The KDF has less of everything. That much is factual.
But when demanding more "KDF content", what is actually demanded?
Is it:
1. Missions?
Missions are the last thing this game needs, for either faction.
They take a lot of dev time and end up only being played 0 to 1 time by the players.
Enjoying them for the story? Writing is terrible is this game, fanfic-level terrible.
The writing is one of the reasons I now level my chars through System Patrols and/or PvP (the other reason being: avoidance of ground combat which bores me).
2. Levels 1-19?
Won't really solve the problem of having little to do at endgame; it'll just be a tad slower for KDF chars to get to that situation.
Do you actually want to go through lv1-19 on your second (and following) char(s)? Personally, if there was an option to skip to 20 FED-side, I'd use it. Wouldn't have used it on my first char, but now, yes, I would.
3. Playable races?
Heh, I guess there are RP reasons. Then again, there are RP reasons why the KDF would be less diversed than the Federation.
For us non-RP minded people, the best race is Alien; on both sides.
Joined Trill is the only race that can really compete with a char that gets to pick Efficient Captain, Warp Theorist, Accurate and Elusive or Techie.
4. Ships?
When I first started, I really thought they should've fleshed out the KDF Ships before adding any new FED Ships.
Nowadays, I'm not so sure.
See, while the KDF has less variety, its Ships tend to be pretty damn good:
- The Guramba is one of the best Escorts around. I should know, I fly a Ship that's strictly weaker and still hold my own.
- Battle Cruisers don't pale in comparison to Cruisers. For the most part, they're the same Ships with more Turn Rate (Bortas excluded), a Cloak and the ability to use Duals.
The Vor'cha-R and Negh'var are quite frankly better than the Sovereign and Galaxy-R/Vanguard and the Bortas line competes very well with the Odyssey line.
- The Hegh'ta is a lot of fun to play and a beast in both PvP and PvE.
Yes, even PvE: a damage boost every 20s and the ability to switch between being a SV and an Escort more than makes up for the lost Turret.
On faction uniquness: I, too, would've liked it being preserved: no FED Carriers (no Atrox, different Akira-R)... but also no KDF SVs (no Varanus nor the lower level ones).
So, how 'bout adding new ships?
Well, using those that have been asked for or promised:
1. Hegh'ta-R:
- Traditionally, a Refit/Retrofit keeps the same turn rate, inertia and crew.
- A Refit/Retrofit of the same tier keeps the same hull.
- Weapon slots depend solely on Ship type and level.
So, stats for an Hegh'ta-R:
Hull: 24000
Shields: ~4175 (usually a ~5% bonus to Shields on C-Store ships)
Weapons: 4/2, can use Duals.
Crew: 100
Consoles: 3/3/3
BOFFs: Commander Universal, LC Universal, Lt. Universal, Lt. Universal.
Turn: 21
Inertia: 60
Bonus Power: Weapons+15
Bonus Console: ?
Need I go on? Point is, it's a Hegh'ta with a bit more Shields and a Console. Might as well buff the existing Hegh'ta rather than have it as a new Ship.
Design space for BoPs is very limited, given the universal BOFFs and 3/3/3 consoles.
2. Qin-R.
The KDF sure could use a few more Escorts but I think Cryptic is more likely to introduce Destroyers than Raptors at this point.
Let's face it, Raptors are all "Escorts+Cloak"... in the case of the Qin, that's fine, it's a free Defiant but imagine a C-Store Raptor with some sort of separation... it'd have both the Defiant's gimmick and the MVAE's. Either they compensate for the Cloak by making it weaker in another area (which will lead to complaints) or they don't and it's not balanced.
So, Destroyers are more likely.
Besides, if it uses the Qin model, it'll probably have the same pivot point and nobody wants that.
3. Negh'var-R.
With rumours of a Sovereign-R, there's no reasons why a Negh'var-R couldn't be made.
But I'm wary of any new Cruiser, FED or KDF: either it's balanced with the "olde" Cruisers and is obsolete upon release (moreso FED-side, KDF-side there's a significant Turn Rate difference) or it's balanced with the Odyssey/Bortas and that's a huge power creep.
The two things I'd want out of KDF:
Costumes up to par. Broken record, but mercenary isn't available for KDF? Seriously? Give KDF most of the same options! Maybe you have a KDF Romulan refugee who likes Earth tuxedos. Who cares?
No obstacle to entry. Let people start as a KDF. I don't care about the 1-20 thing.
Campaign: The Fenwick Cycle NWS-DKR9GB7KH
Wicks and Things: NW-DI4FMZRR4 : The Fenwick merchant family has lost a caravan! Can you help?
Beggar's Hollow: NW-DR6YG4J2L : Someone, or something, has stolen away many of the Fenwicks' children! Can you find out what happened to them?
Into the Fen Wood: NW-DL89DRG7B : Enter the heart of the forest. Can you discover the secret of the Fen Wood?
first, KDF 1-19 is about not forcing players into Starfleet so that the KDF is a legitimate choice. it forces the devs to be more fair with development time, especially c store options.
if you look at the number of ship options for the KDF at 50, they pale in comparison to Starfleet. and yet we are criticized for not spending c points by the devs and Starfleet?
sure, the Hegh'ta & B'rel are things that Starfleet don't have yet (but seem to be getting due to faction imba "pining"). Starfleet has more options in everything else, and will inevitably get all the Klingon options as well. I don't care if my Hegh'ta is better than a science ship.... I made certain sacrifices for that, and continue to sacrifice for that privilege. when Starfleet is handed their bird of prey on a silver platter, then I will reconsider a great many things about this game.
also, the qin may be free, but it looks like a duck, or maybe a goose. it also turns far worse than the defiant, which is a huge issue with that ugly duck. bad turn, defiant boff layout... not a very good combination.
the real solution is to end the charade and add the Klingons as a Starfleet option, with slightly different graphics.
first, KDF 1-19 is about not forcing players into Starfleet so that the KDF is a legitimate choice. it forces the devs to be more fair with development time, especially c store options.
if you look at the number of ship options for the KDF at 50, they pale in comparison to Starfleet. the Hegh'ta & B'rel are things that Starfleet don't have yet (but seem to be getting due to faction imba "pining"). Starfleet has more options in everything else, and will inevitably get all the Klingon options as well. I don't care if my Hegh'ta is better than a science ship.... I made certain sacrifices for that, and continue to sacrifice for that privilege. when Starfleet is handed their bird of prey on a silver platter, then I will reconsider a great many things about this game.
also, the qin may be free, but it looks like a duck, or maybe a goose. it also turns far worse than the defiant, which is a huge issue with that ugly duck. bad turn, defiant boff layout... not a very good combination.
the real solution is to end the charade and add the Klingons as a Starfleet option, with slightly different graphics.
Makes me sad.
I want more bushido feel. I want more "Good soldiers know when to disobey" or "Good soldiers know when to sacrifice," missions where we support allies with arms not subjugate all with those arms, house intrigues that do not always lead to outright civil war all so we can stop being space ogres. I want 1-20 so new players are not forced to commit to Feds. I want a T5+1 Raptor. I want some fighters and shuttles so we have a few options.
Oh well as a step mother of mine once said, "Want in one hand while you TRIBBLE in the other and see which one fills up first."
If you are a pickle in a pickle jar you know every pickle's different, sort of, but really they're all just pickles...
The KDF has less of everything. That much is factual.
But when demanding more "KDF content", what is actually demanded?
Is it:
1. Missions?
Missions are the last thing this game needs, for either faction.
They take a lot of dev time and end up only being played 0 to 1 time by the players.
This rolls into item 2. While it does take effort to create them they help by feeding the need for lower level gameplay which in turn feeds the ability for a player to invest in a KDF toon.
Enjoying them for the story?
Not for the KDF and these mission could help clarify our role in the affairs of STO, bringing us out of the Ork designation.
2. Levels 1-19?
Won't really solve the problem of having little to do at endgame; it'll just be a tad slower for KDF chars to get to that situation.
Do you actually want to go through lv1-19 on your second (and following) char(s)? Personally, if there was an option to skip to 20 FED-side, I'd use it. Wouldn't have used it on my first char, but now, yes, I would.
Endgame is a different problem and effects everyone one currently, hence why they are focused on it at this time.
Yes, I want a reason to enjoy creating ALTs that feeds my desire to play KDF. Currently the feds have this level start point and while anything gets boring grinding numerous times the option to do so is a staple of a complete faction experience.
Having a faction anyone play in a day to endgame is not a faction and offers nothing to invest the player in said faction except pre-existing loyalty.
So, how 'bout adding new ships?
Well, using those that have been asked for or promised:
1. Hegh'ta-R:
- Traditionally, a Refit/Retrofit keeps the same turn rate, inertia and crew.
- A Refit/Retrofit of the same tier keeps the same hull.
- Weapon slots depend solely on Ship type and level.
So, stats for an Hegh'ta-R:
Hull: 24000
Shields: ~4175 (usually a ~5% bonus to Shields on C-Store ships)
Weapons: 4/2, can use Duals.
Crew: 100
Consoles: 3/3/3
BOFFs: Commander Universal, LC Universal, Lt. Universal, Lt. Universal.
Turn: 21
Inertia: 60
Bonus Power: Weapons+15
Bonus Console: ?
Need I go on? Point is, it's a Hegh'ta with a bit more Shields and a Console. Might as well buff the existing Hegh'ta rather than have it as a new Ship.
Design space for BoPs is very limited, given the universal BOFFs and 3/3/3 consoles.
2. Qin-R.
The KDF sure could use a few more Escorts but I think Cryptic is more likely to introduce Destroyers than Raptors at this point.
Let's face it, Raptors are all "Escorts+Cloak"... in the case of the Qin, that's fine, it's a free Defiant but imagine a C-Store Raptor with some sort of separation... it'd have both the Defiant's gimmick and the MVAE's. Either they compensate for the Cloak by making it weaker in another area (which will lead to complaints) or they don't and it's not balanced.
So, Destroyers are more likely.
Besides, if it uses the Qin model, it'll probably have the same pivot point and nobody wants that.
3. Negh'var-R.
With rumours of a Sovereign-R, there's no reasons why a Negh'var-R couldn't be made.
But I'm wary of any new Cruiser, FED or KDF: either it's balanced with the "olde" Cruisers and is obsolete upon release (moreso FED-side, KDF-side there's a significant Turn Rate difference) or it's balanced with the Odyssey/Bortas and that's a huge power creep.
Sounds good to me. I have no initial use myself for special consoles (though I will not mind having them) and really just wish to see the KDF ships mention above be competitive.
This rolls into item 2. While it does take effort to create them they help by feeding the need for lower level gameplay which in turn feeds the ability for a player to invest in a KDF toon.
I should've prefaced with this: I'm not into this whole faction identity thing.
When I see "the feds" or "the klinks" on these forums, it makes me cringe... because I play both and think it's silly to take a partisan stance on these matters.
Then again, the MMOs I've played for a decent length of time weren't faction-based, so maybe I just wasn't raised in this culture of "us vs them".
I'll admit it was weird not being to start a KDF char immediatly, but frankly I never saw it as a big deal.
1-20 is extremely unlikely to ever happen, though: we get 1 Ship every 3 months or so and they'd have to create at least 3 solely to flesh out 1-20, Ships that by nature would be as short-lived as the Miranda, Constitution, Saber and Nova; not to mention create new missions and trying to make them fit with the old ones that are quite obviously meant to be a starting point.
Not for the KDF and these mission could help clarify our role in the affairs of STO, bringing us out of the Ork designation.
MOAR DAKKA! Maybe that's the solution? Paint all KDF Ships red (they'll go fasta) and give Klingons fangs? Wouldn't be Trek, but it'd be pretty awesome.
Heh, I guess there are people that can enjoy the STO story. Personally, I'll reiterate that I find it fanfic-level horrible and would rather not be subjected to more of those terrible-dialogue, unskippable, weirdly animated cutscenes.
But even if you enjoy it, you have to concede that, at this point, it should take a backseat to more important matters... namely fleshing out the nigh-nonexistent endgame.
Sounds good to me. I have no initial use myself for special consoles (though I will not mind having them) and really just wish to see the KDF ships mention above be competitive.
You don't seem to have read. I was giving rationales for why those Ships aren't that easy to introduce.
More variety in Klingon Ships'd be good, but it's not necessarily easy to introduce it while maintaining balance.
And let's stop the paranoia. It's highly unlikely they'll add a FED BoP.
Btw, the whole 16% excuse the dev make? Yeah, that's BS.
The KDF has less of everything. That much is factual.
2. Qin-R.
The KDF sure could use a few more Escorts but I think Cryptic is more likely to introduce Destroyers than Raptors at this point.
Let's face it, Raptors are all "Escorts+Cloak"... in the case of the Qin, that's fine, it's a free Defiant but imagine a C-Store Raptor with some sort of separation... it'd have both the Defiant's gimmick and the MVAE's. Either they compensate for the Cloak by making it weaker in another area (which will lead to complaints) or they don't and it's not balanced.
So, Destroyers are more likely.
Besides, if it uses the Qin model, it'll probably have the same pivot point and nobody wants that.
Whats wrong with destroyers ?
The Garamba looks like a great ship, but as I fly the Qin there's not much incentive to buy the seige destroyer- They're almost identical in stats.
BUT a Qin-R (the current Qin) with some candy would definitely be something I'd consider. A bit better turn rate, ship abilities or a universal device slot (or 2), maybe a battle cloak and either a universal LT or a LT in place of the current ensign slot. Point defense and more hull points would be overkill but WTF- the Feds got an Armitage.
Why spend effort to convince others the futility of KDF completion if you do not care if its completed or not?
MOAR DAKKA! Maybe that's the solution? Paint all KDF Ships red (they'll go fasta) and give Klingons fangs? Wouldn't be Trek, but it'd be pretty awesome.
Its what we practically have now and it sucks to be the monster play faction.
Heh, I guess there are people that can enjoy the STO story. Personally, I'll reiterate that I find it fanfic-level horrible and would rather not be subjected to more of those terrible-dialogue, unskippable, weirdly animated cutscenes.
Then why do you care if the effort is put into added PvE missions to the KDF? Why fight against it if you do not care for storyline and its existance has no effect on your gameplay?
But even if you enjoy it, you have to concede that, at this point, it should take a backseat to more important matters... namely fleshing out the nigh-nonexistent endgame.
I never said they should stop fixing endgame and I already stated endgame for the KDf is not a concern as it is agnostic and being worked on already.
I said we need a complete level progression for the KDf faction to help the player invest in having a KDF toon.
You don't seem to have read. I was giving rationales for why those Ships aren't that easy to introduce.
More variety in Klingon Ships'd be good, but it's not necessarily easy to introduce it while maintaining balance.
Oddly I thought the ideas sounded feasible. But then again balance is hardly the issue with Cryptic/STO if it pertains to an item that must be pruchased.
And let's stop the paranoia. It's highly unlikely they'll add a FED BoP.
Wow, an attack on the wrong thread. We've heard that before btw with carriers.
Btw, the whole 16% excuse the dev make? Yeah, that's BS.
As is the 82% majority, but I mentioned niether in my post.
I do find it funny though that you have to pull stuff from other posts now to attack with Klingon hate for the purpose of this thread? Did you feel your point of debate was failing or are you just trolling to kick a few ridges while they're down?
I will tell you what I find sad though, how much the Klingon hate is propigated by the feds and the Devs alike in STO, the podcast interviews and the ingame chatter itself.
No wonder we fans of the Klingon aspect of the IP are pissed, we found enjoyment in the genre and it could give a targ flop less about us unless we can prove that we can bring it enough revenue to warrant recieving attention.
What sort of backwards f-upped thinking is that for a MMO that chased away the KDF fans who where in closedbeta/beta and then only gave token attention for two whole years?
I am no longer surprised the large Klingon fanclubs haven't made thier prescence known in STO, they know a feds only club when they see it.
Its what we practically have now and it sucks to be the monster play faction.
Monster faction? Orks are awesome!
Then why do you care if the effort is put into added PvE missions to the KDF? Why fight against it if you do not care for storyline and its existance has no effect on your gameplay?
Fight against it? I was just trying to get clarification on a vague term, initially and analysing the possibilities. I'm not fighting anything.
I never said they should stop fixing endgame and I already stated endgame for the KDf is not a concern as it is agnostic and being worked on already.
I said we need a complete level progression for the KDf faction to help the player invest in having a KDF toon.
Dev ressources are limited.
Some companies can work on story-oriented content and endgame-oriented content at once, but clearly Cryptic cannot.
(aside:"agnostic" doesn't really work in this context)
Oddly I thought the ideas sounded feasible. But then again balance is hardly the issue with Cryptic/STO if it pertains to an item that must be pruchased.
The Hegh'ta-R issue isn't one of balance, it's to make a BoP that's functionally different from other BoPs.
The main differences (stats-wise) between a new Ship and existing Ships are BOFF layout and consoles, T5 BoPs all have the same BOFFs and consoles. Bringing a new one, especially a Hegh'ta Refit without making it too similar to existing options is basically impossible, at least in the framework Cryptic has decided upon for BoPs.
Cryptic they do have some balancing rules/mechanics; whether you or I agree with those is another matter (neither of us does, apparently), but they do.
And any Ship actually released is always more balanced than the "I WANT A SHIP 1SHOTZ UNIVARS!" stuff the community posts on forums, FED-side or KDF-side.
Wow, an attack on the wrong thread. We've heard that before btw with carriers.
Calm down, I wasn't attacking anyone. Why such aggressivity?
I just don't think it likely they'll make a FED BoP. I am aware of the Carrier history.
I wasn't even aware of a FED BoP thread, all I'd heard from it was from the guy who posted above you.
Anyway, if they decide to make a FED BoP, I'll voice against it, but I'm not going to rant pre-emptively about it.
As is the 82% majority, but I mentioned niether in my post.
Not what I meant (16+82=98, btw, where'd the last 2% go?), neither was it aimed at you.
I do find it funny though that you have to pull stuff from other posts now to attack with Klingon hate for the purpose of this thread? Did you feel your point of debate was failing or are you just trolling to kick a few ridges while they're down?
You really need to calm down, dude.
I know from lurking the ancient version of the fora that you're more literate than that, but here you are just half-reading, assuming hostility where there is none and blindly flailing a sword around.
I will tell you what I find sad though, how much the Klingon hate is propigated by the feds and the Devs alike in STO, the podcast interviews and the ingame chatter itself.
I think this goes both ways actually, and sadly.
I have a Klingon character, and I dont play it... I just dont care for it... not for the lack of content, ships, consoles, etc... rather what drew me to STO is the Star Trek shows based on the Federation.
You, or someone mentioned, the ratio of Fed Missions to KDF Missions.... not looking for a 1:1... then what would be an acceptable ratio? Currently it is 4.45:1.. are you looking for say 4:1 (1 more mission) 3:1 (addition of 4 mission), 2:1 (an additional 11 missions).
What path should these missions take? I am intrigued by the Bushido references. Basing my opinions on Worf here (found him to be an honorable, and duty bound officer), I think that would be an interesting story line, the way of the warrior and what not. Explaining who the Klingon are, and what they are about (other than raiding and pillaging).
This is just my opinion here, but would it make sense to help the dev team along with some story line ideas?
I do see, and understand, your frustration with the lack of content. If the numbers I have been reading in the forums are accurate... 16% of the player base is KDF then the ratio seems about right approximately 20% of the content/resources spent on that factions specific content (at least in as far as the faction specific missions).
It could also quite frankly be that the Owners (PWE/Cryptic) and not the devs themselves are placing restrictions on the amount of time/resources that can be spent. We all have our bosses after all... and the bosses generally are more concerned about the bottom line.
That is not to say that additional development can't attract more people to the Klingon side (heck I'd dust of my KDF player to do a way of the warrior mission).
As far as the number of ships, and I think in a different thread people mentioned the number of consoles... I can't speak for all, but mainly the different ship variants we have are reskinned versions of the same tier ship, with an exchanged slot (sci for eng, etc). Which, I would prefer just 1 ship with a universal slot tbh. As to the consoles, after a little game play, most lose their luster save a few, and they are sent off to the bank to rust in piece. I think though that upon serious analysis, the KDF ships have as much customizable options as the fleet of different fed ships (i.e. for each universal slot adds 3 variants to the ship in question)... and that most of the consoles that retain their usefullness, probably equal the number of consoles available to the klingons. So I would argue that some of the ships, and some of the consles are really just fluff...
Fill in the content eneded to bring a toon from level one to the starting level we have now.
Aproximately 20-25 missions.
Why the KDF is at war with the feds? Is it Undine? Is it becuase of our reconquesting? is it both?
How does the houses take this change?
What of the Houses that where destroyed due to Undine subversion?
What of the Gorn, are they on the verge of rebellion?
What of the Orions, what are they really up to by becoming allies?
What of the Undine, is J'mpok one?
Many ideas have been tossed at the Devs on what the faction falls short on fuilling its identity in STO.
We do not have a complete faction from a PvE standpoint. We can not play from level one to endgame and as such the desire to roll ALTs is lessened knowing that the faction has little substance to play through thus diminishing the investment value of even rolling a KDF toon.
Yes, Endgame stability and solid revenue stream is important. After that is accomplished it would be nice if they put some focus towards the KDF instead of refering to it as "beating the dead targ". Why would anyone play a faction they know is incomplete.
Fill in the content eneded to bring a toon from level one to the starting level we have now.
Aproximately 20-25 missions.
Why the KDF is at war with the feds? Is it Undine? Is it becuase of our reconquesting? is it both?
How does the houses take this change?
What of the Houses that where destroyed due to Undine subversion?
What of the Gorn, are they on the verge of rebellion?
What of the Orions, what are they really up to by becoming allies?
What of the Undine, is J'mpok one?
Many ideas have been tossed at the Devs on what the faction falls short on fuilling its identity in STO.
We do not have a complete faction from a PvE standpoint. We can not play from level one to endgame and as such the desire to roll ALTs is lessened knowing that the faction has little substance to play through thus diminishing the investment value of even rolling a KDF toon.
Yes, Endgame stability and solid revenue stream is important. After that is accomplished it would be nice if they put some focus towards the KDF instead of refering to it as "beating the dead targ". Why would anyone play a faction they know is incomplete.
So, you are looking for a 1:1 ratio and 50% of the resource share, from a business perspective, I think that is a little unrealistic at this point. Regardless of what was promised, or eluded to in the past. You'd be better off, from a player perspective, recruit players to the Klingon side, to bring the player base up to at least match the content ratio... if they see more headed that direction, they will release some funds/resources... simple business math. Why invest 50%+ (since you would have to pull from the Fed side entirely to give you the volume of missions you are looking for) of your assets in 16-18% of your revenue stream.
That all being said, I do think that you should be able to play from 1 to 50... but do you have support from the general community of KDF? Its really not the devs you should be talking to, you should be stating your case to PWE corporate... they hold the pursestrings. I'm not saying the Devs are lackeys... but massive projects take oversight, they may simply not have the authority to make the changes you are requesting.
'The KDF is a minority, why spend resources on them?'
Well, duh, it's a minority BECAUSE little resources were spent on them. Who wants to volunteer for the unsupported faction?
As for 'the show was about the good guys,' look at lots and lots of other 2 faction MMOs -- people like playing Horde and Alliance, Order and Chaos, and so on.
OTHER MMOs don't seem to suffer at all for putting resources into two factions equally. It seems like looking for an excuse to say STO is somehow different.
Campaign: The Fenwick Cycle NWS-DKR9GB7KH
Wicks and Things: NW-DI4FMZRR4 : The Fenwick merchant family has lost a caravan! Can you help?
Beggar's Hollow: NW-DR6YG4J2L : Someone, or something, has stolen away many of the Fenwicks' children! Can you find out what happened to them?
Into the Fen Wood: NW-DL89DRG7B : Enter the heart of the forest. Can you discover the secret of the Fen Wood?
'The KDF is a minority, why spend resources on them?'
Well, duh, it's a minority BECAUSE little resources were spent on them. Who wants to volunteer for the unsupported faction?
As for 'the show was about the good guys,' look at lots and lots of other 2 faction MMOs -- people like playing Horde and Alliance, Order and Chaos, and so on.
OTHER MMOs don't seem to suffer at all for putting resources into two factions equally. It seems like looking for an excuse to say STO is somehow different.
Yes and no... Your right in that they can invest some more resources, the fan base they are really appealing to is the Trekkie/Trekker which (by a majority) idealize the Federation. But for most the draw to the game was Star Trek... based on the Federation... in fact the (and please dont take this the wrong way) the Klingon's were, for the most part, a side story to the federation (as were the Romulans, Hirogen, Khazon, Ferenghi, etc). Albeit a larger sub-plot (depending on the series), but not on par with the main story line (A Federation ship, Her captaint, and its crew and their adventures (or station)).
The next argument you are going to make is StarWars MMO's and that they have the two factions equally (if not a little more weighted on the Empire side). Having only ever been two factions this makes more sense, as there were only 2 sides.
The issue really is that the Star Trek story is not 50% about the Klingons, the Klingons didnt take up 50% of the universe. Looking at the broader appeal, people want their favorite Star Trek series/movie represented... Hence this is not a strictly TNG themed game... or a Voyager game, or DS9, or JJ for that matter... etc etc. Each series had their main (and alt enemies).
There is a group of DS9 enthusiasts that want to the Dominion faction... Of course you have your Romulan supports, etc.
I'm not trying to poopoo your ideas here... but take a step back, and look at it from a wider view. The fans of the latest movie are scratching their heads wondering why they didn't start with a romulan faction, as are the
fans of the later TNG movies.
Edit: I don't think that it is a fair, nor accurate, statement to say the KDF is an "un-sopported" faction... if your would not have gotten starbases... then sure, I'd back you on that statement... but it is definitely not... un-supported.
The fact is that Star Trek had many story lines, and the fans of each want content for that... so our of necessity to the larger fan base, the company had to devote more resources to the Federation side (FE about the Romulan/Remans, Dominion/Cardassians, Klingons, Undine, Borg, etc...) it is the fact of the genre that they are developing for... not a personal slight to those that want to be Klingon...
So, you are looking for a 1:1 ratio and 50% of the resource share, from a business perspective,
No, I'm not. I'm looking for 20-25 missions inserted overtime iether by the direct designed of the Devs or in thier sparetime if they are so incli0ned to shore up the missing levels from 1 to the present starting point until such time as the faction is complete. At which point the Devs can let it go and only worry about agnostic gameplay with a nod to the faction when it comes around to new ship/equipment/fluff time as an augment to the revenue draw of STO.
After said completion or even during the final moments of wrap-up, they could then look to creating teh RSE faction.
I have never stated a 1:1 ratio or half the resources of the Dev team be put to this task.
Only feds continue to see us say completion and automatically think we want a 1:1 ration and 50% of the Dev team on the KDF when ever they ask this question about what we KDF fans want out of STO.
The requirements to complete the faction is quite small.
We already have a tutarial waiting according to Stahl
We need some low level missions to acquaint the player to why the KDF is;
At war with the Feds - easy enough to do since we know they are subverted by the Undine as supported by some of thier own missions.
Why the Gorn/Orions are now part of the picture - these can be a short mission a piece since the Path to 2409 covers it as well.
Our advancement into once held RSE space as we recapture lost systems and how it upsets the RSE and the feds. This can easily tie in a support the war with the Feds.
A few missions on how we are still hunting the Undine and why. Sadly the fedplay has more Undine than we KDf do and we are the ones whom first discovered thier infiltration.
Some house versus house struggles would be nice to underscore the storyline of the House of Duras poilitcally fighting the house of Martok.
Etc, etc as I expect the Devs have abetter idea of whats needed and a better grasp of the unkown storylines involved.
We would like some costume options added to enhance our toon options.
Many players will still ask for ships, equipment and other items as thier fandom drives them and those may be possible over time like the feds seem to get when they ask.
Overall though, not much is needed to complete the faction or give it a better feel of playability and investment quality in creating a KDF toon.
That all being said, I do think that you should be able to play from 1 to 50... but do you have support from the general community of KDF?
The idea of a complete faction has so much support from the KDF as a whole that after two years of asking the feds merely see us as whining instead of the fact that we are asking for the same thing we have always asked for since day one.
A complete faction. had the Dev team built it (if even over time), we KDF would be relatively happy and this whole "KDF cry/fed whine" debate would have been far less a pain is our ridges, pain the feds neck and a Dev sour mash than what we have now with everybody over reacting (me especially) based on old biases and perceptions.
Its really not the devs you should be talking to, you should be stating your case to PWE corporate... they hold the pursestrings. I'm not saying the Devs are lackeys... but massive projects take oversight, they may simply not have the authority to make the changes you are requesting.
While true to a point, the completion of the KDF would not be a massive undertaking had the process been dolled out over the last two years instead of being hijacked by both circumstances beyond Dev and under thier control.
We could have been already seeing the beginings of the RSE by now if thier had been a plan in place.
The KDF fanbase may even have never become so jaded and untrusting had a plan existed, been told somewhat to us fans to alieviate our fears of fed bias and had we seen it slowly unfold and grow.
But that didn't happen.
I fear that we may never see any low level KDF missions added to the faction unless there converted foundry missions.
Season 6 isn?t even out the door yet and we?re already being told that Season 7 will be the Season of Story Line content.
Let?s hope that Season 7 will also contain some KDF story line content other than just shared Faction content.
I?m hoping that Cryptic and PWE realize that having 2 fully fleshed out factions can only help their bottom line down the road.
It?s never a good idea to put all your eggs in one basket.
More the reason why we should be grateful when a Dev creates a KDF specific mission in thier spare time for us to enjoy.
Oh to praise the Klingon fan/Dev whom creates missions for our faction in thier spare moments of life.
I know just the person who if hired would do such things in his spare time.
No, I'm not. I'm looking for 20-25 missions inserted overtime --Snip-- investment quality in creating a KDF toon.
I didn't Feel the need to qoute everything said in the paragraph, but I agree with everything Roach said.
No one has ever said content had to be a 1:1 ratio. In Fact, I will say it now, I do not care if it isn't a 1:1 ratio, but 43:9 is not exceptable. Likewise, I find it odd that the Klingons are at war over their protecting the quadrant from the Undine, yet until the agnostic Missions at the end of the game, There are to my knowledge exactly ZERO missions involving the Klingons and the Undine. The feds by comparision, at least by about midway into the Romulan Mission have 4 mission dealing with Undine in some indirect way. One of the Feds missions even has them (accidentally mind you) uncovering an Undine in the Klingon ranks.
WHAT? The feds uncover a Undine posing as a Klingon but the Klingons (who have more knowledge of the infiltration then the Feds) have nothing.
These are the things that don't seem right to me. Likewise, The Klingons and Romulans have been bitter enemies at least since TNG era, but the Klingons have zero missions in which they fight or deal with the Romulans at all.
I didn't Feel the need to qoute everything said in the paragraph, but I agree with everything Roach said.
No one has ever said content had to be a 1:1 ratio. In Fact, I will say it now, I do not care if it isn't a 1:1 ratio, but 43:9 is not exceptable. Likewise, I find it odd that the Klingons are at war over their protecting the quadrant from the Undine, yet until the agnostic Missions at the end of the game, There are to my knowledge exactly ZERO missions involving the Klingons and the Undine. The feds by comparision, at least by about midway into the Romulan Mission have 4 mission dealing with Undine in some indirect way. One of the Feds missions even has them (accidentally mind you) uncovering an Undine in the Klingon ranks.
WHAT? The feds uncover a Undine posing as a Klingon but the Klingons (who have more knowledge of the infiltration then the Feds) have nothing.
These are the things that don't seem right to me. Likewise, The Klingons and Romulans have been bitter enemies at least since TNG era, but the Klingons have zero missions in which they fight or deal with the Romulans at all.
These are the things that need to be corrected.
If the Devs do not tackle it then the Foundry authors could...
Still few would play it as Foundry missions have little payout.
If you are a pickle in a pickle jar you know every pickle's different, sort of, but really they're all just pickles...
If the Devs do not tackle it then the Foundry authors could...
Still few would play it as Foundry missions have little payout.
I'll play one just to have fun with other players but as far as me going out when no one I know is online... You'd likely see me doing doff missions, pi canis sorties, or stfs because that is all I have to do... and over and over and over again LOL.
Now the way the STF system is setup I think we should have like 3 STF's for each non-borg enemy npc faction. The 2 of them would be faction specific and then the 3rd would be sort of like an ending to both for a semi story like they are now.
So in that regard there would be so much to choose from you could keep yourself from being burnt out on end game.
If the Devs do not tackle it then the Foundry authors could...
Still few would play it as Foundry missions have little payout.
Much as I have come to love the foundry and know several great people who are foundry authors, I am still against this.
I don't like the idea of letting Cryptic off the hook with the Foundry. This is Cryptic's game and they are the ones who should fix it, not the community authors.
I can't say much about the FED, because all of my friends plays mainly with FED toons. But for personal choice, I really want to play more with KDF.
I am not a specialist, but KDF can have a lot of new options and kinds of missions and events to play. Just need a better work to place this ingame.
About the C-stuff: Uniforms, ships, pets, weapons, devices, etc are nice, but only worth if is make to give for KDF only. Or have some special difference to enhance this faction.
About the Foundry Mission to KDF faction, is my shame, I need to get more dilithium to pay a better tip to the author. Making something to KDF, if is in the Foundry or not, deserve a better thank you. And if someone can at least give your free time to build a mission to KDF Faction, deserve to receive at least a good tip to incentive to make more missions.
Here is what the KDF has had to put up with since Launch. Presented by the awesome Peregrine Falcon. See how much we get the bad end of the stick. How much promises were made but were cut short due to feds crying. take a look.
No one has ever said content had to be a 1:1 ratio.
What are the constant rage threads about Feds getting a new ship focused on then?
If you don't expect a 1:1 Ratio, what do you in fact expect?
60% vs. 40%?
75% vs. %25?
85% vs. %15?
At what ratio do you think people would realistically be satisfied?
For example let's look at endgame ships.
If we roll all of the Ody and Bortas ships and count them as "1" (Including Tac, Sci, Ops and Free Versions) & exclude lock-box ships (which are faction neutral).
We get
FED RA & VA Ships = 17
KDF RA & VA Ships = 11
For a total of 28 ships, and roughly 40% of those ships are KDF ships.
That's an endgame split of roughly 60/40.
Missions:
I've subtracted the following missions from the total, since they aren't really missions (you just report to X): Heading Out (Fed), Darkness Before Dawn (Fed), Venture into Deep Space (Fed), Report to Gamma Orionis (FED & KDF).
The total is about 70 Fed Missions and 34 KDF Missions, for a rough 69% vs. 31% split or so. (And yes, I understand some of those like the 2800 series are unappealing to some players due to feeling very Fed in their overall design)
So if people are not asking for a 1:1 ratio, what ratio are they asking for?
I'm genuinely curious since both you an Roach have stated you're not asking for 1:1, what would be the target?
I'm not trying to disparage here either, I think the KDF needs to be available from level 1.
However the entire game, both Fed and KDF seem to be on a lowbie content lockdown.
We've been told the future of development is focused on Endgame.
And if 1:1 is not the goal of threads like this, what is the goal?
What are the constant rage threads about Feds getting a new ship focused on then?
Simply ragethreads like any rage thread that any KDf or fed player throws out on the forums for what ever rage-moment they are having at the time.
At what ratio do you think people would realistically be satisfied?So if people are not asking for a 1:1 ratio, what ratio are they asking for?
Completion of the faction so a KDF player can start at level 1 and progress to endgame. At which point the Devs can focus only on keeping us KDF fans in the loop for endgame missions and special agnostic missions and then focus on the RSE and feds as they see fit.
Throwing us the occassional KDF specific mission from time to time to liven things up would be nice but not required. http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=4470511&postcount=141
For example let's look at endgame ships.
Fed players ask for endgame ships all the time on the forums. Ships that they enjoy from the IP and wish to see ingame. Why would thier asking be more important and therefore allowed over a KDF player asking for the same?
Missions:
The total is about 70 Fed Missions and 34 KDF Missions, for a rough 69% vs. 31% split or so
.
Subtract these KDF mission from your ratio as they offer nothing that further the PvE storyline or that immerses the player into the game. They are filler missions with no location, no effort required of the player other than just play and they offer just filler XP to help the player in level progression without adding to the game .
20 LC PVP ?A Good Day To Die - Ground? B'Eta
20 LC PVP ?A Good Day To Die - Space? B'Eta
20 LC PVP ?Captain Killer - Klingons? B'Eta
20 LC PVP ?Captain Killer - Starfleet? B'Eta
20 LC Defeat ?The Most Dangerous Game - Ground? B'Eta
20 LC Defeat ?The Most Dangerous Game - Space? B'Eta
20 LC PVP ?Ship Killer - Klingons? B'Eta
20 LC PVP ?Ship Killer - Starfleet? B'Eta
20 LC PVP ?Turret Killer? B'Eta
Subtract these KDF missions becuase they are really only " report to NPC " missions
21 Cm Promotion “Promotion Commander (Klingon Empire)” Chancellor J'mpok
31 Cp Promotion “Promotion Captain (Klingon Empire)” Chancellor J'mpok
41 BG Promotion “Promotion Brigadier General (Klingon Empire)” Chancellor J'mpok
46 MG Promotion “Promotion Major General (Klingon Empire)” Chancellor J'mpok
51 LG Promotion “Promotion Lieutenant General (Klingon Empire)”
20 LC PvP “Spoils of War”
I fail to understand why all feds seem stuck on the 1:1 ratio belief when we ask for completion of the faction, not parity of the factions.
Comments
But when demanding more "KDF content", what is actually demanded?
Is it:
1. Missions?
Missions are the last thing this game needs, for either faction.
They take a lot of dev time and end up only being played 0 to 1 time by the players.
Enjoying them for the story? Writing is terrible is this game, fanfic-level terrible.
The writing is one of the reasons I now level my chars through System Patrols and/or PvP (the other reason being: avoidance of ground combat which bores me).
2. Levels 1-19?
Won't really solve the problem of having little to do at endgame; it'll just be a tad slower for KDF chars to get to that situation.
Do you actually want to go through lv1-19 on your second (and following) char(s)? Personally, if there was an option to skip to 20 FED-side, I'd use it. Wouldn't have used it on my first char, but now, yes, I would.
3. Playable races?
Heh, I guess there are RP reasons. Then again, there are RP reasons why the KDF would be less diversed than the Federation.
For us non-RP minded people, the best race is Alien; on both sides.
Joined Trill is the only race that can really compete with a char that gets to pick Efficient Captain, Warp Theorist, Accurate and Elusive or Techie.
4. Ships?
When I first started, I really thought they should've fleshed out the KDF Ships before adding any new FED Ships.
Nowadays, I'm not so sure.
See, while the KDF has less variety, its Ships tend to be pretty damn good:
- The Guramba is one of the best Escorts around. I should know, I fly a Ship that's strictly weaker and still hold my own.
- Battle Cruisers don't pale in comparison to Cruisers. For the most part, they're the same Ships with more Turn Rate (Bortas excluded), a Cloak and the ability to use Duals.
The Vor'cha-R and Negh'var are quite frankly better than the Sovereign and Galaxy-R/Vanguard and the Bortas line competes very well with the Odyssey line.
- The Hegh'ta is a lot of fun to play and a beast in both PvP and PvE.
Yes, even PvE: a damage boost every 20s and the ability to switch between being a SV and an Escort more than makes up for the lost Turret.
On faction uniquness: I, too, would've liked it being preserved: no FED Carriers (no Atrox, different Akira-R)... but also no KDF SVs (no Varanus nor the lower level ones).
So, how 'bout adding new ships?
Well, using those that have been asked for or promised:
1. Hegh'ta-R:
- Traditionally, a Refit/Retrofit keeps the same turn rate, inertia and crew.
- A Refit/Retrofit of the same tier keeps the same hull.
- Weapon slots depend solely on Ship type and level.
So, stats for an Hegh'ta-R:
Hull: 24000
Shields: ~4175 (usually a ~5% bonus to Shields on C-Store ships)
Weapons: 4/2, can use Duals.
Crew: 100
Consoles: 3/3/3
BOFFs: Commander Universal, LC Universal, Lt. Universal, Lt. Universal.
Turn: 21
Inertia: 60
Bonus Power: Weapons+15
Bonus Console: ?
Need I go on? Point is, it's a Hegh'ta with a bit more Shields and a Console. Might as well buff the existing Hegh'ta rather than have it as a new Ship.
Design space for BoPs is very limited, given the universal BOFFs and 3/3/3 consoles.
2. Qin-R.
The KDF sure could use a few more Escorts but I think Cryptic is more likely to introduce Destroyers than Raptors at this point.
Let's face it, Raptors are all "Escorts+Cloak"... in the case of the Qin, that's fine, it's a free Defiant but imagine a C-Store Raptor with some sort of separation... it'd have both the Defiant's gimmick and the MVAE's. Either they compensate for the Cloak by making it weaker in another area (which will lead to complaints) or they don't and it's not balanced.
So, Destroyers are more likely.
Besides, if it uses the Qin model, it'll probably have the same pivot point and nobody wants that.
3. Negh'var-R.
With rumours of a Sovereign-R, there's no reasons why a Negh'var-R couldn't be made.
But I'm wary of any new Cruiser, FED or KDF: either it's balanced with the "olde" Cruisers and is obsolete upon release (moreso FED-side, KDF-side there's a significant Turn Rate difference) or it's balanced with the Odyssey/Bortas and that's a huge power creep.
Costumes up to par. Broken record, but mercenary isn't available for KDF? Seriously? Give KDF most of the same options! Maybe you have a KDF Romulan refugee who likes Earth tuxedos. Who cares?
No obstacle to entry. Let people start as a KDF. I don't care about the 1-20 thing.
Wicks and Things: NW-DI4FMZRR4 : The Fenwick merchant family has lost a caravan! Can you help?
Beggar's Hollow: NW-DR6YG4J2L : Someone, or something, has stolen away many of the Fenwicks' children! Can you find out what happened to them?
Into the Fen Wood: NW-DL89DRG7B : Enter the heart of the forest. Can you discover the secret of the Fen Wood?
if you look at the number of ship options for the KDF at 50, they pale in comparison to Starfleet. and yet we are criticized for not spending c points by the devs and Starfleet?
sure, the Hegh'ta & B'rel are things that Starfleet don't have yet (but seem to be getting due to faction imba "pining"). Starfleet has more options in everything else, and will inevitably get all the Klingon options as well. I don't care if my Hegh'ta is better than a science ship.... I made certain sacrifices for that, and continue to sacrifice for that privilege. when Starfleet is handed their bird of prey on a silver platter, then I will reconsider a great many things about this game.
also, the qin may be free, but it looks like a duck, or maybe a goose. it also turns far worse than the defiant, which is a huge issue with that ugly duck. bad turn, defiant boff layout... not a very good combination.
the real solution is to end the charade and add the Klingons as a Starfleet option, with slightly different graphics.
IKS Korrasami (Fleet B'rel Bird of Prey Retrofit T5-U)
Makes me sad.
I want more bushido feel. I want more "Good soldiers know when to disobey" or "Good soldiers know when to sacrifice," missions where we support allies with arms not subjugate all with those arms, house intrigues that do not always lead to outright civil war all so we can stop being space ogres. I want 1-20 so new players are not forced to commit to Feds. I want a T5+1 Raptor. I want some fighters and shuttles so we have a few options.
Oh well as a step mother of mine once said, "Want in one hand while you TRIBBLE in the other and see which one fills up first."
Sounds good to me. I have no initial use myself for special consoles (though I will not mind having them) and really just wish to see the KDF ships mention above be competitive.
R.I.P
I have one hand half empty and the other full of Cryptic/PWE TRIBBLE excuses.
R.I.P
I should've prefaced with this: I'm not into this whole faction identity thing.
When I see "the feds" or "the klinks" on these forums, it makes me cringe... because I play both and think it's silly to take a partisan stance on these matters.
Then again, the MMOs I've played for a decent length of time weren't faction-based, so maybe I just wasn't raised in this culture of "us vs them".
I'll admit it was weird not being to start a KDF char immediatly, but frankly I never saw it as a big deal.
1-20 is extremely unlikely to ever happen, though: we get 1 Ship every 3 months or so and they'd have to create at least 3 solely to flesh out 1-20, Ships that by nature would be as short-lived as the Miranda, Constitution, Saber and Nova; not to mention create new missions and trying to make them fit with the old ones that are quite obviously meant to be a starting point.
MOAR DAKKA! Maybe that's the solution? Paint all KDF Ships red (they'll go fasta) and give Klingons fangs? Wouldn't be Trek, but it'd be pretty awesome.
Heh, I guess there are people that can enjoy the STO story. Personally, I'll reiterate that I find it fanfic-level horrible and would rather not be subjected to more of those terrible-dialogue, unskippable, weirdly animated cutscenes.
But even if you enjoy it, you have to concede that, at this point, it should take a backseat to more important matters... namely fleshing out the nigh-nonexistent endgame.
You don't seem to have read. I was giving rationales for why those Ships aren't that easy to introduce.
More variety in Klingon Ships'd be good, but it's not necessarily easy to introduce it while maintaining balance.
And let's stop the paranoia. It's highly unlikely they'll add a FED BoP.
Btw, the whole 16% excuse the dev make? Yeah, that's BS.
Whats wrong with destroyers ?
The Garamba looks like a great ship, but as I fly the Qin there's not much incentive to buy the seige destroyer- They're almost identical in stats.
BUT a Qin-R (the current Qin) with some candy would definitely be something I'd consider. A bit better turn rate, ship abilities or a universal device slot (or 2), maybe a battle cloak and either a universal LT or a LT in place of the current ensign slot. Point defense and more hull points would be overkill but WTF- the Feds got an Armitage.
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
R.I.P
No wonder we fans of the Klingon aspect of the IP are pissed, we found enjoyment in the genre and it could give a targ flop less about us unless we can prove that we can bring it enough revenue to warrant recieving attention.
What sort of backwards f-upped thinking is that for a MMO that chased away the KDF fans who where in closedbeta/beta and then only gave token attention for two whole years?
I am no longer surprised the large Klingon fanclubs haven't made thier prescence known in STO, they know a feds only club when they see it.
R.I.P
Fight against it? I was just trying to get clarification on a vague term, initially and analysing the possibilities. I'm not fighting anything.
Dev ressources are limited.
Some companies can work on story-oriented content and endgame-oriented content at once, but clearly Cryptic cannot.
(aside:"agnostic" doesn't really work in this context)
The Hegh'ta-R issue isn't one of balance, it's to make a BoP that's functionally different from other BoPs.
The main differences (stats-wise) between a new Ship and existing Ships are BOFF layout and consoles, T5 BoPs all have the same BOFFs and consoles. Bringing a new one, especially a Hegh'ta Refit without making it too similar to existing options is basically impossible, at least in the framework Cryptic has decided upon for BoPs.
Cryptic they do have some balancing rules/mechanics; whether you or I agree with those is another matter (neither of us does, apparently), but they do.
And any Ship actually released is always more balanced than the "I WANT A SHIP 1SHOTZ UNIVARS!" stuff the community posts on forums, FED-side or KDF-side.
Calm down, I wasn't attacking anyone. Why such aggressivity?
I just don't think it likely they'll make a FED BoP. I am aware of the Carrier history.
I wasn't even aware of a FED BoP thread, all I'd heard from it was from the guy who posted above you.
Anyway, if they decide to make a FED BoP, I'll voice against it, but I'm not going to rant pre-emptively about it.
Not what I meant (16+82=98, btw, where'd the last 2% go?), neither was it aimed at you.
You really need to calm down, dude.
I know from lurking the ancient version of the fora that you're more literate than that, but here you are just half-reading, assuming hostility where there is none and blindly flailing a sword around.
R.I.P
I think this goes both ways actually, and sadly.
I have a Klingon character, and I dont play it... I just dont care for it... not for the lack of content, ships, consoles, etc... rather what drew me to STO is the Star Trek shows based on the Federation.
You, or someone mentioned, the ratio of Fed Missions to KDF Missions.... not looking for a 1:1... then what would be an acceptable ratio? Currently it is 4.45:1.. are you looking for say 4:1 (1 more mission) 3:1 (addition of 4 mission), 2:1 (an additional 11 missions).
What path should these missions take? I am intrigued by the Bushido references. Basing my opinions on Worf here (found him to be an honorable, and duty bound officer), I think that would be an interesting story line, the way of the warrior and what not. Explaining who the Klingon are, and what they are about (other than raiding and pillaging).
This is just my opinion here, but would it make sense to help the dev team along with some story line ideas?
I do see, and understand, your frustration with the lack of content. If the numbers I have been reading in the forums are accurate... 16% of the player base is KDF then the ratio seems about right approximately 20% of the content/resources spent on that factions specific content (at least in as far as the faction specific missions).
It could also quite frankly be that the Owners (PWE/Cryptic) and not the devs themselves are placing restrictions on the amount of time/resources that can be spent. We all have our bosses after all... and the bosses generally are more concerned about the bottom line.
That is not to say that additional development can't attract more people to the Klingon side (heck I'd dust of my KDF player to do a way of the warrior mission).
As far as the number of ships, and I think in a different thread people mentioned the number of consoles... I can't speak for all, but mainly the different ship variants we have are reskinned versions of the same tier ship, with an exchanged slot (sci for eng, etc). Which, I would prefer just 1 ship with a universal slot tbh. As to the consoles, after a little game play, most lose their luster save a few, and they are sent off to the bank to rust in piece. I think though that upon serious analysis, the KDF ships have as much customizable options as the fleet of different fed ships (i.e. for each universal slot adds 3 variants to the ship in question)... and that most of the consoles that retain their usefullness, probably equal the number of consoles available to the klingons. So I would argue that some of the ships, and some of the consles are really just fluff...
Star Trek Online, Now with out the Trek....
Aproximately 20-25 missions.
Why the KDF is at war with the feds? Is it Undine? Is it becuase of our reconquesting? is it both?
How does the houses take this change?
What of the Houses that where destroyed due to Undine subversion?
What of the Gorn, are they on the verge of rebellion?
What of the Orions, what are they really up to by becoming allies?
What of the Undine, is J'mpok one?
Many ideas have been tossed at the Devs on what the faction falls short on fuilling its identity in STO.
We do not have a complete faction from a PvE standpoint. We can not play from level one to endgame and as such the desire to roll ALTs is lessened knowing that the faction has little substance to play through thus diminishing the investment value of even rolling a KDF toon.
Yes, Endgame stability and solid revenue stream is important. After that is accomplished it would be nice if they put some focus towards the KDF instead of refering to it as "beating the dead targ". Why would anyone play a faction they know is incomplete.
R.I.P
So, you are looking for a 1:1 ratio and 50% of the resource share, from a business perspective, I think that is a little unrealistic at this point. Regardless of what was promised, or eluded to in the past. You'd be better off, from a player perspective, recruit players to the Klingon side, to bring the player base up to at least match the content ratio... if they see more headed that direction, they will release some funds/resources... simple business math. Why invest 50%+ (since you would have to pull from the Fed side entirely to give you the volume of missions you are looking for) of your assets in 16-18% of your revenue stream.
That all being said, I do think that you should be able to play from 1 to 50... but do you have support from the general community of KDF? Its really not the devs you should be talking to, you should be stating your case to PWE corporate... they hold the pursestrings. I'm not saying the Devs are lackeys... but massive projects take oversight, they may simply not have the authority to make the changes you are requesting.
Star Trek Online, Now with out the Trek....
Well, duh, it's a minority BECAUSE little resources were spent on them. Who wants to volunteer for the unsupported faction?
As for 'the show was about the good guys,' look at lots and lots of other 2 faction MMOs -- people like playing Horde and Alliance, Order and Chaos, and so on.
OTHER MMOs don't seem to suffer at all for putting resources into two factions equally. It seems like looking for an excuse to say STO is somehow different.
Wicks and Things: NW-DI4FMZRR4 : The Fenwick merchant family has lost a caravan! Can you help?
Beggar's Hollow: NW-DR6YG4J2L : Someone, or something, has stolen away many of the Fenwicks' children! Can you find out what happened to them?
Into the Fen Wood: NW-DL89DRG7B : Enter the heart of the forest. Can you discover the secret of the Fen Wood?
Other than the mission ratio... I think we are both in the same boat when it comes to fleshing out the details.
Star Trek Online, Now with out the Trek....
Yes and no... Your right in that they can invest some more resources, the fan base they are really appealing to is the Trekkie/Trekker which (by a majority) idealize the Federation. But for most the draw to the game was Star Trek... based on the Federation... in fact the (and please dont take this the wrong way) the Klingon's were, for the most part, a side story to the federation (as were the Romulans, Hirogen, Khazon, Ferenghi, etc). Albeit a larger sub-plot (depending on the series), but not on par with the main story line (A Federation ship, Her captaint, and its crew and their adventures (or station)).
The next argument you are going to make is StarWars MMO's and that they have the two factions equally (if not a little more weighted on the Empire side). Having only ever been two factions this makes more sense, as there were only 2 sides.
The issue really is that the Star Trek story is not 50% about the Klingons, the Klingons didnt take up 50% of the universe. Looking at the broader appeal, people want their favorite Star Trek series/movie represented... Hence this is not a strictly TNG themed game... or a Voyager game, or DS9, or JJ for that matter... etc etc. Each series had their main (and alt enemies).
There is a group of DS9 enthusiasts that want to the Dominion faction... Of course you have your Romulan supports, etc.
I'm not trying to poopoo your ideas here... but take a step back, and look at it from a wider view. The fans of the latest movie are scratching their heads wondering why they didn't start with a romulan faction, as are the
fans of the later TNG movies.
Edit: I don't think that it is a fair, nor accurate, statement to say the KDF is an "un-sopported" faction... if your would not have gotten starbases... then sure, I'd back you on that statement... but it is definitely not... un-supported.
Star Trek Online, Now with out the Trek....
Star Trek Online, Now with out the Trek....
R.I.P
Season 6 isn?t even out the door yet and we?re already being told that Season 7 will be the Season of Story Line content.
Let?s hope that Season 7 will also contain some KDF story line content other than just shared Faction content.
I?m hoping that Cryptic and PWE realize that having 2 fully fleshed out factions can only help their bottom line down the road.
It?s never a good idea to put all your eggs in one basket.
More the reason why we should be grateful when a Dev creates a KDF specific mission in thier spare time for us to enjoy.
Oh to praise the Klingon fan/Dev whom creates missions for our faction in thier spare moments of life.
I know just the person who if hired would do such things in his spare time.
R.I.P
I am not a specialist, but KDF can have a lot of new options and kinds of missions and events to play. Just need a better work to place this ingame.
About the C-stuff: Uniforms, ships, pets, weapons, devices, etc are nice, but only worth if is make to give for KDF only. Or have some special difference to enhance this faction.
About the Foundry Mission to KDF faction, is my shame, I need to get more dilithium to pay a better tip to the author.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I know I am a bit late in the thread... but why is this in KDF Gameplay if it's addressing "KDF Haters". :rolleyes:
You last visited: 12-31-1969 at 04:00 PM
What are the constant rage threads about Feds getting a new ship focused on then?
If you don't expect a 1:1 Ratio, what do you in fact expect?
60% vs. 40%?
75% vs. %25?
85% vs. %15?
At what ratio do you think people would realistically be satisfied?
For example let's look at endgame ships.
If we roll all of the Ody and Bortas ships and count them as "1" (Including Tac, Sci, Ops and Free Versions) & exclude lock-box ships (which are faction neutral).
We get
FED RA & VA Ships = 17
KDF RA & VA Ships = 11
For a total of 28 ships, and roughly 40% of those ships are KDF ships.
That's an endgame split of roughly 60/40.
Missions:
I've subtracted the following missions from the total, since they aren't really missions (you just report to X): Heading Out (Fed), Darkness Before Dawn (Fed), Venture into Deep Space (Fed), Report to Gamma Orionis (FED & KDF).
The total is about 70 Fed Missions and 34 KDF Missions, for a rough 69% vs. 31% split or so. (And yes, I understand some of those like the 2800 series are unappealing to some players due to feeling very Fed in their overall design)
So if people are not asking for a 1:1 ratio, what ratio are they asking for?
I'm genuinely curious since both you an Roach have stated you're not asking for 1:1, what would be the target?
I'm not trying to disparage here either, I think the KDF needs to be available from level 1.
However the entire game, both Fed and KDF seem to be on a lowbie content lockdown.
We've been told the future of development is focused on Endgame.
And if 1:1 is not the goal of threads like this, what is the goal?
R.I.P