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Nerf Dual Heavy Cannons
bobtheyak
Member Posts: 374 Arc User
No, this is not a troll post. Considering the upcoming tweaks to EPTX, this might be a good time to tone down cannon damage a bit.
The primary change that comes to mind is removing the inherent CrtD bonus on DHCs, but any sort of (slight) damage reduction could benefit ship type balance in both PvP and PvE. A nerf would be good for PvP because of the upcoming reduction in tanking ability (mostly for cruisers) and good for PvE because there's little reason to run anything but escort due to the prevalence of damage-based mission objectives.
Don't get me wrong, cannons are awesome and I use full cannon builds on my escort and BoP, but it's simply too easy to do both alpha strike burst damage and sustained dps while using a minimal variety of bridge officer powers and cooldown timing techniques.
Would there be any major downside to reducing burst damage on cannons to allow for more variety in hybrid escort builds? Are there any other ships besides escorts that would be too negatively affected? Do any escorts believe they're *not* doing too much damage in comparison to other ship types?
This may be a touchy issue so please keep the forum wars to a minimum if at all possible, but it doesn't hurt to give input for the sake of discussion.
-Robert T. Yak, Esq.
The primary change that comes to mind is removing the inherent CrtD bonus on DHCs, but any sort of (slight) damage reduction could benefit ship type balance in both PvP and PvE. A nerf would be good for PvP because of the upcoming reduction in tanking ability (mostly for cruisers) and good for PvE because there's little reason to run anything but escort due to the prevalence of damage-based mission objectives.
Don't get me wrong, cannons are awesome and I use full cannon builds on my escort and BoP, but it's simply too easy to do both alpha strike burst damage and sustained dps while using a minimal variety of bridge officer powers and cooldown timing techniques.
Would there be any major downside to reducing burst damage on cannons to allow for more variety in hybrid escort builds? Are there any other ships besides escorts that would be too negatively affected? Do any escorts believe they're *not* doing too much damage in comparison to other ship types?
This may be a touchy issue so please keep the forum wars to a minimum if at all possible, but it doesn't hurt to give input for the sake of discussion.
-Robert T. Yak, Esq.
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As for PVP , i don't care. They can add a damage resistance for players, just let us still be able to kill the borg in pve.
Because nerfing DHCs may look good and dandy for a cruiser pvp captain, but any escort ship that is trying to grind up Omega marks and such for better gear will be seriously nerfed to uselessness.
Hopefully Cryptic reads this.
Not because it means they won't do anything, but rather like all the other changes that take place - they will changes things because of PvE.
Course, Geko already said they can't do anything to DHCs because the forums would flood for 40 days and 40 nights with all the tears...
With the new gaps hello overloads and torps.
Has anybody unlocked any of the Nukara weapons on Tribble yet?
In STFs, the DHC damage is the only saving grace of an escort. Their hull is pathetic, and they die easily.
Sure a fully kitted out escort is nice... but please remember all the stfs that needs to be grinded trough to actually kit the ship out!
If all the escorts and DHCs are nerfed to oblivion, then starting players simply won't be able to use them.
They will just die in seconds.
Just try to play with an escort, using only mark XII purple convariant and resilient shields.
The borg will get trough that like a hot knife trough butter.
So the only way to survive is to kill the spheres fast enough.
The simplest fix for all weapons is to return the power drain mechanic we used to have.
DHC would take a small nerf unless people swap armor or what ever else they have in there engi slots for a EPS unit or two.
Beams dmg would be acceptable again imo... and engi cruisers for sure would take a nice bump with there eps up.
After that I think people need to get used to dying more often. The amount of time we all have to spawn seems crazy to me... to much shield resist to much defense to much dmg resistance.
I have to admit Dual Heavy Cannons for Tactical Officers are just too good right now. And will become more obvious when LoR is released. Especially when you have Warbirds de-cloaking and alpha Striking with those Same DHCs.
Granted how ever, Antonio does also make a Valid point, Spike damage will also get a boost from this change to the Emergency power to X abilities also.
Giving players a resistance vs other players is a nice Idea in theory, but with how Resistance currently works in STO, it might not be as helpful as it seems.
Dual heavy Cannons are definitely a number 1 "offender" for some crazy events I have witnessed and been the victim of in PVP. And I'm not just referring to damage numbers in a Final Score.
It may be time to decrease either their Weapon damage, or perhaps even the way they register weapon Power drain across multiple Dual heavy Cannons.
Think about this:
American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
Which seems to be a familiar trend in STO, appeasing tacs in escorts. LOL, there will come a day, sooner than later, when no sci or cruiser captain will be around. I can't say I'd blame them. :P
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Im just not sure anymore.
R.I.P
except when the aux to battery also gets nerfed because its too powerful.
isnt there a thread below this one that mentions it being put onto a global cooldown with eptx powers?
enjoy your cruiser equilizer
Do you even Science Bro?
They need to address various modifiers rather than address what's being modified. That interaction...is what throws off any potential balance that may have existed in the first place.
Or perhaps opening up DCs to non-Escort ships and/or widening the arc?
Agreed. There are other aspects of escort that should be nerfed first but this seemed like the easiest and most straightforward change without overhauling ABC and causing the 40-day flood of QQ.
Tactical.
*Ducks and hides from the onslaught*
Think about this:
American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
Hrmm, I wasn't as clear as I meant to be then. It's not the DHCs - it's the new passives/gear - it's how it's easier to keep them on target - it's all the stuff that's been added.
Kind of like Trics...everybody calling for a change - that change being the chain crits. It wasn't the Trics, it was the chain crits. What did they do? They did both...
While DHCs may appear to be the issue at first glance - cause they're right there - sometimes it's a case of pausing for a moment to look at what's just behind what's right there.
I know I do it wrong:
5x Beams/Turret/2x Torps
2x Beams/4x Torps
2x Cannons/3x Turrets/DBB/Torp
6x Beams/2x Torps
Turret/5x Torps/Mine
6x Torps
6x Beams
6x Beams/2x Torps
Those are the weapons on my guys. So it's not a case that I'm saying the issue isn't with DHCs because I'm a DHC guy. They don't fit my wheeeeeee playstyle. It's just a case of having faced them before S7/etc and since S7/etc...and like oh so many things, S7/etc has made things worse.
It's like the proposed EPtX changes - 2x EPtS or EPtS/EPtX was not the issue...it was all the stuff added with S7/etc.
Cryptic did a craptic job considering all the variables when adding the S7/etc stuff... I mean, just consider CrtH/CrtD before and after S7/etc, eh? Bazinga...it's those kind of things.
edit: Consider that 2.5% DEM with the Nukara rep. It's only going to increase the calls for nerfs on DHCs. The DHCs are the same, though...it's all the TRIBBLE that's being added.
But we'll never see a change to them. A DHC nerf would do exactly like Geko said - bring torrential floods of tears. And a Tac nerf is out of the question as well.
My Tac/Escort (which is hardly spec'd correctly, using blue Mk XI weapons and consoles) can rip through an entire PvE mission in less than 1 cycle of APA... but apparently there's no issue there.
What about poor Scis?
also in that thread, i brought up a problem with just nerfing this, or just changing that, that directly buffs 1 group or the other and makes a lot of people mad. when DHCs get adjusted, other stuff like resistance levels need adjusting too.
Half APA and Tac Fleet's damage bonuses, in exchange have Tac Ini work on captain and boff skills, and apply the effect to the entire squad, like it is on the ground (except weapon firing cycles). That way Tacs can still buff pressure dps in a way that benefits the whole team while reducing spike further.
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I don't see how anyone can actually want to nerf DHCs in a PvP environment that can see nearly all damage drowned in heals.
If any player thinks that the systems team is about do a system wide audit and nerf all of the resistances and heals that have been layered and layered on us, they are delirious.
They might do a few tiny "surgical tweaks", but I'm confident saying the majority of this stuff is here to stay.
It's threads like this that lead the devs to perceive that people actually do need those rep passives that add extra shield regen, placate procs, Elite Fleet Shields and heals that go off when you get hit with a crit.
So when we continue to see more of that, just remember what contributes to it.
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YES! LOL. Introduce front only heavy beam array for large saucer ships instead. :P
Ouch :eek:
This will boost whale cruiser damage significantly, because the now 1-2 low tier Boff tac slots are not longer wasted for 2x TT1.
The innate need for using at least 1 TT in PvP and PvE should be removed.
Then nothing will ever die.
You don't need TT in PvE, lol. It's PvE.
In PvP don't need to have TT on everyone, you just need to cross heal. I run two science teams, no tactical teams. Ditto for most, if not all the other sci/sci players in Pandas. Escorts double down on tactical teams and send them around as needed.
Fixed it. In the rest of 95% pvp done, you pretty much neeed TT because you will never get any from anyone.