IMO, what really pushes cannons overboard are turrets, but I would have to say that beam array also drain an excessive amount of power for the damage they actually do, even on a full broadside.
At this point, we should remind ourselves that STO is a PVE-centered game. 95% of players (if not more) do not really play PvP in any significant amount.
This is a very important thing to keep in mind.
I play PVE exclusively and part of the problem with the beams weakness is the inability to finish missions anywhere near as fast as escorts. I am being forced as a science captain to adapt like a borg to be able to complete space battle centric RA's and DC's that require blowing up some number of enemies that seem to have a neverending supply of ships. It's not right.
The easiest solution is to not change anything in regards to cannons. Just add greater shield penetration to beams - nothing huge mind you, but enough to raise their game. Lets say an additional 15-20% increase in shield penetration.
Heck maybe new beams are introduced in S8 or 9 as a T6 weapon for fleet admirals.
Beams offer the ability to modulate your output, and in some cases surf right past shields of varying types. This flexibility allows for ships to engage in multiple scenarios while exploring. This is Star Trek after all.
Cannons are not modulatable (OMG - its a real word), and are design exclusively for combat. Their sheer damage output clearly has one purpose - damage. I can't imagine a starship captain saying -'blow the TRIBBLE out of the ice field and maybe we can splash some water over there' when 'we can pierce the heliosphere to drill holes in the ice to help increase precipitation across the lower continent' seems much more in line with the game
To be honest, I am satisfied with beams as they are. I can easily finish the STF's and missions, and for large fleet engagements, the flexibility with their firing arcs are tough to beat.
The problem is actually with the cannons not with the beams.
Cannons have an absurd damage and rate of fire and this is what makes the beams look so decrepit.
Cannons need to be changed to:
Single cannon
Single Heavy Cannon*
Dual Cannon
*Rather than it being dual heavy cannon.
By removing the very high damage dual heavy cannon and 'trimming it' to a single heavy cannon the cannon ships in the game fall in line with the beam weaponry.
How? Simple. The cannon's primary advantage is that it has a rapid refire & fire rate plus the boff abilities buff ALL cannons not just one (unlike beams) when firing on a single target.
The dual heavy cannon receives an insane damage boost and rate of fire bonus from boff abilities and this is why most people dont bother with single cannons and rarely use dual cannons. The dual heavy is the one that has the massive damage output.
A single heavy cannon would have the same refire rate the dual heavy has now but only have minimally better damage output than the dual cannons .The catch: the heavy cannon has twice the secondary effect the non-heavy cannons have. Not chance to proc but the effect itself.
Oh here come the witch hunting cannon brigade :rolleyes: seriously this trolling is getting beyond a joke now what do you people not understand about needing your enemy ship to be in the firing arc when dealing cannon damage. If anything cannons should be given the 250 degree firing arc that beams have. Seriously Im having a tough time understanding peoples irrational thinking on this.
Im fed up and wish people would realise that its unrealistic to expect every single thing in this game to be balanced. All ships serve different purposes. A Tac in an escorts serves to do high DPS, High damage and to rip open enemy shields and hull before cruisers go in and finish the job. In the time an escort pilot has whilst having 10 - 15 seconds with cannons bearing down on the enemy, he will have done the same damage that you have done flying around with your 250 degree firing arc beams. I mean come on ?
If you were to nerf cannons you wouldn't have the spike damage and fights would be long boring and rawn out.
How about everyone who complains about cannons grow a pair and use a tractor beam on an escort. As an escort pilot I can tell you if you catch me whils my OMEGA and or Polrize hull is on cd, and I have you and 5 of your buddies on me then im done for.
That is the simple answer to cannons, teamwork + tractor beams. How hard is it to grab and understand this simple fundamental gameplay mechanic. It would take a lot less time and effort than coming to the forums being butthurt and ruining other peoples gameplay.
If anything, and I think is a more suitable, realistic and agreeable change is to speed up beam firing and shorten the gap between beam firing. I do agree beam firing animation plays for too long.
Watch this and pay attention as the defiant and neghvar go at it. Beams need to be shorter than they are but do the same damage :
Now please, enough of the stupid ideas and illogical ramblings, go learn to play or go play neverwinter. I shouldn't have to have my style of play removed from the game hence ruining my enjoyment because of peple on an agenda because they are butthurt or mad from pvp.
Ive been in this game since start and if you saw all my characters, builds, traits, playtime I can truly make an informed decision on this issue. If you saw what Ive done in game you would think ok yeah fair enough this guy knows what hes on about.
Im not judging or trolling but the ongoing witch hunt which the moderators allow to continue makes me sad. ABout time moderators started putting a curb on this trolling.
If you're in a Federation cruiser and you're being taken out by 2 attackers, you are doing it wrong. Unless they literally overloaded you with sci spam or other disablers, a competent cruiser PvPer should be able to tank 2-3 attackers for a good while.
As for escorts. . .with evenly matched opponents, I can see a tanky escort (JHAS, Patrol/Advanced escorts) hold off against 2 attackers, at best. If the attackers are crappy at PvP and timing their bursts, it'll take more. Hit 'em with immobilizers, and they'll go down faster.
Perhaps escort defenses need to be nerfed a bit. That's definitely open to discussion, as some escorts are rather good at tanking when in the right hands.
Instead of TRIBBLE around with weapons, we should be taking a look at defensive powers, and re-work the system to make it harder for escorts to tank, making cruisers more valuable both in PvP and PvE. The only reason DHCs even cut through competent defenses in PvP right now is because it's burst damage. Nerf the damage of DHCs, and suddenly everyone's nigh unkillable.
My PvP toon is Krov, of The House of Snoo. Beware of my Hegh'ta of doom.
If you're in a Federation cruiser and you're being taken out by 2 attackers, you are doing it wrong. Unless they literally overloaded you with sci spam or other disablers, a competent cruiser PvPer should be able to tank 2-3 attackers for a good while.
As for escorts. . .with evenly matched opponents, I can see a tanky escort (JHAS, Patrol/Advanced escorts) hold off against 2 attackers, at best. If the attackers are crappy at PvP and timing their bursts, it'll take more. Hit 'em with immobilizers, and they'll go down faster.
Perhaps escort defenses need to be nerfed a bit. That's definitely open to discussion, as some escorts are rather good at tanking when in the right hands.
Instead of TRIBBLE around with weapons, we should be taking a look at defensive powers, and re-work the system to make it harder for escorts to tank, making cruisers more valuable both in PvP and PvE. The only reason DHCs even cut through competent defenses in PvP right now is because it's burst damage. Nerf the damage of DHCs, and suddenly everyone's nigh unkillable.
Perhaps escort defenses need to be nerfed a bit. That's definitely open to discussion, as some escorts are rather good at tanking when in the right hands.
Well, I had an argument in a thread with someone about percentage based healing Where (for example) Aux2SIF would be more effective from a cruiser or sci ship than from an escort lets say we have an escort with 1000 max hull (post skill points etc) running 25 aux power they would get an Aux2SIF heal of 150 but a cruiser with 5000 max hull (Post skills points etc) running 50 aux power would get 1000 from the same skill and a Sci ship with 3250 max hull (Post skill points etc) running 100 aux power would get 975 from Aux2SIF
The formula would be as follows:
A= Max hull (1000)
B= Percentage of max hull (in this case 10%)
C= Aux mod (0.02)
D= Aux Power (25)
E= Base heal (100)
F= Aux bonus (50%)
G= End Heal (150)
So; E=A*B and F=C*D
Heal formula: =E+(E*F)
This means you can have an escort with 1000 max hull and 125 aux power and the cruiser with 5000 max hull and 5 aux power and the cruiser will get a better heal. The same can be done for shield heals and so long as base hull and shield HPs are adjusted accordingly escorts will become glass cannons again
as you can see, escorts are at no disadvantage in hull strength
indeed, they would be have more powerful heals than science ships.
the base hull disparity just is not there.
well, except for bop's, you actually notice their hulls are weak when you get into a fight...
I know, that is why I said they would have to adjusted accordingly, as long as that is done the system will work and escorts will no longer be tanking elite tac cubes as they currently do
What are they doing to the compressed cryo gun in upcoming patch? Nerfing them to 75% effectiveness against PvP while keeping as is for PvE. Do the same thing with beams. Buff them by like 25% of whatever is appropriate for PvE while keep them as is for PvP so a semblance of damage/tank/heal can be retained for PvP roles while PvE jocks can compete with escort DHC damage in STFs and other stuff that matter. And maybe, just maybe, I do not have to read any more escorts vs rest of the world and DHCs vs rest of the world threads in STO.
You are a bad player. You just can't handle that your class is not the damage dealing one.
No matter what happens, these people will not stop whining until their ships will : Do the most damage, have the most shields, hulls, and turn the fastest.
And the worst of all? They can't even admit they just want an undefeatable ship.
Cruisers are tasked with tanking in this game. Grow up and accepat that fank. Learn to tank..hehehe.
Let us wear Swimsuits on Foundry maps or bridges please! I would pay zen for that.
You are a bad player. You just can't handle that your class is not the damage dealing one.
No matter what happens, these people will not stop whining until their ships will : Do the most damage, have the most shields, hulls, and turn the fastest.
And the worst of all? They can't even admit they just want an undefeatable ship.
Cruisers are tasked with tanking in this game. Grow up and accepat that fank. Learn to tank..hehehe.
Ask a frequent player of STFs tanking is not needed or helpful in the slightest.
You are a bad player. You just can't handle that your class is not the damage dealing one.
No matter what happens, these people will not stop whining until their ships will : Do the most damage, have the most shields, hulls, and turn the fastest.
And the worst of all? They can't even admit they just want an undefeatable ship.
Cruisers are tasked with tanking in this game. Grow up and accepat that fank. Learn to tank..hehehe.
That's a cheap argument. Escorts players are the ones who complain because they see threatening their fooling position. Escorts were designed as a glass cannon. Today escorts do not have more serious drawbacks.
No matter what happens, these people will not stop whining until their ships will : Do the most damage, have the most shields, hulls, and turn the fastest.
And the worst of all? They can't even admit they just want an undefeatable ship.
Oh, you're talking about escorts? Ok.
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
Read most of this thread and thought I'd pitch in.
First a disclaimer: I am not a super-leet PVP guy. I just like math and game design.
The biggest problem I am seeing isn't that beams don't do enough damage, it's that it's hard to sustain it and that beam BOff abilities don't seem to give them much extra punch. Cannons tend to be more efficient, higher dps, higher proc-chance* weapons with BOff abilities that can boost that enormously.
I don't think cannons should change. I like their flavor and I think they work.
Beams should change, but not in a way that makes them effectively wide-angle cannons.
So, what can be done to make beams attractive for use in PVP without having them fulfill the same roll as cannons?
There are a few options and I think a real solution could be derived from a mix of them. They concentrate on sustainable, reliable damage across a broad spectrum of situations rather than simply increasing raw damage output in ideal situations.
1) Decrease their power drain: Rather than give raw numbers, I simply suggest that single and double-beam arrays have a shallower DPS curve than they do now. Sustaining fire with 6 single-beam arrays should give me a base DPS of somewhere between 65-75% of the first volley, rather than the 60-65% that I usually see if I run my ship without item or set bonuses to weapon power.
2) Power Projection: Increase the base damage of beams from 60% to 80% at maximum range. 1 on 1 this trait, combined with movement debuffs to help keep range, will allow a beam ship to keep an cannon-armed rival at a more advantageous distance part of the time. X v X this trait will mean cruisers and science ships can work together to deal good damage output from a variety of ranges to a single target.
3) Accuracy Increase: Nothing major here, either. The idea is simply to make sure that beams simply miss a bit less often. Or, perhaps, give them a large accuracy boost when attacking smaller targets, like fighters or torpedoes. A small boost to crit chance wouldn't hurt, but isn't necessary, I think.
4) Increase Proc Occurance and Severity: Cannons already have the biggest, best raw DPS and, honestly, something being blown apart by concentrated cannon fire isn't going to be bothered overmuch by the occasional plasma fire or system power drain. A cruiser or science ship, on the other hand, takes longer to kill stuff and will find the procs more useful overall, so let them generate those procs more often.
5) Give BOffs an ability with will increase beam weapons' effectiveness against a single ship for a short period of time. Put it on a shared cooldown timer with BFaW or make it the same level, which will encourage captains to pick one or the other as the situation demands it. I would actually encourage an accuracy/proc buff rather than a straight dps buff for a change of flavor. A phaser barrage that leaves half a ship's systems offline for a second or two or polaron volley that makes a target's power levels tank temporarily would be fun and wouldn't steal the cannon's thunder.
That's just my thoughts.
*EDIT: In the interests of avoiding confusion, what I am referring to is that, given the BOff abilities that boost how many cannon shots can be directed at a single target, cannons have more opportunities to score a proc-inducing critical NOT that the base percentage is higher per weapon.
This is brilliant.
I would also suggest as an alternative idea, that beams be made a time on target type weapon, instead of multiple volleys, you actually burn your way through an opponent's shields and hull.
Beams have drain problem in STO combat. It needs to be fixed.
Doesnt matter though since the Tac hating torch wieldings players will see Tacs,DHCs and Escorts nerfed into the basement for the sins of working well we will all be playing Cruisers, cruisers, science and thier vessels in the months ahead until the playerbase gets bored, pissed or whatever and complains about how weak tacs are having forgotten how it all got to that point anyways.
Its the ugly truth Ive noticed about this forums and the game. Just a cpntiuos circle of nerfing buffing nerfing buffing... But little balance.
I don't want cannons nerfed. Cannons as they are are fine.
Where my issue comes in is that in an STF I can put 6 beam arrays on a nanite transformer or a probe or especially a sphere, I can lay down warp plasma, I have Ep2W on cycle and it still takes forever to kill them, while a DHC can come through and mop the floor with them in one or two passes, in half the time that I've been working on them and it makes me feel utterly useless. Especially in STFs where it's ticking clock working against you, if you have a boat full of beams you not only need to get the job done, but get it done in a timely manner. So we need to have cannons there to punch through, but in a scenario where everyone has a part to play, if you're using beams, if you're not getting the job done, you're holding the team back.
That's why beam dps needs to increase. So someone using beams can actually contribute. Using beams should be just as viable as any other method. Different yes, but currently beams are clearly inferior in every possible metric except firing arc. One good attribute does not balance make.
Expanding it to a cruiser argument, in the above scenario, I don't need to heal others that much, if I'm going to contribute I need to do damage. My tanking is fine, but I can barely scratch the opponent's defenses.
IMO, what really pushes cannons overboard are turrets, but I would have to say that beam array also drain an excessive amount of power for the damage they actually do, even on a full broadside.
That's a good point. Usually you would see a drawback for a positive quality to have balance.
The weapon that does the most damage should logically have the greatest power drain. Energy for energy. If you want a bigger bang, you use more explosives. By that thought, you would think that beams that have the largest power drain should produce the most damage per volley....but they don't. So the weapon that does the most damage, actually uses the least effective amount of energy. So a beam does a pittance of damage and is a terribly draining weapon.
It's interesting as well as in canon, the energy weapons on Federation Starships since the Enterprise's retrofit have had their power ran straight through the warp core as a way to increase weapons power. So weapons fire should drain from all power systems if at all. It works the same on Klingon ships too.
I am very curious about this new warp core mechanic and looking forward to it.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
People have been griping about the damage output/drain of beams for a while now. Why i sit that we haven't heard from any Cryptic staff about this? We can discuss this among each other until rapture, but it won't make a difference. The devs' need to hear and be involved for a real solution. But alas, the sound of (dev) silence is so loud.
People have been griping about the damage output/drain of beams for a while now. Why i sit that we haven't heard from any Cryptic staff about this? We can discuss this among each other until rapture, but it won't make a difference. The devs' need to hear and be involved for a real solution. But alas, the sound of (dev) silence is so loud.
I believe that Capt******* has made his views very clear on beam arrays, to the effect that they are fine. I also remember him saying something about DHCs not getting nerfed. Since all signs point to him being in charge of "powers and systems", what do you think is going to happen?
People have been griping about the damage output/drain of beams for a while now. Why i sit that we haven't heard from any Cryptic staff about this? We can discuss this among each other until rapture, but it won't make a difference. The devs' need to hear and be involved for a real solution. But alas, the sound of (dev) silence is so loud.
You are misinformed. Al Rivera (CaptainGeko) made it abundantly clear that beams are working as intended.
You are misinformed. Al Rivera (CaptainGeko) made it abundantly clear that beams are working as intended.
His exact words were: "Beam arrays are WAD." Which goes to show he's probably a cannon jocky, or doesn't actually understand what those lines of color coming out of his ship do, or if he does, exactly how massive of an effect power levels have on them.
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
Or they really are working as intended, and no amount of complaining is going to help.
In which case it may well be time for cruiser and science pilots to take the hint and find a new game because Cryptic evidently doesn't care about them
His exact words were: "Beam arrays are WAD." Which goes to show he's probably a cannon jocky, or doesn't actually understand what those lines of color coming out of his ship do, or if he does, exactly how massive of an effect power levels have on them.
Considering he recommended we put points in Power Insulator skill I'm going to go with the he has no idea how the two systems are interacting. Beams and power drain that is.
He also feels cruisers need more survivability so yeah.
the day gecko gets a clue will be the day after the world has burned or so it seems....and i sure hope he meant electro plasma systems instead of insulators course they stripped that effect a few seasons back so again still sounds like a well i can't say it as branflakes would just edit it ;-)
but as he has no control of his own actions for being a PWE puppet (pwetty wittle elitest puppet)....
after what he said in that same time frame about science pilots not knowing what we want i can't honestly take him seriously on anything he says or believe he knows what he is talking about because the same thing comes up in EVERY science rework forum and that is tactical skills should not buff science and that our skills should be returned to pre-nerfbowl 2012 stats.
the day gecko gets a clue will be the day after the world has burned or so it seems....and i sure hope he meant electro plasma systems instead of insulators course they stripped that effect a few seasons back so again still sounds like a well i can't say it as branflakes would just edit it ;-)
but as he has no control of his own actions for being a PWE puppet (pwetty wittle elitest puppet)....
after what he said in that same time frame about science pilots not knowing what we want i can't honestly take him seriously on anything he says or believe he knows what he is talking about because the same thing comes up in EVERY science rework forum and that is tactical skills should not buff science and that our skills should be returned to pre-nerfbowl 2012 stats.
If this is the case, the game has a serious problem. I play all three classes and types of ships and I can appreciate what all are supposed to do. I can also understand that Gecko might have a bias towards escorts, but is he the only dev' in the game? Surely someone else has to have driven a cruiser and got the same feeling about the power drain issues and near whiffle-ball level damage that the beams are doing.
If this is the case, the game has a serious problem. I play all three classes and types of ships and I can appreciate what all are supposed to do. I can also understand that Gecko might have a bias towards escorts, but is he the only dev' in the game? Surely someone else has to have driven a cruiser and got the same feeling about the power drain issues and near whiffle-ball level damage that the beams are doing.
According to one of the devs, he handles "powers and systems", and that tells me two things:
- Gecko is the only who handles balancing.
- STO is short on staff.
If he thinks that "beam arrays are working as designed", or that the game is just about balanced, then I believe we may have a problem, and that said problem is both inside the game and outside of it.
According to one of the devs, he handles "powers and systems", and that tells me two things:
- Gecko is the only who handles balancing.
- STO is short on staff.
If he thinks that "beam arrays are working as designed", or that the game is just about balanced, then I believe we may have a problem, and that said problem is both inside the game and outside of it.
I will say this much, I am glad that I have been busy this semester, I havent had time to PvP that much, heck I havent had time time to STF much for that matter. I'd imagine I'd be much more disgruntled if I had been able to play more. I've been hearing whispers from my box'o 'Battletech to get dusted off and go to the local gaming store because of some of the "messedupinees" as of late.
get yourself the Romulan experimental beam array. this stops energy drain on your beams.
then equip a tac and engineering console that gives you a bonus on your beam weapons
and energy weapons damage respectively.
Comments
I play PVE exclusively and part of the problem with the beams weakness is the inability to finish missions anywhere near as fast as escorts. I am being forced as a science captain to adapt like a borg to be able to complete space battle centric RA's and DC's that require blowing up some number of enemies that seem to have a neverending supply of ships. It's not right.
Heck maybe new beams are introduced in S8 or 9 as a T6 weapon for fleet admirals.
Beams offer the ability to modulate your output, and in some cases surf right past shields of varying types. This flexibility allows for ships to engage in multiple scenarios while exploring. This is Star Trek after all.
Cannons are not modulatable (OMG - its a real word), and are design exclusively for combat. Their sheer damage output clearly has one purpose - damage. I can't imagine a starship captain saying -'blow the TRIBBLE out of the ice field and maybe we can splash some water over there' when 'we can pierce the heliosphere to drill holes in the ice to help increase precipitation across the lower continent' seems much more in line with the game
To be honest, I am satisfied with beams as they are. I can easily finish the STF's and missions, and for large fleet engagements, the flexibility with their firing arcs are tough to beat.
My Two Bits
Admiral Thrax
Oh here come the witch hunting cannon brigade :rolleyes: seriously this trolling is getting beyond a joke now what do you people not understand about needing your enemy ship to be in the firing arc when dealing cannon damage. If anything cannons should be given the 250 degree firing arc that beams have. Seriously Im having a tough time understanding peoples irrational thinking on this.
Im fed up and wish people would realise that its unrealistic to expect every single thing in this game to be balanced. All ships serve different purposes. A Tac in an escorts serves to do high DPS, High damage and to rip open enemy shields and hull before cruisers go in and finish the job. In the time an escort pilot has whilst having 10 - 15 seconds with cannons bearing down on the enemy, he will have done the same damage that you have done flying around with your 250 degree firing arc beams. I mean come on ?
If you were to nerf cannons you wouldn't have the spike damage and fights would be long boring and rawn out.
How about everyone who complains about cannons grow a pair and use a tractor beam on an escort. As an escort pilot I can tell you if you catch me whils my OMEGA and or Polrize hull is on cd, and I have you and 5 of your buddies on me then im done for.
That is the simple answer to cannons, teamwork + tractor beams. How hard is it to grab and understand this simple fundamental gameplay mechanic. It would take a lot less time and effort than coming to the forums being butthurt and ruining other peoples gameplay.
If anything, and I think is a more suitable, realistic and agreeable change is to speed up beam firing and shorten the gap between beam firing. I do agree beam firing animation plays for too long.
Watch this and pay attention as the defiant and neghvar go at it. Beams need to be shorter than they are but do the same damage :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-trPu637dS0
Now please, enough of the stupid ideas and illogical ramblings, go learn to play or go play neverwinter. I shouldn't have to have my style of play removed from the game hence ruining my enjoyment because of peple on an agenda because they are butthurt or mad from pvp.
Ive been in this game since start and if you saw all my characters, builds, traits, playtime I can truly make an informed decision on this issue. If you saw what Ive done in game you would think ok yeah fair enough this guy knows what hes on about.
Im not judging or trolling but the ongoing witch hunt which the moderators allow to continue makes me sad. ABout time moderators started putting a curb on this trolling.
As for escorts. . .with evenly matched opponents, I can see a tanky escort (JHAS, Patrol/Advanced escorts) hold off against 2 attackers, at best. If the attackers are crappy at PvP and timing their bursts, it'll take more. Hit 'em with immobilizers, and they'll go down faster.
Perhaps escort defenses need to be nerfed a bit. That's definitely open to discussion, as some escorts are rather good at tanking when in the right hands.
Instead of TRIBBLE around with weapons, we should be taking a look at defensive powers, and re-work the system to make it harder for escorts to tank, making cruisers more valuable both in PvP and PvE. The only reason DHCs even cut through competent defenses in PvP right now is because it's burst damage. Nerf the damage of DHCs, and suddenly everyone's nigh unkillable.
Finally, a sensible suggestion.
Good work sir!
Kirk's Protege.
Well, I had an argument in a thread with someone about percentage based healing Where (for example) Aux2SIF would be more effective from a cruiser or sci ship than from an escort lets say we have an escort with 1000 max hull (post skill points etc) running 25 aux power they would get an Aux2SIF heal of 150 but a cruiser with 5000 max hull (Post skills points etc) running 50 aux power would get 1000 from the same skill and a Sci ship with 3250 max hull (Post skill points etc) running 100 aux power would get 975 from Aux2SIF
The formula would be as follows:
A= Max hull (1000)
B= Percentage of max hull (in this case 10%)
C= Aux mod (0.02)
D= Aux Power (25)
E= Base heal (100)
F= Aux bonus (50%)
G= End Heal (150)
So; E=A*B and F=C*D
Heal formula: =E+(E*F)
This means you can have an escort with 1000 max hull and 125 aux power and the cruiser with 5000 max hull and 5 aux power and the cruiser will get a better heal. The same can be done for shield heals and so long as base hull and shield HPs are adjusted accordingly escorts will become glass cannons again
I know, that is why I said they would have to adjusted accordingly, as long as that is done the system will work and escorts will no longer be tanking elite tac cubes as they currently do
Why should PVE be ruined because of their lack of skills?
Why should all the players suffer because a few of the PVP players ( a minor part of the gamers in game) feel that they are not super cool enough?
Why not buff cruiser healing and hit points instead?
Elite Defense Stovokor
Why should escprts not have to pay for their damage output?
No matter what happens, these people will not stop whining until their ships will : Do the most damage, have the most shields, hulls, and turn the fastest.
And the worst of all? They can't even admit they just want an undefeatable ship.
Cruisers are tasked with tanking in this game. Grow up and accepat that fank. Learn to tank..hehehe.
Ask a frequent player of STFs tanking is not needed or helpful in the slightest.
That's a cheap argument. Escorts players are the ones who complain because they see threatening their fooling position. Escorts were designed as a glass cannon. Today escorts do not have more serious drawbacks.
Oh, you're talking about escorts? Ok.
I would also suggest as an alternative idea, that beams be made a time on target type weapon, instead of multiple volleys, you actually burn your way through an opponent's shields and hull.
I don't want cannons nerfed. Cannons as they are are fine.
Where my issue comes in is that in an STF I can put 6 beam arrays on a nanite transformer or a probe or especially a sphere, I can lay down warp plasma, I have Ep2W on cycle and it still takes forever to kill them, while a DHC can come through and mop the floor with them in one or two passes, in half the time that I've been working on them and it makes me feel utterly useless. Especially in STFs where it's ticking clock working against you, if you have a boat full of beams you not only need to get the job done, but get it done in a timely manner. So we need to have cannons there to punch through, but in a scenario where everyone has a part to play, if you're using beams, if you're not getting the job done, you're holding the team back.
That's why beam dps needs to increase. So someone using beams can actually contribute. Using beams should be just as viable as any other method. Different yes, but currently beams are clearly inferior in every possible metric except firing arc. One good attribute does not balance make.
Expanding it to a cruiser argument, in the above scenario, I don't need to heal others that much, if I'm going to contribute I need to do damage. My tanking is fine, but I can barely scratch the opponent's defenses.
That's a good point. Usually you would see a drawback for a positive quality to have balance.
The weapon that does the most damage should logically have the greatest power drain. Energy for energy. If you want a bigger bang, you use more explosives. By that thought, you would think that beams that have the largest power drain should produce the most damage per volley....but they don't. So the weapon that does the most damage, actually uses the least effective amount of energy. So a beam does a pittance of damage and is a terribly draining weapon.
It's interesting as well as in canon, the energy weapons on Federation Starships since the Enterprise's retrofit have had their power ran straight through the warp core as a way to increase weapons power. So weapons fire should drain from all power systems if at all. It works the same on Klingon ships too.
I am very curious about this new warp core mechanic and looking forward to it.
I just was in an Infeted Space run and there were no beam weapons at all. It made me wonder if this still is a Star Trek game...
Makes me wonder also, people are equipping their vestas with PDHC's now. go figure.
I love those types of runs.
People have been griping about the damage output/drain of beams for a while now. Why i sit that we haven't heard from any Cryptic staff about this? We can discuss this among each other until rapture, but it won't make a difference. The devs' need to hear and be involved for a real solution. But alas, the sound of (dev) silence is so loud.
I believe that Capt******* has made his views very clear on beam arrays, to the effect that they are fine. I also remember him saying something about DHCs not getting nerfed. Since all signs point to him being in charge of "powers and systems", what do you think is going to happen?
You are misinformed. Al Rivera (CaptainGeko) made it abundantly clear that beams are working as intended.
His exact words were: "Beam arrays are WAD." Which goes to show he's probably a cannon jocky, or doesn't actually understand what those lines of color coming out of his ship do, or if he does, exactly how massive of an effect power levels have on them.
In which case it may well be time for cruiser and science pilots to take the hint and find a new game because Cryptic evidently doesn't care about them
Considering he recommended we put points in Power Insulator skill I'm going to go with the he has no idea how the two systems are interacting. Beams and power drain that is.
He also feels cruisers need more survivability so yeah.
but as he has no control of his own actions for being a PWE puppet (pwetty wittle elitest puppet)....
after what he said in that same time frame about science pilots not knowing what we want i can't honestly take him seriously on anything he says or believe he knows what he is talking about because the same thing comes up in EVERY science rework forum and that is tactical skills should not buff science and that our skills should be returned to pre-nerfbowl 2012 stats.
If this is the case, the game has a serious problem. I play all three classes and types of ships and I can appreciate what all are supposed to do. I can also understand that Gecko might have a bias towards escorts, but is he the only dev' in the game? Surely someone else has to have driven a cruiser and got the same feeling about the power drain issues and near whiffle-ball level damage that the beams are doing.
According to one of the devs, he handles "powers and systems", and that tells me two things:
- Gecko is the only who handles balancing.
- STO is short on staff.
If he thinks that "beam arrays are working as designed", or that the game is just about balanced, then I believe we may have a problem, and that said problem is both inside the game and outside of it.
I will say this much, I am glad that I have been busy this semester, I havent had time to PvP that much, heck I havent had time time to STF much for that matter. I'd imagine I'd be much more disgruntled if I had been able to play more. I've been hearing whispers from my box'o 'Battletech to get dusted off and go to the local gaming store because of some of the "messedupinees" as of late.
then equip a tac and engineering console that gives you a bonus on your beam weapons
and energy weapons damage respectively.