has
Lt. Tac
Cmdr. Engineering
Lt. Engineering
Lt. Sci.
Ens. Sci
Althrough it is just a T4 ship its BOFF layout is by far better that the Galaxy -R BOFF layout.
On the other hand i don't see a big hinderance to give a ship the same BOFF or console Layout as another ship has.
Especially since both ships don't belong to the same faction and even if they did, all other stats and their function would still be different. The important thing is that people could fly their favourite ships without being disadvantaged so i wouldn't care if they would give it the same Layout like a Kamarag Battlecruiser Retrofit or Mirror Universe Vo'Quv Carrier, the GCS still would be hugely different.
Yeah, but in order to make it a heroic death, i would make them a squadron of three Vor'cha Battlecruisers, and we all know Klingons like to attack in superior numbers
That fight didn't need to be as static as most TNG space fights where, instead they could have maneuvered the -D to the center of the Planets magnetic pole to confuse the attackers or could have maneuvered the -D into a nebular and start them a cat-and-mouse game.
But in my opinion, the -D didn't need to die at all.
TBH, i found her death far more sad then Kirks.
Yeah, I'm still not sure about the LTC tac because I somehow try to put the GCS into the limitations that STO offers. Just considering cruisers in game and presume they have a "role", the GCS would not be the first choice for a tactical mission. She's a command ship more than a frontline battlecruiser and we have the sovereign and regent fill that role already which I can accept being more tactical oriented cruisers. That should be reflected by an ability rather than tactical slots like make the Gal-X's phaser lance a charged phaser blast using the full array or something. You know that I know the GCS can pack a punch while keeping the Federation's more peaceful principles up - and I feel just putting LTC tacs on every ship somehow doesn't help the problems of the game. The sci/eng heavy seating I proposed wuld be a good upgrade over the T4 venture, like you pointed out.
To be perfectly honest - I don't see a reason why ships should have different/not all universal slots at all because we should just use the ship we like to use. Sure, a console layout/bonus abilities can change and smaller vessels should have less abilities than large one but compensate for it by other means so we have a high diversity on ships, many different big cruisers who are accompanied by smaller vessels that support them would make a much better and epic feel than the trinity. But it's hard to implement such a fundamental change to the game.
Well, three Vor'Cha Battlecruisers would be a little bit overkill, as much as I love the old girl she's not that tough especially when ambushed. But A fight Galaxy vs Vor'Cha would be a epic final moment since I love both ship classes - it just would be hard to explain how renegade Klingons could get hold of a Vor'Cha which was the most advanced and important vessel in the KDF until the Negh'Var came along.
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It was more of a quick thought than an actual suggestion. I am well aware that you can't just make everything uni in an instant, the whole mechanic as to how ships work and how they are balanced had to be reworked as well.
I just meant why should vessels be locked in trinity classes in the first place while their distinctive factor should be mass/size, technology, armament etc. - the game would have to work in a different way than "most guns, most tac slots = win". I just like the thought of having vastly mixed fleets consisting of large cruisers forming the base, smaller cruisers fulfilling the "escort" role as it is intended by screening them/watch out for ambushes and maybe even implement longer range "artillery" support and the like. It's just daydreaming, not a "make everything uni now" suggestions ^^
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THAT'S how a Star Trek game should be balanced!
Aplying a RTS mechanic to a RPG/MMORPG is just lazy, and plainly said a stupid idea. I have no idea why game developers had any success with this.
The sad thing is, that way too many people have grown used to that mechanic and seem to think that it is the only way a game could be balanced, lol.
OT:
I think a more science heavy BOFF and a balanced console layout would fit very good to a GCS.
Since i doubt we will ever get get dontdrunkimshoots enhanced exploration cruiser retrofit 3 pack, a science heavy Cruiser with 3 tac/sci consoles would be the next best and appropriate thing we could ask for.
Mirror to the vo'quv or not I'd like it to have that layout. Shouldnt be to big of a deal as one is a science carrier and GCS is a cruiser with no hanger. Though as always i think they would be better off doing another ship and adding it with a new setup instead of changing the current. Would be nice however if ppl that have original version got it free or atleast a discount price.
I don't know, IMO the Galaxy wasn't meant to be the same in this game as in the series. For one thing, it's now an old vessel in terms of timeline. Another is, the TV series made for a super hero style entertainment. They made the ship powerful in the series to present the fact that it was not only the flagship of the Federation, but the vessel was carrying the best officers in the fleet (aka the protagonists).
I accept that you want the best for this ship, but I hope that it won't dissuade you from playing the ship you love. There are plenty of ships in the game I wish were better, but they've got to balance the mechanics that are in place. When I'm swearing blue murder that my Defiant class retrofit is getting mashed when I just want to destroy everything in sight, I accept that it has weaknesses, and that I have to adapt to them to make the ship better. That's the name of the game.
Cool idea though I'd settle for taking my most like cruiser frame the Galaxy and putting the Odyssey Boff layout with Excelsoirs console layout and building it for the cost of dilithium or zen points. Would be nice to use the kind of ship we want with different layouts of boff and consoles from other ships in their class we own. Adds flexability but still have to pick from its class so no defiant builds on your science ships or intrepid builds on your atrox.
That would be a neat concept as well (I think that's akin to skollulfr's suggestion? If not, sorry mate I might have mixed that up ^^) with the only "fix" factors would be hull and unique abilities. I think that would make for more versatile endgame fleets. If the game would then be changed that even a Miranda could have her endgame task we'd have a pretty solid experience
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the vorcha is no slouch, just 1 with that shield bypassing could more then believable take out a GCS. it seems to me that the sovereign is really the vorcha's direct counterpart. smaller heavily armed battlecruiser, not full size battleships like the much larger galaxy or negvar.
the TNG movies would have been awesome if the sovereign class never existed. the D in all the movies would have made them better. fighting the borg and slowly getting assimilated, talk of saucer separation to save the ship from assimilation, it would have looked cool in the brier patch, and the fight with the scimitar wouldn't have been nearly as 1 sided. if it was choreographed by someone who has done half the research i have done on its capability
Anyway the unholy trinity doesn't fit for Star Trek ships either way.
true, i was just wanted to make it as heroic as possible.
i also think that the shield bypass part should have been scraped by the authors, if they would have made the threat more menacing. A full combat ready GCS going 1 on 1 (2 or 3) with another ship would have bcome a massive battle of material.
Very true.
I think the audience didn't had a chance to get accustomed to the new ship before it was bogified. So there never was a phase to get accustomized to the new ship, especially since the the beginning of ST:8 is very fast paced.
On the other hand seeing a ship we had seen for 7 seasons being assimilated by the borg, would have been much more emotional for the audience.
And to be honest, if the producers wanted to keep the GCS they easily could have given her some upgrades, without any problem.
All the other battles would have become real epic with a GCS IMHO.
Especially if we consider it being similar upgraded (but not nearly as OP as the Sov in ST:10, torpedoes everywhere..., just rediculus). But i think a upgrade from Photons to Quantum torpedoes, and maybe some Phaser strip improvements (stronger with a new kind of special effect maybe) would have made every chance to see this ship in action into a Special effects celebration. :cool:
..but hey .. the sovereign looks cool also (yuck).
I wouldn't wait for it.
They will maybe release some "cool" escorts they have put into the C-Store for a long time, or maybe a ship like the risian corvette, but a GCS 3pack?
Even if a dev would say they would give away
dontdrunkimshoots enhanced exploration cruiser retrofit 3 pack today, i would first believe it if i would fly it on my own.
No worries i do remember seeing it on the forums somewhere just wish the devs would and setup a system to do it. Be nice if you could fly what you like and still have the boff and console setup best suited for your playstyle and it would be even better seeing more different ships flying around instead of going into a stf and seeing all the same ones everytime.
Forum signatures. They're one of the most eye-catching parts of the forum. People look at them and read/see the contents. And they remember pictures far more often than words.
I propose a movement. It's not a petition or a rebellion or anything, it's a simple silent declaration. All it requires of each of you is to give up your forum signature, at least for a little while.
I propose the "wearing" of forum signatures that encourage a change in the Galaxy-class.
For example, there would be a picture of the Enterprise-D from the series in the background. Text on the top and bottom would say, "My name is stardestroyer001, and I support a revamped Exploration Cruiser". Your name and/or handle would be placed there, and you can choose colours and fonts for your name.
If we got enough people to do this, I'm sure people would start noticing - especially when it is uniform (except for the names).
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9
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I think it could help to get our cause a bit forward and maybe to get bit of the devs attention so it doesn't appear to be the thing of just one or two people anymore.
On the other hand i have no idea if that would offend the forum rules or not, so i'll be a bit cautious.
I like angrytarg proposed system very much.
I was always annoyed by the Stone/paper/scissor sytem cryptic used for Star Trek ships.
We all saw that TNG ships had programmable bridge stations which are universal stations in STO terms. So giving Ships fixed BOFF stations always seemed odd to me from the beginning.
Cryptic stated themselves that ships in the 25th centure where build modular, so there shouldn't be any big difference between cruisers for example. The crucial differences between them should be their mass/size, power generation, Crew and position of the ships weapons for example.
Instead of putting Star Trek ships into roles like Tank, Damage Dealser and Wizard, they should have given them different weapon arcs, power generation, inertia, speed and stuff like that. Things like that should be the decisive value of a ship, not just the lame Stone/Scissor/Paper mechanic. Additionally it should be harder to get better ships, maybe they could be earned by the accolade system.
OT:
I have found asomething at the STO wiki (upcoming content), but i have no idea if that's already outdated or not.
"If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe." - Carl Sagan
Email him, message him ingame, send him a letter in the mail, hide in his closet if we have to. And not just him, do it to every mod as well, get their attention to this thread.